US Open Day 6 - Williams sisters lose, but Serena might return

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1:10Matt Roberts: Well, hello and welcome to the Tennis Podcast on a special Friday night here at the US Open, a night that saw the return of Serena Williams to the Arthur Ashe Stadium. We are coming to you from Flushing Meadows at just gone 11pm, having just watched the Williams sisters in doubles action. There are still matches going on out there, and we'll be back to cover those in part three of today's show. We'll certainly be recording that post 2am, because that does seem to be how this US Open is rolling. But just before we get into the singles, David, a word on the Serena and Venus experience tonight. They lost their round one doubles match to my joint and Chan Hao Chin.

1:56Matt Roberts: In a deciding set tie break, the match lasting more than three hours and the length of the match, incidentally thrilling though it was, has meant that Ben Shelton and Denis Shapovalov have only just begun their best of five set match at gone 11pm. But tonight, and we experienced much of this match live inside the Arthur Ashe Stadium, it was both the loudest and the quietest it has been all week.

2:25David Law: Yes, because usually what you get inside the Arthur Ashe Stadium is just 10, 20 ,000 conversations of people catching up with each other on a night out. I mean, we experienced this feeling of it just being a big night out. We came in a little bit later today after last night's 4 a.m. finish with our recording of last night's show. And so we were walking the boardwalk down to the Billie Jean King National Tennis Centre, along with everybody else who were coming for this 7 o 'clock start time with Serena and Venus Williams. The place was ready for a party. It was just an amazing experience to walk in.

3:01David Law: But then when you got inside the Arthrasch Stadium, just about for the first time that I've had all tournament, And first time, in fact, that I can remember, those conversations were not happening. Everybody was focused, I think, on the court, on the presence of Serena and Venus Williams. When they came out, when they were introduced to the crowd, the place just exploded in noise. I mean, it was still probably only about half full at that point. I mean, it takes such a long time to get everybody into this place that it was not completely full. But within half a dozen games, it was full. and yes, when they were winning points, it was the loudest it has been but when people were just watching the points unfold, I mean, it was more like Wimbledon's centre court than it was the Arthrash Stadium and you just don't get that here, do you?

3:51David Law: It was a measure really of the way they just focused everybody's attention on them.

3:59Matt Roberts: Yeah, and a word for Maya Joint who has now beaten Serena Williams on two of the biggest and most intimidating stages in the sport on two separate occasions in 2026. Now, if you'd told us that at the start of the year, Matt, we, well...

4:17Catherine Whitaker: We wouldn't have believed you. We'd have been confused. For lots of reasons.

4:20Matt Roberts: We would have laughed. I mean, Caroline Wozniacki did apparently spill in commentary on ESPN that Serena Williams does intend to properly come back to singles in 2027 to some degree. Whether she will row back on that, I don't know. But it's a bit of a surprise to me, I think, on the basis of what we've seen of Serena, albeit quite a small sample size. I mean, it was incredibly fun tonight, but they did lose a first-round doubles match.

4:52Catherine Whitaker: Yes, and Serena, I thought, was nowhere near as sharp as she had been in the mixed doubles with Alcaraz last week. and actually I felt like Serena's serve was a bit of a struggle tonight, which is normally the shot that's always there for her. They were down a break in the third set and it looked like maybe it was going to fizzle out, but they came back. They were pretty close to winning. They went five love up in that match tie break and Joint and Chan clawed it back. And yeah, look, it was a very special occasion, very cool to see Serena and Venus playing. Like, it's a match that I think everyone will remember fondly, but it's very, very different to singles, you know.

5:38Catherine Whitaker: And, like, they held their own in this match, absolutely, but they lost in the first round, and that's in the doubles. You know, the singles is a totally different ballgame whatsoever. So, yeah, it will be interesting to see. Thoughts and prayers, I think, with Caroline Wozniacki. if she has spilled the beans that maybe she wasn't supposed to.

6:02Matt Roberts: Yeah, if we've learnt anything this year, it's that Serena Williams likes to announce things on her own terms. Indeed.

6:07Catherine Whitaker: Not via Wozniacki on ESPN.

6:10David Law: I mean, interestingly, she did do an interview with Malika Andrews from ESPN quite recently and did intimate that she wasn't done yet, but there wasn't much detail given. They're not doing a press conference tonight. We've had that announcement come out over the sort of media-wide WhatsApp group, which tells us when players are coming and which room they're going to. And it just says Serena and Venus Williams will not be available for speaking to the media tonight. And those were greeted with some unhappy emoji faces and arms out wide. Oh, really? People reacted in the chat?

6:47Matt Roberts: We've got one shrug emoji and two sad face emojis. Have you done one of them, David? I won't expose.

6:53David Law: You've been known to react to a WhatsApp group announcement. I have, yeah. But no, I didn't do on this occasion. So, yeah, there's no opportunity to press Serena on that here. So we just, I mean, it'll be really interesting to see whether she decides she wants to try to play in Australia. And there's no question there will be a wild card waiting for her if she wants to. But that's a long way off and it's a long way to go. will she want to play maybe Miami or something like that in this in next spring it's just fascinating I mean I I'm done with trying to predict what she is going to do but I certainly enjoyed that tonight there was a real I mean it sort of built didn't it but once we got into the final set and the second set was just thrilling and the way that the noise they created but But then in the third set, I was really into it, you know, the competition of it all.

7:49David Law: It was great fun.

7:50Matt Roberts: If she did want to play Australia, it would probably be a wise move to play the United Cup because that's guaranteed matches.

7:57David Law: Yeah, true.

7:57Matt Roberts: And that's what she needs, isn't it? To get some momentum, get some matches going. But the problem is you... The point at which you most need to get that going is when you're losing and that's when you, you know, you're losing, therefore you're not playing any more matches. But, yeah, there you go. There's my pitch to Serena Williams to go to Perth. Go and see the Quokkas again, Serena. OK, let's move on to talk about the singles matches that we've seen today. And let's talk about the woman that was, well, bumped off the Arthur Ashe Stadium in favour of Serena and Venus Williams in doubles action, quite understandably.

8:36Matt Roberts: But I also think quite understandably, Serena Sabalenka, the top seed and defending champion, seemed quite pissed off about it. She was playing like a woman pissed off today, David. 6-3, 6-4 over Camilla Rakimova.

8:51David Law: Yes, it didn't take very long for her to clock that there were, in her view at least, somebody smoking marijuana in the vicinity. The sort of hairdryer noise you can hear in the distance is they're cleaning leaves off the practice courts right in front of us at the moment. But, yeah, and that's what New York's like, isn't it? There are noises everywhere. There are wafts of smells wherever you go. We went up the stairs. You know, it's quite a walk up to the press seats, you know, pretty much into the third tier of the seats. And the smell of the various food stands was pretty overwhelming on the way up.

9:32David Law: And Irina Sabalenka was saying that she could smell marijuana smoke pretty strongly at the end of the court that she was at. And, of course, she's not used to being on the second court here at Flusher Meadows, the Louis Armstrong court, which I think is a wonderful court, actually. And I think she probably sort of grew into it because they gave her the most incredible reception in there. I think the crowd there loved having her. You know, it's more intimate. You feel like you're more involved. And she had her hands full today. She was playing Rakimova, who just came out with a big smile on her face right at the start.

10:09David Law: She was sort of doing almost Alcaraz-style jumping movements at the net when they were about to start the match. But I also thought that Irina Sabalenka was very clean today in the early points of the match. I mean, her serve is incredible. And things did get a bit dicey in the second set. But I think she's starting to play well, which is interesting.

10:31Matt Roberts: And she might need to because in the next round, She has Taylor Townsend backing up her run to the fourth round here last year, repeating that feat. And she said in her on-court interview after today's victory over Deanna Schneider that she was anxious about that coming into the tournament. She was very aware of the points she was having to defend and very aware of kind of proving to the world that she's not a worse version of herself than she was last year, which is a really perfect way of expressing what's so messed up about the ranking system and what it does to a tennis player's mind. Sort of having to constantly compare yourself to a past version of yourself is not a healthy way to live.

11:14Matt Roberts: But anyway, she's matched up at least equally to the version of herself from 12 months ago. And when asked about playing Irina Sabalenka on what I very much assume will be the Arthur Ashe Stadium in the fourth round in a couple of days' time, she said, I'm fucking pumped.

11:32Catherine Whitaker: And David was like, does she want a T-shirt?

11:35David Law: I loved that. Yeah, she can have one of my pumped T-shirts to walk out onto the court with for free. There you go. There's my offer. Yeah, look.

11:44Matt Roberts: I think she's got her own outfits, David. And there.

11:48Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, add some, well, she seems to have a sort of buckle on her outfit today.

11:55Matt Roberts: and yeah that they haven't been my taste but then they're they she's clearly really enjoying expressing herself and i absolutely support that how i feel about those outfits is neither here

12:08David Law: nor there i like the one when she had flames on it last year uh black dress with sort of flames

12:15Matt Roberts: yeah i like that one too that was good these are a different vibe okay yeah i mean it is a very

12:21Catherine Whitaker: very exciting thought isn't it i mean that's the one that we kind of circled in the draw when it came out for sabalenka as a potential test of where she's at mentally with the game of townsend but also the crowd likely to be pretty against sabalenka on that night and this one today for townsend was an absolute thriller against schneider and it didn't look like it was going to be. Townsend was winning pretty comfortably, a set-up, a break-up, serve for the match, and Schneider at that point broke her back, and then Schneider herself had multiple set points in the second set before the tie-break with Townsend serving at 5-6.

13:07Catherine Whitaker: And time after time, Townsend kept hitting the line with winners. Schneider was throwing everything at her trying to get the break it was one of the most high quality games of of the tournament i would say and the crowd on court 17 were so into it and she held firm townsend and held and took it into a tie break but schneider still managed to win that tie break after not converting those i think six set points it was so when we're at one set all and suddenly it's feeling a bit like last year for taylor townsend where she's had a chance to close the match last year it was against kraychikova and she hasn't taken it and suddenly she's in a third set and i remember last year that third set against kraychikova you always kind of felt kraychikova was going to win it this one i thought townsend did such a good job to avoid that happening and and managed to get a crucial break towards the end and still win the match, despite not being able to get it done in straight sets.

14:11Catherine Whitaker: And, yeah, it was a very impressive mental effort, I thought, from Townsend to win that one. And, yeah, she talked about how, yes, she's defended all those points, and that means she can now feel like she can play free again on the court. And that's probably what she's going to have to do against Sabalenka, I would have thought. Absolutely just bring it to her, try and be crushing rushing on some second serve returns and things like that, and try and disrupt Sabalenka and throw off her rhythm. It's a tantalising matchup.

14:42Matt Roberts: How credible a chance do we give Taylor Townsend there?

14:46David Law: I do give her a credible chance. I think probably, say, a 30 % chance, which I don't think is too bad. I think she'd sign for that. I think she's at her best here. I feel like I've seen some really good stuff from her this year and last year. When I think back to that critique of a match, which she should have won, you know, having eight match points, not winning the match. And honestly, you know, we talk about when the draw came out, we saw Townsend Sabalenka as a possible fourth round. I really didn't expect that to happen because I thought Schneider was the favorite, really, to be coming through that section of the draw.

15:26David Law: So to find a way past her when she lost the lead, I think is a huge achievement. You know, to just banish the demons of last year as well, you know, having lost that match against Krishikovic. We still don't really know about Sabalenka. We don't know whether her improved looking performance today is down to just not facing much in the way of opposition or whether this is the real thing. And now she's going to get the crowd as this other factor. To me, it's a really tantalising proposition. To me, this could make or break Sabalenka's US Open. Obviously, if she loses, it breaks it. But I think if she wins it, it could be the thing which propels her to a title defence.

16:13Matt Roberts: Yeah, I think I agree with that. I mean, I give Taylor Townsend at least 30%. I think there's a world in which it's a beatdown for Sabalenka for sure. but I think the crowd are going to be feverish, feverishly for Taylor Townsend. She is so popular here in a very vocal, vociferous way, and I could see Sabalenka's got a bit of a The World's Against Me vibe at the moment, and there's an element of confirmation bias to that, isn't there? If you're feeling that way, you know, the fact that you're on Armstrong and there's someone smoking weed, it's like, oh, it's all rigged against me type of vibes.

16:57Matt Roberts: And that was kind of how I think it's legitimate to not be enjoying the smell of weed while you're trying to play a professional tennis match, for sure, and to express that annoyance with the umpire. But just reading her vibes, you know, it's definitely kind of me against the world type stuff. And look, that can be channeled positively, but she is right on the edge with it at the moment, Sabalenka. and I don't know, we've seen a lot of evidence recently of her being on the edge and tipping over, and I could see that happening.

17:29David Law: Yeah, I feel like we've seen her win titles almost because of those sort of feelings, and we've also seen her lose huge matches as a direct result of them. So, yeah, can't wait.

17:43Matt Roberts: Tantalising. Jessica Bagula through to the fourth round just, Matt. 1-6, 6-4, 6-3 against former finalist here, tricky lefty Leila Fernandes, who played a hell of a match. And Jessica Pergula was in a real tussle here and a bit like Taylor Townsend. This was a match up until kind of, well, up until the end of the second set, really, the blueprint of which we've seen before for Pergula and she's failed to come through. Like this felt like burying some demons for Pergula today.

18:17Catherine Whitaker: Yes, she's definitely had some losses at slams that have been surprising. And the word that's come to mind when we've seen her play them is flat. And she came out very, very flat today onto court. Perhaps she was also up watching Alice against Zverev because she was looking in that first set how I was feeling watching it. Just, oh, my God, tennis is back on, and I'm having to partake in this? Like, what is going on?

18:49Matt Roberts: If you want to know how Matt Roberts has coped with today, he's wearing his plain trousers.

18:56Catherine Whitaker: I'm not, actually. They're not your plain trousers.

19:00Matt Roberts: Well, they look very good. They look like they could be plain trousers.

19:02Catherine Whitaker: Yes, I see why you've thought that. A comfortable vibe. Yes. and she was so flat and lost the first set 6-1 to Fernandes and she was having a torrid time on her own serve. She really wasn't serving well and she was finding the Fernandes game really tricky and one of the things you would look at, I think, as an opponent of Fernandes is what can I do to attack her serve? Fernandes wasn't serving particularly well but it was her second serve that was causing Pagula all sorts of issues. She had no range on her shots. Her body language was kind of bad. And I did think she was in some trouble here against Fernandes, but she cleaned it up, I would say, as this match went on.

19:47Catherine Whitaker: She still had to come through some dicey moments. She was struggling at the start of the second set. She was actually two break points down at one, all in the third as well. And Fernandes missed second serve returns on both of those that I think she would want back. But it was, as you say, Catherine, and good that for once she managed to find a bit of spark rather than let the flat performance continue. And it feels like she's just got through this one and will probably play better in future rounds because I do think Pagula is someone who absolutely thrives off rhythm and consistency. She's one of the best players in the world when it comes to trading ground strokes.

20:25Catherine Whitaker: And Fernandes was smart. She didn't allow that to happen too much in this match, using her slice, using her leftiness. and I don't think Pagula enjoyed that at all. She was just uncomfortable most of the time, but she got through it.

20:37Matt Roberts: I'd expect her to be as great a season as Serana Castella is having, and as well as she's playing. She beat Jasmine Paolini today, Castella. I would expect Pagula to enjoy that matchup far more in a couple of days' time.

20:52David Law: It's going to be more straightforward, isn't it? It's going to be ball striking.

20:56Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, I mean, they played a couple of weeks ago in Cincinnati, and Pagula was handling it absolutely fine, but she let it become an ordeal. She just couldn't serve it out, she couldn't keep a lead, and it got very tense in the third set, but I agree she was comfortable in that matchup from the start, so yes, I do think her stay is dangerous, you just don't really want to see her in your draw, but yeah, I do think Pagulo can come to that. Marta Kostiuk

21:24Matt Roberts: has set up a fourth round meeting with the Wimbledon champion, Lyndon Nozkovic Kostiuk handling getting Ekaterina Alexandrova handily today, 6-3, 6-2. Nozkova getting embroiled against Anne Lee, really embroiled and a bit like Taylor Townsend, losing a heartbreaker of a second set and coming back masterfully to win the third, 6-2. Kostya Nozkova is, I love that. I'm really into that matchup.

21:53David Law: You know, I didn't actually know that that was coming up as a match. So when you read that out, I thought, oh, what a tantalising prospect that is. The Wimbledon champion against one of the form players of the year in Marta Kostya.

22:06Catherine Whitaker: Repeat of the Wimbledon semi-final, which Noskaver won, of course. And yeah, this was a fun match against Anne Lee. Like she's, I've been banging the Anne Lee drum. Not like a huge drum, but just a little one, just for a little while. Just being like, she's pretty good, Anne Lee. Gets better when she gets a big win, you see.

22:27Matt Roberts: Matt actually said while watching this match, if Amanda Onisimova had Anne Lee's forehand, she'd be the best player in the world.

22:33Catherine Whitaker: I'll stand by it. And we were talking to Pam Shriver the other night who was coaching against Anne Lee the other night in Donna Vekic's box. And yeah, Pam was saying it's like an ATP forehand, the Anne Lee forehand, because she whips it and she's got a lot of topspin on it. And you just, you don't see that as much on the WTA tour. It tends to be a lot flatter hits. And she used that shot to really good effect to get back into this one and saved a match point in the second set, did Anne Lee, with an absolutely brilliant burst of tennis and won it with her forehand. And Noskova was doing that thing that we saw in the Wimbledon final when she was putting her fingers in her ears and blocking out the noise on court 17.

23:15Matt Roberts: I love that trademark move. I would support that becoming her trademark move. I like it. I think it's gangster. her and like we've seen it you know she's done it in moments where it's been going against her

23:29Catherine Whitaker: but given that she still went on to win the Wimbledon final it's now like a bit of a signal like oh like she's she's she's gonna be okay she's gonna turn this around you might just have to get through a dicey moment and even in that even in the third set it was it was close at the start but then but then Noskova settled down and Anlie played a really poor game to lose serve and um That was kind of the difference maker. But yeah, really good match. And like you, excited for Kostya at Noskova. The women's draw has just held up in a way that we just so rarely see. So many top players making it through.

24:03Catherine Whitaker: And that means now we're getting these big clashes. It's really exciting.

24:08Matt Roberts: Also set up today, Emma Navarro, who will play Anna Kalinskaya. Anna Kalinskaya has just taken down Alina Svitolina over on Armstrong. Navarro kind of low-key pulling off the upset. of the day, 6-3, 7-5 over the Wimbledon finalist, Karolina Mukova.

24:25David Law: Those are two results that I just wouldn't have expected. I would have been billing Mukova against Svitolina in that position and thinking what a great match-up that is.

24:37Matt Roberts: Are you about to confess to the premonition you had this morning?

24:39David Law: I woke up this morning thinking, crikey, Karolina Mukova seems like she's coming through this draw serenely. I thought she, I think she could win this tournament. and she was a set down and in a close tussle in the second set, and I thought she was turning it around. Huge credit to Navarro, you know, to pull that off. She's been having some results kind of low-key, I feel like, this year. She's won some good matches without really making any headlines, not really kind of getting on our agenda in quite the way that Muka has, for instance, but she's so steady and a player like Muka just has to play kind of pretty top level to dissect somebody like that and she she obviously didn't and then the Svitolina match just gone just now I mean that was a real knockdown drag out of Farah but they were just going toe to toe for a long time um it looked exhausting out there I mean it's very humid tonight isn't it and uh But, yeah, I'm surprised, though.

25:43David Law: I'm really surprised by both results.

25:45Matt Roberts: Have you heard Bjorn Fratangelo, Matt's husband and coach of Madison Keys, pushing Anna Kalinskaya for his own personal backhand list?

25:54Catherine Whitaker: Yes, you were telling me this. I'm all in favour. Don't push her for mine, but make your own list. That is exactly what I've been saying for a long time.

26:07David Law: yeah but the problem is matt you call yours the backhand list because i was first like the tennis

26:13Catherine Whitaker: podcast that's a good shame matt that's very good i thought i got you there uh okay on that note that

26:21Matt Roberts: is it for part one we'll be back in part two to talk about the very demure carlos alcaraz

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28:04Matt Roberts: Welcome back to part two of today's tennis podcast. Moving on to the men's draw now. And let's start with Carlos Alcaraz, 6 '3", 6 '4", 6 '1", over Wu-Yi Bing, slut-shamed into putting his nipples away. And in his own words, honestly, I'm better than I thought.

28:24Catherine Whitaker: What, addressing or hitting the ball? I think that was a tennis comment. That was a tennis comment, yeah. Yeah, and look, to me, it was actually his scratchiest, if I can use that term, not to describe his clothing, but his scratchiest tennis performance of the tournament. You know, I think in the first round, we were all just very impressed by his level after so long out. And then we talked about him hitting a really top level in sets two, three, and four against Faria. And today he came out playing really well and went up an early break and was really on it from the start of the match. And it's a very one-sided scoreline, but I thought he was fighting his game a little bit more in this one.

29:12Catherine Whitaker: And he was under pressure on serve a lot. His serve is definitely not clicking or firing. I can't quite figure out whether it's because he can't or because he's just holding back because he still doesn't really feel like he needs to go full pelt with it. But against someone like Wu Yibing, he was getting involved in just a lot of tussles on serve. Look, he's already lost serve more times this tournament than in the whole of last year's US Open when he went on to win the title. That's just the different place he's in now compared to last year where he was so sharp in every department. He was fighting his forehand a little bit.

29:53Catherine Whitaker: He was getting a little bit frustrated by that. He actually went out to practice after the match and hit forehands, hit some serves again, I believe. So he was very upbeat and joyful in that on-court interview, which is just brilliant to see. But I did get the sense watching that he thinks there's more to come and maybe he was expecting to play a little bit, better today overall but he was by no means bad and he he was pretty comfortable even if

30:24Matt Roberts: there was just quite a lot of long games i think he finds day and night very very different here doesn't he i do think adjusting day so he played day session then night session now day session again might very well go back to night session in a couple of days time i do think he finds that quite tough. I mean, look, it's the same for everybody, but I get the impression he mentions it a lot.

30:50David Law: Yeah, the fact that, I mean, it's classic Carcras, he doesn't pretend that it's not something that bothers him. A lot of people would, you know, but he's an open book, isn't he? And yeah, it does bother him.

31:01Matt Roberts: Yeah, he sure is an open book. I actually think maybe even more of an open book than we've ever seen before. I do think there's been a little bit of a shift in the Carlos Outgrows that we've seen since his comeback. I feel like, Matt, some of his shyness has been shed. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, I mean, the way he answered the question about the nipple.

31:30Catherine Whitaker: You know, he came out with the vest on today, of course, and he was asked about why he was wearing the vest. and he, with a very straight face initially.

31:43Matt Roberts: It was incredible line delivery, this incredible. Yeah, he said, well, I think I saw my nipple too much lately.

31:53Catherine Whitaker: And then he burst out kind of into a smile. I kind of want to know whether he's talking now about himself seeing it on court or seeing it all over the internet.

32:05Matt Roberts: I think both.

32:07Catherine Whitaker: Okay. Yeah. That makes sense.

32:09Matt Roberts: I mean, there was a BuzzFeed article about it. Like, it's gone. You don't have to be that online to have seen Carlos Alcaraz's nipple on the internet. He's quite online, you get the feeling, don't you?

32:22Catherine Whitaker: He's very quick to like Instagram posts and all that kind of stuff.

32:27Matt Roberts: Yeah. So I think both. I do also think it was bothering him. I mean, he said that. He was trying to kind of not throw Nike and Travis Scott under the bus, wasn't he, whilst also saying, he was actually asked, was this a Nike thing? He was like, no, it was my decision. I asked if we could do something about it. And he was asked how distracting it was and he sort of said, no, not very distracting but definitely a bit distracting. And yeah, he kind of suggested that he was going to continue to play with the vest. I could not stop laughing when I saw him come out in the vest. It was so funny. Imagine the conversation.

33:07Catherine Whitaker: that have gone on.

33:09Matt Roberts: I was disappointed when he took his shirt off at the end to do the outfit change, and it was revealed that it was a proper Nike vest that he was wearing. I'd imagined Alvaro being sent to Kmart to get a multi-pack of emergency vests, but it looked like it was a slightly more planned situation. He's improved the look.

33:34David Law: I really think it looks great now. Yeah.

33:41Matt Roberts: Yeah, I mean, I think some of the internet are disappointed, David, but I'm glad that you're pleased with this development. He plays Tommy Paul next. There's Carlos Alcaraz, which is one of those match-ups that we have in our mind is good, and that Tommy Paul can threaten and trouble Carlos Alcaraz, even a peaking Carlos Alcaraz maybe. But it is that sort of a residual feeling from the past, isn't it? It has been quite a long time since... Well, it's been since 2023 that Tommy Paul has beaten Alcaraz and the head-to-head is now 6-2.

34:20Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, his two wins were in Canada in back-to-back years. I think when I've seen that match-up in the past and it's been competitive. The thing that stands out to me is how well Tommy Paul moves and covers the court. And he's such a great athlete that I think he can hang in some of the incredible rallies that Alcarez produces in a way that other people on tour can't. And I think we've seen at times that shake Alcarez just a little bit. But, you know, at the slams in their last few meetings, Alcaraz has definitely had the better of it. It hasn't felt like a huge match-up problem for him. I think actually it's kind of sometimes been one of those match-ups that's ended up bringing out the best out of Alcaraz because he's kind of needed it.

35:16David Law: Like a Marvel film when two characters are going against one another and the real superhero just has to employ a level that the other one can't.

35:27Catherine Whitaker: And I think there's also a point here to be made about, is Tommy Paul in his best ever form? No, he's not. I'm not sure he is, you know. So it was a really good win for him today over Bublik, who he lost to last year. He won it in five. But in truth, Bublik totally faded in the last few sets and lost all of his resistance. And look, Paul was playing some good stuff. But Alkraze isn't going to fade like that, even just coming back from four months off. and yes, Alcaraz may not quite be at his sharpest, and that serve may be vulnerable, and Paul may be able to take the ball early there and cause some issues, but I think it's kind of, right, the tournament really starts now for Carlos Alcaraz.

36:14Catherine Whitaker: The first few rounds have been about finding himself back on court, figuring out what he's got. He's talked about how he's actually recovering from matches better than he expected to, and now it's like, okay, like I've got through those tricky first few rounds where maybe I could have been really rusty and lost the tournament I'm still here and now it's time to step it up even more and it wouldn't shock me if an even better Alcaraz appeared in that matchup in a couple of days

36:43Matt Roberts: he could very well face an all-American path through to a final Colos Alcaraz if he is to get there Tommy Paul next there's a lot of Americans in this section of the draw We're going to have Daniel Medvedev against Francis Tiafoe in the fourth round. We're going to have Alex Mickelson, who's in this section of the draw. We've got potential Ben Shelton, although we'll cover him in part three. He's still playing against Denis Shapovalov. But yeah, Medvedev to play Tiafoe. Medvedev having beaten Arta Rindeknesh today, 6-4, 6-4, 6-4. He rated his own performance a 7.5 or an 8 out of 10, did Medvedev.

37:22Matt Roberts: Matt, you've been monitoring volcanic activity. Do you have any updates for us?

37:27Catherine Whitaker: I think I'm prepared to declare him a dormant volcano. Huge. Not a prediction that he's going to win the title. But capable thereof. I think he's earned that status. I think I've considered what you said the other day. He's been very convincing so far this tournament. There have been no crash outs. There have been no drop sets. yeah contemplating a life of pickleball ahead of you has turned him into hell of a tennis player again and he's erupting is he no but there's a little bit of activity there's a bit of lava like yeah like an eruption i think is if well really i think it's if he beats someone and gets to the final until then it's just rumblings is that fair yeah i think so but it feels like something that he

38:24Matt Roberts: he might still have in him which was your question mark the other day remains to be proven whether he actually does it yeah but it feels like it might still be in there yes i think

38:34Catherine Whitaker: i think that's the the crucial that's the crucial thing he's got a very good record against tiafo he's got six one head-to-head lead i believe against him and actually i think tiafo's one is Lever Cup so count that if you want to.

38:50Matt Roberts: My big prediction is that that match will be played on Armstrong because Francis Tiafoe said to the Armstrong crowd after his very convincing win over Valentin Vachero on Armstrong tonight he said I'll see you back here on Sunday. That's how much I loved it and I asked him about how much he loves Armstrong and whether he's been requesting to play Armstrong in his press conference just now and he said I may or may not have been he said yeah I've I've been requesting Armstrong and said you know it just suits me there's a great vibe there's no VIP boxes in there the upper bowl is for grounds pass holders that that is that is Francis Tiafoe's vibe isn't it and he's never lost on that court but he's only ever beaten Medvedev in Labour Cup so

39:34David Law: something's got to give here I think it it gives him a better chance a tangibly better chance of winning that match, A, because he likes the vibe more, B, because it's a smaller, it looks at least like a smaller playing service and surround to the vast cavernous Arthrashe Stadium, which is where Daniel Medvedev can do all of his damage by standing so far back and running out so far wide. It's a little more enclosed. I think you're more likely to wind up Medvedev on this court, and that's what Tiafoe wants.

40:09Catherine Whitaker: Just on Medvedev, by the way, the other thing that came to me is that I do think the US Open often brings out the best in Medvedev. I know last year's loss to Benjamin Bonzi is the exception to that. That was very much the worst of Medvedev, but it's generally taken very good players with very good performances to beat him here, or very good players or very good performances. You know, like he's lost here to Sinner, Djokovic in a final. Kyrgios beat him here once on a night where he had everything going. Thiem beat him here en route to the title. Nadal beat him in a final. Like, he's not had that many really poor losses.

40:49Catherine Whitaker: And obviously now we're at a stage of the tournament where he's got through those rounds where he could have got tripped up by someone he's kind of better than and now we're into the meat of the tournament. But, yeah, he's way more convincing than I was expecting him to be.

41:06Matt Roberts: Likewise. Alex Mickelson, David, has set up a fourth round meeting with Thomas Martin Echeverry, two unseeded players. He beat Daniel Merida today in straight sets. Mickelson, you're a Mickelson guy. I am.

41:23David Law: And increasingly so. I love watching him play. I think what it is, I've been trying to work out for a while, what is it about this guy that I really like watching him play? There are certain things he does that remind me of Pete Sampras, just in terms of movement and his stroke production on the forehand. And he showed some incredible athleticism at the net today and leapt into the air to slam dunk a smash away. And I think he's super dangerous. I don't understand how this guy is not seeded. How can he not be one of the 32 best players to be seeded for this tournament? I think it's underachievement, really, in that respect.

42:09David Law: And listen, there are a lot of factors that go in, health and so forth. But I think back to when he beat Sitsapas in the Australian Open last year, at the start of last year. I think back to when he beat or lost to Rafael Hoda at the French Open a few months ago. And he was totally in charge of that match. He was outplaying Hoda. He was knocking him off the court, really, at two sets to one. And then he ran into some physical issues. And I attended his press conference. And as well as talking about whether this is the best he's ever felt as a tennis player, which he confirmed it is, I asked him whether, is this, are you sort of feeling now more comfortable kind of in your own skin around the tennis circuit?

42:51David Law: Because he comes across as slightly shy and a bit of an oddball compared to some of the other American players. He's not one of the crowd in quite the same way. And when I went to his press conferences in 2005 at the Australian, or 2025 in the Australian Open last year, I thought, crikey, he's having to sort of fight his own shyness and his own feeling that maybe I don't completely belong in this in this environment and and he's trying to just sort of deal with it he's totally different now in terms of how he comes across I saw his on-court interview a couple of days ago he was so outgoing and he was so exuberant and I thought and loud you know it's a bit like watching Sam Query's transformation from completely uninteresting press conference interviewee to suddenly this personality that he's become.

43:46David Law: Obviously not to that same degree, maybe, but, you know, it's a big difference in terms of how he comes across. And I asked him also, and he said, yeah, I'm more comfortable now. It's taken me a bit of time and I feel more comfortable. And I said, well, what do you think separates you from where you are to where you want to be as a tennis player. He said, oh, the physical side. He said, for the last year, I've worked hard on being fitter and stronger and faster, but I did absolutely nothing before that. I did no physical work at all. And I said, well, was that lack of knowledge or was that lack of application?

44:23David Law: He said, oh, it was application. I never went to the gym. I'd just played tennis. I didn't, and he says, basically, I haven't got a leg to stand on. It was my fault. now I've got two great trainers and I'm doing all the right things but fascinating to to hear his

44:39Catherine Whitaker: candor about that yeah and he said how he wasn't really expected to turn pro you know he was never really thinking about it about tennis in those terms I think until he got to like 17 or something he said and that and that just is interesting when you compare to you know some other names in the drawer I'm sure who it was kind of destined for from when they were probably you know like a young kid and they've probably been doing loads of physical work for a very long time alongside their tennis and he's just kind of playing catch-up in that sense and it does make you think about how much more room to improve and grow that there is because most people at his age have probably been doing everything right for a very long time, and it's little things they can still improve.

45:33Catherine Whitaker: It feels like Mickelson's kind of feeling like he's got quite a lot, a long way to go. I think he has. And I think actually the one that came to mind, I don't know whether it's quite the same in terms of not doing the work, but if you speak to any of the American players about Taylor Fritz, they all say when he was younger he was not a good mover, he was not a good athlete, and he's absolutely worked so hard on that and put himself, you know, right at the top of that American pack. And maybe Mickelson can, you know, follow that trend and learn from him.

46:10Matt Roberts: And if he can make up that lost ground, it's a far healthier place to be to not have been groomed to be a tennis player your whole life. Like, obviously, that is an accelerator and that's an effective way of creating tennis players. That's why parents and academies and so on do it. But, you know, it's borderline unethical in a lot of cases and doesn't create well-adjusted human beings. and quite often that can feel like a ticking time bomb in tennis players. So if he can make up that lost ground, it feels like he might be in really good stead. It's the winner of Mikkelsen-Echevere to face the winner of Medvedev-Tiafoe.

46:56Matt Roberts: Look, both draws are shaping up really well, aren't they? There are some really fun sections in both draws and it's very finely poised. We still have Stefanos Tsitsipas to talk about. He awaits the winner of Ben Shelton against Denis Shapovalov. Shapovalov. That match is currently on call. We're going to go and watch it. And we'll be back in part three to talk about it and look ahead to tomorrow. AI is only as powerful as the platform it's built into. That's why it's no surprise that more than 85 % of the 14500 use the ServiceNow AI platform. While other platforms duct tape tools together, ServiceNow seamlessly unifies people, data, workflows, and AI connecting every corner of your business.

47:39Matt Roberts: And with AI agents working together autonomously, anyone in any department can focus on the work that matters most. Learn how ServiceNow puts AI to work for people at servicenow.com.

48:07Catherine Whitaker: percent cash back at different places each quarter, like grocery stores, on gas, and at restaurants. It pays to Discover. Terms apply. See discover.com slash five for details.

48:21Matt Roberts: Welcome back to part three of today's tennis podcast, where it is now 20 plus two in the morning. We're back at Tennis Podcast Towers, Manhattan. And Matt, we're celebrating a new US Open record.

48:33Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, history made. The first ever US Open with three finishes past 2am.

48:44Matt Roberts: And still nine days to go.

48:47David Law: So exciting. Think what we could achieve in that time.

48:54Matt Roberts: We're trying not to think about what could be achieved in that time, David. Matt's got Fulham kicking off in seven and a half hours. Yep.

49:02Catherine Whitaker: David's got Albion. You've got Reading.

49:05Matt Roberts: Yep.

49:06Catherine Whitaker: Pumped. We will be here.

49:08Matt Roberts: But we'll certainly be somewhere. Let's talk about Ben Shelton, who we've just seen beat. Denis Shapovalov, 7-6, 6-7, 6-3, 6-4. We cut these guys a bit of slack because it's not ideal taking to a tennis court at 10.30, starting a match at 10.45. And of course, for the whole build-up, not knowing exactly what time you'd end up taking to the tennis court. And yet we're talking here in particular about Shelton as a title contender, David, and that was some scratchy old tennis we saw from both players. But, you know, Shelton's the one that needs the analysis here.

49:53David Law: yeah he did a good job to get over the line without having to go five that's probably about as complimentary as you can get really because this is not the ben shelton of a year ago in terms of the form that he's showing i mean he was he was flying a year ago at this tournament and then he he had a horrible experience when when he tore a a muscle a pectoral muscle i think it was and and or a shoulder i can't exactly remember but he was in a terrible state and he there's no way he could continue and and continue in the tournament um at the moment he's just used the word scratchy he's scrapping around trying to find form and multiple times he was a breakup in this match and then got broken back um we we've had that 6-1 set that he lost the first set of the tournament that he played which james blake tonight in commentary called it the worst said he's ever seen shelton play um and i don't know whether it's pressure i don't know what it is but he he doesn't look in top form at all he's trying to find it um i think there were some good signs in in the sort of mid to late portion of the match in terms of the power he was finding on the ground strokes and particularly the success he was having when he went to net he at one stage I saw a stat pop up saying he'd been successful 35 out of 40 net approaches.

51:24David Law: Now, I don't think Shapovalov is the world's greatest passing shot player or returner. So that has something to do with it. But, you know, it's a good sign you're putting pressure on, you're getting success. But he is going to have to raise this level several notches if he's going to do what I thought he would do, which is win this title. He doesn't look like the title winner at the moment. Stefanos Tsitsipas next, that's not the worst thing. But, you know, I think he will win that. But, you know, it's tough to imagine he would win the title playing like this.

52:04Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, agreed, really. I thought he did quite well by the end. He had his serve going and he, you know, was broken a lot in the first two sets of this match. and then not in the latter two sets. So he definitely improved as this one went on after a very sloppy start. And yeah, Stefano Sitsipas, I mean, I don't really know what to make of that matchup, to be honest.

52:34Matt Roberts: Beat Le Hetchke today in four sets to reach that fourth round.

52:38Catherine Whitaker: Yeah, look, a few weeks ago, I wouldn't have been worried about that matchup at all for Ben Shelton. I think a lot of his weapons suit playing Sitsapas quite well. The big swinging serve into the Sitsapas one-handed backhand return, that feels like that's going to be very successful for Ben Shelton. But I must say, Sitsapas is playing with a bit of a spark again. It's only three matches. And obviously the first round against Feast, he was getting beaten handily until Feast's energy dip. but he's been impressive the way he's stayed in these matches after dropping the first set and really took over.

53:21Catherine Whitaker: I watched a bit of the final set today against Lehekshko and he was absolutely flowing. So I even think Shelton's going to have to raise it for that one, you know, because Tsitsipas, there's a similarity there, I suppose, with Shapovalov in terms of their career trajectories, but I think Sitsapas has always had a higher level in him and is playing with a bit more confidence just as a result of these wins. I would still expect Shelton to win, but yeah, it's unconvincing.

53:57Matt Roberts: I would expect him to be in the same slot as well in a couple of days' time. He's now in the situation that Zverev's in where they have to schedule him at night. I'd expect it to be the second night session match after Sabalenka Townsend, I would have thought. So, you know, if he didn't like the situation he was in tonight, Ben Shelton, and I thought coming out onto court, he didn't look like he loved that situation. And fair enough. Yeah, he's likely, I think, to be in the same one in a couple of days' time. I'll obviously let you know tomorrow once the schedule is out for Sunday. In terms of Saturday's schedule, it looks thus.

54:35Matt Roberts: Arthur Ashe Stadium starting again at 11.30am with Taylor Fritz against Francisco Sarundolo, second on Christina Bookcher, taking on Coco Gough. Winner of that to face the winner of the first night session match on Ashe, Evie Jovic against Alex Iala. Alex Iala making her Arthur Ashe Stadium debut. That one feels so on a knife edge, doesn't it, Iala Jovic?

55:03David Law: It does, and inevitably, Iala's getting the headlines, the publicity. She is this incredible story for sport, really. But Jovic is such a tough player. They're great friends. It's a really interesting dynamic, all of that. I think Iala will win because I just think she's just got such a flowing game and a hurtful game. but she's going to have to play really well.

55:35Matt Roberts: Cannot wait for that match. Really cannot wait. Following that on the Arthrasch Stadium, Alexander Zverev in his eternal nightmare slot against Alejandro Tabilo. I know he's been getting himself tied in knots against everybody so far, but Tabilo should be meat and drink for him, shouldn't he? I mean, there's a golfing class and Tabilo's a lefty and Leonard Tien, I think the only lefty that's very first lost to in the last few years. He just doesn't lose to lefties. So I'd be surprised if he and we don't get a slightly earlier night, but it is the 2026 US Open, folks. So who knows? Armstrong tomorrow opens with Amanda Anisimova against Anastasia Potapova.

56:24Matt Roberts: That match starts in eight and a half hours, Matt.

56:27Catherine Whitaker: yep just when Fulham were attacking the Hammersmith end for the second half thank you very much schedulers for that for that clash yeah I mean Potopova has been in no form at all since a very strong start to the season actually and she beat Coco Goff at the French Open she was playing I think the best tennis of her career but hasn't been in good form and Nisimov's form has improved in that time so I do expect to win that one.

56:57Matt Roberts: Alexander Blocks taking on Flavio Caballi, second in the day session on Armstrong. I think that could be, I mean, look, anything's tricky for Flavio on any given day, but I think that could be trouble for Caballi. We will see. Armstrong tomorrow opens the night session with Naomi Osaka against Elisa Mertens. And this might be where our late finish comes from tomorrow. Jakub Mensik against Lerna Tien, the final match of the day. It could be great, that, but also could be long and late. Oh, tennis. Grandstand tomorrow opens with Madison Keys against Jung Chinwen. Can't wait for that one. Followed by Iger Shontek against Marie Buskova.

57:41Matt Roberts: Michael Zheng taking on lucky loser Arthur Zeyer. Artur Gea and Jaroslav Starob Dobsava is that her first name Jaroslava? Yulia Yulia so close dear oh dear Yulia Starob Dobsava taking on Elena Rabakina the final match on grandstand tomorrow Androva against Bartonkova is second on Stadium 17 third on is Hashanov Bonzi and fourth on is Zizi Bergz against my man, Bertic van der Zanschup. The marvel that is, folks. And that's it for today's tennis podcast, except to say hello to Leo, who's really raising the bar for Grand Slam mascot photo content. It is an extraordinary showing from Leo so far. And much like the US Open's late finish record, still nine days to go.

58:42Matt Roberts: Who knows what Leo could still have in store? Here he is wearing a bandana and some shades. And Vicky says, Leo has been hearing a lot about influencers at the US Open. He's not sure what they do, but when he wore his Cut the Faf t-shirt, quite a lot of people bought one. So he's wondering if that makes him an influencer. I think that's the very definition of an influencer. Here he is trying out his best influencer pose. 10 out of 10, Leo. We thank you for your excellent content. Hello to our mascots, Bozy, Bodie, Maisie and Roger. Hello to you. Hello to our top folks and executive producers. Hello, Greg.

59:21Matt Roberts: Hello, Chris. Hello, Jeff. I would go to Matt for shout outs, but his face sayeth no.

59:29Catherine Whitaker: I've invoked a policy. I put a curfew on shout outs. And we long past it. That's good.

59:38Matt Roberts: Okay, shout outs, hopefully, to return tomorrow. Folks, we are part of the Athletic Podcast Network. And before you go, a note to say that if you're an NFL fan, the Athletic is something really exciting starting next week. The Athletic Live, which is presented by Google Gemini, is a brand new YouTube watch-along on NFL game days featuring the biggest and best beat reporters that the Athletic has to offer. You can even become part of the show in the interactive chat on YouTube. And it all starts from September 8th. Great news, guys. It sounds like a party is starting next door.

1:00:17David Law: That's what we need, isn't it? That's what we need.

1:00:20Matt Roberts: I was like, who's playing music?

1:00:22Catherine Whitaker: Oh, it's out. It's outside.

1:00:23Matt Roberts: Someone's playing cool in the gang in the corridor.

1:00:28David Law: Great.

1:00:30Matt Roberts: Oh, tennis, folks. What a time. We are part of the Athletic Podcast Network. Thank you for listening. Whatever the time it is, we will be back tomorrow and we'll speak to you then.

1:01:03Catherine Whitaker: on gas, and at restaurants. It pays to Discover. Terms apply. See discover.com slash five for details.

1:01:10David Law: Hey everyone, it's Chris Guillebeau here, host of the Side Hustle School podcast. This episode is powered by AT &T Business. In my early days, I did some of my best work in parked cars or coffee shops. But when I landed my first big contract, I realized I couldn't bet my future on a public connection that cuts out if someone turns on a blender. As a small business owner, you're already wearing at least 10 hats. You shouldn't have to be your own IT department as well. That's why I rely on AT &T Business. They keep your connectivity reliable so you have one less thing to worry about. Powered by AT &T Business, built to work.

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