Amorim’s Man United knocked out by Grimsby, as Arsenal head to Anfield

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1:21Thursday, the 28th of August, just after a midweek that was not kind to managers who wedded their philosophies in the Champions League playoffs. Disaster for Rangers. Duncan Alexander is here with us. Hello. In the Carabide Cup for Ruben Amorim and Manchester United. Tom Williams also here with us. Hello, James. And Colin Miller as well. What to say about Wednesday night at Grimsby Town? Good, wasn't it? Oh, it's Grimsby's night They've reeled in the big fish And a story that will be told From generation to generation In Grimsby Ecstatic scenes on the Lincolnshire coast Extraordinary At first I thought maybe ITV and Sky Broadcasting the fixture was too much But if anything we needed a third broadcaster Well let's see what we can add to the picture now Now, if you missed it, Manchester United Football Club, I think we'll add that in this instance, who were only in this round of the Carabao Cup because they finished 15th last season and failed to qualify for Europe, went to fourth tier Grimsby Town and League Two Grimsby Town, who play in League Two, promptly knocked them out after a penalty shootout.

2:42It was a proper United line-up as well, Tom.

2:45Colin Millar: Well, in the sense that it was, of course, the uncontestable 3-4-2-1 formation, Lots of changes to the starting XI, but nevertheless, a group of players who should have been able to play with, I was going to say a degree more coherence, multiple degrees more coherence than they managed. And just a brilliant, brilliant cup tie, biblical reign at the start of the second half. And yeah, an absolutely fantastic underdog performance and yet more problems for poor old beleaguered Ruben Amarin. Yeah, we mentioned on Sunday Amarim's floor stare of despair during the Fulham draw. Wednesday night, spent the shootout at the end of the game, stood not with his staff, but alone, sat on the bench, head in hands, shaking quietly.

3:31Colin, worrying times. Yeah, yeah, and as Tom said, the sort of thunderstorm backdrop to this match kind of gave it that cup tie vibe, didn't it, with the epic penalty shootout at the end. And there were so many moments in that shootout as well, there were so many sort of talking points within it that made it really interesting. Well, we'll get on to those because to tell us more about the magnificent Mariners Grimsby town, we're joined now by Grimsby fan and former Soccer AM host Lloyd Griffith. Lloyd, hello. Oh, good morning. How are you? Yeah, I'm very well. Are you outside a train station?

4:03I am outside the train station at Cleethorpes. Yeah, I'm jumping on a train about 15 minutes to go back to London. If I'm being brutally honest, I didn't think that I would need to do the media rounds this morning. I thought it'd be a closed shop, you know what I mean? would have got thumped four in the last time. I can have a lie, maybe a couple of pints. I've been up since seven o 'clock doing Radio 4, 5 Live. It's a lovely story, as you just alluded to. It's a proper underdog victory, and the whole town is buzzing this morning. People wearing their shirts, car horns going off. It's a lovely atmosphere.

4:33Everywhere you look, it's winner, winner, chicken dinner, as the famous motto of Grimsby Town runs. It is one of the famous mottos of Grimsby Town. I mean, it's one of our mottos. It's been around since 1878, actually, that motto. Not just happy with fish, you need chicken on top. It's like a buffet of success. Look, it's all about protein, Duncan. You know what I mean? It's all about protein, so fish and chicken. And you've got your Just Desserts against Man United, Lloyd. Extraordinary action. So you were on holiday in Malta and cut your holidays short to get back for the game, almost didn't make it.

5:08Yeah. But you were there. It was a situation where I didn't necessarily have the second round of the Carabao Cup in my diary. so when me and my partner decided to go to Malta it wasn't something that I needed to really factor in and then when you get drawn at home to Manchester United it isn't something you have to factor into a relationship it's like how do I broach can I come back to Grimsby for this and so bless her she let me when I say let me I mean you know she's a lovely lady but as in she was like yeah fine let's cut our holiday short so I came back via Manchester she went back to Gatwick and a friend of mine picked me up and you know we haven't played each other since 1948.

5:47We spent a lot of time in the top flight of English football but we just never played Manchester United since 1948 so it was a game that I just wasn't going to miss. Can you believe what you witnessed, Lloyd? The going 2-0 up, the thinking you had a third and that shootout that was epic. What was it, 20 minutes long? Yeah, 20 minutes long. I mean, it did really have everything. Do you know what I mean? You say you had the biblical storm in the second half. Like a lot of the lads and I sit with my mum in the upper fenders I'm sorry the upper Ramsden's home furnishings stand as it's called this year and the lad in front of us he works at the dock and he got an alert from one of his mates on a boat be like there's a flash storm coming I was like what and then we're following this storm and then it was just it was great I mean we were tuning up at half time and we said at half time look no matter what happens obviously you're gonna have to make changes because they're losing to Grimsby town whatever happens we've had this 45 minutes and we ran them off the park like there's no denying it I'm not sure if you saw the whole game, but we absolutely dominated Premier League, Manchester United for a full 60 minutes.

6:49And it was lovely. Obviously, they brought on Bruno Fernandes and it swung back into their kind of favour. And then to go to penalties, you know, the scoreboard says 12-11. So, you know, it does look like we won 12-11 after 95 minutes if you look at the scoreboard. But yeah, I've never seen in life penalties go on for that long. All right. Christy Pym, the hero, the Grimsby Town goalkeeper, who told Nathalie Jedder afterwards that he's actually a Man United fan and saved that, well, Cunha's second penalty because it went round, of course, the shootout. What a moment, Lloyd, the extraordinary pitch invasion.

7:24What a joyous encapsulation of just pure sporting joy that was. Yeah, and it was a moment where it did just keep going on and we weren't sure how it was going to end. And I think, you know, when we got to the second round of penalties, it's like, look, if we go out here, we've held our heads up high. And also, I have to say, probably quite difficult for Man Utd to do their research on Grimsby Town penalty takers when Henry Brown, bless him, I think has played five senior games and hasn't taken a penalty in his professional career. How is Inanna doing homework for that? So, look, if Manchester United want Christy Pym, I don't work for the club, but I'm sure I can broker that deal.

7:59£35 million is yours. But it was amazing. Then the pitch invasion. I mean, it was everything you want in a cup tie. And the dust hasn't really settled. I'm talking about it and, you know, doing various interviews. But I think when I get on that train and just kind of have a little moment, I'll think, oh, that actually happened. And I'm just going to devour every interview, every highlight package there is going on that train. It's one for the ages. Magnificent. I think, Lloyd, you've got a train coming up and about seven interviews to do before that. So we'll let you go. And maybe, holidays permitting, we'll speak to you after the third round against Sheffield Wednesday.

8:32I am not putting any holidays into my diary for that week. I will be going to Sheffield on my holiday. So we're actually, weirdly, my other half is from, so it might actually work out in my favour this time round. So, but yeah, thanks for having me and of the Mariners. Lloyd Griffith, who was certainly in a good mood this Thursday morning. Cock a hoop. Indeed so. That pitch invasion really was a thing of beauty, especially because it was on a greasy pitch. So you had people tumbling left, right and centre. And such was the mood of... A good-natured pitch invasion. It was. So good-natured that...

9:06Did you see the TV director?

9:07Colin Millar: Scenes we like to see for once, rather than scenes the commentator instantly condemns. Right. Good joy, not bad joy. There was one young waif who approached a TV camera only to be shouldered out of the way by a young fellow who wanted to try a knee slide on national television. failed but then the director so was the mood of Bon Ami that the director just stayed on and said have another go and he got his moment knee slide followed by a Stephen Gerrard style camera snog so ticking off multiple professional footballer celebrations well done that man and Lloyd was saying about the shootout and their feeling that whatever happens we've done ourselves proud it was really noticeable how the faces of tension even when Man United were ahead in the shootout that you looked on the Grimsley Town bench and the manager was smiling and chuckling.

9:51The players were grinning ruefully at times, but grinning anyway. Whereas again, you looked on Man United's bench and it was just a pit of despair. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, obviously they did the body language. They showed out much of the match was completely different. And I think the way, I mean, obviously if you're a fan in that stadium, you're a Grimsby Town fan, I mean, that was a night that you're never going to forget. That you're always going to have that no matter what happens the rest of the season from the years that are going to come by. You're always going to have those moments and you're never going to forget it and that's obviously obviously what makes football so special for a lot of people when you're following a team week in week out and you get those moments obviously the flip side of it is probably the much bigger story in a way well um and obviously james you mentioned the ruben amaran body language uh during the shootout but his interview after the match was was i thought extraordinary what did he say um he said to multiple uh media outlets i thought the players spoke really loudly today and then he said something has to change and you're not going to change 22 players again.

10:50There you go. Laurie Whitwell was also in Cleethorpe for the match and he joins us now. Hey, Laurie. Hi, guys. How are you doing? Very, very well. Laurie, the opening two games of the Premier League season haven't been kind to Manchester United, but this, how would you describe this? An idea, unprecedented. It was kind of wild to be in this stadium and witnessing this event, you know, the rain pouring down. There's so many different aspects to it to kind of unpick. But I think you're right there in terms of Ruben Amarin's statements after the game being the most important, kind of most relevant to what happens next, because it certainly seemed to me that he was hinting at at least talks about his future, if not even one step further and potentially him offering his position, because he's touched on that before.

11:36In the last season, we reported on The Athletic at the time. And then he spoke to us in Chicago about that situation, saying that it was more about him than the club in terms of whether it would continue or not. Now, maybe that's him speaking with the emotion of having witnessed that game. And certainly he is a manager who feels a lot during the game and then afterwards. And maybe in the coming days, he'll calm down and sort of be more reflective if that is indeed what he was hinting at. But he was given opportunity to clarify and kept it fairly cryptic. So it kind of feels like a pretty significant event for Manchester United, a historic event.

12:11And where that leaves Ruben Amarin in this team and this club and this regime, I don't really know. But you certainly wouldn't rule out a change coming, potentially, in the international break that's coming up after this weekend. Yeah, I think everything's open at the moment, you know, because of the way that Amarin was speaking. I think he could have diffused the situation, said, listen, it's a really bad night. Maybe he felt that he had to be so strong because it was such a bad occasion. But I feel that him speaking on those terms does bring it into the realms of possibility. Let's say, you know, previously when he's done this, the club have persuaded him not to and kind of backed him with signings and kind of support.

12:46But yeah, I feel like, you know, maybe it's different this time. Maybe it's not. You know, the initial soundings that I'm getting would be surprised, perhaps if he does depart. But I think we're in the realms of at least talking about it right now. Right. Sometimes managers can say that kind of thing as almost a challenge either to the club or to the players. But everything about his body language, not just on Wednesday night, but throughout the start of the season suggests that he is deeply unhappy to be in charge of that team. Ruben Amorim certainly gets fingers pointed at him over his tactical inflexibility, but he wasn't the only one who shoulders the blame for Wednesday's defeat.

13:21Andre Onana might not be feeling too happy with his return to the first team. No, yeah, obviously that was the big talking point from the start of the season, who would be in goal. Altai Bayinder was selected by Ruben Amorim. Andre Rennard wasn't even in the squad for the Arsenal game, back on the bench at Fulham and now starting his first game, getting his first minutes of the season. And yeah, it was a disaster, wasn't it? I mean, the first goal, letting it slip through his hands and then it looked like he was trying to atone for the second goal, sort of getting in the mix on the players. And yeah, it's a difficult situation maybe for a goalkeeper to totally be powerful on.

13:55But yeah, to look that bad against League 2 opposition, I think is a damning indictment really of where United are at with the goalkeepers. At least he scored his penalty, shall we say that? Because then the penalty shootouts, he had that one save that was a really good save, but then for me, he just kept diving really strongly to his left, repeatedly. And even then, the ones that he got his hand to, he wasn't strong enough on. I mean, I guess penalties, you're a bit of a hostage to fortune, but it didn't fill you with confidence. So yeah, I mean, that's another area that they're going to have to look at.

14:25And they are obviously in talk with Antwerp for Sene Lamans, the 23-year-old goalkeeper. But it's a big situation to come in if they do pull that deal off, to then a young lad that has had one full season at Antwerp to kind of come into this unprecedented atmosphere. Talking of the shootout, Laurie, what do we make of Sesco being the final outfield player to take one? That seems a bit odd for a big new number nine signing, right? Have you not got a stat for us there? On the last time a 70-odd million pound signing was the 10th penalty taker, the last outfield penalty taker in a shootout on his first appearance.

15:01Got to be a unique occasion, that as well, right? Yeah, I mean, I'm going to steal another stat from my colleague, Mark Critchley, who said that apparently he's converted 11 of his 11 penalties that he's taken in regulation football. So for him to be, it's not like he doesn't take penalties. Were they trying to protect him a little bit in case he did miss and then became the story? But I think really you should be having a striker take a penalty earlier than that. I mean, to be fair, you know, Harry Maguire, who is a central defender, is actually really good at penalties. Diego Dallow as well has converted in penalty shootouts before.

15:33But I'd probably put Sesko ahead of Matthijs Delic, right? I mean, I know Delic scored, but you're sort of thinking, surely the guy that he spent all this money on should be higher up the order. But yeah, it was another curious anomaly of a night of many anomalies. Well, it was another of the players who United have spent a lot of money on this summer. Mbemo, who missed then his second penalty to seal Grimsby's passage to the next round. It's Burnley at Old Trafford this weekend. Laurie, they couldn't, could they? Well, I thought that coming to Grimsby, you know, on my drive over here, Longall Drive, I was over in Anglesea on a family holiday and I thought, I need to get to Grimsby just in case something happens.

16:08And I'm currently here in Cleethorpes, here in the Seagulls' chirp, right next to Blumdorff Park, actually. And so, yeah, I thought that couldn't happen. It did. So I'm not writing anything off with this Manchester United team now. Yeah, in a weird way, I kind of feel like they would prefer a big team to go up against in the next game because they could get themselves up for it. I kind of worry that Burnley at home at Old Trafford sort of might be another one of these, I don't know, lethargic performances. That was what Amaran was really agitated about last night. The fact that they didn't start the game with intensity.

16:39He was really on it from the kickoff, kind of trying to instruct them where to be, which again, you can maybe get into in terms of, is that the best thing for this group of players, having a head coach that is so particular about positioning at this particular stage? But yeah, I mean, Burnley obviously coming off the back of a good win in their second game in the Premier League season. So they look like they've got a little bit about them at least. United have to win this game, really. I mean, maybe it still becomes a footnote in the wider picture. But I certainly think that it would be an absolute cataclysmic start to the season if they were to lose this one.

17:13Indeed. Burnham beat Derby 2-1 at Turf Moor on Tuesday in the Carabao Cup round two. You've got to head off, Laurie. Are you heading back to Anglesey now? I am indeed, yes. I'm a four-hour drive. I point out, Anglesey to Cleethilx, back to Anglesey, is one of the greatest journeys anyone's ever made in this country. Really? In terms of what? Seafront? West to east, back to west to east. Yeah, it's ridiculous. When the draw was made, and I realised I was always going to be away on this holiday, I just thought, I've never been to Grimsby before, I'm never probably going to watch a match at Blundell Park, with United certainly being there.

17:47It had all these ingredients for this occasion, and as it transpired, obviously, not for positive reasons for United, but it was a spectacle to be there. So I'm glad I made the journey. I've got some energy just about for the trip back, although four hours sleep for fuel, I might need a couple of Red Bulls on the way. Excellent. Laurie, we're so glad that you went along and many, many thanks for joining us today. Thanks so much for having me, guys. Cheers. Laurie Whitwell. Kieran Maguire putting up an interesting chart. Did you see this on social media on Thursday morning? Grimsby versus Man United financial comparisons.

18:21You can pick out loads of things in the percentage difference column that he's put. But I personally like total squad cost, which Man United's is 1.27 billion and a bit. Grimsby's is a bit. And the percentage difference is 483, 451%. It's a big old percentage. It certainly is. still 11v11 on the pitch and it's still 12v11 at the shootout I mean I do think I don't want to go full little Englander but I do sometimes think that overseas managers underestimate the strength of the pyramid in England because Amorim kept saying after the game it was a fourth division team which one was he referring to very fair but League 2 is a strong league and yeah I think compared to a country like Portugal or Holland or somewhere like that these teams can, I think they surprise managers sometimes.

19:20But I think all through the game, his body language, as Colin said, was just weird. He didn't watch the penalty shootout. He had his tactics board later on in the game, which he was shuffling around. But I don't understand, what was he doing? It was like rosary beads, not rosemary beads.

19:37Colin Millar: It felt potentially like the precise moment in which he became a meme. And that is never a good moment for any manager. And I think the tactics board is key because it strikes at the heart of the problem. And the big problem for Amorim is that he's looking through the wrong end of the telescope. The questions he should be asking are, how do I make this team better? How do I fit these players into the positions where they will be able to play their best football? But the only question he seems to be asking is, how do I fit these players into my preferred 3-4-2-1 formation? You take the case of Kobi Meynou, for example, probably the most talented footballer to have come through the United Academy since Marcus Rashford.

20:21Colin Millar: Now looks like he's going to have to leave against his own will, pretty much, if he wants to get first team football somewhere. The problem that Amarim has created for himself is that he's decided that Fernandes and Meynou cannot play alongside each other in the midfield too. but because he's signed a Beimo and Cunha in the window, Fernandes has to drop deeper. A slightly more experienced manager or a less dogmatic manager would think, well, Fernandes kind of needs two pairs of legs alongside him. I'll pick Mainu and someone else, you know, Ugarte or Casemiro or whoever. But because it has to be 3-4-2-1, Mainu is basically going to be forced out of the club, a club that he loves, a club where he is adored by the fans.

21:03Colin Millar: Having shown he's good enough purely because of this tactical straitjacket that the manager has decided to fit himself in. Unless, as we were hinting, there is a change on that front over the next day or two, week or two, Colin. Yeah, well, this is a point that I think does need to be made. You're now talking about Amarim's future and how long is that going to last, but Manchester United have, what, at the time of recording, four or five days left of the transfer window and they're desperate to sell players. It specifically is down to the system that Amarim has, the players that he does and doesn't want.

21:31And not just that, but as Tom said, those players include Alejandro Granato, Kobe Manu, players who came through the academy and when we talk about Manchester United and the attachment they have to the youth system and the players that come through and the players that do mean something to the club and I know that there's extenuating circumstances on a case-by-case basis but fundamentally they've been trying to sell both of those players since January because they don't fit Amarim's system so if Amarim's going to leave and there's going to be a new system would all of a sudden they want those players again?

22:00I mean this is probably the worst possible moment for Manchester United as a club in deciding what is going to happen, not just in the next week, but in the next season. Worst possible moment so far, I think you would add. All right, well, so Burnley at the weekend. Let's park the magnificent exploits of the Mariners' Grimsby Town and the worrying times at Manchester United. And next up, get on to what awaits in Manchester 3 of the Premier League.

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24:03best football writers around. Matchday 3 off the Premier League kicks off Saturday lunchtime. Chelsea against Fulham. That'll be fun. 3 o 'clock games are Wolves against Everton. Spurs-Bournemouth, Manchester United-Burnley and Sunderland-Brentford who are having their first top-flight meeting since May 1947. 5.30 on Saturday, Leeds take on Newcastle. Brighton-Man City is one of the 2 o 'clock games on Sunday, the other being Nottingham Forest against West Ham where there's also a significant degree of pressure on the manager Graham Potter. At 4.30 on Sunday, last season's top two Liverpool and Arsenal face off at Anfield and that's followed by a 7 o 'clock game.

24:47It's Aston Villa against Crystal Palace. Why, Duncan? Well, why indeed? The suits say it's because of Palace's sudden involvement in the Conference League. They have to stick it on a Sunday night. Well, we saw this invented as a concept last season with teams playing on Thursday night and finding out that they can suddenly move games to Sunday at seven o 'clock. It's not fun for anyone, is it? It's not. No one needs that. It's a very COVID-era match slot, isn't it? But that was the match slot that Aston Villa, whenever they beat Liverpool 7-2, was a late Sunday match. So let's not write off the Villa Park seven o 'clock.

25:23I mean, Villa Park does, I mean, you mentioned Project Restart. I mean, obviously the Hawkeye occlusion was at Villa Park. So it's got some heritage. Hawkeye occlusion. That's what the Wikipedia page is called, I believe. Reminders about the Hawkeye occlusion. Well, there were too many people on the goal line, so although Sheffield United should have scored, Hawkeye just kind of shrugged and went... Exploded. If Big Sam was still Premier League managing, he would have tacticked that up and installed a certain number of defenders on the goal line for any chance. Mind you, I suppose that would stop balls going in anyway.

25:57Yeah, possibly. We'll move on. So, well, headlining that set of fixtures, without doubt, is Liverpool against Arsenal. Last season's top two. Both clashes last season ended 2-2. This is actually the Premier League fixture that's provided the most goals in the last decade. 78 in 20 matches, which is, what, sort of three and a half a game. Liverpool on Monday certainly doing their best to suggest that kind of goal-scoring activity will continue because they once again conceded a couple of goals for the fourth game in a row, in fact, in their trip to Newcastle. Once again, they got away with it, but against a 10-man Newcastle, a Newcastle with no strikers, the positives were few and far between.

26:41Yeah, I mean, this Liverpool Arsenal game, I do think these are the two strongest teams in the league. I think that ultimately it's going to go head to head for the title. But I do think what's so interesting about this clash isn't just that, it's this sort of stylistic differences, and we've just seen that already in the couple of opening games that Liverpool are just so open defensively and we've always obviously spoke about the amount of money they've invested and Arsenal have as well of course in the window but Liverpool have invested it in attack-minded players, front-footed players and that includes both full-backs obviously Milos Kerkhez and Jeremy Frimpong and I think Kerkhez has really struggled to adapt because obviously he did so well at Bournemouth but that's in a slightly different system and in a slightly different dynamic whereas when you're at Liverpool and obviously they've had Andy Robertson in that position for years sort of bombing down but you also have to have that sort of defensive discipline and positional awareness as well and I think that just takes a bit of time especially for defenders to bed in with new teammates and do a new system and with new expectations as well of exactly what's required of you and I think that that sort of maybe exposed a little bit of Ibrahima Kanate's sort of vulnerabilities as well I think he's struggled in the opening couple of matches Virgil van Dijk who obviously signed a new contract last season I don't think he's been out of form particularly but I think when you've got to then cover a lot of space when you're into the stage of the career that he is in that also becomes a slight issue and I just think Liverpool have been too open I mean that's they're conceding two goals per game and if you're going to win the title you just cannot do that that has to stop and Arsenal of course are the sort of other end of the scale aren't they and that how much control they have and how much they try to make sure that they're not open at the back and that they always have that cover there and that they're always I wouldn't say safety first but they're certainly set up in a way not to lose these games and if you look at their record against this big six as it were and I know it's a bit of an arbitrary measurement but they're undefeated in the last 22 matches back to April 2023 they've won 13 of those so they're very very strong in these matches.

28:36People point out that the other members of the big six have all won trophies in that period but in some ways not losing is the biggest trophy of all. Isn't it though? It's 13 years actually since Arsenal for all their record against the big clubs have actually won at Anfield That was when Brendan Rodgers was in charge on Merseyside. This time they go in with some very exciting new arrivals. No Pakao Saka. Not sure what the other injury news is, but could be seeing a Gunners debut for Eberichi Eze. I think the loss of Saka is important for this fixture because, as Colin points out, Kirkus has looked very unsure.

29:11I think if Saka had been fit, then I would have thought Robertson would come in for this match. But on the other side, I thought Schroberzade was brilliant right back at Newcastle on Monday night. So that is a positive given the other injuries Liverpool have. But yeah, I mean, Eze, the one thing Arsenal have struggled with is breaking down deep blocks. They're not really going to face one in this game. So they kind of don't need Eze as much for this game. Eze is like your lock pick for when they're facing a deep Brentford block at the Emirates, really. But given the injuries, I think he might play a role, definitely.

29:45I mean, obviously the other thing is young Rio against young Max, if either of them make it. Oh, yeah. Right. So Rio is the lad who scored the 100th minute winner away at St James' Park, Rio Ungamoa. Youngest scorer in Liverpool's history. Only the fourth youngest scorer in Premier League history, behind Rooney Milner and the youngest, James Vaughan for Everton.

30:08Colin Millar: Widest gap in age between a passer and goal scorer in Premier League history, because it was Mo Salah. ripe old age of 33 teeing up 16 year old Rio Ngomoha but which pairing did those two supplant in the record books? Duncan can't answer because he probably wrote the tweet that I read got this information from. Was James Milner involved? It was not but it was the same club. But which James Milner club? Sorry the same club Liverpool same club listener but producer Charlie's got it. Put the kettle on or something like that. Do you want it now or should we leave it for the end of the show? Yeah, leave it for the end of the show.

30:50Sure. Ha, ha, ha.

30:52Colin Millar: No spoiling for it. But also, ironically, ironic that Mursala got the assist because the definitive act in the build-up to that goal, that Dominic Sabozlai's absolutely magnificent dummy, does he get an assist for it? No. Does he get anything at all? Nothing. Just gets empty praise. How's he going to put that on his stats spreadsheet? We simply don't know if he was about to shoot and then a bee went near him and he jumped like that. They can't cover that. Oh, is that it? Excellent. Well, I look forward to the answer to that stat question later on. Arsenal so dangerous from corners. The numbers say three of their six goals this season have been from corners taken by Declan Rice.

31:35In fact, he's taken the three corners this season and they've scored from all of them. Incredible.

31:40Colin Millar: That is remarkable. He's kind of doing with corners what he did with free kicks last season. Nice. He takes them, they go in. Yeah. What a valuable asset to have. What do you think? Liverpool Arsenal, is this huge? Is it massive for the title race? It's one of those very exciting early season fixtures. Is this a day when you can't win the Premier League title? No, it's not. But you can lose it. No, you can't. It's neither of those things. It's neither of those things. If you ask me, I think the fixture computer has gone too hard too early this season. Really? The first few weeks has been an absolute cavalcade of big games.

32:15We are going to reach some point in October when it's going to be quite bleak. Burnley-Brentford again. I mean, I enjoy a little fixture, so it doesn't affect me, but there are some out there who will be, you know. Right. Okay. I think a key part of this as well, rewind one year, and Arsenal had all these really difficult away fixtures early on, and they had a really strong record in them, and they were winning 1-0 and 2-1, and they said, oh, this is the mark of champions, and this shows that they've got what it takes this year. And ultimately, it was the other games they sort of stumbled in. So would it really be a surprise if they put in a sort of strong or controlled performance here and got at least a draw and then in a couple of weeks' time maybe slipped up in a game that you might maybe expect them to win in?

32:55So, yeah, I don't think this game is going to be definitive in any way. But I think it's going to be really interesting to see the clash of styles and who's going to be able to adapt it that little bit better. Okay. Should be a lot of fun to watch. That's 4.30 on Sunday afternoon. The other games featuring the teams at the top of the table. Chelsea are taking on Fulham Saturday lunch, as we mentioned. Spurs are up against Bournemouth and Manchester City head to Brighton. Manchester City beaten, of course, by Spurs last weekend. Brighton were involved in the Carabao Cup second round. They went to the Kazam Stadium and beat Oxford 6-0.

33:33Colin Millar: They gave up quite a lot of chances, though. I'm not sure what the XG was, but Jason Steele, who was back between the posts, had quite a busy... I'm not sure they don't care, but just in case any Oxford United fans are screaming at their smart speakers, I thought I'd mention that. Duncan's not having it. I can tell by his face. Three stands, six goals, do the ratio. Bruce and Charlie observes that in view of Brighton's clash with Man City, Pep Guardiola is actually old enough to be Herzog's dad. There's 22 years of age difference. Tom, you'll enjoy that. Weird to think of Pep. I still think of him as being one of the younger.

34:11Colin Millar: As an elder statesman. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe that's just me, eh? One of the joys of premature balding, James, is that you age much less slowly. Is that... Well, you... No. That's an embarrassed pause. No, you age very quickly. You do your ageing early. You get your ageing out of the way. Get it out of the way. Lose your hair. Oh, no, my hair's gone. I'm bald. but then oh actually welcome to my head there's a reducer that's the alright literally a reducer Pep Guardiola hasn't he doesn't okay his beard's getting greyer yeah but in a stylish fashion he dresses young dresses young dresses young anyway the actual youngster Fabian Hurt younger than the big breakfast he's yet to lose a game in oh two two clashes with Manchester City and in this game last year City had the lead three times and then across the two games and obviously didn't win either of the matches and i do think that for manchester city there was a massive overreaction generally to that opening day game against wolves i mean obviously they want they won 4-0 and it's like you saw all the things that are good about them but that's exactly what we saw in the sort of last 10 12 games of last season against teams you sort of think they should beat and when they go and then they just look so good when they're afforded that time on the ball and they're not really threatened defensively but then the flip side of that was tottenham last week and also when you kind of look back over the past sort of couple of games across a couple of tournaments stretching back at the earlier this year of course but the FA Cup final against Palace and how they struggled to assert their authority and obviously the Club World Cup as well they had that exit and they've had so much change whereas if you look at Brighton Brighton who we are all sort of accustomed to of having this massive turnover of players they've only really got one new signing in their starting XI from last season that's Maxime de Cooper in the left back whereas City have made all these different changes obviously trying to evolve a little bit and trying to refresh the squad but I think for this particular fixture you kind of think Brighton have all the qualities to kind of exploit those weaknesses in City's team like the kind of weakness in transition and the front-footedness We'll see, I mean this could be one of the most exciting fixtures of the weekend Yeah, I mean City's problem still boils down to the fact they don't have Rodri in their starting XI and he's on the bench and maybe this is the game where Pep ushers him into the XI I mean, for Brighton, I guess their fans will be clamouring for Stefanos Zimas to come into the team.

36:34Obviously, he saw twice at Oxford. You know, not a high watermark, but he's only 19. Obviously, he brought in this. Well, he was on loan, wasn't he, last year in the Bundesliga. But he looked really good. OK, good.

36:46Colin Millar: And Brighton's problem so far has been not scoring goals. The 1-0 up against Fulham on the opening day should have won, conceded a stoppage time equaliser. I saw them at Everton last weekend. And before Illumundi scores the first goal at the new stadium, Danny Welbeck has missed an absolute sitter. Also the penalty later on in the game. Kourou Mitoma almost got an absolute worldie. Flicked the ball over defender's head, volley off the crossbar. And this has been the kind of recurring feature. And, you know, City do give up chances. If they can kind of, you know, stick the ball in the net, we'll have some goals.

37:22I don't want to press the sample size klaxon, but every year... Well, allow a Nations League once again, the enigmatically titled poster, who writes in to do that for you, don't finish my sentence, they write in to say, is there a need for people to wind their collective neck in? For the start that Thomas Frank has made at Spurs, post the City win, we've all been eulogising Frank, and I think just generally for the excellent start when they went 2-0 against PSG. I don't feel like the collective neck has been wound out in general. I sort of agree with the... Well, let a Nations League once again pick up the story.

38:00Given that Spurs won eight of their first ten Premier League games under Ange, and he picked up an unprecedented three Premier League Manager of the Month awards in a row, should we, etc., and so on. I would say, spoil sport to you, a Nations League. I think that's more of an indictment of the Manager of the Month awarding system, to be honest. I think with that start with Ange, it was so unusual. And I think the Premier League took two months to basically realise they can't surely be playing this open. And then eventually they did. And then Spurs declined. But we should point out that two games...

38:37You wouldn't look at the Boxing Day fixtures and the one in between New Year and go, I'm going to base my whole judgment of a team on these two games. No, but when... At the start of the season, the map is undrawn. And you fill in the blanks with your wildest imagination. Here be Dragons, there be a successful Tottenham season. But they win two and go down. There's teams that lose the first two and win the league. It's too early. Maybe Manchester United aren't going to win the league. We can maybe say that. He's gone early, he's gone big. But with Spurs, I just want to throw in the fact that there was the PSG game.

39:09And I know that they didn't ultimately get the Super Cup, but it was... Yeah. although Nuno Espirito Santo won all three of his first matches and won the manager the month forward and didn't get the chance to win many more managers people just love Spurs starting the season wow

39:22Colin Millar: it speaks to just the impatience of the football fan we want to know we want to draw our conclusions as hastily as possible and just get rid of this terrible uncertainty no but that's why and then people get to February and they're like no no no I mean we here are literally we're talking about it because you sit there you watch the game for 90 minutes and you can't help but think well this means something and that team's going to be playing that team and look what they did and you know that's the whole thing. It's part of the joy of it but I think the only thing you can say about Spurs is they've had a good start to the season.

39:54Colin Millar: Thomas Frank has had a positive impact but they had ideal opposition on the opening day promoted team Burnley who looked a little bit caught in the headlights and then they won away at City which is what they always do and they played well in the way for Super Cup and Frank is obviously getting his ideas across and you know Rakudas has started well. Richarlison's filling in very well for Dominic Solanke. And Brandon Johnson's in the goals, et cetera, et cetera. But it's too early to say. Well, this might be where it all comes unstuck as they welcome Bournemouth to the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium.

40:27Curiously, Frank Zoltai played Bournemouth midweek. Brentford, they were in the Carabao Cup. It was actually Brentford who won 2-0. Bournemouth who said goodbye to a wealth of players over the summer. it's going to be an interesting one I guess we can draw further conclusions but a long way from concrete ones after that game's played the other game I wanted to mention here is Chelsea Chelsea who equally last weekend looked fantastic smashing up poor old West Ham and then this week followed that up by getting Liam DeLapp to do live cubic routes first of all for anyone who didn't see this sorry a cubic square route what is a cubic square route Duncan?

41:08I mean, his dad did long throws. He does long division. That's all I can boil it down to. I mean, it's a bit beyond that, though, isn't it? They're shouting out 374 ,953. And he's thinking, is that the wage difference percentage between Man United and Grimsby Town? But actually, he doesn't. He just comes out immediately with the cubic square root. And for multiple numbers.

41:30Colin Millar: And every time they say correct, he nods like, yeah, I know. And at the end, he's asked, oh, how did you do that? How did you do that? and he just goes, clever, isn't it? Fair enough. It is. But that's extraordinary. Clever in that very specific way. Is it as good as Sunderland's Luke O 'Nein juggling the ball while doing a Rewitz cube? I think that's better. I mean, they're both impressive. I'm just fascinated by how does a mind pass those numbers? Because it's obviously as clear as day. He doesn't have to do calculations. It's just you can just draw a line through that number and that's the answer.

42:03I guess your dad's outside endlessly practicing his long throws.

42:06Colin Millar: You've got to fill those afternoons somehow. He had to fold a lot of towels as a youngster, so you've got to think of something. His dad must have had an innate understanding of parabola, I would suggest. So maybe there is a... He didn't pay the stake. It's in Tony Pulis' short-lived expensive foreign signing phase. Parabola and tun-shy. Right. Okay. Anyway, if you haven't seen the clip, or if you have and you just want to be impressed again, seek it out. It's on Chelsea's social media account, and it is amazing. Oh, on the subject of Chelsea against Fulham, prepare the steak and get the kindling ready because we've got a heretic writing in.

42:42CNG says, are Chelsea better without Parma? Ooh. No. Is CNG saying what everyone's thinking? No, no. Finally, Chelsea have got a very good squad of good footballs and might be good at football. Right. We don't know if Cole Parma is going to be fit for this one. It may not matter because they've got Jean-Pedro, who's got four goals in four games. They got Esteval William. Lim de Lapp's clever. So is Marco Silva, who has gone to his bench in both of Fulham's games so far and found a goal-scoring substitute. Oh, by the way, Fulham won this fixture last season. That was their first win at Stamford Bridge in 45 years.

43:22I mean, there are many other things we could say about this game, but perhaps let's wait for it to happen and then draw conclusions. Instead, next up, we can have a quick chat. What about those midweek Champions League playoff games? This is the Totally Football Show with James Richardson,

43:39Colin Millar: part of the Athletic FC podcast network. It's Thursday, listeners, we record this. And later on today, they're going to do the draw for the Champions League League phase with seven new teams entering the mix, courtesy of the Champions League playoffs, which they had the second legs off Tuesday, Wednesday. in amongst the PSGs, the Man Citys, Liverpools, Inters and Barcelonas we're going to have the northernmost team in Champions League history who are Bodo stroke glimped, they put out Stormgratz and also the easternmost team in Champions League history Karat Almaty who knocked out Celtic on penalties after two goalless draws listener Stephen Taylor points out that Karat Almaty are closer to Tokyo than Newcastle who will undoubtedly draw them We shall see Thursday night.

44:29Colin Millar: There is a look on the Wikipedia page for the season's Champions League and there is a map showing where all the teams are. And Kairat is so easternmost that on the map it just says Kairat and it's pointing off the map. No. And then it says in brackets, not on map. Right. Close brackets. Well, they're on the map now after those. Oh, they've put themselves on the map. Yeah. And so Paphos FC of Cyprus, who also put their place midweek, not featuring in the Champions League group stage or league phase rather will be Jose Mourinho and his Fernabache side who got beaten by his old club Benfica and there are no Scottish teams whatsoever after Celtic's draw and exit with Alamati and also the very next day after Rangers went to Bruges looking to turn around a 3-1 first leg defeat and didn't quite do it narrow 6-0 reversing right 6-0 Wouldn't it be fun if Rangers and Celtic played each other this weekend?

45:27Well, Duncan, you're in luck. Oh, well. It is the old firm game this weekend. Rangers, who are already six points behind Celtic, they did have a player sent off after eight minutes, but the way that their team collapsed and eventually went out 9-1 on aggregate, which I believe is the third worst aggregate defeat in Champions League history, has set alarm bells. The alarm bells that weren't already ringing, they're ringing now because Russell Martin's had 10 games in charge, won only three of them. And well, if it doesn't go well for him in the old firm game this weekend, one wonders. New owners, new manager.

46:06So you never know. Yeah, it's also been a really, really difficult week for Scottish football in Europe. And I think, I actually think you're talking about all the new teams that are in the Champions League, league fears. And I think that kind of shows that there is a triumph of how UEFA have kind of, not manufactured the draw, but you have in these tournaments, you have like a champions path and then a path for the best. And so that's why you get teams like Benfica and Fenerbahce. So it's almost like a nation's league for clubs. Yeah. And I think it gives an opportunity for nations like Kazakhstan, like Cyprus, like Norway, the opportunity to reach those stages of the competition.

46:40I mean, Kairat aren't the first Kazakhstani club, it was Astana, who'd been the flagship team they were in the group stages 10 years ago. And I think one of the things is for teams like that, when Astana were in the Champions League group phase, they didn't lose any of their three home matches. I mean, those are really, really difficult away matches to go to for any team. It's really cold there as well. Very cold, very long journey, hostile atmosphere. And the match against Celtic actually ended at local time on Wednesday morning. So that must have an impact on you as a player after all that traveling and the sort of time zone differences and trying to acclimatize yourself.

47:17I guess, to that environment. But yeah, I think it's a really interesting format the way things have panned out this year. You're talking about, obviously, Bodo Glimt being the most northern club in the Champions League, Carabin being the most easterly. It's really cold there as well. Yes, I would imagine. So I've never been quite that far north into the Arctic circle. But yeah, it's extraordinary. And the westernmost club in Europe, Santa Clara from the Azores, Ireland of Portugal, have a chance to get into the Conference League group phases. they are I mean we were recording this early on Thursday they're 2-1 Shamrock Rovers over the League of Ireland but again it's geographically it's a very pleasing draw I think this year in Champions League Excellent Like Laurie's Angleseed's Cleethorpe's journey we're really maxing out the old latitude and longitude of football We're getting plenty of mileage from it Cahir asks are there any major coefficient repercussions for Scottish clubs in football ooh is this one of those situations where because they have a better chance of going far deep in the Europa League that could actually work out better or not.

48:19Yeah, sorry, I think it could potentially. And I think one of the things is Celtic have been really underperforming in Europe for the best part of two decades. I made the point last season, they haven't won a, they haven't progressed through a knockout round and passed the league phase or group phase since 2004 in any European competition. So that's going into the 22nd year of that, which is remarkable when you look at Rangers, who've actually done quite well in Europe, obviously have reached the Europa League final. They tend to go quite deep into that competition regularly. But domestically, Rangers have obviously struggled in comparison.

48:50So I think there is an issue there. And obviously you've got Aberdeen are still playing in Europe, Hibernian as well, going into the Conference League playoff games. But I think Scottish football in general has an issue because you look at a lot of teams that they're going up against, especially Rangers and Celtic teams, who've got comparable budgets. I mean, Club Bruja's budget is similar to Rangers, but they're beating them 9-1 in aggregate. and obviously there's maybe a coaching factor in there too as Rangers fans will point out. But yeah, it's not great. And I think Scottish football tends to compare itself to England quite a lot, which is kind of unhelpful because, I mean, England's a complete one-off in terms of the income that it's got for its clubs.

49:25But I think Scottish football needs to have some sort of fundamental issues addressed. I mean, if you look at the current UEFA coefficient rankings, which obviously are subject to change a lot as we go into the season, but Scotland now, after this week's results, have gone below Cyprus. I mean they should pull that back because they've still got four teams left in Europe and perhaps got three and yeah as we said one of them is in the Champions League but they are 18th and quite a long way to Colin's point behind England Wow Alright Looking forward to seeing what happens in the draw Right now though let's get back to the Premier League and more Crisis Club news West Ham West Ham have followed up last weekend's 5-1 defeat to Chelsea by losing 3-2 away at previously winless Wolves.

50:12They were 2-1 up in this game before two goals in three minutes from Jürgen Strand-Larsen. Strand-Larsen, who's very much the subject of transfer interest from Newcastle, coming off the bench. And in the last 10 minutes with that brace to get Molyneux rocking. Worryingly for West Ham, Victor Pereira had fielded a much-changeable side, but I think I'm right in saying that Graham Potter had gone with a strong Hammer 11 with certainly Bowen and Paquitar right from the start. A few changes. A few changes. Yeah. All right. Not wholesale changes.

50:52Colin Millar: Jared Bowen. I've seen it with Jared Bowen. Jared Bowen, yeah. Quite low-key beef. Right. Describe it, Tom. The headlines made it sound worse than actually what it was. Did he offer a fan? It was nowhere at Cancel. He did not appear to offer a fan outside. Did he appear to wish to climb over the advertising hoarding to confront? Not necessarily. So basically the West Ham players traipse over to the away fans at the end of the game. And Bowen sort of is the closest to the away supporters who thinned out quite considerably. And I think one of them is giving him a bit of stick. And Bowen kind of remonstrates and looks like he wants to get involved in a more profound conversation.

51:32Colin Millar: And he's pulled away by his teammates. And that was it. And he apologised very quickly on social media. Everyone's hurting. Everyone's hurting. Everyone's hurting. And you can understand why. What are West Ham doing this weekend? They're going to Nottingham Forest. Wolves will be up against Everton, who also they're going to be facing in the third round of the Carabao Cup after knocking West Ham out this week. So, yeah, West Ham against Nottingham Forest. But it's no disgrace to lose away to another Premier League side, 3-2. but against the backdrop of Graham Potter's other results, the start of the season and the fact that he's now been in charge for 20 Premier League matches and has won only five of them, is the clock a ticking there as well?

52:15I mean, West Ham's issues definitely go much deeper than Graham Potter. But I think that was obvious when he walked through the door there last season that you kind of think, is this going to be the right club for him? Is West Ham the right club for any manager aside from maybe David Moyes over the past sort of five or ten years? You know, whenever Jürgen Lopetegui sort of sacked several months into the season, he was like, oh, you know, look how much of a disaster Lopetegui was. But you kind of look at his track record, even at Wolves, he's actually done quite a good job there. You can see he's trying to implement the style.

52:47He's got his own ideas. He didn't see any of that at West Ham. And it's exactly the same with Graham Potter. You just don't see any style of play. And looking at West Ham starting at 11, only two of their outfield players are younger than 28. And it seems to be a sort of recurring theme of their recruitment that it just seems so scattergun. It seems to be like, let's bring in Callum Wilson, who's sort of India's early 30s, has had pretty bad injury problems the past couple of years. And that's on top of Nicholas Fulcrook, who they signed last season, who's India's early 30s and has had injury problems the past season.

53:15And you sort of just think, what is it they're trying to do? What's the overall aim? And they're going into this game against Forest, who've obviously made a decent start to the season, but who've obviously got massive question marks over the future of their own manager for very different reasons. Right, well, yeah, issues indeed. Chris Wood is not under 28, but he is still scoring lots of goals. And bad news for West Ham, they're his favourite opponent. He's got eight goals against them so far. As you mentioned, Forest do have issues of their own. They have not lost a game. They have not dropped points against the Hammers since Nuno took charge of the club.

53:49But there was some doubt last weekend whether he would still be in charge of the club come this fixture. Has it all gone quiet on that? Has peace broken out at the City Ground?

53:58Colin Millar: Well, it feels like it's gone quiet and that there hasn't been any news out of the last few days as we record. But then the most explosive provider of news with regard to this saga over the last couple of weeks has been Nuno Espirito Santo himself. I think it will be his pretty much press conference that gives the clearest indication as to where things are, you know, whether things have settled down. And even prior to the very explosive press conference that preceded the Crystal Palace game, prior to the opening game against Brentford, he gave a very downbeat, very pessimistic press conference about how unprepared the team was for the season and seemed determined to strike a pretty miserable note.

54:44Colin Millar: And then Forrest go and put three past Brentford and, you know, play pretty well. so yeah I suspect that will I was going to say that will be the most keenly anticipated pretty much press conference we've also got Ruben Amarim to come and also Graham Potsdam so perhaps not yeah ray of sunshine ok well West Ham the visitors to Nottingham Forest Wolves who beat them midweek hosting Everton Wolves are the only team who've got no points and no goals in the Premier League this season but they have got Jürgen Strand Larsson will they be keeping hold of them we don't know they have rejected a£55 million pound bid from Newcastle this week.

55:21Everton, meanwhile, have they now tied up the services of the young and exciting Tyler Dibbling? He made his debut last night

55:29Colin Millar: as a substitute, yeah, as a replacement for Jack Grealish in the 2-0 win over Mansfield. What we're all hoping is it'll be Grealish on one flank and Dibbling doing the dribbling. And NDI in the middle. I mean, dribblers galore. Dribblers delight. It should be pointed out that people sort of, think David Moyes is quite a dour manager but he does enjoy a sort of dribbly front unit and now he's got one and a cross and a header yeah alright Wolves Everton that's Saturday 3 o 'clock don't try and watch it unless you're outside the UK or you're at Molineux yeah those are your options so prepare yourself let's get on to some other things from the weekend including that late late Sunday night game Villa against Palace next

56:3528th of August as we record listener 20th of August is a bad day historically for Arsenal fans on this day for example 28th of August 1994 young Robbie Fowler scored what was at that time the fastest hat-trick in Premier League history against Arsenal at Anfield it took him four and a half minutes on this day in 2011 it was the Man United 8-2 young it's 8 and he scored two beautiful Manchester United showed absolutely no mercy. Very much the birth of social media football meme-ology, I'd say. Right. I hate to be an Arsenal fan, etc. Also, it made people think about Loughborough's football team more than any other day in football history.

57:32Because? Because it was Arsenal's biggest defeat since they lost to Loughborough back in the day. So, yeah. There you go. Arsenal were so spooked by that 8-2 defeat that they signed in a deadline day splurge. Mikel Arteta, who's now their manager, and Pep Murtesac, who's now head of their academy, an academy that's furnishing them with a flurry, a phalanx of young football talent. Lovely.

57:56Colin Millar: Wasn't that also the window when they signed a bunch of other really random players? Was it Ben O 'Yoon as well? That one. And it was generally seen as this very unsuccessful, panicky, late transfer window splurge. It was very much the era where Arsene Wenger didn't really sign many players, so Arsenal fans had become... Choo Young from Monaco as well, I think. They were so eager for any signings. And we must remember this was the peak of Transfer Deadline Day when, you know, in its pomp. In its dildo in here. Yeah, fans would gather behind reporters up and down the country. What killed that? Was it COVID?

58:29Probably the dildo in here, I think. I think security measures for journalists. Right, OK. All right. Premier League weekend. Also coming up, we've got Sunderland against Brentford. Leeds hosting Newcastle and late, late Sunday Villa against Crystal Palace which has been moved as mentioned because Palace have suddenly found themselves caught up in the Europa Conference League. Now Palace in that competition are in action this Thursday night. They are 1-0 up against Frederik Strat from the first leg but they're away in Norway. So we'll see what happens. A narrow lead but they are on a 12-match unbeaten run in all competitions.

59:10Oliver Glasner earning plaudits for his progress so far with a probably pretty understrength Palace. What's up with the Villa, though? I know they haven't made many signings either. You've got your Evan Gesson, is it? Gesson? Evan Gesson. Gesson? Yes. Oui. Oui. Will it be a Gesson game, this? I don't know. But what is up with Villa?

59:33Colin Millar: Well, they haven't really signed any players. They've lost a lot of the important loanees that came in in the second half of last season and gave them a bit of a boost. And they've just looked really flat. I mean, that first game against Newcastle at Villa Park, that was the game in which, I think in April, Villa just completely took Newcastle to the cleaners, beat them 4-1, I think. And Newcastle just got into them and they never got going. And then similarly toothless in the defeat at Brentford last weekend. And the only players they've signed are Evan Gasson, who hasn't started a game yet in the league, and Marco Bizot, the backup goalkeeper.

1:00:10Colin Millar: I mean, you can't put it all down to, you know, transfers. But I think, I mean, it doesn't help with the mood. But I think the fact that, you know, you had this new dynamic in the second half of last season that with, you know, Marco Asensio and Rashford notably leaving has now disappeared and they've not managed to find a new dynamic. And, you know, Ollie Watkins has looked a little bit off it. Morgan Rodgers, Ditto, Bubakar Cameras now injured. So yeah, I think a combination of factors, as is so often the case. Oh yeah, isn't that? One of the issues with Villa is that on the opening day of the season and for the second game too, seven of the ten outfield players that they had were there when Steven Gerrard was manager at the club.

1:00:52Now that's obviously going back quite a while. I don't know if it's a consensus amongst football fans. People see Villa and say, oh, that's like a really well-run club who make really savvy sign-ins. But when you look back over the last several windows under Monchi, the sporting director, a lot of the sign-ins just haven't worked out at all. A lot of the signings haven't come anywhere near to being in the first team. You kind of think, are those players that Emery wanted? Are those players that the club wanted? Obviously, Villa have had all these sort of PSR issues in the past couple of years.

1:01:18And it's like they're trying to make all these trade-offs to tick sort of financial boxes. That was he sold Jacob Ramsey last week to Newcastle. And that's another player you think, oh, he sort of fits into their model very well. But all of a sudden he's gone. Is he going to be replaced? And Evan Cassand has come in. But he was sort of, I think, a target for Crystal Palace this summer. and they had sort of evaluated the possibility of signing him and then they kind of thought better of it because of the sort of finances, financial package and they kind of thought it was a relatively small sample size from his time at Nice last season.

1:01:49I think you were excited about him, no?

1:01:51Colin Millar: I really like him. He's quite a curious player in that he started off last season at Nice playing through the middle and then ended up playing more off the right. He's a right-footed player who plays on the right, which makes him quite unusual, but a very inventive player. And I think when he came on at Brentford, but he made a real difference. I mean, guess him. He what? He keeps him guessing. He keeps him guessing. Sorry. Yes. Yeah. Yes. He does. He does. I'm just saying. Just firing him out here. Yeah. Just firing him out. But yeah, he's very much the kind of player who will keep his opponents.

1:02:24Colin Millar: Yeah. You can't pronounce it. Yeah. That pun doesn't work in the French accent. So I just, yeah. Guess on. All right. I'll abandon that sentence. Villa Palace. the Harry and Meghan Clasico Sunderland Brentford Black Cats v Bees shout out to Sunderland's Elisir Mayenda who's played so far 139 minutes in the Premier League out of a potential 180 he's made only three passes completing two of them this is both the fewest passes and fewest successful passes in a player's first two Premier League starts since Optus started recording these things in 2003 what position does he play? Centre forward OK so he just never gets the ball essentially Your move Erling Haaland Wow It's almost 140 minutes and he's made three passes Don't need to pass the ball if you're busy sticking it in the net That's probably what he thinks Just cause a few problems to the defenders Yeah Nice Sunderland and Brentford probably two really strong examples of how the kind of narratives flip so quickly in the early weeks of the season after the first match day and Sunday and get that massive win over West Ham and all this positivity and then they go and slump at Burnley.

1:03:39Whereas Brentford and all the sort of doubts over is Keith Andrews actually a manager to begin with and then that really poor force performance and then they go and beat Aston Villa 1-0 and then the League Cup win and you sort of think all of a sudden it's completely changed and you're still in August so yeah this game will be really interesting and I do think that stylistically it might not be one for the purists but Or it might be one for the purists. Or it might not be. I think whoever wins this game stays up. It's a big shout from Duncan. Not the first one he's made, nor I suspect the last.

1:04:12The other game taking place this weekend is Leeds-Newcastle. Leeds against a depleted Newcastle because Tonali, Joelington and Shah are all out injured. and Anthony Gordon is now suspended post-Monday night's defeat to Liverpool. Yeah, calf rake. Calf raking. Well, if we're talking about depleted teams, they don't come much more depleted than Sheffield Wednesday at the moment, who essentially played what was a sort of youth team almost against Leeds midweek. And Leeds were relatively strong, brought on a lot of their big guns in the second half, couldn't get it done and lost on penalties. And I actually saw the sort of closing stages of this game and Dominic Calvert-Lewin had a series of really point-blank misses and then he skied his penalty in the shootout.

1:05:07And again, it goes to sort of show that Leeds' early kind of positivity around that Everton game and then you go and lose 5-0 at Arsenal. Okay, it's away at Arsenal. And then that match midweek. So again, this feels almost like a big match for them that if this doesn't go well and you sort of think all of a sudden there might be question marks where is Daniel Farker the guy that's going to that can keep them up and have they had a good window or not, so yeah it's all early conclusions isn't it, but these games are all really good markers for it. I mean Cavaloon had an exigy of 1.4 in that game and Sheffield Wednesday had an exigy of 0.15 so

1:05:40Colin Millar: plus the squandered shootout penalty yeah and he had to come out, if early into your career you have to come out on social media and almost apologise for performance not great Mark Carey was suggesting on Sunday that XG is a misleading statistic when applied to a single game, but only really comes into its own when applied over a bigger sample size. That is true. Okay. Duncan's drunk on the power of it. He knows he shouldn't, but he does. It's like when they built the Death Star. You shouldn't use it for certain things, but if you've got it, they've got it just there. It's hard not to, isn't it?

1:06:16Order on. Whoops. I would say that's it for today's show, our preview of the Premier League weekend and much more. But there's still one matter still outstanding, Tom Williams. Just remind us, first of all, what the question was.

1:06:33Colin Millar: So in Liverpool's 3-2 win at Newcastle on Monday, a new record was set for the largest gap in age between an assist provider and goal scorer when 33-year-old Mo Salah set up 16-year-old Rio and Gamora for the winner. And my question was, whose record did they beat? And it was set by two former Liverpool players. Right. And the answer is... Oh, does anybody know, Colin? Duncan? Producer Charlie? No, Charlie's not allowed. No, Charlie is allowed. Come on, here comes Producer Charlie. And keep a guess. John Barnes and Michael Owen? Is incorrect. Ooh. Do I know the answer? So that's why you're not allowed to answer?

1:07:13Colin Millar: Why do you know the answer? Because someone I know came up with the very good statistic that Tom Williams has stolen for his own. All right. Should we credit the person who came over? Yeah, this is Michael Reid, who is an opt-in, a Liverpool specialist. Right. If you like Liverpool data and stats, then you should follow him on social media. All right, and his shiny laptop. The correct answer is, of course, Gary McAllister and a young Stephen Gerrard in the early noughties at some point. Yeah, 2000? Yeah, something like that. Wow, great question Thank you for that Tom and so much more and thank you as well to Colin Miller and Duncan Alexander to Lloyd Griffith and Laurie Whitwell too also to Jake and producer Charlie in the booth and you listener we will have a totally extra for you on Saturday again this is our kind of weekend special show where we just chat about some stuff Duncan, we recorded this earlier in the week yourself, myself, Junior Leron and Michael Cox, who in between getting a dining table delivered helped us with a bit of a deep dive into the enigmatic career of Nicola Anelka Was he Le Sulk?

1:08:31Is he simply misunderstood as his own Netflix special suggests? Suggests very strongly Why not join us to see our conclusions and some dining room table delivery banter. That's in Totally Extra. And then, of course, on Sunday night, late, late Sunday night, thanks, Premier League fixtures, we'll be back with our Sunday night live stream on our YouTube channel, or you can just wait till the sensible time on Monday morning and hear what we make of match day three. Excellent. That's it for today. From all of us here, it's goodbye.

1:09:08Colin Millar: You've been listening to The Totally Football Show, part of the Athletic FC podcast network. For more great podcasts just like this one, including The Athletic FC and our dedicated club podcasts, search for The Athletic on Apple, Spotify and all the usual places. We're also at The Totally Football Show on Insta and at The Totally Show on YouTube. The Totally Football Show is an Athletic Media Company production.