Bayern make a statement in Madrid as Arsenal get back to winning ways

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1:36The Athletic FC.

1:44Liam Twomey: Totally Football's show today, Tuesday in the Champions League. Wonders and blunders at the Bernabeu. Olise makes it look isé and Kane scores once again. While in Lisbon, Havertz and especially Hans of Raya see Arsenal past Sporting in the week's second biggest story about players relying on Raya swipes. We'll be talking about all of that plus big Football League news and much, much more in this Totally Football Show.

2:17Liam Twomey: Wednesday the 8th of April, special bonus Totally Football Show for you and for us indeed, listener. Thank you for being a part of it. Here in the studio, we've got Liam Toomey. Hi, Liam. Hello. Been a busy guy, have you, Liam? Yeah. I mean, it's all within the realm of how busy Chelsea would normally keep you. Right. I'm just pleased to still be invited to the Champions League party. Nice. The club I cover is at home. Yeah. You've done a bit of extracurricular stuff as well. Penning, what I believe is the most viewed article on the Athletics Exit website. We'll get onto that a little bit later.

2:54Liam Twomey: Art de Rocher is there, probably in close second with your output. I doubt it. Really? But good morning, everyone. Good morning to you, Art. I hope you're all doing well. You very much drew the long straw and got Sporting Arsenal to watch on Tuesday night. Yeah, it was a tough one to watch, especially when I caught up on what happened in the Madrid-Bayon game. But, I mean, thankfully for Arsenal, they were able to get something of a job done with a 1-0 win. So the result made it worth it, I guess. A 1-0 win away to a team that had won its last 17 in a row at home. As you say, you missed out on events at the Bernabeu and also at the race course ground.

3:32Liam Twomey: But Daniel, you didn't because you actually went along to choose this highest scoring game, Wrexham Saints. Yes, I did indeed. It was an odd game. I think Wrexham were really up for it, partly because Southampton had played and beaten Arsenal. and there was this sort of after the Lord Mayor's show energy hope, I think, from the homestands that Southampton just completely obliterated. Yeah, they were phenomenal. Where you sit at Wrexham, there are fans directly behind you. And it sort of feels sometimes like you're watching an episode of the Royal Family, hearing them all sort of chat to each other.

4:07And the defining punditry at the end of the game was just leaving on 89 minutes and saying that's the best team we've seen this season and it's not Wrexham. So, yeah, Southampton mean business.

4:15Liam Twomey: that's the royal family as in the tv show rather than the outdated etc and so on right okay good and i'm not making accusations about anyone right okay and that's also wrexham saints the fixture not the reformation policy just to clear that one up uh wrexham no okay fine uh so that was in the championship and a significant game it was too there were other big events we'll get onto those later on in the Football League. But in the Champions League, Bayern were a big story, getting their first win at the Bernabeu in a quarter of a century. A 2-1 victory, could have been 3-1, could have been 2-2.

4:54Liam Twomey: Kind of a crazy game. Leon will be telling us all about that very shortly. Over in Lisbon, Arsenal beating Sporting 1-0 with a late, late winner from Kai Havertz. They remain the competition's only unbeaten side. and it's a win that also confirms the Premier League's fifth team in next season's Champions League. We'll begin at the Burnabout. This is the Totally Football Show with James Richardson, part of the Athletic FC podcast network. Rubber Drib 1, Bayern 2, Liam Toomey, a game with lots of big names, lots of shots, quite a few errors, a lot of fun basically. Yeah, I feel like this was close to the Homeric ideal of what you'd want from a big time Champions League knockout game.

5:3940 shots evenly divided between the two teams. Every minute it felt like there was a chance at one end or the other. And it did ebb and flow. Although I think you have to say that Bayern broadly controlled it and looked significantly the better team for an hour. Real Madrid are Real Madrid and they're never truly dead and gone.

6:01Liam Twomey: As you say, Bayern look significantly the better side Looked like they were making the Bernabeu their own playground A ground where they hadn't won since 2001 Michael Olisse in particular Michael, perhaps not Michael Olisse himself Writing in and saying Is Olisse the best player in Europe right now? He's got a case Have you seen anyone play better than he did last night? I think it has a real case to be the best game of his career in terms of the stage and the quality of play that he was doing against. Although you have to say that his direct opponent, Alvaro Carreras, maybe not the best left back that he will ever play against.

6:40Initially, for the kind of first 10 minutes, I was a bit surprised that Bayern didn't go straight for Trent Alexander-Arnold because that's what we've seen a lot of teams do over the course of his time at Liverpool. But it turned out actually that they thought Real Madrid's left side was even weaker. And of course, that's the side that Alissé generally dominates. So Carreras didn't have any protection from Vinny Jr., as you would expect. Arda Goulair tried to get out there to help every now and then, but it felt like Alise could just do whatever he wanted. And he beat Carreras on the outside and floated dangerous crosses in.

7:15He also beat him on the inside and had really dangerous shots. And he was kind of the hub, I think, of Bayern's dominance for the first hour of the game.

7:24Liam Twomey: They had a chance to take the lead, spurned by Upamecano after a nice pull from Harry Kane. But it was Trent Alexander-Arnold's side that was exploited by the much-missed Louis Diaz for the opening goal. Yeah, so the goal did originate from the left side. So it was Vinny Jr. giving the ball away and then Bayern had a rapid attack. They were basically playing a front four, which is incredible in itself to see for a visiting team at the Bernabeu. and all four players were involved with the passes, with the movement. And it ended up being Serge Gnabry playing the ball through for Luis Diaz. And watching that sequence, I did feel that maybe that's not the first time Luis Diaz has made that run off the back of Trent Alexander-Arnold.

8:10I feel like that may have happened quite a lot in Liverpool training over the years. Trent Alexander-Arnold never once looked back to see where Diaz was really. Although in his defence, it did kind of all happen. so quickly and Carreras played everyone on side and Diaz provided the kind of finish you'd expect from him.

8:29Liam Twomey: Okay under the watching eyes of Thomas Tuchel that was shortly before half time very shortly after the kickoff of the second half about what 28 seconds or something Harry Kane made it 2-0. Yeah Real Madrid came out with their business faces on no changes at half time you were expecting some kind of response and instead Bayern just jumped all over them and they got another high turnover this time it was Carreras giving the ball away again very fast attack and Harry Kane just did that thing that he's increasingly done in the second half of his career whereas he's become this more withdrawn nine of just peeling into that spot just out just on the D outside the penalty area and just waited for the ball and when it came I feel like there are very few players in the world that you would back to find the corner as consistently as he does he I say this a lot about Harry Kane.

9:19He reminds me a lot of Frank Lampard in his prime because he's obviously trained so religiously on his technique, particularly his shooting technique, that he's just incredibly reliable in those situations.

9:47In this second half, his first moment!

10:17a little bit for some Bundesliga padding there, but they're doing it against elite European opposition now. I wrote a piece on Kane last week, which wasn't meant to be a hot take, but sort of ended up being one by the reaction I got to it. And I sort of theorised that maybe he's, for the first time, this was hot take one for the first time, but that maybe he's the best player in the world at the moment. And I think Elisse might be one of two or three players to rival him. At least one of the other two played against him last night in Kylian Mbappe. But as Liam says, it's this unnerving element to him that you don't really get with any other player at the moment.

10:56Generally, over the last X number of years, certainly since Cristiano Ronaldo's peak, I think we have looked for excitement and intrigue in the players that we like the most and generally the ones that win the awards. And yeah, Kane is completely unerring. He is like a joke at the moment. He's a cheat code for Bayern. And the response to that article was to suggest that he hasn't done it in the biggest games, which A, I think is a bit mad about a player who scored in two major tournament semifinals. But also, for so much of his career, he was at a team that didn't really compete towards the end.

11:31This feels like arguably the biggest six months of Kane's career in terms of defining his legacy, I think, when he's got England to lead and is so important to England and Bayern now to lead, albeit with a far better supporting cast. And last night was a heck of a good start because he did have a role in the first goal being withdrawn and deeper again. He obviously took the second one. And yeah, they look pretty unstoppable, Bayern.

11:57Liam Twomey: Bayern's ability to hoover up talent from the struggling clubs in the Premier League, whether company at Burnley or from London's sides in difficulty, Michael Ollisay and Harry Kane at Spurs, has really been transformational for them. Yeah, it's given them a whole new lease of life in terms of their attacking firepower. And company appears to have kind of rejuvenated their identity as a team. I think he's kind of restored them to Pep Guardiola levels of dominance, at least domestically in Germany. And, well, we'll see if he can do it in Europe, of course, Guardiola fell short of Bayern ultimately.

12:33Liam Twomey: Well, Ador Apollo writes in as well, says, is Bayern squad depth going under the radar? Kompany had the ability to bring Musiala and Davies off the bench alongside Karl, who didn't even make it on the pitch on Tuesday night. They'll be able to rest players for the rest of the Bundesliga. They're nine points clear at the top of the German First Division. They have to be favourites, says Ador Apollo. For him, what do you make of them as potential winners? Yeah, they are formidably deep. I think particularly when you compare to Real Madrid and the situation that they found themselves in this game.

13:06Real Madrid have incredible top-end talent, but Jude Bellingham gets injured at the wrong time of the season and you saw what it did to the balance of Real Madrid's midfield for the first hour of that game. When he came on, the game changed and they looked a lot more dangerous, but they really couldn't compete with Bayern.

13:20Liam Twomey: So the game did change because at the end of it, for all the wonders of Kane and Olisse, it was Manuel Neuer who was their outstanding player, making nine saves, which is the most, I read, that he's had to make in any game, in any competition for five years. It felt a little bit like his masterclass for Schalke against Manchester United. You know, the one that was basically his statement to all of Europe that I may already be the best player in the world. And obviously he was at a much earlier stage of his career back then. But he doesn't seem to have aged physically in terms of mobility. I mean, he's had some serious injuries, but he's still so fast off his line, so great with his positioning outside of his box.

14:01And his command of the angles in the penalty area, there was one chance that stuck out to me where Vinny Junior and Mbappe, it was maybe their best combination of the game, where Mbappe played the ball to Vinny Junior and then curved his run to overlap him on the left. And Vinny Junior slipped him in. And it was a tight angle, but against most goalkeepers, you think Mbappe might find the far corner there. But Noy is so big and he'd also positioned himself so perfectly that the angle was just gone immediately. I'm not sure of this the same chance, but there was one shot where his body, the commentator says that he's spread, but his body's actually gone inwards.

14:40and it's like both of his legs are stuck together. And obviously the injuries that he's had in recent years to be able to not just come back to playing at this level, but having the agility and flexibility to do that at his age, I think is unbelievable. Yeah, and maybe his signature moment of the game actually was completely psyching out Vinny Jr. in a one-on-one. It was a mistake, I think, from a Pamukano. And he was just completely in around the hour mark. it looked like this was going to be the turning point of the game. This was the moment Real Madrid had been waiting for. And I think Vinicius looked up and realised, wow, he's a lot closer than I thought he would be in this situation.

15:20And Neuer managed to just calmly but very quickly shepherd him to a less favourable angle and then kind of take the shooting pocket of the goal away so that he could only really hit the side netting. And looking at Vinicius' face afterwards, it was almost like he couldn't quite process what had happened. he always scores those chances or at least it feels like he does in big Champions League games and Neuer just took him out without appearing to even do that much Neuer was eventually beaten by

15:48Liam Twomey: Kylian Abappé who hadn't scored in his previous five inches, almost saved that one it's incredible that scoreline 2-1, it's Real Madrid and you never know etc or you kind of do know when it's Real Madrid often what do you think then sorry, return as well to the earlier question you mentioned Ju Bellingham coming on what what was the difference for Real Madrid were they always in this game but just didn't realize it it's weird because the way the team set up Madrid had technically a numerical superiority in midfield so they should have been able to at least have a fighting chance of controlling possession but the way that Bayern functionally played even though they only had two in in Kimmich and Pavlovich because Kane was dropping deep because Nabry was dropping deep it was so fluid and Aliso would come central sometimes they they just controlled the game I think after the first 10 minutes Real Madrid had a decent first 10 minutes on the ball without necessarily threatening all that much and then it just became one-way traffic um and Madrid just felt very it was the most passive performance I've seen from them at home in quite a long time yet they had nine shots yes they did because they've always got with Mbappe and Vinny Jr the puncher's chance right and it's probably the best puncher's chance in world football given how good those players are and how fast they are so you you always have to be wary and Bayern always looked a little bit vulnerable at the back but the actual dynamic of the game favoured Bayern so much for so long that you you have to think that they are heavy favourites in the second leg right I think that word dynamic is probably the most important with this Madrid team because I remember Arsenal playing them last year in the quarterfinals.

17:33And once the momentum was in Arsenal's favour in the first leg, it just seemed like Madrid didn't have, I guess, the balance to deal with that off the ball. And then on the ball, even though there were maybe a few times where Mbappe could break, it just didn't seem like there was a glue there that Arsenal did have that Bayern Munich had last night as well. So even though it is Real Madrid, as you say, I just feel like there's something just not the same compared to in previous years. That being said, I caught up on the game and it felt like Madrid could have won that game with the amount of chances they had late on.

18:15And I think that's what makes Mbappe in particular so exciting. I mean, everyone knows what he did in the World Cup final in 2022. And it seemed like he still has the potential to do something like that, even in the next couple of weeks. Come up second best. On that part, we'll see. But yeah, I think he can still have a big part to play. I think what created the game that we saw more than anything else is that Real Madrid have two cheats off the ball. And I don't mean that in a libelous sense.

18:47Liam Twomey: No one's taken it that way. but that's what happened last year yeah because Mbappe and Vini Jr. do no work when they don't have the ball and they don't track back right there's no resistance to Bayern or Arsenal last year in terms of building the play into midfield so their dominance in that sense is pretty unrivaled but the flip side of that is that because Mbappe and Vini Jr. have literally nothing to do but focus on taking up dangerous positions for when the ball comes back to Madrid they are that much more threatening in those situations and they are so fast and they're so good at combining and it's very off the cuff.

19:26It's very improvisational what they do. I think we saw this with the best Madrid sides under Ancelotti when it was Vinny Jr. and Rodrigo as well. I think Vinny Jr. and Mbappe are building that kind of chemistry and that's a real weapon and it created a really fun game because it kept Bayern vulnerable even while they were on top but Madrid were relentlessly vulnerable. It's also nice to see, really heartwarming to see the Trent Alexander-Arnold culture war go international this season. Last night felt like the perfect example. After the game, I saw tweets from two professionals in the industry and they might both be right.

20:00And one of them was saying like, you know, the way he creates that goal for Mbappe, some of the passes he's playing, this is why he has to be at the World Cup. And one was saying, you look at how he can't track a man who he played club football with for years and can't spot a run behind him and this is why Thomas Tuchel won't take Chanty Alexander to the World Cup and I was like yeah that's it that's perfect this is both why he will and will not be on the plane to the US and yeah it's kind of fascinating that he is forever destined to be this like weird like one of those sort of desk toys that just constantly swing and in constant movement it's like every action will get a reaction everything good thing he does someone will say yeah but every bad thing he does people say yeah but and last night just from the watching the highlights this morning last night felt like a pretty good embodiment of that schrodinger's

20:48Liam Twomey: galactico there you go a dress that is neither blue nor gold or perhaps both at the same time rather less heartwarming though uh on tuesday the news from fifa that they're launching disciplinary proceedings against the spanish federation after the instance that paul belus was telling us about in Tuesday's totally football show during the Spain-Egypt game played at Espanyol's ground. Large parts of the ground, much of the stadium apparently joining in repeated chants, well, anti-Islamic chants. And it was kind of worrying from that point of view to see similar chants enacted outside the Bernabeu ahead of the match.

21:24Liam Twomey: Obviously, this is not an isolated issue. Anyway, on to Arsenal's successful trip to Lisbon next.

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24:42Martinelli.

24:45Liam Twomey: In towards Hammett. and this time they look and there is no flag and Arsenal have stolen this first leg at the very end. Stealthy play from Kai Havertz. Sneaking in unspotted and converting with ice cool. Ah, go on then. You sat through what the Athletic described as a seriously tough watch. But you did get to see a lovely goal at the end. Yeah, it was a great goal. Gabriel Martinelli was a real spark for Arsenal. He came on what? Quarter one hour to go? Yeah. Less? 10, 15 minutes to go. Right. And until that point, a lot of Arsenal's play had almost been like walking football, to be fair. There was no real pace in the play, whether that was running with it or passing.

25:36And when he came on, he just looked like a player that wanted to make a difference. and for the goal, he's come inside the field, lovely ball over the top for Kai Havertz, who, I mean, as Liam will know extremely well from his time at Chelsea, is so good at ghosting into the penalty area without being marked. Also his touch to kill the ball. Great touch and I also think the finish is much harder than he made it look because, I mean, everyone's been in those positions at five a side, let's say, and you want to put it through the key of his legs is really tempting but to find the corner and beat the extended hand of Ruiz Silva I think he's done extremely well in that position but those two I think in particular really helped Arsenal out there because even though I feel like the game did have some ebb and flow not as much as Madrid v Bayern Arsenal needed to come away with a win after what had happened in the Carabao Cup

26:39Liam Twomey: and the FA Cup. Right. What happened in the Carabao Cup when they had Kepa in goal? Now, one similarity between this game and the one at the Bernard Bay was that the winning team's goalkeeper was man of the match. And the arrival, the return rather, of David Rea between the posts for the Gunners was decisive, would you say? 100%. When you look at him this season, I feel like he's had similar performances throughout the year. I mean, I remember West Ham at home in October or Forrest at home in September and he's come up with big saves at 0-0 or 1-0 to keep Arsenal ahead. And then they've gone on to build on a lead.

27:16And those moments, I think, can't be underestimated in the story of their season because he's done it so often.

27:24Liam Twomey: And he had a couple in this game, particularly that early chance set up by a wonderful Trivela pass, extravagant pass from Diamande for the left-back. Arohu, I believe. Sorry if the pronunciation is terrible. but yeah that first save in particular I didn't actually realize sometimes when there's a fingertip save it's hard to really understand how much of a difference it's made but there was one close-up angle that showed the difference in trajectory of the ball and to be able to flick that onto the crossbar I think you know could completely make the tie for Arsenal but then also So in the second half is, I believe it was a double save or a reaction to not being able to hold on to one shot and then spread in again, kind of like Neuer did.

28:14Or didn't. Or didn't. Yeah, I thought his reactions, his concentration is basically the big key to being able to help Arsenal in so many situations where in previous years they may have conceded and gone on to draw a game.

28:32Liam Twomey: in previous years or previous games indeed. How many Arsenal fans would have watched last night or at least come away thinking, oh, what could have been this season? A few, but... I know it's tough to put yourself in the mind of an Arsenal fan. A few, but I do feel like some Arsenal fans are probably over the Carabao Cup final. Oh, really? Yeah. And the Southampton game? maybe the Southampton game not so much but the Carabao Cup final was coming up to three weeks ago right um and don't even remember who won it to be fair no um I think in this moment a lot of the focus is now on Premier League and the Champions League they're not trying to look back at what could have been um and with with those Kepa uh mistakes I I feel like there was an understanding that if raya was in gold those mistakes wouldn't have happened so it's not one that most arsenal fans would be overthinking about there probably would be some regret but um i mean you can't change the past so yeah yeah well on the positive side of things the two most important titles still out there arsenal with a one goal lead much as bianar but much as the Bavarians they won away at a notoriously difficult ground sporting with a terrific record there they'd beaten everybody who'd visited in the Champions League including Paris Saint-Germain this season away from home how are they?

30:06So they lost 3-0 away to Bodeglimp in the round of 16 which I think looking back on it I wouldn't say it was a completely surprise because of how but a glimpse have played throughout the Champions League before they got knocked out. And looking at how the second leg came about for sporting, obviously it was at home, but it was interesting that Rui Borges, their manager, gave them two days off after that first leg just to completely reset mentally and physically. I don't know if you'd do the same this time around. They weren't, I guess, put away as convincingly as they were out in Norway. But what they would, I guess, take encouragement from is their performance because they really hurt Arsenal at times, even though they didn't score.

31:01They showed that they are a side that can cause issues at the Emirates if they are brave and really go for it. So it's not one where Arsenal would think, okay, the tie's done. I think there's respect there from both sides and Arsenal are really going to have to, I think, up it in the second leg because even though they have the lead, I don't feel like they can perform the same way for the first half hour, 45 minutes, hour of that game.

31:31Liam Twomey: They may well have Bukayo Saka returning already. Declan Rice was back for this game as the injury crisis eases a little bit for Mikel Arteta, So whoever makes it through from the tie with sporting will be taking on either Barcelona or Atletico Madrid in the semifinals. They face each other on Wednesday evening while Paris Saint-Germain or Liverpool await whoever makes it through the second game at the Allianz Arena. In other Gunners related news on Tuesday before we move on, a shout out to Aaron Ramsey who has announced his retirement from football. just yesterday. He'd been without a club since leaving Mexican side Pumas after that sad business with his dog.

32:20Liam Twomey: So yes, but sad to see him go. Yeah, another player who I grew up watching that's retired and makes me feel old. How old is he now? 35. Yes, 35. Yeah, so I mean, I remember him coming in. Actually, the first time I watched him was the FA Cup final. Oh. Cardiff versus Portsmouth. And that summer that he joined Arsenal, Manchester United have actually, they'd put on their website that they'd signed him. So it was kind of before, obviously the David Ornstein time where you kind of know what's happening before. It's confirmed and stuff. But for his time at Arsenal, I mean, I think it's looking back, it's quite mad how young he was.

33:11and the amount of games he was playing, even after that broken leg that he suffered at Stoke, to be able to come back and have a season like he did in 2013-14 where he really took the league by storm. I think his ability should be looked back on and really respected because he's a player that I don't think you see much of in the Premier League. And for me, I think one of my favorite goals that he scored is actually not in the Premier League, not even in the Champions League, but it's the Europa League. A game against CSKA Moscow. Oh, yeah. Ozil thinks a ball into him and he's kind of, he's jumped and he's managed to work the outside of his right boot into this mad position to flick the ball over Akinfeyev.

34:02Really, really lovely goal. I'd recommend everyone to go and look it up because it is top stuff and it just shows the wizard that this guy was that I think people only saw in glimpses.

34:15Liam Twomey: Nkhitaryan, lovely movement, Ramsey! Scores brilliantly, quite brilliantly. That was audacious. 3-1 Arsenal. For Wales as well, he made the team of the tournament in Wales' remarkable Euro 2016 campaign. Daniel? Yeah, I mean, we haven't heard from Aaron Ramsey for a while, but I think you can probably expect to hear from him more now. I remember seeing a video in Euro 2016 where they asked seven or eight of the Wales squad which player in the squad would go on to be a very good manager. And all of them answered Aaron Ramsey within about a quarter of a second of the question finishing. He did his, because he's not played a lot of football recently and he had a lot of injuries, he finished his UEFA A licence in 2024.

35:00he's already managed Cardiff on a player manager basis although it was very much caretaker managing at that point so I think yeah he said I want to manage Wales one day and that's you know the rest of the goal for the rest of my career in football is to manage my country so there is very much a conveyor belt I think for that to happen so expect to see him in going for a managerial job soon

35:24Liam Twomey: I'm just watching the CSKA game at the moment not all of it but Ramsey's already scored once it's not the goal you're talking about is this the game at the Emirates? Yeah it'll be on its way then it's remarkable the team it's not remarkable if you remember what Arsenal was up to at the time but they had Ozil they had Ramsey Mkhitaryan there's probably others in there as well I mean the game that Daniel mentions that he managed a caretaker role for Cardiff was actually against Jack Wilshere against Norwich that was back end of last season and that was another kind of wow moment for a lot of Arsenal fans who grew up watching them.

36:00But, I mean, for both of them, Lacazette scored a really good goal as well, left-footed, kind of on the half volley in that game. I remember being kind of right in front of it. But, yeah, in terms... Is that for the Ramsey goal? That's the Ramsey goal. Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, imagine watching that in real time. That was honestly... I couldn't believe I'd seen it. Go on.

36:27Liam Twomey: No, I was just going to say, the other takeaway from this is how much he looks like Theo James. If he doesn't go into management, possibly not got the same build, but... Anyway, sorry, perhaps you had something more apposite, Ted. No, I was just saying that Jack Wilshere being in management now, full-time of Luton Town, he's got, I believe, what is the competition called now? Because it was the Papa John's, it was the Czech trade. Vertu, that's it. He's got the Virtu Trophy final coming up. Okay. What is the Virtu Trophy? So it's like the St. Johnston's paint trophy. Oh, okay. Yeah. If I'm going back even further.

37:08Yeah, yeah. So yeah, he's got a trip to Wembley coming up, Jack Wilshere. Hopefully it goes well for him. But yeah, a lot of that kind of group of players are coming towards their retirement now, which is quite scary for me.

37:24Liam Twomey: well next on the making you feel older wistful list is bernardo silver will be getting misty out about him or perhaps not i don't know how people feel about bernardo silver i think it depends who you support right yeah anyway his departure from man city at least although hopefully not from football confirmed uh this week by manchester city amidst all of this Liam you wrote this week and I referenced this at the top this much clicked investigation of where is Mikhailo Mudrik now and the answer is quite surprising yeah I didn't actually know how many people had read this so that's quite pleasant to hear he has been training at Uxbridge FC in northwest London for several months at his own kind of expense and behest and arrangement because Chelsea are not allowed to arrange anything for him.

38:20Okay, so a brief timeline on this is they bought him for what, 68 million? 62 million, I believe, up front from Shakhtar Donetsk in January 2023. Of course, gazumped Arsenal in the process. I was going to ask, do you think there's an alternate timeline where he joins Arsenal and it's just a completely different story? I mean, who knows how all of this particular process would have played out, But I did feel even at the time that Arsenal would have been a better spot for him because he would have been coming into a more settled environment. He would have been behind Gabriel Martinelli and he would have had, I think, one of his best friends in football in Zinchenko at the club to help him settle.

38:59Whereas he came into this, I think even people at Chelsea would admit it was chaos at the time in January 23 in the process of overhauling the squad with Graham Potter, who obviously wasn't long for the job. and I think Modric's career at Chelsea never really recovered from that bad start but then of course this anti-doping violation happens.

39:23Liam Twomey: So he's been charged with that but he's never actually had a verdict on it and as a result doesn't know how long he will be suspended for. Yeah so the timeline on this December 2024 the FA wrote to him about an adverse finding in a routine urine test. So he hasn't played since then. His last game for Chelsea was a 2-0 win over Heidenheim in the UEFA Conference League group stage, a game he scored in, but it feels like a century ago. And then in June 2025, the FA formally charged him with a violation of their anti-doping policies. And so the disciplinary process has been ongoing since then, but no one is guiding or briefing or saying anything about it.

40:09Everyone's very tight-lipped and there is no clarity. It appears even really to the parties involved about when this is actually going to be concluded.

40:18Liam Twomey: Is it behind Man City on the docket? Well, that's the thing. There have been some suggestions that the FA and the Premier League are a bit busy with other stuff. I mean, the FA still haven't ruled on Chelsea's historic breaches of financial rules. I thought they had. No, the Premier League came back and punished Chelsea. The FA are still to rule on that. Oh, they have a separate disciplinary. It's a separate process that's going on. Again, it's unlikely to end in a sporting sanction. But that may happen before Madrid. I mean, Madrid could get clarity today. He could get clarity in a week, in a month.

40:52But it's been 16 months now since he played.

40:54Liam Twomey: Yeah, I mean, even longer since he played a game. You were saying December 2024. Yeah, about 16 months since he played and I think about 10 months since he was charged. yeah um and the thing the thing for me about the piece was how do you stay ready as a footballer when you don't and you're not allowed to play football and you don't know when you will be um and it was quite interesting to find out essentially why he'd picked Uxbridge FC it's important to know I didn't get any of this I didn't get any of this from him he's quite a shy reserve character did you speak to him at all no no I kind of said hello and that was it um There's not much he can say, really, in the midst of this process.

41:34But he picked Duxbridge FC, I think, because it's a very secluded place. It's a public facility. He could rent the pitch. And they also happen to have the same grade of 3G surface that young boys in Switzerland do. So it's far beyond the level that you'd usually expect from step three in England. So it's easy to see why a Premier League footballer in a kind of exile would choose it. And he looks in good shape? He looks in excellent physical shape.

42:03Liam Twomey: Whatever you feel about how he came to test positive in that sample, it does seem like kind of mental cruelty to keep him in this limbo. Yeah, I mean, we just don't know how the positive test came about. Right. And he maintains his innocence, has done since the start. But I do think it's unfair that the process has dragged on so long. I mean, you have to say the maximum punishment he could get is a four-year ban. History suggests that time served would be part of any punishment, and he's already missed 16 months. But if he's found innocent, he could play tomorrow. But then what happens about the 16 months that he missed?

42:46He's 25 at the moment? He's 25 now. He was 23 when he last played a game. Yeah.

42:52Liam Twomey: Madness. It recalls slightly the Adrian Mutu affair. and the only reason I mention this is that Chelsea famously then sued Moutou for millions and millions of pounds. Did they ever get that money? I don't think so. I mean, yeah, that's why I hesitate when you mentioned it because I think the difference so far has been in Chelsea's approach. I think they've very much supported Mudrik in all the ways that they're allowed to. They can't arrange anything for him, but they've been monitoring his situation. he's on a physical program that they are monitoring which they're allowed to do and they've been fulfilling their contractual obligations to him.

43:31I think with Mutu it was immediately more of an adversarial situation because it was a recreational drug and there was a sense I think maybe that he wasn't taking life super seriously at Chelsea after all the money they'd spent on him and it felt like Chelsea were maybe sending a bit of a message by pursuing him as vociferously as they did through the courts. I mean, that took more than a decade, that legal fight. Did it? Yeah. Yeah, it went through every conceivable sporting court you could imagine. And I think it ended up with Chelsea technically winning. But I don't think they ever got anything close to the money that they were technically awarded.

44:06All right.

44:08Liam Twomey: Crikey. Daniel's going to tell us very shortly about Saints-Wrexham or Wrexham Saints and also some of the other events that have taken place in the last few days in the Championship and beyond.

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46:31You're listening to The Totally Football Show with James Richardson. Now we do four times a week. Keep up to date with us on Insta and enjoy seeing glorious Technicolor on YouTube at The Totally Show.

46:43Liam Twomey: Listener, amongst all the other things that happened this week, Tuesday night brought news of the passing of Macer Luchescu, who I think for pretty much anyone who's followed the game any time in the last four decades is something of a legend. We saw him only a fortnight ago managing Romania in their World Cup playoff with Turkey, and we did kind of wonder, I think most of us at the time, if it was his goodbye. Everyone knew, I think, that he'd been seriously unwell, that he'd had to leave his hospital program to be there with his national team in this key game he said prior to the match i can't leave like a coward of his role as romania coach they lost the game and there was a certain look that he gave as the as the whistle blew that made you wonder if we'd be seeing him again and sadly we won't uh but a legend he leaves as uh 45 years as a manager over 1 ,500 games.

47:36Liam Twomey: He was in charge of two national sides, Romania, who he took to their first ever European Championship way back in 1984, and 11 different club sides as well. And just a remarkable fellow. A salute to him and to all who miss him. Daniel, let's now talk about the EFL. You were in Wales on Tuesday night for Wrexham against Arsenal conquering Southampton. Southampton very much looking like the Bayern Munich of the championship here. They are in a remarkable run of form at the moment. 16 games unbeaten before Tuesday, including beating two Premier League sides in the FA Cup, Arsenal and Fulham, Fulham away.

48:23It's been a mad season for Southampton in that they came down from the Premier League and so should have been or were one of the favourites to be automatically promoted. Appointed Will Still, sacked Will Still, gave a job to a caretaker who did very well, then appointed the caretaker. He then didn't win for the first seven games. Everyone thought we've completely balked this whole season. And now they are the form team in the country with the run they're on. It was such a statement on Tuesday night. So Southampton made six changes. They changed both their central defenders, both their holding midfielders and their striker.

48:58from a team that beat Arsenal and beat Wrexham 5-1 away. It was a remarkable thing to see. The game was close until it was 3-1. There was a kind of heads gone down Southampton sort of kicking, you know, stop, stop, he's already dead element to the last 15 minutes of the game. But before that, they just look really good under Eckert now. There's two things he's done, or three things he's done very quickly. Firstly, they brought Seal Larine, who didn't play much and is now fit and firing. And him instead of Adam Armstrong just gives them such a big physical presence up front. He's changed formation from 3-4-3 to 4-2-3-1 to support Larine.

49:41And they're also prepared to sacrifice possession a little bit more under Stil and to an extent under Ekker on the bad run. They were this kind of sterile domination, having the ball but not really doing anything with it team. They're the opposite of that now. They are all action. and they've got some of the best players in the championship, which they should have. They sold players for nearly 150 million last summer, Southampton, in Fernandes and Dibbling and others. And they didn't spend it particularly well, but it has finally all clicked. And they are, I think you'd call them the team you don't want to face in the playoffs.

50:13There's still a slight squeak that they could get top two because they play Ipswich at home before the end of the season. They'd need Ipswich to drop three or four points and Southampton to win every game. But the way they're playing at the moment, the winning every game bit looks possible.

50:26Liam Twomey: Currently six points between Saints in sixth spot and Ipswich, who have moved ahead again of Millwall and Middlesbrough, back into second spot, thanks to the other results on Monday, which saw the Lions, who we bigged up in Sunday's show, promptly lose. But all in all, a good set of games for Saints. Rod Stewart scored again. That's nice to see. Coventry and Ipswich. which Coventry only drew nil-nil at Hull, but they still bettered their position in terms of what they need to secure automatic promotion. Only four points now are necessary for Frank Lampard's side from their final five games to return to the Premier League for the first time in 25 years.

51:11Liam Twomey: Ipswich, meantime, who are looking for an immediate return, as mentioned, now second on goal difference, but with those two games in hand. They came from behind to beat Birmingham 2-1. Daniel, you like to get around. And you were also in Berkshire at Reading on Monday to see Lincoln getting promoted to the Championship for the first time in 65 years. Yeah, the story of the EFL this season by a distance, Lincoln, in terms of overachievement, in terms of building. So 10 years ago this season, Lincoln were finishing in the bottom half of the National League, England's fifth tier for the fifth season in a row.

51:50and Leicester were winning the Premier League. And at best for Leicester, they'll play each other next season. It's not guaranteed that Lincoln won't be in the division above Leicester, obviously, with their relegation pending. But Lincoln have just gone about everything the right way. It started very quickly. It started, you know, listeners may remember their FA Cup run when they played Arsenal in an FA Cup quarterfinal under the Cowley brothers. That paid for a training ground, paid for some ground improvements. And ever since then, they have just supercharged everything by being really smart.

52:22So last season in League One, Birmingham City were promoted on April the 8th, which was the earliest ever promotion from that tier. The average wage at Birmingham last season was£18 ,500, we are led to believe. It's being reported for players. Lincoln don't pay anyone more than£3 ,500 a week. They have done this on a budget. Michael Skubala has been phenomenal. His coaching team with Chris Cohen and Tom Shaw former friend of the show or still friend of the show, David Priest, as goalkeeper coach and set piecework. They're just brilliant at everything they do. And I think I said it on the show the other day, but you feel sometimes covering the FL that it's all bad news and financial emergency.

53:02So it's really nice to go to clubs that get it right. And they also let me go on the pitch with them to celebrate winning the title on Monday, which goes up in that kind of top 10 career moments you pitch invaded daniel story i did what daniel story does which looks sheepish and tried to stay quiet and try and sneak on uh and nobody telling me not to and the club said it was fine and yeah nobody at reading told me not to uh yeah it was it was just yeah it's just magic to stand in front of an away it's not a club i support but right to stand in front of an away end and watch them uh you know 3 000 people in an away and celebrating as you say first promotion to the second tier in 65 years 65 years just on um Lincoln City I've done a few bits with them over the years um obviously as Daniel mentioned there's uh Arsenal link there um because of the FA Cup game but also around the start of this decade so during Covid times they were really good at using the loan market so um they took a couple of Arsenal players one was Tyrese John Jules who's now playing at Kilmarnock and the other is Brooke Norton Cuffey who's now in Serie R with Genoa and was being linked to a move to Inter in January but they also had Morgan Rogers Brennan Johnson as well so at the time I was able to speak to their director of football Jez George and he was really good on how they kind of looked to identify really good talent at the top teams who are in need of real football experience, senior football experience, and being able to give them, obviously, a dose of reality in terms of what, I guess, I think League One football offered at that time, but also just the experience of playing men's football as well, which they got spot on with quite a few.

55:00I mean, four players there, for example.

55:02Liam Twomey: Daniel, I was going to ask you, you mentioned the incredible wage budget. What kind of problems are they going to have going up to the Championship that other clubs are going to come in for all these massively underpaid talents? I think how they would describe it is that they think they're the best club in the country for what they want to do as a home for the players they have. They sold John and McCarma last summer to Norwich for£1.2 million, which is the highest ever sale in the club's history, and they got better. so they are certainly not scared about selling players they bought a ukrainian under 21 international for not very much money from the czech league who has slotted into defensive midfield it looks brilliant so they all you know art mentions jez george he will back himself they will all back themselves to do that again there's obviously a big financial gap there was a change of ownership structure midway through this season so they have some american investment it's an investment group led by the former owner of the San Diego Padres also includes Landon Donovan who's been watching their games at early morning US time over the course of the last few months so there is the ability to spend but they say they want to do that on infrastructure and kind of legacy projects more than player wages I don't think they're going to deviate too far from it keeping hold of Michael Scaballo is the massive thing because he's East Midlands based he's this is still his first job in management he's done a remarkable job and if I was Leicester City I'd be doing anything I could to try and appoint him this summer whichever division they are in but yeah I mean it's just it is just a brilliant story and there aren't that many as many as them around as there should be it would be remiss of me not to plug the piece I wrote because I spent Friday with them and Monday with them all behind the scenes and obviously on the pitch after the game so there's a kind of long read feature on how they did it okay that'll be on the eye already or in the days to come, certainly?

56:56Yeah, that was out yesterday, so the inews.com, yeah.

56:59Liam Twomey: Perfect. Very, very good. Thanks so much, Daniel. We'll be seeing you on Sunday in the studio, I think. Absolutely, after Chelsea and me and Matt Davies-Adams, I think, schlepping over from Stamford Bridge. Brilliant. It's a big weekend as the Premier League returns. Many thanks, anyway, for joining us today. Many thanks to you, Liam, and to Art, and to Xavi and producer Charlie in the booth, a new listener. We're back on Thursday morning all over again. Do join us then for now from all of us here. It's goodbye. You've been listening to The Totally Football Show, part of the Athletic FC podcast network.

57:38For other great podcasts just like this one, including The Athletic FC and our dedicated club podcasts, search for The Athletic in all the usual places. We're also at The Totally Show on Insta and at The Totally Show on YouTube. The Totally Football Show is an Athletic Media Company production.

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