Can Chelsea topple red-hot Villa? Can Man Utd function without Bruno?

0:00The Athletic FC

0:30there's Premier League matchday 18. Man United without Bruno against Newcastle. Wolves not without a hope, perhaps, though, at Anfield. Plus, fun facts regarding Sean Dyche and James Milner for you to amaze friends and family with in awkward Yuletide moments. All that and more in this Totally Football Show.

0:53Hello there. It's December the 23rd, excitingly enough. We've got a small but elite crew here in. in Turley Studio One with Art de Rocher joining us. Hello, Art. Hello. Good morning. Thanks for having me. I've given your surname a bit too much. No, it's fine. You should hear Ayo say it. It's unbelievable. How does he say it? I'm not going to do an impression, but he gives it a lot of flair, basically. All right. Yeah. Duncan Alexander. You can't do much with that. You know. Lovely to see you anyway. See you both. We will also have the thoughts of Mahir Mazahi, who's out in Morocco on the opening days of AFCON.

1:32That'll be a little bit later on. Also, Jacob Townswell will be dialing in from the second city to discuss Aston Villa. Aston Villa, team of the moment. Although, as soon as we've discussed them being team of the moment, they will of course lose this weekend. That's how it works. Final games of this year, 2025, coming up. Are you pumped, Art? Pumped. I think once we get into them, I probably will be. No, you're not excited. Well, I think that's because I'm coming off of watching Arsenal away at Everton, which was a very dull game. My mum caught up on match today on a Sunday morning, and she didn't even realise Arsenal were going to be on.

2:15She was so excited by all the other games, Leeds Palace, Spurs, Liverpool, and then she just felt that the Arsenal game was a bit of a dull one at the end. So that's where I'm coming from. But I'm sure once it all kicks off, I'll be up for it. Right. Benji's Uncle Jeff has long been part of the Totally Pantheon, but now Art's mum. Yeah. The Art mum factor. I'm not sure if she caught Monday night's Fulham Forest effing forgettable fixture. Duncan, were you across that? I was across it, yeah. Yeah, why not? Bit of Monday night action. Yeah. I mean, obviously, Raul Jimenez, perfect penalty record.

2:57Is he the best penalty taker in Premier League history? He's up there. He's up there, but he's not the best, is he? Who's the best? Yaro Turi. Oh, OK. So, Matt Letizia did 23 in a row. Yeah, but he missed one. Mark Crossley saved it. Right. Paul Palmer equally has done 12 in a row, but he has also missed one. Yeah, if we're looking at players to have a perfect record, then it's Jimenez and Toure. OK. There's very few players when they run up, or in Jimenez's case, amble up to take a penalty that you're pretty confident that they're going to do it. I mean, obviously, Arsenal now have Gokerez who takes a mean penalty.

3:36But yeah, that was about it, really, in that game. It wasn't a classic, but it was a big win for Fulham, second in a row. And there's a little gap opening now, isn't there? Obviously, Forrest is probably good for West Ham that Fulham won that game because West Ham are five points behind Forrest now. Fulham, fully ten points above the Hammers. Speaking of perfect penalty records, did you know that Harry Kane in the Bundesliga has had 20 spot kicks? How many has he converted? 20. 20 of them, yes. That's right, the remarkable Harry Kane. Are you going to mention France, Duncan? No. We'll move on.

4:15We'll move on. Matchday 18 with Matchday 17 freshly finished at Fulham. match here 18 awaits it begins on Boxing Day just one Premier League game that evening at 8pm it's Manchester United against Newcastle Newcastle, oh I thought had a poor record at Old Trafford they've actually won 5 of the last 6 meetings between the two sides of course Man United will have Nobun Fernandes this time Saturday there's Nottingham Forest against Man City at lunchtime City have won 7 games in a row in all competitions at three o 'clock Arsenal who by this point will quite possibly be in second place will be hosting Brighton who they beat their 2-0 in the Carabao Cup back in October I think you were there Art yes so that was a heavily rotated Arsenal team Brighton aren't a team they usually have an easy time against and to get a 2-0 win I believe it was with a rotated team I think would maybe give them a bit of encouragement facing them and also people don't remember last season, Arsenal didn't beat Brighton in the league.

5:21Both 1-1, that's it. Yeah, both 1-0. And that game was the one where Declan Rice got sent off later. Yeah, yeah. For a gentle nudge. Oh, on the free kick. But there's a lot of talk in Arsenal World at the moment of points versus what they did last season. Uncle Jeff. Yeah, Uncle Jeff, very much. So this is a chance to add two to that tally. Excellent, we'll get on to that game a little bit more in depth soon enough. but continuing with the Saturday fixtures. Also at three o 'clock, there's Liverpool against Wolves. Yep. West Ham taking on Fulham. West Ham in desperate need of points, of course.

5:57Brentford take on Bournemouth, who are eight games without a win currently. And Burnley face Everton. Here's a question. This is the first meeting between these clubs in more than a decade to not what? I have Sean Dyche as manager. Oh, nailed it. In one of the two dugouts. Extraordinary statistic, no? Yeah, unbelievable. I think when you think of those teams, I guess Dwight McNeil might be, actually, and James Tarkovsky, they'll be the survivors. Michael Keane as well. So there's a lot there. There's a lot of Dyche influence, even though he won't be there. Kind of a Spider-Man meme. Forest play at 12.30, so they could get there for the second half.

6:41At 5.30, it's Chelsea-Aston Villa. That should be good. Sunday then, two games. Sunderland take on Leeds at 2pm. Sunderland and Arsenal, the only two sides who are unbeaten at home so far this season. Leeds, though, on a terrific run of form, and in particular, Dominic Calvert-Lewin. And then, at 4.30, Crystal Palace against Tottenham, who will be without the suspended Christian Romero and Xavi Simmonds. let's begin it all with boxing days man united newcastle treat this is the totally football show with james richardson part of the athletic fc podcast network your plans for boxing day no i think football manager i'm quite deep into that are you i know it's divided a lot of opinion has this yeah this edition has why um so last year's game was cancelled and uh this year's one is quite different to the last few editions.

7:42Oh, really? Last year was cancelled because they couldn't get it ready in time. Yeah. They were able to have a game out ready at the right time this year, but it's needed a lot of updates since almost every couple of weeks. Mostly just to sort out a few bugs and add or re-add things people were missing from the old games. Right. What have they done? it's hard to properly explain they they basically wanted to re-imagine how the game looks so the big thing is the user interface right and a lot of uh i guess the diehard football manager fans right would you categorize yourself in that bracket i i'd say i'm maybe a rung below okay just because i'm not as intense as most seem to be and also i think i understand that you can change the layout or something and it'd still be good can you yeah i think so yeah a lot of people are struggling i guess with that but also just the feel are you saying that that game attracts an unusually high proportion of people who might struggle with a form yes yes uh but i've been okay with it i just won the league with arsenal um a tuna won at anfield actually so very can be done yeah so it can be done um very 1989 yeah yeah very much so excellent all right well that's boxing it and then of course at eight o 'clock you'll be in front of your telly or possibly even at Old Trafford I don't know to see Man United take on Newcastle because it features one of your favorite players and obviously it's not Brynna Fernandes because he's not going to be there but you're excited for Big Nick or Saint Nick which one do you want to go with we'll go with Saint Nick Saint Nick what do you like so much about Vuldermade well I first really got to grips with him during the summer because I went out to the under 21s Euros and England had Germany in their group so a lot of research was done around just watching his clips at Stuttgart and I think at that time I saw what people are now seeing with him at Newcastle in terms of being an incredibly technical player who just didn't seem to have the right body type for it.

10:03So yeah, I was really taken with him just off that. And throughout the Euros as well, I think a lot of people who would have just been glimpsing at the tournament would have seen he was top goal scorer, but he got quite a few assists as well. And I thought, yeah, this is just a really pure footballer. and whether it was Newcastle or a different team, I thought he was someone who was going to have to have a move in the summer and I'm glad that it's worked out. I know he scored that unfortunate own goal a couple of weeks ago but even with that, I think he's been one of the signings of the season.

10:43Made up for it with a brace last weekend and from Newcastle's point of view, I know it was a trauma, the whole Isaac going and the way that he left but having Volta Mardi plus cash compared to Isaac. He's still a villa, to be fair. He's still a villa. Indeed. Compared to Isaac, obviously, as we now discover, fractured ankles has made that a particularly unfortunate comparison. But anyway, Newcastle, for all Nick Volta Mardi's exploits, how many goals has he got? Is it nine? Seven in the league. Right. And it might be ten in all comps. Ten in all comps, yeah. But when you look at how he performed last season, he's on quite similar tracks.

11:24So last season, it was 17 in 33 games in all comps. So almost a goal every other game. He feels like a very one in two. But I do love players that do play like they're not in the body that they're in. Yeah. You know, like Tim Cahill was essentially like a six foot four hitman. Maybe him and Volta Marder just were born in the wrong bodies. Maybe that's a sort of, you know, Tom Hanks film down the line. All right, were you born in the right body, Dan? I think so, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I've got no complaints with this battered old unit. But anyway, there you go. Newcastle, for all Nick Voldemort's exploits, are in 11th place.

12:02Although if they win this, they'll be level with Man United. And maybe in the conversation again for knocking on the door of the top four. Their away form has not been the best, Newcastle. Only two wins in their last 11 away in all competitions. those came at Everton Union Saint-Gilois but they are facing a United team for whom Ruben Amirim's got a bit of a tactical conundrum what are they going to do without their most ever-present player Bruno Fernandes? Well it would have been a really good time for Kobe Mane to come in but he's also ruled out Casemiro will come back which will help but yeah it's an interesting, there's some Manchester United fans who obviously think that Bruno Fernandes is as good as he is and his numbers are incredible in terms of chance creation that he does mean that they are very open in midfield and on transition, particularly against a team like Newcastle who don't get to counter-attack perhaps as much as someone like Anthony Alanga would have liked them to but they can do that and maybe this will make them a bit more shored up in the middle Who comes in?

13:11Agate maybe? It's very negative because I was trying to rack my brain. Obviously, Mbwemo is away, Diallo is away. You could drop Mason Mount in there and maybe get Xerxi in somewhere. But it's come at a bad time given we knew that United were going to be one of the most affected by AFCON teams. So, yeah, losing someone like Bruno Fernandes, who basically never gets injured, is bad timing. I mean, in terms of good timing, it's good that the Premier League have given us at least one Boxing Day game to head off the ultra-purists. And it's good that it is the team who've won the most on Boxing Day, Manchester United, against the team who've lost the most on Boxing Day.

13:54Is that right? Yeah. So there's not going to be a draw. We shall see. We shall see. United, who've looked better in recent performances against Bournemouth and Villa, but at the same time only took one point from those two matches because they can't hold on to a lead, essentially. Just on that, so when I was looking at a few bits, I saw that for shots conceded per 90, they're actually the fifth best in the league. But when it comes down to goals conceded from shots, they're fourth worst. So it's very much, OK, they might not concede a lot of shots, but when they do, they tend to fly in, which is a problem.

14:35It speaks to that XG table, which people have been sharing a lot on social media, which has Man United third. If they'd scored as many goals as the boffins say they should, and their opposition had scored as many goals as the boffins say they should. A Wolves equally be third last, not last. I don't know how much we can rely on that table. But the one that counts at the end of the season currently has them seventh, but only three points off the top four. It's a tough game, though, on Boxing Day. I think the signs are good for Manchester United. I think what you needed to see this autumn was a combination of results that were OK, which I think tick, and improvement in all areas.

15:18And they are looking, each game, they're looking better. And we've talked all season about the fact that they're not in many competitions, thanks to last season in Grimsby Town. But they've got a really good chance to go on a bit of a run. And yeah, I still think that a top five finish for them is within grasp. There you go. That's the one game then on December 26th. On the Saturday, the opening game is Nottingham Forest against Manchester City. Forest, who are 17th, five points from the drop and a little bit dismal Monday night at Fulham. Yeah, 0.67 xG, no big chances, just a bit. Yeah, I mean, you do get this with Sean Deitch teams away from home sometimes, where they sort of set up to be quite cautious and then realise quite early on, oh no, we should be a bit more adventurous and they can't really switch.

16:05I don't think that will be the case at home at Christmas fixture against Manchester City, but we shall see. You don't think that they'll be looking to be expensive? No, I think they'll be, you know, not that they weren't up for Fulham, that's such a nonsense cliche for professional footballers, but it was that sort of game where they never really got going. I think they will at home against a big side. They actually won this fixture back in March, although there was a different Forest, arguably a different Man City as well, who now got Ran Chirky, another of your favourite players are, and Phil Foden in banging form and Erling Haaland on a remarkable scoring run.

16:42This is, of course, him against his dad's first club in England. Indeed. I think the first time he played against him, he scored a hat-trick. Did he? I remember because on the FPL, that was my triple captain. Nice. But yeah, I think with City at the minute, I know they're Arsenal's title rivals, but it's just nice to see that they're playing football that looks enjoyable again. It isn't just a robotic, okay, you pass to him, he passes to him, he'll score. It's a bit more free-flowing. And I think Ryan Shirky, whichever club he joined, at some point that was going to happen. and when you look at his last few games, obviously he's starting more games in the league now.

17:25He's got a really nice connection with Phil Foden as well, which I think for Pep Guardiola would be massive because he doesn't have to pick between one or the other. He can play them both and they can coexist. So yeah, I think with those two behind Haaland, it's actually quite fun to watch, I say begrudgingly. Yeah, I think the thing you're right, For a long time recently, City were quite sort of, they were incredible but very functional and it was like you knew what we were going to get. This feels a bit more like they were in the early 2010s in the first couple of Premier League titles where they're not perfect but they are quite exciting and it's good.

18:02Pep going out with a flourish perhaps at City. Arsenal, their title rivals. How many title rivals do City have though? Because Aston Villa, who will be at Arsenal a week on Tuesday, well, a week today as we record, are only three points off the top themselves. Let's get a little measure of what people think about that in Birmingham with Jacob Tanswell.

18:31This Saturday at 5.30, Chelsea will be hosting Aston Villa. You're going to be there to see if Villa can make it 11 wins in a row in all competitions. Yes, it's quite remarkable, really, isn't it? Considering where Villa were at the start of the season, where all hopes seem lost. They couldn't score. They couldn't win. The summer was terrible, really, a nightmare. And now they've won seven in the league in a row. First time they've done it since 1990. And yeah, they've just got this remarkable knack of winning all the time, which is a world's away from the start of the season. Jacob, are we looking at a three-way title chase?

19:10No, I don't think so. Why not? Even Villa fans don't say that. I even said at the start of the season, I think if Villa got into Europe, whether that's Europe League or obviously, that would maybe Emery's best achievement at Astrid Villa because of all the adversity he'd faced in the summer. So the fact that they're nestled in that top four at the moment is incredible. So, yeah, I think right now they're definitely Chabby's league contenders, but they probably haven't got enough to mount a real title charge. OK, and partly that would be because of that limited summer transfer window. is there any sign that the club is maybe going to try and make up for that or has the potential to make up for that in January given what an extraordinary run of form they've put together?

19:51Yeah, they're always in a difficult spot really because they're still wrestling with all these financial sanctions but at the same time they want to placate and please Emery however much they can. Of course he's got the keys to the city and they'll give him as much as they can but again they're very limited in what they can do in January. What they will try is they'll try and sign a striker that's one of the priorities and really James it's quite incredible that they are third because Ollie Watkins has got three goals all season and he's really struggling so the fact that they're able to do what they have been without their key striker or key source of goal scoring is incredible but they'll try and please Emery as they can they know they need more in order to really sustain their top four credentials OK, is there any name that you've seen circulating?

20:33Well they're going to sign Brazilian winger Alisson he could add pace and they haven't actually got a right winger so he's someone that could potentially help that Emery's going to look at him in training first and assess whether he can be part of first team plans but ideally according to the recruitment team and scouting team they probably want someone younger as a centre forward they've looked at a few in Brazil in Europe as well someone like like a John Durant almost to come with a view to replace Nolly Watkins whether they can do that with the lack of money they've got is another question but that's certainly the priority.

21:06In the meantime, goal-scoring duties have been picked up nicely by Morgan Rogers, whose season has really mirrored the clubs. An underwhelming start, abuse from the crowd at times, and then an extraordinary run of goal-scoring. He's now up to 10 goal involvements in the Premier League this season, seven goals and three assists. And this weekend, of course, facing his celebration nemesis in Cole Palmer. Yes, and if I was Morgan Rodgers, I'd be pretty annoyed actually because he was the one that first came up with the celebration. I know it fits Cole Palmer's name better, but Morgan Rodgers was the one that done it.

21:45And now Cole Palmer is off trademarking the celebration. So yeah, if I was Rodgers, I wouldn't be too pleased. But you've seen it a lot recently. And like you say, start of the season, Rodgers was so poor. He could not make a pass really. and he knew that, he told people close to him that he needs to improve his final and end product and although it's quite simplistic he also said I just need to shoot more I'm getting into the final third I'm great at ball carrying, driving at defences I just need to, when I get a chance instead of trying to thread the ball through that's not my game my game is power and shooting from distance and essentially he's been doing it every time and what, six strikes from distance in the last ten league matches he's a phenomenon really Has Emery done anything to unlock that potential?

22:24Sean. It's interesting because you mentioned the abuse and criticism he was receiving and he was asked so many times about this and Emery was constantly kept saying it will come the goals will come he's doing what I want from he's doing his tasks in terms of he's standing in the right position in between the lines and passing lanes to get the ball he's pressing well he's doing everything I want I know he's too good a player not to then start working things out himself but also hit in form what he has been doing and what his coaches have been doing is after training they've been taking him aside and really working on different techniques in terms of you see now he's shooting a lot more of his laces i know laces is quite a rudimentary thing but the type of power and when to use his laces if you look at last season a lot of his shots were whipped efforts and he lost his accuracy lost his power now you're seeing him hit the ball top of his laces and the ball's deviating and that's something that he's been working on with the coaches after training and playing with so much confidence as well arsenal will be hosting aston villa next tuesday jacob if villa win that game do you think that the needle might shift a bit in terms of ambitions yeah i imagine so if you they can go away to arsenal and they've got a good record at the emirates from recent times of course they derailed arsenal's title challenge two seasons ago where they won there.

23:45Last year, they came from 2-0 down to draw 2-2. So Emery's got an overall good record against Arsenal since being Villa, actually, when he was at Villarreal as well. And if they can go away two games in London before New Year, away to Chelsea, away to Newcastle, and they can get positive results from that, then I will probably start telling you, James, that Villa are probably in a title race. Wow. I look forward to that if it happens. Not because I don't want Arsenal to win, just because it'll make it ever so exciting. Of course, Arsenal did lose to Villa not long ago in the league at theirs. Magnificent, Jacob.

24:18Have a terrific Christmas and look forward to catching up with you after. Likewise. Thank you very much, guys.

24:28Jacob Tantowoc, the XG question that, Duncan, I'm sure you'll want to bring up with both Morgan Rodgers and Villa themselves, that essentially they are unsustainably overperforming their XG. How long is something unsustainable and how long is it just a trend? If you look at the biggest overperformance in XG in Opta's vast database, and XG obviously goes back to the early 2010s, the biggest one was Chelsea in 2016-17 under Antonio Conte when they had an XG of about 57 and they scored 85 and obviously won the league. So it can happen. You think that Chelsea team, again, had players a bit like Morgan Rodgers who could score from range.

25:14If you look at their goal difference, which is obviously a much more rudimentary metric, but it's plus nine compared to plus 25 for City and plus 21 for Arsenal. These things should count against you as the season progresses. But, you know, teams do go on very... You know, a lot of titles are built on runs that were unsustainable or unusual. I think of Leicester in 2015-16. And it just... Other teams get affected by it. And I think the fact they are away at Arsenal next week is big because that feels really pivotal. And you know the Arsenal crowd will be quite nervous for that game. Just before we get to Arsenal, though, on Rodgers, I think the Premier League has needed someone who just takes shots, who doesn't really think.

25:56He is obviously thinking about his technique and the laces, as Jacob mentioned. But when you look at how the Premier League's evolved or regressed in some ways, there's so fewer shots taken from outside the box in general when you compare it to 10 15 20 years ago and if you're good enough to get on target have a little bit of movement on the ball just go for it and I'm he's another player like Shirky like Voltemada who's just an entertainer at the minute and I just think those sorts of players are making this season what it is yeah he's almost having a season a bit like someone like Philippe Coutinho used to have, which is ironic given he went to Villa and didn't very much do that.

26:41But it kind of closes the circle in a sense, because if you go back to the last time Villa maybe were unusual title contenders at Christmas, it was 97-98 under John Gregory. And he was like a manager who was one of the first managers to fine his players from shooting from outside the box. So he was like a kind of proponent for XG before it ever kind of became a thing, sort of rustic XG. So, yeah, I think it's just good. It's good for the title race. It's good for the Premier League. And it kind of increases the number of must-watch games. A Villa title push, an exciting prospect. Of course, if they were to lose this weekend against Chelsea, that might put a different perspective on things.

27:21There have been some standout clashes between these two clubs over the years, one of which we mentioned in our upcoming Totally Extra Duncan, which we took the liberty of recruiting last week. A bit like Jules Holland's Hogmanay. What? What? No, that's not live. I can't believe it. So that's out at the end of the week, but in it we discuss great Boxing Day games, and favourite one, I think, by popular consent, is the 4-4 between these sides at Stamford Bridge back in 2007. There's also, on the 23rd, the day we're recording, there's an 8-0 victory for Chelsea against Villa at Stamford Bridge. That was back in 2012.

28:05If we're talking Villa history, I said 97, 98 for when they were in the type race. It was actually 98, 99. Was it? Yeah. Right. What an era. Just on that 4-4, I think didn't Sean Maloney score on that? And he's another guy, long shot. I was going to say long shot merchant, but that's a bit harsh. I don't want to call him that. All right. But he was one of my favourite players to watch as well, just because he'd take those shots on. Who are your least favourite players to watch? Oh. Well, if you like long shots, presumably it's Dominic Coward-Lewin because he keeps scoring from close range. I don't mind Coward-Lewin.

28:42Maybe give me some time because obviously there are some that I could say, but I don't want to. You might meet them. Okay, as we run through the rest of the fixtures coming up this weekend, maybe one or two names will pop in. You can just kind of smile wryly. Chelsea's home form, by the way, very much mid-table. they've only won 50 % of their games at Stamford Bridge. There you go. Arsenal, who are Villa's next opponent away, are home to Brighton. You summed this one up nicely. Boyd, by the memory of that 2-0 victory in the League Cup back in October, aware of the fact, Mikel Arteta, that his was a rotated team that day.

29:22But then again, I guess probably Brighton's was too. So very much I'm not left-handed either. No. But with that, what Jacob spoke about in terms of Villa needing a goal scorer and not being, sorry, and being where they are in spite of that rather than because of it. I think Arsenal would probably feel like they're in a similar position. They bought Jokeres. They bought Jokeres, but. 70 million. But he's not been in form at any point in the season. I've seen a lot of pieces about the fact that this is just not going to work. Arsenal and Jokeres. I'm not sure that it's not going to work. It's more been, it hasn't been working.

30:04Right, but it's only half a season. Yeah, yeah. Previously, he'd done well at Coventry, but not at Brighton. Yes. Right, so he'll be up against his former club this weekend, if selected. And Arsenal players this season. So Declan Rice against West Ham, Eberuchi Eze against Palace, and I believe there's another player who's scored against, Mikel Moreno. Mikel Marino against Newcastle. He did a major celebration for 17 games. So three Arsenal players have already scored against their former clubs in the Premier League this season. So maybe it's a good omen for him this weekend. OK, has Trossard done that or not?

30:44He has already scored against Brighton, but it was a couple of seasons ago. OK, all right. Arsenal, Brighton is Saturday at 3 o 'clock and so is Liverpool Wolves. We'll touch on that and the other weekend pictures next.

31:24Every chance they'll add to it with this fixture at home to Wolves. They've actually won 16 of their last 17 Premier League meetings between the sides. Dominic Slobazai is suspended, which is not a bad game to be suspended for. Although they are getting a little bit thin. Liverpool, Isaac is facing, we now hear, several months on the sidelines with that ankle fracture. Mo Salah is away at the Africa Cup of Nations with Egypt. We'll be hearing about what he got up to on Monday very shortly. Cody Gakpo is also injured. But they have got Hugo Iketike with five goals in three matches. Does this one look a little bit cut and dried, Liverpool Wolves?

32:05Well, as the last remaining Wolves might stay up advocate on the planet. You're not only a Wolves might stay up, but you've got them to beat Derby County's points tally. I think you'd have to do that. One would lead to the other. I almost messaged you after their performance at home to Brentford. As I said last week, it felt like that was a game they needed to win. Right. But, you know, they're still only three wins behind Derby's total. And they did play well at Arsenal. Right. In their last away game. So that is probably the template for what they'll try and do at Anfield. They did well against Villa as well.

32:41Yep. The week before. Yeah. So I don't think this is as cut and dried as it might look based on points in the league table. Okay. But I still expect Liverpool to win. Okay. Points in the league table currently reading 2-4 Wolves. We shall see if that changes. Now, Sunday at 2 o 'clock, Sunderland are hosting Leeds in what will be the two teams' first Premier League meeting since Boxing Day 2002. Why was it a momentous day when Sunderland and Leeds met on Boxing Day 2002, Duncan? Someone who used to play in the Premier League called James Milner. Oh, no, wait, he still does. He scored his first goal.

33:21Terry Venable's team needed something special. Step forward midfielder James Milner, 16 years, 356 days old, and has just become the Premiership's youngest ever scorer. Wayne Rooney's record lasted just over two months. I watched the fuzzy old footage, but you can't really see it. He gets buried amongst his teammates straight after the goal. Did he look more or less identical? Almost, yeah, the same. Incredible. What a player. I mean, we've got a piece coming out at some point over Christmas, sort of best stats of the year, and I looked at penalties. There's been over 3 ,000 penalties in the Premier League at all time.

33:59All time? In all games. Yeah. And Milner's been in those games where there's been a penalty nearly 6 % of the time. Oh, stop. That's not possible. If any game in Premier League history where there's a penalty, there's a 6 % chance James Milner's just knocking around. Wow. So he's a phenomenon. That is extraordinary. He turns 40 in the first week of January. Does he? That unlocks a few. There's not many players that have done stuff in their 40s. Ted Shearing obviously did. But, yeah, he's just a bizarrely permanent fixture. Sunderland leads very much not a permanent fixture, as we say this is the first time in over 20 years that it's occurred in the Premier League.

34:39It comes around this time with Sunderland, along with Arsenal, one of two unbeaten teams at home in the league this season. Leeds, though, arriving with no defeats in their last four and Dominic Calvert-Lewin looking to score for the sixth game in a row, presumably from somewhere dead either on or between the penalty spot and the centre of the goal. Yeah, everyone's seen the shot map. Our colleague Tom Harris wrote about it. It's out in The Athletic today. It is like one of those funny, bizarre things that happens in football from time to time. But it does kind of speak to the sort of player Cabot Lewin is.

35:18And I think it's really good to see him bounce back like this. I mean, he's probably, when fit, which has obviously been his major issue over the last few years, there's not many players better in football at sort of holding the ball up and leading the line in that sort of classic number nine role. And I think he was doing that from the get-go at Leeds, but he wasn't scoring straight away. But now he is. A lot of people point to the change that they had on 29th of November when they were 2-0 down at Man City. And it looked like the jig might be up for Daniel Farker. And he makes this big switch to playing two up front.

35:51And Calvert-Lewin certainly says that he's preferred it. The quotes on Sky Sports after the brace against Palace, I enjoy having bodies around me, he said. It can be a lonely role up there on your own. With bodies around you, you can link play. And that's why I've had success recently. But it is a remarkable turnaround. 12 goals in three seasons after that brilliant early career form. Yeah, I remember Arsenal were actually heavily linked with him around the time when they bought Gabriel Jesus. So 2021, 2022, he was one of the main options because he brought something different. He was able to hold the ball up well and be a threat in the box.

36:34But have the touch as well. And yeah, have the touch. And I think when you look at what you just spoke about there in terms of having bodies around him and playing with another striker off him, I've actually been waiting for a Premier League team to do that. I thought Chelsea could this season when they bought De Lapp and Gio Pedro. I was quite excited for just a combination of two strikers for once because it's been so long since we've seen it. so I'm really glad that a manager's been bold enough to kind of go against the trend of just using one striker and wingers and have someone play off each other.

37:16It's heartbreaking that you were born when you were born. You really should have been here for the 90s. Yeah, I should have been. Seeing a big man and then a little man feeding off scraps. I mean, feeding off scraps is very much the vibe of Christmas so I would tune in to watch this game. superb I mean I would if Cavalink continues like this for the rest of the season it's a big if but I mean I would take him to the World Cup you would don't you definitely just on the two striker thing oh yeah that actually helps me win the Champions League on football manager there you go yeah there you go that's Sunderland Leeds that's at 2 o 'clock on Sunday and that's followed at 4.30 that day by Crystal Palace against Tottenham Palace who beat Spurs home and away last season and this Tottenham team will be without both Christian Romero and Xavi Simons after last weekend's red card fest Palace stretch quite thin though by their unusually large number of fixtures of late one of which is coming this evening in fact as we record Tuesday to you listener when they take on Arsenal in the Carabao Cup quarterfinals yeah I wonder how they'll set up for that whether they'll go full changes.

38:31I know in the Conference League last week they gave out a few debuts. So I wonder if some of those players will feature again. We'll find out Sunday afternoon. Other games this weekend are West Ham-Fulham. West Ham without a win in six matches now, though this is possibly the start of a run of fixtures that they might have highlighted on their calendar. They've got Fulham and Brighton at home, Wolves away, Forest at home. So for a team looking to break out of the bottom three, this might be the time to start putting some points together. Burnley against Everton is, for the first time in over 10 years, a fixture that is orphan of Sean Dyche.

39:15and then you've got Brentford against Bournemouth on Saturdays, on Saturday rather, just this one. Is there any reason, is there any easily explainable reason why Bournemouth went on a run where they didn't lose in eight games and have now immediately replaced that with a run where they don't win in eight games? I'm not sure, but when I've thought about them recently and my mind's gone back to last season, they started last season incredibly well. and then kind of just dropped off. Which was the season when they started really, really badly? Was that the one before? Yeah, that was when Irrela came in.

39:52Ten games? They played Burnley and the talk was if they hadn't won that, he would have gone. And then they stuck with him. I think Bournemouth are very much an example of the weird fluctuations in football. I think they win early in the season. They were winning games that maybe they shouldn't have done and now they're losing games or drawing games that they probably should win. But, you know, at least no one took them to be in the title race. Well, as if anyone would. What they'll also be concerned about, perhaps, is losing Antoine Semenyo, who's been doing all their goal scoring, or I think 42 % of involvement with goals.

40:34A lot of suggestions that he might be prey to some big club interest come next month's transfer window. All right, well, in the meantime, that's how things stand as we head towards this weekend's action. Meanwhile, you'll have spotted that since our last show, Africa Cup of Nations got underway in Morocco. Let's finish off today by catching up on the early action there.

41:04You're listening to The Totally Football Show with James Richardson. Now with you four times a week. Keep up to date with us on Insta and enjoy us in glorious Technicolor on YouTube at The Totally Show. Afgorn got underway on Sunday and enjoying the action there in Morocco, Mahir Mazahi, who joins us now. Mahir, how are you? Hi Jimbo, I'm good, how are you? Excellent. Very, very well. Is that your hotel room? Yeah, this is my Airbnb. As always, you know, as freelance journalists, when we go to these tournaments, we like to share accommodations. So not only does it help out with, you know, sources and stories and we keep each other motivated, but it lowers costs, obviously.

41:44So me and two others here. Who are you sharing with? Yeah, so a French-Algerian cameraman named Yusuf, who works with Canal Plus mostly, and another French-Algerian journalist who works for AFP. Okay. Yassine, very good guess. Nice. They appear to fix the television to the wall in your Airbnb backwards. It's not backwards, but there's still plastic on the door, on the television. It's very much, I guess, a North African grandmother kind of thing where they still keep the plastic on the couches and on all the furniture for as long as possible, I guess, until it falls off. All right, okay. The wraps have come off.

42:21The Cup of Nations got underway Sunday night. So far, we have four matches at the time of recording, featuring three of the tournament favourites, Morocco, South Africa, and Egypt, who on Monday night had a dramatic game against Zimbabwe. A very good night for Mo Salah. Yeah, this African Cup of Nations is coming at an opportune time for Salah. Obviously, things were not going so well at Liverpool. He was, as everybody knows, benched for three consecutive matches. He comes out and he says, somebody at the club is trying to throw me under the bus, or at least that's how he feels. And now he gets away from all of that, if I can say toxicity, and he's back with his national team where everybody does cater to him, not necessarily the case under Arnest Zlat at Liverpool.

43:06And everybody needs him to perform well because that's the only way they're going to win this African Cup of Nations. I think he's fully aware that he's 33 years old and this is probably the last AFCON that he's going to be at his physical peak. And he also is fully aware of the fact that he's succeeding a generation of players that won three on the trot. And so to fully complete his legacy at home, he's going to have to win one. And this is his opportunity. Okay, didn't look like it was going to get off to a good start when Zimbabwe, ranked 129th in the world, actually took the lead through Prince Dube.

43:37A very good player, actually. He plays for young Africans in Tanzania. Has been killing lumbering, slow defenders. He did it in the CAF Champions League on the first match day. This time around, if I could say a slightly Bergkamp-like turn when he took the ball and finished past Ahli goalkeeper Mohamed Chennawi. But it didn't start well because, actually it started very well for Egypt. In the first 15 minutes, they could have scored one or two goals easily, and they should have. They were just a bit wasteful in front of goal. But the main criticism of this Egyptian national team now will be the two center halves and the goalkeeper.

44:08The two center halves are not supposed to be their A center halves. The A center halves are Mohamed Abdel Mounim, who's at Nice, but he suffered a knee ligament injury, and he still hasn't fully recovered. He's not selected. And Rami Rabia, who I think is also suffering an injury. So they've tried to come up with replacements from the local league, And one of the players from Zamalek, Hussam Abdel Magid, is the one that got turned by Prince Dube. And so they're going to have to find a solution at the center half position because that's what was unacceptable. And the second problem was the goalkeeper, Mohamed Shunawi, who's 36 years old.

44:36Felt like he had butterfingers since the goal, really. But they have a solution there. And that's his goalkeeper, his backup goalkeeper at the club and with the national team, Ufa Shoubert, son of legendary Egyptian goalkeeper Ahmed Shoubert. So I think there's going to be some changes in the back for Egypt. and if they do that, then they should be fine. OK, well, they got through this game. All right, Omar Mahmouche equalising the lovely goal midway through the second half. And then in the 91st minute with the scoreline still tied, it was Mo Salah.

45:17I like this goal. Some people have described it as scruffy. Yeah, but I think what he did was something that was very Mo Salah-like. First of all, we have to give credit to the coach, Hussam Hassan. He started the match without a striker. He was playing Omar Marmoush as a false nine. And then 30 minutes in, he hooked off his number 10, Imam Ashur, and moved Omar Marmoush back into that number 10 hole, which allowed him to attack the team, Zimbabwe, with his pace. And when you have a real number nine, he brings on Mustafa Mohamed from Nantes in France. That's where Salah, I think, can operate at his best.

45:49And for the goal, you can see that Mustafa Mohamed, the striker, the real number nine, wins a header. It's a flick on. And as he flicks it on, that's the space that Salah likes to attack. When that center half is being dragged out of position and he's holding off the Zimbabwean left back with his arm. And that's what I like about it a lot. It shows his strength and it shows his predatory instincts as a winger. And so I think it was and you can't write a better script. Ninety first minute, AFCON, first match. What a way to start the competition for him. Indeed. Things probably not going to get any easier, though, for Egypt.

46:19After the game against Zimbabwe, they've got South Africa next, another of the favourites, a team that you were bigging up on this show a short time ago, Mahir, and they got underway with a victory as well. Also 2-1, this one against Angola. Yeah, Jimbo, I think I'm going to be a little bit presumptuous here, and I'm going to assume that not many of our listeners on the Totally Football Show are going to be too familiar with many players from South Africa. But they are, and I'm adamant about this. one of the main favorites of this African Cup of Nations. They play the best football on the continent.

46:50And yesterday was a real entertaining match between them and Angola, who also were actually one of the sides that played the best football in the previous African Cup of Nations. So it was very good technical football. The ball was on the pitch for long periods of time. The pitch was nice and sleek as lots of haze and nonstop rain here in Morocco over the last few weeks. And South Africa, they started this match with a goal from probably the best player in the domestic league for the first half of the season, Oswinopoulos. and then they conceded from a set piece and that's maybe one of the main weaknesses for South Africa is that they're not great at defending aerial duels or crosses and so I'm curious to see when they come up against you know a much bigger side like maybe Senegal how they're going to defend you know an aerial duel or a cross and then the winning goal came late on sorry if I'm if you're supposed to be reading off the match facts but it came in the it came in the 80th minute via Lyle Foster at Burnley who was not at the last African Cup of Nations because he was going through some mental health issues and he's back now and he's done a lot of good to the Spafane side.

47:46Excellent. Now the other big favourites, Morocco, the hosts of course, they were involved in the opener, which you were there at Meher, where they took on Comoros and beat them 2-0. I will read out the goal scorers here. Real Madrid's Brahim Diaz, who had a sparkling performance, won an early penalty, then scored. And then the second goal from the marvellous El Carbi, which a lot of people are already flagging up as goal of the tournament.

48:24It's actually, I think, his 10th bicycle kick in his career. 10th. It's ridiculous. I tweeted out a video after that where there is a three minute and 37 second compilation of the bicycle kicks that he scored in his career. And that was missing all of the ones that he had at Olympiacos and several with the Moroccan national team as well. But for Morocco, it was a tame first-half performance, and that's been the general sentiment here in the country. People wanted them to be a little more sharp, particularly when they're trying to break down the low blocks. And this is one of the main narratives about Morocco in this Afghans.

48:58Look, at the World Cup, they were better when they were reactionary. When they gave up possession of the ball, they sat back in that 4-1-4-1, and they were hitting teams on the counterattack or on set pieces. They only lost one match at the World Cup. That was against France in the match where they had more possession of the ball. This time around, teams are going to be sitting back against them. And do they have the ability to take the game to the opposition and break down their low blocks? It's something that Waleed Regragui, I think, has struggled with at times, but they keep winning. It's their 19th consecutive victory.

49:27And so ultimately, at what point are we just being too harsh on them? These are the kind of conversations that are happening in Morocco. Who have they got next, Morocco? Mali. Mali, I think, on the 26th. Okay. Boxing Day, where there's no Premier League, so you should tune into Afgan. Well, just one Premier League game that day, but a bunch of matches in the Cup of Nations, Angola, Zimbabwe, Egypt against South Africa, as mentioned, that's at 3 o 'clock UK time, Zambia, Comoros, and Morocco against Mali. Mali, who had a 1-1 draw with Zambia, which saw Mali leading for the first, well, until the 92nd minute, when Patson Daka popped up for Zambia with the equalizer and then very nearly almost severely injured himself trying to do a backflip.

50:17We can laugh because he's fine, thankfully. But that was the first meme-worthy moment of the African Cup of Nations, a tournament that's very rich with these moments. Yeah, I guess it's a trademark celebration of his where he does a backflip, but he felt like right on his face. But thankfully, he's okay. I was really worried about his neck, but thankfully, he's okay. But Mali deserved to win that match against Zambia. They were the better side. They're, I think, a more balanced side than they have been in the past, where they've been maybe too, is it fair to say too combative? Like, they just have, like, destroyers in midfield, and they're not creative enough.

50:48This time around, I think they have enough attacking quality in players like Lassine Sineyoko, Kamori Dumbia from Brest, and Nene Drogelis. I think they deserve to win this match, but there's one thing that we keep saying about Mali, where we, in Africa, we like to say that teams have collective psychologies, And Mali is like, they always fluff it up at the very end when they should win. And if you hearken back to the last African Cup of Nations, they're beating the host, Cote d 'Ivoire, 1-0. And Cote d 'Ivoire have a man sent off. And somehow, someway with 10 men, Cote d 'Ivoire come back, equalize in the final minute of regulation, and then win the match in the final minute of extra time.

51:24So that is typical of Mali. And then there's that another meme-worthy moment of the manager sort of crouching down on the touchline and somebody's pouring water on the back of his head. I'm not sure if you've seen that. Eric Schell. But these are the kinds of things that happen to Mali. So if we're going to take them seriously, they have to learn how to close out matches. And not fluff it up at the end of games, as you say. Of course, being called Mali, they should stir it up. But yes, what's coming up? Boxing Day, loads of games, as we said. Egypt, South Africa, possibly the highlight. Ivory Coast against Cameroon on Sunday looks like fun.

51:56Where are you heading next, Mahir? Today I have Benin DRC, 1.30 Moroccan time and then I have Tunisia-Uganda at 9pm and tomorrow my country plays Algeria vs Sudan so those are my next trips before Boxing Day for Egypt, South Africa and Agadir Very very nice Enjoy all of that, have a happy Christmas and we will catch up with you afterwards Very happy to be on the Totally Football Show for our third AFCON Thanks for having me on again

52:25Lovely report there from Meher and lovely that there's all that AFCON action on Boxing Day, along with the other treats from other leagues that are not called Premier League. Very good. Duncan, what are you going to do on Boxing Day? I will be working on Boxing Day. Are you going to be here? Yeah. Well, I won't be here, but I will be working. But, you know, it's going to be involving a lot of football. So is that a bad thing? Is it worked? Question mark, question mark. Wow. Wow. All right. Looking forward to reading that piece about the stats of the year. of the year. When's that out? 30th. On the 30th.

53:03Good. Art, look forward to seeing how you get on with Championship Manager on Boxing Day. And also you've got a big piece coming up on Arsenal and education. Yes, so that's with the Premier League as well. So I've got some nice voices to kind of help bring that to life and hopefully it adds a bit more context to what goes on with boys in Premier League academies around the ages of 15 to 18. So GCSE and A-level kind of age groups. Excellent. Okay. We've also got a Totally Extra with you on Saturday, as I mentioned earlier, on talking about Christmas. Woo! So do join us for that. We will then be back with Totally Football Show on Monday morning.

53:48I'll be with you, I guess, sometime Monday afternoon, reviewing all the action on Boxing Day, Saturday and Sunday. For now, though, that's it for today's show. So many, many thanks to Mahir, to Jacob earlier on, to Art, Duncan, Jake and Charlie in the booth. And you, listener, have a very, very super 25th of December and adjacent days. And we'll see you soon.

54:27The Athletic on Apple, Spotify and all the usual places. We're also at The Totally Football Show on Insta and at The Totally Show on YouTube. The Totally Football Show is an Athletic Media Company production.

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