Martinez unleashes on Man United board as Barca make it 10/10

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2:06Julien Laurens: The Athletic FC.

2:13Liam Twomey: Totally Football Show with Tuesday's Champions League action. Today, it's the banger in Stavanger, Viking Bayern 3-3, Atletico against Manchester not very united with Martinez shaking and stirring. Arsenal's little big win, more collapses from the Italians, Sabah climbing the ranks and much more in this Tony Football Show.

2:47Liam Twomey: Hey, thanks for joining us on this special Wednesday edition of the Tony Football Show. There's been Champions League action. We're here to tell you all about it. Art de Roushey joins us. All right. How are you? I'm very well, actually. Yeah, excited. Excited about today's show. Excited to hear about Arsenal-Lille. Yeah, six minutes of it, I assume. Six minutes? Yeah, yeah. A full six minutes. All right. A full six minutes. Liam Toomey's here. Liam, what are you going to be telling us about? Thanks for having me back. Atletico, Manchester United. wow and and the associated drama yeah post-match yeah lissandro martinez woof hey may not be long for old trafford right well we'll see what the fallout will be julia loranz is here hello what a the second sexiest thing i've seen in a barcelona oh thank you very much this week

3:39Julien Laurens: after la means turn after la means would you call it a turn so i think in academies in this country they call it the joke all turn because he was the one of the first one to do it that way with

3:50Liam Twomey: the other foot right so this is the second assist that he provides yeah and he essentially he's running towards the byline yeah and he essentially fakes a rabona yeah it's a bit like that but you

4:05Julien Laurens: stop the ball with your foot that's the joke all turn yeah okay but with a rabona stop yeah with The idea of that.

4:11Liam Twomey: Shapes as if he's going to shoot. Yeah. Sorry, cross it, but instead touches it to his other foot, which completely bamboozles the defender. And then drags the ball,

4:18Julien Laurens: which is the hardest bit of the dribble. The drag of the ball after. He gets a bit lucky because the defender got like a toe on it, but still it's incredible.

4:26Liam Twomey: Incredible. And that was for Anthony Gordon's goal.

4:28Julien Laurens: Yeah, who then was really hard shot to finish it off because there's not much space, but he finishes it really well. It was one of those touches off Jamal's knee, which was slightly fortunate. It helped him keep the ball in play, but the skill level that you need to be in position to get that bit of luck is just outrageous. And not break both of your ankles. Incredible.

4:47Liam Twomey: Yeah. Well, lots for us to discuss. Quick check on the results from Tuesday, the first half of match day two. Man United lost 2-0 at Atletico Madrid. Lissandro Martinez wasn't happy. Arsenal, Ysparce, Lille, 3-0. Barcelona went a goal down at Galatasaray but came back to win 4-1. they have now scored at least three goals in each of their past eight games. Result of the night came in Stavanger, Norway, as Viking in their debut Champions League campaign went 2-0 up against Bayern Munich. Bavarians came roaring back to score three, but after they went down to 10-1 with a bizarre red card from Michael Olisse, Viking got a late equaliser.

5:27Liam Twomey: Elsewhere, another bad night for the Italians. Napoli taking the lead at Villarreal, then collapsing to a 3-1 defeat, while Inter hosted Bruges who'd lost seven games in a row in the Champions League. They didn't lose this one though. 4-3 the final score to the Belgians with a hat-trick for Niccolò Tresoldi who's currently the subject of a tug of love between the German and the Italian national side. Criking. Also Sporting won 2-0 at Lens and Sabah got their first ever Champions League goals and win in a victory over Slavia Prague that we're going to be talking about later on, certainly one of their goals.

6:05Liam Twomey: Also, the last couple of days, we saw Premier League action Monday night. Coventry got their second straight win and bounced out of the bottom three with a 4-1 victory over Newcastle United. Are we beginning in Madrid, Liam Toomey? Feels like the place to start, doesn't it? Off we go. I mean, do we start at the end or do we start with the game? By all means. Okay, so Lissandro Martinez with probably Man United's best attacking display of the evening going in two-footed on sporting director? Technical director, he said. He didn't name Jason Wilcox, despite the efforts of Gabriel Clarke in the interview, but it was pretty clear who he was talking about.

6:49And he was very incisive with his comments, saying that it's not enough just to look at the players and to look at the coach. Michael Carrick is doing his best, he said, which felt like slightly faint praise um i kind of recognized that that tone from the uh liam rosinio graham potter eras at chelsea but his biggest criticism was for the club and he doubled down on it in a cbs interview with peter schmeichel as well saying that the club needs to show more

7:18Liam Twomey: ambition right is it curious i mean we know how the post-game interviews were is it curious that after he gave that one to gabriel clark he was allowed to go and do another tv interview yeah Completely.

7:29Julien Laurens: I find it baffling, really, that either somebody from the club has stopped him. The club decide quite early on anyway who's going to do those flash interviews.

7:40Liam Twomey: Why do you think it was, Sandro Martinez?

7:42Julien Laurens: Maybe it was his turn. Maybe he volunteered to do it. I don't know. It depends. But usually the clubs send a message to UEFA and to the broadcaster saying like, you know, for CBS, you'll be X and Y. for Amazon Prime BX and Y, you know, depending. But yeah, once you've heard this, because there's always a press officer in the room. Right. You would think that they would... Do you think maybe the press officer

8:04Liam Twomey: was called away while Martinez was... I don't know, really. But I would love to know, really. As a comms person, you have to be slightly suspicious when a player volunteers to do a flash-down interview because that is increasingly rare these days. Especially when they're in the last year of their contract, which is what Lissandro Martinez is. Do you think he was right with what he said? I think his comments will play very well with Manchester United fans, given the way this season has started. Just as actually his country Menento Fernandes, when he came out against the Chelsea owners after defeat to PSG last year.

8:40These kind of comments always play well outside the club with supporters. inside the club they tend to hasten a departure because you know whether you've got a point or not doesn't really matter if you're not seen as a good soldier you won't be there for very long

8:58Julien Laurens: it's an Argentine thing right because obviously Enzo Kuti Romero did it as Spurs too on social media which is probably even worse in a way because at least you could say okay Alessandro it was the heat after the game it's not easy to give those interviews although he seemed prepared and knew exactly what he wanted to say. I think he said out loud what we all thought, right? Is that probably they should have invested a bit more, especially defensively. This idea and the strategy of doing, strengthening your attack, one or two transfer windows. Right. And then moving on to midfielders and only doing midfielders in the same transfer window and just nothing else.

9:31Julien Laurens: And then you would think the defenders are next at some point, either in Jan or next summer. It's a bit weird, but I think it was wrong the way he said it and he should probably have not said it.

9:42Liam Twomey: So United should have bought maybe a defensive replacement for whoever it was didn't mark Solanke at the weekend. Yeah, who was that?

9:49Julien Laurens: He's not even looking at the ball. Handled by Dominic Solanke in the penalty area. But you can say those things if you're irreproachable and if really you are the leader and the top and you've been at your best and you've been, which is not his case really. So I can see where he came from, but you know, he should have not said it.

10:05Liam Twomey: Okay. Season hasn't gone well for United. They've only won two games, one against newly promoted Ipswich and the other against Sabah in their opening Champions League fixture. Was this performance, Liam, better, though, apart from two goals they conceded? Had they had a functioning striker up front, would this have been a very different affair? There were certainly moments when it could have gone a different way. Brian and Bumo had a couple of good chances. United did have Atletico worried at times, and Atletico did look quite vulnerable. You know, this is not peak Diego Simeone, take your soul defensively, Atletico Madrid.

10:45They do give you chances.

10:46Liam Twomey: They are on a terrific run of form as well, Atletico. Yeah, they're a confident team. They've started well in La Liga and they started this game incredibly well in the first minute. United showed an intent to press high. It started with an Atletico goal kick. and Carlos Baleba got a touch on a pass upfield out of the Atletico defence and just directed it to an Atletico shirt and United were completely open. Diogo Dallo, as Wayne Rooney highlighted at half-time, did not go with Alex Biner. Atletico get him behind. He was running the other way, I think, when the pass came through. Yeah, and then kind of said to Lenny Uro, right, you get him, and ran diagonally away from him.

11:25So no one was really on Biner. He had time to check back, pick out a pass across the Barrios. and it went in with a little bit of help from Aiden Heaven. It was a shambolic start to the game, maybe slightly unlucky from United's perspective, but also highlighted how fragile their structure was. And they recovered quite well in the circumstances, but it always felt like Atletico had a measure of control on the game, and they were playing the game on their terms, very much on the counterattack, and that's where ultimately the second goal came from.

12:00Liam Twomey: Right. Second goal came with about 10 minutes to go, Ademoyle Lutman. Before that, they'd had a goal in the first half disallowed for the kind of handball which wasn't a sanction when Harry Maguire did it in a recent United game. So you could say Adelaide go, we're a little bit unlucky with that. But overall... Yeah, and the kind of handball which I think wouldn't be given in the Premier League, given the different ways that handball is interpreted by Premier League and UEFA. So they could have been functionally out of sight earlier as much as United had decent moments, the bar from recent performances is on the floor, as Martinez was keen to highlight afterwards.

12:37Right.

12:38Julien Laurens: And the red card of Euro, obviously, just a few minutes before the second goal just changed the dynamic, really. It's a bit clumsy challenge. I think Karik said it's not a red card. I don't know. He must have seen another footage. I think it's a red card every day. Yeah, yeah, it's just clumsy. In terms of contact, you've probably seen more from other tackles, but there's a hand on the shoulder, then he clips his legs.

12:56Liam Twomey: You can't have any complaints. So they have Leeds United coming up on Sunday, which doesn't look easy. Away, yeah. Do you feel that there were enough signs to reassure Man United supporters, like Peter Schmeichel, for example? He took positives. He was trying to steer Lissandro Martinez onto the more positive side. It's only October, the season isn't gone. And Martinez was just like, we say this every year. Right, yeah. It's quite a funny exchange to watch. I mean, I think the more relevant question for Carrick's immediate future is how much encouragement was there for the hierarchy. And I'm sure our Manchester United colleagues at The Athletic will be working right now to establish just how much immediate pressure he's under.

13:46Liam Twomey: Do you think he is under immediate pressure? I think you have to be. Do you think he's in that? Yeah, and it's what, six points from six Premier League games? So we're starting 40 years or something like that? Yeah, it's not good. And I think they probably felt, maybe the dressing room doesn't share that, but they probably felt quite good coming out of the last window with the business that they had done with Tielemans, with Balaba, with Andre Santos coming in. I think they felt like they had three good names to strengthen what was the clearest weakness in the team, but it's pretty clear there are still some fairly obvious holes.

14:19And the way they set up against Atletico kind of highlighted the muddled recruitment as well, because you have Brian Mbumo, who's not a nine, playing as a nine, more of a right winger. On the right wing, you have Bruno Fernandes, who's a 10 and was quite often trying to play as a 10, despite the fact Uri Tillemans was also there. so it was a bit muddled and then you have Marcus Rashford on the left who's more of a forward than a winger and doesn't really defend which is where some of United's defensive problems came from so there's a lot of problems for character to solve and you don't really necessarily see that consistency from game to game in terms of the way he's setting up or what he's trying to do

14:58Julien Laurens: and after Leeds it's Como in the Champions League because we're on back-to-back Champions League so you know Leeds is tricky is probably trickier even in the way they play although it would be an open game but you could lose the next two as well

15:09Liam Twomey: yeah wow that's Man United Arsenal meanwhile Art de Rocher you watched their game against Lille which saw a return to the Emirates of 4 won Olivier Giroud indeed very interesting return I felt coming into it there's been a lot of I guess different opinions about him and his time at Arsenal there's been fans who have been very pro Giroud because he was able to you know give Arsenal help Arsenal win three FA Cups in four years scored over 100 goals for the club but there is another section of the fan base who can't quite forgive him for basically winning Chelsea the Europa League final against Arsenal and then having a little jive at Arsenal afterwards too so it was quite interesting I know I spoke to the guys beforehand on the tv it seemed like it was just applause when he came on but right in the stadium you could hear a mixture of applause and booze so it was a little bit of a weird one but i think most people were glad to see him back especially michael arteta right three nil the victory for arsenal what can you say what was important about it um for me i think when you're looking at arsenal's last two games they're almost a carbon copy of each other um very slow uh first hours of the game uh where the timing just wasn't right in the final third for a lot of that kind of section of the game and then michael atet has readied a triple sub in both games and as those players are waiting to come on they get their first goals of the game so i think the the big thing uh in each game is he didn't decide to change his mind he kept with those triple subs to really double down on on the attack and you saw last night um I think this week really has been uh a week of Mikel Arteta and Bukayo Saka because in the press conference before the game he kind of set this challenge for Saka to score more goals per game he said he wanted two free goals each game from Saka and that he could do it because he's getting into better areas he said he was ill so he couldn't start the game but he still wanted to contribute and I thought um the way the way Saka entered the pitch he looked like a man on a mission really his first touch was crisp and sharp and he got an assist within minutes of coming onto the pitch and then for his goal he was really calm a lot more calm than he had been in previous games against Napoli for instance when he blazed shots over the bar from similar areas so I think for him it was a really important night to kind of answer Mikel Arteta's call in almost the perfect way a goal and an assist within six minutes of coming on and it was a really promising performance from him in particular.

18:02Liam Twomey: As you mentioned Arsenal had taken the lead before that triple sub was made and what a goal that was from Jurian Timber. Very nice he'd been getting into that position all night really um it was just yeah little things so earlier in the night he might cross the ball instead of having the confidence to take such a good touch and then dink it over the keeper in the way that he did but i felt like him being fit and available at the same time as ben white is also a massive massive bonus for michael arteta because so often since he's come to the club there's been times where timber's been fit but white's been injured or white's been fit and timber's been injured it's almost like a revolving door but to have them both available at the same time and for Arteta to be able to pick and choose who he thinks suits the game best is a massive, massive boost because you saw, I think those positions that he was being found in you're not really seeing white in those positions white's more going around the outside so it's a nice kind of it's a different problem to give opposition teams for Arteta

19:09Julien Laurens: I think Timber is very underrated for the talent that he has. I don't think there's many right backs in the world that can score that. The goal, the way he took the first touch and then the dink, I don't think many can do that. It's uncanny how many times Arsenal's underlapping fullbacks are the ones that really make the breakthrough. You know, we've seen it with Calafiore on the other side. Teams know what Arsenal are going to do in terms of those positional rotations and overloading the wide areas. But it must be just really, really difficult to plan for and to stop. Yeah, I think when so many players are making forward runs as well, if you're defending that, there's so much to take account for that you're going to lose someone at some point.

19:50And as you said, Calafiore for the goal against Leeds on the weekend, when he's taking the shot, there's no one around him. But I don't think it's a coincidence just because of how much pressure Arsenal were putting on Leeds at the time and a similar case with Timber against Lille.

20:07Liam Twomey: opt to have Arsenal as Champions League favourites right now when was the last time they actually lost a game and apart from the final on penalties which in some ways technically doesn't count as a defeat

20:19Julien Laurens: 17 unbeaten yeah it would have been actually against PSG as well again in the semi-final second leg the season before the season before yeah I think they've only considered 7 in those 17 games in a row so yeah and without Saliba obviously for another month or two yeah just on on that as well i think esri konza deserves a massive shout out because when when he arrived he was one where i personally i wasn't sure if arsene needed to recruit at center back i would have preferred a right back because as i mentioned it just seemed like timber and white would never fit at the same time but i think the way that konza defends big spaces i think that's probably been what i've been most impressed by because you see how saliba at times he's he goes as far as the opposition penalty area when he's defending and Konza does the same and it doesn't seem to you know take any effect on him he's so calm in the way he does it and he hasn't missed a beat so I think he deserves massive credit for the way he's slotted in seamlessly

21:23Liam Twomey: Arsenal didn't concede a single shot on target against Lille they travel to Nottingham Forest on the weekend and then next week in the Champions League they're up against Bayern Munich oof we'll talk about Bayern Munich Look at what they got up to on Tuesday next.

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23:41This is the Totally Football Show, part of the Athletic FC Podcast Network. The Athletic is the only place you can read articles by Daniel Taylor, Amy Lawrence, Phil Hay, James Pearce,

23:51Liam Twomey: Olly Kaye and the very best football writers around. Scenes in Stavanga as Viking debut taunts in the Champions League after their championship winning season last time around in Norway took a two goal lead against Bayern Munich of course Bayern came back Harry Kane scores two sets up although they didn't get the assist the third for Luis Diaz it was his through ball and Bayern are cruising 3-2 now but oh my word what's this a red card for Michael Olisse what happened in the red card who's going to tell us

24:29Julien Laurens: I mean to be fair Olysses hasn't been hadn't been great in the game and you could tell he was frustrated he was not involved in in the games that you mentioned and then he lost the ball quite cheaply to be fair and then when the defender got the ball and started going for the counter attack Olysses kind of grabbed him with the shurn by the waist so that stopped but the Viking players were quite annoyed this is an annoying foul whatever level you're playing it's really annoying because you're going and he's quite cynical and everything. So there was a bit of like kind of argy-bargy with Olisse and Trippic, who's the viking captain, was saying like, you know, pointing at him.

25:08Julien Laurens: And Olisse had the ball in his hand, had a yellow card already for stopping that counter-attack, which is normal. And then just threw the ball at Trippic's face right in front of the referee as well.

25:19Liam Twomey: Which is really... Trippic was down.

25:20Julien Laurens: No, but it's not nice to get the ball in the face, even if it's not thrown too hard. So really unlike Olisse though, I've never seen him reacting in that kind of way ever before. But now he's going to miss the Arsenal game next week. And it's a really silly red card to get. And then they continue the third goal to drop two points there. It's really an interesting one for next week because going into it from an Arsenal perspective, you're kind of looking at, okay, which players are going to be the most dangerous. And I think Michael Olisse is top of the list for me. I know Harry Kane was amazing and that pass was sublime.

25:52but when you're looking at the elegance of elise and how easy he makes the game look it was also one where i'm going to that game so i was looking forward to actually just watching him play um but it's really um a strange red card and one where arsenal fans have a really good memory and whenever um basically there was a similar kind of red card for gabriel martinelli away against wolves um four years ago where he made two fouls in one action and was sent off and Arsenal fans bring it up quite often because they say they've never seen a red card like that since so now they can I think they can settle down a little bit and say okay maybe Michael Alise having that one against him is working their favour going into next week

26:39Julien Laurens: they've got Leonard Karl who can play on the right hand side who started the game yesterday on the right and Alise Moore has a 10 or them kind of switching a lot but Karl was taken off for half time because he was not good enough. And Kompany made three changes, a half-time too, because they were 2-0 down and it was not really working.

26:55Liam Twomey: So Bayern, who only drew 2-2, it was at Augsburg at the weekend, conceding after eight seconds, this time conceded after 71 seconds. Yeah, on a set piece.

27:05Julien Laurens: And obviously Neuer has been dropped for Jonas Werbeck, who is the big heir to Neuer, really, who I thought should have done better on the first goal to be far. On the plastic pitch, the bounce slows the ball a lot. and yet he's still not there to stop the header and I don't know who's going to play at the weekend but they have a big game at the weekend against Leipzig

27:29Liam Twomey: then it's Arsenal

27:30Julien Laurens: then it's Freiburg and then they've got the Classic against Dortmund two games down after that so it's a massive massive time for Vini and Bayern

27:38Liam Twomey: RB Leipzig who beat PSV 1-0 I forgot to mention that in the results there you go so they RB Leipzig 6-0 winners at the weekend so it's going to be an interesting game. Yeah, it should be good. In the Bundesliga this weekend. What a result, though, for Wiking. The gulf between these two clubs. Bayern's transfer record, lame as you know. Harry Kane, 100 million euros three years ago. Wiking's transfer record, Erik Boteim from Malmo for three million. Of course. There you are. Who could forget? I mean, I was going to say Wiking could be this year's Bodo Glimt and then I realised that Bodo Glimt are in the Champions League again.

28:18So we were saying before we recorded, when was the last time there were two Norwegian teams in the league phase of the Champions League? It's got to be a golden era for Norwegian football.

28:27Julien Laurens: At least the first time.

28:29Liam Twomey: Their team at the World Cup tearing it up. Amazing. Amazing.

28:32Julien Laurens: And they're both top of the table in Norway, both Bodo Glimt and Viking. I think... Same points, same goal difference, same wins, same draws, same defeats, everything the same.

28:40Liam Twomey: They've got two managers as well, Viking. Yeah. That's incredible. That's the pictures. Yeah. maybe that's the key but maybe Italian clubs should get plastic I think they should and two managers too

28:52Julien Laurens: because clearly one is not enough

28:54Liam Twomey: we'll get on to Serie A's contestants a little bit later on but Barcelona also went a goal down away at Galatasaray in Istanbul unlike Bayern though they came roaring back and made it an emphatic victory 4-1 it finished we talked about Laminia Marz a terrific assists. In general, anything else about that performance that you'd like to highlight, George?

29:20Julien Laurens: Yeah, because I think you can get at them and I think Galatasaray did that quite well in that first half. The problem is to do it over the whole 90 minutes is difficult but Galatasaray were close to a second goal and got 2-0 up on a set piece that there was a tiny offside, it was the right call but I think Ilma was just about offside but to do it over 90 minutes is too hard and if you try to play their game a bit then they're going to they're going to destroy you and when you take Gordon off and bring Adeyemi on Adeyemi scores five minutes later and Rafinha is not even there because he's been rested so you're thinking wow Gavi's on the bench too and you just think the attacking power that they have is still unmatched I think

30:00Liam Twomey: They are five points clear at the top of La Liga they haven't kept a clean sheet in 14 games in the Champions League but equally they've scored 84 goals in their last 28 games in that competition which is exactly three goals a game what an incredible average

30:14Julien Laurens: they scored 43 in the 10 games this season

30:17Liam Twomey: yeah and they won all 10 of them they must create more chances than any other team in Europe it's not just it's not just the goals it's the constant danger absolutely and even Luminiumal doesn't score in that game but it just felt like every single pass every single cross was dangerous found a teammate his cross for Firmien was just unbelievable just weighted perfectly there was one in the first half

30:42Julien Laurens: for Dani Olmo that was slightly over here Balamin and then the second half is just the inch perfect and I think it's the variety of the attacks too so you could go that kind of cross on the fermion goal you could do the cutback like he does for Gordon it's through the middle too when Rafinha plays because they just find that space there a Pedro can create something then you've got wingers 1v1 who could then come inside and shoot it's just everything and I think it's really hard to defend against with them I find it really interesting when we get to the latter stages whether it's just a case of them perfecting the craft of what we've seen for the past two seasons obviously they were in that kind of shootout semi-final of inter and then they kind of shot themselves in the foot against atletico madrid last season um do they just keep doubling down on what they feel like is the right way to play or do they adapt a little bit this time around and see if they can be third time lucky if that makes sense because yeah everyone i think there's no doubts that they're probably the most dangerous attacking team in the Champions League.

31:45But to make the difference in, let's say, March, April, May, will they have to adapt a little bit?

31:51Julien Laurens: Flick wanted like that with Bayern, but this is a different team. And it's still Eric Garcia, right back. And yesterday, Leao on the guys' goal, just he's still chasing him like right now. And then it's Cancelo on the left who scored a great goal, but he's just not a defensive left back. So I think once, and they haven't played really anybody great in those 10 games that they've won so far maybe Athletic Club away that was the only tough test that they might have had so I think Art is right I think there will come like better opponents and bigger tests and bigger challenges for Flick to kind of resolve

32:25Liam Twomey: Well they have Real Madrid coming up in the Clasico in a week or two PSG next week PSG next week and the Champions League away in Paris Wow Flick has previously last season on the record saying well this is how we play football we're not going to change it even if it doesn't work out and well I'm grateful to him because it's certainly fun to watch as was Inter's game with Bruges he said segwaying nicely Inter who were taking on a Bruges team who had lost seven straight games in the Champions League Bruges duly went a goal up Inter managed to equalise and then so Bruges were fielding the player who used to be between sticks for Inter Jan Sommer he had a blinder and his replacement Yusuf Martinez decided to come running out for a, to kind of snuff out a Bruges attack, failed to snuff out the Bruges attack, found himself stranded about 40 yards upfield.

33:18Julien Laurens: Yeah, and Forbes and Tresoldi just took advantage of it. Martinez who made big mistakes. They did that again and again.

33:27Liam Twomey: The counterattacks against the Inter. This was the Inter team who used to go through the Champions League not conceding a goal until March.

33:33Julien Laurens: But Martinez made mistakes against Real Madrid in the match de Bois.

33:36Liam Twomey: tried to drag back and Valverde yeah absolutely

33:41Julien Laurens: so it's not the first time and I mean in a way I like that Kivu was quite honest after the game and said it's on me I have time I should have probably more serenity maybe to the team because at 1-1 I think I thought okay Inter are backing and Lautaro scored a great goal and they're going to win this

33:57Liam Twomey: yeah well they really dominated until yeah until they got a hit on the break yeah absolutely at 1-1 they looked like yeah

34:04Julien Laurens: and then Tresoldi who's a Milan fan obviously half Italian as we said his dad was a player for him to play as an zero must have been special and to score a hat-trick too he's got a hat-trick with Germany under 21 in the international break and like you said he can still choose one or the other although I think he leans towards Germany no no no I think he does I think he does he said he's spoken

34:26Liam Twomey: to both Mancini and Klopp and but he's not giving any hints no not yet about where born in Cagliari so you know

34:35Julien Laurens: yeah Yeah, Club Bruges are just really good. And we know this, but just identify talent. And Tolis goes and they sign Virgil from Spain. And he looks great, apart from the yellow card for diving in a second. But, you know, Trezoldi is the next one probably who will go for quite a lot of money because he's 22 and the right age now and such a great profile for better clubs than Bruges, really. And then this is what they do. And they were really good, I thought, last night. Drisoldi came out of the game with a hat trick but the difficult thing for Inter is it's the easiest hat trick you'll ever see in terms of the finishes in terms of the average yardage of where he's shooting from the big problem that Inter had was they just couldn't deal with Carlos Forbes his speed, his direct running they didn't seem to have the athleticism to manage those defensive transitions against a player like him and if they want to get deep in the Champions League they're going to come up against more players like that the deeper they go

35:31Liam Twomey: Very, very true Napoli with a similarly poor performance. They took the lead themselves away at the Ceramica against Villarreal against the yellow submarine side who hadn't won a Champions League game in 12 attempts. And again, the Italians turned up and ate pressure.

35:50Julien Laurens: They wish they played Italian teams all the time.

35:53Liam Twomey: The Italian sides have had six games so far because we've got Coma and Roma playing tonight. So far, they've only won one of them, which was Coma's terrific performance against RB Leipzig. way back on match day one. But yeah, Rachmani with the goal for Napoli. It was terrific. Very well taken goal. A little bit of luck in the bounce of the ball, but the way he finished was terrific. But after that, yikes. They absolutely collapsed.

36:17Julien Laurens: If you're Kevin De Bruyne and you play for a team like this with Max Allegri on the bench, you must go mad. Because they don't play football. Like the game yesterday again, and Villarreal had a good team, but they started poorly. They're 11th in La Liga. They lost their first game in the Champions League as well. It's not like if this version of Napoli had played Arsenal or Barcelona. And against Arsenal in match-to-1, I don't know if you were there. They were not great either. They didn't do anything. It was basically Kevin De Bruyne versus Arsenal.

36:49Liam Twomey: And De Bruyne, that was the night when you could see that he was really frustrated. And yesterday the same, you should see it on his face. He's always trying to drive forward like it's 2016 or 2017. And obviously it's not, but also the fact that he doesn't have the tools around him. There's a point really late in the game where he breaks into the Arsenal box and he squared the ball across the six yard box. It's an easy tap in for a striker who's ready to be there, but no Napoli player is anywhere near him. He turned away in disgust. and it just you just felt like this was a player who is still capable of producing great moments but he needs the teammates to to create them many would feel that he does have the tools alongside him now but uh i guess but there you go disastrous start for napoli yeah two defeats out of two jules sorry we about to add something else or should we no no i was just saying like yeah

37:49Julien Laurens: it's not looking good because he had a shockingly bad campaign last season as well not even finishing top 24

37:56Liam Twomey: Leipzig beat PSV 1-0 what a save by the Leipzig keeper on the Ivan Perisic penalty did you see that?

38:06Julien Laurens: yeah great more and more I think the players go in the middle so if you let your leg dangling is that dangling is that? I don't know

38:14Liam Twomey: if he was dangling I mean he would kind of

38:16Julien Laurens: he was more active than yeah you'll dive right or left and you're ready

38:20Liam Twomey: leave a leg out there leave a leg there exactly

38:22Julien Laurens: just in case anyway

38:23Liam Twomey: and it was Brighton Looney Brian Brian Gruder Brian Gruder there you go we had the late winner for Leipzig Sporting beat Lens 2-0 goes from Luis Suarez and the Italy international Ussa Dumbia who's been doing brilliantly of late and it was 2-0 for the champions of Azerbaijan Sabah against slavia prague the which goal was the one where the slavia it's a second goal i think the clinching doll tell us about it liam well the goalkeeper comes out big time sweeper keeper vibes takes a touch takes another touch which goes really wrong the ball gets taken away from him and then everything from there seems to happen in slow motion the the player who gets the ball from him the sabbath so it's joy lance mikhails maybe what 35 40 yards out but has a clear shot on goal well and and he has time to actually dribble a bit closer he doesn't shoot immediately um and then hits a shot which i wouldn't say was fiercely struck um and there's a defender in the way defender to get across it's david moses running across to intercept and clear so that's fine no worries except he does what an air kick and then falls over on the ball which trickles underneath he's him into the net.

39:44He kind of tries to clear it and dummy it at the same time and the ball kind of deflects under him and trickles in. Yeah, probably the worst goal we'll see in the Champions League this season.

39:54Julien Laurens: Brilliant. No, just on sporting, I forgot earlier, but Liam is here and for all the Chelsea fans who are listening, Jesse Derry, who's on loan from Chelsea to sporting, wasn't played much at all, but came on in this game and started the move for that Dumbia second goal. Oh, nice.

40:10Liam Twomey: Okay. Sabah, with this victory, their first, their maiden victory in the Champions League. Of course, they were only founded nine years ago, which is insane that they're already in the Champions League and now winning matches. Crikey. They are the club managed, you'll recall, by a game show winner, Valdas D 'Ambroskas, who, with his winnings from a...

40:34Julien Laurens: Who wants to be a millionaire.

40:35Liam Twomey: ...variant in Azerbaijan, came to England to study and was basically... Began his coaching studies at London Metropolitan University. And then with his first senior coaching position at Kingsbury London Tigers, where he was, I believe, for a couple of years in the ninth tier of English football.

40:53Julien Laurens: He also coached like academy levels, was his assistant coach, I think, including at Stoke and United, clubs like that. Right. So he had a good time, I think, in England learning his trade.

41:04Liam Twomey: And he's having a pretty good time in Baku. Yeah.

41:06Julien Laurens: And you know what? I think they got battled by United, obviously, in match of one, but they played really well up to the first goal. should have taken the lead at Old Trafford. They had a massive chance and they played really well yesterday again.

41:17Liam Twomey: Yeah, magnificent. Who's they got next? Dortmund at home. Big game. In Baku? In Baku. Ooh. So yeah, massive one for them. Early kickoff as well. So hopefully people can catch that early on. Excellent. Very good. All right. Also this week and certainly since our last show was some Premier League action. Monday night's Coventry-Newcastle-United game. Let's talk about that to finish off next.

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45:20You're listening to The Totally Football Show with James Richardson. Now we do four times a week. Keep up to date with us on Insta and enjoy seeing glorious Technicolor on YouTube at The Totally Show.

45:32Liam Twomey: Monday night in the Premier League, Coventry 4, Newcastle 1. Liam, that's back-to-back wins for Super Frankie Lampard. Try and be negative about that. Well, I guess they still qualify as back-to-back wins if they're separated by three weeks. But the momentum did clearly carry through. Certainly the positivity. and they took the game to Newcastle and they exploited I think some horrendous defending from Newcastle but there were some really good finishes in there as well and also a fantastic clearance from Bobby Thomas, critical one when I think Coventry were 2-0 up at the time. The game was still close anyway and he basically made a goal line clearance.

46:20Very John Terry-esque.

46:21Liam Twomey: So J.B. Carrigan compares him to J.T., Captain Leader Legend. Was that fair? I mean, in all aspects of his game, maybe not, because I think people forget just how good all-round John Terry was. But I did see the comparison in that kind of last-ditch hustle, the composure that you keep in that situation to just get round behind your goalkeeper, not slide in out of control, just block the space and make sure you block the shot. We should also talk about the 19-year-old Frenchman. The sheriff is in town.

46:53Julien Laurens: The sheriff is in town. Because people mocked him. You English people mocked him when he arrived. When did we mock him? You've seen that video. I know you have. Which was the video? We mock a lot of people here, George.

47:01Liam Twomey: I know, I know.

47:02Julien Laurens: Which you're mean sometimes. But he did this video that a lot of new signings do when they come to a club for social media where he said, like, you know, I don't know, what's your favorite color? What's your favorite this? What's your favorite that? And at the end, the guy interviewing him said, okay, I think the question is, can you describe yourself in three words as a player I think it was that and he goes I love pizzas right that's three words yeah but not really describing himself as a footballer so everybody laughs and I'm like come on he's a good youngster

47:31Liam Twomey: we have never mocked anyone for loving pizza you have

47:33Julien Laurens: all you English people have so I was glad first he started and then two he did so because he's a really good talent he's very young but his breakthrough season with Angers was very very interesting in where he can bring and where he can what he can do.

47:47Liam Twomey: Okay. What did he do in this game? He scored. Yes. Won an early penalty. Then he doubled Comps' lead in the second half. Yeah. And I think he took his goal really well too

47:57Julien Laurens: because he's still young. He's still very raw. Right. He got a good slice of this victory, I think. No!

48:05Liam Twomey: That's the pizza thing. He'll run and run. You see? Excellent. You're even still

48:10Julien Laurens: mocking him now.

48:11Liam Twomey: I think that's a loving homage. Affectionate. I'll tell him when I'm texting. He was born in Guinea, but called up by France to the under-21s back in March, Charles. Yeah, although Gérard Batik, just to finish on the sheriff, called him before when he was not eligible to play for France, which is only in France you see things like that. Why was he not eligible before and he is now? What changed?

48:37Julien Laurens: He just had, his passport was just not ready at the time.

48:41Liam Twomey: Right.

48:42Julien Laurens: But you would think that national team head coaches would know this. You know, that's someone who said to him, don't look a fool, don't call him up because he cannot play for you. And yet he was called up.

48:51Liam Twomey: Okay.

48:52Julien Laurens: And he called up another guy who had already played for another national team anyway as well. So it was a disaster.

48:59Liam Twomey: Coventry move out of the bottom three, which is now composed of Bournemouth, Spurs and Fulham. None of whom who won a game.

49:06Julien Laurens: He's going to go first of those three managers. If Carrick stays a bit longer.

49:11Liam Twomey: Well, you think Carrick might be the head of the sack race? I think Carrick is under massive pressure. Coventry have the same number of points as Manchester United now. I thought it was interesting last week, Carrick was asked about basically time and managers not being given time. The first person he mentioned was Mikel Arteta. It was the same with Ruben Amarum. There was always this comparison to Arsenal. Look at Arsenal as the example. But I think people, when they say that, They don't realize the circumstances and the clubs are just completely different in the way they behave and what, I guess, leeway they're willing to give.

49:50But also what the managers are actually showing in terms of encouragement, what Liam spoke about earlier.

49:56Liam Twomey: On average, how many managers a season have Man United had in recent campaigns? Three? I mean, yeah, as you say, they do have a different way of going about things.

50:06Julien Laurens: And he said in that interview as well, he talked about always changing, always changing. Just look at the top instead of just changing your manager. They are on an extremely damaging run of appointing managers or giving them new contracts in the summer only to sack them in the autumn winter of the following season and then be plunged into a whole new transition. I mean, Antonio Conte is ready to come though. Well, as we read in James Wonkast's lovely interview. And ready to be a company man, I'm sure. Yeah, I'm sure. I mean, I would literally, I would love Comte at United. It would be box office.

50:43Julien Laurens: Just on the other teams you mentioned, Bournemouth, Spurs and Fulham, I would like to see Marco Rosa given a bit more time. Yeah. Well, they are the perfect example of a club

50:55Liam Twomey: who's stuck by their manager and were rewarded. And they've obviously been very unlucky in their first, you know, first three league games they were in winning positions until very late and just couldn't hold on so yeah i think they're the one of the three clubs that i'd maybe say would give that so we all agree with arbeloa then

51:15Julien Laurens: right because the zerbi is going to stay even if they lose this weekend so i think the heat is massively on arbeloa but that would also be pretty mad after the fulham castilla pivot in the summer that seemed to be happening with the squad as well that's right to all the recruitment but then it It looked like a gamble from the beginning, right? It looked like, are you sure he's ready?

51:36Liam Twomey: Perhaps you don't know, Abelhoa, Jules. Perhaps you don't know that he played for Real Madrid. Maybe you don't know that he managed Real Madrid. So, yeah. Okay. Away with you. Well, there you go. That's how things stand on this Wednesday morning. Of course, a fresh round of Champions League matches coming up this evening. Some bangers in their not least Man City against Paris Saint-Germain. And we will be back here on Thursday to have a look back on whatever happens the evening before and what's coming up on the weekend. And for now, many, many thanks to Julianne for being here, to Liam and Art, to producers Jake and Jesse, and to you for joining us.

52:18Liam Twomey: We'll catch up with you soon for now. From all of us here, it's goodbye.

52:24You've been listening to The Totally Football Show, part of the Athletic FC podcast network. For more great podcasts just like this one, including The Athletic FC and our dedicated club podcasts, search for The Athletic on Apple, Spotify and all the usual places. We're also at The Totally Football Show on Insta and at The Totally Show on YouTube. The Totally Football Show is an Athletic Media Company production.

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