Paying tribute to Diogo Jota

0:00The shot is starting to score for LFC. It's out of Portugal, LFC, Ponggiro. Oh, the game is Diego. The shot to Tristin, turning this. A remarkable goal from a remarkable young player, Diego Chossa. When I come here to work, I'm trying to be very professional, do the stuff I have to do on the pitch, on the gym. The flag stays down. It's Schota! It's the hat-trick! Finishing-wise, he's as good, if not better, than Torres, even Suarez, even Saleh. He's absolutely out of this world. Diaz, sweet touch, Schota! I just live 100 % whatever I am. I just want to live my life and try to be happy.

0:54James Horncastle: And Diogo Schota for Liverpool. It's absolutely brilliant. As long as you try your best, you are in the right path.

1:06Diogo Jota, his Parthenars have now suddenly parted. It is the Totally Football Show. It's Friday the 4th of July, the day after everybody got the terrible news that Diogo and his brother Andre Silva had died in a car accident in Spain. It's a struggle to take in that this hugely popular figure and brilliant footballer has left us so suddenly and so soon. And our thoughts are with the two men's family, friends and teammates as they come to terms with this enormous loss. Joining us on the show today, we have James Horncastle, Colin Miller and Duncan Alexander. And we're also joined by two colleagues who knew Diogo at Liverpool and his time at Wolves, Kiva O 'Neill and Tim Spears.

1:50Kiva and Tim, thanks so much for coming on today. Kiva, the feeling in Liverpool seems to be very much that they've lost one of their own. What can you tell us about the mood there? Just devastated everybody. You know, when the news came through yesterday, I think it just stunned everybody connected with Liverpool Football Club. You know, it's just not the news you expect to hear. So, so tragic. You think straight away of the family and, you know, what they're dealing through and the emotions they're going through. right now it's just unimaginable pain and you know when you've when you I think you know we're journalists but when you support a football club and you love football players you just feel connected to them like you know them even if you haven't met them I think that was the feeling and the outpouring of grief yesterday in Liverpool and around the world because people thought and did know Diogo Jota you know that was the feeling and yeah my mum and sisters went over yesterday to lay some flowers and I think, you know, the mood there, they said, was sombre and quiet and a lot of people crying and, you know, just I've got goosebumps now even talking about it.

3:02Just it feels surreal that we're having to talk about this. It doesn't feel right. Yeah, and fans, I think, of any club seem to feel that connection with Tiogo. Tim, you knew him at Wolves from his time there what what can you tell us i had messages from from almost sort of wall supporting friends and colleagues yesterday and obviously everybody's absolutely stunned but yeah a couple people said they sort of felt like they'd lost a friend even though they never met him which i think i think just says so much about diogo i mean he was he was hugely popular at wolves and important to add a bit of context really and that you know people already talk about the team that jota played in at Wolves in sort of nostalgic terms.

3:43You know, he was a key part and pretty much the driving force of the most special, incredible period in Wolves' modern history, basically. You know, people couldn't believe that he played for Wolves. They managed to lure him from the Champions League, Atletico Madrid, you know, via George Mendes, to the Championship. And him and Neves in that team, it was like playing with a couple of ringers, basically. he was always clearly destined for something you know bigger and greater but you never you never got the impression that he kind of thought that the way that he played you know a lot of players come through walls particularly in the last few years knowing that it's a sort of a stepping stone you know that's happened time and again but jota never played like that he he was he was tenacious he worked incredibly hard and he sort of he really earned that's why he got to the very top because of that attitude but he really earned getting to the top and that's why nobody you know sort of begrudged him his his sort of exit when when he left but yeah he's undoubtedly and i saw this written yesterday giving wall supporters some of the greatest moments of their entire lives to be honest and the decisive goalie in man united in the fa cup quarterfinals 2019 is sort of still seen as sort of a high watermark of like 50 years of fallsish history basically and it was jota who who delivered that and the fact that he was the fact that he sort of embraced wolves and wolverhampton just sort of really adds to this sort of you know folk hero status that he already had um it's not like he was booed when he came back to molyneux because he left you know people still liked him and loved him so it's i mean yeah it's it's it's pretty hard to put into words how this city is feeling right now.

5:34Keefe, a similar impact that he had at Liverpool. His last goal for the club, the winner at Anfield in the Merseyside Derby with Portugal, the last time we saw him on a football field, he was lifting the trophy, the Nations League trophy with Portugal. Beyond that, though, him as a man, those words that we heard from him at the start came from a piece that you did, a kind of in-depth interview that you did for the My Game, My Words series. What can you tell us about how he was? You know, when you meet footballers or you're preparing to interview them, I do get quite nervous sometimes. It depends, like, I guess who it is, if you've met them before, you know, how long the interview is going to be.

6:12Heading over to Kirby to Liverpool's training ground, I had that, you know, that excited feeling like I'm going to interview Diogo Joss. I'd been trying to set it up for ages and I was a bit nervous. And as soon as I got in the room with him and shook his hand, I was just like, this is going to be great. Like, I just knew straight away, you know, he's going to be just great here. really like calm and and just straight away I knew you know I don't need to be nervous about this because we're just going to have a lovely chat about football and you know got my laptop out started showing him all these clips of his goals and he was immediately just like smiling like a little kid and you know just looking through his goals like it was the first time he was seeing them and just getting that moment to sort of talk through them with him was so so special and you know really come across in that in that time how much of a family man he was you know I I come away from it and I didn't necessarily write about that I was writing about his football but I come away thinking god this man really loves his family because um his second born he was waiting to get a passport to you know um I think the baby had been born like a month before and he He was going to Portugal for international duty at the end of the 2022-23 season.

7:26He was, you know, I might have to leave this interview. And I was like, absolutely, do what you've got to do. And then he did relax into the interview as well. And I just, yeah, I think, you know, when you spend time with someone, even just an hour or half an hour, 20 minutes, you can get to know them. And that's what I came away thinking. You know, this is a really well-liked person at the club. You could tell the way he interacted with people that people really loved him. And the fans adored him as well. For that side of him, you know, off the pitch, you could... So many videos were being shared yesterday that he'd sent people, you know, personal messages and that kind of thing.

8:03You know, he just, I think, epitomised what it is to be a Liverpool player. And his last goal, just sad to say that it's his last goal for Liverpool. It still feels surreal to say that. But, you know, epitomised him as a player as well. to weave through the Everton defence and score an important goal that needed to be scored. He was a player that Tim will now start him or bring him off the bench. There was always this feeling Diogo Jota will make something happen and I'm desperately sad that we'll never get to see him play football again. Well, as you say, the pain that his family and friends and teammates, some of whom were due to actually be taking the field at the Club World Cup over the next couple of days is Portugal international teammates.

8:50What they must be going through is difficult or if not impossible to imagine. You both contributed to a lovely piece on The Athletic sharing your reflections and memories of Diogo Jota. Thank you so much for that. There's also a special tribute podcast recorded by The Athletic's Liverpool team. So there's more about his memories and the remarkable moments that he leaves us with there. Thank you so much for being with us today, Kiva and Tim.

9:20Tim Spears and Kiva O 'Neill. Just the timeline. I mean, beyond everything else, the timeline. Incredibly successful summer on the field. Then he gets married to the mother of his three children. And then this. And how it's going to be for so many of the tributes coming in from Clark, Slott, Andy Robertson who was at his wedding, Cristiano from the Portugal team. It's going to be just so difficult for everybody. We're obviously recording 24 hours after the news broke and it's strange how you react to these sorts of events because it's just impossible to digest in any kind of meaningful way. And obviously you're initially shocked, but obviously you start thinking of the family and sort of personal elements to it and who's been left behind and who's going to be sort of dealing with the immediate after effects of all this, which is obviously terrible in itself.

10:15But you speak about a sports person at the peak of their career professionally. And I think a lot of us view sports people particularly as almost because they're in such amazing shape and fitness and health and everything else that they're almost seen as invincible. and it's just a sobering reminder that obviously these terrible events, as rare as they are, do sporadically happen. And it's just such a loss. And it's the fact as well that a lot of people sort of come out and be like, you know, this sort of puts football into perspective. But I think what this does from a sporting point of view is just sort of reminds us how powerful sport actually is and driving these personal connections in the sense that none of us would have known Diogo Jota on a personal level, but how many hours have we spent watching him play football and how many interviews have we seen of him and everything else?

11:10And it's just such an immense loss and immense sadness that it's so difficult to put into words and to try to encapsulate everything right now. And there's just a lot of hurt right now. I mean, Colin's absolutely right, but I also think that Jota was like a really ordinary guy as well. I think that was his appeal to a lot of fans of other clubs as well. He would play, everyone sort of knew he was very good at playing FIFA and gaming and stuff, but he would just join games with random people and talk to them. He was almost like a fan that just happened to be very, very good at football rather than sort of your standard sort of football.

11:43I think that kind of just makes it feel more personal and more tragic. Well, as I say, he leaves us with so many remarkable moments and memories, and there's a lot of those being shared at the moment. Tim Spears and Kiva O 'Neill contributing to that piece with James Pearce about his time in English football and the man he was, and that special tribute podcast as well from the Athletics Liverpool team. Also, Jack Lang is out in Portugal to tell the story a little bit, the backstory a little bit more of Diogo and his brother, Andre Silva. So look out for that. Meanwhile, the football continues.

12:23The Women's Euros got underway on Wednesday. say the Club World Cup starts the quarterfinals on Friday and also on Sunday, Sunday night. There's the final of the Gold Cup in the United States with the US men's national team taking on Mexico. Very, very shortly, we'll take a look at those topics.

12:47All right, Friday the 4th of July and lots of football on the way. James Horncastle, you just got back from somewhere near Miami yes yeah yeah I was I was between Miami Beach and

13:04James Horncastle: Fort Lauderdale nice a place called Hallandale Beach all of these places sound like Mario Kart tracks to me and to be honest when you are in the South Florida area you do feel like you're in Mario Kart as well you need a car there's no public transport nothing and yeah that was one of the interesting things about covering this tournament or covering a tournament in the states for the first time um because you know me my day job is covering italy listening to these american owners who've invested in italian football clubs about you know how america sports media entertainment capital of the world we build them they come incredible stadiums this is what we're going to bring to italy and then you go and you can't get to these stadiums unless your uber if you want to leave the stadium and there's not a media shuttle so you're a fan you know you have to get a golf buggy to a gas station and they say that'll be 15 dollars and now you can get your uber um which you know in in i respect and admire their ability to monetize absolutely everything uh in in the united states and that will make america great again or not On a scale of worst idea ever implemented to full Janny, where would you put the tournament as a whole?

14:29What's your take on the Club World Cup?

14:31James Horncastle: So I think my take is, look, there are problems with it and we've reported on them, be it sort of ticket prices initially being expensive and then being slashed, crowds differing. And in my experience of being, for the most part, in and around the Miami area, I was quite fortunate because all of the games I went to were close to sellouts. The least attended game I went to was the game which everyone outside of the tournament said showed the tournament was kicking off because it was Bocca Benfica. That was the least attended game I went to, 55 ,000. but I think when you're actually out there and you're you're covering the club world cup you're engaged in it in a way that people back home and in Europe are not what about the other people in the states were they aware that it was going on were you very much in a kind of club world cup bubble okay so there are a couple of things to say about that Miami so sprawling that you feel very disconnected so even if you weren't on Miami Beach when there were those Bokka fans there you wouldn't be aware that a big tournament was going on um if you walked into a sports bar uh and got a a nice cold beer all of the sport on tv would be baseball because it's baseball season and you have to ask can you put into miami al-aqli on what um what channels that on disown what's that kind of kind of stuff um but you know once you got to the stadium and again in the stadium is in Miami Gardens and it's it you have this Ryanair experience I suppose in the US which is a game is played in Miami but it's not in Miami you know it's it's like flying to Milan and landing in Bergamo but once you're at the stadium the atmospheres that I experienced were actually really really good and it wasn't plastic it wasn't tourists it was genuine into miami fans or messy fans all wearing pink messy number 10 shirts and then really passionate al acli fans and you'd walk down this kind of spiral conf course at the hard rock stadium and you know they were singing songs at each other um and it was loud so i i enjoyed it and if if you were to pitch this concept to an eight-year-old horncastle you would be all for it oh yeah because I don't know I'm curious I learned a lot about geography and the world from my passion of football you know like ah Boca that's in Buenos Aires where's Buenos Aires that's in Argentina what's the flag of Argentina blue white okay that sort of thing this is back when you read this was back so so like it the concept sort of works for me right um the branding around the concept doesn't because it sells it as something it's not which is the 32 best teams in the world they are not the 32 best teams in the world um but um you know a lot of the football i enjoyed like even that opening game which was a nil nil it was a quote-unquote good nil nil um so um i think my experience would have been different had i been in charlotte um where you you have what an 80 ,000 Cedar Stadium and they really struggled to fill that regularly and you know even the stadium Atlanta you know a lot of people went to that stadium and it was bucket list not because the event you were going to or watching it was just like wow this stadium's unbelievable.

18:10James Horncastle: So I come away from it thinking I had two and a half weeks it's nice to be back and yet at the same time I can't let it go I have to keep watching this tournament and I was up until four o 'clock in the morning watching Al-Hilal, Mad City. What a game. So, yeah, jet lag helped. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, for a first tournament, and I think you're on the money, especially with the branding, and you can factor into that the way that they've decided to do things like the teams coming out as individual players, which just feels ridiculously bombastic and completely kills the momentum going into the game.

18:50But as a first tournament, and with the provisors that big clubs like Barcelona, like Liverpool, aren't there, it has been absolutely fascinating, I think, for most neutrals, those who can kind of get over the principles, objections, to one or two of the kind of key players behind the scenes. It has been an absolutely fascinating tournament to follow so far. The quarterfinals get underway this evening, Friday, as we record. That's Al-Hilal against Fluminense. Then later Friday night in the States, 2am in the UK, Chelsea take on Palmeiras. On Saturday, 5 o 'clock, we get the other side of the draw, kicking off with PSG against Bayern, the winner of which will take on the winner of the Real Madrid-Borussia Dortmund game, which is late on Saturday.

19:33Real Madrid and Dortmund, who both booked their spots in that fixture, after our last Totally Football show. Real Madrid with a 1-0 win over Juventus. another goal for their young academy graduate Gonzalo Garcia, that's his third of this tournament, and a first assist for Trent Alexander-Arnold as well. Dortmund meanwhile, after a somewhat nervy second half, triumphing 2-1 over the Mexican side Monterey. By the way, Joe Bellingham picking up a yellow card in that game which means he will be suspended for what would have been the big Bellingham clash. Duncan, that bracket with with Real Madrid, Dortmund, Paris Saint-Germain and Bayern on one hand, one of whom will make it to the final, and on the other side of the draw, Fluminense, Al-Hilal, Palmyra and Chelsea.

20:22A lot of people have been commenting on the fact that it's hugely imbalanced. The fact that those teams have knocked out European sides to be there, though, does that mean that it's not quite the easy route to the final for Chelsea that a lot of people are calling it? Yeah, I think so. It's good, isn't it? I mean, we'll see what Chelsea do, but if they don't play well, then we're guaranteed a non-European team in the final, which I think is probably the best outcome. We didn't want a Champions League light taking place in the heat. Don't wish Chelsea ill fortune in the game, but it would be interesting to see one of the other three make it to the final.

20:58Chelsea without the suspended Moses Kosaida for that game against Palmeiras, but they do have Nicolas Jackson back, but they also have Jean-Pedro available to play as well. decisions for Enzo Maresco. His opposite number, the highly rated, not least by Jack Lang, Abel Ferreira. His Palmeiras side are going to be without Captain Gustavo Gomez and their left back is Joaquin Piqueires. Ferreira, who's lent into July the 4th and said, let's join together as Brazilians and Americans against the English on Independence Day. Respect that. Fair enough. Also, of course, a big game for Esteval Willian. yeah so uh this batch palmeiras against chelsea chelsea have a new signing on their team and a new signing on the other team um obviously joao pedro has been signed from brighton uh is um available for this game whether he starts or not is another matter uh esteval willian um for palmeiras um who chelsea i this is going this is going back quite a while ago that they agreed a deal for him and i think esteval was actually the one signing who was like this this guy is actually potentially a superstar signing rather than just signing a young player for the sake of him being quite young and talented.

22:11This guy really had an extra edge to his game. Pelmeyres are really interesting in the fact that the players that they've been producing in the past couple of years have been selling on to European clubs for a lot of money. Esteval is one of them, Endric, Real Madrid, Vito Reis, signed for Manchester City in January. Luis Guilherme went to West Ham, Danilo did Nottingham Forest and so on. And so they've really seemed to have perfected their kind of use system to generate a lot of money. And talking about Brazilian clubs at this tournament, and they've probably been, I would say, the most impressive in terms of overachievement compared to what we might have assumed.

22:48But some of these clubs actually have quite a bit of money about them. And you can see from the recent Copa Libertadores results that Brazilian clubs have dominated, that these clubs are at a different level to their South American counterparts, including in Argentina. So I think, yeah, I mean, this half of the draw is probably is a little bit tougher than what would be assumed. And I think it's just much more interesting, isn't it? These games are just much more interesting because they never happen.

23:12James Horncastle: I like their ability to trash talk as well. I mean, you mentioned Abel Ferreira sort of leaning into an independence day. But I was at Inter Miami Palmeiras where they were 2-0 down. And the first goal, the Palmeiras defender, Murillo, he basically seemed to pull up with a muscle injury. and before that game he'd made a big point of being team ronaldo as he was facing messi um so you know i i like that they brought this um to the tournament and uh also abel ferreira like you know you mentioned their copa libertadores record i mean you know he's been out there for a long time now uh has really i think proven himself to be a good coach really engaging in press conference as well.

23:58James Horncastle: He's got great charisma. And, you know, when the Portuguese teams, well, particularly Porto, were struggling, you kind of thought, well, why isn't this guy going back? And I think there's probably something to be said that he can earn more money at Palmeiras. Brazilian economy is better than your Portuguese economy. But, you know, you look at him and think, you know, why wouldn't he be like the next Fulham coach or something? Maybe he will. Not now he's trashed the English. But also, maybe, with more due respect to Fulham, maybe he's happier with Palmeiras, you know? Yes. It can't be a bad life.

24:34We should see. We should see. Whoever gets through the Chelsea... He finds out about that swimming pool in Fulham's new stand. Fair. That'll get him over. The winner of that game will be up against the winners of Fluminense against Al-Helau. James, you no doubt saw Fluminense's emphatic 2-0 victory over Inter. never in doubt and equally Al-Hilal's constantly very much in doubt 4-3 win over Man City. What's your take on who could be going through from that and the incredible job that Simone Inzaghi's done, declared a boob after the Champions League final, what, a month ago?

25:13James Horncastle: And now... Yeah, Inter have completely imploded. And they haven't really because they got to the round of 16 in quite a tricky group, Wood River. But I mean, like, you know, Inzaghi, I think, did an incredible job. With Inter, you know, a lot of people, you use the word boob after that final defeat. But I mean, if you look at what was the prevailing narrative about Inter going into both their Champions League finals, it was kind of like, well, they're a bit old, aren't they? They haven't got any superstars. And so if you take that all together, then you think, well, the manager must have done a phenomenal job.

25:51James Horncastle: and again with Simone Inzaghi what I did their first game which was Real Madrid against themselves, Al-Hilal and they could have been one or two goals up in the first half they really kind of knew what the weaknesses in Real Madrid's team were which was that right hand side of Rodrigo and Trent Alexander-Arnold and what I like about them and you know you have to caveat this They are a piff club, which has had lots and lots of money spent on them. We've seen clubs in the Premier League spend a lot of money and build crap teams, Man United being one of them. You look at that Al-Hilal team, and it's been actually really well put together.

26:36James Horncastle: You know, in terms of their fullback, centre-back, goalkeeper, midfield, strikers, you know, they've – whoever's built that team has done a good job, regardless of where the money's come from. so you know i after that real madrid performance i kind of said they can go far um i did fall asleep during the second half of man city al hilal and then woke up like startled and surprised that they had gone through um but um yeah i i think it's it's interesting pippo inzaghi simone's brother was talking yesterday um now pippo has gone to work for the city football group uh as their Palermo coach. He was like, oh yeah, Simone just wanted a new challenge, he'll be back in two years.

27:22James Horncastle: But, you know, I mean if he makes a... If he takes this team to a final, you know, chapeau. But he'll have to get past the Fluminense side, which has the inspirational leader, that is Thiago Silva. There's been a few things that have come out about Thiago Silva over the last few days where he did this incredible... I say incredible, It's just like what you'd expect from a captain in a team talk before a big game. He sort of really kind of leaned into, you know. Did you do a Michael Sheen? He didn't do a Michael Sheen in Nye, which is, you know, you're recommending every West End theatre goer to buy a ticket to Michael Sheen's latest performance of a great Welsh figure.

28:10James Horncastle: but he no he talked about the 2014 world cup and how before a big game his stepfather had visited him and his stepfather was ill and basically made him appreciate that you need to take every moment as it comes and make the most of it which again is quite topical in the time we're speaking and then there was another video of him on the sideline during the intergame telling his coach how to coach the team saying basically like mate we need to go 5-4-1 what you what you're on about no mate no and then you see him basically talking to his players saying right you go to the wing back i'll do this blah blah blah and you just see him as being leader organizer legend um and he just trolled inter really well as well after the game against against them because you know He's an ex-AC Milan player and said, oh, yeah, a few people have called me.

29:05James Horncastle: Oh, who called you, Thiago? Oh, you know, Max Allegri. He basically asked me how can I beat Inter next season, so I told him. And that sort of thing. So just great Thiago Silva banter. Excellent. I don't know if we saw the Fluminense's social media activity. Oh, a lot of ketchup on the pizza. A lot of ketchup on the pizza, which obviously naturally infuriated a lot of Italians. What did they mean by that? Is it like blood on the pizza or is it we're just going to mess up your national dish? It's like put pineapple on pizza. Right. Ketchup. I think it's a case of just trying to wind up a lot of fans too.

29:46And they posted the goal highlights against Inter with a Milan soundtrack in the background.

29:52James Horncastle: They also said, how's the weather in Rio, Botafogo and Flamengo? Damn. As well. I think this is bad karma. I think this catches up with you. Yeah, definitely. They have so far kept four clean sheets in their five matches, with Thiago Silva marshalling their back line. But they come up against the expectation-defying Al-Helal, and that's Friday night. The other side of the draw, absolutely colossal. Two recent Champions League final rematches, Real Madrid against Dortmund. That was the 2024 final at Wembley. 2-0 win for Real Madrid back then. Real Madrid so far playing without Kylian Mbappe, who did, though, make his first appearance off the bench in the last 16, coming back from that gastroenteritis.

30:38In the meantime, Gonzalo Garcia with, I think, three goals and an assist. Halfords Lane saying, do you think Gonzalo Garcia is going to get to play much at Real Madrid this season? Yeah, it's a really interesting question. And had it not been for Mbappe's absence from the team, you could probably make the point that he wouldn't have been starting these games. He might have been coming on off the bench and showing what he can do. But I think stylistically he gives Madrid a much better balance in attack because we've been speaking for the past year about how Mbappe and Vinicius are essentially exactly the same profile of player.

31:10But Garcia is much more of a natural kind of number nine. He's good in the air. He holds the ball up quite well. I think he's got a good awareness of what goes on around him as well. and he scored 25 goals last season for Real Madrid's Castilla team it's essentially the reserve team in the third tier of Spanish football and that is a record for a Castilla player but I think the expectation was he was going to leave probably on a loan deal or a permanent transfer this summer but it does open up a lot of questions now because he's obviously come in and he's... Selim Mbappe Get rid of him Free transfer, yeah It does be a lot of questions because Madrid obviously spent so much money on Endric who we just spoke about coming through Palmeiras' system and they spent 40, 50 million on him last summer.

31:52I mean, he is obviously much younger. I mean, Garcia is 21 years old. He's not that young. He's already developed quite a bit in professional football, but he looks like he's ready to play a part for this Madrid squad. I don't think Hendrik does look ready at all. I think he looks far too raw for them to be relying on at all. And obviously, can they fit Vinicius and Mbappe in the same team? And how will Garcia fit into that? But again, this is... There's also Rodrigo who does look destined for the exit. Yeah, yeah. And Rodrigo is, again, quite a similar player to Vinicius and Mbappe, but not quite on that level, I believe.

32:24And he is a player that they will probably look to cash in on this summer. But Madrid never replaced Hossolu whenever they sold him last summer. I love it. But it is these players, right? I mean, those are the players that are perfectly happy to play a role in a squad and to make a difference stylistically. And when you need a goal against defences who are sitting deep, and if you've got players like Mbappe and Vinicius as wonderful as they are it can be quite easy to know what they're going to do rather than having that alternative in attack and I think that is what's got Madrid over the line quite a bit in the past couple of years are those players who've come in to make a bit of a difference and I think they see Garcia in that mould and a lot of people, Xabi Alonso has said he looks like Raul in terms of how he plays and Raul was his coach in the Castilla team last season and he's been messaging him after matches being like well done and this is what I think you should be doing a bit better and he's like he's still guiding me so there is obviously a bit of a connection there and I think it this again this is a tournament where Madrid are finding out a lot I don't think Xabi Alonso wanted to come in quite so abruptly for this tournament but now that he has you can see the benefits from it and see the benefits of giving these players a chance which Real Madrid haven't done very much in recent years they don't don't tend to give their youth team players much much of a chance in their first team.

33:44James Horncastle: Or they sell them with buybacks, don't they? That's the Madrid. Danny Carvajal, Leverkusen, the like. But I saw, I was there for his first game, the Al-Halal game, and he's there for tap-ins, which, you know, just like, your Mbappe's are not there for tap-ins. They're not there for scruffy goals. And like, you know, he's quite happy to just be in the box rather than sort of involve himself in the play or want to come left, run at players. He knows his role, which is important in all aspects of life, James. So, so true. I mean, Jossel, he was top scorer for Real Madrid-Castilla once. And then, obviously, went all around Europe, including Stoke.

34:26We could see Gonzalo Garcia. I don't know who the current equivalent of Stoke are.

34:30James Horncastle: I was in Orlando for Juventus against Man City, which was played at the romantically named Camping World Stadium. Right. Home of an intense atmosphere. Yeah.

34:46James Horncastle: And on the way to the camping world, which was the Citrus Bowl, which is such a nice name. That's a nice name. Citrus Bowl. I think it was also the Tangerine Bowl before that. Lots of bowls. A lot of bowls. Because the Orange Bowl was down in Miami, and you got the Tangerine Bowl. Yeah. Is there a Clementine Bowl? I'm sure. Yeah. a Satsuma Bowl? Don't know about that one. But back to your story. On the way to the aforementioned orange place, there's the MLS stadium for the team that Nanny and Kaká played for. And that was built. It's modelled on the Britannia Stadium. What? Really? Because I think one of the...

35:35James Horncastle: Did they incorporate the little hill where the bus stops? I don't know. There's no little hill. I mean, that would be very American. Just like go to Vegas and they recreate Venice. Go to Orlando and they recreate Stoke. It's a laptop plan. Rory's a laptop. Stoke plan. But yeah, apparently the person who got the expansion team for Orlando Tavern MLS, he was, I think, in some way involved in Stoke in the past. And so, yes, there you have it. a bit of Britannia in in Orlando magnificent magnificent well that's where which game is taking place there the Fluminense Al-Hilal I think yes yes it is Real Madrid Dortmund that's going to be in New Jersey Saturday 9 o 'clock and at Atlanta at the magnificent Mercedes-Benz stadium earlier on Saturday 5 o 'clock UK time you've got probably the most eagerly anticipated game of the entire tournament so far as Paris Saint-Germain take on Bayern.

36:37Yes, they faced off in the 2020 Champions League final. They both also have looked in this tournament pretty devastating. Bayern, particularly in their opening game with that 10-0 against Auckland City, but convincing as well against a fiery Flamengo side in the last 16. Paris Saint-Germain, meanwhile, apart from that one slip-up against Botafogo, have looked Death Star-like in their ability to just blow people away and belittling Inter Miami in their last 16, which from the kick-off was not even anything resembling a contest at that game. Anyway, Osman Dembele, as Mbappe returns for Real Madrid, Osman Dembele finally getting his first minute to the tournament for PSG in the clash with Inter Miami.

37:24Who's your money on for these two quarterfinals then? Real Madrid on one side? Yeah, PSG, Real Madrid. You think? I believe so the Gonzalo Garcia Classico as many are calling it are they? no no one's calling it that

37:40James Horncastle: PSG Real Madrid if we get that obviously with Di Mbappe that would be fun Bayern have been actually very good I think so far in this tournament but when it comes to facing fellow Champions League peer elite I still have reservations about a certain Vincent company in those games they were I thought pretty disappointing in the Champions League this year to have lost some of the games they did in the league phase and then obviously Inter did them in the in the quarterfinals so yeah I would anticipate PSG would go through what a shock that is indeed indeed Colin any anything against that No, I would share James' reservations on Bayern.

38:33The way Vincent Kompany does set up his teams, it's very much if you have higher quality players in the opposition, that's very effective. But when you don't and your vulnerabilities off the ball are exposed, it can cause trouble. I watched both of their games earlier in the season against Celtic in the Champions League. I really just thought their level had dropped off so drastically from what I'd seen before. So, I mean, obviously they've got very talented players and, of course, they've got the firepower. They beat Open City, to be fair. Slashed them. Really laid a marker down. It does feel very European Super League-y, this half of the draw.

39:12I've got to say, obviously Real Madrid got three. In a good way, right?

39:14James Horncastle: Yeah, but that was one of the interesting things. I'm not sure whether we picked up on it, but before the Real Madrid-Al-Hilal game, I was sort of travelling around and hanging out with some of the Spanish journos because they've got some incredible stories in terms of what they focus on rather than what we focus on. But anyway, they looked down from the aquarium-like media box at the Hard Rock Stadium and they saw Florentino Perez walk out on the pitch. Now, Florentino apparently does not really do this. He's in his sort of executive suite at the Bernabeu, doesn't really go down to ground level.

39:52James Horncastle: and he was there because he gave this interview to DAZN in Spain where he basically thanked Gianni Infantino for doing what they couldn't do, which is essentially create a Super League-style competition and sort of made it about him in terms of like, you know, we've been fighting this fight. Right. And, you know, we're still held up by the courts. But Gianni, Gianni. It's a battle of Yavin again. Yeah. Jani has gone beyond, so thank you. Grazie, Jani. Well, that makes us all feel a lot better about the quarter and finals. If, listen, you're one of those people for whom the kind of bloated egos, the weather delays, the farcical nature of the team introductions, etc., have been an issue for you and the poor attendances of many of the fixtures, then there's another tournament which you might regard as the antidote almost the gold cup the club world cup and that's the women's euros and that's now kicked off in switzerland to packed houses so next up with the quarterfinals awaiting us at the club world cup let's get on to what's already happened over at the euros

41:19Women's Euros got underway on Wednesday. We've had four games played now. Megan Ferenga has been at, I think, at least two of those games, and she joins us now. Hey, Megan, how's everything going out there? Yeah, it's hot, it's sunny, it's good football. I mean, it's been really, really fun. Excellent. So Thursday night, you went along to the big game between Spain and Portugal. A minute silence observed before that, and with both the games yesterday, in memory of Dugo Jota, after which Spain World Cup winners displayed pretty quickly why they're absolute favourites to win this competition as well.

41:574-0 up by half-time. Well, they were one goal up after, what, 90 seconds? That brilliant poachers finish from Esther Gonzalez. How impressive did they look? It's easy to see why they're favourites for this tournament. There was just this silkiness to them And that was like pretty much sublime. And it was hard to be mad at them for doing this. I think a lot of people wanted Portugal to win. But then when you watch Spain play the way they do, it's like it's hard to begrudge them. That said, like Portugal weren't great. Like the first half defensively, they were absolutely terrible. That goal like Esther Gonzalez started off with.

42:30She just ran in behind their really, really high defensive line. There was a little bit naivety. they like insisted on playing out from the back, which just seems kind of silly to do against a team like Spain. But I mean, Spain were just phenomenal. And you don't want to take like too much from this game just because Portugal weren't that great. But the way that they played and the way that they just, you know, kept adding better players to the game was quite something. Okay, among the better players added to the game, Aitana Bonmarti, whose fitness had been a big, one of the only questions really about Spain after her viral meningitis.

43:02but she came on in this match. You mentioned not wanting to take too much from the result as well. Probably should mention the fact that the previous two results for Spain against Portugal back in the Nations League were a 4-2 victory and a 7-1. So, yeah, they do this. Spain, though, off to a great start also on Thursday. The team, I think you have down as dark horses, Italy, with a more measured but also impressive victory over Belgium. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think a lot of people didn't really expect Italy to be as great as they are. But if you watch them in the Nations League for the last couple of months, they've shown a lot of progress over the last two years.

43:40And I personally think that when people are weighing up this group, a lot of people thought Portugal would be the dark horses. Belgium, because they'd be England in the Nations League about two years ago. But Italy, if anyone's watched them, there's something special. So personally, for me, I think they'll get runners up in this group. Excellent. In Group A on Wednesday, you also went along to see the host Switzerland and their clash with two-time Euros winners, Norway. They didn't get off to a winning start on the field, Switzerland, losing 2-1. Off the field, though, it has been a brilliant start for the Swiss-organised tournament.

44:14Yeah, it's been really, really great. And I was speaking to someone at UEFA kind of in the lead-up to the tournament, and there was some worry that maybe people wouldn't come out to the games, that this country that maybe hasn't historically always been a bedrock for women's football wouldn't really be up for it. But that first game proved that they really were. And it was great also to see that the team was up for it as well. To go 1-0 up against Norway in the first half, the first half they absolutely dominated, by the way, was, I mean, you could tell it really captured the imagination. And even when Norway went 2-1 up, it wasn't that fans kind of felt, oh, this is inevitable.

44:47It almost felt like a sense of injustice for them. And I think that's going to really be important for the rest of the group games. Before the tournament started, 22 of the 31 matches already sold out. That's phenomenal. Yeah. Yeah. And again, this kind of goes back to this conversation leading up to the Switzerland bid, which was, you know, do you want to go to a country with, you know, smaller stadiums compared to England where, you know, you had a 90 ,000 sellout Wembley, Old Trafford with its huge capacity. But Switzerland were arguing that, no, it's better to fill out stadiums and show that there's demand than maybe have a repeat of the Euros in England, where I think it was a third full at St.

45:21Mary's for two Northern Ireland games. And you don't really want that. So I think right now it's sort of proven that there's demand here. and the atmosphere has been phenomenal at these games. The other game in Group A saw Finland beating Iceland 1-0. 29 shots between two sides, just the one goal, but what a goal it was from Katarina Kosola. Yeah, Finland, again, this Group A, a lot of people didn't expect much from it. I remember Gemma Granger, he's manager of Norway, when they got drawn into Group A, some coach official from another national association sort of quipped to her that there were no big teams in Group A.

45:56So not a lot of people thought this group would be quite fun. But Finland, Iceland, there's a lot of funness there. And I think Finland, this is their first Euros win since 2009. This is a team that I think a lot of people didn't expect much from, didn't know much about, but they showed themselves pretty well in that first game. Well, you're about to catch a train to Lusanne. What are you going to see and what are you looking forward to over the next few days? So I'm covering Wales for the next two, kind of six days, really. They're debutantes at this tournament. They've never reached a major tournament before.

46:29It's all quite exciting. I think there's about 3 ,000 Wales fans making their way over. I'm excited to see all the bucket hats. And no one's expecting anything from this Wales squad in this group, pretty much group of death, England, France, Netherlands. It's kind of disgusting when you think about a major tournament debut. But Wales, they're going to show up. They're going to show out. And I'm excited to see what they can bring. OK. The other game in that group is England against France. and that's 8 o 'clock Saturday evening. The two teams, both of whom are among the contenders for the title this time around, they traded victories, away wins actually, back in the Nations League.

47:08England won 3-1 away in France. France did England 2-1 at theirs. What do you think about this game on Saturday? I think for me, this is probably a group decider. I know it's kind of early to say that, But if one, whichever team gets ahead of the other one in this match, you've got such an advantage going into the next two games and you want to win this group. So for me, whoever wins this group, one, you establish momentum, but you kind of also establish yourself as the big dog in a very, very difficult group.

47:42You can hear more of Megan on Full Time Euros, which is the Athletics Women's Football Podcast. which we're going to sell, Duncan, to a separate company called The A Limited to help with our account. PSR cannot touch us. Ooh, very good. All right, then. Oh, look, there's another international tournament underway right now, which I'm curious, James, in the United States, how much is, if the Club World Cup hasn't necessarily permeated the national consciousness, what about the Gold Cup, which has kind of been happening, sort of buried over on the west coast from our perspective yeah so i i went out for dinner one

48:22James Horncastle: night um at a messy family owned restaurant oh yeah um but it's not owned by the messy family it was just badly worded it's a family restaurant where messy's an investor it's called amalfi llama oh yeah nice amalfi llama what was on the menu steak it's just ridiculous there's no No llama with lemon squeezed from the Amalfi Coast. No, it was just that. Anyway, they had… Amalfi llama. Yeah. So they had Live Sport on. Did they? It was the NBA Finals. They had, I think, Game 6 of the Pacers against the Thunder on. And then one of the people on our table basically said, can you put the Gold Cup on this?

49:05James Horncastle: I can't remember which game it was. It was involving the US. And they turned it on and were like, no, this can't be it. And I'm like, no, no, it is it. And the crowd for this U.S. men's national team game made the Club World Cup attendance look like a sellout. It was incredibly bad. And, yeah, I know crowds have sort of picked up the further they've gone in the competition. But Pochettino in the semifinal, he basically said, well, it felt like it was 90 % Guatemala, 10 % U.S. men's national team. And so anecdotally, being in the States, you hear about how the game is growing in the States. It is.

49:44James Horncastle: But I looked at Club World Cup attendances and the apathy towards the Gold Cup and thought, what is going on here? It did not feel like football was taking off. It did not feel a year out from the World Cup. And OK, that US men's national team, it's without Wes McKinney and Tim Ware, who were with Juventus. It's without Pulisic and, you know, a lot of the build-up to the Gold Cup had been dominated by him basically saying, lads, I'm not going to do this. I'm going to focus on my body, focus on next summer. But still, I thought there would be more take-up for men's national team games in a competition like the Gold Cup.

50:29James Horncastle: You know, I don't even think the Club World Cup cannibalised the Gold Cup in terms of like, oh, what do we go and watch? Do we go and watch our national team or do we go and watch Al Hillel against Real Madrid? You know, it was strange. Well, the US came into the tournament on the back of four straight defeats and a lot of question marks over Mauricio Pochettino. Five consecutive victories, though, have put them into a much happier place and into the final of the tournament, which, as you know, listener, is the CONCACAF Championships featuring men's senior national teams from North America, Central America, and the Caribbean.

51:07And for this edition, their special invited guest, Saudi Arabia. Yeah. There you go. They didn't make the final, the Saudis, but the US have done, and they'll be taking on Mexico, which happens a lot. By the way, on the whole kind of former Premier League manager now in charge of North American national team under pressure pendulum, that shifted from Pochettino, who we're delighted to see doing better, to Jesse Marsh, whose Canada team, highly rated Canada team, have now exited again early from a competition, this time in the quarterfinals against the Guatemalans who the US beat in the semi to reach their final.

51:47All right, let's finish off today's show with some of that transfer talk.

51:59producer charlie says let's be quick but on our transfer in tray we've got nico williams no longer off to barcelona but instead signing a new deal with athletic club de bilbao colin a new contract through to 2035. Wow. 2035, that's an eight-year extension on what he already had at the club. And yet, really interesting way of Athletic Club of announcing this video of Nico Williams going to the, there's a wall in Bilbao where both he and his brother Inyaki, his teammate, in the badge are. And that mural had been defaced by angry Athletic Club fans ahead of this proposed move to Barca. So Nico Williams was at the wall and spray-painted 2035 beside his name.

52:48That's strong. So it was good. And it was one of those stories that really nobody predicted. Nobody had expected. It was all when was the deal going to happen rather than if. So yeah, it's a massive moment for Athletic, massive moment for Barcelona, potentially a massive moment for Marcus Rashford. Right, who has ambitions of making his way to Catalonia.

53:11James Horncastle: He's going to be spray painting that wall. He might also be. I don't know. He's got a clean-up job, yes. A little summer job, the tag. What was the issue with the Barcelona? Was it registration issues? He didn't fancy a Dani Olmo situation? Pretty much, yes. And Dani Olmo, obviously, it's sort of contractual obligations last season, whether Barcelona could afford to pay him or not. And Barcelona did get that over the line, but in very kind of murky circumstances, whether they should have been allowed to, it's a whole other matter. And I think that there was just a case of Athletic Club had publicly said they would go to La Liga and make a legal complaint if this was to go through and it was to be transferred because they had doubts over the financial sustainability of it all.

53:59So essentially that was the hold up. Barcelona could pay the fee, but whether they could commit to the wage structure that would fall within the La Liga system, essentially, was the question mark. That had held up the deal, but the fact that Nico has pretty much said, right, I'm signing for 10 years, seems to rule out that transfer for quite a while, you would imagine. It does, isn't it? Perspective moves that are coming up include a Newcastle bid for Anthony Elanga of Nottingham Forest. That would be their first senior player brought in in, what, two years since that Italian fellow that they got.

54:37Of Big Sandro. He got married this week. Did he? He did, yeah. Oh, nice. Okay. That would be a big move. El Anger to Newcastle. Could see him setting up his Sweden international teammate, Alexander Isaac. Also potentially reaching completion in the near future is the Jonathan David to Juventus move. He's in Turin, I believe, James, for his medical as we speak.

55:02James Horncastle: Yeah. Just once Damien Camoli gets back from the Bruce Springsteen gig he attended at San Siro last night. Did he? Yeah. OK. Jonathan David, who's... Context. Jonathan David, very much a Belle and Sebastian song rather than Bruce Springsteen. Is that an actual Belle and Sebastian song? Yeah. I'm not... Sing it for us. I can't remember where I go, but it's an actual song. I've got a lot of time for Belle and Sebastian. I believe it'll be Serie A's first ever Belle and Sebastian songs to play in the competition. So, fair play. Fair play. Perhaps producer Charlie will play us out with a bit of Ben and Sebastian and Jonathan David.

55:45They do have Mike Piazza. Yeah, yeah.

55:51James Horncastle: Former Regina. Yeah, so there is that Serie A tie-in. I thought I was doing quite well there, but yeah. Anyway, oh, and they're still in for Victor Ozymen, or so they say. Are they, though? I mean, they would have too many strikers. but not if Randall Kulomwani didn't stick around yeah but they still have Duzan Vlajevic earning 12 million euros a year net the one they've been trying to get rid of in every transfer window it's like I'm going to go as a free transfer so have that I'm going to sit it out for a year crikey well a lot for Damien Kamoli to get onto once he's returned from his session with the boss have you seen the boss recently?

56:33James Horncastle: no I have not been to a boss gig You went all the way to the States. I went to the Met life because I assumed that was the last time he'd ever be playing in New Jersey. The following season. The following summer he goes back and does the Stone Pony in Asbury Park, which is the place I should have done. But anyway, yeah, he was... He gigs in Italy every year now. Right. Last year he was in like Ferrara, which is quite bizarre. That is surprising, isn't it? Yeah, pretty sure Charlie was saying let's wrap this up quickly. Anyway, so reports suggest that Everton have agreed a€35 million deal for Villarreal striker Tieno Barry.

57:11What can you tell us about Tieno Barry? Well, what I can tell you is he's an all-action forward. He's a little bit unpredictable, a little bit raw, but I think quite a lot of that is kind of baked into his game. And I think that's maybe what Everton need. Obviously, Dominic Calvert-Lewin's gone, but they have Bedou as well. And he sort of thrived in that David Moyes system. I think they like someone who can just do a lot as one package, really. Barry is also 6 '5". Would that fit into a David Moyes-style football team? Well, it depends on how many crosses will be coming into the box, of course.

57:43But he's all action. He's all in. He's kind of a player that, as a neutral, you like watching. I'm not especially sold on if it was my team, if I would enjoy watching. He can be quite infuriating with a lot of his decision-making. but yeah, I mean I think Everton definitely needed to bring somebody in in the final third and he could take a lot of boxes for them and yeah, it could be quite fun Okay, Arsenal have announced the signing of Kepa, that one's come out of the blue That also means that they have signed a player from Chelsea in six of the last seven seasons What's going on there? Fun game to play though, can you name, I'm sure you can those six previous, well those six including Kepa transfers.

58:2819-20, who did they sign from Chelsea? William? David Luiz. Yes. Okay. 2021? William. 21-22? No one? There was the incident with the pigeon, but no player signed. 22-23? Havertz. Jorginho? Jorginho. 23-24? Kai Havertz. 24-25? Raheem. And now Kepa. Very good work, people. Yeah. And they've been linked with Madueke as well. Have they? That would make up for the fallow year. Right, so it would be seven out of seven, but just not, you know. Still no word on Goikarez. Is that kind of inching towards happening? Don't know. I mean, it's weird. I think there's definitely been a lot of chatter around it.

59:15Sporting's president is very media happy at the moment. I'm saying that they will sell him below his 100 million euros release clause. Should a suitable offer come in. but it's one of these things it's very difficult to get players out of sporting who are of that level the negotiation process could take quite a while and Arsenal obviously are in the market for a number 9

59:39James Horncastle: I thought their priority was goalkeeper and they've got that now so now they can move on to the other priorities I have seen that stat that under Mikel Arteta they have signed as more goalkeepers than out and out forward players in that 5 year period but I think there is a little bit of internal disagreement over who that striker should be which has maybe slowed this down a little bit they will sign one but who it will be and when it will be remain to be seen OK well let's finish off then with a quick comment from Jasper hi Jasper Jasper says can you please give a mention to the end of the Insigne era at Toronto says Jasper fans are ecstatic to see the back of the worst signing in MLS history Insigne, who was the league's highest paid player, was on nearly$16 million a year.

1:00:28That was until, well, he remained on that figure, but lost top spot to Leo Messi when he came in. And during that time, his Toronto team finished bottom of the league, which didn't help. He started this season frozen out of the squad, was brought back in after a few poor performances by the team, and has delivered one goal this season. and all in all just 15 in his 66 MLS appearances.

1:00:53James Horncastle: Yeah, and left four Toronto impact and Napoli have won the league two of the three years he's been away, which for a Neapolitan son must sting a little bit, even though he made a lot of turning on Napoli games. Cash James, but also he would turn on the TV to watch Napoli and his two kids would be wearing Napoli shirts and that sort of thing. But, yeah, having come very close to winning the league with them, to leave and then see them actually do it. Yeah. With, well, Cavalazkelia was just so much better, wasn't he? Yeah, I don't think it's uncoincidental. I mean, he was a good player. Lorenzo Il Magnifico.

1:01:35Yeah. I mean, hugely inconsistent, though.

1:01:39James Horncastle: But scored one of the best goals when they won the Euros, a goal against Belgium. Yeah. Tierra giro. Very good. that's it though for today's show many many thanks to well to Kiva and Tim who were with us earlier on and to Colin, Duncan and James and producer Charlie, new listener we'll be back on Monday with us another totally gold episode what season is it on Monday? well Duncan it's 0-3-0-4 the Invincibles ah, Muzzy is its best performance top assist during the Premier League that year so does that devalue Arsenal's title win? Not for me to say. So you remember that season. I mean, you have remembered that season for that rather than the Invinced Spills.

1:02:23Also coming up next week. So we'll be returning with the regular show on Tuesday and that will feature the eagerly anticipated inter-totally cup clash between yourself, Duncan, and Charlie, which was due to have been this week. But in view of events, we've put that back to next week. so we'll have two of our quarterfinals next week.

1:02:47James Horncastle: What's the Super League side of the bracket in the Intertotally Cup? I mean, I think you're looking at it with Duncan and Charlie and... Well, the other one is Coxie against... Coxie and Daniel. You know, could be finals, all of them. Yeah. Excellent. Well... Did Gianni Infantino put this tournament together? No, another nefarious bald individual.

1:03:14yeah good listener thank you so much for being with us today i hope you have a good weekend and enjoy every moment we'll be back soon on the totally football show

1:03:25you've been listening to the totally football show part of the athletic fc podcast network for more great football podcasts like this one including the athletic fc and our six dedicated club podcasts search for the athletic on apple spotify and all the usual places the totally football show is an athletic media company production

1:03:48the athletic fc podcast network