Totally Extra: Liverpool frustrate Arsenal + AFCON quarter-final preview

0:00The Athletic FC

0:30to it with the magic of the cup. The Cup of Nations, that is, but possibly its greatest quarterfinal line-up ever. All that and much more in this Totally Football Show.

0:43Friday the 9th of January, listener, a big hello to you. What a show. What a show we've got planned. For a start, Tom Williams is back. Hello, James, and happy new year. Happy new year to you, Tom. And happy Friday morning to you, Charlie Eccleshire, because You were with us just yesterday getting into some song confusion. Yes. I've thought of little else since. Have you? Yeah. I mean, confusing the 2002 pop idol songs or whatever I did. Just, yeah, what a gaffe. Have you seen Liam explain? He wrote in and explained thanks to Liam. He crawled into my mind, and that's exactly what happened. That is exactly what happened.

1:20Tom, I know you're wondering. I am. We were talking about 1995, and Charlie said, And did you know that even though Britpop was raging and you had the chart wars between Blur and Oasis, as they were called, yeah, it was actually, you won't guess the name of the song that was the biggest seller of the year. So we kind of thought about that. And then Charlie very kindly hummed it for us, but hummed an entirely different tune, which did throw us off the scent a little bit. So the stat was correct. Yeah. But the musical accompaniment was wrong. Yeah. He hummed Evergreen, which is not easy to do, When in actual fact, it was Unchained Melody.

2:00Even Will Young probably doesn't remember the tune to Evergreen. So fair play. Well, real heads do. Charlie, would you like to? Or do you feel that having wasted at least five minutes of yesterday's show with this, we should probably maybe not do the same thing? Today, especially since, almost as crucially, Thursday night... Sorry, just only because I haven't yet listened to yesterday's pod. I mean, of course I will. What was the answer? What was the correct song? It was Unchained Melody. Oh, right. Sorry, I was already thinking about everything. By Robson and Jerome. Just one last thing. That's so wrong.

2:32Who was the man behind this great idea to have Robson and Jerome perform Unchained Melody? I thought you were going to say behind Demi Moore because of Patrick Swayze. It was, what's his face? Pete Waterman or Simon Cowell or the other one. Or anybody else. It was Simon Cowell. It was Simon Cowell, really? It was an early manifestation of the... Yes, and fuels this belief he has that don't tell me what's cool and trendy because, you know, that was what the people wanted to listen to most of that year, not Blair Oasis or Pulp, etc. Exactly. And right he was. Well, people demand that we now address what happened Thursday night as Round 21 of the Premier League season came to its dramatic conclusion.

3:15The Emirates with Arsenal nil, Liverpool also nil. Arsenal staying six points ahead of Man City and Villa. They're in top spot. Liverpool stay fourth, eight points behind Man City and Villa. Charlie, you were there at the Emirates in driving rain on a frustrating night for the home fans. Yeah, it was. It was a really disappointing game, I think, as well. I mean, it wasn't, you know, you can have a frustrating result, but the game has been exciting or entertaining for the neutral. I don't think anyone was entertained by this. Liverpool came and played really well So their fans might have been satisfied with it especially the second half I think they definitely would have been heartened by it in what's been a pretty mixed season often quite a disappointing one and given they were without three of their best attackers they might well feel that had they had some of those available they could have nicked it rather than having to settle for a 0-0 Perhaps the numbers do make entertaining reading.

4:15Liverpool who as you mentioned were without Izan Ekotike et al failed to have a shot on target in a Premier League match for the first time in almost 15 years, no, over 15 years, March 2010 against Wigan. Arsenal, who did have a striker, but it was Jokeres, didn't manage a shot between the 44th minute and the 90th. They ended with their fewer shots in a home game in four years and failed to score for only the second time this season, both of which came, oh yeah, against Liverpool, Tom. And yet Liverpool came closest to scoring because they hit the crossbar. They did. Through controversies, Connor Bradley.

4:49Yeah. Anyway, we'll get on to that in a second. Or we can do it right now if you want. I mean, there are different points. One, the recent game that Arsenal had at home to Aston Villa, which saw a similarly cagey first half. And then Arsenal absolutely tore Villa apart in the second half. This time, as you're hinting, Liverpool actually the better side in the second period. Why? Yeah, I think there was actually... I didn't sense that much anxiety in the first half. there was far more anxiety in that Villa first half. Villa were actually creating chances, to be fair, in a way that Liverpool weren't really.

5:23But I think because that second half had been so great and Arsenal, there were stats doing the rounds against Bournemouth as well because they then came out in the second half and basically blew Bournemouth away. So I think there was a slight feeling of, OK, the first half was entirely forgettable, but Arsenal have been good in second half. They had a far stronger bench than Liverpool did. I mean, Liverpool didn't make a sub until that Bradley injury and stoppage time, which kind of tells you the state of their squad. But yeah, so I think there was a sense that Arsenal would have to step it up.

5:49I mean, they were the better team in the first half, but not a lot happened. And then Liverpool just got their foot on it. I think they'd had about 70 % of the ball for the first 20 minutes or so of that second half. They really just sort of controlled the game without, you know, let's be fair, it's not like they created anything either, but there was far more of an onus on Arsenal to do that as the home team and the one who had this dangling carrot of an eight-point lead. I think the kind of the nervousness that there was in the stadium in the second half that you sensed even watching on TV was very telling because as much as this title race is Arsenal versus Manchester City and Arsenal versus Aston Villa and Liverpool and whoever else.

6:29Is it Arsenal against themselves? Very much. Arsenal against Arsenal themselves and Arsenal against their own psychoses and the weight of history and, you know, this long wait for silverware. And a nil-nil draw at home to the defending champions when you're already five points clear is a perfectly acceptable result, particularly when they've won every other game that they've played over Christmas. And yet there is this sort of anxiety. There is this desperation. And not to blame Mikel Arteta for it, but, you know, kind of creating this state of like heightened competitiveness means that you end up with scenes like Gabriel Martinelli lobbing the ball at an injured Connor Bradley.

7:13There's no need for that. No need for that. That level of no. And I think a season title winning team doesn't get drawn into that kind of mindset. But at the same time, you can understand why Arsenal do find this sort of thing happening to them. because they haven't won it for so long. It's interesting that you raise this because, Charlie, you were touching on this theme just yesterday, the fact that if City draw three games in a row, for example, people just regard that as something that can happen in the course of a season. But when Arsenal do it, people start talking about psychosis and about their greatest enemies themselves.

7:46Do you think that's something that the media or people like to see, imagine as a narrative for Arsenal? Do you think that is actually something for the team? I think there's a degree of it. I think the reason we latch onto it so much in the media is because it's a very easy thing for us to make sense of. Like elite football, it can be hard to explain away, but we can all understand feeling nervous, feeling anxious, being desperate for something and not quite getting it. And so I think we do over-index that as kind of the only explanation or the biggest explanation when I think, you know, it's also an impossible thing to disprove.

8:20It's completely intangible. But I do think it is significant. Like I said yesterday, you know, City draw three games in a row. They've won the league. So it's totally binary that they are kind of mental giants for whom psychology doesn't matter. Arsenal are mental pygmies who, you know, we kind of imagine their players sit at home fretting over City results. I imagine the fans do. I think there is a conflation and a confusion of the players and the fans. And yesterday, I didn't feel it was that nervous because they had nothing. If they'd been 1-0 up, don't get me wrong, the place would have been like an absolute cauldron of anxiety and nervousness, as it has been, you know, even in games against, say, Brighton, where they had a one-goal lead.

9:03I felt it was more just a, certainly where I was, was more just a bit kind of frustration that this game was just completely passing them by. It didn't feel edgy in the other way. It could be that I just know too many neurotic Arsenal fans. Right. I genuinely... Just Arsenal fans. Well, this is the thing. I mean, again, there's no real way of proving this. I feel like Arsenal fans, as a fan base, are a more neurotic bunch than a lot of fan base. Tom, what's your Twitter handle? Yeah, I'm not really tweeting at the moment. But yeah, so feel free to contact me on there as much as you like. Okay.

9:40Jokeres. Jokeres. Eight touches in the game, only one in the second half. For perspective, Gabriel Jesus, who replaced him in the 64th minute, managed three more touches than that, despite playing less than half a minute against a much stronger Liverpool performance in the period that he was on the field. Jokeres, to go further, in his 10 appearances since returning from injury in November, has scored only once, and that was a penalty against Everton. I think there were maybe five chances in the game on Thursday night against Liverpool where crosses came in, balls came in, where you would have expected him to at least be there to meet them, and he wasn't.

10:22Is it him? Is it the way the team's set up? What do you think? It's weird, because when Jokic has played, Arsenal have generally won the game and scored a decent number of goals. And so, in one respect, the fact that he's not the one scoring isn't a major issue for Arsenal. You know, they've had two games this season where they haven't scored, and one of them was last night. And then it becomes a big issue. But Arsenal have also had periods where they've had a prolific striker, but not been very good. I'm thinking Aubameyang, Van Persie, those sort of eras. So obviously, you know, you want, you can have both.

10:58Those things are not mutually exclusive, but it does, I think it's, obviously he's a new signing. He was so prolific before. And clear, you know, he does offer something. He occupies defenders. You see when he comes off, teams can step forward. All of this, I appreciate, you know, sounds a bit like squinting and that, you know, just say he's terrible. But I just think they've had a pretty effective attack when he's played. Clearly, he has not been anything like as prolific as most were kind of hoping for. I think, you know, his goal return has been pretty bad. I think Jesus as well is slightly overstating it, to be honest.

11:33Like, Jesus is a bit one of those players who I think there'll be a clamor for until he actually plays regularly. Do you know what I mean? And then he doesn't score and you're kind of like, ah, yeah, OK, it's sort of not. Maybe Jokeres wasn't as bad as we thought. You know, he came on and he buzzed around. He didn't really do a whole lot. You know, he got involved. He will get involved more than Jokeres. That isn't Jokeres' game. Jesus is a higher touch player, drops in and looks like he's kind of trying. He's very visible. Swiss Ramble, who is busy posting on Blue Sky and is always worth a follow, posts some interesting numbers actually about Jokic, who had amazing stats when he was at Sporting.

12:14But Swiss Ramble breaks them down and spots that, crikey, he got loads of goals against the bottom three in Portugal's top division and quite a few against teams from seventh downwards, but very, very few against the top ones. and you might suggest that it's therefore a question of the level of opposition. Anyway, we shall see. The expectation is that Gabriel Jesus will be leading the line or possibly Kai Havertz might be returning. I think Kai Havertz is that's the big issue and Arteta really wouldn't have wanted Jokeres to have been playing quite as much as he has done. I mean Havertz would be the first choice striker and he came on as a sub on the opening weekend and hasn't played since.

12:54That's been a massive factor and Havertz is really important to the way Arteta wants to play. And they're still six points clear, so it can't be that bad. Now, Martinelli. Mark Ridley writes in, should Martinelli have been sent off for two yellow cards for separate incidents regarding the Bradley injury? Bradley, who appears to twist his knee, collapse looking in serious pain, was later stretched off. A frustrated Martinelli first drops the ball on him, then kneed him in the back, and then try to basically shovel him off the pitch, incurring the wrath of Bradley's Liverpool teammates, understandably.

13:31Yeah, I mean, it was appalling, but he has come out after the game and apologised and said, well, I didn't realise... Martinelli has apologised and said, I didn't realise how seriously Bradley was injured. That's the only possible explanation and that's the only possible excuse. Yeah, but you can't just decide... You could see that the player was down on the ground riding in agony. I don't think it's defensible. You can only behave like that If you think that your opponent is egregiously play-acting, and Bradley was clearly seriously injured, and yet Martinelli did what he did. Martinelli, who knows a little bit about feigning injury himself.

14:12Well, you know, an Arsenal player being annoyed by an opponent time-wasting. I mean, you can understand where that annoyance must come from. Roy Keane in the studio comparing it to his own. coming together with Alfie Haaland, Erling's dad, which, of course, Keane famously took well. Hopefully, there's no similar afters in this case. Well, how long did Keane wait? Four years, I think. So, you know, rendezvous in 2030. Bookmark it. I mean, Arnaz slot was really generous, actually, because what he said was that because there is so much time wasting, he could understand why a player would assume a player was doing that.

14:53But clearly, Martinelli was completely out of order. I mean, he said that he's already apologised to Bradley and they've spoken and that kind of thing. That's good. We'll move on then. Liverpool next up have Barnsley on Monday in the FA Cup third round. Arsenal have Portsmouth away. It's the start of four road fixtures in four different competitions in the space of 10 days for the Gunners. Barnsley who beat Liverpool in a famous Premier League upset in 1997. Yeah. Okay. I was thinking of the 2008 FA Cup upset. Of course, and more recently. So there's precedent there. There's beef. There's dangerous precedent.

15:32And not the only place there's dangerous precedent right now, of course. Portsmouth in the FA Cup for Arsenal. And then Chelsea in the Carabao Cup away. Then Forrest away in the Premier League. And then Inter at San Siro in the Champions League. Crikey. Kind of matches that will see them rise to the occasion, I imagine. Anyway, we'll find out soon enough. That's enough. I think on Arsenal Liverpool unless there's any postscript you want to chuck in no postscript listener next up on this day

16:09this is the Totally Football Show part of the Athletic FC podcast network the Athletic is the only place you can read articles by Daniel Taylor Amy Lawrence, Phil Hay, James Pearce Oli Kay and the very best football writers around

16:269th of January, as we record, we've got a couple of topical on this day's view. On the 9th of January 2007, what's this? Liverpool facing Arsenal. This one was slightly more exciting. It was the quarterfinals of the League Cup. It saw the Gunners going to Anfield and winning 6-3. Charlie, do you remember this? I do. Yeah, this was a weird sort of period in Arsenal's history when they were kind of in between things. They'd just moved to the Emirates and they were in transition. The Invincibles team was kind of being broken up. And in the, what was it then? Because it was the Carling Cup and Wenger would make wholesale changes.

17:08So you had this kind of shadow team operating in this competition of which Julio Baptista and Jeremy Aliadier were the kind of - Aliadier, who scores the opener here. He scores the opener, exactly. Exactly. And Baptista just, I mean, this was a guy who'd come in from Real Madrid that summer, Jose Antonio Reyes going the other way. And there were big expectations because at the time, everyone, a bit like now, saying what Arsenal need is a big, burly forward who can kind of, you know, put an end to all this tippy-tappy rubbish and just whack the ball. Turned out he wasn't very good. And he'd scored once for Arsenal going into this game.

17:46You're kidding. And he got four in this? And got four. I don't know if he fancies his chances against Paleta. And Batista's coming in again. He's got another tap in. And Arsenal have scored six at Anfield. And he's got four of them. Julio Batista. The rest of his Arsenal career, I think he only got six goals outside of this game that season. But yeah, he got four. It was one of these. It's kind of an arse-shaving performance. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it was extraordinary. He had a really curious career. in that he went to Sevilla from Sao Paulo, having never scored many goals in Brazil. He scored 20 league goals in his first season at Sevilla and then 18 the following season, went to Real Madrid and never reached double figures for league goals in the rest of his career.

18:30Just this incredible goal scoring flourish. But he was a weird player as well because he could also play as like a DM. He was this sort of hybrid. He had enormous shoulders. Because he was massive. Massive. Yeah, I mean, I think he was, what was his nickname? The Beast. The Beast. And then I think he got unkindly named the Fridge because the bounce the ball would just bounce off him. Yeah. He was a very strange signing. All right. Well, there you go. That was Gili Baccham Moore. It kind of heralded actually the start of Wenger seemingly like listening to fans and signing players that fans thought should be signed.

19:07And that didn't work out so well for him. So you also Marouane Shamak. Yeah, exactly. Another one who is going to score loads of headed goals and be a big presence. Now, another 9th of January for you, and it's also Liverpool relevant. This. I have to talk about facts because I think it's important. I think that they are nervous because we are at the top of the table. So I want to be clear that I don't want to play mind games too early. I think that they want to start. So I was taking some facts and then it will be easy to talk about this. November 1st, they play against Hull City. And Mr. Ferguson, the manager, was too much touchline ban and fined with£10 ,000 after confronting Mike Dean, the referee, for improper conduct.

19:59Yeah, that was the famous, is it still famous? I wonder, the Rafa Benitez fact press conference. Lives on in GIF form. Does it? If nothing else. OK, this was about as huge as a petulant and pink-faced man reading from a piece of paper could be. Midway through a pre-game press conference, Liverpool were going to be facing Stoke. Somebody asks Rafa about Manchester United, whereupon he reaches into his jacket pocket and pulls out a sheaf of paper with notes and off he goes for about four minutes. It's really awkward. Yeah, it is. I mean, it is funny. and it came out of nowhere it wasn't like Sir Alex Ferguson had been kind of cranking up the pressure in the days prior to it it just came out of a clear blue sky one man one man meltdown do you think it's the sort of thing though that in the social media age it wouldn't have come out of nowhere so much because now there would be so much on Twitter about how people would be clipping up all the mad decisions that United get at Old Trafford and that kind of thing there were murmurings it was him talking about all the various infringements that Ferguson had made, the favourable treatment, perceived favourable treatment from the referees, and also in fixtures and the scheduling of fixtures.

21:16But what I found strange about it, and it was the perception at the time as well, was that this was where Liverpool, who were seven points clear of Man United, remember at this point hadn't ever won a Premier League title. United had two games in hand. This was where Liverpool effectively blew the title and they ended up drawing the next three games and ended up losing the title to Man United. But Sir Alex was perceived to have won this by effectively just going, well, I don't know what his issue is, and not really even bothering to respond to it. I can't imagine taking out to a packed press conference a list like that, starting it, keeping going for four minutes, despite the total lack of reaction and almost stunned disbelief from the room, and at no point thinking, wow, maybe this isn't the great idea that it seemed last night when I wrote all this.

22:08I guess once you've committed to it, you've just got to see it through. Surely, I mean, I could go on. It's just sitting waiting for you there. I don't know. Anyway, poor Rafa. It's a bit difficult if you've written something down that you're intending to deliver. It's hard to, you know, work had gone into that. Tell me about it, Tom. I mean, has history... I mean, there is now a lot, a lot of people do look back on that era and are like, wow, you're not... Nine games. No, not that he was right to do it, but the substance of what he was saying, that there was something in it. And people didn't stand up to Sir Addicts.

22:40I think people thought that at the time, though. Everyone thought that at the time, surely. I think the initial reaction was, oh, wow, someone standing up to Ferguson, someone saying what should have been said. You know, this is admirable. And then three draws later, oh, mind games, Rafa's lost it. So there's various... Stephen Gerrard, in one of his autobiographies, talks about this. I think he says he was gripping the sofa. He felt so awkward for Rafa. What's he done here? Yeah. And Carragher as well. He was quite disparaging about it. But then these were autobiographies that were written at the end of these players' careers, looking back retrospectively.

23:11At the time, I don't think this was met with ridicule immediately. It was more towards the end of the season, or probably even afterwards, people start looking back, trying to make sense of what happened. Well, that was obviously the moment. And again, go back to convenient narratives. That was the moment Rafa lost the plot. I was doing a show called Football Matters on a channel called Satanta. Don't look for it. It's not there very well. My co-host was Rebecca Lowe, who whatever happened to her. And I do recall that this was basically a Monday night review the weekend and all the talking points type show in front of the studio audience.

23:47What lucky, lucky people they were. And, yeah, I do recall us going quite strong on this. And it did feel like it was Rafa effectively. Sort of Kevin Keegan moment. Yes, just that, that he'd shown that Sir Alex had got under his skin and had thus effectively lost that battle before it even began. The absence of mind games is a real shame. Is it? Well, I mean, like it would have been great if there'd been, you know. Who would have mind games now? Well, Klopp and Guardiola always had so much mutual respect for one another. Right. But, you know, it would have been, I would have added a layer of intrigue to that rivalry if there'd been some needle there.

24:22Yeah. And now obviously Arteta and Pep are too respectful of one another. Game's gone. Guardiola Klopp, same thing, wasn't it? Can you see anyone out there? I mean, everything's cyclical. So do you see any young mind gamers breaking through? That's a good question. I don't think they're... None that are really... They're all too respectful and well media trained. Could Herzler... Has he got that in his locker? I don't know. Has he? Maybe. Has he? The Herzler locker. So nice, Tom. Anyway, you know what? We could talk about this for at least five more minutes, but we're not going to because I can see that Jay Harris is standing by from Morocco.

24:57So next up, let's get on to AFCON.

25:05You're listening to The Totally Football Show with James Richardson. Now we do four times a week. Keep up to date with us on Insta and enjoy seeing glorious Technicolor on YouTube at The Totally Show. AFCON. Not everybody has been following the Cup of Nations. In the group stages. But if you are after some exciting football to watch this weekend and the FA Cup third round doesn't quite do it for you, now really would be the perfect time to get into this magnificent tournament. AFCON quarterfinals start today, Friday as we record. They've been hailed as the strongest set of quarterfinals possibly the competition's ever seen.

25:45The eight remaining nations are all but one of them, former winners. a combined 22 continental titles in there. You've got Egypt, seven-time winners, Cameroon, who've won it five times, three-time winners like Ivory Coast, Coupe d 'Avoire and Nigeria, Algeria, Senegal and Hose, Morocco also triumphed here before. Mali are the odd ones out and they, this afternoon, will be involved in an all-West African battle against Senegal to kick off the Court of Finals. Then you've got, Friday evening, Cameroon, Morocco, boom. Saturday, Algeria take on Nigeria, the two teams that still have perfect records.

26:24And then Saturday evening, it's Egypt, Ivory Coast. In Morocco, Jay Harris. Jay, it's Happy New Year to you. Happy New Year to you all. How's it going there, Jay? It's been going really well. I think, as you've mentioned, it's a really strong quarterfinal line-up. The other side of that is that there haven't been that many surprises at the tournament. Normally, AFCON, sort of legendary for lots of massive upsets. The last tournament, Ghana were knocked out in the group stages. We obviously had Ivory Coast win, but they'd lost two games in the group stages. So I'm a little bit sad there's been no major shock, but at least there's a very, very strong quarterfinal lineup.

27:02Well, for anyone looking to dive in this weekend, you kind of summed up the story so far pretty well there. What to look out for in the matches coming up? Should we go through them one by one? So Mali Senegal is Friday afternoon. So that's Mali, who've not yet actually won a game in this tournament, taking on a Senegal side with so many attacking options. Is this quite cut and dry, do you think? I think so. Senegal, as you said, have just sort of grinded through this tournament. They beat Tunisia in the last round on penalties, whereas Senegal, just over the last few years, have been consistently performing at a really high level.

27:35They obviously got to the last 16 at the World Cup, where they lost to England. I think they beat England this year. They were winners back in, I think it was, 2000 and 2021. They've got Mane and Jai, Jackson. There's players I've missed out. Their attacking options are just silly. So I do expect them to win. Although they beat Sudan 3-1 in the last round and actually went a goal down. So let's hope there's none of that complacency tonight. Okay. You'll be going along a little bit later on today to see host Morocco against Cameroon. Jay, how much are you looking forward to that? I think this could really be, maybe, I don't want to bid it up too much as a potential game in a tournament, but I'm really excited about this one.

28:13And there's two reasons. Firstly, Morocco have not played that well. Of course, there's been a few flourishes. We've all seen El Kabi's overhead kicks and Brahim is doing well, but collectively, the local people in Morocco just expect them to win this tournament. And you can feel that pressure when you're in the stadium. They beat Tanzania in the knockout stages, but I think they only scored in the 60th minute and they only win 1-0 against Tanzania who'd never reached the knockout stages before. So they really had to grind through that game. I watched Cameroon against South Africa, which was a really fun game.

28:48South Africa were fantastic for the first 20 minutes. Cameroon looked like they could have conceded three or four goals. And then Cameroon switched it around. But Cameroon have a very young team and there's reasons for that. Some senior players have been excluded, shall we say, politely. But I just have a feeling that it could be a really open game because Morocco have Hakimi, Azal Zouli, Brahim as I mentioned Sabari they just basically throw people forward and this is a very young Cameroon team who I don't think know quite how to game manage and sit back so I'm hoping it's very open and there's going to be lots of goals.

29:20The team is young the head coach has been in the job what four weeks after that weird pre-tournament where they submitted two different squads to CAF. Yes yeah exactly so Mark Brees was the Cameroon head coach but Cameroon didn't qualify for this summer's World Cup. So he was sacked a few weeks before the tournament, which means David Pagu, who's now in charge, when he announced his squad for AFCON, he never would have taken a training session with those guys, let alone play a game with those guys. So credit to him for making them reach the quarterfinals. And there was actually a little bit of mind games in the press conferences yesterday because Morocco's head coach basically said, Cameroon have to win this game because they're not going to play at another major tournament for a few years.

30:01And I think Cameroon's head coach politely pointed out that the entire nation expects Morocco to win so actually I think you'll find there are 80 ,000 people in the stadium who think you'll win so the pressure's on you yeah indeed whoever does get through this tie will be up against the winners of Saturday's similarly enormous looking Nigeria Algeria Clash Jate you're going along to that one as well aren't you yes I am I'm really looking forward to this game again Nigeria always provides drama at a tournament and if you looked at it you'd say okay, they've won all four of their games. They beat Mozambique 4-0.

30:37There's nothing to worry about. But of course, Victor Ossiman and Adam Oluwukman had this fight in the second half of the game against Mozambique. Ossiman then asks to be substituted and walks straight onto the team coach after the game. And so now there's this bizarre tension. The Minister of Finance in Nigeria came out yesterday and spoke about unpaid bonuses yet again because this happened in November when they were trying to qualify for the World Cup. So I've written this a few times, but Nigeria just have this ability to self-sabotage. They've got a perfect record. Their team's playing incredibly well.

31:12And so they just decide to start fighting with each other. And the Federation decide to not pay them on time. So something's never changed with them, unfortunately. Well, it cost them their place at the World Cup. I mean, it was certainly a factor, no? It was definitely a factor because they played, I think, Gabon on the first day. And then it was DR Congo on the Sunday. And they didn't train for, I think, two days. But also, it's the emotional and psychological impact that constantly having to do battle with your federation. And I should point out, a lot of these players, the money's not really important to them, it's important to the backroom staff.

31:47And that's often why they're protesting. It's less about them and more about the people who work underneath them who rely on that money. And so when you've constantly got to battle and fight for yourself, of course, that's going to have an impact on how you play on a football pitch. Yeah, absolutely. There were reports that the team might not travel to Marrakesh for the game against Algeria on Saturday. But as you mentioned there, the finance minister, I think it was, saying that the issues are now all resolved. So that's good news. And hopefully, Victor Azumain will be over his huge post-game sulk from the last 16 match.

32:22And feeling a bit happier with Adam Ola-Lukman, who's been absolutely brilliant in this tournament. Three goals, four assists in the four matches so far. Yeah, there's something about AFCON which just brings the best out of Adamola Lukman. He was sensational at the last tournament in Abidjan, but Lukman's playing in a slightly different position than he normally does for Nigeria. Sometimes he's shunted out on the left. He's now playing at the top of a diamond. He's just getting the ball in more central positions. He's having an impact. And I should point out to people that the slightly bizarre thing about the Osserman and Lukman feud is that Lukman's, I think, assisted all of Osserman's goals at this AFCON and the last AFCON.

33:00But Osserman, I think, is three goals away from tying Nigeria's all-time top goal scorer, Rashidi Yakini. So I think that is part of why he blew up on Tuesday evening. Jay, can I just ask how this tournament compares to the last AFCON you did? Because you were in Cote d 'Ivoire, weren't you, a couple of years ago? Yep. And yeah, just wondered your impressions of it compared to that one. Yeah, I think it doesn't feel quite as entertaining as the last AFCON. Maybe I shouldn't say that when I'm trying to convince our listeners to watch this. Until now. Take it all back. It's been amazing. You've got to check it out.

33:33As I mentioned, there's been no major surprise. I just remember the group stage in the last tournament. Ghana getting knocked out in just bizarre circumstances where their goalkeeper conceded a really unnecessary last-minute corner. And I can't remember who it was who knocked them out, but they scored from that corner. Ivory Coast lost 4-0 to Equatorial Guinea and they were the hosts and they sacked their head coach. There were just so many moments of ridiculous high-tension drama at that tournament. There were even loads of memes that came out about it. I don't know if you guys remember, but Marley got knocked out by Ivory Coast.

34:06They're obviously neighbouring countries. Ivory Coast win in the 120th minute and there's this meme of Marley's then head coach, Eric Schell, who's now with Nigeria, getting water poured on his head. There's just so many odd things that happened at that tournament. Loads of penalty shootouts and it just feels like this tournament's lacked that a little bit. I think we've seen it a little bit more in the last week with South Africa's head coach losing his head a little bit and then with the Osman situation. So I'm really hoping that the tournament is about to explode into life this weekend. Nice one.

34:35One more quarterfinal I should mention. Saturday evening, Ivory Coast taking on Egypt or Coup d 'Ivoire against Egypt, the winners of which will be taking on whoever comes through Senegal, Mali. Code d 'Ivoire with another Man United. We've got Brunnen Bwemo, of course, doing wonders for, well, featuring for Cameroon. And Amadialo, who is doing really, really well for the Elephants. Yeah, I was a little bit concerned about how Ivory Coast would do this tournament. Not because they're not a talented team and they've done really well under Immersfe. Obviously, won AFCON when he was the caretaker.

35:13But just because quite a lot of change had happened from the squad that won the AFCON final. They were missing Simon Edinger, they were missing Sebastian Hilaire, but Ahmad Diallo and Yandi Amande have done exceptionally well. They've still got people like Frank Kessier, Seko Fafana, Ibrahim Zengari in midfield. So I think there's a very good blend of youth and experience. And it's going to be really interesting to see how they do against Egypt. I mean, Salah's popped up in some crucial moments for Egypt, but they still needed extra time to beat Benin. So I do wonder if they're going to come unstuck against Ivory Coast.

35:46All right. The holders against the seven-time African champions. That's 7 p.m. UK time on Saturday. Brilliant. Jay, listen, enjoy the game this evening and tomorrow. How's the weather there, by the way? The weather's actually improved. It's looking a little bit better. It was raining a lot. But today I think I can put my raincoat in the cupboard and crack out the shorts. Excellent, Jay. Excellent. Very good. Good. Enjoy yourself there, as everyone around you will do too. And we'll catch up with you soon, I hope, on the Totally Football Show. Thank you very much.

36:24Well, Tom, I guess that kind of wraps it up for today's Totally Football Show, unless there's something else you wanted to talk about. Well, it was the little matter in Kuwait City last night of the Trophée des Champions. Were you doing little matter? Were you doing little matter? Were you doing that ironically? Of course. Of course. Right, okay. Because it is quite a small matter. Genuinely quite a small matter. So glorified friendly. We were talking to the lovely Louis Vicks. I know a colleague of mine at Canal Palouse. There you go. And I asked him why is Ligue 1 doing its Super Cup in Kuwait.

37:02And he kind of shot on his feet and said, can we not talk about that? Do you know what the issue is? The same reason that Spain do it in, where are they? Saudi Arabia? Saudi. He's trying to grow the French League around the world. For sure. I was just wondering why it wasn't in Qatar or Saudi and they had to go to Kuwait. They've done it in Qatar. They did it in Qatar last season. They want to take it to more glamorous places. Yes. More glamorous places in Thai for PSG. Don't want to host it. So they end up playing in places like Doha and Kuwait City. But Full House. Having lived in Kuwait City, I've got to say that it's a step or two down from Doha in terms of...

37:37Did you? When you were growing up? Yeah, when I was very young. I'm sure it's changed a lot. Lovely stadium by the looks of things. Oh, yeah? And it was, you know, a full house. I mean, good luck to them. Actually, I shouldn't be disparaging. It's been a long time since I've set foot in Kuwait. Do you still feel an affinity with the place? Hugely so. Hugely so. It's the first result I check when I look at the Asian League qualifying thing. Do you know Michel Platini once played in a friendly game for Kuwait? Really? And didn't realise it would count as an official fixture. What? If you have a look at Michel Platini's playing record.

38:07He played for Kuwait? He played for Kuwait. Why? So at the 1982 World Cup, there was that game between France and Kuwait. 4-1 France win. And it was famous for the fact that at some point, France scored a goal and the Kuwaiti defenders stopped because they thought they'd heard a whistle in the crowd. At which point, a Kuwaiti shake walked down onto the pitch from the stands and was like, this is a disgrace. That goal cannot be allowed to stand. And the referee overturned it. And everyone was like, what is this? absolute nonsense. And that was the beginning of some kind of unlikely friendship between this Kuwaiti sheikh and various members of the French Football Federation.

38:46And a few years later, I can't remember the exact date, Platini is invited to play for... I think he'd retired as a France player by this point. And he's like, yeah, sure, whatever. But how was he allowed to turn out for Kuwait then? It was the 80s, James. Plus he was Platini. Plus he was Michel Platini as well. Is this in your fascinating Vavavum chronicle of French? It is not. No, I do... Vavavum wouldn't have been possible without playing for Kuwait. Is this in a future term about Kuwaiti football? Well, yes. I don't know what that would be called. Hold that thought. Yes. No, I do refer to the one-man Kuwaiti shake pitch invasion.

39:21Right. But not the curious, Platini friendly appearance. Anyway, I'm sorry. 1988, extraordinary. 1988. Playing for Kuwait, yeah. We've kind of... The reason we were talking about Kuwait was that they're playing the Super Cup there. They played it Thursday night. Oh, it was PSG against Marseille. Oh, 90 seconds Marseille were away from actually winning the trophy. Yeah, so PSG go ahead early on, Ousmane Dembélé. But very open game. Marseille equalise through a penalty. Go ahead through an own goal three minutes from time. You're like, oh, this is it. Like at long last, they're going to get their hands on the trophy.

39:56And then PSG scored the most absurd team goal in the fifth minute of stoppage time to equalise. Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang, who's come on as a second-off substitute for Marseille, is through on goal. William Pacho tackles him. Ball gets fed out to Vitinha in midfield. He lofts a pass out to the left. Bradley Barcola heads it back across goal. And Gonzalo Ramos just volleys it home.

40:33This is the bar of Paris Saint-Germain who explodes and who exult. Two balls everywhere between the Paris Saint-Germain and the Olympique of Marseille. I mean, ridiculous. The ball is airborne from basically the centre circle until it hits the back of the net. Penalty shootout, PSG win. And a big night for Lucas Chevalier, the man who was signed to take the place of Gianluigi Donnarumma, whose form has been a little bit patchy since he arrived at PSG, was at fault for the one goal that Marseille scored when they beat PSG in September. And when PSG won the Intercontinental Cup against Flamengo in December, it was Matvei Safanov, Russian goalkeeper who was in goal, saved four penalties in the shootout.

41:17And it was like, oh, wow, what if he's PSG's new number one? But he fractured his hand in saving one of those penalties or at some point in the game. Chevalier's back in. He's the hero, saves two penalties, played very well. so it looks like he is finally proving himself as PSG's number one. Tom, that's incredible. I've got to say, I feel, I want to apologise to you and Kuwait and the French Super Cup as a concept. Michel Platini and the Kuwaiti shake. Yeah. Apology accepted. Because that was not only clearly a pretty exciting match, but also a fantastically vivid reenactment here in the studio by you using just your hands.

41:59And gestures. I live the games I watch. Wow, that was amazing. I'd love to follow more of that tournament, but it's over now. I can, if I would want, I could follow the Spanish Super Cup, which is even now underway in Saudi Arabia. They've had the semi-finals, which saw Barcelona and Real Madrid triumphed against Athletic Club and Atletico, respectively. Fede Valverde scored an absolute scorcher. There you go. Do you want to re-enact that with your hands? From a free kick. Boom. And so Barca meet Real Madrid What Sunday? Yes In Jeddah Famous seat of Spanish football historically Although there's a lot of murmurings about not doing The Super Cup there anymore From the RFF Maybe Q8 Maybe Q8 could be an option Yes Anyway let's leave The Middle East for now and indeed park this Totally Football show stroke Totally Extra.

43:02Listen, many thanks for your company today. Hope you've enjoyed it. We'll have our regular Sunday night roundup of the weekend's action with you either live on YouTube or as a podcaster on Monday morning dealing with the third round of the FA Cup. And then, of course, we've got the Euro show talking about French football and so much more with you Tuesday morning. For now, many, many thanks to Jay Harris, to Tom and Charlie and producer Charlie and also producer Jesse. And to you, listener, from all of us here, it's goodbye.

43:56an Athletic Media Company production.