Sam Heughan, 'Outlander' star

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1:31Hello and welcome back to a brand new season of the Travel Diaries podcast. I'm your host Holly Rubenstein and here each week I'll be speaking to a very special guest about the seven chapters in their life's travel diaries. From their all-time favourite destination and their hidden gem to their worst travel experience and what's at the top of their travel bucket list. We'll be uncovering their adventures around the world and the travel experiences and destinations that have shaped their lives. Well hi everyone, it's great to be back. How are you all doing? I'm so pleased that you enjoyed our island destination special with the hilarious Ardlow Hanlon a few weeks ago.

2:17That was a good one. Can't get enough of all things island have you guys been traveling since we last spoke it's been great hearing from some of you I've uh I've done one trip since last season a quick one to the south of France you might wonder why I've not been traveling more of late if you follow me on Instagram you might know that that's because all being well I'm actually expecting my second baby later this summer so I had to cut back on travel really because pregnancy I just don't find it that easy I've been sick pretty much the whole way through both of my pregnancies so it just makes traveling a bit tricky so I guess the next time we'll be flying now we'll hopefully be as a family of four so a lot of change and excitement this end and it was lovely to get down to one of my favorite parts of the world um on the Riviera I went to review a hotel that has been on my bucket list since forever actually it's called La Reserve Ramatuel.

3:17I was reviewing it for The Telegraph. I don't think that the reviews come out yet but I mean yeah it was exquisite a very very special place to get to experience. Needless to say spoiler it gets a very good review from me and then I went on to review another hotel in Provence which I'm really excited to share with you guys next week. It's more of a family kind of country club type property and I think it would appeal to a lot of you so I'll tell you more about that in next week's episode. But now let's get on to today's guest, the brilliant Sam Heughan. Sam is best known as the star of Outlander, the historical drama that has become nothing short of a global phenomenon.

3:58It's based on the best-selling novels and the series blends romance, adventure and time travel against the backdrop of Scotland's most breathtaking landscapes. Now having just wrapped the filming for its final season Sam and I chat about how Outlander has you know not only shaped his life and career it's also driven record-breaking tourism to Scotland as fans follow in the footsteps of its characters perhaps unsurprisingly I mean it's really a love letter to the country too and even if you've never watched the show its cultural impact is really impossible to ignore it's one of the most watched tv dramas worldwide and it's transformed Sam into one of the most recognizable faces on TV.

4:43And as you'll hear today, you know, travel has shaped a lot of Sam's story. He grew up in rural Dumfries and Galloway. He's spent a huge amount of time filming around the world, obviously, particularly in Scotland. And his free time is spent taking on some epic adventures from walking the West Highland Way, which he wrote a memoir about, and trekking Mount Everest, which I didn't know, which we chat about on today's episode. It's a really great one. Whether it's sipping coffee in Cape Town, diving with sharks in New Zealand, discovering secret beaches in Sydney, there's a lot that we cover off in today's episode.

5:21Sam's passport is very well stamped. I caught up with Sam just last week, actually, when he was in Australia. And he is just lovely and down to earth and genuine. And I really, really enjoy chatting to him. So I think this is one that you'll enjoy too. So, right, guys, let's buckle up and get started. Here's Sam.

5:45Sam, welcome to The Travel Diaries. It is amazing to see you today, coming to me from the land down under. How are you?

5:54Sam Heughan: Indeed, indeed. And I think, you know, we've had a few challenges trying to set this up with time zones and norovirus not included. But no, so nice to see you. Good morning, I guess. Yeah. So what time is it there? It is exactly five minutes past six because it took me five minutes, five minutes to download whatever app we needed to get this working. But yeah, the sun has set because winter here and winter is like our summer back in Scotland. I've seen some of your Instagram videos. It looks absolutely gorgeous, to be honest. yeah I mean it is pretty pretty amazing here I do love coming to Australia and this particular part um North Bondi in in Sydney it is such a special part of the world they have such a good quality of life over there don't they they do I was surprised so with my jet lag I've been waking up kind of early and I sort of hear this noise and like you know 5 a.m I look out the window know and it's still dark here obviously it's winter and um there's about 500 people all going for a swim you know and then running along the beach and it's just so impressive because i think at 5 a.m on a winter's morning in scotland we're not doing the same thing but um the quality of life here is amazing and i was trying to also work out what the the light is because the light here is quite special it's very different to to the uk and the north and hemisphere so um yeah i think it's kind of more more bright or more yellow maybe I don't know it's an interesting light interesting so quite cinematic in a way yes yes there's probably a filter for it but um yeah no I love it and honestly yeah like I've been here many times uh over the past few years very lucky to to come here for work primarily um but I really do enjoy it it's um it feels familiar but uh but also kind of um kind of you're on on on the on the edge of you know the gnome world in some ways yeah yeah I totally see what you mean although actually it was interesting you're saying about the kind of people getting up early and going for a swim and that outdoorsy lifestyle because while it may not be something that I'm especially familiar with back in London I kind of get the vibe that like growing up in the epic landscapes of Scotland that nature must have been an important part of your childhood 100 yeah I think you're right that's perhaps why I'm drawn to places like this because I was born and brought up in the southwest of Scotland in a place called Dumfries and Galloway and it's the undiscovered Scotland I think it's the part that's not really talked about but should be because it has so much it's kind of remote but wild has great scenery great history and growing up I was very lucky to grow up in the grounds of an old castle and I think that kind of being alone a lot as well because there's not many people that live there so there are only like four children in my class at school but I think you know being alone creating your own games or your own environment and and sort of playing I guess make-believe that I did a lot perhaps uh definitely did influence my career as then becoming an actor I think yeah gosh I didn't realize that your childhood was so remote four children in your class that's quite that's not um run of the mill no I mean we were the local village this is the primary and there were obviously other years but I think in the whole school itself there was like 20 children um but it yeah it was it was an amazing kind of I guess idyllic upbringing and then as a teenager I moved to the bright lights of Edinburgh which for me was um like moving to Las Vegas you know it was kind of this unknown world and um there was so much going on you know from theatre to music to yeah to people and shops and yeah as a teenager it really was quite eye-opening I bet well we're going to go on a journey today Sam through the seven chapters of your life's travel diaries we've already begun to uncover your childhood but we kick off with chapter one which is your earliest childhood travel memory what would that be?

10:16Sam Heughan: Ah well I guess when we think of travel you know we think of sort of glamorous locations like here in Australia or you know going abroad but But actually, for me, my earliest memories that I instantly thought about, and I had a few because we used to go up to the Western Isles a lot. My uncle used to live on the Isle of Egg. So we'd spend summers up there. However, I don't even know the Isle of Egg. I feel like I know a lot of the Isles. Can you tell me a little bit about it quickly? The Isle of Egg. I mean, it's next to Rum, Muck, Mull. Right. There's a lot of fantastic islands there. And it has one single track road.

10:54Sam Heughan: I believe it's a cooperatively owned island. So the islanders all own it. And my uncle used to live there. As children, we used to go there. And I just have memories of fishing for crabs and kayaking, which it's actually a really amazing place to kayak all along the West Coast. But yeah, very vague memories of that place, but very, very great memories of sort of the wilderness and the wild of it, you know, being on this remote island. But actually, the memory that the core memory that I really remember of travel would actually be going down to Hemel Hempstead to see my granddad, which is not very glamorous.

11:35Sam Heughan: A glamorous location. Yes, exactly. But yeah, I went down on my own as a child and I used to spend time with him. You know, I think for me, that was actually quite special because it was a great place for me and him to create this bond together. We would walk along the canals there. we would go fishing but the thing that i made him do more than anything was go to theme parks so we would go to chessington welded adventure or thorpe park and my poor granddad i've got photos of him you know being forced to go on these roller coasters and not enjoying a moment of it but um yeah i think there was something about that because he's from obviously the generation that went through the second world war and he used to play these cassette tapes of lagoon show or Hancock's Half Hour, these radio shows, which were, I know, something you sit down and listen to and they're very much in your head.

12:30Sam Heughan: But again, I think very informative in terms of acting. I think they sort of created this world that you couldn't see, but was there, all these great voices and great characters. So yeah, it was very instrumental, I think, in my informative years. You know, days out in London were a proper day trip you know it was quite an event to go to London and get on a double-decker bus you know and it was yeah really special but I guess I guess you know as I've got older I've been lucky you know I think travel for me has always been related to work but through work that's allowed me to see some some great locations.

13:11It's interesting that you mentioned And also how these kind of couple of locations were already at such a young age informing your kind of passion for acting. So, I mean, at what stage did you feel like that this was a path that you were interested in exploring? Was it a gradual thing or did you just always know?

13:32Sam Heughan: Well, I think travel is, and what's perhaps so wonderful about your podcast is that it's a great metaphor. And, you know, I think in travel, we reflect upon ourselves, but we also see other people, right? We see people from different cultures and religions, and it informs us. And I think, for me, yeah, I was always interested in theatre, I think, and acting, but I don't think I was particularly sort of confident in it or anything like that. I wasn't precocious, sort of getting up on stage and singing and dancing. It was for me something more about a self-reflective journey. And at the age of 18, I went on my own to America and I flew into San Francisco, actually.

14:18Sam Heughan: And I did this tour starting in San Francisco on buses from San Francisco down the West Coast, down to Texas and Mexico and then back up the East Coast. and it was kind of that journey that really instilled in me the thought that actually I want to go for this I want when I get back to the UK I'm gonna I'm gonna pursue this career in acting and it was probably some random traveler I met I think it was in Pensacola on the beach somewhere watching dolphins part of the trip and he asked me you know what do I want to do with my life and what I want a career would like to pursue and I think it was then I was like actually that's what I want to do oh isn't it nice when travel gives you that kind of like moment of clarity especially if you can pinpoint it that's so romantic yeah sitting on the Floridian beach looking out at the sea yeah well I remember actually landing in San Francisco and I had you know no idea where I was staying in a hostel I got up I had a cassette player I was listening to Otis Redding on the dock of the bay and I walked and then suddenly there it was the Golden Gate Bridge and I think I spent most of the day, like four or five, six hours sitting, listening to this one track.

15:32Sam Heughan: I don't know what was wrong with me, but I was just captivated. This beautiful bridge and the sun went down, you know, the sort of haze of San Francisco. It was stunning. And it's really incredible to then go back years later. I was there recently. So yeah, very full circle, but yeah, really the beginning, I guess, of sort of a wanderlust maybe. well yeah that moves us beautifully on to chapter two of your travel diary sam and that is the first place that you fell in love with out of all the places you've traveled where's a place that really captured your heart first well i guess i would have to say there right because um it was the gateway i guess in some ways to exploring and going on an adventure on my own and And I think that's very much part of the way I operate.

16:22Sam Heughan: I do love to sort of adventure. I love the outdoors. I love to take myself out of my comfort zone and go places. And I think traveling around the U.S., albeit not being in a very different culture, but it took me to some places I never thought I'd ever be. And, yeah, I think it really instilled in me a sense of adventure. and who knows what the next day's travel will take, where it will take you. That sense of wonder. I think so, yeah. And so I would say, probably to answer your question specifically, yeah, I think sitting next to that bridge, it was quite eye-opening for me. And I was living on a diet of$5 burritos.

17:03Sam Heughan: I'd never had Mexican food before and probably wasn't even that particularly Mexican. But yeah, now to look where that's taken me, you know, in terms of my spirits making, you know, I've spent a lot of time in Mexico. So, yeah, it's really nice to reflect on where it's all gone from and where it's all been spawned. And what was the catalyst for that trip? Because that's quite a big, you know, exciting adventure for someone from rural Scotland. Like, how did that all come about? Yeah, it's, you know, it cast my mind back. I was supposed to go study English and film studies in Aberdeen, which no offense to Aberdeen, but I don't, I'm not sure it would have been the place for me.

17:47Sam Heughan: But I took this time out. I had also traveled around Eastern Europe, sort of interrailing. That's the thing to do in those days with some friends, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia. and this was kind of continuation of that before I sort of I guess settled down to go to university and during as I said those travels I just saw a lot and thought this is this is where I want to go and actually my last stop was New York City I had perhaps$30 left in my pocket and I had no idea how I was going to get home back to the UK and I thought what do I do with this$30 instead of doing something sensible like calling my mom and or trying to work out how to get home I decided to go up the Empire State Building uh spend the last of my dollars and I went up there to catch the view and uh for some reason Val Kilmer was up there and I took a photo of him and I was like oh my god this famous actor up here um but I don't know again maybe perhaps a moment there was some sign and I went down back to the hostel I was staying and was like okay I now need to work out how to get home and there was a sign on my door written by a very good school friend of mine who had flown out to New York and tracked me down and we spent a week together in DC so I was very lucky to sort of I guess be rescued by my good friend but also in some sense be rescued by a fellow actor and I was very fortunate I applied for drama school my local drama school in Scotland and they were even though I'd missed some sort of window that for applications they allowed me to apply um I did a terrible job and didn't get in however again you know it gave me the impetus to like be like okay actually this is what I want and I'm going to reapply next year and try again and then the rest was history the rest is some long-winded history it takes me to the shores of Bondi Beach yes today's episode is brought to you in partnership with Airbnb there's always so much to organise before a trip.

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22:26Sam Heughan: about yourself ah well i think if anyone has watched my tv show outlander they will they will know how much scotland means to me i wish again it was some glamorous coastline somewhere on a beach with palm trees. But actually, Scotland does have many beaches with palm trees. This is true. Not very warm water. Very beautiful. But yes, I think I have to say Outlander and Scotland because I've been living in London and been to the US a lot. And finally, a big break, I suppose you could say, was that I came back to Scotland to shoot Outlander. And it made me fall in love all over with the country that I'd been born and brought up in and realized how wonderful it was.

23:14Sam Heughan: And when, you know, the fact that you can get in a car and drive to 45 minutes to a Munro, you know, one of the almost 300 peaks that we've got are over, what, a thousand, thousand meters? Is that right? Yes, a thousand meters. They, you know, they can be in the winter. They can be as, you know, as remote and challenging as, I don't know, anywhere in Europe. Incredible. You know, there's this great, I don't know, playground that Scotland is. There's so much to explore. So, yeah, I think Scotland for me has been a great place. And especially shooting the show, you know, we have so many amazing locations.

23:56Sam Heughan: We shot from Galloway, where I was born and brought up, to some great castles in Central Belt, all the way up to, you know, the Highlands, up to Aviemore, where you can go skiing in the winter, or Glencoe with the Bechail Etiv Moor, the Great Hertiman Mountains. So right there, it really is a very, very magical place. Such a cinematic landscape. Yeah, Scotland in general. Oh my God. from Edinburgh, which is, it's like walking back into Harry Potter, to probably where the stone circle is. It's not a real stone circle, but in Ranachmoor under Shehalion, which is where we film the circle that Claire goes through the stones to.

24:38I imagine that there are Outlander tours of Scotland that are going on, are there?

24:44Sam Heughan: I believe so. Yeah, there are a lot. Scotland has benefited a great deal by Outlander. I think probably more than they realize. But yes, they say something around 34 % of tourism. It has increased by, I mean, if you look at certain locations. Yeah. If you look at in Dune, the castle there, Castle Dune, they raised, their tourism went over 800 % or something like that. They fully financed their project to restore the castle and it's the same all over you know I think Scotland has so much to see but I think the problem it's got now is actually it's perhaps oversaturated in certain places the north coast 500 is quite famous route 500 miles all around the top of Scotland but in the summer we have these very small roads and it can get quite congested so yeah we've got some work to do in Scotland to to expand because there's so much of Scotland that hasn't been explored well I mean I was going to ask you when somebody is drinking one of your your spirits perhaps your whiskey what landscape would you like them to be picturing while they're sipping on it well that's a great question Holly because um yeah we call our whiskey the spirit of home because I think well I created it because I travel I do travel a lot and I wanted to create something that literally is you pick it up and smell it and taste it it takes you back to scotland it takes me back home and um our whiskey is the most awarded blended scotch whiskey uh in the multiple multiple um spirit awards blind tasting competitions that's epic congratulations thank you but i think it's i mean in some ways you know all these spirits from our wild scottish gin that we've created and new products we're making as well for me it's all just about bringing what i love about Scotland and sort of capturing it I guess in in an essence in a glass and our wild Scottish gin is made in New Galloway where I'm from all the botanicals are from there so it's essentially like terroir right we're talking about the same things that you talk about in wine tasting winemaking so it's it's really specific really creative and something quite organic and living which I enjoy because I think it's quite a creative process.

27:11So can you actually if you're a connoisseur of spirits can you like you're talking about the terroir can you kind of get a taste for the region in which it was produced in a way?

27:25Sam Heughan: I think 100 % I mean look there will be people who argue with you you could say the same for wine but I think that's absolutely true you know our gin you know we use crab apples from trees because as a kid i remember not being able to eat them because they were so sour to my mom growing rhubarb in the garden to lying in the heather to climbing the pine trees that we've used the pine essence for to even the water the water in scotland is very soft it's it's amazing water so yes i think it it is very specific and very specific about our region. And the same for the whiskey as well. I think, you know, if you look at Isla whiskeys, they talk about, you know, the, the sea mist coming in and the salt water, you know, impregnating some of the bottle, the barrels, but also it obviously comes from, you know, smoking the barley, but, but yeah, there's, there's definitely something in that.

28:25Sam Heughan: And I, I hope that people, when they drink it, it certainly transports them back to Scotland. Hmm. It's so nice that you have been able to connect with Scotland and so many different facets of your career, because of course, Outlander is a celebration of Scotland, this, um, the spirits as well, but then also waypoints, another kind of real moment of self-reflection, your solo walk on the West Highland way in Scotland. And I'd love to find out a little bit more about, about that and what you learned about yourself on that journey. thank you yes um so the west highland way is a 100 mile hike that goes from pretty much the outskirts of glasgow up through glencoe and then over luckily even into um fort william and you end up at the base of ben nevers our highest mountain in the uk and um yeah something i wanted to do it was you know a break in filming between seasons uh and i set out probably like most of my adventures kind of not really prepared just kind of thinking I'll do it and see what happens and very quickly was handed uh well I should say my handed my ass to me because um it was tough you know the weather was tough I was not prepared I didn't bring enough food with me and I brought too much equipment and it really was a moment of self-reflection because I was going to give up I hadn't really told anyone I was doing it I thought after day two you know miserable cold where I got lost somewhere along the shores of Loch Lomond.

29:58Sam Heughan: And there I met another hiker who sort of supported me and we talked our way. And I don't know, it gave me a new lease of life. And then once I dumped all my equipment, I carried on and had this really amazing journey, just sort of exploring the landscape of Scotland and seeing, I guess, the miles pass by. But I think the thing I realized was that I was trying to get to the end. I was trying to get to the destination. I was trying to give myself a timeline, a goal each day. And then as soon as I relaxed and was like, let's just enjoy the ride, it blossomed and became such a rewarding journey. And then I guess you can you can look outwards more rather than just straight ahead.

30:42Sam Heughan: Yeah, because I was I was exactly I was I was eyes down on the ground looking at my watch saying, God, I have another, you know, 15 miles to go today. and I've only got a few hours. And then the moment I sort of dumped all my equipment and got rid of the time pressure I put on myself, I was like, wow, look at all these great things. And I found, amongst other things, you know, mushrooms that were friends.

31:11Sam Heughan: I went on little expeditions. I took time to sit by a loch or, you know, climb an extra hill that I didn't need to do. And it just became a real adventure. And I met, as I said, several people along the way that became great characters in this journey. And yeah, by the time I reached, well, the top of Ben Nevis, should I say, because I did that on the last day, I had this really amazing reflective journey where I'd also had time to sort of think about, I guess, my life and my travel so far. And I guess we're all so busy, aren't we? And I think we rarely take time to reflect. And perhaps travel does that for us as well.

31:48Sam Heughan: it always gives us time to reflect and this was one of those moments yeah because I mean when you are thrust into a world of kind of fame and you know shooting and that that schedule that comes along with being in such a successful tv program it must feel like quite a luxury to have alone noontime in nature yeah yeah it does um and perhaps sounds I don't know selfish or um because we're very lucky you know we get to do what we love and we do get to travel the world and you know sit in business class and go somewhere fabulous and get looked after but but it is quite frenetic I think and there are rarely moments that you actually are alone I suppose and I think it's important for all of us to take moments isn't it and reflect to like where are we going where have we been where are we going and yeah I think nature for me is a huge part of what I like to do I created my own charity fitness program called My Pete Challenge and that's all about I guess creating healthy habits and a healthy lifestyle but also encouraging people to get outdoors.

33:00And so speaking of which then encouraging people to perhaps you know get outdoors in scotland that that walk that west highland way walk you mentioned you name checked so many you know iconic vistas places in scotland that people must see if they can in their lifetime is there a part of that long hike that you'd recommend something that's accessible for where they could really get a flavor of the beauty of of that part of scotland oh 100 because it can be

33:32Sam Heughan: broken down into days there's actually a great obviously great railway network and you can practically it practically follows the railway actually because the railway follows through the sort of valleys um snakes its way around so i mean i think actually the toughest part for me was loch lomond it was really difficult it's a very big loch it's the biggest in scotland and it's a lot of up and down and uh i wouldn't recommend that for me i would say um you want to it's called well there's a famous motorbike stop called the Green Welly and that's just before you get to Glencoe and I believe you can get the train up there and it's probably only 10 miles and then probably another 10 if you want to have a long day up to Glencoe and there you can stop and spend the night perhaps at the King House Hotel which is this lovely hotel right in the heart of Glencoe and there's the great mountains there and it's also a spot where we um we filmed Outlander we filmed um a couple of scenes there nearby so yeah it's a great place to end up but yeah the whole the whole route can be broken up into smaller sections so you can you don't all have to do it at once.

34:50Is Glencoe I've been to Glencoe and I'm just trying to remind myself is that where there are these beautiful little white houses kind of dotted around the odd white house kind of dotted in front of the mountains am i thinking of the right place

35:05Sam Heughan: yeah i think i think you're thinking that there's quite an iconic house um i think it's only one of them or there's a few around but that there is a very iconic house that everyone likes to take a photograph i don't know who owns it right now but um but yeah it is it is an amazing place but actually um there's also amazing places around there if you want to spend a couple of days There's a side road called, I think it's the Etip Road or the Loch Etip Road. And you go down there and that's where they filmed Skyfall, the James Bond movie. It's actually where we shot a lot of men in kilts as well.

35:36Sam Heughan: My travel show that I created about Scotland. And yeah, there's this single track road and you can find yourself amongst the Three Sisters Peaks. But there's so much to explore. It really is fantastic. And even if you get down to Balahulish and the village of Glencoe, there's so much to see there. It really is a sort of gateway to, I guess, the Highlands in some ways. Yeah, absolutely. And am I right in thinking this is the final season of Outlander to come? Yes, we have shot eight seasons. This season will be out. I don't think we've announced when yet. There's obviously the prequel show called Blood of My Blood, which is out this August.

36:19Sam Heughan: but the final season season eight I'm imagining will be next year some point and yeah 101 episodes have you shot that we have yes yes we finished in November and we finished November and it was an amazing journey yeah it was really incredible and then so to sort of mark the end of that I thought it was a good idea to go see Everest in real life yes yes oh wow so in November I well I jumped on a flight and flew out to Nepal and I made friends with an amazing mountaineer called Jake Norton who was one of the team that found George Mallory's body back in the 90s and he's an incredible encyclopedia of knowledge but also just a wonderful man and we did a route that hasn't been done before so we were the first hikers to do this trek for about two and a half weeks.

37:19Sam Heughan: We went up to the Ampalatza Pass through this sort of valley. We hiked up this peak and then had to abseil down into the Thumbu Valley and then a couple more days up to Everest Base Camp. But it really was an incredible way to sort of mark the end of Outlander and also to, I guess, challenge myself, but also hit a bucket list moment as well. That's incredible. So what was the kind of, like, how did that come about? Like, was it just that you wanted to just do something that was huge, like a momentous thing for you personally? Yeah, I mean, the longer story was I was supposed to do a movie about George Mallory.

38:01Sam Heughan: I was supposed to play George Finch, who was an Australian climber, who actually is the gentleman that, in a sense, he created the modern down jacket when he was also part of the expeditions in the 20s to go up Everest. He also helped innovate the oxygen system that we use now. But yeah, so I was supposed to do this movie and it sort of fell through with COVID and scheduling, but I'd always been obsessed with with Everest I think uh perhaps most young people are I don't know it's it's you know the highest point in the world and yeah of course also extremely dangerous so um yes so when that didn't happen I thought well I want to do this I became friends with Jake and we decided to to do this hike and he'd always wondered if we could do this hike it's somewhere he'd seen and thought can you go through this valley and we were very lucky yeah there was a team of us and we went up and yeah the first people to do it and it was amazing.

39:03Wow so it was a first talk like it's uncharted territory.

39:08Sam Heughan: I received a wonderful certificate some months later from the government there in Nepal and with my name on it and this extremely long name describing the trek itself but it was incredible you know just even to you know fly into kexam which was this village was about 8 000 feet up and we were lucky to spend a day there sort of acclimatizing and we got to go to a local wedding and meet the local rye which is the local tribe there um and then to spend time with these amazing porters you know on our journey up there and learn a little bit about their culture as well so it was yeah it was incredible and did you spend time on that walk kind of saying goodbye to to Jamie were you were you ready to were you ready to leave him behind at that point or you know were you reluctant to let him go yeah that's a good one well I I thought you know perhaps while I was filming at the time thinking oh this is going to be a great way to say goodbye and of course the reality of it was I was more concentrated on breathing and putting one step in front of the other and not freezing to death so i don't know if there was much much time thinking about jamie fraser i mean there was a lot of time to think it was fantastic but actually saying goodbye to jamie fraser has been a longer process it's weird i don't know it's it's you know spending 11 years in one very intense world playing a certain character um I feel like it's taking time and perhaps only now do I feel like uh you know he's uh I've put it to rest a little bit but um it certainly was part of the process yeah yeah I can't really imagine how it must feel when when somebody has become so intrinsically linked with with you and with your your career to then to then kind of to say goodbye it just must feel so overwhelming and so monumental on that last day of filming what was your kind of overriding emotion oh yeah I mean look I think you know many you know people in every walk of life go through breakups or changes in their situation and big life changes and I wouldn't equate this in that extreme but it but it is in some ways because um you know you're surrounded by a family you're surrounded by people that you see every single day um in you know quite in sort of high pressure moments um so you you get you become very close very quickly um so then for it to suddenly end it is kind of a bit of a you know a rift or um a moment that you have to get over so yeah I think we all knew it was coming so the months before you know some days it just felt like another day and other days you were like oh this is the last time I'll see that person and I'm sort of saying goodbye and there were a lot of goodbyes and it went over for a long time but the very last day myself and my co-star Katrina we had a scene that was very long and we had to shoot this and they invited all the crew from the building to come and watch the last take and there were about I don't know several hundred people watching which also adds pressure um but yeah it was very emotional I think Katrina I think it's fair to say you know I could I was watching her on her close-up and her you know lip was quivering uh the whole time couldn't control it and I think I shut down a bit I was just like I have to get through this and then obviously at the end it all kind of came out but um wonderful what an amazing journey to go on And it really, I'm very thankful.

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44:56so let's move on this out to the big one chapter four of everywhere you've been where holds the title of your all-time favorite destination oh yeah this is so hard and i think

45:10Sam Heughan: it'll always change for me it's a real toss-up it was a toss-up between hawaii which is incredible However, my winner would be Cape Town, South Africa. It is somewhere that I've been for work a few times. We shot Outlander there. I shot Bloodshot there, an action movie with Vin Diesel. And I also, earlier on in my career, shot a bunch of adverts for a Scottish beer company there. And it's just, over the years, been such an incredible place. the landscape the culture the people the food is incredible and I think the reason I like it is because it feels it's again on on the edge of sort of civilization or in terms of there's a wildness to it and I think from the ocean to the mountains to the wildlife yeah I enjoy that and that's perhaps why where I always seek you know places that feel like they are perhaps undiscovered or on the edge.

46:13So what would be your perfect day in Cape Town?

46:18Sam Heughan: Oh, perfect day in Cape Town. Wake up and go get some coffee because the coffee there is amazing. There was a place called Deluxe Coffee I used to go to. Great coffee. Then walk up Lion's Head, which is this small peak, I suppose, which requires a little bit of scrambling, but not really the sort of chains set up into the the the cliffs there um there's lots of wildlife that runs around these little gopher things that run about um get up there and from there you can see you know almost 270 degrees of you know incredible coastline table mountain is right behind you uh in the evening table mountain there is the i guess the temperature changes The clouds condense and form above the mountain and then they roll down the mountain like a waterfall.

47:11Sam Heughan: It's insane. It's insane. I would go for dinner. The food there is incredible. They have amazing sushi. Mr. Willoughby's perhaps is a sushi place or some steak place or a braai. And yeah, that would be a wonderful place to spend a day. That sounds absolutely epic. I love the recommendation. and do you like the wine country there as well i'm thinking with your oh yeah yeah of course you've got to go out to well go out to franschuk and stellenbosch and franschuk has some amazing places to eat um there's a place i think it's called chef's table or something that's one of the best meals i've ever had and then the vineyards in stellenbosch um stay over babel and storin would be my go-to they do an incredible rosé but they have a garden you can walk through and everything is picked from the garden and then served at dinner.

48:04Sam Heughan: You stay in these beautiful little cottages. Yeah, it's really quite incredible. Or even go down to the Cape, the tip there, and you can see the two oceans colliding. Yeah, really special. Oh, absolutely gorgeous. Have you been to Babylon Soren's UK outpost in Somerset, the Neat? No, I haven't. Now you're telling me. Sam you've got to go it's absolutely amazing it's absolutely full of all of their beautiful wines but it's this amazing country house in Britain in Somerset and it has a fantastic spa the architecture of which is absolutely incredible they produce their own cider there they've got this huge cider press you can do a cider press tour and all this lovely natural produce um and it's yes it's sister hotel of um babylon sorens so yeah i've got to add that one to your list that will be up there on my list i've just written it down so yeah i'll see you there yeah absolutely uh well chapter five sam is your hidden gem you've already shared some fantastic hidden gems with us with us but is there a place maybe somewhere unexpected off the tourist trail that's really stayed with you the other day i walked i got up and i went for a walk along the cliffs here from uh from North Bondi to Bronte Beach and on the way there's a beach which is very hard to say it's Tamarama Beach I always think of the Tim Tams which are very popular here it's chocolate biscuit and I got there it's a beautiful little beach there's people surfing of course and there's a coffee shop does great breakfast and of course you know avocado and toast and eggs and got myself a coffee and I sat down and had these bean bags on the beach I thought this is perfect and this little Scottish terrier ran up to me with his name on his on his collar and he was called Max and I thought wow we've made I've made friends with another Scot and as I was sitting with Max sipping my coffee um wiping uh you know crushed avocado from my lips um I saw a bunch of humpback whales reaching and jumping out the water and I thought it can't really get more magical than this and I looked around and I was like no one's seeing this but me and Max so yeah for now that's my my special spot but I'm sure I'll find one.

50:32Sam Heughan: That is such a beautiful beautiful sight the wildlife in that part of the world that you could just come across just getting your morning breakfast is just otherworldly. Well you're right you're right but then you know I was walking from the beach up this beautiful sort of steps because it's obviously a layer. It's quite high going back up to the main road and you go through this little bit of forest and there's beautiful ferns and tropical trees or subtropical and whatever. And then this big, and there's, you know, wild cockatoos flying around and, you know, it's quite magical. And then I heard something in the tree above me sort of crack and I suddenly, instant thought was like boa constrictor or some sort of snake and I'm like I'm getting out of here um so yeah I think there's a lot of animals here that probably you know would rather eat you than welcome you like Max but um yeah no it is it's very special that's why I've not been to Australia Sam I'm arachnophobic and I am just so frightened of what might what might be lurking in the trees even though everything I've heard about Australia just sounds so incredibly magical yeah Have you seen anything horrifying in the trees?

51:43Sam Heughan: No, well, no, I haven't. And I'm also not a big spider fan. But if I'm totally honest, I've seen bigger spiders in Scotland, which are terrifying. And I know they're probably not like poisonous or anything, but they are massive, like bigger than your hand. And they will walk across your living room as you're watching television and stop and stare at you and say, what's your problem, pal? so maybe I'll go up against the Aussie spiders or grey wet sharks I'm just imagining you in the grounds of an old castle with this like hand-sized spider wandering in front of you terrifying terrifying I was very lucky I my travel show I met in kilts we went to New Zealand and did a lot of very fun stuff you know from possibly the exploring the culture there from the Maori to the food and the drink and and obviously the wildlife and one of the things we got to do was dive shark with sharks in a cage great whites and that was ultimately terrifying but also really really special but um yeah I would rather do that and face a spider with the size of my hand.

52:52Me too to be honest what was that like because I was going to come on to Men in Kilts next so going going down in into well first of all why did you want to do that what was like the motivation for that the the shark dive and what what was it like yeah was it as what was it as a much of an adrenaline rush as you expected or or because i've i had steve backshaw um on on the podcast quite recently and he made a series about sharks and his real you know raison d 'etre was that we you know they are animals that shouldn't be so feared um and that well but but I guess these were great whites weren't they so slightly different how did you feel about it yeah I I

53:39Sam Heughan: look New Zealand's an incredible place and there's so much to explore and we barely scratched the surface but for me you know I do have a fear of of them and I think it's a healthy fear I just know that, yeah, for them, we're not prey. We are just something inquisitive. But unfortunately, they'd like to bite things to see what they're like. I met a man called Taylor who studies great white sharks, actually out of California. And he took me out tagging great white sharks off the coast of Santa Cruz. and within two minutes there were seven great whites circling us and he tagged one with a sort of clip on its dorsal and it was literally like something out of the movie jaws it swam off it turned around you could see it it swam back it came out the water and started biting the engine the outdoor motor oh my god punching it politely on the nose and um and then he was actually punching it yes yes yes yes and um and at this moment i haven't let go of whatever i'm holding on to very tightly and then everything disappeared because we had these sort of sonar tags and it suddenly went quiet and i was like where have they gone and taylor said to me there's a big one and no sooner had he said those words then i looked out and i saw this wave coming towards us and it was coming off of this let's say 14 to 16 foot great wide it was bigger than our boat for sure and when they stopped going long they grow wide it was enormous and it glided under our boat and disappeared I never saw it again but it was quite incredible and yes it made me question whether I should go swimming uh ever again actually I did go surfing that day with Taylor because I thought if anyone I'm going to go surfing with it's going to be the shark guy.

55:37But actually on the same day we saw orcas,

55:41Sam Heughan: we saw pods of whales, we caught crab. So wait, this is Santa Cruz, California, right? Sorry, yes, California. Yes, totally segue there. But yes, I was just on my shark stories. But yes, going back to New Zealand, yeah, I wanted to face my fear. And actually being under the water with them, you can see how incredibly intelligent they are. they knew exactly where we were looking and what we were doing and um you know they are mighty mighty predators but um also utterly beautiful and very very important for marine life and we should we should preserve them but um yeah i'm gonna stay in the cage well our penultimate chapter is your worst travel experience sam or the place that you never go back to i mean we've kind of had a bit of a hairy story just now with with with the great whites okay so i at the time i vowed i would never go back and in fact so i decided i had a small window of opportunity and i thought going to bali was the thing to do and i flew to bali and um you know it's a long way from the uk and got there and um staying in changu which is um sort of the main um tourist part in this lovely villa, outdoor villa with a pool.

56:58Sam Heughan: And I was eaten alive by mosquitoes for three days and nights in a row. I didn't sleep a wink, literally a wink. I was covered in mosquito bites. And on the third night at sort of, you know, two, three in the morning with jet lag and everything, I was I'd had enough. And I was like, I'm going back to the UK. I hate it here. I hate these mosquitoes. So I changed my flights to go back to the UK, but I still had a couple of days left. It was then I thought, oh, wait, why don't I go somewhere else? So I got on my moped and I drove up to the jungle in a bud and had the most incredible, incredible experience there.

57:37Sam Heughan: I got to do some woodwork with a local artist there. I did, you know, of course, the yoga and the rice fields. And it was really exceptional. The people there were so lovely and welcoming. and I realized what a mistake I'd made by changing my flights but the mosquitoes they they got me the first three days but so I would go back but at the time I was with some more repellent with some more repellent or or a mosquito stroke midgy net yes I suggest everyone has whether going to Bali or Scotland yeah yeah this is true actually do you have midges where where you grew up oh yes I I I mean, as a child, I remember watching clouds of them come out in the rose bushes as the sun was setting.

58:22Sam Heughan: Midges are the bane of my existence. They are like mosquitoes. They go for certain people and not others. And for me, they love me for some reason. You're tasty. I'm tasty too. You're tasty as well. Well, when you're wearing a wig and you're shooting outdoors and the midges are out, they get under your wig and they just live there because it's quite warm and maybe a little moist. when you're doing a scene and you can't move or itch or you have to just keep talking but actually your head is on fire um it's it's very it's very challenging oh my god i could now i'm itching i can only imagine acting i guess at that thing when it's such a high stakes you can't you know you've you've got to get that take it must be almost like an act of meditation like you can't pick your nose or scratch your back or whatever your wife is about to be killed or you know imprisoned by your enemy and you're trying to stare them down but all you're thinking is god damn these bloody midges oh dear oh sam it has been so fun chatting to you thank you so much for sharing your travel diaries with us we are on to chapter seven your final chapter and that is the destination that is at the top of your travel bucket list where is left for you to discover that you'd love to go oh I was thinking about this one and it's a really difficult one and I've said I've spent a lot of time in Mexico um and I love it there and I want to go back um and obviously I was in Nepal recently so I think between the two I'm gonna have to say Nepal but it's a it's a trip that I've been planning with my friend Jake, but also a couple of other friends of mine.

1:00:04Sam Heughan: I'm a keen motorcycle cyclist. And I don't know if you've seen, you know, Ewan McGregor's shows, The Long Way Round, where he drives around motorbikes. And I think that's something I want to do. So next year, I'm planning a trip. And we're going to fly to possibly India, because I've never been. And I know it's gonna be challenging place for me. And we're going to get some motorbikes and we're going to drive through india through darjeeling up to nepal along the himalayan plateau and perhaps hopefully make it as far as camandoo so that's my next bucket list because i think um for me yeah india is a big one um obviously it's a huge country and i want to see a part of it but um not only do they have great motorbikes but they also like good whiskey so yeah yeah that's a lot of best of both have a listen to the hairy bikers episode of the travel diaries where they talk about going through india it's it's a good one although just ignore the part where they get the stomach bug because you know say that sometimes that happens wherever you are in the world feel that's gonna happen exactly it'll happen anywhere and um just got to be careful but it sounds like an epic route what what and and so exciting to see that northern part of India as well with the mountains exactly I've always been interested by that I mean obviously you know I'd love to go back to the south and go and stuff but um this one I feel like something we can do over perhaps two weeks and um I'm not sure if all of us will make it um we might lose some on the way but um it's going to be great and to do it with friends and again I think you know having finished Outlander now I'm more available to to do these kind of trips to to take a bit more time to myself so yeah it'll be really special oh I can't wait to hear more about it thank you so much Sam those were your travel diaries it has been such a pleasure thank you so much thank you Holly oh what a lovely way to kick off the new season a huge thank you to Sam for finding the time while over there in Australia to chat and you know I think we only just scratched the surface of his travels I really must read Waypoints his memoir because that walk through the highlands just sounds incredible one of the most beautiful parts of the world and Sam has a new book coming out in September which is available for pre-order now it's called The Cocktail Diaries and no doubt if he's making the cocktails he's using some of his hugely accoladed spirits to the Sassanac spirits so do go and give those a try as well you can find more information about that online.

1:02:45Thanks so much for listening today. If you'd like a reminder of any of the destinations that we chat about on any of the episodes, just open up the episode show notes on your podcast app and there's a destination recap list in there. Or you can visit my website, thetraveldiariespodcast.com. If you'd like to find out who is joining me on next week's episode, come and follow me on Instagram. I'm at hollyrubenstein and I'm also on TikTok at hollyrubenstein2. If you can't wait or then remember there's the first 14 seasons to catch up on. That's about 155 episodes to keep you busy. If you enjoyed today's episode and you fancy leaving a little rating or review on your podcast app, that would be fantastic.

1:03:26It helps other people to discover the podcast. In the meantime, wishing you guys all safe travels, a wonderful week, and I'll be back on Tuesday.

1:03:53Today's episode is brought to you in partnership with Airbnb. As you guys all know, I spend a lot of time traveling and we've listed our home on Airbnb in the past while we've been away. One particularly memorable time was when we set off on a seven-week road trip across the US. We lived in central London at the time and our flat would otherwise have been sitting empty for all that time. So we listed it on Airbnb during the trip. That journey became even more special because it was also when my husband and I decided to get married on a beach in Santa Barbara and we used some of the extra money from hosting on Airbnb to help pay for some really personal touches for the wedding like the flowers from the market that morning and a local photographer who we booked last minute.

1:04:33So in a small but very real way, hosting became part of one of the most memorable trips of our lives. It wasn't about becoming a full-time host. It was simply a practical way to make use of our home while we weren't there. If you have a trip coming up, it might be worth exploring whether listing your space on Airbnb could work for you too. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at airbnb.co.uk forward slash host. Thank you to Airbnb.

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