Sunderland Shock Newcastle & Should Enzo Maresca Watch Out?

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1:06Discover the V-Series lineup at cadillac.com. Oh, I was really surprised because I think Sutherland were in every department so much better than them. City are looking dangerous again and that could disturb Arsenal, I think, later on in the season. It was very premeditated. Board and the owners of Chelsea will know that it aimed at them. Wayne, do you play football manager? No, I used to. I used to play when I was a few years old. I used to always get Scott Sellers on a free every year. So yeah, I used to play, I don't play anymore. Yeah, because I was asking, because I used to see Jose on that Amazon documentary.

1:47He had it on his laptop. That's why I thought... Yeah, no, I think he's probably promoted a little bit. I think he does that in return. they've got about 2 ,000 scouts so I think he has access to use their scouts for whatever team he goes to because for the game, all the research they need to obviously have some good scouts on him. We've done something similar with DC United as well. Kay, are you plotting a potential career in management? Are you thinking of starting up? I don't think anywhere will take me after some of my opinions on it. I'd tip Crystal Palace to possibly win the league at the start of the season, so here we are.

2:26Oh, wow. Yeah, there we go. But anyway, they didn't have a good time today either, amongst others. No, they didn't, did they? Manchester City, Erling Haaland, Phil Foden doing it again. Let's talk about the football from the weekend. By the way, did you guys, Wayne, did you watch the Sunderland-Newcastle game, the derby? How good was it? Yeah, do you know what? I loved it. I think just the energy, the passion, the atmosphere. It's one of them games, which I haven't watched many over the last few years, where it's You know, you wish you were there. The atmosphere seemed great. I loved Sutherland doing the pitch at the end as well.

3:03Obviously, getting Newcastle back when they'd done it. But no, I thought Sutherland were really good. I thought Newcastle were poor. I don't know whether it was tactically, which I haven't seen them do much this season where they sat deep in and let Sutherland come onto them, which I probably assume it was with the selection of Langer and Anthony Gordon. But no, it was a great game. and Sunderland I felt deserved to win. It's the kind of rivalries that make English football it is, isn't it? Yeah, exactly. We've missed them games and, you know, you have big derbies throughout the country and that's definitely up there with the passion from both set of fans.

3:42So we've missed them games and just happy it's back. I love seeing like Sunderland versus Newcastle in the Premier League. That needs to be a fixture that happens every year. That's why I want both teams to stay up all the time because it's like... Well, it looks like they will, doesn't it? Yeah. I was one who feared for something, if I'm honest, at the start of the season. Obviously, I played against them last season, but I think the signings they've made, and I weren't familiar with quite a few of them, and they've come in, they've been excellent. The energy they're playing with, the quality as well.

4:14And Xhaka, it looks like he's the one who's putting all that together and the leader in there. So I think from the owner, he's quite young, and the manager. It's been very detailed what they've done and it's paying off for them. Micah, Richard said on TV that potentially Xhaka was the signing of the season so far. Do you agree, Wayne? Yeah, he has to be. Obviously, I've always known he's been a good player, played against him and he went out to Leverkusen after Arsenal and done really well. And then when he signed, you're wondering, you know, is he coming back to England? Because he's never been the quickest.

4:50so I don't think that would affect him but I thought going into someone who potentially would struggle it wouldn't be a good signing but he's been incredible and not just his leadership but what I love today and throughout the season is his passes through the lines and getting the attacking players on the ball and his calmness and his ability to dictate the play and slow the game down when it needs to be or speed it up so So for me, he's definitely been the sign of the season, for sure. I'll tell you what, let's bring in a couple of fans who I'm sure are feeling very contrasting emotions this evening.

5:28Chris Wins, Sunderland fan, one of the hosts of the Hawaii, the podcast, and Lee Lawler, thank you for actually coming on, despite your team losing. From Newcastle Fans TV, Chris Lee, welcome along to the Wayne Rooney Show. Chris, I'll come to you first. You've just been listening in to what Wayne, Kay and I had to say about it. I imagine you echo all of that. Just how good was it? I mean, well, for a start, I appreciate your pronunciation of how here. That wasn't bad for a start. But no, I mean, it's one of them where it's just you almost don't know what to say because of everything around it, because of how much it means.

6:04And you would think, you know, going 10 unbeaten, we'd get used to it. But no, we're not. You know, every time we get a result against them, it just means everything. And this one just feels hugely symbolic. you know that if you just go was it three and a half years ago we beat Wickham in the League One playoff to just over two years ago Newcastle swatted us aside in the FA Cup and we've had to come from that place where basically we were almost a laughingstock across football not just in the North East and we've come from that place and we've come back where all week the discussion has been that the two sides are so evenly matched and I think Wayne touched on it that during the game, I think we just bossed them.

6:48This is symbolic. We've played them in playoff semifinals in the past. We've played them in FA Cup quarterfinals in the past. But this is just a symbol of how far we've come and that we're here to stay and that it feels like there's a good era on the horizon for us. Yeah, no, I agree. I completely agree. And I think if you go back to the playoff final, Sunderland were in a bad run of form, really. They weren't playing great towards the end of last season. and Sheffield United dominated the final really so they were actually quite lucky to win the final but then since then, I remember I watched the game and I was in my car driving and I remember the fans phoning in saying oh, let's just enjoy today because we'll be straight back down but then all of a sudden the signings which they made I didn't know, to be honest, I didn't know a few of them but it just clicked and the manager has been I think with the manager, he brings a calmness to it Because obviously with the atmosphere and the emotion around Sunderland, I think he brings a real calmness to it.

7:49And I met him after we played last season and he's a really nice fella. And some managers you meet after the game and you don't always think that, but he's a very nice fella and dead humble and respectful. And so I'm really pleased at what he's doing. And obviously having that derby back, I think is massive, massive for the Premier League. Before we dive a little bit more into Sunderland and what's been so brilliant, I'm very conscious that you probably don't really want to sit here and hear people waxing lyrical anymore about Sunderland, but I was keen to get your perspective. You're shaking your head.

8:18Just what went wrong for Newcastle today? Yeah, I think a lot went wrong. I mean, I came out the ground. I felt embarrassed to be a Newcastle fan. That's why I don't have my Newcastle top on, because I feel hurt at the same time. And it's been a while since we've felt like that. I've come out of the ground. I go all the home and away days. I just came out and thought, nah, get me out of here. and obviously we couldn't get out because the police were like rooting us out a certain way. It was like, get me out of here, get me out of here, because obviously they're taunting women, you know, the police are holding them back and what have you.

8:47And look, it's good for the North East, don't get me wrong. It is great that Sunderland are back because, let's face it, we've laughed at them down the years and playing the likes of Grims being accurate and standing for years upon years. But now that they are in the Premier League, look, it does hurt. And I just don't feel that Newcastle had the heart of the day. If we played Sunderland over ability, Newcastle would win every day of the week. And that's not very now-like, is it? Eddie Howe's teams normally have heart. He normally taps into the emotions. So did that surprise you a bit? Massively.

9:16I mean, even in the first half, suddenly they were crunching. They were literally just like slap-bang in the middle of the players. And I was thinking, where's Newcastle from that? And realistically, it didn't take until this 87th, 88th minute when Fabian Shea and Bruno Gormier was wanting to start scrapping with people. It's like, well, where's that 10 minutes into the game? Where's the heart? Where's the passion for it? I think, sorry, just to jump in there, sorry. I think I listened to Eddie Al yesterday talking and he was saying he was having to explain to some players about the history of this fixture and the passion of this fixture.

9:50I don't know whether he's, you know, he's known that someone were going to come with that and whether he said, listen, let them come with it, but we have to stay composed to win the game. And he's given that message, let's keep our composure because that Newcastle performance, Newcastle being brilliant over the last few years and that performance was unrecognisable to what you've seen with Newcastle throughout the last few years so I was really surprised I think both tactically and physically at Newcastle today because I think Sutherland were in every department so much better than them I have to agree I think our wingers Alanga has just not set the world to light he was shocking he was appalling Anthony Gordon on the left side he'll do well to get on the England side come next summer because his form this season has also been poor.

10:39Valdemar, I mean, he scores at the wrong end. It's an absolute world of a known goal, which we can joke on about, but he didn't have any service the day, and I know Eddie Howe tried to change it, and Eddie Howe has been criticised that his in-game tactics are not quite at that elite level, and you're just waiting for something to change, and yes, we had a little bit of a spur when he made that triple sub in that second half, but we didn't create enough to warrant to even score a goal, and I cannot sit here and say, defend Newcastle, I cannot, because Sunderland deserved the three points today, and that hurts me saying that.

11:08Of course, it is being a Geordie and a Toon fan, but I have to be realistic and say fair play to Sunderland. Does it worry you for the rest of the season, that performance? Yes and no. It's like the previous four games were picked up 10 points in the last four games, so we started to show a little bit of form, and then bang, this happens. That's been our season all season. We need to bounce back, and the only way to do it is, luckily we've got a game in midweek against Fulham in the Cup that might soften the blow a little bit if we get through and then we're in the semi-finals then we've got a couple of tough pictures after that like Chelsea in the league and Man Utd away so we've got to start picking up some points really really fast because yes I know the Premier League table is tight but we've got to get another run if Newcastle want to be in the Champions League we could lose another star player next summer I don't think Newcastle were as bad I mean if it wasn't for that own goal it could have easily stayed 0-0.

12:01They just didn't have any clinical, they weren't very clinical. It never felt like they were going to score watching it. Did you not feel like that? That's how I felt watching it. I felt like that. It felt like they didn't want to score because they set up from the very off, as soon as kickoff was taken, they went 4-5-1 and they sat inside their own half and just allowed us to come on. Every time Newcastle got the ball, they just didn't seem to even want to try and create. They didn't want to seem to keep the ball. It was almost kind of safety first. And they set out almost to say, right, well, let's keep it nil-nil and get the point and get out of here and move on to the cup game.

12:35And Wayne talked about the emotion. It was interesting to hear Xhaka standing next to Dan Ballard after the game with the interview. And he pointed at him and said, Dan Ballard and a few others who were around for that cup game, talk to us all about the emotion about that game and how much that hurt. And I think they tapped into that. and the manager got them to tell them to say, this is how much it means when you're on the wrong side of it. Make sure this time you're on the right side of it. But like I said, I was so surprised about how Eddie Howe set up, but you've got to then say, well, okay, well, Newcastle set out to do that.

13:08But as Lee said, we were on top of them. At some point, they would have probably wanted to come out and take control of the game, but I just don't think we allowed it. I thought your fullbacks handled, as I say, a langer and Gordon brilliantly. absolutely fantastic because those two were just no product at all at all and also we didn't have anyone breaking through into the box to support Valde Mara to create chances just it was awful It was nice to hear Wayne at the beginning when you first started speaking and you said oh it was brilliant it was a fantastic game because in truth technically it was an awful game I was going to I was going to jump in at that point and just say the first half wasn't great was it?

13:49Like the second half was better from a neutral point of view. You could feel the anticipation. You could feel how tense it was. And that's why I enjoyed it. And you could feel the atmosphere come through the TV and the speakers. And that's why I enjoyed it. And listen, we could sit here and say, you know, you watch Man City or Arsenal and moving the ball from side to side and a lot of good play. But just, it was different. It felt like a bit more, I might be shown getting a little bit older now but it felt like a game from the 90s where the quality weren't as high as we see today but you knew that the passion was there and that fight and drive was there so that's why I enjoyed it not so much for the quality It's always it's nice seeing games like that again where somebody puts in a tackle and stuff and just shows you the temperature of the game There wasn't that many from Newcastle actually I think Tenali was the first one to get booked in.

14:48He's shaking his head again. That's what it is. Take me out of court. Tenali got booked in the second half and that was the first one. And I was sat there before the game because I've been looking forward to this game all weekend. And I was speaking to Michael Carrick yesterday and his wife, Lisa, over it. And the excitement from everyone connected with obviously Newcastle and whatever. So he's been looking forward to the game all weekend. And I was thinking there's definitely going to be a red card today. It's almost what you want though, isn't it? Yeah, and then it didn't obviously erupt. It didn't have to for Sunderland, but it didn't erupt till the last minute when the game was really gone for Newcastle.

15:27I think the best example was the Michaela challenge with Dan Byrne, where Dan Byrne ended up having to go off injured, but it was full-blooded. And those two were two players who knew what it meant to go in for a challenge like that and win the ball or just to get the best of it. But you saw Michaela, he almost knew he wasn't going to get the ball, but still went in for the challenge and knew he was going to get there late but he still knew that if he left one on him it meant something. Wayne, I wanted to ask you a little bit more about Sunderland and in particular what the manager has done there.

15:57Did you manage against him at all? Well, that was my only wins, I think. We played last season and it was a good game actually. We won late on 3-2 but it's a different squad, different group of players and different minds. Last year, they were very... If you look at the game today, they were in control of possession and a lot more quality on the pitch than they had last season, where last season it was very much counter-attack. A bit of what Newcastle's done today is how Son Lund were playing last season. So, yeah, he's bought... I think to go in, and I think his previous job, he was an analysis coach, I think, and he's gone into management and obviously got Sunderland promoted, which is incredible from where Sunderland were to then go and do what he's doing in the Premier Leagues.

16:53I think, you know, if you're choosing manager this season right now, I think he's got to be up there. I'd probably choose him over any other manager at the minute. Can I just quickly say that game, he won his first four off the bounce when he first came in in the Championship and Wayne was the first manager to win a league game against Regis Labyrinth. It went off on me once all day. That's why I remember it so much. I didn't realise that as I was asking the question and your face started to go and I was like, oh no, don't tell me you had a really bad result against them that I didn't know. Take the leash off your laptop with the processor that gives you long battery life.

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18:02Brilliant season so far for Sunderland. What can Sunderland achieve this season, Chris? Because I imagine, let's be honest, you must have come into the Premier League and just wanted to stay up. You know, we're on a bit of a magic carpet ride this season because after that final whistle went to Sheffield United, we didn't know what would happen because we were already behind in terms of the transfers, in terms of the transfer window, because every team who goes up via the playoffs is always kind of playing catch up. and the transfer of Enzo Lafayette was a bit of a clue into what was going to happen into the transfer window, but everybody knew that Joe Bellingham was going to leave, which we thought was going to be a blow, and he went for 30, 40 million.

18:43So we knew we were going to lose players, but the recruitment has just been incredible. You talked about Xhaka and we've put legs around him. We've put Siddiqui, who I wouldn't be surprised in the next 18 months or something he moves. Keepers being brilliant as well. Keeper's fantastic. But the beauty of it was that we looked around Europe and we took the gamble a year earlier than the big clubs would. So the likes of Siddiqui in Belgium, Rufus in Holland, and I'm trying to think, Diara in France. So players like that who'd had one breakout season and the big clubs were sniffing around them thinking, well, okay, we'll give them another season to make sure they can prove it.

19:23we just said there's the money how much do you want we probably overpaid in some cases in terms of um what they may be really worth in the market and then we we put jacker right in the middle of those 20 21 year olds in midfield and just said we'll put the legs around you you do the tell them where to go tell them where you want them you stand there you get in position right going back to the original question where can we go we're just enjoying it we're just enjoying it and And, you know, talking about getting passports out and things like that and dreaming of European qualification, you know, if that happens, then that would be a level above anything that we even imagined last summer.

20:00But whatever happens, happens. The challenge is going to come now, isn't it, when you lose the players. And so that's why I think it's really important that you just picked up the points that you have because the next four to six weeks, I think, will be a real challenge for Sunderland. So if I was a Sunderland fan, I'd just be thinking, let's just stay in the division that's the that's that was I'm sure that was the target before the season or it will have been and if they do that I think it's a massive achievement because we've seen over the years last few years the amount of teams who come up and then go stay back down so I think that'll be the target I'm sure for the owners and the manager at the minute Chris thank you so much for your audience Lee as well especially to you because it's easy to come on and speak when your team's won but I imagine you just want to go to bed and forget it ever happened I just want to get Wednesday to come up now and forget about it.

20:49Hopefully beat Fulham and then soften the blow a little bit. Well, thank you so much for coming on, both of you. And the best of luck for the rest of the season. Already looking forward to the next derby. Thanks a lot. Thank you. Well, you already mentioned it. Not a great day for Crystal Palace. Manchester City winning away there to cut Arsenal's lead to two points at the top of the Premier League. 3-0, Man City 1. Aston Villa a further point behind them. They beat West Ham 3-2 at the London Stadium. Wayne, you've said all season that you think Arsenal can do it, they need to do it or they need to win something this season.

21:21What are you feeling like now? It feels like the last week or so there's been a bit of a shift. Yeah, well, I mentioned a few weeks back actually I think Arsenal are still favourites to win the league. It's going to be really interesting if City are doing what they're doing and they stay close to them or even take over them. Because then the memories of them Arsenal players and of Mikel Arteta of having the lead before and City or Liverpool at the time as well coming to snatch you off them will come flooding back. So it's going to be insane. I think Arsenal are still favourites but City are looking good.

21:59I think... City in January, Wayne, though, man. City in January, they turn it on and it's scary. Muscle memory, isn't it? Yeah, exactly. And it looks like, like you just said, Kelly, yeah, muscle memory. It's like they know that they start slow and they know once they get into January and they know how to get the results and to grind it out. And you're looking at somebody like Haaland. I was looking at a stat today. He's got 16 appearances, 17 goals, three assists. Those are crazy numbers, man. Like, if he stays on form like that, I can see City just taking it again. Yeah, no. I still think Arsenal with the squad, I think that for me, they're still a favourite sport.

22:40City are looking dangerous again and looking good again. and not that they haven't looked good, but I think that could really, that could disturb Arsenal, I think, later on in the season. I hope it doesn't because I'd love to see Arsenal win it over City, but that would be my concern if I was an Arsenal fan. Do you think the Arsenal players are thinking about the pass and when they have let it slip and that can seep into the squad as well? Yeah, they'd have to. They'd be crazy not to and I don't even think they'd want to, but I think that will just pop up. And if you're seeing Haaland score all the time and City winning games and picking up results, that pressure becomes even more of trying to win that first Premier League title for, what is it, 20 odd years?

23:26Marseille haven't won the Premier League title, so that pressure becomes even greater and Man City just sitting there behind them will create an enormous amount of pressure for their Marseille players, especially if we're in this situation with five games to go, six games to go where Arsenal 3.4 Man City then happy worry for Arsenal Word on Villa at West Ham what a game I really enjoy watching Aston Villa at the moment not only are they in ridiculous form but they just always seem to give themselves a mountain to climb I imagine as a fan it's an absolute nightmare but for neutrals it's pretty good isn't it and it also shows even when they go behind they're managing to win it's a pretty good trade no?

24:04Yeah I mean it just goes to show Unai Emery and what a fantastic job he's doing as well I mean, at the start of the season, they had a few games where I think it was the first four games were absolutely horrible for them. But ever since then, they've had such an upturn in form and they look amazing. And that goal from Morgan Rodgers today, I think it was a third. It was absolutely insane. What a banger that was. I really enjoy watching them at times. And I honestly think that they could push for a Champions League position properly this time. They only missed out on the last day of the season, last season.

24:41And I definitely think that they could be one to watch out for. Were they in the title race, Wayne? No. I didn't even finish my sentence. No, if we're realistic, Aston Villa, I think what, as Kay said, what the manager's doing is incredible. I think you've got to credit the players as well, because in the summer they were losing, they lost a couple of players and didn't resign, obviously, with the likes of Rashford and who else was there on loan? There was another one on loan and he didn't resign and the fans weren't happy. And then he started, I think the first four games didn't score a goal in the first four games and they were down there at the bottom of the table and the players have really helped turn that round.

25:26And I think, you know, Henry's management of Europe and the Premier League has been really good because he has rest of players in Europe as well where they're doing well also. He's rested players and kept players fresh for the league games as well and it's paying off and he knows better than anyone how to do that especially in the Europa League with managing your squad I think he's won in Europe four or five times I think so but in terms of a title race then you know there's no chance they're going to get above Manchester or Arsenal. Do you think if Unai Emery had stayed at Arsenal and got the same back in Arteta had he'd have won the league by now no I think there's different factors as well because he was the first one after Arsene Wenger to go in and same with David Moyes going in after Alex Ferguson so that's a huge pressure in itself and so yeah so I think that was a difficult difficult one but I don't think that Arsenal job is a true reflection on him as a manager and what we've seen and he in my opinion he's probably the second best manager after Guardiola in what he's doing in the Premier League.