Why the UK won’t retaliate to Trump tariffs over Greenland – The Latest

0:00This is The Guardian.

0:12These kind of tariffs are potentially economy crippling. So it would have set off a wave of panic inside Number 10. The use of tariffs against allies is completely wrong. It is not the right way to resolve differences within an alliance. It's almost easiest to understand Trump as a mafia boss. You know, there's this idea he deals in deals. He doesn't, he deals in threats. If you thought the days of trade war threats were over, sadly you were wrong. Donald Trump is yet again threatening tariffs. So is the UK's more diplomatic approach going to work? From the Guardians today in Focus, this is The Latest with me, Lucy Hough.

0:56joining me is Peter Walker senior political correspondent at the Guardian so Peter you were at Keir Starmer's press conference emergency press conference this morning we'll come on to the substance and the tone of what he said in a moment but but first of all just talk us through the events of the weekend because Saturday was the big day wasn't it when we got this sudden threat that the UK was one of eight European countries that Donald Trump was threatening with tariffs if effectively they didn't hand over Greenland? It's all very weird, even by the standards of Donald Trump land, which is a kind of ever-changing feast, you know, a kind of news feast.

1:31And it's fascinating and, you know, quite alarming for us. But if you're in number 10, you must just kind of dread what the next thing is. I mean, the UK in terms of tariffs has thus far largely escaped the worst of them. And number 10 are very, very keen to put this down for the fact that Keir Starmer has this weirdly quite close relationship with Donald Trump. But it has worked. And he's been using this Trump whispering partly to be what he sees as a bridge between Europe and the US over other issues. But it's very much worked so far in insulating the UK from the worst of terrorists. But this was a sudden shock that the UK, along with the seven other NATO members, were being singled out for having had troops on Greenland soil.

2:12Or in the case of the UK, troop, because we have one person. Just one. Just one person. We were joking in the office earlier, they could have sent a second one just for company. Or to justify the 10 % tariffs that we might now be facing. That is a heavy load to carry. Well, exactly. But it's almost easiest to understand Trump as a mafia boss. He doesn't, you know, this is idea he deals in deals. He doesn't, he deals in threats. And this was a very, very open threat. Unless you pave the way for Greenland to become American, whether by purchase or annexation, Then from February the 1st, you get 10 % tariffs on all your goods.

2:47And if it's still not sorted out by June, it goes up to 25%. And these kind of tariffs are potentially economy crippling. So it would have set off a wave of panic inside number 10. So the tone of this press conference this morning, I mean, we know that Starmer was on the phone with Trump over the weekend, trying, as you say, to capitalise on that perceived warm relationship between the two. but clearly that was to no avail because the UK was grouped together with countries like France, Denmark, Germany others as being the target of this new tariff threat but the tone from Starmer was there is this very important relationship between the two not least because of security and defence we want to keep that going and ruling out it seemed any retaliatory tariffs It was a quite interesting tone because it was quiet and conciliatory in some ways, but in other ways it was very, very firm.

3:42There's people like the Liberal Democrats and the Greens who very, very much want Number 10 to go in and say, we're going to fight back, we'll have retaliatory terrorists, we'll cancel this deal or that deal. Stammer's argument is whatever Trump does, the US and UK are inexorably linked to each other in terms of nuclear deterrent, intelligence issues. But in terms of the idea of Greenland being given to the US, against the wishes of the Danes. He was very firm, you know, and it was interesting. On Sunday night, the reader of his call with Trump and with other European leaders said the word, you know, wrong.

4:16He said that he stressed to all of them, including Trump, that to try and impose tariffs to force the Europeans to give a grueling would be wrong. It's an incredibly difficult balancing act and it doesn't look particularly dignified. Yeah, and crucially, Starmer seemed to be saying that he didn't actually believe that Trump's plan was to annex or purchase Greenland, that like you say, he was likely to row back on this. Well, that seems to have been the gamble. So therefore, at this time, retaliatory tariffs weren't necessary. But that is in marked contrast with what we're hearing from the EU and Europe who are threatening what they call a trade bazooka.

4:51I love that phrase. Trying to match Trump in his own language there, which is 93 billion euros in retaliatory tariffs that they'd had prepared already back in 2023, but were on ice, right? Yeah, this is the French. And Emmanuel Macron has recently taken a kind of more pugnacious tone. And the whole thing is, is that the EU is this enormous trading bloc, has actually got the economic power to be able to do that. And the Americans would have to listen. And obviously Trump is heading towards the midterms, you know, assuming the midterms take place. And having a big economic shock to ordinary voters would be for the Republicans and for him a very, very bad thing.

5:28it's interesting to have the counterfactual of if Brexit never took place, how much Keir Starmer, if he was PM in the post-Brexit world, would, or in the world where Brexit never took place, how much Britain would want to play along with this. And you get the sense that Britain would probably be a slightly more cautious voice. But the whole thing is, we are now an independent trading nation, so we can make the decisions. We want to, down the street, argue that this has done as good so far and we've been able to escape some of the tariffs. But it also means we just, you know, haven't really got the choice.

6:00The EU can say, all right, we're going to fight back and the Americans will, you know, definitely listen. If Britain does that, they'll just laugh. Yeah. And is that because the EU is substantially so much greater of a force as a trading bloc and the UK, as you say, in a post-Brexit era doesn't carry that cloud? It's just maths. It's 27 nations against one, you know, and you can argue both things have their advantages. But when it comes to the possibility of an American president who simply won't listen to anything except reciprocal threats and force, then being of one of 27 is clearly, you know, you have more power.

6:35But how frustrating is this for European leaders? I mean, we know that Starmer was on the phone to Trump on more than one occasion over the weekend, but he was also talking regularly to European leaders. Do you think there's any frustration in Brussels and other European capitals that the UK is trying to take this more moderate line? To be honest, I wouldn't have particularly thought so. I mean, one of the constants of the post-Brexit world is the UK, you know, worries and thinks endlessly about what Brussels is doing and assumes they're the same way. Whereas, to be honest, they've got better things to think about.

7:10And the whole fact is that beyond the trade, there is much more existential stuff at play, which is going to be more on the minds of European leaders, particularly the NATO leaders. is the fact that, you know, NATO has been the bedrock of security on this continent for decades and decades. And US guarantee has been central to that. And suddenly that US guarantee doesn't seem to exist anymore. When you have an American president threatening to effectively invade another NATO member, it's the sort of stuff, if you told someone about that even 10 or 15 years ago, they think you were utterly mad. This is the sort of stuff which would throw the whole global order on its head.

7:48You know, it would embolden Russia, China, every other malevolent actor in the world. So, you know, trade is the focus on this now, but at the back of everyone's minds, you know, in the forefront of many of them, is also what this means for NATO as well. For now, I mean, it's quite a big week, isn't it? Because world leaders are also gathering in Davos. Keir Starmer, very keen to iterate in the press conference this morning that, you know, channels with the US remain very open, that they are speaking as leaders, but also that their teams are in regular contact. So clearly the idea is that Trump will sort of soften.

8:20The Italian Prime Minister, Georgia Maloney, has this theory that Trump has misunderstood the sending of troops, or in the UK's case, just one troop to Greenland as more of a threat, and that she and Starmer and others who are perceived to have these close relationships will be kind of working to get Trump's ear to talk him down. I'm sure there's something to that. And, you know, the difficult fact that Keir Starman and other European leaders need to accept is that dealing with the US is to an extent like dealing with a slightly senile medieval king who's got courtiers around him. And on some days you'll get sense from the king, on some days you won't.

8:58And a lot of it depends on which of his advisors have got sway at any particular moment. And there are some rational people in the White House. So the hope is that they will just, you know, listen. But it's kind of hard to overstate just how detached from relatively Trump actually seems at the moment. And the question that I asked at the press conference was referencing this bizarre note or text message that Donald Trump sent the Norwegian PM, which was basically saying, we're really annoyed with you because your government didn't give me the Nobel Peace Prize. You know, it's not the Norwegian government that actually decides who gets it.

9:32So, you know, I basically asked him, when you have a president who says and does things like that, can you understand why British voters wonder if it's even possible to be able to rationalise with him? And he slightly ignored the question, but he did interestingly say that he could understand why British voters, why the British public would actually be a bit peeved at the fact that the US is targeting Britain in this way. So there is the beginning of this acknowledgement in a public sense that, you know, these are not normal times. Yeah, and in many ways it just feels like a race to the bottom.

10:06Peter, thank you so much for your time. Thank you very much. That's it for today. Thanks for listening to this episode of The Latest, the new evening edition of Today in Focus. Today in Focus will be back with you tomorrow morning with a look at the billionaire behind Donald Trump's obsession with Greenland. We'll be back tomorrow night. This episode was presented by me, Lucy Hoff, The producer was Bryony Moore. The lead producer was Zoe Hitch.

10:35This is The Guardian.