Why MAGA Is At War With Itself - Dinesh D'Souza

25:54And they weren't the only ones. So you had established churches. Now, what was really going on was everybody was persecuting the dissidents within their area of control. So in some ways, you can see the resemblance to the atmosphere of what's going on now. We're in the right. Our opponents are wrong. We have to squash them. But what happened out of that is people then realized that this is actually a very awkward way to operate, because if I move from, let's say, Boston to Maryland, well, the Catholics are in charge over there. Or if I move to Connecticut, it's going to be the Episcopalians or the Congregationalists are in charge.

26:29Things aren't going to be so pleasant for me. So one way to understand our Bill of Rights is not as articles of faith, but as articles of peace. People over time realize that this mutual recrimination is actually a very painful way to live. All right, let's make a truce. You agree not to persecute me, I agree not to persecute you. Let's write it down, right? So that's how we get religious liberty, not out of some philosophical reflection on the importance of liberty, but rather out of a kind of bitter tussle in which the religious liberty emerges as the only modus, the only viable solution for living together.

27:15Francis Foster:So that sounds to me, correct me if this is wrong, but I'm just trying to pass what you're saying in my head that this there will be a very painful period for america coming now we're we're in it already but it's going to get more painful before it gets better right because you i mean you're already shooting each other you know that's what's happening right uh i mean i think it's fair to say that most recently most of the high profile incidents are left on right but is it going to stay that way you know i don't know right Exactly. There's no way to predict that there is an easy stopping point for all this.

27:54Now, I would say that here is a key difference ideologically, and that is that the right does not have a philosophy of assassination. The left does. So the left's philosophy of assassination is this. Our opponents are fascists. They are on the verge of establishing a tyrannical, totalitarian regime. Think of the rhetoric just even of no kings, right? So tyrannicide or overthrowing the king, and even the phrase by any means necessary kind of tells you that there's no limit. Any means necessary means any means necessary. So arguably, let's say the Charlie Crook shooter goes, I am merely drawing the logical implications out of this philosophy, which is the mainstream point of view on the left.

28:46Now, you can't find an equivalent philosophy on the right that would justify doing something.

28:51Francis Foster:I agree that it's possible that we would see political violence from the right end also. And we have seen, right? And we have seen some of it. But it's not, it doesn't have this legitimation. Right. Yeah. For the moment. For the moment. But the problem is, is the more you do tit-for-tat reactions, what inevitably happens is it becomes escalatory. And then before you know it, there's going to be political assassinations on both sides. Yeah. Now, in fairness, I think that the mainstream MAGA and conservative position in America now is not tit-for-tat. In other words, it's not the Democrats have, you know, pallets or bricks to throw at cars and citizens.

29:30So let's go get our own pallets and bricks. Let's find our own George Soros. But the view of the right is if you have these pernicious actions and even pernicious lies in some cases, in some cases pernicious schemes to frame people, it's really important to punish that, hold it accountable. And so, for example, you know, Bill Barr went before Congress. This was obviously in the in the some years ago. And they said, you know, you are you are you are going after leading Democrats. You are going after the Democrats. You're making your office a political prosecution. And Bill Barr goes, name a single Democrat that I've indicted.

30:17And you couldn't name one because there wasn't one, right? But after this long procession of indictments, not just of Trump, we're talking about people, ordinary people, pro-lifers with rosaries, you know, 70 years old, getting long prison terms. The right has been a little radicalized, and you can see why. Because you're going after ordinary citizens. You're not just going after people, and even going after me. I mean, I have the means to fight back. I have a top defense attorney. You know, I spent half a million dollars defending myself. But some January 6th guy who walked in the Capitol for 10 minutes because he was carried by the crowd.

30:54You know, this guy's life is completely ruined to now, to this date, even after a pardon. So who's going to pay for all that? I mean, I'm very, I feel keenly the desire to have maximum accountability here. not necessarily recrimination but to the degree that there's abuse of power the abusers need to be locked up fair the thing that concerns me Dinesh is look everybody sitting around this table is to a greater or lesser extent a political animal we chose to get involved in this and when people say things about us or misrepresent us or criticize us in a manner that is deeply unfair there's a part of you that understands it because that's the nature of the game.

31:43Politics has always been a dirty business from day one. Who I worry about in all of this are the soccer moms, Dinesh. The people who see the cohesion within their society, cultural, political, start to degrade, and it affects ordinary people who are not political, but who are the very backbone of America. I agree. Although I don't think that the main problem that those people face is so much, let's say, political acrimony or political violence. I think it is the actual economic and cultural dislocation of the society. So in other words, sound policies, good ideas, getting economic growth churning again, getting an educational system that actually teaches you stuff.

32:36I mean, I'm so, to me, going to Dartmouth was such a transformative experience. You know, it was tennis courts as far as the eye can see. It was libraries with like coffee and donuts open all night. It was old books. You know, it was. So to me, it was an opening of the of the mind that I've never forgotten. And all I'm one of the few people who got a liberal arts education and made a career completely based on that. Most of most Dartmouth guys, you know, they read Blado and they read Dante and then they go to work on Wall Street. They don't read a book or they read very little since. So Dartmouth is more of a like a way station to a job as a lawyer or as a banker.

33:26But for me, I've tried to retain that sense of wonder that I had as a teenager when I set foot on the Dartmouth campus. And yet I look at it now and I'm like, that experience that I had, I don't think is available anymore. No, it's not. It's really a tragedy.

33:43Francis Foster:And a lot of kids are opting out because they know they're not going to get it. So as someone who broke perhaps with your former colleagues and became a big supporter of President Trump, how do you assess the first year of his presidency? You mean this new term? Yes. Yeah. So Trump 2 is quite different than Trump 1. And in fact, reflects exactly the shift that we've been talking about. Trump won was basically the real estate guy comes to Washington. He essentially says, I am the new CEO of America, and I'm going to get things to really work in a way that they haven't before because politicians have been running the show.

34:28And he goes, I need some people to do what I want. So generals are reputed to be people who take orders. Tell them what to do. Get it done. OK, here's John Kelly. He's my chief of staff. He'll get it done. And Trump realizes soon enough that all the kind of affable political appointees who have come up through the system are extremely self-serving and treacherous. And they recognize that there are huge cultural prizes to be had by turning on Trump and stabbing him in the back and leaking to the media. And so Trump suddenly realizes that his first term, I mean, it's remarkable that he got some good things done in that term, because essentially he was sort of like Caesar surrounded by Cassius's and Brutus's all around.

35:15But I think he figured that out. He realized that not only is there a very powerful cultural left and democratic establishment against him, but there's a whole Republican establishment that would not be unhappy to see his carcass dragged out of the Roman Senate, to continue with the Caesar analogy. So what happened is Trump weathered the storm of all the 90-plus charges and the attempts to lock him up and the two assassination attempts. Then I think he realized, all right, well, I am now in a completely different situation. If you've seen Mel Gibson's movie The Patriot, you know, in the beginning of it, Mel Gibson is like a normal guy.

35:59He's a farmer. He doesn't really want to get involved. He's mainly concerned with his crops. But once you're subjected to a certain level of humiliation and abuse and degradation, you're like, that's it. That's Trump. So I think we now have a scorched earth president who just sort of doesn't care. And as a result, you're seeing a an aggression that you never saw in the first term. but I would argue it is a justified aggression. I mean, on a personal level, I completely understand how Trump is that way. That is the normal way to be. There was that moment at Charlie Kirk's funeral. I was right up there with my wife in the front, and, you know, Erica Kirk made this sort of marvelous profession of, you know, of agape, Christian love.

36:48I forgive the man who killed my husband. That is a sort of a beautiful expression on the individual level. But Trump comes right back and you could tell he had been wrestling with that because he then blurts out, well, I don't wish my enemies, you know, the best. I wish them the worst. That's the more natural response. And I think that reflects, call it, you know, Old Testament morality, if you want to call it that, versus, you know, the Erica Kirk approach. So how's Trump doing? Well, I mean, to me, the tariffs are rocky waters. I'm unsure about them. As a lifelong free market guy, I have all kinds of anxiety about them.

37:36I do recognize that our old trade policies have caused a lot of problems and have caused a lot of problems for a particular large group of working class people in this country. And I do think something needs to be done to address that group. Many other groups, including my group, has benefited enormously from globalization, from free trade, from the policies of the last 30 years. But I've seen other people whose lives are very dislocated, whole communities wiped out. Trump knows that. So I do commend him for trying to do something about it. And what he's trying to do is really turn a lot of economic wisdom on its head.

38:13Will it work? I don't know. A lot of other things that Trump is doing, I think, are fabulous. And so in general, I'm very happy with Trump. You know, I would give him an A minus so far, and he's only just getting started. And it's also as well, I think part of the reason that he wants to move the manufacturing base to the United States is because a lot of the blue collar guys and girls who voted for him, that was the core of the voter base. But I also think he's very aware of the rising danger of China. Yes. And I also think that his motive isn't just the voter base. I think what he's realized is that a lot of the social values of a society are based upon having a steady job.

38:57Francis Foster:Right. So let's say, for example, you can achieve on the on the balance, great economic efficiency by wiping out a steel town and sending over those jobs. let's just say hypothetically for half the price to Indonesia or to China. So on the balance sheet, you're doing great. You are actually following free market ideology. You're going, you're making the product where it can be made most cheaply. And I come up with a whole economic tradition that goes, that's right. That's what you want to do. You don't want to pay farmers when you don't need farmers and technology can produce the crops. If you can have the steel made more cheaply over there, let's do it.

39:34But then what you end up with is you have a whole town of people sitting on the sidewalk, you know, and fentanyl is a big problem over there and their kids are dislocated and the civic structure has all broken down. There are small businesses that supported, you know, the bowling alley and the Little League have closed down. So you now have a you just have debris. And so bringing those jobs back is part of that cultural restoration, no less than the economic.

40:05Francis Foster:To say nothing of the fact that when COVID happens, you can't import drugs from China or masks or whatever, because they'll hold on to them. Because when push comes to shove, countries believe in the national interest. And we have a situation in Britain where we don't make our own steel anymore. Now, how are you going to fight a war if you can't produce the very basics that you need to manufacture? We have net zero. This is brilliant. I mean, exactly. How this was allowed to happen, even in critical industries, is a little unbelievable. You, the trigonometry audience, understand how vital free speech is.

40:43That's why we're proud to reintroduce you to our longstanding partners, Give, Send, Go. We caught up with their founders at Jordan Peterson's Alliance for Responsible Citizenship Conference this year, and it was clear they are not just running a crowdfunding site, they're defending a principle. Take one of the most powerful examples, Daniel Penny. He stepped in during a dangerous subway incident in New York and was later charged with homicide. His Give, Send, Go campaign raised$3 million, allowing him to mount a strong legal defense as his case moves through the courts. That case made headlines, but the biggest story was this.

41:20While other platforms shut campaigns like his down, Give, Send, Go stood firm. So if you want to support causes that matter or raise funds yourself, whether it's for free speech, helping a friend in need or disaster relief, visit givesendgo.com and use the code trigger for a special 2.5 % processing rate. That's givesendgo.com, the platform that doesn't just talk about free speech, it protects it. The same thing is true in so many other sectors of life. When I look at the universities, I say to myself, now, when I was a student, we had two groups of people running the university. And I'm sure this was just as true at Oxford.

41:59You had an older generation that I would describe as classically liberal. They were not on the right. They were actually on the left. But they did believe in free speech and they did believe in debate and they believe in academic standards. and if you were to tell them something like, you know, we're not going to be teaching Plato's Republic, they would have no tolerance for this kind of thinking because they believe that there are great books and people should read them and people should spend a lot of time immersed in this kind of stuff. But there was a younger generation out of the 60s and 70s and you could tell that those people even dressed differently.

42:36They were more bohemian in style. they were much more casual in their rhetoric they didn't typically wear a jacket and i saw to myself i said you know if you were to remove the older generation and just move these guys into full control this campus would look totally different that's exactly what happened uh the older generation retired was phased out um the younger generation insisted on ideological homogeneity. So it replicated itself. And it produced really something more resembling an indoctrination factory than a real debate. Now, when I was at Dartmouth, the college was left wing. But there were probably two dozen conservatives on the faculty, including five or six outspoken ones.

43:22I could name conservatives at Harvard, Yale, Harvey Mansfield at Harvard, the law professor at Yale. And so the conservative students had mentors to gravitate to. But all of that was wiped out in the early part of this century. And so suddenly the conservative became a complete pariah. If you want to know, like, what was Charlie Kirk's accomplishment? I think what it was, most of all, was not his brilliant oratory or his knowledge of issues. It was really the fact that you had conservatives beaten down and humiliated, treated as the sort of public enemy number one. And then along comes an organization that basically says you can be with like minded people.

44:05You can hear ideas from intelligent people. Your point of view is not crazy. And they were like, oh, my gosh, this is almost like a sanctuary, a refuge. And that was what Turning Point provided and still does. And just to go back to economics, because I'm glad we're talking about this. I think one of the genuine criticisms you can make against Trump is his unwillingness to deal with the deficit, which is one of the things Elon got so frustrated with. Now, this is a problem that we've been dealing with since the Reagan years. Reagan could not cut the government either. Even though his ideology was completely about cutting the government, Reagan came to office on slogans like, government is not the solution, government is the problem.

44:54But I will tell you as an insider, one of the things we realized, it is what economists call the public choice dilemma, which is just a kind of a esoteric phrase, but it means something really simple. If you take a government program that costs, let's say,$10 million, and let's say you take the$10 million and you give it to one group, I'm going to call it Planned Parenthood. Planned Parenthood now will hire 10 lobbyists to protect that program, right? Let's say that the money for this program comes from 10 million Americans who have all contributed$1. So the truth of it is, there is a much larger constituency for, let's say the program's not working, you want to stop it.

45:34The problem is this. Planned Parenthood applies concentrated lobbying pressure on the Congress to preserve the program. And then if we in the Reagan administration tried to mobilize the 10 million people who funded the program, each of them only gave a dollar. So we can't even get them to make a phone call. So there is an inequality of pressure. And so what we realized, which was somewhat devious, but nevertheless politically pragmatic, is that there is no way to cut the program. The only thing you can do is take the money from Planned Parenthood and give it to a pregnancy center. Why? Because now you have created a new constituency on your side.

46:16So that, in effect, true, are you cutting the deficit? No. You are merely moving the money around. You are merely moving the money from their gang to your gang, right? And so at the end of the Reagan years, and there were massive successes of Reagan, right? The Berlin Wall comes down. The Soviet Union collapses. Reagan restores American patriotism and pride. I've written a book on Reagan. But nevertheless, on this count, you'd have to say that the Reagan project was a failure. Reagan was unable to cut the size of the government at all. Trump comes in, I think, and he knows this dynamic. He recognizes intuitively that what you have is a structure of democratic government where you have these imploring constituencies.

47:05They have, unfortunately, become habituated to getting benefits. The benefits are extracted through taxation from unwilling taxpayers, but they are also funded by printing money through the Fed. So Trump is like, I don't think he knows how to tackle that monster. And I don't either. So I don't blame him for not cutting the deficit or the debt. His only solution, which would be my solution as well, is, listen, if you can make the economy instead of growing at 2 % or 3%, grow at 5 % or 6%, that will actually make a serious dent in the problem. So I think Trump is betting, look, I would rather put my energy in lubricating the economy.

47:48I'm going to get, you know, the United States has giant deposits of natural gas. We are on the world is on a technological frontier. If we can open up those kinds of things, it changes the rules of the game. And so I think Trump is betting correct rather than essentially saying, look, the two big spending items in the government are entitlements, Social Security and Medicare. Republicans, at least in the past, have discovered that going after those two things is really a good way of getting booted right out of power.

48:18Francis Foster:Well, Dinesh, you mentioned Charlie Kirk a number of times, and it was obviously, you know, a horrific moment for this country and for America. But actually, just globally, I thought it was just a horrific moment for the world. And seeing that happen to a father of two young children simply being killed because of his political views. That was absolutely shocking. And because of how shocking it was, there was a naive part of me that thought that this might be a reset opportunity for everybody. And I thought maybe the left will go, oh no, we can't, there are some Nazis and they have to be called out, but we can't call center-right people Nazis.

49:05Francis Foster:We can't throw around labels like fascists because I've said it on this show a number of times We said it on Joe Rogan yesterday. If you keep calling someone, if I thought the Nazis were here to invade, I'd pick up a rifle and go to the front line. So when you call someone a Nazi, you are literally putting a target on their back. And I also thought it might be a moment in which the right might reconnect around its core values and core ideas and go, you know, we need to get together and challenge all of this. Well, what's happened is the exact opposite. it. You know, the left is doubling down on all this stuff.

49:41Francis Foster:And on the right, you now have these very fringe voices who are saying, you know, a foreign country assassinated Charlie Kirk and making up stuff about planes that left before the assassination that proved that all of this crazy stuff. You've been quite outspoken about all of that. Talk to us about this whole thing. the yeah i think that um look how strange it is you have you had a militarization around antifa which became publicly evident over the george floyd riots that's the antifa element there's the blm element which has somewhat subsided but what has taken its place is these violent trans rings.

50:29I'm not talking about people who are trans. I'm talking about people who think that the society is out to get them. And so they go to training camps and they talk about doing martial arts or shooting people or fighting with weapons. Now, again, I don't think there's a lot of reasoning to be done with those people. If you look at the Portland rioters, if you look at these Antifa militants, and if you look at these trans terrorists, it's really important to sort of get to the bottom of it, excavate exactly what happened. So there were some reports after Charlie Kirk's assassination that there was prior knowledge of what was going to happen, that there were people in chats talking about, hey, something really big is going to happen.

51:11Not just big happens, it's going to happen to Charlie Kirk tomorrow at so-and-so location. Well, I mean, this would suggest, if not a conspiracy, at least prior knowledge of people who knew that he was going to be going to be shot. Just when the FBI, the authorities are sort of moving the crackdown on all this, along from the right comes Candace Owens with this sort of idea that, hey, let's take a look at these photos. I see a pipe. I wonder if a Mossad agent might have crawled through the pipe. I mean, stuff that is just absolutely crazy. Now, again, if she were to produce some substantial evidence, a single reliable fact that, let's just say, contravenes the government's theory, and she says it couldn't have been that, because take a look at this.

52:10But the investigative style, although I admit it's from a certain point of view, it's like irresistible to watch because it's like listening to a well-trained philosopher who has completely lost his mind and is now in an asylum and is giving you crazy discourse, but it's crazy discourse that is embedded with witticisms and all kinds of... And you're like, you can't turn away from it from a certain point. Candace is actually quite magnetic in the way she presents information. And she has a style, it's intellectual striptease because she never puts her cards out and goes, here's what I got. She goes, okay, well, I got something.

52:53Let me show you something. You know, more to come tomorrow and more to come the day after that. It's a little deranged, but there's something magnetic about it, right? But look at the political effect and how pernicious it is. It's taking attention away from the actual, not just the bad guy, but these ideological bad actors that are embedded in our society. And it's basically telling everybody, look over here, it's the Jews, or it's Israel, or it's Mossad.

53:27Francis Foster:Now, you'd have to ask yourself, well, why would someone do that? Right? Or to look more broadly, take the phenomenon now, go beyond Candace and take the larger phenomenon, you've got a strange but pernicious alliance between the cultural left and the West and radical Islam. I actually wrote about this in a book that I published around 2006. It was called The Enemy at Home. I was reacting to Samuel Huntington's idea that there's a clash of civilizations between us, the West, and them, meaning the House of Islam. And my argument was, not exactly. There's a division inside the West, and there's also a division inside of Islam.

54:08And I said, not only that, but the cultural left is going to become strange bedfellows with the radical Muslims. This seems fantastic because the two groups have utterly different end goals, and they cannot inhabit each other's world. And not only that, but if they were in full control, they would come to blows. But they are united against a common enemy. And who is the common enemy? Well, it's the Jews and Israel on the one hand, and it's America and the principles of the West on the other. So it would seem natural, unavoidable, that Jews and Christians, America and Israel should come closer together in recognition of this obvious, nefarious alliance.

54:52You know, let's call it, I filmed the dragons. This is like the devil's platoons. All right, well, the good people need to come together. So I can understand why the left is doing what it does, because it is an ideological war against the Jews and Israel, no less than against Christians on the West. What I don't understand is this movement on the right that is attempting to sever our connection with Israel. And I think in the process, undermining Trump, undermining MAGA, undermining America's national interests, undermining the foundations of the West, which are Athens and Jerusalem. But on top of all of that, strengthening radical Islam and strengthening the cultural left.

55:42Hang on, but you say you don't understand. Let me push back on that. I think it's relatively simple to understand, Dinesh.

55:48Francis Foster:How so? We all know smartphones are essential, but they've also become the ultimate surveillance machines. That's why we were so interested when former Trigonometry guest Eric Prince created the UpPhone. This isn't just another handset. The UpPhone runs on unplugged OS, free from big tech ecosystems. It comes with a firewall that blocks third-party trackers and gives you full transparency into who's trying to access your data. and it works straight out of the box. I got one of these myself because I want to know my phone is serving me, not Google, not Apple, and not some faceless data broker. And that's the point.

56:25Francis Foster:Your phone should serve you, not spy on you. Check it out at unplugged.com slash trigonometry and use our code trigonometry for$20 off a protective case with the ARP phone. If you go along this way of like, the left of the creator have done this, they've done all these egregious things, these tactics to silence and destroy, to play identity politics, to say if you're white and male, you're bottom of the oppression pyramid, which means you're far less likely to get a job, far less likely to progress. It becomes socially acceptable. Let's be honest, to demonize you, particularly if you're blue collar and white and male, you automatically become thick, stupid and racist.

57:07Then why wouldn't you start to tribalize? Why wouldn't you become conspiratorial. Why wouldn't you go out and attack the people that you think have done you wrong? You're absolutely right. So I do not blame the fractured, dislocated, angry young people who are responding in just the way that you say. I know why they're doing that. But I do blame the pied pipers who are leading them to the precipice who should know better.

57:42Francis Foster:Right? Let me try a few other theories on you, because I don't think the explanation Francis gives is fully here, because what it doesn't really explain is why there are certain people now absolutely obsessed with the Jews. Why are they obsessed with Israel? Because it's not Israel or the Jews that caused the cultural disintegration that you're talking about. They didn't take over college campuses 40 years ago and introduced all this anti-Western crap. I think there's a few things going on that I think are contributing as well. One of them is I wrote an article when Tucker Carlson went to Russia and interviewed President Putin, which was called Tucker Carlson and the Woke Right, in which I basically said that there is these sections on the right that have become very focused on victimhood and are replicating some of the things we saw on the left in doing so.

58:34Francis Foster:And when you're focused on victimhood, you have to find someone who's victimizing you. And at that point, Jews and Israel were not the thing. And I said, you know, for now, the label is globalists. And those sections of the right keep talking about globalists. But a globalist isn't something that you can visualize. No one has, like when I say globalist, you don't, a picture of a person doesn't come into your head. So they were looking for somebody to be the scapegoat, the explanation that explains everything, like the left's explanation of, well, everything is because of white supremacy. Everything is because of institutional racism.

59:12Francis Foster:Everything is because of straight white men. I think that's one thing. And the other thing is, once President Trump gets elected for a second term, in the overwhelming fashion in which that happens, what does the media do whose entire, new media in particular, whose entire identity became, you know, it was the anti-woke coalition, of which trigonometry was 100 % a part of. But once that collapses, like we don't really talk about wokeness very much anymore on the show because it's kind of I mean, I think it's overstating the case to say it's over, but it's not the live issue right now. Right. We don't talk about trans issues, which we used to talk about because it's not the live issue right now.

59:56so if you are in a right of center media person or channel organization you can either keep beating

1:00:05Francis Foster:you know you know that meme of stop stop he's already dead right that's not going to get you any views because beating up on the democrats i mean don't even know where they are anymore right so you have to go the incentive structure is to go in a more conspiratorial out their direction. Those are my two other bits that I'd put to you. Yeah, I have a bunch of little things to add to that. So the first one is that

1:00:33in the Reagan era, in conservatism, there was a certain, I would call it the intellectual guardians of the tribe, people like William F. Buckley, Reagan to a certain degree, but there were others, Irving Kristol. And the idea here was that if you came in with like the poison of anti-Semitism, blatant racism, you know, criticism of affirmative action, yes. Calling blacks monkeys, no. So if you did that, you were basically asked to leave the room and you were abolished from the, you wouldn't be invited to conservative conferences. You certainly wouldn't be a speaker. it would basically be the end of you as a public figure.

1:01:21So that's gone. And it's gone. Why? Partly because we don't have a conservative intellectual class that performs that task. And why don't we have that? Well, partly because the mainstream of that class went never Trump. And so when I look around for like, if I were to make a list of, let's say, 30 of my colleagues from the Reagan days, I would say that probably about 25 of them went anti-Trump. And they went to anti-Trump in different places. John Bolton is a little different place than, say, Bill Kristol. But nevertheless, they're by and large excluded from MAGA. And what happened is, partly as a result of a cultural shift, MAGA produces a new type of pundit who is not, I mean, think of the distance between, say, Irving Kristol and Tucker Carlson.

1:02:22Tucker doesn't even purport to be knowledgeable about anything, right? So as a result, what Tucker says is, I will develop a ventriloquist style. I have strong opinions, but I don't want to defend any of them. So I will set up a structure in which I bring in sources, often rather dubious sources, people you've never heard of, you know, the nun with the mustache, some disgraced academic. And what I'll do is I will ask sort of leading questions that in which is embedded an answer, my answer, but framed as a question. You then will blurt out the obvious implications of the question, giving me the answer I expected, but I will pretend to be thunderstruck by it.

1:03:08It's an epiphany. It's a new revelation. People have been suppressing this kind of thinking for decades. So this is a shtick. It's a different shtick than Candace. Candace's shtick is the Candace Intelligence Agency. I'm like the world's greatest detective. You know, I'm the Pink Panther of my time. I'm deputizing all my viewers also to be detectives. Feed me information. We're going to crack the case. So to me, this is like an intellectual embarrassment because all my life, I've been an iconoclast. I will take on ideas and I will try to dismantle them, but not in this way. My ideas are things like this.

1:03:47The Dixiecrats all became Republicans. And my strategy of challenging that is I go make an inventory of the 200 Dixiecrats. I put them up on a movie screen And I say, all right, I'm now going to show you through a movement of the mouse, which of these 200 Dixiecrats became Republicans. Answer two. So did the Dixiecrats as a group become Republicans? No, there's the empirical evidence right there on the screen. You can check it out for yourself. So when I see this almost parody of investigation, parody of scholarship, it's very unnerving. Now, for young people, just as you said, there is a susceptibility to all this.

1:04:31And also there's no easy check on it. Like, for example, right now I'm in these big debates about Christian theology. But I'm debating Christian theology with people who have, like, listened to two podcasts. I've written three books on Christian apologetics. I've thought about this stuff for 30 years, but it's difficult to address people who say things like, Dinesh, open a Bible once in a while. You might learn something. I'm like, are you serious? So, but our culture has had that leveling effect. This guy who's watched two podcasts is on an even playing field with me. Now, this would not have been the case in the Reagan years because that guy would not even be, that guy would not be speaking at a conference at AEI.

1:05:17So there was a filtering structure that is now gone.

1:05:21Francis Foster:And look, there's... And there are good things about that. Well, that's right. I was going to say that. And I know you've tried to debate, Tuck, and this is one of the other things that I do find strange because with some notable exceptions, quite a lot of these people don't engage in what used to happen, which is you come together and you have these debates and discussions. But now I think the economic incentives aren't there. You don't need to do that. Like if you're Candace, you just do your show and you make millions of dollars talking about how someone you used to call your friend, denigrating his legacy, in my opinion, and all of that.

1:05:57Francis Foster:But you don't need to go and engage in a debate. There's nothing to gain, really. Right. And so everything gets siloed. Right. So if you look back, like what was the motivation for Hitchens and me to debate? We had nothing in a sense to a reason for debating is that deep down, each of us thought that, like, this is what happened with me. I turn on the TV, and I see Hitchens, and he is debating a pastor, right? And Hitchens is making witty Oxford Union jibes of this guy, and this guy doesn't even know that he's being struck with these rapier thrusts because the pastor comes out of divinity school.

1:06:35You know, he accepts the authority of the Bible. His argument is the Bible, and Hitchens is speaking a secular language. So I'm like, this is a disgrace. I've got to write Hitchens and tell him, look, why don't you pick on someone who's not only your own size, but who will speak to you in your own language? And so, and Hitchens is like, well, that's great. I'm up for it. So we're both up for it. And that's our motive. Our motive is that deep down, we actually do believe in the power of ideas. There's probably a little bit of narcissism that each of us thinks that we are like top-notch gladiators and we're willing to step into the arena.

1:07:11You know, but you're right. Like these days, if you say, hey, Megyn Kelly, hey, Patrick, that David, why don't you invite Tucker and me to have this out? And we'll do it in a very civil way, but we'll get to the bottom of it. Even they become very skittish because everybody, it seems to me at least, is being strategic about how they approach all of this. In other words, what's in it for me? How is this? How am I going to be positioned to be? As opposed to saying, hey, this would be great. Wouldn't people love to sort of eavesdrop in on all this? And now it can be done so easily online. So even though the opportunities are much greater, the actual debate, as you know, I mean, I first noticed that the left didn't want to debate, but I'm finding the right really doesn't either.

1:08:02Well, give me a small example. I did a debate online with Nick Fuentes, partly because he was prancing around telling all his viewers and an increasingly large group of people, everybody's scared of me. I'm alpha male. He's like, Ben Shapiro's scared of me. He's like, Charlie Kirk's scared of me. Everyone's scared of him. So I'm like, I'm not scared of you. So I did this debate. It went very well. In fact, a lot of his young listeners were like, who is this guy? And like, Nick is not doing as well as we had hoped. And so all this stuff. But my point is, as soon as I did that, I got a text from Charlie Kirk.

1:08:32Dinesh, why, why, why? The basic idea was you should not debate, and you certainly shouldn't debate Nick Fuentes, and you shouldn't give him any platforming or any recognition. So again, Charlie was approaching it strategically, like I'm the head of an organization, a youth organization. I don't want Nick Fuentes to be sort of poaching on the... So So this is the prevailing mentality among the new punditocracy. And it's also what I find incredibly frustrating, Dinesh, as someone who comes from the left, I see part of the problem of the left was a cowardice, if I'm being brutally honest, that people on the left saw these radicals start to propagate these, quite frankly, nonsensical, ridiculously toxic ideas, which would alienate huge swathes of the population.

1:09:22yet people were so scared of them and were so terrified of being exiled from the group that they didn't challenge them. And now I see people on the right doing the exact same thing. I'm not going to name names, but we all know who these people are. And we're just going, right. So if that doesn't happen, then the exact same thing is going to happen as what happened to the left. absolutely correct i mean the tucker and candace jumped into this arena with such a splash that all the conservative pundits were like i don't want to take that on because candace is extremely vindictive tucker has a huge following this will immediately put me on the wrong side with a lot of my own followers.

1:10:09I might lose followers. And as soon as I stepped into this arena, I basically started getting messages to that effect. Well, Dinesh, you make movies for the mainstream of the right-of-center audience. You realize there are a lot of young people who might start hating you or start calling you names, which, by the way, has happened.

1:10:33But it's just foreign to my own mentality. I don't even think like that. Even when I make films, I never say, I mean, I do make films by saying, is this a pressing topic? Is this an interesting path to go down? But I'm very supply side. I say to myself, when I came up with the idea of my film on Obama, for example, the prevailing view was that Obama was a civil rights guy, kind of the modern reincarnation of Martin Luther King. I come along, I go, no, I think Obama, his spirit, not his birthplace or anything, but his spirit is third world. It's anti-colonial. It comes out of the hot winds of anti-colonialism in Kenya.

1:11:14I mean, his own autobiography, Dreams from My Father. It's all in there. And so I go, I'm going to make a film about how Obama's real ideology is a third world anti-colonialism. Now, as soon as I said that, people were like, Dinesh, are you insane? are you going to make a movie on a topic so obscure as anti-colonialism? Nobody even knows what that is. Not only that, they think it's good because America was a colony of the British. So people tried to deter me on the grounds that this movie is not going to succeed. I paid no attention to it. I make the movie. It's the second most successful movie ever made, a political documentary after Michael Moore's Fahrenheit 9-11.

1:11:55so so i've learned from my own experience to find things that are interesting and important and just say them just go for it uh and that's my approach right now and and it's maybe naive in a more strategic era but you know it's it's stood me pretty well um and and every time i do this stuff people like charlie sykes you know who's now i think he's with the bulwark he's he's a never Trumper. And he'll be like, this is a career ending move by Dinesh. I'm like, my career has been ending since 1992. So I just don't worry about it. Because when you're looking at the podcast charts, I think it was Konstantin who pointed it out to me, but number one and number two on the conservative podcast charts is Tucker and it's Candace.

1:12:41And that is a pretty damning indictment on conservative political thought, isn't it? Well, what it shows, I think, is that the type of people who listen to podcasts and the type of people, for example, you find on X are drawn to this kind of... It's a certain type of political porn, isn't it? I mean, it's these it's candace puts out a salacious incendiary allegation um it doesn't hold up and over time it becomes obvious that it's stupid but she then replaces it with another one and it's a never-ending playing of these kind of nude cards so to speak on the table and apparently there's a virtually endless fascination for them because it's a new card It's like, it's not, okay, we've played the Brigitte Macron card.

1:13:43Now we're on to the Who Killed Charlie Kirk card, and tomorrow it'll be something else. Now, when people said to me, well, Dinesh, but didn't you speak at Blacksit? Like, you know, didn't you and Tucker tour Australia last year, which we did? I say to myself, look, my admiration for Candace and Tucker was developed on a completely different basis. Candace had stepped forward as like a young black woman taking on affirmative action, taking on DEI, basically speaking to young blacks about leaving the plantation to use her own rhetoric. And I'm like, that's fantastic. That needs to be done. She's very good at it.

1:14:19Very good at it. And no one else is doing it. And she is the perfect messenger. And so my admiration for Candace was based on that. Tucker, you know, he was really good in COVID. He was really good on Fox, his very memorable and kind of witty monologues. He showed a lot of bravery, I think, in the way he handled the break with Fox. But what's happened is that, you know, it's it's I don't mean to make light of it, but essentially you could say that Candace and Tucker have gone trans on us. They have transitioned into something completely different. And now we're being asked to sign off on them, even though it's not the same Candace, is not the same Tucker.

1:15:01And I'm like, okay, I'm not going to get on this bandwagon. I admired you for other reasons, but you apparently have become a different person.

1:15:10Francis Foster:You know, one of the other things that's happened, Dinesh, and this isn't just specific to the two people you're talking about, but more generally, is you can no longer disagree with people's arguments or behavior without being accused of being a hater or having some personal animus towards them. For example, when I wrote that article about Tucker Carlson and Work Right, I made very specific points about ideology and worldview. I never made any personal comments about him or anything like that. I've been on his, I was on his Fox show a number of times. And I thought, you know, during the summer of BLM, he was the funniest comedian on TV.

1:15:48Francis Foster:He was brilliant. But the difference now to me, it feels like is if I say Dinesh D'Souza is, I respect him for his work on this, but I don't agree with that. I'm a Dinesh D'Souza hater, and I have to be called out. And this is no way to discuss ideas. This is another game. It is. I mean, I play by the old rules. So what happened was Tucker had posed a question to Ted Cruz, namely, are the Jews of today the descendants of the Jews of the Bible? Interesting question. The film, by the way, tackles some of this. But I decided I'm going to do a one-on-one with Netanyahu. And since Tucker specifically mentioned, like, Netanyahu's Jews, I'm like, all right, I'm going to put it to Netanyahu.

1:16:36Perfectly legitimate thing to do. Netanyahu does an elegant sort of dunk on Tucker. And I'm about to post a clip on social media of Netanyahu's comment. So I think, as a courtesy, I'm going to send it to Tucker because I don't want him to feel, like, ambushed. It's his question. I'm putting it to the Israeli prime minister. I texted Tucker. Tucker sends me back an extremely annoyed text, basically accusing me of suggesting he's an anti-Semite. I go, Tucker, I never said you're an anti-Semite. I'm very careful about making that kind of allegation. To me, an anti-Semite is somebody who holds the Jews and only the Jews to a standard that they won't apply to anyone else.

1:17:21And if you do that consistently and systematically, then your motives are rightly suspect. But I didn't even say any of this. This is more the criterion spelled out in the film. But I just said, I'm not doing that, Tucker. And then he sends me some genetic study showing that the Jews of today are only 67 % connected to the Jews of the Bible. And again, I'm thinking, first of all, would you do this with any other group? I mean, would you consider, for example, saying that blacks don't really come from Africa because let's do a genetic test on Whitney Houston, see what a percentage of black is and non-black?

1:17:56I mean, if you did it with any other group, there would be immediate outrage. And Tucker knows this. I mean, again, we're not talking about some goofball on social media. We're talking about a smart guy who's been around. I've known Tucker for probably 25 years. So this is a savvy guy. He does know what he's doing. And this is a little bit of why I hold him to a higher standard, is because I think he does know better. So, but he becomes very annoyed, because I challenge this mode of sort of, you could call it genetic verification. I say, listen, of all the groups that have been dispersed to the ends of the earth, as far as I can see, the Jews have kept a tribal identity more than any other group.

1:18:37If you look at, say, Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice, the Jews don't intermarry. Shylock doesn't even want to go eat with the Christians. When his daughter runs off with a Christian, he's outraged. I mean, this gives you a little window into how Jews as a group have preserved their Jewish identity, not to mention gone back to their ancestral homeland, revived the Hebrew language, and essentially recreated, at least to an observable degree to me, the world of the Bible. it's observable if you walk around jerusalem you feel like you're in the land of the bible and um and then i also of course became very interested in the biblical archaeology and all of that that goes with it but uh but sort of tucker and i have this break that again would normally be settled by saying all right well look this is a very interesting discussion as far as i know it's never happened let's do it on my show but maybe as you say tucker is like why would i want to have an informed critic on my show, that might show me up.

1:19:42That might show that I am actually far less of an authority and the man in control or know what I'm talking about. I would much rather keep the structure I have, which is the ventriloquist structure of having essentially submissive guests who echo back to me what I want them to say. And I don't want to really veer too far from that.

1:20:07Francis Foster:And your film is about October 7th and Israel. Why do you think there has been this level of focus on Israel in, uh, in Western political debate? I think for young people, the, um, young people already think, or at least a lot of them do, that this group of insiders or elites has its own racket going, and they care about everybody, like, except me. I, the ordinary American, I, the working class guy, I'm, like, the very bottom of their list. Is that unfair, though, Dinesh? Is that an unfair assessment of the situation? when you look at the Rust Belt, when you look at comments like the deplorables, etc., etc., when you've seen how societies, particularly in the center of this country, have been allowed to go to seed, is that really an unfair criticism?

1:21:13No, no. I'm actually stating it sympathetically. I understand why people say those things. But what I'm saying is now imagine the Pied Piper who comes along and goes, listen, the reason that you have this predicament is because this whole American structure, which has a lot of bad elements, it's got the police state, you know, it's got the cultural left, it's got academia, the media, Hollywood. But there is, in fact, a kind of super manipulator that is controlling all of these, and that's Israel, right? So it's almost like Israel is being presented as the master key. Now, Tucker's backing off from some of this, because I noticed that in his most recent talk in Indiana, he goes, well, there are some disagreements in MAGA over foreign policy.

1:22:04I think we can all agree that America's interests should come first and that Netanyahu is a leader of a foreign country, as if that's just what we've been talking about. In reality, I think the sort of the poison is not about that. It's far worse. It's essentially putting the Jews as the master manipulators of the entire elite structure, and a lot of young people buy into that.

1:22:32Francis Foster:What's interesting about all of this is you have to be very, I don't mean this disrespectfully, but the word ignorant has a meaning, which is a lack of knowledge. You have to be very ignorant to think that in an alliance of the most powerful country in the world and a tiny country which is dependent on that country for its security, that relationship could be anything other than the powerful country getting its way 99 % of the time. Like if a 25-year-old White House staffer comes over to Britain. He's talking to people way above his level, twice his age, and they're all sitting there taking orders because America is the world's hegemon and Britain isn't.

1:23:15Francis Foster:And it's inevitably the same with any other country with which America is in a kind of relationship of some kind. America sets the terms, the other countries do what you want. So it's a very strange trick that's being played. That is part of it. The part of it I don't understand is that even if you take the ignorant guy and you give him a very simple, coherent cure for his ignorance, he still resists. I'll give you an example. So I was on Matt Gaetz's podcast, and Matt Gaetz goes, well, you spend a lot of time in your movie, Dinesh, Biblical Archaeology. or trying to show that the Jews have this ancient ancestral presence going back 2 ,000, 3 ,000 years ago.

1:24:00He goes, so what? He goes, the American Indians were here first. Does this mean we've got to turn over the whole country to them? So I reply as follows. I say, well, Matt, as far as I know, if you look around the world, I only know three ways in which you can get the title deeds to a country, any country. First, you are the original inhabitant. and that's one basis for making a claim. The second, some sort of negotiation or treaty. Someone gave it to you as part of a deal that was made. And three, conquest. I go, I don't know a single country in the world that didn't get its borders and its map out of one of these three ways.

1:24:40I go, in America, quite honestly, there's a bit of a dispute because the Native Americans were here first, so they get original inhabitants, but the white man conquered it. So conquest goes to the white man. And so you could argue that there's at least some sort of a disputed title. Let's apply this logic to Israel. Number one, the Jews were there first. They were the original inhabitants. Check. Number two, the United Nations at the end of World War II, by treaty, basically, or by negotiation, says, all right, Jews, you can have this. Arabs, you can have this. The Arabs say no. But you have the second box, a negotiation or treaty.

1:25:15And number three, the Jews have fought multiple wars, 48, 67, 73. I've held the land by conquest. So I go, I don't know a country in the world that has a stronger claim to title Israel is checking all the boxes. Now, again, if someone is ignorant, they could go, well, that makes sense to me, or I can think of a fourth box, or I can... But what I find is that if you say this, which seems to me very straightforwardly convincing, you make no headway. The person who is ignorant doubles down. And then they will start saying things like, who paid you$7 ,000? Right? And so what does that tell you? That tells you that they want to be in that pit.

1:26:06Francis Foster:There's another agenda going on. Yeah, there's another agenda going on. They are emotionally committed to that ignorant position. They dig in. And what's been very interesting to me is with the ceasefire, which Trump and lots of other countries negotiated, but Trump was at the forefront of it, particularly when it comes to the public element of it, and the return of the hostages, which is a fantastic achievement. We can all agree on that. But the fact that all of these people who seem to be banging the drum day in, day out, demanding a ceasefire in Gaza, which I think we're all sympathetic to, nobody wants to see the loss of innocent life.

1:26:45And you go, but you did not celebrate this in any shape or form. That betrays something very fundamental about your outlook. That's an exact continuation of the point I'm making, that they will state an objection. were concerned about the civilian losses of life. That stops. They go dead silent. Not only that, but Hamas now begins to drag people out in the open, break your legs by hammering your legs with a stone or shooting someone in the street. And remember, these are Palestinians. These are the very people that these groups on the left and on the right have professed to be motivated by. Anna Kasparin is like, whenever she goes on Piers Morgan, And she's like inconsolable.

1:27:30She can't stop herself out of, you know, profess concern for civilian life. And yet, suddenly, you find that she has nothing to say. And this is, I think, the low deceitfulness of our age. It's not that people say, you know what? I was wrong. Or I'm relieved there's a ceasefire. Or I made an error in this news article. I'm going to admit it. What they do is they go back and they stealth edit it. right? And it's as if to say, I never made the mistake. Go look right now. See, it's all right. Or what they do is they go dead silent. They wait for the issue to pass so they can reemerge sort of unchastened.

1:28:13And again, this is just dishonest from the point of view of scholarship, right? It's kind of like you published a paper, you made these claims. They're actually false. It's up to you to go, you know, I got it wrong. Here's why I got it wrong, but I'm going to fix it and I'm not going to make that mistake next. If you don't do that, the dishonesty becomes habitual. And I'm glad that you use the word dishonesty because when I look at the situation in Gaza dispassionately, there is no way forward for that situation to be solved until you get rid of Hamas. I think everybody can agree with that.

1:28:54Francis Foster:Most Middle Eastern countries agree. Yeah. Until you get rid of Hamas, there is simply no way you are going to have peace in that region. But how do you get rid of them? Because they're not going to want to go off their own volition. They're not going to go, you know what, actually, we still got 20 ,000 people, however many soldiers we've got. We're going to put down our weapons and we're all going to become organic vegan farmers. That is simply not a reality. So I guess the question is, how do you solve a problem like Hamas? Let's fill out the problem a little bit more. Hamas, does have a lot of civilian support and allies.

1:29:32Normal civilian families in Gaza have stashes of weapons. It's not entirely a case, even though I will say even, you know, Hamas has human shields, and the picture that gives you is the Hamas guy grabbing these civilians and sticking them in front of us, you know, shoot, you know. But the truth of it is there are a lot of civilians, maybe because they've been propagandized over 20 years, they shelter Hamas. They are willing human shields. You will have moms who say things like, I've given two sons to Allah, and you expect her to say, I've got two more, so I'm not ready to, but no, she means, I am ready to give two more.

1:30:09I'm going to give them all. So there is a... And I also feel it's fair to say as well, Dinesh, so there are people going, you know, if Hamas come in, point a gun at your head and go, you were going to stand here in front of, what are you going to do? There's nothing you can do. I mean, look at how they're punishing dissidents now in the street. And then there you have a global jihadi movement that doesn't wake up actually sweating about the Palestinians, but does see Hamas as part of its global jihad. It's one tool, right? So they have their own reasons for keeping this festering. So even if Hamas decided to dismantle the global jihadi operation, which has much wider ambitions, right?

1:30:54They want to infiltrate Australia and Canada and Europe and the United States. And that doesn't go away. So I'm very hopeful about what Trump has done, but I'm also very conscious of the magnitude of the task ahead.

1:31:08Francis Foster:And you'll be aware, as many Americans increasingly are, that Islamist extremism has become a very big problem, particularly in Europe. It's interesting that right as actually it's being solved across the Middle East and places like the UAE and Saudi Arabia, it is now rising in Europe. What about America? Do you guys feel that that issue is under control here? Are you safe? Absolutely not. I think that Europe is almost a case study of having largely succumbed to massive radical Islamic infiltration, taking over towns and suburbs. We're seeing glimpses of that in the United States. this has been, I have to say, something like a 30-year project.

1:32:02Because even in a red state like Texas, you'll suddenly just notice a proliferation of mosques. You'll suddenly notice that you've got all these Islamists running for school board. You suddenly notice that they're trying to create 100 Ilhan Omars. So the prospect of a United States of Islam, which would have been unthinkable even a few decades ago, I think is a real danger that people should be aware of. It hasn't come here yet to the extent of Europe, but is there any doubt that it's going to?

1:32:43Francis Foster:Dinesh, great speaking with you. We're going to head over to our sub-stack where people can ask you their questions in a second. But before we do, we always end the same way, which is by asking what's the one thing we're not talking about that we really should be? Before Dinesh answers a final question at the end of the interview, make sure to head over to our sub stack. The link is in the description where you'll be able to see this. What are some areas the Trump administration can improve upon after the first year in power? And what are some criticisms you would have? What do you think conservatives misunderstand most about the concept of freedom?

1:33:18Francis Foster:And what do progressive misunderstand most? Quick reminder, thank you to CyberGhost VPN for sponsoring this video. a top-tier VPN for$2 a month. Click the link in the description to get their special offer. Well, I think that there is the issue of how do you put the MAGA house in order. That's a challenge on the right. The challenge on the left is, or from the left, is the Red-Green Alliance, which has now come to full fruition. Mamdani is sort of a walking embodiment of it because he embodies both sides of it. There's a leftist side of him which views all these different groups as constituencies.

1:34:07I got the blacks over here, the Latinos over there, the feminists are over here, and then I've got the radical Muslims over here. So on the one hand, he is a traditional kind of leftist. But on the other hand, he does bring in the Islamic element. And the important thing to realize is that if Sharia ever comes to America, it will not look like Bin Laden or the Taliban any more than if communism ever came to America. It would have a Stalin trench coat or, you know, or a toothbrush mustache. These things will come here in American accents. If Sharia comes to America, it'll look more like Mamdani or Tucker Carlson.

1:34:51It'll be all-American. It'll be homegrown. It will be suave. It'll be social media savvy. It'll have pink cheeks, and then Tucker's gay will have a bow tie. So as a result, Americans are not looking for that. It's almost like the thieves are showing up at your house, but they don't look like traditional burglars. They aren't in masks. They've actually come to the front door. They want to be let in. They're like, wait, is this where the dinner party is taking place? And you're like, there may be some misunderstanding. Oh, no. I mean, can we just come in? So alerting America. See, the thing is, Israel, the reason Israel is so good in fighting radical Islam, in my view, Israel's on the front line, right?

1:35:34It's kind of like when you live in a bad neighborhood, you learn to look over your shoulder. You become very survival oriented. You become very lean. You become very tough. America has had a kind of spectatorial distance from all this. the luxury that, well, yeah, we did have 9-11, but by and large, this kind of thing we have not seen here. And as a result, Americans are slow to wake up to it.

1:35:58Francis Foster:Dinesh, thank you very much. Follow us on over to triggerpod.co.uk where we ask Dinesh your questions. Many of us were driven away from the Democratic Party by woke excesses like racism, sexism, and anti-Semitism. What are conservative leaders doing to minimize the racist, sexist, and anti-Semites in the Republican Party.