Lilly and Jack Sullivan

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1:13Voices for Justice is a podcast that uses adult language and discusses sensitive and potentially triggering topics, including violence, abuse, and murder. This podcast may not be appropriate for younger audiences. All parties are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Some names have been changed or omitted per their request or for safety purposes. Listener discretion is advised. My name is Sarah Turney, and this is Voices for Justice.

1:45Today I'm discussing the case of Lily and Jack Sullivan. Six-year-old Lily and four-year-old Jack Sullivan vanished from their rural Nova Scotia home on May 2, 2025. Their disappearance sparked an immediate and massive search effort, involving hundreds of volunteer searchers, canine units, helicopters, drones, and specialized RCMP units meticulously combing miles of the dense, challenging terrain near Lansdowne Station. Despite these efforts, there have been no confirmed sightings of the kids, and it seems like the best evidence they have is a child-sized boot print and potentially a piece of a blanket belonging to one of the children.

2:28This is the case of Lily and Jack Sullivan. It's the morning of May 2, 2025, in rural Nova Scotia, Lansdowne Station in Pictou County to be exact. Malaya Brooks-Murray and Daniel Martell are having what they've described as a lazy morning with their baby, Meadow. She's one. While there have been some conflicting statements, they say that they're basically just hanging out in bed, drifting in and out of sleep. Now, Malaya also has two children from a previous relationship who also live with them, four-year-old Jack and six-year-old Lily. They do attend school at Salt Springs Elementary, but they've been sick.

3:06While Malaya and Daniel are in bed, they say that they can hear Jack in the kitchen, and Lily seems to be kind of running between the bedroom and the kitchen as well. Unfortunately, the timeline is a bit unclear. But sometime around 9.30, Daniel begins to nod off. After about 20 minutes, he wakes up and sees Malaya asleep beside him. But he says that he realizes that their home was quiet, too quiet for a family with a one, four, and six-year-old. Now, Meadow's fine. She's still right there by them. But Daniel says this is when he realizes that he can't hear Lily or Jack playing anymore. so he gets out of bed to check on them.

3:43When he does, he sees that their sliding glass door was closed, but Lily's backpack and both her and Jack's boots were gone. Daniel says that from here, he immediately runs outside to look for them, but doesn't see them anywhere. At about 10 a.m., Malaya calls the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, the RCMP, to report her kids missing, while Daniel continues to look for them. Now, he doesn't really find anything other than these two footprints beside the home facing the road about 10 feet from the door. He told Global News, quote, I was ahead of the helicopters, ahead of the drones, screaming as loud as I can until my throat hurt, running through water that was up to my waist.

4:26He added, they hate being wet and cold, so they immediately would have come back into the house. The only two footprints are right beside the house facing the road, and that's it. End quote. Because the kids were believed to have left on their own, there was no Amber Alert issued. But the RCMP did understand the urgency and began looking for them immediately. And at 12.43 p.m., they did issue a vulnerable persons alert. This went out to cell phones in northeastern parts of Nova Scotia, including New Glasgow and Lansdowne Station. It explained that the kids were believed to have wandered away from their home.

5:04Six-year-old Lily was described as being four feet tall and weighing 60 pounds. She has shoulder-length light brown hair with bangs, hazel eyes, and may have been wearing a pink Barbie top, pink pants, and pink rubber boots with a rainbow print. Her backpack is cream-colored with strawberries on it. Jack was described as being three feet six inches tall, weighing 40 pounds, with dark blonde hair and hazel eyes. They believe he was wearing a pull-up diaper, black underarmor jogging pants, and blue rubber boots with dinosaurs on them. The next day on May 3rd, a second alert was issued with the same information but to an expanded area.

5:44But immediately, this was an all-hands-on-deck situation that included multiple agencies. In addition to the RCMP, they also had the help of the Northeast Nova RCMP Major Crime Unit, forensic investigators, and they utilized canine teams, helicopters, and drones with infrared technology. They also had the help of hundreds of volunteers from Ground Search and Rescue, help from the Civil Air Search and Rescue Association, Department of Natural Resources Air Services, the Nova Scotia Guard, and provincial and municipal forces from across Canada. I know it's a little exhausting to list all of these out, but I just want to convey the massive scale of this search for them.

6:26I say all hands on deck a lot, but this response was truly impressive. But also because there were so many people on the scene, the RCMP asked the public to avoid the search area. However, they were encouraged to share information about the kids on social media. I also think it's important to note here that Lily and Jack are members of the Sabeganegeti First Nation, one of Nova Scotia's largest Mi 'kmaq communities. But just to be clear, the RCMP does have full jurisdiction over this case. This search for Lily and Jack was nothing short of treacherous. This is an extremely rural area. Again, I feel like that's a word I use a lot, rural, but this is extremely, extremely isolated.

7:11It's also heavily wooded. And to make matters worse, this area in particular was extremely dense with thick brush and fallen trees from a 2022 to Hurricane, Hurricane Fiona. Searchers described this area as almost impassable. They literally had to climb over or crawl under some of these trees. Search manager Amy Hansen told CTV News that the brush was so thick in some areas that searchers were close enough to physically touch fingertips but couldn't see each other. This was also, unfortunately, the height of tick season in Nova Scotia. So of course, as difficult and dangerous as this was for the search parties comprised of adults, I can only imagine how difficult it would be for two children, especially ages four and six, to be in this environment.

8:00It seems like it was truly a best-case scenario in terms of response, and a worst-case scenario for search conditions. But the full-scale search lasted for six days, and the search efforts as a whole continued for 10. Now, sources do differ here, but some of the sources say that the area was as large as 8.5 square kilometers, or just over 5 miles. Of course, they started with the home and searching every inch of that, even launching a drone to search a hatch area underneath the home. They expanded to the wooded area surrounding their home on Garelock Road, and then expanded to outbuildings, nearby triseptic systems, culverts, mine shafts, and lakes.

8:43On May 8th and 9th, an RCMP underwater recovery team was launched to search the bodies of water near the home, but nothing was found. However, they did find what appears to be two pieces of crucial evidence in searches on land. On May 3rd, so the day after the kids went missing, searchers found a single boot print that they believe came from a child's boot. And nearby, they found what Daniel Martell says is a piece of Lily's blanket. Now, just to be clear, this is separate from the two prints Daniel Martel says he found beside his home facing the road. These were found near a pipeline trail over a kilometer or just over a half mile from the home, along that main road the home is located on, Gerlach Road.

9:28Amy Hansen said that while they can't confirm that the boot print belonged to either of the kids, she admitted that it was really the only thing they have to go on at this point. Now, these items are a hot topic of debate in this case. So just as a side note here, the RCMP did confirm the discovery of the boot print, but they declined to answer questions about what Daniel Martell says is a piece of Lily's blanket. Why they refused to answer questions is really anyone's guess at this point, but they go all in on this boot print. They send canine units along with human tracking teams. They create a cast of the boot print and conduct a new grid search in the area.

10:07But despite this promising lead, nothing else was found related to Lily or Jack. And on May 7th, the search was officially scaled back, as the RCMP announced that the probability of the kids surviving in those conditions was low. This message is sponsored by Greenlight. Money is this invisible thread that ties us all together. It's something everyone has to deal with. That's why teaching kids about money isn't just smart, it's essential. Greenlight is a debit card and money app for families. It's a safe way to teach kids and teens about money. With Greenlight, parents can send money quickly, get spending notifications, and even assign chores.

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11:32Volunteers in law enforcement worked over 12 ,000 hours combined over the 10 days searching for the kids. They meticulously marked each area searched with pink and orange ribbons. Many of these searchers were injured or had to leave the search efforts due to the emotional toll it was taking on them. Now, there were also a few subsequent searches in the weeks after that initial 10-day search period, but again, there was just no sign of either Lily or Jack. Of course, we know how these things go. While physical searches are being conducted, they're also conducting interviews, gathering evidence, and in this case, collecting hundreds of hours of video from the weeks leading up to their disappearance.

12:14This came really from the areas surrounding Lansdowne Station, specifically footage taken along Gearlok Road, focusing on 12pm on April 28th to 12pm on May 2nd. They also had dashcam footage. I mean, one neighbor, Melissa Scott, provided hours of video footage from her seven trail cameras that dated back to five days before the kids went missing. They also obtained video from a store near Highland Square Mall in New Glasgow. The goal was to figure out which way the kids may have gone, and to also establish any timeline they could. So far, it doesn't look like any of the footage has helped the RCMP get any closer to finding Lily and Jack, but they were able to establish somewhat of a timeline.

12:58Here's what we know. The last time they went to school was April 29th. There was no school on the 30th. On May 1st, they stay homesick from school, but they were seen in public that day with Daniel, Malaya, and Baby Meadow. This has been confirmed by both eyewitness accounts and video surveillance from a store near Highland Square Mall in New Glasgow. So while some people have speculated that maybe the kids went missing before they were reported missing, possibly that being the reason they missed school, that doesn't appear to be the case. And I really am going to try to make a point to correct as much misinformation as I can in this episode, because rumors and speculation have been running wild in this case, to the point that the RCMP and the First Nation have publicly spoken out against it.

13:43Now unfortunately, that really is where the timeline of the kids going missing ends, but of course there is more to go over in this case. I mean, just to address the elephant in the room, after such a vast search, investigators of course have to look at the family, or anyone else who might want to harm Lily and Jack. Daniel Martell says that both kids didn't typically stray far from home. Them just up and leaving like this was highly unusual for them. Both Malaya and Daniel have stated in separate interviews that the sliding back door was nearly silent, and they can't hear it when it opens. However, according to reporting by CBC News, they also have a family dog that barks at absolutely everything, and for some reason, they didn't alert to the kids going out the door.

14:28Malaya specifically added that the kids were not the type to go outside alone, and that they were always accompanied by adults while doing so. I mean, these are small, small kids, four and six, and there are miles of wooded area surrounding this home. It's a dangerous place for young children, but I think we know that not all kids are aware of the dangers around them, And I think it's fair to say that these kids were familiar with this area, and kids do wander away. I have told you countless stories in our segment of Hope featuring kids who wandered away and were later found. We know it happens.

15:03While I'm by no means on the side of attack the family and think that all their behavior is suspicious, to be fair to Lily and Jack, we do have to look at all angles here. Could there have been some type of accident that's being covered up? Did one of them hurt the kids intentionally? We don't know. And at this point, the authorities don't either. What I can do is tell you what we know and what's been said by all parties. Now, I do think it's worth noting that this has caused a rift in this family. While it doesn't appear that Malaya and Daniel are married, they were certainly living together as a couple.

15:37But on May 3rd, just the day after the kids went missing, Malaya took their baby to a relative's house, and it appears that she actually left Daniel all together. Daniel has also confirmed this split in interviews, saying that they haven't talked in weeks. However, before you get excited, it does not appear that Malaya has fled the country as some have speculated. She hasn't even left the province, just the family home to be with her mother's family. That's what we know. What we don't know is why this separation happened. Was it the stress? Or did one party suspect the other of harming the kids?

16:12Again, we don't know. But there's no denying that all eyes are on these parents. Malaya hasn't spoken to the media much. Her mother told CBC News that they were instructed not to speak to the media, while the RCMP states that they told everyone involved to just be mindful of what they're sharing with the public. I also think it's important to note that Daniel Martell has said something similar, that he was asked to not provide updates in the case, but he has participated in many interviews. Here's Daniel in an interview with CBC News to discuss what happened that morning in his own words. Malaya and the baby were asleep.

16:52Lily came in multiple times. I was not in deep sleep by any means. And then about 20 minutes passed, and then when I woke up, Malaya was right beside me. She was still asleep. And I said, I don't hear Lily and Jack. I ran up in the woods to the kids through. They have cabins up in the woods, which only took me like 30 seconds. I came right back down. She was on the phone with the RCMP. This story just sounds odd. Mm-hmm. Do you understand that? Yes, I do. And I see it every day online. And here's Malaya in her own words. What happened was we woke up. I heard them playing in the next room beside us.

17:38And I was drifting in and out of sleep. And they're not the type of kids we tell them not to go outside on their own. We always make sure that we're out there with them, watching them. And they happen to just get out that sliding door and we can't hear it when it opens. And they were outside playing, but we weren't aware of it at the time. And the next thing we knew, it was quiet. And we get up and I tell him, my partner, Daniel, I tell him, do you hear the kids? And he says, no. And we get up instantly. We're looking outside. We're looking everywhere, yelling for them, and I instantly just call 911.

18:18Polygraph tests were administered to both Daniel and Malaya. Daniel says he passed his, but he was not told if Malaya passed hers. Here's Daniel again speaking with CBC News about the suspicions against him and the polygraph test. The stepfather was always a prime suspect right off the beginning. I was extremely nervous. Especially with the first question they asked, did you kill Lillian Jag? That was the first question they asked you? Yeah. Yeah. When did you find out the result of your test? Immediately right after. What did they say to you? You did a good job. You passed. Daniel states that he's been fully cooperative in this investigation.

19:03And that does appear to be true, not only through his statements, but it has been confirmed by the RCMP. He says he was interrogated for four hours and told CBC News, quote, They searched every rock, every root, everything. I've been giving them every detail, everything from my bank account statements to all the information that came off my Google Maps. End quote. The RCMP stated that they have interviewed 54 people in this case, and that all of them have been cooperative. They've also taken and searched both Malaya and Daniel's cell phones, along with numerous other items that the RCMP has not explained in detail.

19:43Now, many people have also wondered about Jack and Lily's biological father. Maybe he had some reason to take the kids. So let's dive into that. His name is Cody Sullivan. He and Malaya were in a relationship for about three years. But it became a bit rocky when Cody lost his construction job, his apartment, his vehicle, and moved in with his mother, Belinda Gray. Ultimately, Malaya left Cody, and according to statements from Belinda, she and her family told Malaya that they would support her no matter what. Malaya petitioned for full custody of the kids, and Cody didn't fight it. According to statements from his mother, he said that he essentially was done and walked away from the kids.

20:25However, Belinda remained present in the kids' lives, at least for a while. She describes Malaya as sweet and said that despite her fears that her relationship with Jack and Lily would change after the breakup, it didn't. She says Malaya would bring the kids by whenever she asked, but by the time the kids went missing, it had been about a year and nine months since she last saw them. Like Daniel, Belinda has also been pretty vocal in the media. Here's part of an interview she gave to CBC News. The mama of my grandson called me we were in town. Hmm. Shastiff, I heard the news. She sent me the article that was on Facebook showing the kids missing.

21:11I couldn't call Malay yet, so I waited till we got home. And I called. Well, I didn't call her. I texted her. And she told me that, yes, that the kids were missing, that they'd been missing since this morning. I was in a state of panic, shock. but in the back of mine and I kept saying well they'll find them I mean

21:40I'm assuming that they'd find them so I told her well we'll head out first thing in the morning and help with the search it was around 3 between 3 and 3.30 in the morning a couple of cop cars pulled into the driveway the lights wake me up that I'm a fairly light sleeper So I see the cars pull in. So I knew what it was. So they come inside. They only stood in the kitchen. They wanted me to wake Cody up. And they wanted to know when was the last time he had seen the kids. And that they were just making sure that the kids weren't here. And then they left. Saturday morning, me and my sister. And we met up with my daughter.

22:25And we started. Well, I asked Malaya. I said, Malaya, you know your kids. Nobody knows their kids like their mom. Where do your kids normally go to play out in the yard? What direction do they usually like to explore? And she said, well, they always play up in the little woods on the side. I said, well, okay. I said, we'll start from that point and we'll work our way out. We had spoken to a search and rescue and we weren't allowed on the other side because that's where they were searching at the time. So we just started combing through the woods up through there. We were gone for a couple of hours.

22:59I'm yelling for Lily and Jack. We always call Jack, Jackie boy. And yeah, that went on for a few hours. But those woods, I started to feel that I can't see them being in the woods. There's trees everywhere. You literally have to climb over trees, climb under bushes. It is really, really sick. We come back out and I wanted to see Malaya again. I assumed she was in shock. She was very non-emotional, very just flat, monotone. But Malaya's very soft-spoken anyway, that she's not usually excitable. I thought that that made her a really great mom. She was an excellent mom. She never raised her voice at the kids.

23:51It was always, now, Lily, what did mommy say? And I used to think, now if anybody's meant to be a mom, it was her. Now, she does go on to say that after seeing the home the kids were living in, she felt like there was some type of change in Malaya. The house just wasn't as clean as Belinda remembers her keeping it. But she admits that she's not sure if that was due to so many people coming in and out of the house since the disappearance, or if it was like that all the time. Other than that, she speaks very highly of Malaya. Belinda and Cody were formally questioned by police about three weeks after the kids went missing.

24:30According to Belinda, Cody explained that he hadn't seen the kids in about three years, and he was upset that the RCMP was treating him as a potential suspect. But Belinda said that she understood why these interviews had to take place, and went even further to say that she wished that they'd done it earlier so they could move on to finding the kids. She also said that the RCMP did call Cody back to let him know that they were no longer considering him to have any possible involvement. So according to Belinda, Cody seems to have been cleared in this case. However, Belinda has stated that after helping in the searches and seeing the area, she does not believe that the kids simply wandered into the woods.

25:10She believes someone hurt them. There were more searches for Lily and Jack on June 1st and 2nd. they were still focused on the area around the family home on Garelock Road and along the pipeline trail. About 75 volunteers came out to help, but nothing new was found. The next day on June 3rd, they held a public candlelight vigil outside the RCMP detachment station in Stellerton to mark one month since the kids went missing. Daniel did attend this vigil. On June 9th, the RCMP made a statement that they are still committed to this case, but didn't have any updates to report. At this point in Jack and Lily's case, the RCMP says that they've received over 500 tips, and they are continuing to follow them.

25:57Officially, this is still a missing persons investigation. However, Jim Hoskins, a retired Halifax regional police officer and former major crime staff sergeant, is really saying the quiet part out loud. He's not officially a part of this case, for the record, but he says, in his opinion, the case is being worked as a criminal investigation. Really, he says it's just common sense. He says that the only other option after all these searches didn't bring home Lily and Jack is to work the case assuming that there's some type of foul play involved. But despite his title, that is just speculation, which I always feel a moral obligation to point out.