$1M Stolen Rail Merch & Why 600k Carrier Lists Are Complete BS

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0:53We'll be right back.

0:55Malcolm Harris: Ladies and gentlemen, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to a Wednesday edition of What The Truck. I am your man, Malcolm Harris, joined officially by my brother. It is Mr. Michael Vinson out there in Dallas, Texas, representing 147 Studios. Mike, what is up, brother? How you doing? Looking good. I'm doing fantastic. Look at you, brother. What's happening, man? Listen, clean shave, man. I shaved just for our guest today because I didn't want to look dusty, man. Sweet, dude. You don't want to look dusty. I don't want to look dusty. Didn't want to look dusty. We got a great guest. My man, Tristan, he's a good dude.

1:33Malcolm Harris: This is going to be a good one. This is going to be a good one. You guys heard the man. If you guys don't know, let's look at On Deck to see who we have here on the show today because Tristan is in the house. I'm talking Tristan Bordalo, man. This guy is a three-time founder. he spent so much time in trucking we're going to get into his entire background but the guy he's he's done it just about at every level i'm talking brokerage agency ownership owning trucks and now he's working around the supply chain startup space and he is a phenomenal man he's got great energy this is going to be a great interview and uh i'm excited mike appreciate you putting this one together brother hell yeah man i mean i mean two of my favorite people in in freight how could i not bring us all together.

2:18This is going to be a wild one and I'm ready. Here's the thing. You're going to quickly realize Tristan is just a darn, just a damn good human being. He's a great dude.

2:28Malcolm Harris: If you say that, I know the brother's talented, man. I know he's a good dude. I can't wait to talk to him. I can't wait to talk to him. I'm telling you. It's fantastic. You having a good week so far? You having a good week? Yeah, man. Yeah, hell yeah. Hell yeah, I am. Well, except my Indians are about to get swept by the white socks but that's okay listen man uh you were hilarious uh maraq they're not even my indians anymore now they're not you know they're not they're not they're not the indians yeah you sell the team trade ramirez who cares you know what i'm saying well uh freddie freeman and the dodgers i mean back-to-back home runs freddie freeman is a braves i don't know how Braves fans are supposed to feel about Freddie.

3:14Malcolm Harris: Okay, that's how we feel about him. I just got one. Frazier could get him. They hate him. They hate him. Oh, yeah, man. Dodgers are... Frazier, I'm sure Frazier hates him. I didn't get to hear Frazier's speech. Yeah, I imagine. He was not... Well, we talked about this before. You can hate the Dodgers, but you can't hate the individual players. You just can't. That is such a true statement. I really love the individual players and what they got going on as a collective. it's just like this is really bad for the sport of baseball

3:49Malcolm Harris: I need live feedback from you throughout this show this is great this is beautiful Shohei is a gambling addict for sure no come on now man you don't know any of that shit look if he retires and goes and plays like B basketball right for a while to let all his gambling blow over like MJ did then then we then we got some evidence you know me and show hair actually the same age he's like a month older than me and it kind of puts in perspective like yeah like he is the most amazing baseball player in the world but i don't think he could hop on what the truck and do what i do i don't think so so that is what that is that is what i take solace in knowing that you know show hey can do something but but you gotta understand this he probably drawn a bigger audience 100%.

4:42You my brother, but Shohei's big on. You know what I'm saying? Shohei, he's incredible, dude. You're not strong in the Tokyo market.

4:56Malcolm Harris: I ain't got enough out there in Tokyo, Japan, man. Yeah.

5:02Malcolm Harris: Oh, man. As you guys can tell, this is going to be a fun and amazing episode of What the Truck. All right, we got a lot up our sleeves, but it would not be possible without our sponsor, of course, that is TruckStop.com. The team at TruckStop.com is absolutely incredible. Appreciate you guys. Colleen, of course, the rest of the team for all that you guys do to support us here at What the Truck. And again, for more than 30 years, TruckStop.com has helped carriers and brokers move more freight profitably. It is an all-in-one freight platform covering load matching, compliance, and payments. Carriers meet ABA, truckstop.com's voice assistant.

5:43Malcolm Harris: Inside the truckstop.com Go app, you can actually go and search the live load board. All right, you can check rates. You can get patched through to the broker all without taking your eyes off the road. It's included with load board advanced and pro at no extra cost. And brokers, truckstop's broker assistant and risk factor. It actually helps you fill capacity and spot carrier risk before it becomes your problem. You can learn more about this and our sponsor of the month here at WhatTheTruck at truckstop.com. Again, that is truckstop.com. And in just three weeks, count it up. One, two, three. We are going to be - Not one, not two.

6:24Not two, but three.

6:26Malcolm Harris: We're going to be at the Future of Freight Festival. Ladies and gentlemen, it is F3 season. And you guys understand the magnitude of what I'm saying, but it is going to be at the signal October 27th and the 28th. A little buddy of mine called me yesterday. I was on his show Trucking Sense. He goes by the name of Charles Gracie. He is officially in the house. Chucky Gracie is going to be in the house officially. So we're going to have a nice little collab, hopefully, between what the truck and brake check. It's going to be a good time. Yeah, we're excited to have. Yeah, what's up, Mike? Break the truck or truck the brake.

7:09Malcolm Harris: It's going to be like a WWF versus WCW type thing. That's what I'm thinking. You know, make it really wrestling. I think you take him, dude. I don't think there's any question. We're going to see, man. He's trained up, and we're going to do it right. Again, October 27th and 28th. Tickets are on sale right now. You can use a promo code. We've got multiple promo codes, The one that you guys have been familiar with is Take 20. But there is also several other codes located on the website right now. So tickets will not last. There is a limited capacity. What's up, Mike? I'm just going to say this. Come to think of it, I've never seen Charles Gracie, Matt Leffler, or Craig Fuller in the same place as that lizard.

7:53Malcolm Harris: Honestly, you're not lying. You're telling the truth. Could be any one of the three. You're telling the truth. Yeah, and I've never seen them all in the same room as well. That is not a lie. So, yeah. Yeah, we'll definitely see about it. Let's look at the overall itinerary for F3. So you guys know what you guys are getting out of the money and what you're spending on it. So you're going to have Supply Chain Day, of course, on day zero. That is Monday the 26th, followed up, of course, by the Freight Brokerage Compliance Symposium. That is going to be an awesome, awesome time. We're going to have several type of fireside chats there, as well as a great keynote.

8:30Malcolm Harris: If you're in the brokerage space, you would be foolish to not take part into that. And then also the F3 Awards Dinner is going to be on the 26th as well. So we're gonna highlight a lot of different organizations, specifically the Freight Tech 100. So you get to know the names and meet the faces behind the biggest brands and supply chain, trucking, and all the good things. And then day two, which is technically day one, we're gonna say the 27th, all right? It's gonna be day one. followed by day two on the 28th. So we got a lot going on, man. This is going to be, again, the event of the year, the Future of Freight Festival F3.

9:08Malcolm Harris: Tickets are on sale now. So again, make sure that you're getting them while supplies last because once they're gone, ladies and gentlemen, they are gone. So that is, of course, your bill payment brought to you by, of course, truckstop.com as well as F3. Now, let's do what we do. Let's get to the headlines before we get to Tristan because I'm excited to bring him. Yeah, we got some stuff to talk about. We got some stuff to talk about. Now, one of these headlines, we've already discussed, but there's a little bit more details that we have been made aware of, so I wanted to kind of bring that to everybody.

9:44Malcolm Harris: But as it gets to you by— We're talking about two of these. Technically, two of these. Yeah, see, you're doing the scouting report. I like you, Michael Vincent. I'm in it, baby. You're doing your scouting report. Well, I want to. oh man all right let's go to la i could i could throw that ball a quarter mile everybody know how i play everybody know i i go in uh we're talking about practice all right all right la pd la la pd they officially uh are back in the news and uh because they've been doing a little work out there they haven't covered one million in stolen b and sf and union Pacific Rail Cargo in LA.

10:25Malcolm Harris: All right, so put this in perspective. The detectives from the LA Police Department, LAPD, they searched a Whittier, California shoe retailer at the end of September, uncovering 59 pallets containing branded merch. All right, LAPD connected the goods to a stolen BNSF and Union Pacific Rail Cargo trailer. The recovered property totaled about 1 million. Police also arrested business owner Wasim Saman on site. The hall included the following brands, Nike, New Balances, Brooks, and Sanuk Footwear. There was also Yeti cups, jugs, Jansport backpacks, and Shark vacuums. This is one hell of a combination.

11:07Malcolm Harris: Authorities also served a warrant at Whittier Retailer Shoes and Shoes. The brands covered consumer goods, spanning, of course, apparel, drinkware, luggage, and appliances. All right. So what happened and how this went down is there was a warehouse search. All right. So the task force detectives, they contacted Saman, who was, of course, detained, while executing a search warrant, according to LAPD. The 45-year-old resident admitted to purchasing much of the inventory from brokers or middlemen, as you guys know. and then police characterized those suppliers as illegitimate distributors serving the listed brands they booked them at the van noise jail on suspicion of receiving stolen property so question my my thoughts here yeah should he did he know do we think he knew he was getting it for the load do we think he knew they were hot i think it's a case of plausible deniability so yeah You know what I'm saying.

12:04I know what you're saying. Yeah, but wink, wink, nudge, nudge, say no more. He, you know, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Yeah. Prove he knew. That's going to be the hard part, right? Yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, he's in jail. That sucks. But yeah, he knew, but can you prove it? I don't know. I have no idea. It's funny. I was just talking to Ann Ranke. She's, you know, CEO, president of IANA. And I asked her if there was, you know, the same type of, like, you have theft and fraud and stuff like that in rail like you do in trucking, right? Like, is it that prevalent? You know what I mean?

12:42She said, well, fraud, not so much. It's really hard to knock on another door and say, hey, we're here to pick up that shipment for BNSF. You know what I'm saying? For sure. But theft, yeah. There's an issue with theft. It's not as big because of the type of cargo usually on trains, right? You don't steal a whole lot of coal cars and massive volume is 10 and long, long range type of stuff. And they don't randomly stop.

13:09Malcolm Harris: I just wonder what happens next with this because the money, the dollar amount, I mean, that's a million dollars in merch. Well, I mean, I looked into that too. So I looked into that too, right? And so here's the interesting parts behind it, right? So rail is somewhere in$100 million a year cargo theft, right? Which is far less than trucking, right? And you would suspect that. It's a much more difficult thing to do, right? Right off the rail, right off a rail car. It's much more difficult and much more difficult to target and know exactly what's on that rail car. You know what I'm saying? Intermodal, hell, the BCOs don't know where their shit is most of the time on rail, you know what I'm saying?

13:49let alone tracking it to pinpoint and steal something. They don't know what's going on there, right? But, you know, I mean, there's other bigger ones. A million dollars is big, but, I mean, there's, you'll see 200, you know, 2 million, 5 million, 10 million dollars, specifically in shoe theft. Yeah. You know what I mean? Shoes are, and here's the thing with shoes. Depending on what the shoes are, the stolen merchandise can go higher than retail. why is that because it's just depending on the brand of the shoe it's the brand of the shoe it's the release it's that type of stuff oh i'm the first one to get these new release shoes well people pay a premium to get it before everybody else does you know what i'm saying you see that

14:35Malcolm Harris: dude there's online auctions for shoes dude yeah yeah it's like a whole different sector of the market is a whole different thing i will say you do see that believe it or not in memphis uh because you know, the Nike factory is there. So you see a lot of these rail cars that are, you know, infiltrated. And then you see a bunch of folks in, you know, Memphis with, you know, I'm not saying everybody, this is a very small, like there's great folks in Memphis. Everybody in Memphis got the latest. I heard, I heard what I said. I was like, let me, let me, let me walk this back. Uh, I love, I love the M.

15:08Malcolm Harris: I don't want no disrespect. Uh, but yeah, you'll see it. And, uh, you know, we talked about it as a friend of college. It was like, yeah, like, you know, legitimately like people you know uh you know break into these real cars and get this new merchandise and it kind of uh takes a hit with nike uh quite a bit so yeah completely get where you're coming from um read more on this by the way guys for those that uh want more information freightwaves.com you guys know where to get it um we've talked about this next article in detail but this is a different take on this and this is from mr adam wingfield so you guys remember that we talked about this rico case all right and uh this was again six trucking companies suing ch Robinson and TQL in federal court in Texas, alleging that brokers benefited from working with carriers that use things like forced labors, fake logs, safety shortcuts to operate at lower cost.

15:55Malcolm Harris: All right. So the RICO case, all right, isn't just saying you did something illegal, so I lost money. It's a key distinction for a civil RICO scheme. What it is, is the plaintiffs have to establish an underlying pattern of qualifying criminal activity and then demonstrate that they were injured by reason of that conduct. So essentially the plaintiffs are saying that this illegal, non-compliant carrier behavior, cheaper transportation, brokers won the freight, legitimate carriers lose their freight, we lost revenue. The defense is likely to say that there's too many steps and that's where the 2006 Supreme Court case comes in.

16:35Malcolm Harris: And this is what Adam Wingfield highlighted in this. This was Anza versus Ideal Steel Supply Corporation, A steel company sued a competitor under Rico. The allegation was that the competitor avoided paying New York sales tax on cash transactions because the competitor allegedly didn't pay the tax. It could offer lower prices and take customers away from ideal steel. So this must sound familiar to you guys because I just walked you through illegal conduct, lower costs, cheaper prices, and then the competitor loses the customer. But the Supreme Court said it was not enough. And the reason was because the state was the direct victim of the tax fraud.

17:16Malcolm Harris: Ideal Steel lost customers, and that was more of an indirect consequence. There could be other reasons that customers chose the competitor as well. And this is what CH and CQL could try and apply here. This is how I kind of broke down the article. But Mike, I want your entire thoughts. I've been talking for a minute. You take it away. Tell me your initial thoughts when you read through this and about Adam's take on this. Yeah, so I don't necessarily disagree. And how can I disagree with Loeffler? You know what I'm saying? Or really, Adam, I respect both of them very much. But in my nature, I always look to the other side to see how well the side I agree with or disagree with stacks up, right?

18:00So I'm still trying to figure out where this case actually goes. And there's some things that they mentioned and some things that they conveniently miss or just miss legitimately, depending on if they're trying to support, you know, the people that are being sued, which, you know, anyways, we won't get into the politicking of reporting, but there is such a thing. So here's the thing in Anza, right? It wasn't a direct hit. The whole deal was that it was tax fraud. Okay. And the argument back from the judge was that the state can go get their own tax it wasn't the same thing so in this in this is in this issue i mean it it was rico case period the end the rest of it had nothing to do or isn't even similar to this case in my opinion because it was a tax thing they didn't charge tax and those people agreed not to and that's how they got the business okay so the plaintiffs here alleged that false electronic bids were submitted to the same shippers whose freight they lost.

19:04The alleged loss happens in the exact same transaction. It isn't a secondary loss. It's an initial primary loss, not a secondary like it was in ANZA. And it's not a tax thing either. Also, Bridge versus Phoenix in 2008, which is a much better, much more relatable precedent, was two years after ANZA. And the Supreme Court unanimously let the losing bidders at a county tax lien auction sue the rivals under RICO for cheating the bidding rules. Even though the false statements went to the county, not to the plaintiffs, losing bidders in a rigged competition were direct victims, just like a bid. That's what a bid is.

19:45It's a bidding competition. An RFP is a bidding competition. So that one much more closely aligns. It's a much stronger precedent. And it is actually the same, the exact same type of transaction and it was allowed to be sued under rico so i'm not so sure that ends applies in any way shape or form at least not better than bridge versus phoenix and i'm not so sure their argument stands up that's my that that's my take i'm not saying they're wrong i'm not a lawyer laugh leffler much smarter than i adam wingfield much more involved and smarter than i but doing

20:21Malcolm Harris: my research this is what i'm finding yeah they are smart but i i like my dog in the race as well And I thought you broke that down very eloquently. And you guys can also check this out from Adam Wingfield. Adam's been a busy guy. He recently drove in the Tesla Semi and saw some media assets from that. So, Adam, keep doing your thing. Adam's awesome. I love Adam. Yeah, he's fantastic, man, doing great stuff with our editorial team here, too, at Freight Waves. More on this, again, FreightWaves.com. Make sure to go check that out. Now, I want to pivot to one of our other riders. You guys know this guy very well.

20:53Malcolm Harris: And, well, you know, but you annoy him very well. This is Noi Mahoney. Ah, I see what you did. Noi Mahoney, TA Services. All right, they are acquiring two Texas cross-border carriers and adding more than 130 trucks and 550 ,000 square feet of warehousing to its growing U.S.-Mexico cross-border network. All right, so they're out of Mansfield, Texas. They're a 3PL provider. They announced Tuesday again. And it acquired the assets of the operations of Carmen Pacheco Transportation and Interload Affording LLC. The terms of the deal were not disclosed. But again, this deal expands TA's footprint when it comes to warehousing operations in El Paso and Laredo.

21:39Malcolm Harris: And you guys are not idiotic. You guys are not stupid. You guys know that those are two major, major hubs when it comes to cross-border operations. So, Mike, is this a trend of things to come for TA and other competitors, or how do we feel about this? Yeah, no. Okay, so first of all, TA is owned by PS Trucking, our boys over there in Birmingham, right? Yeah. Flatbed, primarily flatbed. Houston Vaughn, I think, is the president or CEO over there. I know him well, and there's some other people there we got to know in the beginnings of Freight Waves. Great, great people over there in Birmingham. Very cool outfit.

22:14But mostly truckload. And they've got subsidiaries, and one of them is TA. They own TA. And through those, they've been acquiring and diversifying into more dry van and cross-border. So I think this is just a – it's not just a – I think it's just a very smart play by Houston and the boys over there and gals over there at PS Trucking and the whole conglomeration to tap into a market that's obviously growing and making a strong bet on the impacts of renegotiating, what is it, the NMFCA or whatever it is, the North American freight or trade.

22:56Anyways, yeah, no, it's a great strategy, and it's a continued strategy because they already started this before. I think they already have like 120 or something like that, drive in through another acquisition, and now this puts them firmly as a player in the cross-border, which I think is a smart move.

23:13Malcolm Harris: It is a smart move. From their CEO, Scott Schell, I like this quote as well. Bringing our teams together gives us a stronger foundation to serve manufacturers and other shippers moving freight through the U.S.-Mexico corridor. As the industrial economy continues to expand in 2026 and over the years to come, we are setting ourselves up to be a key partner to support this growth. So some good stuff coming from Scott Schell and the rest of the team at CEA. You can read down this entire article from Norway. Again, great reporting, bringing this to you yesterday at FreightWaves.com. And then finally, the news that shook up our industry.

23:49Malcolm Harris: All right. Official acquisition of RXO. Again, we talked about this. It's kind of like we have one of those, like at least every month, there's something that's going to be dynamically just change the whole infrastructure, right? This is moving some pieces around. This is moving some pieces around. We talked about it in great detail. It was talked about, of course, on Freight Waves today with Craig and Julia. They did a great job of breaking it down. But I want to talk about this from a Wall Street perspective, all right? Because one concern that was raised Monday by side analysts who follow CH and RxO on a phone call following the announcement was about, all right, the antitrust concerns, all right?

24:29Malcolm Harris: How will you handle technology integration? What kind of legal docket does RxO face? and one by one, those concerns were swatted away. All right. All right. Given that most of the analyst questions included a congratulations to Dave Bozeman, of course, CH's CEO, it seemed clear that Wall Street was sold on the closest$6 billion acquisition. All right. So the two CH executives on the call were Bozeman and CFO Damon Lee. All right. Repeatedly said the deal was not done with the legal fallout from Montgomery and Kareeb case in mind. All right. Still, the term post-Montgomery world was kicked around during the call, represented more of an acknowledgement that the 3PL industry is going to change just beyond protecting legally.

25:14Malcolm Harris: All right. So from this, again, Damon Lee, their CFO, said, I do certainly think in the post-Montgomery world that the flight quality is important. So I think that factors into our confidence. All right, shippers who are confident in using C.H. Robinson and RxO separately are going to be even more confident in our capability as a combined entity post Montgomery that makes this discussion a lot easier as well. All right, so RxL was up on Monday and down on Tuesday. And yeah, this is something, man. I guess what's going to happen here, Mike, and please correct me if I'm wrong, but we're going to see not a lot of overlap, or is there going to be overlap when it comes to, I mean, it has to be some overlap, right?

26:02Malcolm Harris: Because it's an acquisition. Well, yeah, 100%. Well, look, okay, this is, I mean, and you know how I look at articles and I look at stories and all that kind of stuff. I look to see what's missing and what's in there. This is an interesting article. You should read it because it's a very interesting story. But this article is all along the investment side of things and doesn't really kind of dig into what it means to the actual industry or question some of those things that are being said by people who obviously are incredibly biased in telling you what, the truth is, okay, and what is actually going on.

26:39I mean, they can't say certain things, otherwise their stock goes in the toilet, right? They're publicly traded, so you can't believe almost anything that they say because you just have that lens says, okay, everything that they're saying here is kind of maybe sort of linked to the truth and they could get away with it probably in court. That's all you can get from a public CEO, period. I'm sorry, but it's the truth when they talk out there. It just is. If you don't realize that, then you've been living under a rock. Where does the$300 million savings come from? Let's see. What is the biggest expense at a brokerage?

27:21People. Gee, do you think there might be some overlap? I don't know. Maybe there's$300 million worth of overlap. I'll give you a nice value. I was a great point guard. Yeah, where else is there going to be a thing? carrier buying power baloney they don't deal with 600 000 carriers every single broker out there deals with 600 000 carriers it's not possible to manage those contracts and say that when i was in broker carol me look i got 35 000 carriers i deal with hang up because they're it's bs it's it's complete bullshit they can't have 600 000 carriers that they deal with on a regular basis and be able to tell you anything about 99.9 % of them.

28:05They can't. It's not possible.

28:06Malcolm Harris: I agree. Right? Antitrust. No. The biggest, look, the largest broker is buying the third largest. And the CEO just says, oh, it's not a concern. And so that we don't press anymore. Well, of course he's going to say it's not a concern. Duh. But let's look at the gap. $28.28 against$30.25 cash offer. I think that gap probably says there's a lot of investors that go, hmm, wait a minute. Maybe there is some concern here for antitrust. I don't know. You know what I'm saying? And the whole Montgomery contradiction, come on, man. You're completely contradicting. You're using the proof that you're wrong to prove that you're right in that statement.

28:48It's baloney. And they're going to trust us more. Yeah, right. C.H. Robinson, you just got sued and lost like twice in massive deals. and now you're under Rico also, but they're going to trust you more. I mean, because the bottom line, stock fell 15 % over two days. That would tell you that there's a lot of people that they're going, huh, I don't know.

29:12Malcolm Harris: I mean, you are not wrong, but the thing is, I got a feeling that there's somebody that wants to weigh in on this that has been chopping at the bit to get on here. So let's do this. Let's bring them out right now, man. Of course, man, we teed them up earlier here in the episode. I'm excited to have this conversation with him for the next 15 to 20. It's going to be Mr. Tristan Bordalo. Tristan, you are officially on What the Truck, brother. Can you hear us okay? Yes, I can. What's up, guys? What is happening? What is happening? There he is. How you doing, brother? It's so good to see you, man. Well, yeah, thanks, Malcolm, for having me.

29:49Michael, thank you. This is awesome. And I had no idea you guys were going to talk about the Dodgers, So my bad.

29:57Malcolm Harris: Oh, man. Oh, man. Frazier is not good. Our producers, he's not going to be happy with you. He's an Atlanta guy. I love the Dodgers. Okay. He just officially worded in that Tristan's cool. We're going to let it slide. All right. So we got love for you here on What the Truck, man. But, dog, the rotation. Freddie going to the yard last night. How about that? Back to back. Braves in five. Braves in five is crazy. That's what we're doing? fellas yeah i know he's he's dropping it and he he has the control over this stuff he didn't even get my name right tristan it's with a a not an i oh man it's with a a not an i oh good right now it's all good it's all good we're gonna we're gonna get it cleaned up so uh tristan how do you feel fired how do you feel about this uh this this acquisition with ch and r so that we're just talking about man i want your thoughts oh man i honestly i just i think they're just gonna get bigger uh they're gonna you know use ai to absorb the back office i mean that's probably where they're gonna get most of the savings um so yeah it but it's it's i don't know it's probably a better uber i guess yeah yeah yeah i don't want to say too much about it because i you know everyone always thinks I hate on the brokers, but it's not, you know, it's a totally different game than what we boutique brokers are playing.

31:27So they're after their share of the pie, especially when you have, and they're the incumbent. So if you have someone like Uber doing the same thing, I think C.H. Robinson could do a better job and probably better for the industry, I think.

31:41Malcolm Harris: Let's talk, I'm going to go back to back real quick before I toss it to mic, because I personally want to know about this. I mean, you've doubled up my time in the space here. So you got 22 years. I'm just at maybe 10. All right, so looking at this, I'm a young guy. I consider myself still. You've done everything. Every angle, started in LTO. What do you know now, 22 years in, that you just didn't understand and necessarily didn't want to know back when you first got in the game here in Freight? I think the biggest is the cost for me is, and it's not just the stuff that you see on the profit and loss statement or balance sheets, but it's the things you can't really quantify, like, you know, just how much the delays and all the distrust and all the fraud that's going on.

32:34And it's actually kind of sad. I think, you know, the good news is I felt like, you know, we've gone a long way from where we were at. But at the same time, I think we've gone the wrong way. Yeah, that's a great statement. We've gone a long way. Anyway, I love that. I love that perspective. And I know you've learned quite a bit because you and I have talked recently. Well, we talk quite often anyways. But I wanted to present you with your own Claude picture, my friend. And this is a collaboration between Cody and myself. So there it is. That is so funny. There he is, man. That's awesome. You got to send me that.

33:20Oh, yeah. For sure. For sure. So funny.

33:26Malcolm Harris: That's sick. That's crazy. You guys are crazy. You guys are crazy. This is fun. I was going to wear a Hawaiian shirt too. I'm so happy. I would have died, bro. I would have died. Man. Uh-uh, dude. I'm so glad I didn't wear it. I mean, when it came out with that picture, I was like, no, that, it nailed you right on. That is, that is you 100%. I love it. But, you know, look, you, you've learned a lot, right? And you and I, you've recently posted some things and talked to people about your recent change from, or not really, well, change in concentration, I suppose, or focus, right? From asset-based to your brokerage side, right?

34:10So, I mean, you're a 3X founder and did some things. So how did you make that change from asset-based, I am freight, to Freightopia? And what's going on there? Well, no, it was pretty easy. You know, I've always ran the brokerage alongside it. I just wasn't involved for the most part for the last eight years. I was, you know, I got away from the selling part because brokerage is all sales. And I wanted to learn. so you know i spent 14 to 15 years in brokerage and that's all i did which was ltl and truckloads and then i went to owning trucks and at the same time you know i started the brokerage and you know so it was an easy transition but i really wanted to learn the operation side that's something that i i always felt like i lacked and i felt that i needed to do this and also for like it was kind of cool to see my names on the trucks like i'd still i'd see my trucks on the road and i'd have to pinch myself like i did this it's so much different than having you know a bunch of screens on a computer you know so yeah it was it was cool and it was legacy like my kids man like my kids taking them to to see the trucks you know and you know my son was a fan of mac truck you know like the um what's that uh yeah i forget the cartoon the disney cartoon so it was cool to have like oh check this out i've got some real trucks yeah that's kind of what did you what did you learn from what did you learn from those from your asset days that you took into and now are applying uh to to to the brokerage side you felt like you were missing something you needed to learn that what what were those things that that you learned that now you can apply to what you're doing in the in side of things?

36:01Well, first understanding the costs that it takes a carrier to move our ship, you know, and it's, it's a lot, we put a lot of, you know, there's, there's a lot of pressures on and liabilities and risks that the carrier handles. And I wanted to understand that. And the only way to really understand it is, you know, not that you can't understand this in brokerage because you could get 80 % of the way there, but the next 20 % is what I really wanted to know. What was it like to not sleep at night? What is it like to have a carrier call you at the middle of the night? What is it like to have these delays, these detentions, and this, you know, just the world of all of a sudden, sudden repairs, sudden delays, sudden tire blowouts, sudden fuel increases, sudden expenses just increasing, just like insurance.

36:52It's insane. And so I wanted to learn that and see what it really took to support that kind of business. And that's what I'm going to take to my brokerage is being more asset-like, thinking about, I like what you said earlier with brokers bragging about 30 to 60 ,000 or even 100 ,000 carriers on their list, which is pretty much impossible. But I think if you support staying local with me now, with my brokerage, I get to work with the carriers that I could help out because I could understand their numbers. I that the risk, the liabilities that they're faced. And that's where I could really help them in saying, okay, these are the type of customers that I'm going to pursue versus just going after bidding and doing what every other brokerage is doing.

37:40Malcolm Harris: Tristan, in order to be doing what you're doing, you got to have a lot of heart and you got to have a lot of grit and willpower. And let's talk about that from a founder perspective, because you've been very almost too honest about what really being a founder is right like talking about the failures talking about like the ups and downs of the game why have you been so candid with about the the failures and the things that you've gone through and multiple times of founding things and pivoting or going into other aspects because it really is remarkable bro

38:20Malcolm Harris: oh i think we just lost him that was so sad because that was a great question but we're going to keep going and we're going to keep it was a fantastic question you know i i thought it was i thought it was off the chain but that's neither here nor there we're going to hopefully get tristan back in the meantime but for those that want to continue to talk about this michael There is something that I want to discuss, and it is related to the weather really fast. It's related to the weather. All right. We got something special for you that we did not even practice, but it's already here. Hurricane Isaiah is prepared to hit Tuscaloosa, Alabama.

39:02Malcolm Harris: Direct shot. A direct shot. Guys, this is hilarious. It's technically one letter off. We're going to talk about this hurricane system today on Freight Waves Today, but this hurricane that we are tracking right now is in the heart of the Gulf. All right, for this happening right now, if you are in Tuscaloosa, Mike, if you're the SEC, if you're the commissioner, Greg Sankey, do you move the game to a Friday? Do you move it to a Sunday? Or do you move it to, let's just say, a stadium that fits about 100 ,000 people? Neyland Stadium in Knoxville, the rival of both Alabama and Georgia. What do you do?

39:42No, I think you stay there and you be a man and you play it in the weather. Okay. Oh, that is the most Michael Vincent answer I've ever heard in my life. You know, come on, man. You never played Thanksgiving baseball. You know, look, on the shores of Lake Erie, Thanksgiving football, you know, You go out there, you eat turkey and whatever you go out there, but you got to play that game of football in the backyard or in the field or whatever it happens to be. There was regularly 35-mile-an-hour gale force winds coming off of the lake with 10-degree weather and mixed rain and sleet and shit. That's what football is, right?

40:25I hate the indoor games. I hate that crap, the mud and the blood.

40:30Malcolm Harris: You know what I'm saying? You want a real sport. You want something that's going to provide the people what they're looking for. But seriously, I don't know what the forecast is by the time it gets to Tuscaloosa, but it's normally not that bad by the time it gets there, right? I mean, it's hitting as a – I mean, the coast could get hit, right? It's like a two or something like that. Am I back on? Yeah, I believe – oh, we got him back on. We just had a quick meteorologist report. Appreciate you.

41:00Sorry, I didn't get the question. No, you're fine.

41:02Malcolm Harris: You're fine. You're fine. I was just saying, you've been very candid being a founder, right? And the failures that you've gone through and also the successes, right? But you've given it to us on a public platform in like a real way and not really sugarcoating anything. Why have you been able to be and pivot the way you have? Because it really is impressive to me, man. oh i i yeah i mean i just it's all the experience right you could just i always lean into my experience and i think it's going to get me through and uh you know there's there's nothing to be negative about you know failing in the asset side it's a really hard business and i think anyone that uh has ran one or even has just been on the sidelines they could they could say how hard it really is.

41:53So yeah, so it was, it's fairly easy. I've always been on the customer facing sides. So the transition is, wasn't that difficult at all.

42:04Fantastic. So let me, let me ask you this. So you get, you get back in your, you start growing your brokerage side, you go inside there and you told me this story before, but how you went in there and said, okay, look, this is how we're going to laser focus and make this thing work. And we're What was that thought process and why did you pick the specific vertical or space that you're in as a boutique broker? Well, I mean, Freightopia is now just we're focusing on consumer packaged goods. And I went to a natural products expo West about two and a half years ago, and I just fell in love with the culture there.

42:42And I felt like that was something that I wanted to get into. And later on, you know, this is later in my career where I'm not chasing everything and anything just to be able to ship. It just doesn't do anything for me. And the culture of consumer packaged goods, and I'm not talking about the Nestle's of the world. I'm talking about natural products. And I felt like, wow, this could bring me back to LTL because natural products don't move as, you know, they're not, the velocity isn't high as like laced potato chips or any Nestle products, but it's, you know, one, three, four, five pallets. And then, so I just thought about it in a way where I could just help those founders because I know how difficult in a position they are also with logistics.

43:24So I said, this is something that I'd be pretty good at. And it's something that I enjoy. And I love natural products. And it's funny because I've got in the other room, I've got all these like free samples of cool little new brands and up and coming natural products. So I think it's a pretty cool space to be in and something I enjoy. and what, you know, it can't get any better than actually loving what you ship and the people you're helping. And that's why I have this focus on CPG.

43:52Malcolm Harris: Let's talk about the people you're helping real quick because you, again, you found it a lot, but you help a lot of people. I want to talk about the metric specifically that you tell everybody or the item that you tell everybody to focus on because Cash is king. We can talk about that. Culture is what you make of it. But like, what's the one thing that you always tell people to really pay attention to and the one thing that you didn't pay attention to that you wish you would have in your career thus far? Like in terms of the people? Yeah, in terms of the people. Well, I mean, I don't know if I understand that question correctly because you went wrong.

44:35Malcolm Harris: I did kind of go on both sides. Is it helping the drivers? or? I would say when it comes to the question, yeah, when it comes to founders specifically, like, what is the one item that you're just like, hey, if you're not focusing on this, like, I feel that you are genuinely going to miss the mark. I mean, good products, I think, or services, right, when it comes to anything, if you're not focusing on the product and you're focusing on, if you're focusing really on money, people can tell. But if you really, you could tell by someone's story, and where their soul is and why they came up with that product or service.

45:13Because it's all about the story. And the product speaks for itself or the service will speak for itself. And that's something that I always look at even from, with what I'm actually going after in terms of trying to get their account. I'm looking at the founder and seeing if we align. So I'm looking for that alignment because I know what it's like to go out there and say, hey, look, I'm going to do this and you better do what you say you're going to do because otherwise that product or service is going to suck.

45:44Malcolm Harris: That's so real. You know what I mean? Yeah, no, 100%. Lead with products and services and back it up. That's some real stuff. I appreciate that. That's a good answer. Thank you. So, I mean, you are incredibly honest and don't deny anything that you've experienced, which is one of the things that draws me to being your friend and respecting you as a human being and as a business person as well. Because it essentially is who you are. But is it not also, or speak to that as far as something that a successful person or someone who wants to be successful needs to cultivate within themselves and inside their business.

46:36I mean, you said it, and I posted it everywhere for everybody to hear you say, I was just a loser surfer, and I wanted to be successful, but I didn't know how. I think you did, and I think you teach some people by what you're doing. Can you speak to that a little bit about what others should really be looking at as far as success if they want to follow your footsteps? oh man i think vulnerability and and that curiosity is what really helped me out curiosity was was always something that i had you know how do i make money i was always trying to find the easiest way so i could just do all the fun things like surf and snowboard or dj like everything that i i was trying to avoid the hard work but i know curiosity and just learning about something is definitely one of the, um, the traits that I think you'll need to, to be successful.

47:28And then vulnerability, you know, that's something that came on later as I matured. I just talked more about my, my, the challenges and, and being able to reach out for help because you can't do this all on your own. And so being vulnerable allows people to help you because if you're hiding the truth and no one's gonna you know then people can't help you because you're hiding and so i just thought just being open and and doing exactly the the work that i i was avoiding so and and and reaching out for help because that's that's going to help you through a lot of things instead

48:05Malcolm Harris: of trying to do it yourself no i think leaning on on those things is super important and and not just kind of internalizing it just for yourself and and being vulnerable to your point i think That's fantastic, bro. Oh, don't get me wrong. There was a lot of times in my earlier on, I thought I could do everything on my own. You know, you think you could, because you're young and you think you're invincible. But when you start handling a lot of money and accounts that you're responsible for, people you're responsible for, that's when it becomes real. Because it's easy to do it for yourself. But when you start to have people depend on you and you have employees and you have a lot of responsibilities, like, wow, I think it's best to be open.

48:51Malcolm Harris: Definitely, definitely. I want to talk about the great debate, all right? Brokers versus carriers. We've talked about it a lot here on the show. I remember my first month here on What the Truck, we hammered this one. But there's nobody really better to ask than you, Tristan, because you've been on both sides. So do brokers understand what carriers are going through? And then do carriers understand what brokers are going through? And a second part of this question, is this relationship going to get better as time goes by? Or where do you think we're at when it comes to the relationship between brokers and carriers?

49:27Well, you know, I'm going to stick with what I said before, which is, you know, we've gone the wrong way. And I'm not saying, I'm not doing that to talk shit. But I think some brokers understand, but most don't. They've taken the package belief that this is the market or this is what it costs. So they have this package belief that they've taken in from whatever big brokerage they've worked at. And they think that's the truth. So it prevents them from seeking the truth. And then I guess being on the carrier side too and understanding how some of the carrier friends that I made and how they didn't understand what the brokerage actually does, right?

50:08They think we just make all this money. So because we say broker versus carrier, that's already, you know, you put that versus word, we're already divided. And so that's something that I always think about because there's this saying, it's like, you know, trust equals transparency. And then you divide that by self-interest. And I didn't come up with this myself. It's Mark Cuban. But transparency, you know, is a numerator. And then the denominator is the self-interest. So if you really think about it, the more transparent, and I'm not talking about broker transparency, okay, guys, just being transparent about, you know, what it's like to be on the brokerage side.

50:51But at the end of the day, if the more transparent you get, the more trust you get with carriers. But you also have this thing called self-interest. that's greed so the higher the self-interest the worse it actually is for all of us it's like prisoner's dilemma it's better if we all cooperate together and the outcome will be better versus us looking after our self-interest because then you know the outcome will be worse for all of us and hence i mean that's where we're at today i feel i mean the self-interest is super high

51:20Malcolm Harris: it's heavy super high let's have this good stuff right there mike go ahead man it really is but i mean a lot of that is is is external forces that impact and enforce that right and and not not necessarily just societal pressures i mean we could talk about how we built a society that demands that or financial system that demands that right but the geopolitical landscape and and so on and so forth kind of forces you into that self-interest right i mean it's survival of the fittest at times right and you got a collaboration is great but at some point you can't collaborate if you don't exist anymore right and that that's a hard that there is a really hard balance would you agree yeah i mean it yeah of course i mean it's just i feel like we're we're more divided than ever right and and that's why it's it's being destroyed and um i i sometimes wish i could go back to like 22 22 years ago where it was so much slower but i felt like relationships were built, but it moves slower.

52:20But things move so fast now that how can you build these relationships? And I feel like everyone on their website or their, their, their, you know, values will say something where it's relationships or integrity. But I mean, I think they forgot it's on their website. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's actions, actions, not words, right? Right? Yeah, I mean, A lot of talk. And I mean, if you're you could sit with a carrier just for one week and you could see how the others are behaving. You know, those college kids behind the phone and the 12 screens that they have. They if the way they talk to carriers, you'll know.

53:02And it was it was crazy. The first couple of months I was booking loads eight years ago. I was like, wow, I'm so glad I never behaved this way. And I don't think upper, you know, like the executives or the founders even know this is going on. Or they know, but they're not willing to do anything about it because the numbers are speaking for itself. They don't need to fix behaviors.

53:26Malcolm Harris: For sure. And that just, it festers in really bad organizations because you have like this one top guy that has, you know, great principles and is kind of the stakeholder of the relationship. But then everybody else, it goes down and you lose that communication. Man, I could talk about this. for an hour. Tristan, what's next for you? I could talk about for a year. What's next for you, bro, in terms of things you got cooking up and how can our audience and our listeners and viewers get involved with what you got going on, man? Well, I just, I'm staying local, first of all, because I love what I've seen on the driver's side.

54:05First of all, I don't think it's very sustainable for drivers driving cross country. So I'm doing my part to just stay local. I want to just be in Los Angeles doing local deliveries. And that's where consumer... I mean, I happen to be in one of the best places in the country that adopts natural food. And that's why you guys made that funny picture of all this organic food. Because yeah, we do have the demographics and customers that are willing to pay for expensive groceries. So I just want to be local and I want to help my local friends that own trucking companies and warehouses. And we're here to help in California to deliver your goods, especially if you're in the consumer package natural product space.

54:54We're definitely here where the velocity is big out here. So being in Los Angeles, we could help you with our transportation. I mean, I don't feel, gosh, I feel like I'm selling now. what I mean is, yeah, we just help you with transportation in the Los Angeles area or anywhere within LA. So that's what I'm doing now.

55:14Malcolm Harris: Tristan Bardallo, representing the City of Angels. Tristan, thank you so much for being here on What the Truck, Brother. It was one heck of a show and looking forward to having you next time. And the boys told me in the back to tell you, chop on Braves and Five. That's what they told me to tell you. That's funny. We'll see about that. We will see. Maybe Shohei will bet on the daughters. Maybe he will. Oh. There we go. Tris, appreciate you, bro. I appreciate everybody for being here on the show. It's been an awesome jam-packed show. As we look to the road ahead, we got a great way to end out your Friday because we've got two great guests.

55:54Malcolm Harris: Both have been on the show, some repeaters for us as we head into the weekend. We got Adam Kahn from Netrodine. He's going to be on the show as well as Ari Silkey, the chief operating officer at TEN. Going to be on the show. Ari, Adam, that's it for us. Another episode of What the Truck. Like, subscribe, follow. Do all the things. I'm Malcolm Harris. That's Michael Vincent. We will see you when we see you. Peace and love. Holly.

56:47We'll be right back.

57:04We'll be right back.