Ep.37 Let's Talk About Sex With TikTok Star Hayley Morris

0:00I uploaded it and was panicking. I can't put this out there, why have I put this out there? Instantly I've got loads of likes. I've always been really embarrassed with my body. It's embarrassing that I've got a vagina and a vulva and boobs. Why am I living in embarrassment when it's, you know, like half the world experiences it? Someone messaged me earlier, like, how many sex toys do you have? I've got sent like four of the little roses and I was like, I'm going to give those out to everyone, I know they are great. You do have to prioritise yourself and I think if you lower your standards, rather be unhappy alone than be unhappy with someone.

0:30Men don't always know what you want and we don't always know what men want. We kept going in a long distance relationship. That relationship died at the three year mark. But I personally would say if you want different things, there's no end in sight. Think it's time to give it the end.

0:56hey guys and welcome back to working hard hardly working the podcast today's episode is with hayley morris who is a hilarious comedian and comedy writer she does stuff all over instagram and tiktok her sketches are just great and we have such a wholesome chat in this episode it was just really really lovely to have a little heart to heart talk about her career talk about everything she's kind of been through to get to this point to talk about how she's always done these little sketches it's kind of her comfort place she tried for eight or nine years to be doing this before getting any traction and then completely blew up on TikTok and now has over six million followers across her platform so it just is absolutely unbelievable so this episode is half and half It's half and half talking about Hayley, her career, her amazing comedy, her biggest life lessons.

1:45And it's also half about answering your guys' sex relationships and dating dilemmas. So it's a really juicy one. I had such good fun recording this episode. I hope it will be a really nice listen for you no matter what you're doing at the moment. As always, if you love the episode, please rate it and share it with your friends and subscribe on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, wherever you listen to it. I have a feeling you're going to really enjoy this one because I personally had a great time thank you so much to Hayley for coming thank you to you for listening and as always have a lovely day

2:18so thank you so much for joining me thanks for having me very excited to chat to you today can you take us back how did it all happen? we are going to go back to when I was like maybe seven there was a point where I was so shy my dad was like the only thing we can do is put them on stage like me and my brother he wasn't shy but that was his answer was go on stage that is a bold parenting choice honestly ridiculous so I was like there in the face of like you know everyone with the lights on me and I was like this is not for me um but kept at it for years and um in the background of that my dad would write little sitcoms or sketches and he'd get me and my brother to do the sketches and he'd film them looking back I don't think I ever understood the comedy of them I was just like oh I'm doing this or we're you know I would never find it funny because I'm a kid didn't really understand comedy but me and my brother always did these sketches our family and friends always found them like really funny and then getting older when I went to uni I was studying broadcast journalism and my lecturer was like everyone has to have a YouTube channel everyone has to you know get on there and practice being in front of a camera.

3:23You've been forced in front of audiences. I was like yet again here I am doing something I didn't ask for you. broadcasting to an audience and everyone's watching me again get out there be happy don't be shy I was like sure okay but I actually loved it I was like oh I'm really here for this it was like in 2009 but then um I was doing the comedy sketches and I I realized now I'm like I obviously was doing that because it had come from what my dad was doing with me my brother and so I'd obviously like developed a bit of a love for it really enjoyed doing it and um yeah I started making these comedy sketches and then those people found them uh at my uni and I was like oh my god delete channel but yeah I basically was doing that and then took it down and was like how embarrassing the whole rugby team have seen me like being a fool on the internet and everyone was like why are you doing that I was like I don't know I was like I actually don't know it just happened um and then I went back to doing it but with a different account and changed the name on there but it was quite blatantly still my face yeah and then people were like yeah we're just gonna be fine with you doing that now did it start to like gain traction was that why a part of why people started accepting it or were they just like no let her do what she wants no everyone was just like cool this is what Hayley does like sure and I have I've obviously you know privatized all those videos but yeah can totally get why no one was watching yeah do you see like a lot of evolution oh yeah yeah I feel like that got me to where I am now though there's a lot a lot of failing a lot of embarrassment a lot of what on earth was they thinking um but yeah I was doing it for 10 years or so um or maybe like eight or nine years and then kind of stopped for a bit and then during the pandemic along came TikTok and Reels.

5:08Just quickly with um YouTube so you were doing that for eight or nine years were you doing that alongside a more traditional job or was that making you money? so no it was probably making me about 60 pounds or whatever it is you can get at that threshold to pay you on google so it's probably about 60 pound a month which at the time I was like yeah google pay me I'm a youtuber I'm like I don't know if you've heard of everyone's on I was like yeah no I definitely brand deals but I like yeah google do pay me um people were like yeah no I don't think so um but alongside that I was uh working I did I was very much a quitter because I just really wanted this like wanted to go into comedy and I was always like it will happen something will happen so I worked in a beauty company uh doing social media and then I worked in like a viral video company doing their social media uh and then I did a lot of dipping out of hospitality because like it's just a struggle and I was always I always worked kind of two jobs made sure in the evenings I was making extra money and then the day was doing the social media and then on the weekends filming um but yeah I just kept doing it kept getting people being like still still trying and I was like I'm still trying I'm enjoying it and was it that you really loved it was it that you thought this is definitely gonna blow up was it I think it got to maybe year five and I was like this isn't gonna happen for me however there's no one that could say oh here's a million pound stop making videos because I feel like it's it's part of like almost like my lifestyle now and I love doing it I've always enjoyed doing it and that's why I don't think I've ever stopped doing it um like someone messaged me the other day I'm like do you think you'll stop making videos like if you do can you let me know like I need to be warned and I was like I truly think I'll be 90 still doing it yeah like it's so just something I just love it I love how this is all stemmed from your dad yeah I know like sitcoms yes did he have like a background in script writing or like he was a creative director at an advertising company so he wrote scripts but he also always wrote sitcoms and always wrote scripts and he was on like comedy forums where you'd write something in to go and like you know like a panel show just like writing the jokes so you're living his dream I'm living his dream I know and it's because he he like passed away in 2021 never saw any of it but I'm like I'm doing it for you dad oh my god so that like for me makes it even like like such a kind of like full circle moment exactly I I just like absolutely love that that was like his hobby and is that okay I know if you'd done it and then blown up really quickly you kind of be like yeah sure but like the fact that you like obviously clearly genuinely love it and then have been able to like create a career out of that it's just absolutely amazing wild like I feel because it took so long I feel like I'm even more grateful for it but it also hasn't sunk in so I wake up and I'm like this is my job this is actually I'm actually doing it now oh I love that so TikTok came along and did you hop on it straight away at the beginning of the pandemic had you what were you kind of working in at the time that everyone went into lockdown it's actually a weird like my mum always said to me everything that's meant for you would always happen for you and basically I was working at Disney just before the pandemic and a brand had reached out I can't remember who it was or they were an agency and they were like we want you to do the videos you do on youtube but transfer them over to musically and i was like i don't know what musically is sure um and i was like um maybe and they were like we'll we'll write you up a contract and you'll be paid like 400 pound for it and i was like oh my god that's so much money i was like oh my god i have to do it but i didn't do it i was like i um i didn't have the time because i was it was like 60 70 hours a week at disney so i was like i just don't think i've got the capacity what were you doing at disney so i was working as a bartender there okay um and I was like I just don't have the time to do it and then the pandemic hit lost my job at Disney got sent home and all I did was look through TikTok and I kept going oh I could have been one of the first ones on here and like maybe something would have happened um I've really missed the boat and then I was like yeah I've just missed the boat so the whole of 2020 I was like I've missed the boat I'm not going to do it and then 2021 um well by the end of 2020 I was like I'm just gonna of it ago yeah I'm just like I feel like this is a really fun platform I feel like I want to just like see what happens on here and then 2021 it just blew up and I was like what the hell is going on oh I love that and I also feel like I I mean I so strongly subscribe to the idea that like what's for you won't miss you because I also think that like some of my biggest like some of the biggest opportunities you get that then like don't work out or the things that you thought you wanted more than anything that like like the things I think of in my um like way back like I remember when I first started as an influencer like my biggest dream was to have like a like a clothing deal with like PLT or like something like that which personally for me now it's not very alive yeah um and like I remember realizing that in kind of my like second or third year of uni because that was like at the time that was like the height of what you were looking for like influencer at the time I was like oh my god I just like really want a collection with like PLT or Boohoo or whatever and then I remember and I like I kept seeing people getting them and being like I'm working so hard why does no one want me in the clothes like all of this and then like I look at that I'm like thank fucking god and then there's other things like right at the beginning of the pandemic I'd been signed for this like tv panel show like as a regular panelist and like I was really really excited about it and then I just looked back and I was like that just would have been I would I was at such a delicate state in my like mental health and I would have been just like put out into you know like almost like live tv and it just would have been terrible for me and like so was not that like the direction that I needed to go in and I just feel so strongly that like your life really like really really will as long as you're like putting in effort yeah and like trusting the process and just like kind of following what you love but also just like working hard like I really feel like it will always find the right path for you.

11:13I 100 % agree yeah. When you started those types of videos on TikTok what were like the first few about? The first I think the first few I made I kind of was like trying to find what worked so I was trying different characters the first ones I did were because I was in hospitality when I came home and obviously I'd been there when I was on Disney so I started doing the like what you actually want to say when you work in hospitality or like what people say and they were doing well they were hitting you know 100 ,000 views or so on TikTok but they also I was like I don't feel like this is it and then I tried another one which was characterizing someone and then kind of doing a spoof of it and I was like I feel like I also don't really like this it feels like it's almost felt like it was mean to the people that it was about that's not very me um and then I did I was just I had like a really big intrusive thought one day and I was like do you know I wonder what would happen if I you know acted that out and I don't think I I still don't really know what the thought process was it just happened and there I was like with me and my brain doing this acting out an intrusive thought um and I uploaded it and was panicking I was like oh my god I can't put this out there why have I put this out there and I was like I need to go back went to go and delete it and it just instantly had like got loads of likes and had loads of comments and I was like oh my god it's not just me I was like it isn't just me and then I just went with that yeah and So how do you like develop your characters?

12:36Do you like have an idea, try it, and then if it works, you do more? Or do you kind of plan ahead? I try to plan ahead. I feel like that's the difficult thing with what I do is I try to plan ahead, but I don't think I can ever truly plan ahead because it all comes from like my own experience of what I'm most inspired by. um but when I'm introducing a new character at the beginning I used to put out like polls on Instagram and be like you know who do you want next like what do you want to see and everyone was always like we want to see like boobs and vulva and I was like sure let's do that go on and I was like let's see where that goes um and then you know I'll introduce them and then see what people think and then I just try and think if that was a person how can I make like where would they go and try and build it from there but I feel like my brain characters probably had the most like development over time but yeah it's a real weird thing to explain my job yeah no I'm jumping up and down I'm a penis okay so you've got to imagine a penis in a sleeping bag that I won't use ever again jumping up and down um and those types of things where you do content about like more taboo topics why did you decide to and I know in the book as well you talk about kind of taboos and like normalizing like weird thoughts and all of that like why was that important to you I think because like growing up I've always been really embarrassed of my body really embarrassed about the things that happen to my body embarrassed of like the things I've been thinking or just like in general everything about my upbringing like everything has just been an embarrassment for me I've been like it's embarrassing I have a period it's embarrassing that I've got a vagina and a vulva and boobs um and I was like you know why am I living in embarrassment when it's you know like half the world experiences it so I just thought if I can say it like I would say it to my friends maybe that will help people and that was like my thing with with the videos I was doing it was make people laugh also try and make them feel like normal yeah no I think that's really important and I also think that like it's nice to be able to do that in an area where you're kind of rewarded for it like on somewhere like TikTok where people are a lot less polished it's a lot more like people are just you know you can't really it's not the same as your username popping up being like blah blah liked this like on Instagram like it's you don't need to have a TikTok account that has you on it at all so you can kind of I mean bad thing in some ways but also actually like a good thing in being able to just be like you can't some of the shit I go on TikTok and see I'm like wow you're really talking about this on the internet I'm like okay sure yeah go ahead I'm glad you're talking about this because now we can have this conversation even though we I'm not having a conversation with you like it's important to be able to kind of like open that up but I also just like love the fact that something like TikTok is so like some of the dating stories it's so unapologetic and people like three years ago there was no way no one would sit on Instagram and talk about a hilarious dating story no whereas it's almost like it takes away the power of embarrassing thing happen yeah it really does just like you'll never guess what happened yeah I feel like it's one of those things I think a taboo is only a taboo because no one talks about it like it's 100 % you know as soon as you start talking about and open up a conversation it's then like why was I so worried about like farting in front of my boyfriend yeah you know it's really not a big deal I don't know why we've made it such a big deal yeah yeah um but I think that is the the joy of TikTok is that you can say all these I mean there's some things that people do overshare to a point I'm like maybe that one wasn't for online but we tried it um not necessarily things I've done but I have seen other people yeah uh come out with you know things that yeah you know when people are like it's not too late yeah they're like if you read the comments you're like oh my god oh no that was too far but is it mean me thinking it's too far goes to comments and everyone's like yeah you can delete that one I'm like yeah there is a there is a line yeah yeah 100 and so how's your like career in comedy writing and everything come from come from this point was that something that sort of developed at the same time or like fully came from the TikTok stuff I think it was like at the same time but I still think I'm learning from I think the beauty of what I do is I'm learning on the job of what works and what doesn't work um especially going from writing 60 second sketches to a book was very like such a jump but really a really fun process of being like oh okay I don't actually have to cut loads of stuff out what I'm doing here is trying to make it something that's like a story to read rather than being you know something that you watch and get just the points you need out of it I can actually go into detail and you know it's it's just learning how to keep people captivated in a long piece as well as a short piece which I found like really yeah no 100 % and what made you want to write the book basically my dad he um he always well he's he wrote a book and self-published it but he'd always write books and then um send them to publishers he sounds so amazing he was just sitting there like writing like he he wrote this really good um I think it was a murder mystery kind of thriller um definitely wasn't murder mystery I don't know why I said murder mystery it's like a crime like a crime thrillery book um and he got it self-published and everyone that bought it that was kind of word of mouth through friends and family they were all like this is just amazing I don't know why it's not been published and it was always his dream and then Penguin were like hey do you want to write a book I was like absolutely sign me up right now I was like in fact he's a murder mystery I wrote earlier what about a crime how do you feel about this I swear I wrote it oh that's amazing and so what was that did you like pitch a concept to them yeah so I think it always had to be about what I was doing it always had to be like an extension of the sketches um But I wanted it to be more vulnerable, more honest, also aligned with the make people laugh, make people feel normal.

18:39So that was kind of the journey of that. It does make me laugh that I'm like, yeah, it's dedicated to my dad. But it's like a lot of mentions of like queefs and vulvas. Yeah, it's usual. I think you're proud of that one. Thank you, father. Not quite the crime book. Yeah, but that is that that's amazing. How is like the process of writing that? did you find it like I mean it's obviously very different from writing like a TikTok which is much shorter form but how did you yeah like how did you find that process I mean it's a wild process because I mean you've written a book and like I don't know you just find it very like daunting I guess because you know the word count as well so it's like okay how do I structure this but I enjoyed the process I made sure that I got up really early and joined like some days the 5am club because I work better with writing when I know the world's asleep it's really odd it's almost like I need a peaceful environment yeah yeah so I was like I'm really good at writing you know before 7am and then after 7am I'm a bit like oh there's so many distractions yeah I think the one thing you keep reading over and you keep finding new things you can add and change and there's never a point where you're like oh this is I'm 100 % finished and then once it's out it's out it's not like with a caption how you can tweak it or whatever and it's the thing forever so like if you put out a youtube video you can put out another one the next week or like what yeah whatever it might be and you're kind of it's constantly evolving whereas a book's a book a book's done yeah I found when I was doing the audio book because I did it um a few months after I'd finished the book I was reading it and I was like oh I really just I wanted to like ad-lib and you know change bits I was like I actually can't do that actually not allowed I regret not doing that but yeah no it's just you just find more more stories you want to add or more things so yeah it's just never another one I know my book too come at me so I want to do some dilemmas I've asked people for their sex dating and relationship dilemmas because I feel like as someone who talks about taboo topics and generally kind of you know opening up the floor to talking about things like this I have opened it up to myself excited the Instagram floor so my dating dilemma is that I grew up without male attention and now when a man is even slightly nice to me I'm always hopeful of it being in a flirty way because I rarely receive this attention however I am not looking for anything ATM but how do I break pleasing the male gaze mindset that's really tough isn't it I feel like a lot of us have grown up like that but it's just do you know what the one thing this is really mean to men and I don't mean this to be mean but um a wise woman once said to me that all men are losers and I was like they are I feel like maybe they are but it's just a good way to to look at it um and I don't I mean that in the most no I know what you mean it's like normalizing I think we're given sorry literally just hijacking response but I do think we're given this like superiority of men especially if you didn't grow up with male attention and male attention is seen as the be-all and end-all then you're kind of given this like it's given too much power yeah and what you really need to do is you need to take away the power that men have over you and therefore it's not about like as in when you're saying all of them are losers you're not being like oh you're a loser yeah it's being like it's a way to put them yeah it's like level as attention or male not attention and being like either way it's fine yeah and therefore kind of taking away the power of thinking that's necessarily like yeah good because I think everyone thinks they didn't get a lot of male attention when they were younger unless you're like emrata right in which case she knows she did yeah but like I think everyone thinks that they were like a pretty awkward teenager who maybe didn't get the attention that other people got whatever it might be and therefore we all have this like pedestal when it comes to like the male gaze or like that's what the patriarchy puts us in yeah as in it's like you will see the superiority of like you're the you're the like girl who's been chosen to have this attention or whatever and so we're all like I've you know had times where I've like not been looking for anything and then just because someone's like giving me attention sure like there's still times where you can go and like you know you might not be looking for something but it might still be a good thing to you know go on a date or whatever but actually like reprioritizing everything just because a man showed you attention yeah it's it's just it's a hard thing to break out of I think you need to focus on you and what makes you happy and I always think when I like I actually would prefer to have a woman say to me oh my god you look great today rather than have a guy say it um so I think you have to kind of shift to be like I'd rather get attention from other people that think they can empower me or you know they're there to make me feel good in different ways yeah and I think it is one of those things where you do just kind of train yourself to think more in that way as well like as in you know I was about to say like an actual sciencey thing again I always do this as if I have like some sort of like psychological sciencey background but I was about to say like cbt in yourself out of it so you know with like cbt how like this is the worst definition of cbt but essentially you're stopping yourself thinking things that you usually think or like stopping yourself in your tracks so if you're thinking that and then you're kind of like hot i'm actually gonna like why am i thinking yes go back to the source is it because i thought i looked horrible today and actually now this person's shown me attention i finally accept myself and validate myself yeah yeah is it because like it could be so many different reasons or because you're going through a breakup or because I don't know it's nice when someone compliments you whether it's a man or not or whatever but kind of just being able to be like stop yeah I think I feel like we're therapists right now yes without the qualifications without any qualifications we shouldn't be much cheaper but no I feel like in therapy for me I always look we look back at the source of where I've started feeling things and generally all of it comes from that space of when I'm younger not feeling good enough yes and I feel like that's one of those things that kind of you come from a place there you don't feel good enough or you don't feel yeah you've got to look for the source yeah well that's why people become serial killers isn't it all of them thought I'm not good enough I'm gonna murder everyone thought that they were you know everyone should get therapy before it goes wrong so everyone just see yourselves and stop it and we'll be fine let's break it there okay next one this one's hilarious and it says how to hammer it into men that just because i don't come from penetration doesn't mean i'm fine with not coming at all and then it says get on your news to be fair communication communication it was only until the relationship I'm in now where I was like hey you're gonna need to now finish me like yeah I'm not done yeah but let's not just be that's not that's not the end I think men are so used to women not saying anything so they're just like oh yeah we're done and we have more recent generations to undo in terms of that misunderstanding because I think that there's not been a lot of like female sex positive acceptance until literally the past like of course there were like previous waves of feminism where it's like but it was quite a niche like it still wasn't accepted to be able to like speak and be like hey actually like that doesn't work at all for me yeah like as in like it's nice but that's not me and a five yeah thank you very much that's a bone yeah um but like actually being able to kind of say you know like that type of communication was not accepted and was not required as like part of you know like someone in a relationship for whatever reason and I think therefore we all need to I think men as well obviously have a duty to be able to understand that like first of all orgasms often don't happen from penetration with women but also being able to actually like open the conversation because I will say that the method by which women orgasm is very different from woman to woman like more different from woman to woman than it will be for men and therefore being like very vocal in terms of like I'm so surprised at like how many people literally just like don't know the stats on that and like how it's something like 80 something percent of women like won't and so it's like let's have some conversations it's hard communication the communication is a difficult thing to bring up if it's not someone you're comfortable with but that I never know how to advise on how to have that conversation but I think you have to be really selfish and be like if I don't say something I'm gonna have a really shit time and I'm not gonna enjoy it um well you might enjoy it still but you're not gonna end how they've ended yeah yeah that for me I'm like it's too important to me to not say anything yeah and I think also not putting the pressure on yourself to necessarily sit like if you build it up too much and you think you're literally gonna have to say that the first time you sleep with someone like that doesn't need to be the case you don't need to literally like you don't need to put the pressure on yourself to ultimately ultimately they should be asking how they can do that too like to be honest but also in like it doesn't need to be the first time if you're sleeping with someone regularly they should absolutely know and have asked questions about that and you should have had communication about that and like it both of you should really want to bring that up yeah but can completely understand especially the younger you are how that is not like i literally used to like you know when you're like a teenager and you're with like your kind of like first partner and you're like lie there being like i wonder if we'll have sex soon as if you could like never initiate it yeah you can like that would be nice like afterwards you're like oh will that happen now let's never talk about that until the next time it happens and then we probably won't talk about it then the conversation's hard but it does need to come into things for sure yeah completely agree all right more questions not my current partner but a while back something happened and i want to know what you would have done so I had a friend with benefits for about a year dangerous and one night I was very drunk and peed the bed with him in it would you one admit to what happened or two lie and say you spilled something or another lie that was her option she's given I think I would have owned it yeah I would have been mortified because we all are in those situations but I would have been like yeah I pissed your bed because i thought you'd smell it yeah i think pee's got a real unless you just said you sweat the bed yeah and then your sweat smells like wee i don't know i think i'd pretend i'd like fainted i think i'd literally be like oh i don't know i'm afraid i died in the night someone burst my bladder it was you you squeezed my bladder in the night yeah or like you pissed yourself i yeah wake up and be like look what you've done yourself and it's gone all over me right on my crotch i also love that this is the first thing someone thinks of when they think of like a dilemma that i'd like in my dms and then she goes i said i spilt water and he was like oh that's okay it happens and then a few days later he texted me saying he knew i pissed the bed to be fair it's better than shitting the bed oh for sure i would rather be like i have to be fair I don't think that we in the beds, well, it can be embarrassing, but I mean.

30:10I do it regularly. I've not weed my bed before, since I've been a kid, because I've got the strongest bladder in the world for some reason. But my friends wet the bed so many times. Really? In like boys' beds when she's been drunk. And she's just like, yeah, I've pissed in your bed. And I love that, that she just says it straight away. Oh yeah, no, but you have to own it that way. I've pissed in your bed. That is a wild trait to have. Yeah. She's got the weakest bladder. That would stop me drinking. bladder and she's just got like a little paper bag i really appreciate the fact that she just still goes around yeah just like a pee band i've pissed me bed i'm so sorry your mattress is going to need to be flipped but you should probably flip it anyway yeah flip them every six exactly i'm just helping you out she's just done you a favor little reminders you are so welcome okay next one i've been seeing a guy for like four weeks he still hasn't taken me out on a date let alone asked me to be his valentines for people listening to this later date it is nearly valentine's date for anyone who's forgotten it is nearly valentine's um now i know i could just ask him but as someone who has terrible a terrible dating history i have demands this time around i think i'm just gonna put these aside and ask him out right some men get a bit lazy yes and they don't think it's what you want and they don't this is the one thing that's annoyed me in the past with people I've been with where I'm like hey I'm not I'm not asking you because I'm waiting for you to ask me and you still haven't asked me it's looking like about time you need to do something now um yeah I would just say I would be like hey you've not asked me so did you want to go out for a date and he'll probably be a bit embarrassed but I also feel like if you've had a rough dating history as you should have those demands that you should for the best for yourself oh 100 i also think like so the way i read this is you were saying not you for context not my guest the person who asked the question it's her um now i know i could just ask him but as someone who has terrible dating history i have demands so i think you're saying that your demands are that like someone goes above and beyond and makes an effort and then you're being like well I should just ask him shouldn't I and I think there's two I think I would usually say absolutely yes like before you walk away 100 % communicate like 100 % be like I'm interested in you I'd like to go out on a date um but I also would say if your demands as someone who like falls head over heels for you immediately wants to take you out all of this yeah like this might not be the person because you're now potentially compromising what you've already said as a standard that you're setting for yourself because it hasn't happened yet but I also would say that you set the tone at the beginning of when you're dating someone and if it's if you've been seeing each other like sleeping together very casual his perception may well be that this is just casual like that that's what you want that's the what you guys are going to be doing and that's also like very that's totally understandable that could work both ways and so like you do need to be able to communicate and just be like hey by the way would love to go out on a date yeah is this what I think it is yeah like I'm not sure because you haven't asked me whether you think this is more casual or whether you don't want to go on a date and we're just going to keep and maybe this isn't but I do think you need to clarify because I don't think that people can read minds no I think this is the issue though with relationships like I think we're all quite scared or we don't want to communicate that up front the older I'm getting and the more I'm learning about relationships it's like from the get-go you do need to literally outline kind of what you're looking for and if it's not going the way you're thinking it's going or if they're doing something that isn't what you're after you need to say to them like hey by the way it would be really great if this happened um and then see how they respond and if they're like oh I'm just like that's not really me then you know you're never going to get that from that person.

34:10Yeah and it's probably ill aligned and you can decide whether that's something that you genuinely want or whether it's you know a standard you thought you wanted because it equates to effort for you or whatever like I'd say the older I've got the more I've very much just been like oh no this is what I require from a relationship and I also think the thing is it's not telling someone to do something you're not being like you must do this you're being like what I need from a relationship is this and then it like invites someone to either meet you at that point or depart yeah and it's like or just be like oh no that's not it and then you're like cool we're probably not aligned we're not looking for the same thing this is great it's not like no hard feelings no but I think the misconception is that you literally have to like I will never nag someone like you do like you you don't have to nag someone to get up to a point like you kind of have to be like this is what I'm looking for yeah and the bar is can you get that would you like to join me at this bar yeah or would you like to stay at your bar on the floor and go and I will step over it and move on um yeah I feel like a bit like communication like people can't read minds otherwise no it is all about communication yeah agreed I don't want to lower my standards but I've been single for five years and feel quite lonely sometimes but equally happy in others not sure if I'm being unrealistic or silly I also miss sex but don't enjoy one night stands basically in a relationship with love honey oh i love that love that well valentine's day meals i'm sure we'll be coming around not that i'm sponsored by love honey but i would be open to the idea absolutely i mean i think that's it's difficult because i mean i've got a friend that it sounds very similar she's if i'm thinking it's like her um it's difficult because i feel like it can be really lonely especially if all your friends are in relationships it's a little bit like oh I've you know who have I who have I got to like go to at the end of the night or but you do have to prioritize yourself and I think if you lower your standards you're going to invite someone into your life that you're going to be unhappy with and you'd rather be unhappy alone than be unhappy with someone oh my god a hundred percent I also just think that like you don't need to lower your stuff I mean some people to be fair some people you cannot expect someone to be completely perfect no but you can expect someone to align with your standards as long as it's a realistic standard yeah like if it's a standard that for example and I can only relate on a level of like I know what standards I set my standards are corresponding to what I bring into a relationship and what I'd like someone to bring into a relationship to in terms of effort in terms of love in terms of like you know kindness like all of these things and therefore like I feel like it's not unrealistic because I know it's kind of like what I'm bringing and what I'll bring to a relationship and so it's like I feel like that's kind of fair however if you think it's something that you could never bring to a relationship yeah I think that might be a point yeah it might be unrealistic expectations um but I also think that like I don't think the solution to loneliness is a partner no I agree you have to be you do it is like that cliche you do have to be happy in your own company yeah and I know that this person says that they're like lonely sometimes and that's probably like not a good sign but like if you're lonely all the time the first option is not a partner because otherwise you're going to fall into a relationship yeah like there's so many things you should be doing to or you can do to stop yourself being lonely as you say like friends family activities classes like literally whatever of course like if you're lonely sometimes it's probably like the sunday morning when you're like huh and especially if your friends are in relationships like the majority of my friends are single so I'm like yeah like as in but um yeah like the definitely if you're friends with more people that are in relationships like it's going to be those things that like yeah that will feel tough yeah yeah but I also would just say like never compromise that for like like lonely sometimes is so much better than being with a person who doesn't meet your standards 100 % I just so strongly believe that no one should compromise the standards no and I also I think I think being alone and being single is actually a really great thing like when I've been single I think it's when you feel the most free and you're not tied down to anything and I think it's a time that you should really celebrate yes it's hard I know that's coming from someone I'm in a relationship so obviously it sounds a bit like yeah well you can say that now um but I do think that when you get in a relationship you're with that person and you'll find the right person um it just enjoy that time you have to be like you know just yourself yeah I mean I completely agree I'm also in a relationship but I feel like the the time I had single I would never trade for the world like I wouldn't have met that person earlier like I wouldn't have like first of all fully believe in trusting in the timing of your life like think that's so important and think the right person and the right situation will come along at the right time and often you'll see those you know like any of the things that I've being like oh my god I thought that was this and I can't believe it didn't work out it's being like you look back and you're like oh my god thank god like oh but like I I also think that kind of you I'm such a strong believer and maybe people will disagree but I'm such a strong believer is in the fact that you really really need some time of like being battered through the dating world and like having situationships not work out and like spending loads of time with your friends and like wake like sleepovers with your mates on the weekend and like waking up like still drunk and like all of these things which you could obviously absolutely still do in a relationship yeah but I also think that like you need that time to be able to like build yourself as a person without changing yourself for not who you're in a relationship with but like changing yourself for like or falling into what you are in one specific situation like I absolutely do not subscribe to the idea that like when you get into a relationship or like whatever that's the end of your growth at all but I think being single especially when you're younger is a very very important time to grow yourself and find out who you are exactly and it also teaches you like what you do and what you don't want not just from a partner but out of life like the people that you're around especially if you're doing like situationships I feel like those are the sort of things that molded me the most and showed me like the part of me that I wanted to die and the part of me that wanted to thrive and like what I wanted in a relationship what I didn't want oh my god a hundred percent I think that like I mean the next question is actually how to keep dating when all you feel is rejection I'm being ghosted all the time and feel like no one chooses me which first of all breaks my heart um I would also say that every single bad dating experience not to like take away from the severity of like your feelings and how you feel and all of that but I feel like it's so important for learning who you are and learning what you do and don't want and also learning when someone like comes along and is so clear that they like want you and want to be with you and all of that you will never take that for granted not that that should be the only thing you look for no but it should absolutely be something that you have as a bare minimum yeah and I think that if you haven't had those like situations where you're literally like you've stalked someone scrammed so far that you've hurt yourself and then you're like of course I knew that was happening and like yeah it's it's character building yeah it really is but the rejection thing is so hard yes oh my god that is that is so tough I feel like there's nothing that can repay for that and I also the thing the thing that's a problem like I had in the past and my mum always said it she was like when you're rejected you want that person more you always want what you can't have and you don't want that person you just want that validation from them and it can feel like I mean I've been on dates where I've been like this is going really well but it's because I'm enjoying myself like it's probably my own company I'm not there such a good time yeah I'm like I'm having a great time but actually like I come away they've rejected me and I'm like do you know what I didn't I don't think there was actually if I'm being logical and not just going oh they were great and they didn't want me being like no actually I don't think they were that fun they don't realign with me I couldn't imagine yeah I was the fun one that yeah um but I think like the rejection is horrible but again like the character building it does it's horrible to go through and I don't wish it on anyone I'm sorry it's happening but you'll come out of it when you get the good person you'll be so much more like grateful and fulfilled in it yeah and even if you decide that you want to be like you know lots of people don't aren't looking for like a long-term partner like lots of people will be very happy um you know having different relationships for different seasons of their life and like all of this and it doesn't have to just be like as in yeah you don't need looking towards this like idea of like exactly but I also think that like you will never experience rejection so starkly in quite the way that you get it in like dating rejection because which is important like as in it's horrible and I think it gets to a point where if you're finding it really affect your mental health I don't think it's good to be keeping on dating like it's just probably not the right time yeah thing you know whatever like it's just sometimes it's not right like sometimes it's not yeah you know like sometimes you just need a little bit of a break to like recover yourself and work out what you want and all of that but I do feel like sure you might be fired from a job once every few years or you might be rejected from your dream job or like whatever you will never get rejection in such high frequency and like obvious like oh no I just don't like you didn't want me but I think as well you've got to remember when you're rejected it's not you it is them like if you think about a food you don't like yeah the food isn't the problem because so many other people like that food well exactly the reason you don't like it is it's not to your taste or like all the people who you're like imagine how many people you'll sit next to on the tube every day or like you know wherever it might be yeah who you would never be with yeah but there's literally nothing wrong with them and there's so many people and there's so many there's far fewer that you would like to be with than there are that you would it's just like of course it's hard when it's like and also especially there are different people who like know quicker whether they don't want something so you might find yourself going on lots of first dates and then going on a second date and then they don't really or whatever like there are different things that you know you might start being able to put boundaries in place where you're like actually I don't go on a third date unless I know whether they're like actually genuinely interested and we're both looking for the same thing or whatever it might be but I feel like it's yeah it's like absolutely no reflection on you it's a reflection on compatibility and actually like thank god for the people who are quite clear because there's actually nothing worse than the people who were like not clear and a little bit wishy-washy or I think worse than ghosting is like keeping some like I know so many people who keep people along for the ride but like don't ask to see them because it's like you're a great backup option that's that that is far worse and that's where you need to have boundaries being like I'm not gonna let myself yeah yeah like that's not a thing I also just think that the your to your point on how we want people more if we can't have them that's also why we want emotionally suppressed people more and more because they like you're never gonna get no the emotion from them that you want like whether it's like and then when you get that little bit of like affection or whatever which is why like yeah what's that do you watch white lotus yes yeah so there's this one point that like you know like tanya like looks at her like assistant she's like don't spend your life chasing emotionally unavailable men and i was like oh tanya you're so right yeah she's bang on i love tanya spot on there but it's like as in like don't allow yourself to go for things that you know like lure you in and aren't actually what you want yeah like I think that's so important and like learning what your kryptonite is but knowing that it's not actually what you want because I think there's such a different thing to like what you go for in dating and what you genuinely you don't actually see value in that trait no like it's not something you want in a partner no you just want that person other than that and then you feel like all the people have that in common and you're like might this be me yeah hang on hang on a second there really is a pattern here yeah well dang's hard it is it is so so hard last question we're ready yeah three two one i have a three-year relationship rut i've been with my boyfriend for three years and we have been long distance for most of that time we currently live about 1.5 hours away from each other and spend time together on the weekends i finally got a new job in the same city as him so we could theoretically now move in together and progress our relationship however we recently had a big discussion about the near future and I want to go traveling he doesn't I don't want to continue the relationship while I'm away traveling but he wants to stay together he also doesn't want to move in together now because of our different desires about traveling which I totally understand and think is fair but our relationship has basically run its course now no I feel so confused about what to do I love him and enjoy being with him but is it pointless to stay together when we don't want the same things for the future i'm only 24 but i don't want to feel like i wasted time that that literally that's me really that's like a relationship right now i'm actually breaking up with him no i had a relationship like literally this is how i'm doing it we're over um no i am i literally the beginning of that i was like wow that's that's did i write this it's like an old relationship i had we kept going in a long distance relationship for four and a half years or something and that relationship died at the three-year mark and that should have stopped at the three-year mark really yeah I think it's really difficult because when you've been with someone for that amount of time you're so used to them you're used to the routine of them especially long distance you're used to like existing near each other but not always being together and I think that's actually even more difficult because you don't I think coming out of that relationship as well you don't ever quite realize when it's ended yes sure because it's ended but you're also like you're not talking anymore but maybe you you have days where you don't speak as much um but I personally would say if you want different things and you're young and you're like the living together things not really happening there's no end in sight I think it's time to give it give it the end I completely agree and I also felt like from the tone of her message she's over it I think you're over it because having had like a long-term younger relationship I think you click like you definitely cling on to it for as long as possible because it's what you know yeah like there's something like three years and you're 24 like that's a lot of your adult life like that is you know that's that is it's a it's a good amount of time it's literally half your adult life at that time and I think like you're more likely to cling on to it based on the fact that it's terrifying to break up it's you know what if it's the wrong thing like what's next what if you never meet someone like them like all of these things that go around your head even though you know it's probably not the right thing yeah the fact that you're even being like it's probably run its course no that to me that's the answer is yeah to me that's like you kind of know it's over and you probably want validation from someone else which is so fair like asking your friends and being like you know I feel like one of the first stages I know when like one of my friends relationships is over is when they start saying like a lot of the things that they do wrong because usually you know we kind of protect our relationships you don't want people to know yeah you don't want like when they've done something like really terrible and you tell your friends and they're like oh my god yeah because then you're like word vomiting because you know that they won't let you kind of get back with them and it's almost your way of like protecting yourself because you know that your friends will be like nah like it's not right we now will never like him again exactly and I feel like you're kind of wanting the like external people to be like do you know what yeah which I think I completely agree if you're young and you want different things I think there's definitely still ways to make it work if for example you wanted to go traveling for six months he didn't because of like a job or whatever but you guys were still really clear that you wanted to be together to me it sounds like you're not not totally sure on the fact that you even want to be together yeah and I think moving from long distance relationship to living in the same city or like the fact that you've been in a long distance relationship and you're now at the stage that you could live in the same city but you're not yet is like it should be such a relief to be able to finally be in the same place that to me that's like maybe a sign that it's like it was maybe better at a distance which some things are yeah like some you know it doesn't need to be like the traditional form of relationship where you like spend a lot of time together and live together and yeah yeah I have so many friends who've had long distance relationships and then they've moved closer together and they've been like huh so turns out this could have played out in half the amount of time because we don't like each other that much um and I think that's just classic part of a long distance relationship to be honest but to me I do I do think you're right in saying I think when I was at a point in this the relationship I was in that was long distance the year and a half I think it was probably a year and a bit before we broke up I was checked out a bit mentally I do think that women do check out relationships earlier than men do we will stay in them but be checked out and it's easy to do that in a long distance relationship because they're not there for you to like nothing's changing in the everyday and you also are not like you're not you're not foregoing plans with your friends to also be with them you're living your single life while you're still with them and I think as soon as you get the doubts and as soon as you start to feel like maybe this isn't right you're questioning it and like I did do that thing where I was like do you think like do you what do you think like I'd ask other people what they thought and all I was asking for was someone's permission and I was asking for someone to say break up yeah or also someone to kind of like take the blame if it doesn't go right like as in like not that you'd actually go to them and be like you tell me but like actually so that if you did break up with them and you felt shit you wouldn't have to be like this is only like as in you could be like well everyone said it wouldn't you I'm like of course I thought that or whatever um but yeah it sounds like it's run its course I kind of think she's in the best situation because yeah break up go live your best life go travel and like you will not regret that that'll be the most fun thing you do and it will be so freeing and you you have that independence already you don't feel codependent on this person and you've got all your friends and you can have a great time and maybe if you are suddenly like oh I think that was the right right relationship there's no reason why you couldn't get back together in the future completely agree and also like don't I like the fact that I think it's so easy to compromise what you want based on the fact that it's that or that relationship and ultimately you have so much time in this life to be able to like find something that's right both for a relationship and for you and for like all of these things like go traveling enjoy it have the best time like I'm glad that message was being like I want to go traveling rather than being like and so maybe I won't yeah no definitely go traveling yeah and like yeah also as someone who in the past has compromised for a boy wouldn't ever recommend that ever again that was a huge learning curve to me like why would I why would I miss out on stuff to stay with someone that I never stayed with in the end yeah um which I say that with love obviously I'm not saying that um yeah like you're listening I do feel like there were some mistakes I made yeah and I do feel like going forward that's why I am so so much more like selfish yeah I do think you have to be selfish in like to a to a degree not like everything's about me um but i make sure that i'm getting the things i want out of a relationship and i'm not compromising on the things that are important to me yeah no i completely agree you've got to do it and i think that is a nice wholesome breakup to end on it is for our breakup as well we feel really good about it yeah thank you everyone have you enjoyed the end of the episode and you're broken up with so sorry truly though oh well thank you so much for joining me this has been so great I feel like I've been therapized and I feel like people listening have been therapized too yeah I feel like I'm leaving here a better person I feel really joyful oh good thank you so much thanks for having me