Patrick Lencioni: Build an A-Team with Working Genius | Leadership E306

21:31And I can also tell you, I don't know. As the inventor of this, I'm amazed. I'll be at some place and I'll say, hey, you should take the assessment. And then I'll go, I have to find somebody that can get you on to do that because I don't even know how to do it. But it's very simple. When you go on and everybody fills it out, it's just one person signs them all up and they put it in the same account. Got it. Okay, so younginprofiting.co slash work. You guys can take the assessment individually or you can sign up your organization. We'll make sure of it. And call us if you want. We're at tablegroup.com and you can find us on the internet and you can call us and we'll walk you through it.

22:03Okay, perfect. So let's get into some more tactical stuff because I know you're really good about having good meetings. We talked about Zoom, just some productivity, team management type of stuff. So you've written in the past that it's a mistake to think that A-level talent doesn't need to be managed. managed. So what do we need to know about how much to manage someone and especially maybe in the context of working geniuses? I love that you asked in terms of working genius, because I've been saying this for years, but working genius helps us understand how they might need to be managed because not everybody's the same.

22:36But one of the things I find in organizations is a lot of CEOs, one of the things they don't do is they don't manage their direct reports. And what they do is they say, well, I'm a CEO now and this person's on my leadership team, so I shouldn't have to manage them. They're an adult. Or they think that managing is micromanaging. And so they say, well, I don't want to micromanage them. I trust them. But the truth of the matter is every person in the world benefits from management. And that's why being a CEO is so dang hard, because it is unmanaged. And a board does not manage a CEO. Oftentimes, boards need to be kind of humored.

23:10And one of the hardest things about being the CEO of an organization, it's lonely and there really is no guidance, you have to seek out advice. But there's nobody that says, I own this and I will give you direction. The buck stops with you when you're the CEO. So there's something naked about that role. And it's why it's a very lonely and hard job. But when leaders say, and I fall into this category too, I don't like to manage people by objectives and details and all these things. Because I'm an ID, I hire people and I go, Hey, I hired a guy recently who has ETs, all implementation. But I said to him, hey, why don't you just figure out what your job scope should be?

23:50And you tell me what success looks like. And you tell me what your job should look like. I want you to figure it out on your own. And he was like, mortified. Because that's my ideal job, by the way. And he's like, I want measurables. I want structure. I want expectations set for me. And I realized I can't manage him the way I would want to be managed. I have to manage him to make him the best that he can be. And too often CEOs abdicate responsibility. They don't delegate and they don't, I say at least be a good macro manager, know what they're working on, know if they're doing well, check in with them, provide what they need based on their working genius and take responsibility for being their manager.

24:32And I don't care if you're running a$10 billion company and you're managing the CMO, or if you're an entrepreneur and you have four employees. Everybody needs to be managed. It doesn't mean that there's a specific system for it. It doesn't mean you're checking in every day on their deliverables. It's less about efficiency and it's more about effectiveness. And so even if you don't necessarily like doing it, do it and do it for them based on what they need. Yeah, even just taking this assessment made me realize, even though I have employees that haven't taken it, I know what they are now and how I need to manage them.

25:08It's just so clear. It's really clear. And you know what you're going to do with them? You're naturally going to go by their office and brainstorm and inspire them. You'll do that. I don't have to tell you to do that. But what you might not do is go, okay, do you have enough information about whether you're succeeding or not? Exactly. The management, the enablement stuff. How can I be a better enablement? it's chewing glass for me. I don't like it, but I have to do it. You know what's great, Hala? When you go to them and you go, hey, you know me, I'm an IG, by the way. I want you to see this. And they're going to go, of course you are.

25:43That makes sense. But there's things you need that I don't do naturally. So just know though, I'm not saying that I don't want to do them. Just know that it's not easy for me. And if you come to me and say, hey, I need more clarity from you on something. I'm not going to take that as a complaint. I'm no, I'm not good at it and you need to provoke me to do it. And that'll give them permission to do it without going, Hala, are you going to get more specific with us? And you're going to go, not naturally, I won't, but if you ask me to, I will. So they can coach you. Your employees will be your best management coaches when you give them the language and the permission to do that.

26:19We'll be right back after a quick break from our sponsors.

26:26Hey, young Improfeters. As an entrepreneur, I know firsthand that getting a huge expense off your books is the best possible feeling. It gives you peace of mind and it lets you focus on the big picture and invest in other things that move your business forward. Now imagine if you got free business internet for life. You never had to pay for business internet again. How good would that feel? Well, now you don't even have to imagine because Spectrum Business is doing exactly that. They get it that if you aren't connected, you can't make transactions, you can't move your business forward. They support all types of businesses from restaurants to dry cleaners to content creators like me and everybody in between.

27:00They offer things like internet, advanced Wi-Fi, phone TV, and mobile services. Now for my business owning friends out there, I want you to listen up. If you want reliable internet connection with no contracts and no added fees, Spectrum is now offering free business internet advantage forever when you simply add four or more mobile lines. This isn't just a deal. It's a smart way to cut your monthly overhead and stay connected. Yeah, Bim, you should definitely take advantage of this offer. It's free business internet forever. Visit spectrum.com slash free for life to learn how you can get business internet free forever.

27:34Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas.

27:40Young and profiters. I know there's so many people tuning in right now that end their workday wondering why certain tasks take forever, why they're procrastinating certain things, why they don't feel confident in their work, why they feel drained and frustrated and unfulfilled. But here's the thing you need to know. It's not a character flaw that you're feeling this way. It's actually your natural wiring. And here's the thing. When it comes to burnout, it's really about the type of work that you're doing. Some work gives you energy and some work simply drains you. So it's key to understand your six types of working genius.

28:15The Working Genius Assessment, or the six types of working genius framework, was created by Patrick Lencioni, and he's a business influencer and author. And the Working Genius Framework helps you identify what you're actually built for and the work that you're not. Now, let me tell you a story. Before I uncovered my working genius, which is galvanizing and invention, so I like to rally people and I like to invent new things, I used to be really shameful and had a lot of guilt around the fact that I didn't like enablement, which is one of my working frustrations. So I actually don't like to support people one-on-one.

28:46I don't like it when people slow me down. I don't like hand-holding. I like to move fast, invent, rally people, inspire. But what I do need to do is ensure that somebody else can fill the enablement role, which I do have, Kate, on my team. So Working Genius helps you uncover these genius gaps, helps you work better with your team, helps you reduce friction, helps you collaborate better, understand why people are the way that they are. It's helped me restructure my team, put people in the spots that they're going to really excel. and it's also helped me in hiring. Working Genius is absolutely amazing.

29:16I'm obsessed with this model. So if you guys wanna take the Working Genius assessment and get 20 % off, you can use code profiting. Go to workinggenius.com. Again, that's workinggenius.com. Stop guessing, start working in your genius.

29:31Hello, Yap gang. I know my young and profiting listeners want bigger businesses and a better life. And the new year is the perfect moment to reset and commit to your growth. But let's be real. You can't build an empire if your finances are all over the place. That's why getting into it QuickBooks is one of the best first moves you can make this year. They've got powerful money management tools built right into their platform, and they have them for every stage of your business, whether you're a solopreneur or a small business. And I love that QuickBooks helps you get paid faster, pay bills smarter, and even gives you access to funding when opportunity pops up.

30:06So QuickBooks can help you with bookkeeping, can help you with getting paid, can even help you with projections and understanding where your business is at financially. Plus, QuickBooks Money Solutions reduces manual work by half and keeps your money and your books perfectly synced. That means less time staring at spreadsheets and more time actually building the vision that you started with. That's the upgrade that every profiting entrepreneur needs. Start the new year strong, take control of your cash flow with QuickBooks Money Tools. Learn more at quickbooks.com slash money. Again, that's quickbooks.com slash money.

30:37Terms apply. Money movement services are provided by Intuit Payments Incorporated, licensed as a money transmitter by the New York State Department of Financial Services.

30:48So something that we agree upon is to have a successful meeting, it doesn't have to be short. I've heard that. And this is something that me and my business partner, Jason, disagree upon all the time, where he just wants to have short, short meetings. And I'm like, we had a short meeting, but what was accomplished? We don't know what to do. We need to talk about it. It's not about just having short meetings. We need to know what to do and have clarity, right? So I'd love for you to just break down some of your best tips in terms of having good meetings. And also the fact that a lot of people tuning in right now are having Zoom meetings.

31:21Let's be honest. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Most of the meetings are Zoom. So let's talk about that. And the hardest thing about Zoom meetings, Hala, is that, first of all, we learned this at the beginning of COVID. I just saw this movie called Hot Fuzz. And there's this, where they go, this shit just got real. You know, it's like a cop movie and that was from Bad Boys or something like that. But I remember when COVID started, when we were doing our third Zoom meeting and I finally provoked real conflict. And we said, I think this shit just got real because too often on Zoom, it's harder to go there because you're not in the same room.

31:54And after the meeting's over, you're not gonna be able to recover and walk over to the kitchen and talk to them about it. So sometimes we don't go deep and get messy during the Zoom meetings the way we need to. So that's the thing I would say, first of all, is when we're doing stuff on Zoom, we've got to get to that place where we're being fully human. And it's harder when it's two-dimensional and there's not follow-up and we don't have incidental time. So we need to do that. But the other thing is I would love to know what your partner's working genius is. Because the thing about a short meeting, it's efficient, but it's not necessarily effective.

32:29And I'm a believer in effectiveness over efficiency. Okay. And so sometimes a meeting wanders, but it needed to. And sometimes it takes 45 minutes in a meeting before you finally realize, oh my gosh, we were talking about the wrong thing. When a person's sitting in that meeting going, checking their watch and going, well, I have another meeting to go to and I have real work to do. Here's how to help a person understand that. There's four different kinds of meetings that a leadership team has to have and you and your partner have to have. There's four. And you can't do them simultaneously. When we do them simultaneously, it doesn't work.

33:00I call that meeting stew where we toss out every ingredient in the cupboard into one pot and stir it up and it just tastes bad. And the four different kinds of meetings that need to be separated are, one is what I call a check-in, a daily check-in. And that's five to ten minutes, like, what are you doing today? What are you doing today? Okay, great. That's great. Okay, oh, I didn't know you were going to be doing that. Tell Fred I said hi. Can you ask him about this thing? Okay, I can take that off my list. Totally administrative check-in. Don't sit down. Just every day. This is the me saying to my wife, hey, who's picking the kids up from school?

33:29what time are you coming home? Here's, I got this meeting today. Okay, great. The second meeting is called your weekly tactical, if you do it weekly. And this is the running the business meeting where you sit down and you go, okay, these are our goals. Here's how we're doing. Do we need to solve any near-term problems? This one's green. This one's yellow. This one's red. Alan Mulally, who ran Ford, did it that way too. Green, yellow, and red. We do that at our company too. How are we doing? These are our five big things we're working on. How are they going? What do we need to do? It's probably an hour, maybe 90 minutes.

33:57It's pretty tactical and it's focused on moving the ball forward. The problem is there's a third meeting and we usually combine it with the second meeting. And we call this the strategic topical meeting. This is like there's some big new initiative or idea or problem. And it's really interesting and it's really urgent. And so we try to talk about it in the same breath where we're going through our goals and we never give it enough time. This is the meeting where we need to go into a room, clear up two hours and say, we have a competitive threat, or we have this new product idea, or this new partnership, like you talked to me before about there's new partnerships you're developing.

34:33Don't have that during your regular weekly meeting. Have a separate meeting. All we're going to talk about is that partnership. And go in there, roll up your sleeves, grab some food, get a whiteboard, and argue, and debate, and dream, and do this. That's what people in business school call a case study. It's the most fun you can ever have. And yet we kill that fun by having it in 10-minute increments in between going through our checklists. It robs our meetings. It makes the tactical meetings confusing. It makes the strategic meetings far too limited. And when the leaders of an organization do that, they really lose their way.

35:12So when somebody says, let's have a short meeting, I say, yeah, make your daily check-in short. Hey, maybe make your weekly tactical fairly short, but never cut off a conversation that needs to be explored and work through it. It's messy. And that's the biggest problem I see in organizations. They combine their strategic conversations and their tactical ones in the same meeting, and it's never good for anybody. The fourth kind of meeting, I think it's once a quarter, you should probably do it. And maybe it takes two hours, maybe it takes a half a day. And that's just the quarterly check-in where you just get out of the office, you take a breath, and you say, is this working?

35:47That's probably a WI meeting where you just step back and go, is there anything we're not seeing? What's going on in the market? How are we doing as a team behaviorally? You just need to do that every once in a while. Those four kinds of meetings, most organizations try to have all four in one meeting. And they call it their weekly meeting. And that's why people hate meetings. I'm actually really proud of my company because we do all four. You do? We do all four. So we call each other scrappy hustlers. That's our name. I love it. And every morning we do a hustler huddle. I do it with my executive team.

36:20I do it with my sales and marketing team, 15 minutes. What are we grateful for? What are we working on? Are there any blockers? How do you feel now? Every single morning, we do something called G90s where we talk for 90 minutes every week, me and my executive team about all of our problems called G90. Then we do a monthly strategic meeting to talk about any strategies. And then we do a quarterly planning, which is the ideation stuff. Wow. So I feel like we're really on track here. You got it. That is crazy. Because you know that people have different contexts when they go into those meetings and you can't do them all together.

36:57Good for you. Yeah, no wonder we're doing so great. Seriously, seriously, meetings are key. I had such a great conversation with you. I loved learning about the Working Genius. I loved understanding how this is gonna impact our teams. I end my show with two questions that I ask all of my guests. You can just think of this as not having to do with the topic necessarily, just whatever comes from your heart. The first one is, what is one actionable thing our young and profiters can do today to become more profiting tomorrow? Wow, I wanna give a thoughtful answer to that. I think that one of the things that people don't do when they're young is get very clear about who they are and what their personal values are.

37:40And we're too opportunistic and kind of reacting to whatever's going on and actually sit down and write down, this is the person I wanna be and this is what I wanna do. And it's so crazy. It's so simple. But they say, if you don't know where you're going, all roads lead there or no road is right. And so I just think people need to be a little clear about, yeah, this is what I'd kind of like to do and who I'd like to be. That contextualizes everything else. So that's a very general thing, but it's so simple. And most people are like, yeah, I haven't really done that. Yeah. So actually step back and think about who you want to be in the future, your future you.

38:13What do you want to grow into? Yeah, absolutely. And what would you say is your secret to profiting in life? And this can go beyond business. Two things. It's healing. It's identifying the things that happened to me when I was young that I thought were my superpowers, but they were actually wounds because I was working out of those. And then every day I pray. I wake up and I pray. I'm Catholic, Christian. I listen to some Bible readings and I pray. And that is all the difference between waking up and feeling like scattered and lost and feeling like, oh, yeah, yeah, everything's good. Just to dig deep on that just a bit, is that sort of a gratitude practice that you have?

38:52Like, what do you feel like that does to set the foundation for your day? And how can people mimic that? Well, I think it's everything. It's interesting that you asked that. I have this app. It's called Amen. It goes through the readings of the day, which is like seven minutes, eight minutes of the readings, Old Testament, maybe Psalms and the gospel. And then it asks you a series of questions. And I think in those questions, it kind of gets at the four areas of prayer, which is Gratitude, what you're grateful for. Petition, what you want, what you need. Praise, which is, God, you're good. This is great.

39:23And then sorrow. Hey, I want to be better, and I'm sorry I did these things. I think it touches on all four of those kinds of prayer. Gratitude is the thing I need to work on the most. I grew up, every time I accomplished something, I would go like, okay, what's next? And I never felt safe just going, oh, that was wonderful. Thank you. That's great. So gratitude is a deficiency area for me. And I learned that from John Gordon. I don't know if you know who John Gordon is. Yes, I had him on the show. Yep. Oh, he's like one of my favorite human beings, one of a good dear friend. And the gratitude thing is so critical.

39:53Michael Jervis came on the show and he taught me this morning ritual where he says before he even gets out of the covers, the first thing he does is what are three things I'm grateful for before you get out of the cover. So now every morning before I even wake up, when I'm laying in my bed, before I get out of bed, I just say, what am I grateful for? And then I get up and it just helps a little bit, you know, especially if I remember to do it, it's always a better day. That's great. I'll remember that. That's fantastic. Patrick, where can everybody learn more about you and everything that you do?

40:24My company is called The Table Group. So if you go to tablegroup.com, you can find us there. The Working Genius stuff is at workinggenius.com. They can get to that through your site. You know, there's one thing I have that I've started recently. I do a morning three-minute devotional for professionals who are followers of Jesus. But if you're not, If you're curious about Jesus, you can do it too, because I love everyone. But it's a three minutes. It's called the three-minute reset. Me and a guy named Chris Stefanik do it. And I found that a lot of people really like it. And I just started doing this January 1st of this year, and it's every weekday.

40:56Because a lot of people are like, I don't know what I want to do around my faith. And it's like, well, here's three minutes. Maybe you can just start with three minutes. And it's combining stuff that I do in the work world with faith. And so a lot of people really like that. It's grown. How do you join it? You just go wherever podcasts are and type in the three-minute reset in my name. Oh, it's a podcast that you can listen to every morning. Yeah, it's essentially a podcast with a daily three-minute thing. Oh, cool. We'll put the link in the show notes. Again, guys, if you want to take the working genius assessment, go to youngandprofiting.co slash work.

41:24We'll put that link in the show notes. I can't wait to hear what you guys think about that assessment. If it helped you, let us know, write us a review. Patrick, thank you so much for joining us on Young and Profiting Podcast. It's been a blast. Thank you, Hala.

41:41Thank you for tuning in for the second part of my wonderful conversation with Patrick Lincione. If you missed part one, you can find it right next to this episode in your Young and Profiting feed. It's definitely worth going back for. I really enjoyed learning more about how the different types of working genius can impact teams and organizations. I cannot wait to implement some of these takeaways with my own crew. Every team is only as good as the sum of its individual pieces. and sometimes those individuals are just in the wrong places, often through no fault of their own. The best salesperson does not always make the best sales manager and we shouldn't force them or incentivize them to fill a role that is wrong for them and wrong for the company.

42:20Nor do you want to lose smart people just because they are not wired to do the job you have given them. A lot of young companies and startups suffer from lopsided teams. They may have plenty of inventors and galvanizers, but lack employees who can get things done or who can enable others to do the same, or they may have plenty of implementers, but few new ideas. And it's just as important to find the right mix of these skills as it is to find the right mix of subject expertise. Patrick recommended creating a detailed team map to help identify where the genius gaps are within your teams. This can help you reassign tasks and reshape groups and roles.

42:54It can also inform your hiring decisions. The right person for the job might not be the one that you think based on conventional metrics. Thanks for listening to this episode of Young and Profiting. if you listened, learned, and profited from this conversation, then why keep it all to yourself? Send it to a friend or colleague that you think could benefit from the same insights. And if you did enjoy this show and you learned something, then why not drop us a five-star review on Apple Podcasts? This is such a helpful way to show your support and also help us to reach more people and keep climbing up the charts.

43:23If you prefer watching your podcasts as videos, you can find us on YouTube. Just look up Young and Profiting and you'll find all our episodes there. Looking to get in touch with me? You can find me on Instagram or on LinkedIn by searching my name, Halataha. Finally, a quick shout out my incredible production team and all the different types of working genius they possess. You guys are the best. Before I sign off, I wanted to let you know that this is my AI voice. At Yap Media, we've been experimenting with AI to see just how far we can push it. Send me a DM on LinkedIn or Instagram or send me an email to let me know what you think.

43:58This is your host, Halataha, aka the Podcast Princess, signing off. Thank you.