Bootsy Collins

31:44And I was just talking to my man out here about, you know, Dave Liebert. He came in and started booking us. And, you know, it just started growing so fast. Yeah. And I wasn't ready for that. You know, what I was ready for was playing with Parliament Funkadelic. You really just wanted to be part of that? Hey, man, that was the beauty of, you know, a band is playing together. Yeah. You know, and I knew that if I if we separated them, you know, I knew that the weight was going to fall on me. You know, if I didn't have no sense at all, I knew it was going to fall on me if I take that, you know, that approach of being a solo artist, you know.

32:29But when I started seeing all the good parts that is going to benefits, you know, I was like, OK, George, you know, I'll do it. So I caved in, you know, and sure enough, it turned out the way I was thinking, you know, and you can call that stinking thinking, you know, but that ain't what I wanted. You know, what I wanted was to be with the band and make people feel good about themselves, having fun, you know, actually fun had more to do with it than making money. you know um when we got with james brown i thought we had to pay him you know i mean that's how you know we just didn't know yeah you know like the artists now musicians now know about getting paid you know we were just having a good time we want to have fun you know it wasn't about the era of making money for us yeah you know we just he snatched us off the street.

33:33Yeah. You know, we was riding, having a great time doing that, you know, and he snatched us off the street. How did he find you? Well, we played at King Records. That's the King fellow right there. He's the head guy of King. And so that's where we met James Brown. So that's a whole nother long story. But Charles Spurling bought us the King Records because he thought that we were such an energetic rhythm section that we could cut his records and cut different sessions. And we wound up working with Hank Ballard. Wow. Bill Doggett. I mean, what's my man's name? Henry Glover was the first black producer, you know, of, you know, not just rhythm and blues, but, you know, folk music.

34:39He was doing everything at King Records. Wow. And, you know, his dad, Otis Williams, was the head of Otis Williams and the Charms. Wow. No way. Yeah. Yeah. And so, you know. You never know. Yeah. I mean, you know, so, so, you know, all of that, you know, I was growing into, you know. Those are guys like Hank Ballard and Bill Doggett are incredible musicians. Hank Ballard, incredible front man even. Yeah. That no one talks about these days. What was it like hanging around them? What were they like? Man, very encouraging because they were true musicians. I mean, true to the bone, you know, and it was such a pleasure to be around them and they treat you like regular people, you know.

35:34And so being around them kind of helped set myself up to, I want to be like that. You know, I want to be, you know, like able to, I'm down to earth where, you know, I might look crazy, you know, and I probably do. But at the same time, it's like, I want to be able, I want people to have fun with me. Yeah. You know, I want them to chill, have a good time. and and if they whatever they want to say say it you know and so I try to carry that um you know once once I start picking up from them you know it's like we live on their backs and that's what I talk about you know um a lot of people want to put it all on me but I have to tell them you know you know I'm really not the one you know I worked at being on the one but I'm not the one.

36:33The one is bigger than all of us because it's all of us collectively together. Well, you know what's funny? It's like you were talking about how James was almost like a father figure. Yeah. And like most father figures, when you're that age, you kind of want to buck against them. Yeah. But his lesson about the one seems to have always really stuck with you. Always. Always. Yeah. What was like and you then you even go and introduce that to George and Parliament Funkadelic and that. But so how did that stick? that stuck because i was in it and i got to see it work you know it wasn't just him talking you know about the one it was when i put it into effect in my music that's when i found out he ain't just rapping you know this is real because as soon as i started doing that because I played a lot of, you know, playing guitar.

37:35And I got stuck on bass because my brother played guitar and he needed a bass player. So that's how I got stuck on bass. And once that happened, you know, and I'm with my brother, I'm happy. You know, I'm happy because I don't care what I play, a flute, clarinet, whatever, with my brother. You know, that was the key. and we just happened to get picked up over their King records, you know, because we was tearing it up. We were street kids and we wasn't letting nothing get in the way. Nothing. I mean, oh, you won't pay us? Oh, that ain't no problem. You know, let us put this funk down for you, you know, and that was the attitude, you know, so.

38:20But you were playing, and is it true you were playing a guitar? At first, I learned. Strung like a bass. Yeah, yeah. Like a six-string guitar with four bass strings? Well, I had to do that because my brother needed a bass player, not a guitar player. And I just asked him, can you get me four bass strings? He got me four bass strings. And that night was our first gig. And the place was, let's see. It was about from here to the door. The whole place. The whole place. You know, no stage. We were standing on the floor and people were like this in your face. And drunk as I don't, you know. And here I am.

39:12I'm like 15, 14, 15. And I got in the place, you know, because of my brother. you know he's like eight years older than I so I get in because you know because of him and people are just getting off because I'm so young you know and I'm knowing I'm knowing that they're getting off because I'm young but I'm also playing what they like you know and so when I got When we all got with James Brown, he tightened us up and told us about the one. Once that happened, you know, we all started knowing where the one was at. And it was like, oh, you mean like this? And James said, yeah, I'm glad I thought of it.

40:02You know, so everything he thought of, which was great, you know, At the time, wasn't nobody telling us, man, y 'all should be doing this. When the rappers came out and started sampling, everybody was telling me what I should be getting. And if it had been that era instead of the era I grew up in, they would have been right. Yeah. But the era I grew up in was, you know, we was what do you call working? What do you call that? You know, we was kind of like work for hire. Oh, yeah. Freelance. Yeah. Yeah. And it wasn't about, you know, you know, us getting paid. It was about you mugs are here with James Brown and y 'all better pay attention, you know.

40:54And that's what we did. We paid attention. And if somebody paid us, cool. If nobody paid us, we had a couple of dollars to go get some wine, a couple of girls in the backseat. We good. We good. And he had a way of, I guess for people who don't understand the one, it's just a way of organizing your playing where you're emphasizing. You're emphasizing that one on every four bars. Right. And, you know, that's so true to this day. even the computers, you know, they get, they get, it shows you what a one is that. That metronome. That's it. That's it. I mean, and no computers work like, you know, they don't, don't work like that.

41:40They work like that, you know, and for James to be have told us about the one way back in those years. and then to this day it's still a

41:55give me that I mean it's still there you know and once you start doing that you put the emphasis on that people feel that they vibe off of that you know it's like a internal clock you know it's the heartbeat of the world you know so what about like when you go into play with like you did a Herbie Hancock record with Sugarfuck Bonner from the Ohio Players. Can you do that on a Herbie record? Well, it's all the same thing, but it's in different measures, you know, different bars, you know, they got a one too, but, you know, them being jazz musicians, they got a certain count, you know, But it all, if you know, it all comes back to one.

42:49You know, they got to come to the one, too. Everybody got to come to the one. I don't care what it is. Yeah. You know, it's just not four, four. Right. You know, it can be five, you know, five, seven, you know, whatever that is. But it all has to come back to one. And when you're introducing this concept to Parliament Funkadelic, this thing that James taught you. Yeah. Would it have been Bigfoot Braley on drums at that time or Tiki Fullwood? Well, it was both of them. Both of them were there. Well, it was Tiki first, Tyrone, and then Bigfoot. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And for me, I think Bigfoot Braley brought home the P-funk.

43:36You know, Tiki brought home the funkadelic side. You know. um um tyrone lapkin he was just an all-out next level drummer you know i mean he made you stop and like watch him you know um you know it wasn't really about the one with him you know he'd do it if you you know told him to but it was about he was like a jazz drummer yeah you know he was all over the place, you know, and he defined his own one, you know, so, you know, which was cool because he always had to come back, you know. I don't know what his count was, but he knew what, you know, he knew what it was, and that's what matters. So you guys were playing that just completely different feels going, but that would maybe be some of the magic is you're feeling one thing, he's feeling a different pulse.

44:32And you are allowed to do it. You know, that has a big emphasis on how you feel about doing what you're doing, you know, because if you're not allowed to do it, you know, then you feel like you constricted. You can't express, you can't self-express yourself, you know, the way you want to. And in that era, it was very important to express yourself. Yeah. You know, just like the record, express yourself. you know your boy i mean the boys was funky yeah dr dre and them or or the original exactly uh charles wright yes yes yeah so you know and we had all of that that we was growing up in and today you know it's like where is that at you know i mean we had we grew up in such a great musical era, you know, to have all that around you, you know, to absorb all of that and then wake up one day and it's not there.

45:37You know, it's like, how does that feel? You know, people like ask me, how does that feel? You know, I had to, you know, the good thing for me is learning while I'm on the job. You know, I'm trying to learn it, you know, and when we got to this part here, it's like, I was kind of prepared, you know, to accept, okay, it's done change, you know, because I was in the changing while it was changing. Yeah. You know, so I got a chance to adjust. And most people that I'm not going to stop playing the acoustic. I'm not going to, you know, play the electric. Yeah. But I love this acoustic. You know, that's how I observed it and was like, whatever comes in, I'm going to learn how to, you know, or if I can't do it, I'm getting somebody else to do it.

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49:58Yeah. You know? Well, I was so glad to be a part of that, you know, you know, cause it was only a few of us, you know, And, you know, it's like James Jamison was the cat that really changed my mind about bass playing, you know, because he had he played with one finger. All of that stuff he was playing, he used one finger, you know. That's wild. Yeah. And he I'm glad you mentioned that he all those hit records beforehand. He played upright, upright bass. He got introduced to Defender P-Bass and he wanted to play the P-Bass. Motown said, no, you know, you can't play that. You ain't made no money with, you know, playing that.

50:54So they didn't want to change. But he said, if you want me, I'm playing the P bass. And all after that, you know, the upright bass, all the stuff after that, he made much more money for them. And, you know, he was a perfect example to accept and embrace that change that we're talking about right now. Yeah. That most musicians don't want to deal with. You know, we always going to run into that change that we don't want to change. You know, it's like sampling, you know, it's like, you know, oh, man, God, the sampling. What are we going to do? You know, it's just like, hey, what are we going to do?

51:41You know, they're coming in. They're coming to get us. They come and, you know, take our gigs, you know. And so it's the same thing. Yeah. You know, so I'm getting ready to face this along with the rest of the world. Yeah. But the only difference is I know it's coming. Yeah. You know, and we made it through the sampling area. You know, we can make it through this one, too. You know, so, you know, and I can't tell nobody how to do it because I don't know. I didn't know how to do the sampling. You know, I didn't even know that was coming. Yeah. You know, until you in it, you know, once you in it, then, you know, you have to try to figure out, you know, like, wow, what do you do?

52:23you know um and so that's what i have to say about the ai because because everybody's talking asking me about that you know and you know we'll learn we'll all learn how to deal with it you know because there ain't no way you're gonna keep it from coming that that sort of um that sensibility of just sort of taking things as they come yeah and working with it i've heard you talk about um getting lost yeah as a part of your creative process and um that seems to kind of fit with that like it's like well we don't know where it's going but but we're going anyway we're going anyway you know see where we go that was one of my whole sayings is i don't know where i'm going, but I'm going.

53:10That's one of my whole, you know, it's like very short sentence, but, you know, I'm committed to that. Yeah. You know, and people be hanging their hopes on, well, somebody tell us what to do. Hey, I don't know where I'm going, but I'm going, you know, that right there just tells you that you have to prepare yourself because it's coming. Yeah. Whatever that it is. Yeah. You know, it's definitely coming. Yeah. You know. And so you have to try to prepare yourself the best you can. I'm glad you're not running from it. Oh, no. Oh, no. No. The only thing I'm scared of is flying. Yeah, I was going to ask you about that because you pulled up in an RV.

53:56When did the flying thing start? Oh, that's a whole other thing. When did that happen since you brought it up? That happened in 1979. You know, I wanted to fly on the Concorde. You know, when the MiG-4. Is that where you could get from London to New York? Oh, not light speed. speed of sound or whatever you break the sound barrier that's it that's it so i wanted to fly on it because you know this was our first time going to europe you know and me headlining you know it's like i don't you know just breaking off from parliament funkadelic and we getting ready to go a headline in london and all england paris frank all that you know and and so i wants to fly on the Concorde.

54:48And so I get to fly on the Concorde, you know. So 45 minutes into the flight, you know, everybody's, you know, happy, beautiful. And 45 minutes into the flight, the captain comes on and says, you know, because I knew something was wrong because the plane was, you know, we was flying like this you know and it's like you know and i'm sitting there and i'm looking out the window and then i saw fire shooting out the engine and i was like uh like i'm like we just we just made it we you know and then not only that jaws was a big movie then yeah it's like okay if you make the crash, right? You fall in the Jaws territory.

55:39All in the Washington, right in the Atlantic. All this come to me. I mean, you know, and it's like, oh man, if I ever get on the ground again, I will never ever fly. You know? And sure enough, he turned the plane around. You know, we was just getting ready to cross the line, you know? But he turned the plane around and we was flying like this all the way back to New York. Got back to New York. He landed the plane some kind of way. I mean, told us to put our head down. You know, we went through the whole drill, the whole drill. You know, and the tour was so big, though, that they talked me into, you know, taking the next flight out, which was a 747.

56:30A little more stable. Yeah. And then they gave me some drugs to just sleep. I didn't wake up until I got over there. So, you know, and then when I got back, no more flying. That was it. 1979. Well, that was it up until I think it was more like 2000. That's a bad time to start back. I know. I know. And I did it. I did. And, you know, I lost that fear until COVID. Once COVID hit, you know, it was like, okay, I can't fly no more. What happened? You watched Jaws again for the first time? I did watch it. I did watch it. But, you know, it's always I get these signals, you know, and I call it the universe, you know.

57:19It's like, okay, you can't fly now. And I don't even question it. If I hear that, you know, because, you know, because I'm like I say, I'm really not afraid, you know, until unless it's heights. Yeah. I'm scared of heights and flying. That's why you didn't tell me you're not afraid. Oh, I'm letting you know. I'm letting you know. When it comes to heights and flying. Or heights, I'm through. I mean, you know, the roller coasters. Yeah. I love it. You know, and, you know, we we rode on them thousands of times, you know. But she didn't never know I was scared of heights, you know, until one day I just broke out and said, you know, because we was up in one of those hotels that, you know, you ride up in the elevator and you could see yourself going up.

58:08But then, you know, then it's like, oh, man, I couldn't even look over, you know, like if you up on the 40th floor or whatever. Go out the window. Look, man, I couldn't do that. I couldn't do that. But, you know, that's the two things that got me scared to death. You ever go to the Grand Canyon or anything? Yeah. Yeah? And is that, like, if it's natural, is that okay? That's okay because I'm not going to go to the air, you know, and look over. I'm not, you know, I'm staying away from that. You know, so it's something. Do you navigate around bridges on the RV or no? Is that okay? uh that's kind of deep that's kind of deep we don't know that we don't go that we don't i'm sorry now trail biking just trying to think trail biking in in the um you know um that's cool yeah you know as long as it ain't no way up in the air i'm good with okay okay you know okay yeah okay yeah i get that though because honestly too with covid once once you're grounded and you're not going anywhere, you're not traveling.

59:14I'm to the point, too. I used to love to drive everywhere. I could drive 24 hours. Now you hit it. But now I'm like, I don't want to go anywhere. That's all I used to do. I would take George from New Jersey down to Miami, Florida, and all we're doing is listening to music, getting loaded, and me driving. Because he couldn't drive. He didn't have a license. Didn't want a license. Really? Yeah. That was a getaway for us. You know, we go to Florida and fish, you know, we rent a yacht. And that was our getaway because we was under a lot of pressure trying to get these groups and getting the songs and the albums.

59:57Because George was developing a whole new concept where each group was on a different label. and you know we didn't realize at the time what he was doing he didn't really realize but he thought you know that would have them fighting against each other to make sure that they pushed their own group and it worked it worked but like did he get sued for that or no no no i mean you know At that particular time, it's like sampling coming in and you don't know what to do with it. They didn't know what to do with that. He was a genius as far as that. It's like, damn, how did he fucking figure that out?

1:00:45So, no. I mean, all of them felt like fools. So they didn't want you to know that they were that stupid. So he got away with it. That's incredible. Yeah. And then you guys eventually, because it was like Casablanca and Westbound. Exactly. Then you guys ended up doing Warner. Yeah, Warner's. Major label. Atlantic had Horny Horns. Wow.

1:01:12Columbia, I think, had The Brides. And so, and Paulette was on, damn, I can't remember. Maybe they were on Westbound, I can't remember what. But every group was on a different, you know. And then Bootsy Rubber Band was on Warners. You know, yeah. So that was the whole thing. That's where Dr. Dre and Snoop got that whole concept from, you know, is because that's that whole empire that we kind of, you know, came through. We didn't know what we was doing. Dre and Snoop, they know what they're doing. You know, they take care of business. We wasn't taking care of no business. We was just doing what we thought, you know, would help us at the moment.

1:02:02Yeah. You know, it wasn't like we was looking for longevity or we were looking, you know, for legacy. You know, none of that. You know, it was like, man, I can get some more drugs. Oh, man. You know? Oh, man. Like, did you get, because, you know, I know like Hendrix was a big, you know, for all you guys. Yeah. Big influence. You even had a poster on your, Oh yeah. The Walter Hendricks poster, you know? Like, did his passing, that didn't spook anyone? No, because, you know, we kind of felt the inside story, you know? I used to, yeah, yeah, I used to go out with his, his girlfriend, Lithophane. I was just talking about her, because she's in the, she's like the star of his documentary.

1:02:48Exactly. That came before him, like 71 or two. Well, she was on the road with us, with James Brown. and she would ride the bus with us, you know, and she was going to take me to meet Jimmy, you know, but what happened was, you know, when he was working, we were working, you know, because everybody was on the road at that time, you know, and so we never got a chance to hook up. Wow. Yeah, yeah. It was deep. Wow. Yeah. And she told you what? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. And the rap was they don't ever want another one of those kind of talents to to reach that level because they can rule the world, you know, and we can't have that, you know.

1:03:41So, you know, and then when we came on the scene, it was like, oh, let's make sure these, you know, we got to shut these down because they're a big threat. Yeah. You know, and we wasn't trying to do nothing but play music and express ourselves. Yeah. You know, but it was a it was complicated. Did you have a relationship with with with Kiss beyond just a label? Just a label, you know, as far as the label, you know, and we both use the same clothes designer, you know, Legaspy. Legaspy. Yeah. In New York. You know, so, and then Patti LaBelle, they used them too. And they were, they had the same lawyer we had.

1:04:28So it was all kind of, all, you know, kind of screwed up there. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I'm getting the picture now. Same designer, same groupie, same lawyer. Right. Right. What, I want to talk about the new album too. Yeah. Before we get there. the song like your song right song right you george and bernie right as like a songwriting unit yeah how did that how did that start oh wow um i i see how did it start i guess it started with going in cutting tracks um and then bernie and i would cut tracks and then george would come in with the party, you know, because he always brought the party and we were trying to get some music down, and he'd bring the party in and bust it up, you know, and he'd come in loud, you know, and he had this microphone, you know, in the control room that he would get on, you know, because as soon as he walked in, you know, he heard the music and he was live.

1:05:39I mean, he was so live and loud, you know, it's like we was like, wait a minute, Josh, hold up, man. We're trying to, you know, figure this arrangement out, you know. But he was so hyped up about whatever we was doing, you know. And he would come up with words, you know, and lyrics and stuff right on the spot. Man, let's talk about the new album. I mean, talk about not being afraid. Yeah. Not, not, I mean, you know, there's no boundaries still with you. Right. There's still, you listen to me, like, there's no box or boundaries in which. Well, you know, after what we've all kind of been through, it's like, ain't nothing new they can do to us.

1:06:27I mean, you know, you know, we pretty much know. We pretty much know the game, you know. And so that allows me to do more of what I used to do, but even more than that, you know, because I'm not afraid, you know. It's more like I got a bigger audience to play to. And not only that, you know, I'm standing in front of them trying to show them that they can do it too. That's my whole thing about the mirror star glasses I had, you know, made was when the people look at when the kid looks into my eyes, he sees himself. Yeah. You know, and to me, that meant more than him seeing me, you know, and that's why I had the star glasses made, you know.

1:07:26Same thing with the base, the space base. If you notice this mirror all on the, you know, and that was when the lights hit. the space base, it's going to hit you too. You know, and so all of that was, you know, I thought of that beforehand, before I actually had it done, you know, because it had to have meaning, you know, not just me being a superhero or a star. It had to be something deeper than that. Yeah. You know. Yeah. These days when you're making music. Yeah. Yeah. What's your how do you organ like is there a. There's no certain way. There's no certain way. No, it can come at any time. It can come through somebody else or somebody else might spark you to go in a certain direction.

1:08:19You know, I don't ever put it on. How do should I come up with this music? It just comes. It always comes. You might be doing something. and what, like a line or a melody will hit you or a rhythm? A line, it either comes in a riff or a melody or a beat. If you got the beat down, I'm more comfortable now with having a beat, just something you can go about, even if it's just a metronome. you know and and then you can put this idea

1:09:09you know you can take that in a whole parliament thing yeah you know put some claps on that you know you put that you get that to george he'll kill it he'll kill it you know So, you know, that's the way it came then. That's the way it comes now. But it comes even more so now because of what I got around me, you know, different things. You know, it used to be all about the musicians, you know, like because they're there with you. You know, now I had to up my game and figure out how to work the boy in the box, you know. And instead of putting it down, I picked it up and started learning. My son started teaching me how to work it.

1:10:03I'm not like a professional engineer or none of that, but I know how to record myself. And anytime something comes, bang, I'm on it. And I put the idea down and then I come back to it if I feel like, yeah, that's popping. So that's kind of the way we do it now. Because like I said before, we always had the band with us. I had to get used to not having the band. And so I know how tedious and how hectic that is without the band because I've been through that. And I learned how to deal with it. And rejection is another thing that the younger generation has to deal with. And they don't know how to deal with that.

1:10:52You know, rejection is, that's a heck of a thing to be rejected, you know, and like the funk has always been rejected. You know, that's why we ain't never been in the, you know, the Grammys and all that big stuff that, you know, you know, monks make, you know, they don't give a funk about the funk. You know, that's why we cut album of the year. We give it to ourselves. Yeah. Number one funk a tear. Now y 'all funk with that. They gonna have to funk with that. I love that, man. The ability of funk to give to the audience, man, a feeling of joy and eliminating vulnerability. It's like before hip hop was sort of the language of giving people confidence and that feels like that's where funk lived, you know?

1:11:41Yeah, yeah. And it still does. That's it. Yeah, that's totally it. And, you know, for me, it's like the more I stay committed to that, the more I'll still be around and able to speak the language of today, whatever it is, or I can speak the language of yesterday. today. It don't make a difference. You know, um, it's being able to hang with whoever it is, you know? Um, and so when you feel, start feeling comfortable with that, you start to feel comfortable with yourself, you know? And now it's like, the sky is not the limit because there's walls behind the sky. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. we're so blessed to have you still making music and um and still just giving us that the bootsy energy man because it's needed in the world man so thank you for everything oh thank you man thank in the episode description you'll find a playlist of some of our favorite bootsy tracks along with songs from his new album album of the year number one funkateer be sure to check out youtube.com slash broken record podcast to see all of our video interviews and be sure to follow Follow us on Instagram at TheBrokenRecordPod.

1:13:00You can follow us on Twitter at Broken Record. Broken Record is produced and edited by Leah Rose with marketing help from Eric Sandler and Jordan McMillan. Our engineer is Ben Toledo. Broken Record is a production of Pushkin Industries. If you love this show and others from Pushkin, consider subscribing to Pushkin Plus. Pushkin Plus is a podcast subscription that offers bonus content and ad-free listening for$4.99 a month. Look for Pushkin Plus on Apple Podcast subscriptions. And if you like this show, please remember to share, rate, and review us on your podcast app. Our theme music's by Kenny Beats.

1:13:36I'm Justin Richman.

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