Jackson Wang on Heartbreak, Trauma, China’s Rules & Ideal Partner | FO375 Raj Shamani

0:00If you become a K-pop idol, then you're not allowed to use verb or yawn in public. It depends on what environment you're at, right? If you're in a very, very serious meeting, like, you know, you kind of like, that's just having manners. Basic manners. Everything that you post on social media, you have to take approvals. First two years in your career, you definitely have to. Our today's guest is Jackson Wang, a rapper, singer, songwriter. In this episode, he talks about the dark side of the K-pop industry. Everyone sees the glam, the stage, the stardom, but what's the cost of being a global star?

0:34You have to define ideal love for yourself. She has her craft. She has her dream. She's super focused on that. I'm focused on that even if it's different industry or whatever. What's your biggest dream? I want to be... Have you ever experienced heartbreak? I was in grade 6. She texted me. I'm breaking up with you. It was fucking raining and I had my MP3. I was listening to a song. You know what song I was listening to? It was... You were born and born in China. You trained in Korea and you are going out for the global presence. Have you ever felt that you have to play by the rules of certain countries?

1:13How do you spend your money?

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1:37tell me something like tell me a few things about korea and k-pop as an industry what are the rules there there's no rules what public are you k-pop for you there's no rules i was reading that if you become a k-pop idol yeah you're not allowed to do certain things is it like that that culturally you're not expected to do certain things let's say you're not allowed to date date publicly is that true um i mean the company don't say that and they don't say that at least for me they never told us not to like it's just never been a topic that we talked about but publicly like you're not allowed i have no idea but honestly we never talked about that we never talked about yeah we never the company never told us something like no k-pop artist talks about it right i mean talk about art i think i think for the culture like are everybody feels the same way i think for the for groups when they have interview uh it's a topic that we don't just we just don't talk about don't mention yeah but is it culturally or is it like because the rules of the system but for my company and and at that time we don't we We didn't really talk about it.

2:52But I think for one year, we were not, like we did something wrong, obviously. You know, we weren't behaving at certain times. And then I think it was for a year and training days when we were debuted, I forgot. But we handed in our phones. So you were not allowed to check your phones? Honestly, in the middle, we did some iPads, okay? Hey, come on, man. Yo, you know? But at the end of the year, and then one of the members just came out. We just had another discussion. I'm like, hey, man, we're disciplined enough. I think this shit got to stop now. And then we were like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree with that.

3:29And then we just started having our phones back again. Then you're not allowed to sneeze, burp, or yawn in public? Sneeze and yawn? Is it allowed to do that in front of the camera? No, but I think it depends on what event and what environment you're at, right? If you're in a very, very serious meeting, that's just having magic. Yeah, it's not because it's idle or this or that. No, it's just human manners. Like you're not going to be in fine dining and jump on the table and dance, right? Like it's not an idle thing. I just think it's a normal common sense, right? But if you're just with your friends, whatever, you're live streaming or that, why not?

4:08And for everything that you post on social media, do you have to take approvals? Like your social media is not controlled by you, but by the management of the agency. i mean i think when your first year two year first two years into the uh in your career you definitely have to but like i said you know when you age you have the experience you know there's a lot of stuff that might be offensive to people you know i made a lot of mistakes too but i wasn't i learned my lesson you know but and it wasn't because of you know people can take it a lot of different ways and we are entertainers we we we have responsibility i know i know that we got to entertain people but is there still responsibility of like just being careful of what you do you know so first two year i think uh first two years yeah first two years i think and even like the stuff that you know when you when you post about something or whatever your intentions were not that but people can receive it in a million different ways yeah so i learned my lesson right so yeah when i was young and then tell me about this phenomena which i really find it interesting all of a sudden k-pop is making waves around the world it's not me so you're asking the wrong person i don't know what is why of course you are why why do you think korean music is growing globally so fast have you noticed i feel like obviously you know k-pop is great and like it's doing the thing the engagement with audience and also like the the the amount of engagement you know just caring about the fandom you know the audience right i think that's on another level and also like very dynamic and very on like dancing singing in and whatever music that they're doing you know it's very dynamic that's why i think that's that's that is what i think but have you noticed what i want to say is in general asian wave is coming big yeah not even just music films bro like it's everything yeah and and and food it's it's like everything it feels like the asian wave is like you know like yeah coming yeah you feel that too right i agree i agree like i think india china korea like all of us is going places now yeah so for all the audience that's watching this right now like asians we gotta like this man yeah it's like we're neighbors bro like just hey we're the same east you get i mean and we gotta stick together do you feel as a nation you have to work 2x harder than other people around the world i think it depends on what what what what channel you are at you know it depends on what you're doing let's say in your field to build a global presence do you think there's a lot of western hypocrisy as well so do you feel you have to work 2x harder than other people who's who's other people i mean western counterpart let's say a western musician somebody who is an american musician do you think we have to work harder than them

7:27I mean, I never thought like Western artists. I think like just any artist or even any, I need to be able to not let myself down. You get me? And I think I would want to defeat and destroy my previous self. That's it. I think that is the thing. And I think, you know, a lot of trends and a lot of this and that, you know, we tend to like so much information these days. You just don't know who you are anymore. Like you, what you're doing, is this right or is this wrong? Oh, it seems like the trend is going there. It seems like it's that, you know, you lose yourself in it. And I feel like, like I said, again, just focus on what I do.

8:15I'm just, even it's baby steps. I'm just, I'm just doing this and I'm focusing on this. And I think, you know, the clock will do its thing and then it will be my turn someday. Okay, explain me how, what's your process? Because you were born and brought up in China. Yeah. You lived in Korea. You got trained in Korea. Now you tour around the world and you are going out for the global presence. We're talking about your journey in India. That's crazy. Right? But the thing is, I want to understand, you know, I want to absorb and be inspired, but also share. you know so like i'm sharing to you what happened in china and korea in terms of the entertainment system that i've been through or this and that how is it living there and you know i'm sharing but also i'm learning a lot yeah but which have you ever felt that you have to play by the rules of certain country play rules and i mean like i said it's common sense i think it's common sense like but what's your identity then let's see every musician has some kind of core meaning and identity and the message which they bring out and then they share in the world yeah and the world kind of loves that they appreciate them for that particular reason i think for me i feel like i've always been a performance artist you know and i think like my performance the dynamics of my performance like live right and for me i think a lot of people know me but not know as much of my music you know i think that is a problem and i think um why do you think so i don't know i think maybe i'm not talking about my music enough you know i've been to just talk about some other random things but like yeah i think they yeah this is a problem that i'm trying to figure out too but um this album that i'm prepping it's called magic man 2 and you know as the the previous songs that I made in my youth as a kid I've always been like I want to be cool I want to yeah I want to do this I want to be this and that and then I took a year off because I haven't been resting for more than 10 years I feel like I'm always outputting but I'm not receiving I'm not thinking I'm not reflecting and I just took a year off I was just thinking so what is cool I'm just starting like I understand we want to be cool in our youth but what is cool right and i start to just think like maybe it's just being proud of who you are and just being just being that and everyone's uh standard of happiness is different right just find yours and and i start to dig deep on who i am like what do i love what i not love and what do i believe in right what does everything mean what's the value of my life currently right and what's my lane and then i just started to write personal diaries and i just converted them into music you know about about what i how the entire album magic man 2 is talking about how i feel i've never talked about how i feel i never even written a song for myself it was just like oh this concept is cool but oh she looks like it looks cool because someone else did it not you you know i mean like it's like you said you're wearing someone's jacket you're borrowing it but it doesn't look it's not you you know so i'm like i'm just starting to tap i started to tap into that mentality uh entire album is about how i feel about reality we all have dreams but what's the reality and what's what's humanity dealing with people people around us you know like is it just about benefits and when it comes to you you losing everything who's left around you just things like that just humanity and what i think about society industry any industry oh is it just a show and everyone's every ip is a product right and when when you're done they just move on people just move on to the next show you get me yeah and and and then that's how i view everything and also talking about my feelings when i was going through all that because i debut like i said i debut at 19 i missed out all my youth i witnessed all the very amazing moments memorable moments but also some dark shit too you know like i'm like i was a kid i didn't know i wasn't ready for the industry i was just lucky enough to be a part of it and then i was just looking feeling everything i meet people oh shit this guy fucked me up and then like i meet another person like oh he's a very good oh very good people and then like just all sorts of stuff bro like the system this is the system this is the gameplay like that a certain things uh agreed and then not agreed like just a lot of emotions involved um yeah man it's it's a crazy ride there's so much more that i feel like it's too crazy to say but but like I questioned humanity so much I'm like how can humans do this what give me an example it's just too far like anyway give me an example I'm interested to know that I'm interested to know your thought process now you just said that I've talked about so many things I've not talked about myself so now let's talk about you and your music and everything that you just said like who are you what do you love what do you not love the question you ask about humanity let's go one by one I want to know about that 100 % man I would love I feel honored to share it to you so this is the album is talking about all these feelings that I have towards that right when I zoomed out and was looking at everything fuck I feel like that I feel like this I I'm just I'm talking about my feelings and my personal diaries and the songs made these are the lyrics of the song is the diary there are songs like high alone like they're basically there's four chapters in my album okay from manic highs to lose losing control to realization and fourth lastly to acceptance okay and i feel that with right and every single song i feel like that's the entire process of any when you encounter any situation in life that's the entire process that's that's life itself this fourth chapter yeah right manic highs i feel like um we're always every single day we might be surrounded with a lot of people a lot of people that we're love we really love a lot of people like it's just working or like just a lot of people around us consistently constantly every day but we're all at some point we we know that we can't not admit we do feel lonely inside right that's the fact of it and we all die alone but it's not a good thing it's not a bad thing it's just facts and we just need to accept right that's how i felt and also in the music video i explained that but also i describe how i felt about the industry like i was telling you it's a show i don't know if you watch my music video or not but i will send it to you uh it's me in a water tank right just the show and people are watching it and then boom i can't get out of the water tank i die in the water tank i'm using this analogy to express how i feel about this this my statement my message and people watch the show they clap and they move on just show it's just a show at the end of the that you're just a product.

16:03It's not a good thing. It's not a bad thing. It's just facts, right? So accept that. And then the second chapter, like there's some songs that I wrote about G-Bad. Okay. Gotta be a... Life is so great, but, you know, we always want to share love. We always want to like support people, give love to people. Yeah. But sometimes people take advantage of that. And you just have to be an... And be a... to a d***. You get what I mean? So, not because we want to be a bad person, be a bad person in those situations. It's more like, we got to protect our own will. Did someone do that to you? 100%. I'm sure somebody did that to you too.

16:47Give me an example. Have someone done that to you? That you have to be a d*** to be a bad person from what it looks like, but only to protect yourself because they crossed the line. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. but give me a situation when it happened with you

17:06there is someone that I consider really really good brother right and then to a point that it's also my fault but it's good lesson learned where I trust so much I'm like just take care of this you know and then I'll do my part I can focus on here but it's a working relationship but then you just took advantage of that and just took everything away but it's not about the material that I lost it's the trust that you lost is here bro is the heartbreak here and that shit can't be undone but I'm sure everybody has their own story on that but so that's like another song about how I feel and that's life you spoke about high point tell me the highest point which you have felt in your life highest point what do you mean you said the highs of life the lows of life when did you feel this is the highest like this I'm at my peak like everything to you look like fantasy wonderland i haven't experienced that yet but in my in my story i felt like whenever i'm touring i just feel like i feel alive and when i don't have to uh be responsible on the things that i was i was not good at back in the day i wasn't good at you know what what do i know about finance bro what do i know about legal terms right now i have chat gtp that could cover a little bit but what do i know about that i wasn't trained for that right and what do i know about business what do i know about investment nothing i just trust yeah right but it's also my responsibility now thinking back right at that point i didn't have to care about that i was just fighting i was just sprinting you know and i was just focusing on performing creative strategy directing writing treatments i was just in my bubble but i know like life is not just about that you know the responsibility is 360 so there are a lot of stuff i learned but all those songs that wrote is just certain moments from the diary man i feel like you really gotta be a sometimes life is so great but gotta be that's another song so you became a to that person definitely man 100 bro not that person just these kind of people okay what do you know how do you how do you analyze these kind of people i don't think they think that yo a bad person is a bad person but they would never think they're a bad person yeah but how would you know that they're a bad person and you need to be because there's no human like there's no because there's no it's not it's not something as a brother you would do and as a family you would do right that's just not common sense to me at least but they did it and they did it but at the like at that moment i i just thought like that's why there are these songs you get what i mean but then do i currently in my situation at like right now if you ask me do i think do i think they're they're they're um they're wrong probably not because because probably they're just trying to hustle in their own they're just like probably businessmen on steroids you get me like breach of trust is just pure evil that's it yeah but at the end that's why that's what i feel about reality people people are just like that this is humanity bro you'd also talked about low point tell me the lowest point that's a low point bro like that shit it really killed me really internally and it took me a year to recover from it you know and now i'm good because though all those songs in the album is just my memories that i've been through all these chapters another song about humanity that i feel people don't love to hate they just hate to love you get what i mean people because it takes more energy to love something than hate something yeah because that's what i felt people just hate to say it but reality of just society bro everyone's trying to live right so i understand that now but at first when i encountered that i wasn't ready for it what did you feel at that point were you betrayed bro but did you go low or you wanted to take revenge not of course at certain moment losing control i really wanted to take revenge but then at the end i just accepted it it took me a long time to just accept and move move on with it so that's why i have a song at the end of the album called made me a man whatever this yin yang bro good comes with the bad bad comes with the good it's just life you know what's good without the bad and what's bad without the good same shit so that's a process of growing up and being mature and my that was that this entire thing is my journey and i'm just sharing it for people i'm sure everyone has that journey in different aspect and the entire thing is called magic man 2 magic man 2 is the character with dark uh makeup why what does it even mean it means that people see me as Jackson Wang see me like in this suit like this but at that period and five six years what did I feel inside I feel like that I felt like that that's my internal emotions I felt shit at very very crazy moment because of the reality of everything the humanity of everything but now I just looking back I'm recovered I accepted it and move on and I matured I feel like i i learned and i feel like everyone through the process of life after entering industry even in school you know like you at some point in your life you will have your own version of that you will have everyone needs to go through your own magic man to to to to to mature and probably this happens to our parents too yeah have you ever experienced heartbreak as growing up till this point i made a lot of mistakes too you know and i would admit to that you think and um you broke someone's heart yeah yeah yeah yeah i did just very naive you know i was very naive why and no just like i wasn't being responsible you know like at a young age you know what do i know you know so i learned from that i'll admit you know and um have i been i have been heartbroken before is is like i don't think if i don't know i don't know if it's called puppy love okay the kiddish yeah man like yeah i remember this um i was in grade six and then when you're in grade six you say you're together yeah doesn't mean you know but it's just but it feels strong yeah it feels so strong i remember we were grade six or seven i forgot and and that was the first time narnia came out the movie okay like the closet you're walking right and we were watching that and then the first time in my life held hands man yo it was it we were just sitting there but it felt like i was riding a roller coaster have you ever had that when you're young yeah just so nervous man i felt like more nervous than in mac gala red carpet you know like just couldn't handle that i have felt more nervous than my concerts you know just anywhere and and but then after a few days i think uh um she texted me i remember at that time i had my first phone i think what i forgot what phone is motorola is it back then yeah motorola yeah motorola and then she texted me i think i'm breaking up with you or some shit i forgot but then i was riding a bus it was fucking raining and i had my mp3 and and and and i was just looking out the window just looking at that text and looking out the window i was listening to a song you know what song i was listening to it was by stan what was it i don't know

25:48yeah i was just crying like i cried like i've more than the rain bro like yo i was just i was just on the side i was just looking out yo in my uniform uniform shorts that was great six man and this bag on the i think it was on my knee listening to the mp3 just looking out like this with my whack haircut i'm like just looking out and i remember the guy who's who he she she she oh she told me she's breaking up with me because she is in love with another person called john okay no offense to the name bro but it's just if you i just like yeah yeah man and so john this name has always been like a trauma for me you know so yeah and um i was just looking out i cried so hard but if you had to define ideal love for yourself what would it be like i don't know i think what she has her craft she has her dream that she's working on and she's super focused on that i'm focused on that and even if it's different industry or whatever i feel like like you said you know together we will be we empower each other you know and and be motivate motivate each other on the same thing yeah and i think you know if i don't know obviously i never experienced marriage or like all that but i think now maybe i'll look at this 10 years later and i'll regret what the fuck i'm saying man like what was i saying but but you know but but for now i feel like marriage is like a life partner i wish i can just meet some best friend you know that that can really you know be be be be be there For each other Till Till the day we leave Yeah How about you man Well you're always Asking me questions bro Can I ask you one question Go ahead Have you been Have you been heartbroken Yeah Of course We all have been Oh may I ask A very stupid question How old are you 28 1997 Yeah 96 i turned 29 this year okay you're 94 yeah yeah yeah i still got two more years to catch up with your experience no man i think when when you pass 30 your body just breaks down like your immune system breaks down you just crossed 30 30 feet down i'm 31 but it's just like it's not like slowly it's one day your body we wake up it tells you hey man i think uh we're gonna shut down like It's just done.

28:29Really? It happens like that? It happens. Don't you really scare me, bro. Like, just don't. The recovery rate is slow. And then, for me at least, maybe our body's different, right? For me personally, and when you eat, you have a meal, whatever, you get so sleepy after that. Yeah. Right? And, oh, shit, it's happening to you. Yeah, it's happening already. Damn! It's happening early. Yeah, yeah. And then, and then like, yeah, everything is slow and you know, you just have to take extra care of your body. That's why you, you got to work harder like on yourself. Yeah. That's how I do it. Tell me your training routine and your diet.

29:08Usually if I don't have work, I try my best. Recently, no. But usually if I'm, if I have the, if I have the opportunity, I would sleep around eight or nine and I wake up like five or six, I work out. Okay. empty stomach workout and then after i work out come back shower and then uh do a green juice and my green juice uh which i have shared with my audience before i want to share my green juice to your audience okay i've shared once when i was like five six years ago but it was whack it was so bad i regret i apologize but now i updated it it's only based on detox and anti inflammation okay and try to avoid like it doesn't gas you up like it doesn't it doesn't make you bloated okay what is it all right man so five or six wake up workout shower green juice a little bit of ginger a little bit of garlic peeled right half a lemon celery a little bit you know the amount common sense man right and the one or two like broccoli not too much because the texture is too much okay right and then one banana and then turmeric powder a little bit put don't put a crazy amount and be like jackson your list is whack be calm have common sense okay and few blueberries four to five and collagen powder for the skin if you're over 30 yeah okay if you're over 30 but if you're like 25 whatever you know you don't you gotta gotta worry about that and the next is parsley hmm and is maybe cut the cucumber into three or four and put it in and then put ice on top obviously obviously your blender needs to be like this big yeah this big put ice on top of it and then coconut water feel like don't feel everything have common sense just like maybe one third or and then you start to blend and if it's too thick just add more coconut water or add more ice yeah that's every day and yeah that's every day if if i may like usually in uh china or korea that's my everyday and if you're traveling then i still try to but i still try to give them this formula and then a lot of times i sometimes i might i may get it like maybe two times out of ten because it's too much to ask and the rest of the eight times they say who do you think you are you know so it is reality humanity you're being humble right now i'm sure you have your own ways to no no no no no no i swear to god no no it's not it's not like that okay and then what like after green juice what do you do after green juice which is almost like close to one liter but i don't chug it like all at once yeah something that i did like before we yeah just check my ipad like just just handling making my day like okay today i'm gonna get this this done this done that that and that then okay i know about it cool just drink drink drink and probably check out some news check out what is going on with the world what is going on with the entertainment world and oh what do i need like just strategizing you know okay and also like what do i want to do next just having just brainstorming sessions right more uh afternoon right and then it's when it gets close to afternoon i take my salad number salad like the noodles or whatever i just have one meal okay and a big meal and then i watch him uh netflix while i while i um eat yourself and i watched um recently the white tiger i really like it and then did you watch it yeah the ending is not cliche i like it yeah you know and then yeah just um watch that after eating uh i have my americano after eating and take my supplements i i eat a lot of supplements what supplements do you take give me two right brother right here yeah you have like everything hey man go ahead management bro i'm my manager i'm my manager and uh what i take obviously vitamin c but i think the green juice has a lot of vitamins already but it's just that i always still take it vitamin c uh probiotic super enzyme um very important um b12 b6 because my uh my body check i found out that i'm i need i need those d d3 is it yeah vitamin d yeah d3 yes yeah that's already six right and then um what else what else oh folate acid okay right don't know what is it for i forgot but then my my report tells me that and eat that and then what else i think that's about it oh omega-3 okay yeah omega-3 that's it and so that's your supplements and tell me about your skincare routine i'm like pretty curious about bro why is world obsessed with korean skincare routine i have no i don't think are they obsessed yeah the world is obsessed there are multi-million i think i think not just the cosmetic part but it's also the lifestyle are you going to the gym enough are you sleeping enough and what are you eating what are you drinking that's it yeah but what about the cosmetic stuff is that me no no no i don't do that i don't do that i try to adjust to my lifestyle what i drink what i eat what i um how i balance you know sleep is obviously very important but i have not been uh disciplined on that so much shit to worry about and then yeah it's about that and are you hitting are you doing cardio enough are you lift weight lifting enough or like just anything are doing pilates or you know it's just a lifestyle thing do you feel like the industry you're in people are obsessed with the way you look what you do and just like perfection i just think that's not just this industry i think it's just it's just everyone right everyone want to take good care of themselves right everyone want to be a better version of themselves every day i don't think it's just a Korean thing or a Chinese thing or a Japanese thing or Indian thing.

36:04I just think it's human. But the show business I'm talking about, not about the Korean Chinese thing. I'm talking about you're in the show business. In the show business, do you think people are obsessed with the way you dress, the way you look, your makeup needs to be on point, your hair needs to be on point, like everything? Who, who, who, who, who? Just people, your audience. Do you think you need to just wake up out of nowhere and just walk around? Bro. that's why i'm gonna tell you i think my audience seem too much too many of those sides of me like i always go out beer like more than you bro you never you don't believe right more than you i don't i bro tell them to upload it in the comment you'll be surprised you'll be like who's this guy right more than you and who doesn't care what i wear i'm just going out on the street because i feel like hey it's not a schedule for me i just want to walk around and they'll see me in the most random places right and they'll see me just doing the most random things right so i i don't have that and i don't think i don't know about other people but my audience my fans or my supporters i don't think they maybe they care just that i don't know but i see i seem to think like they're fine with it you know because that's me so you're not obsessed about looking perfect it depends on the occasion right on the show obviously you'd want to it also depends on the concept if i'm having a stage a performance talking about like um something to do with cars a concept i'm probably gonna be in a race suit right race jacket but if i'm talking about something about lullaby right about like beds i'll be in a sexy pajama right it depends on what i what the concept is yeah i don't care like that's why in my a lot of my music videos you don't see two fashionable things it's more whatever the character is and the concept the outfit follows that's it tell me about your dream what's your biggest dream my biggest dream i want to be i want my audience um i want my audience my fans or whoever my future fans or even the fans that's going to leave me soon like to feel in some day i can be be some sort of emotional support for them through music through whatever because all the stuff that i'm doing i'm just writing like the music like even for this album magic man too it's just about life i go through it you go through it but it's just different different things but the same logic and i think from now on all my music and everything i would just write it will be my only source of expression, my only source of expression about how I feel about a certain things.

39:08You know, it could maybe Magic Man 3 is about love, right? About all the stuff that, you know, I wish I could have done and all the stuff that I made mistakes on that I learned and I felt sorry. A lot of stuff that, you know, maybe I should, maybe I wanted to do this, but my heart is telling me something else, you know? just something that i can emotionally give energy to my audience when they're having a bad time when they have when they feel lonely when if they feel like no one understands them yeah you know and i feel like that's what i believe as me as an artist that i want to do be with them in those moments yeah and how would you measure that you have achieved that i have not i have not i'm trying But how would you know Like at one point Because what you said Is very subjective Right How would I know Yeah how would you know That it has happened I would know I would know If I meet them one day Right I would know If I On the streets Whether I meet them In concerts Or even in But that must be happening Even right now People Yeah a lot Yeah so it happens So technically This dream has been achieved I mean in the process of that But I'm saying How can I be like A thing that Because this is the thing magic man too there's still a lot of audience that even my audience don't even know what it means yeah don't know what is it talking about don't know what does it represent so to me i'm just like i want to make sure that i can be a part of them they're they're what i just said you know whether i'm in concert i see them or even the letters you know the letters they write i walk I read, right?

40:49And yeah, even on the street, just anywhere I could feel, being able to hear that, you know, that means the world to me. And do you have any materialistic dreams? Huh? Do you have any materialistic dreams? By materialistic - It's impossible? No. What I meant by materialistic dream is - Oh, like a thing. Like maybe I want to fill stadium with two lakh people in it, like two million people in it or 200 ,000 people in it or maybe that stadium, this stadium, maybe a world tour bigger than, I don't know, Coldplay or... I wish... Or rankings in some way. I don't know. Or like a private jet. I never thought about that.

41:31A private jet maybe. Like whatever. Do you have a materialistic dream? Yeah, 100%. Also being able to tour around any place that I want and also people feel exactly what I'm trying to say and they can relate. Do you have any idols? oh definitely uh tell me about one in music or like what tell me music and one without me like someone who's not from music my dad really why my mom my mom and my dad why their mental mental vision okay i'll tell you one thing okay like it's super personal by the way i have a song about my parents too in the album magic man too in in in the album i have a song that i wrote about them okay but why am is my mom and dad one of my big idol is because um i've seen them you know i'm not from a middle class family like when they first moved my mom moved from shanghai to hong kong and my dad moved from guangzhou to hong kong become the head coach of team hong kong didn't have you know and i saw my mom and dad did shift especially my mom i saw she did a lot of shift every day three to four different jobs and then she would come home sleep for a few hours and she like she doesn't like all the stuff she would provide for us and but herself she would not take them you know even eat you eat first you eat the leftovers but as a kid what do i know i'm like fucking what five six seven eight like young young yeah you know and and like she would work so hard and every time when when she comes back she she just lays on the floor and then like i said are you okay mama like mommy are you okay and then she she said oh give me five minutes i will come up and she has to take care of me and my brother like after all those work come back take care of my make food for us and then uh take care of our homework and after we eat wash dishes just clean basically because my dad also she's he's always traveling for competitions right and then yeah and then she's just basically one woman taking care of the entire family you know me and my brother so i just think she's like she wanted to save up everything so that me and my brother lives in a healthy environment because she also knows that healthy environment at least you will have healthy friends and you know even later on if you my mom thought like even if you guys are very bad at studying and you know you can still have some place to live you can still live with me so she saved up saved up 30 years of her saving to get a house you know for for me and my brother like in case you guys fail in your life you know i'm not gonna be here forever you know i can take all the pain but i don't want you guys to feel the pain you know i want to at least you still have this house to live in you know and and and that she worked she had she only had one goal i mean i figured that out like in this these four or five years but before that i never she never i asked her she never tells me why she said she only had one goal is to do that provide you guys one house in 30 years you worked and and and so that you guys even you guys are failure of humanity you guys still still have somewhere to live i saw how much they suffered you know and have you ever shared this with them yeah and my mom always gets so emotional it's just imagine like how how tough is it for her you know that's why i'm a mama boy like i always it's like we always live under their wings but now i feel like our wings has the capacity and like can work now.

45:52So I want to always protect them here. The song that I wrote is about

46:01us and our parents. It feels like we're on the same street, but they're just further up. And everything is a cycle. You think when they first had us, you think they were ready to become mom and dad? They weren't ready. You think, why would my mom, for example, I'm just saying personal, why would she work 30 years for one go you think when she was young she never had dreams you think she didn't want to like just have fun and chill right and and and my dad too you think he never been to a party you think they never like some just hang around and flirt they've done all that but the thing is having a family that's what it really changed people you know that's why i see it i never witnessed it but i saw it you know and it just inspired me a lot inspired me a lot it's pretty inspiring yeah so that's why the song is about that it's songs about like let me give you your flowers because you let me bloom you know like my superpower came from you so i wish i could be you one day but i know like you know i wish i could be you and i and i feel like i could never be like them.

47:10Do you get time to spend with them? I live with them, bro. I live with them in Shanghai. Yeah. Tell me about China a bit. What's up? We keep hearing that you don't have enough like you can't talk freely in China. Can you? Depends on what you talk about, right? Depends on what you talk about common sense. No, but is it like is there some because you're so big and you're culturally relevant do you think are there things that you are you can't say in public or maybe are there things? This is how I look at it, bro. If we're talking - And there's statements you're not allowed to say. No, I don't think there is such thing.

47:44I think what it is, is I'm a performer. I'm an entertainer. And when you or whoever asks me about something that I don't have the knowledge to make a judgment, the fuck am I gonna say, man? Like, that would be irrelevant. That's fair. Right, right, right. But if you ask me about, like, stuff in my lane, I can share to you what I think because I feel like at least have a basic fundamental of knowledge of what's going on. So there are no restrictions in that? I don't think there is. I don't think there is. And what do we get wrong? What do you think the world gets wrong about China? It's a normal place.

48:20And I think, you know, there are a lot of stuff that out of our control, this and that. I don't know. Definitely something that I don't have an opinion on because I don't have the knowledge to speak on about. But it's just that, yeah, it feels like, it feels like it's more it's just a normal place right you have to go there rather than just hear what it's about you have to come to shanghai you go to chongqing you go to chungdu you go to guangzhou beijing go to the great wall just come and feel and see i'm coming here to feel and see to learn yeah you get me then i would feel like i've been there i felt it whatever you tell me that's bullshit because i saw it you get what i mean it's the same thing anywhere else i think china us we have the same thing like whatever you heard okay cool tell me what have you heard which is absurdly weird bro a lot of like short videos or whatever in on the internet and this and that obviously you've come across with i think this is just not just about china right this is about like any other places just and then it becomes the stereotype and then it becomes oh they're like that that it becomes one video becomes they are all like that but tell me one specific stereotype which you have come across have you come across it no i've not i'm just asking you like for example let me see i mean let me i think horrible stuff which i i i i think it's i don't know what what what it is but i think living in shanghai for myself i don't i don't thing it's true it's like oh is it is some street a certain alley or is it a little a little like not as clean as you think or is it hey is there food there's there's is not um what do you call like is it is it not clean enough or this and that i'm sure every single place on earth you have that side in a certain alley yeah right right we're not in what what are we are we in in in a in a game right then everything is perfect structure built perfectly no we're on earth man and i think there's so much misconceptions about it's just like this the food right this is the places i'm like it's not like that i think that's why come come see first come see you will have a better understanding you will have you will have a better personal experience that you see for yourself you know than not not whatever other people say yeah i was reading one very random article about you just do the research and the article was like you have a very prominent role in shaping china's pop culture in the global world no bro i just think that you're a soft power for a you're a strategy you're part of a strategy of i mean everyone has everyone has the freedom to say what they want they believe in right and i think for me i just represent where i'm from my hometown yeah right i i don't i don't know about anything else i don't even want to comment on any any about because i don't know shit about that but where i'm from where i'm born right where i'm born and where what's the blood i feel proud of that bro and those like whatever people say then i'm like hey i'm so fed up i'm like just come and look at yourself true if you if you had a bad experience oh shit certain places i mean it is what it is right but like the entire experience in general i'm i feel like you should just come and look yourself right yeah have you ever been went through stuff like that?

52:06For example, vice versa, right? Are there any stereotypes people say about like India or Mumbai? Yeah, of course. And I feel this is pretty bullshit. Bro, I am here. Bro, like this is the same thing. But you feel the same. Sometimes some stereotypes I feel like, oh, they're true. But the majority of them are bullshit. And then I start because of those examples and I start to think Like, I start to question, why is there this stereotype? Like, what's the intention behind that? But this is obviously, I'm just an audience just like watching, like just seeing this, right? But I just start to think a lot.

52:50Yeah. Yeah. True. And do you feel misunderstood as an individual? I think this is a very good question because I really thought about that. when I was making this album, right, obviously it's from my personal experience and what I feel about all these different aspects of life. There's also one question I asked myself. Am I the Jackson Wang that people think what Jackson Wang is? Or am I the Jackson Wang who I think Jackson Wang is? so I just pretty much gave no filter on this album and just I could write songs about candies right I can write songs about roses but I needed this album that I want to do and I feel this is me this is exactly how I felt what's the difference what do you feel is the difference I don't know there's so many differences what people feel about you and who you are you know like in other aspects oh he's a c-pop guy yes i am that's my hometown but i still have a lot of different sides of me right it's just just just like every different direction so then i'm like and then oh jackson is um jackson has a big team jackson has a big team uh you know whoever does this shit um people helping him doing this this is this a lot of people probably like 30 people 40 people with with they all think like you're a big star but i'm not a big star bro this is the reality like my my engagement rate is is the worst bro and also and just to be very honest i think it's just an aura thing is not and and and second i don't have my team is only two three people i'm doing it maybe like just all like from from product this is the basic right from product to to um to what uh uh strategizing the rollout plan the launch plan right and then the directing writing treatments right and then gathering directors and dps and our team and and outfits what what is it what is it what's the hair man like what's everything and then you get i mean obviously there's two two three people but the majority lead strategist is me right and and i want to i read this year i really want to go to uh india as one of my big bucket list i want to go be able to go there and feel yeah because i can't just come in because i always think when you're just traveling to a place and have concert the whoever that's going to go to the concert is the people that know you but that's just probably one pocket of that community and loco and i feel like oh shit then And in order to do that, I really want to understand, spend more time there, you know, understand everything.

55:44Just by today talking with you, walking on the street, doing this and doing that, nightlife, a part of it. I understand what's, I would feel like at the end of the trip, I understand kind of the flow. You get what I mean? And the more time I spend, I feel like I understand more. You get what I mean? So let's do that. But I had to think of that. No one thinks of that for me. Who? So I have to think, you know, when I upload stuff on my song is out, right? My song is on Instagram or TikTok, right? I have to go and check, did the lyrics fuck up? Or is there lyrics or is there no lyrics, right? Is it the right part of the song on TikTok, on the reels or, you know, on IG, Instagram, right?

56:37which is fine and also uh behind the scene footage i have to edit that like i have to just every single if i potentially have uh uh um uh what do you call like uh a concert performance right music arrangement uh rundown installations vjs um just everything but i don't it's not me i'm sorry if i sound like i'm complaining but it's not but i'm saying i feel that's like the responsibility that it has to come from me because it's my idea right but i'm talking about some other things where like the marketing right i really want it you know even even on instagram you know that broadcast channel yeah i figured out that recently and i'm like because i want to engage more with with my audience and fans and that's why i created that and i want to be a part of like i was saying you know emotionally or whatever you know i wanted to share my thoughts and you know hopefully could motivate them i also want to share it to them like want to be closer to them you know but nobody told me to do that but i think this is responsibility right i just have to feel like it's it's it's fucking you know yeah uh um see you do a lot of these things sometimes i feel helpless why i wish i could have you know one more more two more people that you know can just back and forth idea with me that really cares about this you know like that really believes in this you know so you feel there's no one who believes no at least for me like the people that i met currently is just i don't know man like i'm still figuring out i'm still figuring out and i think i appreciate their effort and time it's just that i think the puzzles are not um like in the right slot do you feel you find difficult trusting people now after that incident that's why you don't want anyone to come mess up with your vision no i would appreciate if they come in like at least you know offer and deliver and tell you even if it's a different idea you know even telling me jackson shut the fuck up this is i don't i don't this i would appreciate that so much or like jackson you should do this hey jackson be even disciplining me i would love that but the thing is i always struggle with is i don't feel the care and i don't feel like i don't know if you if you if you has have you ever experienced that when there's uh your colleague or whatever when it's a work relationship they a lot of the most common thing they mention is oh i thought it was like that oh i thought something something something oh sorry but i thought like i'm like hey you could have confirmed that if you really wanted to right that's one thing and second is i'm like yo this is the plan one two three four five six seven let's do that okay boom i have other things to worry about boom i do it i'm like and because i might forget this right but luckily i just memo everything in my list i have a whole list of my to-do list right and then i come back what about this oh yeah yeah i reached out uh they didn't reply you get me and then just the entire process stops the logistic operation right so to me if you care enough for example today your your your your throat i know maybe your hand your hand is cut it's bleeding so much right i mean it's a bad analogy sorry and then you're calling the ambulance and then are you gonna say oh the ambulance didn't pick up you get my analogy I get it, yeah.

1:00:20I think obviously it's a very dramatic analogy, but I'm saying, it's the same logic. I feel at the end of the day, of course you didn't do wrong. There's nothing wrong with people didn't reply you or whatever, right? But have you tried calling? Have you this or that? To me, it just comes down to how much you care. I'm from the same school. I hear you and I understand you fully because I have a similar thought process and a similar intensity that if they don't reply you, you email again. If they don't do that, you stalk them on Instagram. You find out something and you make it work. There's no other way.

1:00:58There's a Chinese saying in Cantonese, saying, It means every single street or every single direction, it reaches Rome. You get me? On earth. Like anywhere you go, there's a billion ways to get something done. right are you being like you get me thinking out of the box or is it an effort thing or is it a timing thing or is it like are you analyzing what what's not working out right or are you just like living day by day yeah yeah and then how do you find out people because you said you have two three people i think that's also one of my biggest problem i always start to work with friends for example i need a doctor but i have asked my best friend to come in hey what's happening with my heart man oh you're gonna you're gonna wait okay okay i get it a different thing now because i thought like because music especially art itself it's an to me it's very subjective right it's very personal right and and it's a where it's it's a feeling there's not a problem then right it's a feeling so when i recruit someone or invite someone to my team it's all based off of like i feel that this person has taste or potential you know whatever so i invite but we're very close friends and when you get in probably like oh you never really done this logistic part too much or you've this that's just a puzzle and that makes me not able to maximize their strength probably their strength is triangle but i'm like i want circle man but you might be getting hundreds of offers of people to who want to join you please no not even one i just never i don't know where to go like what are you saying no i yo i swear i don't know but these these agencies apparently who are like apparently the big one they must be reaching out to you maybe not the individual i hope they reach out yeah i hope they reach out they must be doing it and you but i think i'm uh reforming my team a little bit yeah i think i'm reforming and also that i can be so that i can also be like responsible to the previous you know for all my all my staff okay how do you How do you spend your money?

1:03:12I just put it in the account And probably more than half of it I just give to my mom But do you invest or do you spend a lot? I spend so much I spend so much What do you spend on? Production Spend on production But not on personal shit? Like maybe buy fancy cars and stuff like that? I don't think they're fancy Are they fancy? I don't buy like Tell me the most ridiculous Or like the most expensive thing you've bought I don't think bought is the most expensive thing That I lent someone Yeah That I borrowed What was it? A lot of money You borrowed a lot of money? No not borrowed I lent someone And then they never gave you back It just disappeared Vanish bro You gave it to a friend Relations fucked up right and then the money's gone So I learned my lesson You know there was a study I was reading That's also humanity bro humanity I was reading the study like three four days ago which was done on two million people across I think 15-16 countries 15-16 countries two million people three out of four people every three every four people three people said when they gave money to the friend or someone known they never got it back and the relationship is done bro I lent someone for their family just some shit dude I can't really say here I gotta really respect that whatever it is too just for family and then turn out it's not for family nah it was at that time like 40 30-40 % of my income yeah that's the man it's always I don't know it's life magic man too brother yeah magic man too yes acceptance accept everything and move on that's it it's life would you lend money now to somebody?

1:05:07I would say I would still say like if it's anyone like my friend or whoever that I I trust obviously I don't even trust myself too like at this point for this these kind of shit but but like like I would but it's just if it's like it depends on that level of trust I have this to this person right but usually I don't suggest I would say like yes I would do I will lend you but I think we our relationship might end here and I don't let's don't hurt each other now I have a rule I have a rule in this podcast just name all those no no no I'm just kidding I'm just kidding sorry namaste no but now I have a rule that if I I give and forget like I'm like if I'm giving money I'm not even expecting that it'll come back So in my head, I asked myself a question.

1:06:08For whatever reason they're asking money for, is it good enough reason for me - To break the relationship. No, no. To forget that even if they don't give me back, is it okay for me to continue the relationship with them? If the answer is yes, then only I give money to my friends or anyone who needs it. But the thing is - And then I don't even expect they'll give me back. If they don't, it's okay. If they give me, it's okay. Yes, I thought about that. But the thing is, I would be awkward after that. Like, even I could continue the relationship, but I can't stand that awkwardness. But if it's for the right reason, I'm okay.

1:06:45But how do you know it's the right reason, right? I don't even inquire. In my head, I'm delusional that it's the right reason. Oh, you brainwash yourself? Yeah. That's crazy, bro. I'm like, this is it. Okay, cool. You didn't tell me about your music idol. Oh, definitely grew up with Neptune's Prince. Michael Jackson. And as a fan, you know, not saying that it inspired me, but not saying that I want to do that kind of genre, right? Let's just say as a kid. Andre 3000. G-Unit. What else I'm thinking? Do you have any? Black Street. But anyway, I fell in love with the movie RRR. Okay. Oh. Hey, so intense, bro.

1:07:33Yeah. Three hours. Usually, bro, it's a test as an audience. I'm just going to speak my honest truth, right? Honest feeling. Any movie that's three hours or longer, it's so hard to sustain. Yeah. Bro, my eyes were not off of anything, just the screen because it was so intense. Bro, you have the crazy dynamics of it, the relationship, the human emotions within the two character. and the intensity of like all the climate shots and then even the dance at the end, honestly speaking, if any other movie, like it's so in these kind of setup, like dancing in the middle of a movie or some type of stuff, it's very easy to like screw up.

1:08:20Yeah. But it never lost my attention. It built more and I was super locked in on it, man. And I was like, so cool. Yeah. I love that scene when the animals come out. Oh, from the house? Isn't it? Not from the house. Like from the train. Sorry, the truck going into the mansion and coming out. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like I just love that scene. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love the scene when at the end, them two, close to the end, they were battling on some sand. Well, not sand. It's like in front of this whatever place. They were just battling with dance. and also the first scene in the front where I think the main character caught the tiger or something.

1:09:04That's crazy, man. Yeah, that was intense. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're making music with Diljeet? I made a song. Okay. Yeah, yeah, and he featured it. And what do you like? Do you like, have you seen Diljeet music yet? Of course. What do you like about him? He's becoming a global rage now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Definitely. I just feel like, because I think one of the things that hit me the most was three years ago i was performing in uh coachella with him in sahara tent and um i finished my set and the next set was the end of the show dildjit rushed down i was looking along my friends really big fan of dildjit so i was like damn like i wish i can like someday you know if i'm lucky enough i want to collaborate with this person you know and and that was just a thought and then until like two years later i was making my album magic man 2 um the song buck i was like writing writing i was like shit this sound if diligent for some reason like if he hops on it would be fire you know and so i dm'd him i said hey champ um this is i have a song if you vibe with it please let me know and if you don't like it's all good much respect and yeah and then he's he showed me a lot of love and support and and then he you know thankfully for me he just said give me two weeks because i think he was shooting a movie a movie or something yeah so he recorded and then we shot the music video together with we were we were in a couple shoots together and um aside from the music video we were in a couple shoots together and yeah or something oh no no no i've never acted before yeah but but yeah so we we were in other shoots for something else i think it's going to come out later but you know he's not he's never he's always been like as an artist obviously global icon but i'm saying as a person to me as a as a big brother you know he it's not like he never lectures people you know he never lectures or teach you anything but through his words you just have so much shit to learn you know like just wise like decisions he doesn't like i hate to always mention this side of him but he's like he doesn't me i'm rapid fire you can tell right but he just says a few things and when you really think about it just is is what it is yeah yeah do you believe he believes in destiny god and everything someone in the universe is making him do things do you believe in all of this as well are we talking about aliens no just like he believes in the power of universe i feel like there is a reason why the universe is universe there must be something that we just don't know there are a lot of different point of views on this but I think I think there must be a reason do you believe in scientifically speaking yeah right do you believe in God yeah I do yeah but the thing is there must be scientifically some something is happening yeah yeah I also believe I'm a big believer of science but I also believe that where science ends magic begins what podcast what podcast what podcast do you watch No I don't watch podcasts I just watch this My own podcast But I do Oh you have too much Oh shit You have a Scientific podcast Yeah yeah Where's the room man Let's go there And start another episode Two hours episode I'm talking about aliens man That's something I don't do But I talk a lot of Science Researches Stories Neuroscience And all of that stuff What is it about Like what Like brain science I love neuroscience Like the power Give me one example like power of what goes on in your brain like how do you react how do you do certain things what makes you do who you are how do achievers think how do achievers not think like all of this i just love the science of peak performance the science of behavior the science of memory and all that i just love all of this shit like i'm very geeky about neuroscience and human body and evolution and do a lot of research on it yeah and evolution and all of that i love not like the sci-fi you're more into like all that stuff?

1:13:36no I'm just into everything that I don't know I just want to learn same I feel like there's a reason man we never know we're always like guessing even we got it right we don't know right I get it I think there's always a reason I believe in God too and I believe that universe is making us do some stuff there's something somewhere someone is or have you think about the other way we're making oh obviously I understand your point I understand your point because it's out of our control yeah in the universe it's out of our control like someone it's either like too many people doing too many things together and that's why we all are getting control or it's like someone making all of us do things I don't know which one's doing yeah there's something have you seen a human size and then the earth size and then the fucking what Jupiter size and then the Mars and then sun and then becomes a hundred and then goes into the different Milky Ways galaxy or whatever do you think entirely we're the one who's alive there must be something that's alive we'll take this on another day okay or else we'll start like another podcast right here thank you so much for coming man thank you it was a pleasure having you bye bye okay man welcome Welcome bro.

1:15:00How are you doing man? I'm already starting. It's time to get the interview. What are your plans tonight? Where are you going? I want to go. You want to go out somewhere? I want to go out somewhere. Okay. What kind of place do you want to go? I want local stuff. Okay, I mean this when you were asking me before we start you were asking me what's one thing that you find like tiring to answer in Indian media press. I'll tell you I enjoyed everything but one answer is how's your trip so far? it didn't even begin! We didn't even start! Bro, I landed the first day, I landed like around like what? 3, 2?