E124 - After Making $40M Online, This Is My Best Advice To Get Rich | Charlie Morgan

0:00I want to create this guru destroyer 9000 that you just can't compete with the foundations the office stuff the niche stuff the mindset stuff the treats here's how things actually work and now you can build from that he's built a real business empire using youtube as the engine charlie morgan the thing that i've observed with entrepreneurs is they all fall apart and die and end up being blown to smithereens because to get to that point where you're liquid enough to live that lifestyle you have to work obscenely hard but then you start enjoying all these rewards which then takes away from the work which then after a while destroys the business i'm looking at these kids who were like in their early 20s that money when i was 20 years old 21 i would be an asshole being a billionaire is like that's the highest level of the game that's what i'm sort of optimizing and engineering my entire life for it's like walking on a tightrope one misstep and you're dead what have you realized so far the pursuit of becoming a billionaire the key thing and i think the big advantage the big moat it gives me around the business is quick pause guys i need to tell you something it's that time of the year where everyone's on the winter arc hype where they're building their physique which they plan to reveal at some point in the summer of 2026 but i hate to be the guy that says it most of you are going to end up getting fat you'll be overeating you'll be following some sort of a program which isn't actually going to be getting your results you're going to be improvising on the spot no doubt you won't be tracking there'll be no structure just random exercises with minimal progress seen on a week-to-week basis pretty frustrating right well Well, that's the whole reason why I built the Thirst app, to help busy people like yourself find a system they can actually stick to over a long period of time.

1:35We have thousands of transformations for men and women who just plug into the app and get the exact plan they need for their goals, show up to the gym and just put in the work, all for less than an hour of their time. You get access to over hundreds of programs and hundreds of different meal plans, everything which you could possibly need to get yourself in shape. so if you actually want to stick to something and see results without taking things to the absolute extremities click the link in the bio let's get on with the video Charlie Morgan welcome to the show finally we made it happen yeah it's been we've been trying to do this for what like three years now I think yeah sorry I've been like dodging you is that because you just not really wanted to do podcasts or I think it's because I never had anything to sell no i mean it's like i've had a bunch of requests for like since i moved to dubai especially loads of podcasts and dubai obviously and i've just always had the habit of saying no because i've always been like super busy or just i haven't felt like i'm ready to show my face to the broader world except then my youtube start popping up yeah i just it's now i've got this i can actually yeah there's a reason to come on put one whole year's worth of work into that bad boy yeah yeah we want to get straight into it yeah okay um well what do you want to know it took a year well well like why why would you put one year's worth of work into something and then give it away for free well the initial plan was not to do it for free okay so i was gonna like i had this big idea okay i'll tell you the story of how it how it came about and then i can explain why it's free i was like i was thinking back it must have been three years ago um so i was already like at that point I really had a lot of success with the business and I always had this sort of dream idea of just taking everything that I had learned and everything that I knew um which will be in the whole scheme of things is very little but to get you to start or build a little business is somewhat significant and I was like what if I just did that and then made it free and I had this like little exciting idea for like a week or two and I was like no I'm never gonna do that because obviously it doesn't make any sense and then school came out and I was like actually this could make a lot of sense because you know you could monetize it through school and I knew school's whole plan for like premium products vip and um so i got to building it about three years later um and i thought it was only going to take me like two months to make i was like this is just like beginner stuff it's going to be easy it's going to be straightforward and it ended up taking yeah 12 months and by the time it it came around to launching around six months into the build i was like this needs to be free because i feel like there's a few reasons first of all no one's ever a lot of people have done free courses before a lot of people have done like uh free training free courses but they've never been like something you'd expect to pay for that makes sense so like one bit of feedback we get from from the academy is like people will post me like oh i thought this this would be like four or five k worth of value and so the call the main reason i wanted to do it is because the way the program you just want you want to fuck it up for everyone else there is there is there is that but there is honestly there is an element there's a couple of reasons first of all it's like it's a great funnel for my high ticket stuff and you know we've we've already had hundreds of people book sales calls for easy grow for action nirvana for the mastermind we had a mastermind client who paid us a shit ton of money to do some coaching who was like yeah i went into academy it looked great so i was like i'll just buy the mastermind um so the funnel is the main reason but the second reason is to sort of cement the idea that like like try and beat me now yeah it's like there's there's lots of competition and there's lots of people out there but i was like I want to create this like guru destroyer 9000 that let's just you just can't compete with like the only way to now beat me in the long term would be to make a better product and to make it less expensive but that's impossible so the only way to do it is make it better which means you have to put more time in but the key thing and I think the big big advantage the big moat it gives me around the business is because the way I've approached it is it's kind of like the program teaches like the truth of starting an agency coaching consulting business so it starts with the principles like the fundamental like first principles of the truth of like of like the foundations the office stuff the niche stuff the mindset stuff the appointment booking the sales stuff like the truths it's less about like the actual tactical like do this do that it's more about just like here's how things actually work and now you can build from that and the cool thing is because i'm the first to sort of do that the truth is the same for everyone but because i'm the first to make it like sort of accessible to everyone i now kind of own the truth so i saw this with Hormozy because Hormozy owns the truth for offers like whenever someone tries to make an offer training it's very hard to make a really really good offer training without pulling something from Hormozy's hundred million offers if that makes sense because he just he just listed out all the first principles that will never change for everyone and made them available and accessible to everyone for like a dollar whatever it was and so now Hormozy sort of owns that element of the truth so no one can really attack him from that angle so I want to do kind of the same thing um and also i think as well like i the future of info and the future of this sort of internet marketing game for me at least is who has whoever has the best free course will win i think that's like the you know the ultimate thing it's gonna grab some water there yeah that makes sense so especially now it's i don't know who was the first person to do it but it is becoming increasingly more competitive yeah what the the whole money make money online space yeah and the whole like build your personal brand yeah we teach you how to do it and then the i think you mentioned it as well in some of your videos how back in the day if you did a little bit flexing online yeah it was way easier to stand out but now no mate you just the sheer barrier to entry is you need at least a supercar watch yeah maybe a couple other things and then people will that qualifies you to enter the market this is kind of like the thing with the with the you see this a lot with the forex industry and also the only fans management industry like the trading industry the crypto industry and also kind of like smma but not so much anymore it's like the guys that get the attention are the guys that like there's there's a guy i don't know his name but i saw some guy bought a lamborghini worth like five million and then there's another guy who has like a 10 supercar collection and it's like the only way to to get like people to look is that the guy in miami yeah he's in my yeah that is the cn the yeah the green one and someone sent it to me and i'll because they they know that i don't do the flex marketing thing and and you look at it and you think and you know those people they make a ton of money but the only way to enter that space is to get to that point because i know loads of people that have like a 100 grand lambo or like a you know 458 spider or like a nice rolex but you see like the sort of dubai lifestyle vlogs now and you see these guys on the peripheral just sort of fading away even though their lifestyles are like madly impressive there's just this like obscene like um like hedonistic race at the top now for like who can flex the hardest and it's got to the point now where like the only way to beat those guys is to have um like a supermodel girlfriend and a bugatti yeah to sell a course so i'm like I'm sort of thinking of that.

8:50I don't want to do that. So it's like, why don't I just make it free and just beat them on value? And I think that that's really happening. I've already seen loads of messages. Like people send me screenshots of like coaching conversations. People will be like, oh, you should try this and like, just do the Academy. Don't buy this. Just do the Academy instead. And it's like, we won't see the effect of it being free and being as good as it is for probably about a year or two. But I think by that point, I think that the sort of B2C biz market like start a business make money online is so massive and so vast and there's so so many new people coming into it all the time that i'll never be able to like monopolize that with just free value but it's the people that have come in they've bought a 997 course or they've bought a 50 a month you know um discord community and they're sort of i call them beta wannabe but you've got b2c which is brand new to the space you just want to make money then you've got beta wannabe which is like you're not really a consumer but you're not really a business owner yet but you you're you're sort of on the self-improvement game and you're sort of trying to get clients but you're not quite there yet then you've got b2b the academy is for the b2wannabes and that's a smaller market than b2c but you know we'll see we'll see it could be a huge mistake you know but i think for the for the long term of what i want to do with um other projects down the line it's it's a big well fortunately for you you've you've made a fair amount of money so it's not like yeah you you're gonna be struggling like what you made since you entered the space you've like 40 mil or something nearly 40 mil yeah yeah we well we started with that's so we started with an agency got that 200k a month when was this this was 2018 um this was in the uk or yeah yeah so i i went to uni when i was 18 as you do and then how that would have been seven years ago no longer than that now i'm nearly 27 now so like nine years ago or something which university Plymouth it was shit it was shit man because I went to okay so it's actually quite funny when I did GCSEs I got a C in maths because I was never very good at maths and I really wanted to go to Exeter uni to do psychology and so I went to the admissions process and they were like look to get into Exeter or Bath or Bristol or one of these Russell groups you need at least a B in maths at GCSE so i reset my my maths exam during my lunch breaks of my a levels to get a b i got a b by some slim miracle i didn't know that some was not good at maths and then um and then last minute i watched the tai lopez ad like right before um right before i think it was like probably july like before september before you go and i was like the entrepreneurship thing and i'd already committed to uni i was in my mind i had that like confirmation bias i told everyone i was going and i was like and going to university and so i switched my course last minute to this this this two-year fast-track entrepreneurship and enterprise course in plymouth because that was one of the only few places yeah it was like because i looked i was like where can i study entrepreneurship at university because i had no i had to google what an entrepreneur was i had no idea um so i went there and i had these like super high expectations of it and like plymouth was it left it left a bit to be desired let's put it that way it's still it's still got some nice parts but as far as the university and education was concerned like it wasn't it wasn't it was just what you'd expect right yeah um and then after i dropped out after like six months of that because i was like yeah this is this is yeah classic yeah i mean i dropped taught by lecturers who well this was not actually made literally the reason i dropped out is because i was um i was reading there's a book by you know lord alan sugar the lord um he has a book called what you see is what you get it's like his autobiography and i was reading that um whilst i was doing this first like six months at uni and in the book it said like you need to learn if you want to be an entrepreneur and be successful in business like me you have to learn how to sell and i was like right that's a pretty critical piece of information there from an actual billionaire like i'll go and ask the university about it so i went to my you teach me i went but i went to i went to my um tutor um in the uni i won't say his name because obviously a small faculty in a small uni and um i asked him i was like when do we learn how to sell and he's he's sort of like he's he's sort of like close the door sit down like i was like i was like okay like sat down he was like well let me let me be honest with you charlie we don't we don't have a sales module or course in the in the in the two years you're with us because um none of the lecturers have had their own businesses so they don't actually have any sales experience i was like oh okay i dropped out the next day i was like i went back to him with with the with the forms i printed off and he was like are you sure you want to do this like it's going to be a huge mistake what you're going to do i had no idea what i was going to do yeah i tried to like start some businesses at university that had not gone very well um and then after that i was just like yeah all i know is like there's a really good quote i like from charlie monger that says all i want to know in life is where i'm going to die so i never go there and i knew like i didn't know what to do you knew what you but i knew i shouldn't yeah i knew what i knew that university wasn't going to get me any further um and you know i've spoken to a few guys from that same course and of the of the i don't know how many people were in there maybe like 40 50 only a few of them have gone on to do anything like significant with yeah so it's weird actually when i think about some of the some of my friends or people that were in my class at school yeah and even university that on paper performed the best yeah no it's like mate it's like it's it's ridiculous like the whole you know when you when you do your gcscs and your a levels and you think it's like i don't know do you have o levels back in your day no i had i'm not that old i've taken i've just taken i did the gcsc and a level yeah i worked my ass off because i was like this the harder i work for this the more money i will make but it was it was more so university like because when i i wanted to go i don't know why i wanted to go to nottingham but i needed two a's and a b and i didn't get i didn't get the a in maths shit so i i got a level i i went i got a in geography yeah b maths b economics yeah so my second choice was newcastle yeah so then i went to newcastle but that ended up being great yeah in the end i just i just think like i remember like doing a level and doing gscs and like gcses and like the fuck i remember sitting my sats when you're in like year six and all i mean that i i think it's good to have kids exposed to some sort of pressure even if it is of an academic nature but i i think like my my brother got got um he got his a levels back got his gcc back and he did quite well you know he worked really hard and stuff like that but i was like i said to him i was like if you want a business and if you want to do your own thing no one's gonna no there's no client or person you hire or business partner that's going to ask you for your a-levels like we've i've hired like 50 60 70 people at this point i have not once asked for anyone's qualifications never asked for a cv no well you can ask for a cv and but but that's just a formality that's just to see if they've actually put some effort into a piece of paper you just sort of skim it and then just watch the loom that they've sent instead but it's like no i just i just think it's like and i think people are becoming quite aware of that yeah if i was going to go back i would do like an apprenticeship like you know in like a marketing apprenticeship or something and just sort of expedited that learning process but you know even i think now if i was to go back because i did enjoy university yeah i should have done sports science or something i mean at least i would have used that yeah like i definitely didn't use mine i guess it was well that ends well though yeah you know because i look back at it and think why did i do that but then it's like oh it turned out all right and you know so so you basically after that became not necessarily obsessed but you wanted to learn how to sell yeah yeah so that how did you teach i then yeah i kind of follow that advice where like I finished um I dropped out and then like I kind of went home with my tail between my legs to my parents and my dad was had a very much very much an I told you so face because he he he didn't really believe in that entrepreneurship course now I'll get my my parents are incredible for this and they never they never once rubbed in my face or tried to shame me or make me feel bad or anything they were very supportive and very sort of right we'll get you back on your feet and I felt like I'd failed because I was ultimately like shit I've just like I've shit the bed here like i'm just gonna be a failure because i can't even do university and then what i did is i got like i had three jobs so i got no four jobs i worked in clark's hq class customer care you know the shoe brand yeah yeah because their headquarters are in somerset where i grew up then i had two bar jobs and i also worked in a golf course like serving people i was working like a hundred hours a week just to like you were doing them all at the same time yeah just just to like because i wanted i was like i felt the need to like compensate for my failure and so i was like you know i was i just felt awful and i was like so i'd literally my routine would be like i'd either i'd have the the clark's hq like it still rings in my head like good afternoon clark's customer care charlie speaking how can i help you like that that i said that i must have about 10 000 times then i'd like i'd either in the evening i go to either of the pub jobs on the weekends i do the the golf course and go to the pub in the evening i did that for like six months and then i got really ill like i burned myself out like to the absolute extreme my mom then sat me down and was like right you've proven that you can actually at least be useful and you know carry some weight here you know doing all this stuff so that's when my mum sat me down and we made the decision that completely like changed my life where things really got good which is doing the apprenticeship that I did um in sales because I was ranting about this Lord Sugar guy oh I have to learn to sell and I was like I didn't know where to start and then I found this apprenticeship and that was like insane what about you did you so you did so you went to university you did three years there yeah I did economics and business management yeah but it was it was weird because the first year nothing counted to the overall degree so it was like so basically all you need to get is 40 percent like a pass so i was like what's even the point in trying best year of your life yeah so all i did was go out and this is when i actually started going to the gym religiously so i had i had free time and i actually met like i think it was two or three of my friends who were like really into it so they taught me everything or at least everything they knew yeah so it was class it It was just like I would go to the lectures and things that I needed to go to.

19:00And then I managed, actually, I didn't even pass the statistics exam. So I had to go back in the summer to pass it just so that I could get to the next year. What, for first year? First year, yeah. Jeez, man. But the problem with that was I just didn't learn the foundations which was required to then learn everything else after on top of that. so my but i think the second year everything was 25 of the degree and the third year was 75 and then it got to third year where i was like i don't know anything i said this to my brother as well because when he was doing his he's 18 um he won't mind me saying this when he was doing his a levels i was like look mate because he wants to have a business and i was like look the way that you sorry i need to drink some water i've got this out yeah like in university that similar to you i went there because i wanted to learn how to run a business and then very quickly i realized it was all theory yeah like the amount of maths and equations maybe we did this i was like why am i learning this again i thought i'd never have to do my yeah we did this accounting module for like two months and i haven't used any of that in my business once yeah but like anyway why do my throats like fuck um it's all the cigarettes in new york man i'll tell you for the record i don't smokes that's fine yeah so um yeah after that i i think i had just about got a degree yeah but it was nothing you got a two-two it was like it was really bad it's so bad you almost don't want to tell people to go into uni like i used to lie to people and say i got a two-two i remember my dad had a conversation with me he's like well what are you gonna do now because you can't get a job i there's no uh big company that would look at a third and be like oh yeah okay but it ended up being a blessing in disguise because i because i technically had a degree i was qualified to work as a manager at hollister which i didn't realize if you want to be a manager at hollister you need a degree i was like i have a two what a two three so it's worse to put that on your cv like i went to uni two three though so yeah i was a club promoter for a little bit then i was a manager at Holster for a year and a half.

21:12Yeah. And then I did loads of little side jobs that got me a bit of cash. How'd you get into it though? Like the business thing? The influencer thing? Well, it was personal training first. Oh. So my housemate became a personal trainer. It was like seven of us living in a terrace house in Newcastle. And he said he was becoming a personal trainer. So we did the qualifications. Then he was literally in a gym all day. I was like, that sounds fucking amazing. Yeah. So how do I do that? so i i gradually phased out of the job at hollister so i could still make money i used all my holiday days and at the same time i was doing my qualification so i did that and then immediately started coaching people and i think this was around about the time where instagram was getting some traction i asked you that at the beginning i was a yeah i would actually like to say i was an og fitness influencer on instagram and then so i grew pretty quick on instagram couple couple hundred thousand there but i never really capitalized on the online side of things yeah i was still doing a lot of one-to-one coaching like back then no one really knew that you could no followers were just like oh he's just famous but it wasn't like it was there was no way to convert anyone into it was i think the thing that took off first was ebooks yeah and then after ebooks there was online coaching and everything i have a question so when you um Where did you grow up?

22:32Leeds. Leeds. So when you go back to your hometown, like obviously everyone must know what you do and like who you are on the YouTube. Like how do you find navigating that? Where like you go back and it's like, oh, it's Big Mike, like he's back. Is it like a Liberty re-entrance or are you just like, because it's weird, isn't it? And if you go back and you think like everyone knows what you're doing and who you are and no one already says anything, but they know that you're aware that they know. Yeah, because the good thing is, I don't have to update people with what I'm doing because everyone's just watching yeah yeah but there was a part of me and I think even they thought that or maybe he's changed and he thinks he's too good for everyone now so I didn't know if they had this element of thinking that but then the times when we do have this sort of reunion like every year we would do the Headley Mile which is like the Otley Run which is a bar crawl where we all get together and just get pissed yeah so i would meet up with them and then if anything they were all they were really happy for me yeah and they'd be the odd jokes that were being thrown around but that's just like british humor like everyone just grills everyone um but it was largely pretty well received yeah i think because i would come back and i was literally behaving exactly how i was behaving when i was 18 yeah like i think a lot of people like when when people see people you used to know see you online or anyone online is if they see anything like remotely like a car like the amount of people that my mom's friends who have been like is charlie selling a scam because it's understandable because it's like that's like when you see someone a young guy on social media making loads of money talking about making loads of money and then having like a course of it just it it just in their brain it's just scam scam yeah i had this with the to the zubai video i made oh yeah i'm sure you want to talk about we most viewed video yeah it's crazy man it's actually it's wild but that got in the daily mail and so like that gave me this insight into the sort of boomer demographic because my mum and my dad um they're there in like 50s 60s and they had so many people of their friends messaged me like is this charlie is this charlie because they'd read the daily mail and they'd seen like the manchester evening news and they'd seen his reports and i was like oh that's how you reach those people because like you know they're they're in there did they was the article sound or yeah it was the article was actually fine i read through because i was worried because i was like obviously they didn't ask because they might you know over exaggerate everything no they just they kind of just quoted it pretty much word for word and you know it's it was i found it really interesting that video went as viral as it did because it didn't it felt so it felt very niche and very specific you know it felt specific because i thought only people who had lived in dubai would watch it and then it got like a million views and i was like oh shit like because you you did what everyone wasn't doing everyone was talking about like i did one yeah and that was generally very positive yeah yeah and that one i think that's got like over two million views yeah and the amount of people that would come up to me and be like oh i'm here because of you yeah so i watched that video i was like oh okay well i've i've had i've had mixed people um mixed opinions from people on on the video like people come up to me and be like yeah like i agree with everything and like i'm silently agreeing with you or a lot of people will be like oh i don't agree with it and i think it's like it was very polarizing and like when you would read the comments people were either like very much like love it or hate it and i think that's why the video did so well is because it was a polarizing topic it was it entered the realm of like political correctness and stuff and you know i'd seen other people make videos on dubai and stuff like yours um but i didn't expect to do that well i was just like i'll just give my honest opinion on it and yeah you know i think that the uae is an amazing place and dubai is an amazing city um but it just wasn't the right thing for me and i think a lot of people took it the wrong way and i didn't want it to come across as like it wasn't it wasn't like a video that i made because i was like angry or upset it was just like hey guys i just i tried it and it wasn't for me but it probably is for you or might be if you should check it out but you know it's a it's just it's weird because there's a lot of people who go there because other people go there and i might stop being sheep it's like austin just you should have some own independent thought and actually go somewhere that you feel like you'd be interested in going to don't just go somewhere because everyone else is going then you're like oh well i have to go as well that that was kind of what one thing that i struggle with in dubai specifically and only in our sort of sphere the internet money sphere not like the real estate sphere or the you know light attendance sphere or whatever because you've got different pockets of sort of social cliques if that makes sense yeah but for us it was just for me it was everyone just copying imangaji yeah like and you know you we will it's just like i i was just like this is like a a social echo chamber everyone's like saying the same things they believe the same things everyone's got the same life posting the same they post the same stuff they do the same vlogs they eat the same food they smoke the same cigars and it's just like and like i respect him for that because he let he kind of led the charge on on pioneer yeah and it's like you know but then everyone just like suddenly just flocked there yeah and it's like you know where's the where's the critical thinking where's like the you know is like this is kind of what my business partner and i did after because i did the same thing like i i started going shopping at czar and like buying like linen trowel i've never done this in my life i was like yeah i was like i bought my i bought some bloody those those um those travis lows which you got on as well they look very nice by the way and so i bought these expensive trainers and then i was like buying these watches and i was looking at supercars and then i was living on the pump and i was like and after like a year of that i stopped i was like what am i actually doing because it's like i'm not living like a sovereign life here like i'm not i'm not it almost felt like i wasn't really there or making these purchasing decisions or lifestyle decisions on my own accord it kind of felt like i just been sucked into this like social vacuum that was just encouraging these behaviors and just sort of was this self-fulfilling prophecy and then you've got of course the dinners and the yacht parties and all of these things and it and it kind of hit me i was like this isn't like the only way to describe Dubai is the city's amazing the country's amazing the locals are amazing it's very safe it's incredible but for me personally I felt like I got lost in that that whirlwind of like yeah the source basically exactly that like I think that's one thing that you can't be prepared for is navigating your way through all of that like you can have a very different experience of the place depending upon who you spend the time with yeah where you're going and like what activities you get involved in like because i've about six years now i feel like i've almost done it all yeah 100 and there was definitely fear periods where i was getting a little bit carried away even getting just too distracted because nobody really prepares you for when you when you do become successful and you have money yeah and then it's like oh you've got status you got you know you have disposable income and then you're like oh shit like this dubai is built to entertain you and the thing is man is there's no playbook for it yeah like if you're a dude and you're 21 23 25 whatever whatever 26 and you certainly find yourself with millions of dollars or hundreds of thousands of dollars in income tax-free and you go to this city with all the shiny objects and it's like there's there's no there's no sort of like playbook or course or information because it's such a rare situation situation to be in but no one prepares you for it like you said and like if you're not careful you just get sucked into this sort of this this this lifestyle of just that's just how you live and then before you know it you kind of lose yourself in that and it becomes very dangerous but yeah for me it was okay because i didn't start making good money until i was in my late 20s so i'd i was much more mature and i think when i'm looking at these kids who like in their early 20s i'm not even surprised because if i had that money when i was 20 years old 21 i would be an asshole yeah you would i would need to be surrounded by good quality people who would steer me away from all of that temptation it's completely understandable though because like you know if you give if you take any 20 year old guy off the street no matter who he is or where he's from you know you take just a normal 20 year old guy and you say hello mate here's a million dollars a year to spend or even even his 200 grand a year to spend um you don't have to pay any tax you know it's it's like the problem is and the thing that i've observed with with entrepreneurs in dubai specifically is their business then and their business and their work becomes about sustaining a life style as opposed to actually building something and so what happens is they all fall apart and die and end up being blown to smithereens from a business perspective because to get to that point where you're liquid enough to live that lifestyle you have to work obscenely hard but then you start enjoying all these rewards which then takes away from the work which then after a while destroys the business and i noticed that should be reinvested yeah it's like if you took it's like my my objective because everyone makes the argument of tax and you know everyone's over there for tax and that was why we moved because we were paying and we still are paying now we come back a million pounds a year incorporation tax 25 corp tax but it's not nice but it's like it's like my friend said to me jayden which kind of blew my entire paradigm apart he was like because i always talk about wanting to be a billionaire and having all this confidence in building a company that can do that and he was like charlie if you're so confident you're going to be an actual billionaire then why are you worried about a million or two in tax and i was like actually yeah because what it is is it's just like for me at least moving there was was as was unconsciously like a statement in my lack of confidence that this thing might last specifically for the tax now it depends a lot of people move for tons of other reasons because there's loads of other reasons to move there but i i feel like tax having that that sort of um barrier to taking out personally it makes you a better entrepreneur because you can't take it out you have to reinvest it you have to like sort of put it back in put it back in and create that flywheel was there anything that you purchased that was expensive that you look back and think oh that was actually like worth it nearly no no no nothing no honestly man no like i've realized there's not much more that i need to be happy than like good food clean water shelter a desk and something really big to work on and my friends and my family like be like you know the whole maslow's hierarchy of needs like i've climbed to the top of the pyramid and i've sort of looked over to see like what's around and there's there's not much up there like you know i i had the i had the house and i was like i started buying these watches which i sold pretty quickly after um well i didn't actually buy them they like they like gave me them to like try and they're like you can come back and and i drove the lamborghinis and stuff and it don't get me wrong it feels fucking amazing like it's the most like it's the best thing ever to have all that stuff but then i was like i had this sort of like little little pit of like emptiness just sort of like sat there just like you know like what are we actually doing there's only so many cars you can buy or so many things you can do or so many dinners you can go on or so many trips you can go on or business class and first class when it gets so good before and then i then i kind of realized like i just gotta i gotta leave and sort of reset that dope and it took it took a while to do that i do wonder when you when you talk about this when other people talk about this how these things don't really provide you with you know real satisfaction and meaning i wonder how many people are like okay fair enough i'm not going to do that i feel like it's one of those things where people have to learn but they need to experience it yeah it's like even if you know a young guy looking at an older guy who gets his sleep with loads of women yeah as much as he wants he has all this variety that sounds like a dream for a younger guy yeah like of course i would want that then you realize but then gateway to misery yeah when when somebody actually experiences that they're like oh this actually really is not as good as i thought it would be but they're they're only gonna find that out if they yeah it makes you wonder how deterministic that urge is because the argument is like is like with the with the woman thing as well it's like getting it out of your system but i don't know if that's just like a a cope for being lustful or something um because you know when you when you get to the point where you're like super successful and have the money like dating options become much broader and like you said like other guys look at that and think that must be amazing but then it's almost a curse because you've got you've got this just then you suddenly start becoming aware that you can pick and choose what you want in a partner which then means you sort of create this list of what you think perfection looks like and then no one's ever good enough right and then you're always stressed out if you make a decision you always think of the opportunity cost of what you potentially missed out on like oh maybe i was this one and this one's well yeah well that that happened to me until i found until i met my girlfriend and that was like and that again it was funny here yeah it happened the second i got back to london like within like two months i was like oh done because i tried to do it in dubai and i tried the dating thing in dubai and it was it was don't be wrong you can you can have fun and it there's it's it's this it's a crazy experience but it's like it's not you know there's some there's some good people in dubai and there's lots of sweet girls in dubai but it's so transient as well everyone's planning on leaving and the intentions are weird people there for half a year yeah that was that was another thing that i i struggled with is like it there was no consistency of of like you i feel like i couldn't like put my roots down does that make sense yeah like it's like i'm not gonna i'm not gonna get married here i'm not gonna have kids here i'm it's like there are lots of people want to do that and i would encourage it because it is a safe place and it is a beautiful place and there's 101 reasons to live there but yeah it's just like it's not for me yeah so so the goal now is you're you've been there done that yeah now you just focused on your build just build build build because i've like you know we it's a really it's a really interesting phenomenon because when you like when you when you find yourself in a position like where we we've got enough sort of investment interest etc etc where like the the passive income that comes from our investments now is in the cash reserves we've got and stuff is enough to sort of sustain my lifestyle the level it's at right now which i'm perfectly happy with and that's a weird place to be for a guy in your 20s because it's like 12 now 27 so it's weird to be there because then you're sort of like what do i do now like because you can decide not to work anymore but that means absolving yourself of any commercial responsibility which is a just complete like gateway to misery because you're just what you're going to do it's like you're going to you're going to go and like travel the world but there's only so many beaches you can sit on before they all start seeming like the same you know there's only so many temples you can look at before you get sick of it and so i i've never done the travel thing really um but yeah that's that's kind of where i'm at and it just doesn't seem like there's much else so what about you because you're what are you working right now what's what's your big uh my problem is that as i i think this is probably like a a couple years into living in buy i was getting distracted trying to do loads of different things and i'm the type of person that gets bored quite easy like i have a like oh i want to try this and then i do it and i'm like cool um that's boring now i want to do like this thing so i'm trying to think back oh this was like probably realization earlier this year and i was like well okay what am i still like really good at what do i enjoy it's always gonna be the fitness thing like doing anything related to fitness is just your thing i enjoy it and i'm gonna care about it for the rest of my life probably yes it's going to pivot away from being jacked to you know yeah the just how to continue to look good and feel good for as long as possible so the one of the best monthly recurring revenue models for me has been the app okay and yeah you've been doing that for a long time i've not even scratched the surface of how well that can do because it's i've relied mostly on just organic reach because i have a big following it's been fine and then i speak to people and they're like oh you're running ads i'm like no why are you not running out yeah so all these things i am now but this was back then i had none of these strategies in place that could make me so much more money retarget your youtube audience yeah at least so i was i was i was fine because i was making you know from going like 10k to 100k a month yeah yeah i'm i was pretty content with just make like 100k a month yeah yeah that becomes miserable very quickly yeah like yeah and then i was thinking fuck about that because people could be like what this this could be doing like way more but not because i want to buy more things just because i want to build something really cool like it's kind of like a i talked to a psychiatrist about this um because i was doing some research for mindset module i was making for the free program and she was talking about how like certain certain men have like a masculine urge for this archetypal expansion and you just you need to feel this need for growth and she said it manifests in things like bodybuilding and it manifests in things like business where like you'll get to a point where even though you are more successful and more wealthy than basically 99 % of people it still never feels like enough and I was like I was trying to figure out like why why is it never enough why can't we just be comfortable and happy she's like well because like we're kind of she got a bit hippie with it like some of the universe and how the universe expands and we're part of the universe but it's like i get it because it's like you just you just want to see that number just keep growing yeah and almost attach your self-worth to it which can be a pathway for misery but i didn't doesn't that doesn't really bother me yeah do you ever find that where you're like you you feel like you're chasing something you know just like sometimes you're unhappy you're not there but you're still happy that you're trying you know what i mean yeah i think i understand myself a lot more than i used to and i think i'm i'm quite good at self reflecting where i've never let it take over me and i become too obsessed with the numbers same with social media i could very easily imagine that's a trap i could very easily sell out and sell my soul and just create garbage content just to keep the followers coming in the engagement high but i refuse to follow trends and i post the things which i want to post yeah so even though i put a piece of content out and it doesn't perform as well as i would like i'm like okay whatever i don't care even when you see like an 8 out of 10 i like on like the yeah it stings a little bit even some like the i used to read my comments all the time and now i just don't read the comments um so i think i've always had a a very good work-life balance like i don't let it over consume me like the moment i feel like it's overtaking me i'm just like no and then i go off and then i just i will literally walk away from everything yeah and just live life for a little bit and then after doing that i'm like uh okay i'm bored of that i need i want to do work now yeah that must be that must be interesting because i have the opposite of that where like i'm just all i want to do is work yeah it's it's to the point where like it's like i don't really do anything but work yeah then like i'll talk about that online or you made a video about how to become just obsessed yeah and it's like and a lot of people that's a lot of people don't receive that message well because it's not it's not a very you've got to have a yeah if you're dealing with your bad emotions or you've had a breakup yeah or if you got cravings yeah it's kind of like the it's the same sort of token is like you know that that typical sort of myth of a guy going through a breakup and then getting jacked yeah it's like you take that pain and you put it in the gym yeah you can either do that or you can go and sit and be miserable and eat loads of shit food and watch like netflix for like three months or something but i i think it's like i don't have that sort of off switch and like i've it is it comes with its problems because the only way i can really switch off is if i like kind of like sedate myself so if i go on holiday i'll have to like drink loads of beers and eat loads of junk food just to feel that sense of like oh i'm actually relaxed now and like a lot of people comment on things like that and so that's not healthy and that's not good but i'm like but it doesn't i don't you get to a point where you just don't really care with it that much but do you think that's always been in you or it's been the self-taught thing i think that it's um because it sounds like when you were juggling all those jobs yeah i think it's very much like yeah from from from not not necessarily it was weird it was kind of like something sort of lit up in me when i was like 18 because i was never that like conscientious when i was like in my teenage years because typically you see that sort of high agency behavior in in the late 20s but you also see that with people that like smash their a-levels and they go to oxford or cambridge and they do really worked well in their career or something but i i sort of turned it on when i was like 18 but i think the reason is different now so when i was like 18 to 20 it was like i was working so hard because i felt like i was out of pain i was like angry i was like you know i was like i'm poor i'm broke it was it was very much a fear-based thing then it became greed from like 21 to like 24 25 and then i've kind of gone from working out of fear to then working out of greed to now kind of working out of love and i know that sounds like it sounds like you want to like fucking roll your eyes and be like oh shut the fuck up there's no way that's true but it's like the only way to describe my relationship with with work now is i just genuinely love it and i like all i want to do is just it's like it's like if you it's like having like a really good friend and like hanging out with them you feel amazing all the time and they're just a really good person it's like that's how i feel about the work at the moment is it the work itself or the fact that you've been productive i think it's i think it's i think it's the idea of the work itself and i think it's like being productive feels amazing but it's it's building something what it is i think is being able to exercise autonomy i because it's like i'm at the point with the business now where like we're in a good place and i get to sort of envision like it's really hard to to conjure up like a love for work at the beginning or the early stage because you're doing it because you have to you know and once you get to that sort of like seven figure multi seven figure level when you're you're good and you know like kind of like you explain you just walk away instead of like I had that where I felt I had this sort of like empty feeling for like a year I was like what do I do now I was like you know I've got this this life I've got this money what do I do and like I I just then I was like oh I can actually just think up anything I want and just spend every day of my life just doing exactly what I want to do which is for me it's just building a really sick company that makes client acquisition easy which is what I love doing is what i'm passionate about so it's it's kind of to me like work now is like i can imagine it's the same thing as like you know you know fred again and you know when you watch his boiler room sets or you see his dj sets and he's like he's loving it that that's how i feel when i'm at my keyboard just like you know just just like that and that's that's like me when i'm in the gym yeah because you can tell when i i don't know i go into my little zone i listen to my music and i love it and i realized that one thing that pisses me off more than anything is when there's work that needs to be done that prevents me from going to the gym yeah anything that prevents me from going to the gym annoys me so much yeah so i want to still continue to i want to work but i don't want that to where do you think that comes from the like the absolute love and obsession god i don't know because it's like i'd love to know because obviously like i've never met someone that's as like well it shows people out there like banoose and stuff but like you every time i see you're talking about the gym you love it like it's like you love it so like does that was that when you're a teenager you're like the fastest kid in school or something or like i think there's probably a load of different reasons why because i i try to i cannot understand the people who want to get in shape but they don't have that uh drive or that ability to remain consistent because ultimately if you want to build decent muscle you have to be extremely consistent at doing the basics over a long period of time but loads of people struggle to do that and for me it doesn't it just does not feel like hard work do you think it's because you love the journey not the outcome yeah i don't i don't and i never cared about the outcome when i was getting started yeah it was like i just remember going enjoying the experience of doing it and then i I would look in the mirror and I had a bit of a pump and I was like whoa like I like I enjoyed seeing my body change but it was more so just the little hour hour and a half escape yeah that I would get and then this is one thing that probably a lot of people don't understand you know when you when you get really good at something yeah it becomes more enjoyable to do 100 so when I got good obviously executing the exercises and doing it the way I was supposed to do it and then on top of that you see the results like you're in the gym and you probably one of the you have one of the best physiques ever fucking sick feeling yeah yeah and then i realize oh that's i'm trying to think back to the early days when you're first walking into the gym you don't know how to freaking move this weight properly and put like the tension on the muscle you're trying to target do you remember your first workout yeah it was in the school gym when i was i think i was it was 16 or 17 okay so it was this time it's probably the size of this yeah a little bit bigger had machines everywhere smith machine in the corners um i had no idea what i was doing but nobody else was there because nobody cared about the gym okay so i hooked up my it was the old school ipod actually i think it was even plugged in to the speaker system and uh i was like getting like an orcs yeah playing my music and then just going around trying all these different machines i just loved it and not nobody did it with me in fact i was doing it and my schoolmates was thinking about what was the like pull because obviously like like you said nobody cared it was eccentric idiosyncratic nobody's going to the gym so what was it that made you walk past it and think like oh i'll give that a go i think because i wanted to it was definitely i wanted to look different yeah okay i don't know if i had something to do with i've told this story before i got mugged on a bus you got mugged mugged yeah i was on the way to the city center and these two kids who older than me bigger than me they basically mugged me for my for money and i didn't put up a fight couldn't put up a fight yeah i was like wow i don't i feel so helpless yeah yeah yeah the if that's going to happen again in the future i want to at least look intimidating enough where people might think twice or if i'm going to fight at least i can yeah throw my weight around so i don't know if that had something to do with it i don't know if it's because i wasn't very good with girls and i thought that that would help me be better with girls yeah obviously isn't the case but i think it was a combination of different things and then that just enjoying it what's your favorite exercise it's got to be chest press surely it's probably one of the easier ones yeah yeah no one of the problems i have at the gym is like my central nervous system gets like fried really quickly so i don't like i i have this issue again this at the beginning this sort of all or nothing thing of like training to failure yeah and then like i'd do that and then i'd have to take like a week off and it was just hard yeah so you just you would need to follow just a low volume approach yeah you'd probably do two working sets per exercise and then you just do five or six exercises yeah as long as you just focus on you don't have to go to failure but just lift as heavy as you can do six to eight reps okay you'll be surprised it'll feel like you haven't done enough but you're not supposed to walk out the gym feeling completely that's the thing is like i'd get i'd fall into this trap of being like because i'll go through these phases where like i'll train like a fucking animal for like two months which most people do and then i'll get like they restrict themselves yeah then i'll get like fucking big and then and then i'm like oh actually i have i have i start if i continue to train i get like a fever i get sick or something yeah that's overtraining basically yeah so i just go through that cycle but that that's such a like typical me trait of just overdoing it which is stupid but it's it's like you have this i don't know if it's an obsession but you have this love for work i just love going to the gym yeah usually people have this thing which they really like to do yeah but i think a lot of people they either don't realize they like doing it or they don't understand that hey you know if you wanted to you could probably monetize this yeah there's a way i feel like there's a way to monetize any kind of passion especially with platforms like wop and school these days yeah like it's i think if you if you're by virtue if you're i think the thing is though is a lot of people don't do something for long enough to get really good at it because like you can enjoy too many things yeah well that's the problem man is because i like you know you've got kids my brother's age who are like really good at video games but then it's like can you monetize that should you monetize that what like the video did we have do you have the video game thing yes i was horribly addicted yeah me too but that's like an interesting thing like if i feel like if you if you get rid of the video game thing that energy that addiction has to go somewhere yeah so if you cut the video games like you're left with this like massive ball of like addictive energy that you have to play somewhere so for me that was work because i was what games did you play i loved this was more so on the pc so theme hospital roller coaster tycoon age of empires sims i like it was very much like building i like building things i always found sims to be really weird because it's like you're building you're spending your time building this other character's life and like you're you're doing all that you're doing all the right things just on a screen but then your own life is like it's like it's like you're sending them to the gym and you're getting them a job and you're you're having them raise children and pay their mortgages and look out for their pets but then like you're just you don't i never even played the game properly i used to cheat and have unlimited money so i would just i would build them the the most enjoyable and satisfying part was building the house for them yeah and once i built the house i was like okay this is boring yeah as soon as you've done it i had that with like minecraft yeah like as soon as you build like i'd have this this weird relationship with minecraft or like i would play it for like two weeks obsessively build this insane house and then like the second it was built i was like oh like what do i do now and i was like wait what does that tell me about myself like do i want to build a house or something or something i wouldn't even care about like slaying the dragon it was just going on this like build shelter i remember this is a long time ago somebody asked me like oh um i really enjoy playing games you think i can monetize that and i was like games are an absolute waste of time and i thought well actually if you get yourself really really good at playing games there's you can make a lot of money off that you can build an audience good though and then everything off the back of that i feel like you've got to be like everyone's trying to do that yeah and it's like i don't know i feel like quitting and then teaching people how to quit is probably the easiest way to monetize it yeah it's like hey are you a professional guy in your 30s addicted video games and you want to stop the habit because your girlfriend hates you and everyone doesn't like you you should probably quit yeah but i don't know man like i used to play runescape a lot that was like a runescape league of legends but i it's weird because like someone said to me once like once you're once you're a gamer you're always a gamer and i'll still from time to time get caught watching like youtube videos of like video games and stuff and it's like i haven't the games that i haven't even thought about or played or touched for like 10 plus years they'll just find their way into my into my youtube feed and stuff like that but but there's one guy who who i know he was a really good gamer and i didn't realize that there's a huge uh market in this this e-sports gaming thing big so he got really good at gaming then he decided to build his own organization his own team and then he made like i think over hundreds of millions of this organization which he built within esports there's just so much attention there man yeah all right guys quick pause here i've got a question for you are you in shape are you not in shape is there work to do most likely if so i have the tool for you which is going to help you out massively it's the thirst app this is something which I personally use myself when it comes to my training and my nutrition.

54:42I have all the programs in there which I use on a regular basis and for those who are just looking to lose a bit of body fat. The same thing goes for women as well. A lot of people don't realize that I used to coach for a large chunk of my life so all of my coaching experience has been put inside of this app. I want you to learn as much as possible about how to get yourself in shape. There's exclusive videos in there telling you how to do it, how to execute exercises properly, the foods which I eat and a newly added nutrition section where you can track your meals and your daily macros. It is pretty much this pocket-sized version of myself, which I'm going to carry around with you all day, every day.

55:20So if there's something which might interest you, which it definitely will do, I highly suggest you check out the link in the description, head over to the Thirst app, get it downloaded. You will not regret it. Let's crack on with the episode. What do you think of the short-form stuff these days? I hate it. yeah it's slop yeah my problem is i used to love instagram back in the day because i'm an old fogey i liked it when it was just pictures yeah and it was just a love for sharing pictures and you actually see what your friends were posting now the feed is just it's just everything i know you can choose to see things which are posted by friends but a lot of time you just you just get given everything and like i'm not even mad sometimes because some of the stuff is hilarious and i'm like oh i'm actually quite glad i saw this instagram rose could be hilarious but my problem is because of what i do as i mentioned before i'm now trying to run four youtube channels yeah so that's four channels with long form content and then now to be competitive on instagram we need to be pumping out the short form content which you can technically clip from the long form but sometimes it just doesn't hit and i'm like to try and be the best on every single platform is real and then you you are literally a slave to creating content and I realized that i kind of got to that point where all i was doing was just creating content but i was not building any real business behind the scenes it was just like look i would literally just go on trips because i thought i need some just for contact i was like oh the youtube channel is a bit dead like i've been in dubai for too long let me go take a trip and do something interesting yeah which it's it's fun and like a lot of the things i've done that have been really interesting in my life i've done because of the youtube channel i need to go and do something interesting so in a way it's good but to go off and do to create an entertaining travel vlog requires you to it's a full week of doing shit and then it's actually you can get some decent views and things like that but it's financially doesn't really make much sense for the the life aspects and experiences it's great but for building a business and making money it's really not that great i feel like you could just like whack out a whiteboard and talk about quitting porn and just get the same amount of views yeah but i guess which is now i think as well which i found quite interesting was when you know when iman really starts to take off his his videos and other people in the fitness industry like jeff nippard the quality of his videos was so good i was just like oh like fuck do i have to yeah i have to put all this effort into the edits and the transitions and the going balls deep into research papers like i don't care about this i just want to go back to when i was making videos where i just sit down and talk simple edits and there was a period of time where fancy edits were the thing yeah and that's what everyone wanted to see and i felt like i couldn't compete i feel like they're not really that's not really but it's gone back now yeah thankfully i think that we're like gonna see a big like this is the kind of like a theory that i have for content for like longer form content this year is i think that humor is going to sort of come back into like a into the thing because you know when we had like vine and like like you had like what dare i say like some of logan paul's vlogs back in the day like that sort of era that david dobrik yeah five year it was funny yeah like yeah i sourced them you know but it was like it was it was it was less about it being entertaining and it was more about it being funny the david dobrik one's interesting because i realized that like i was thinking a lot like why is it the case that twitch streamers and other streamers have become so popular and i realize it's the same thing it's like what david dobrik's vlogs allow you to do is have is to be part of the popular group just five minutes because it's it's it's first person pov and it's like it's like you're there and so you get immersed in this sort of experience that basically no one ever experienced as a kid which is like well for me at least especially being part of that popular group and it's the same thing with streamers and twitch streamers it's like you have this parasocial that it feels very real but it's not because they don't know you but you have this relationship close friendship that you feel with the popular guy with the guy that has the high status and so like it's it's really like the the i think the long form content game is going to become a lot more about like humor and a lot more feeling like you're with the popular guy and you see this with hormosie starting to do his live streams a lot and hormosie's taking this big bet on content being about live especially because ai can't replicate it and stuff but that's kind of where my bet is on it being and i've i've also found that the more and more and more that i lean into my actual personality on videos like the better the videos yeah yeah like when i'm saying like sort of slightly out of pocket shit yeah it works so much better well that's how people know that you're being your true authentic self yeah because i think i've i've been quite good at being myself but even then when i'm reviewing the video i'm like i can't put that yeah i will i could probably get cancelled if my videographer like i feel like slipped in 20 quid but i i feel like cancel culture's gone yeah it was it was i think 2020 was the worst yeah round about that period when everything was like peak woke it was like you you couldn't crack a joke without someone being offended i think that now that as soon as elon musk bought twitter cancel culture's gone like it's like you know that there's this really interesting statistic um but i haven't actually seen so this whether this is actually true or not it was on the um joe rogan elon musk podcast where joe rogan was talking about this this set of statistics that the amount of kids that identified as as trans was like at an all-time high and the second elon musk bought twitter um it goes it dips down because suddenly like people can actually have rational conversations and you know talk objectively about all these things and express themselves without fear of being banned or cancelled and i i feel like now like it's it's like we've gone completely backwards to the point where you can say retard yeah and no one like and it's still like people some people are like oh you shouldn't say that online but then but they're not as triggered or offended as they used to be and that that sort of culture is back and i think that comedians have kind of led that charge a lot as well yeah but i i think that's awesome because you can actually like be yourself and have conversations without that big fear of like because i mean god you see like logan paul's crushing it he got cancelled pewdiepie's still doing fine he got cancelled mr beast got cancelled for that honey scam he's doing just fine yeah you know andrew tates was doing just fine now so i think what's happened is enough people have been cancelled and been fine for everyone to sort of realize like oh it's not actually that big of a deal and what does it even mean to be cancelled yeah it's like just half the internet just decides that you're not relevant for about three months and that's it i think people i don't think they care as much about something being so picture perfect and well presented like they don't mind if it's you know you make a few mistakes or you know you can't get your words out the way you want it yeah to it's just more relatable i think people want to relate to to people more have you seen the nick fuentes guy yeah yeah because he's like he's like the perfect example oh he's definitely not perfect example of being a man but like he's that's an example of like he's he's the most like honest like true to himself person i think this is also why people like donald trump a lot as well and theo von yeah and theo von because it's like you know these are guys that tend to just sort of say how it is and whether or not you believe trump does that is is up is up to the people watching i suppose but um but that nick guy had an interview with piers morgan and he says some heinous stuff like yeah outright i racist got clipped up i was like is this ai yeah yeah it's real and he says some shit that's so like diabolical that you you think it's a joke you're just like and it's like it's it's one thing to sort of skirt the line with those things as jokes but then when you're actually serious it's like oh you're actually serious but like i was watching this thing and like piers morgan was was trying to sort of catch him out trying to say like okay so like you've openly said you're a racist is that true and the guy's like yeah and and and pierce like his his boomer brain just can't comprehend that this guy is just like being dead transparent and obviously like that's awful you shouldn't be fucking racist but it's like we're getting to this point now which is so interesting to watch from an internet culture perspective where people are just like telling the truth like you saw this with andrew tate as well with like the way he would articulate his opinions whether you agree with them or not like he was speaking what he thought to be true irrespective and unconcerned of what other people thought yeah and you know you've got to respect that because especially when he started doing it there was i don't really recall many people truly speaking how they thought well they they just they would have been you know cut off or silence but or they just didn't dare speak out what happened because obviously you did the tristan take podcast i remember we spoke about this very briefly when we a couple of whiskeys in in dubai person but you said that like a lot of people gave you not like backlash but like some people were like oh you sure you want to like have tristan tate on he's very controversial was that like a yeah well i think tristan was fine but then it got a bit sketchy literally about a month after something that was because they got arrested yeah and there were these wild accusations about the human trafficking thing yeah and everyone went back to that post and to the youtube videos it was worse on instagram for some reason yeah people are like i can't believe you're associating yourself with a human trafficker blah blah and i'm not gonna be a little bitch and like delete the post i'm just like first of all i don't believe it's true and second of all like no i'm just i'm gonna leave it up yeah so there wasn't really especially the first video i did nobody knew who he was when i did the first video so nobody could give me any backlash anyway but i went and did a second video with andrew and generally speaking it was very well received on youtube but i made a reel on instagram oh mate you'd be torn apart and i think i put that reel up i lost probably about 3 000 followers and then there was this the amount of people who were really really deeply offended uh leaving comments i had people putting stories up saying i can't believe someone like mike thurston would associate with a person like this or promote somebody like this and i was like whoa i think it's because like the short form platforms are so polarizing yeah because like on youtube you're only going to get recommended stuff on youtube that you actually want to watch yeah because to to like engage in a youtube video you have to make a decision to click on it which means that youtube's algorithm is biased towards showing you things you want to see whereas like the other short form platforms you don't really have much of a decision it's like it serves you anything you don't you literally don't decide what is next like a slot machine so i feel like you know when you look at some people's like instagram algorithms it's like it's no surprise that on youtube it does fine because the people that receive that are going and want to see andrew take content but on instagram it's like people are so angry as well man and it's like i've always found that interesting the the sort of getting offended thing it's like why yeah i i try to recall any time where i've watched something and it really offend me i think i watched the you know the diddy documentary the 50 cent did i haven't seen that but it's so good but then i was watching it i was like i really did not like diddy yes i was like wow what an actual dickhead yeah like that actually triggered a bit of yeah uh emotional response but in general for you to go and comment no no no i like i've never that's why with the whole commenting thing when i think about the people that go to the effort of leaving a comment and it's negative i'm like what does that say about them yeah because i've never the only time i've left a comment when i do it's i it's either i'm trying to be funny yeah or it's something positive yeah yeah like i just if i don't like something i'm like well the psychology the psychology of negative comments is is really fascinating because it's like it is it is just kind of like i think i think a lot of people on social media get offended and and and it's almost it's like a virtue signal so they're like putting it on your story like like you've seen this with before with like um before with like any sort of trend whether you agree or not with like you know the shit that people put on their stories like this this trend is trending or this march was and it's like a way of community it's a way of signaling to your followers like i'm a good person because i don't like this thing does that make sense i think that there's like i think it also i mean you could argue that that's also due to sort of the fall of religion and stuff and not having anything to believe in but well i see some people who they literally just don't really have an identity yeah i want to have an identity so they're like let me attach myself to this cause and promote this cause yes because now i feel useful and that's that's why if you then attack that cause they feel attacked yeah because they they've merged themselves with the with the cause or with the group and it's also like i feel like people like that their identity isn't is not individual it's not individual it's like it's like if you attack them you attack the group it's kind of like if you ever like you know that that whole i don't know if it's true or not biologically but you know the idea of you kill a wasp all other wasps in the area will kind of like find you and hunt you down it's like it's like it's like that but with and that that's true for both sides of the coin like the left or the right like if you that it's not i feel everyone's off center these days and everyone's so like polarized but like when you i i know it sounds hilarious and cringy to say but when you actually escape the matrix when you actually become like sovereign and free and suddenly like you've got enough resources to live where you want hang out of who you want you don't have to put up with the co-workers or the boss and you get to pick who you're with and what when you're free you you become a lot less polarized to these things because you have something to believe in which is yourself because you've actually done something and you can trust yourself yeah i don't know man people get so upset and it must cost so much energy to get that offended yeah you know and i know people will watch this and get offended about me saying it takes a lot of energy to get offended it's like crap it's like multiple offense matters yeah i think one of the great things which you will probably experience which i've experienced when you get in your 30s yeah with each year you just don't give a fuck and it's like so nice and freeing yeah things not to bother you anymore yeah but you start to realize more and more how valuable your time is yeah so i think one thing that definitely does annoy me is wasting my time or somebody wasting my time or doing something for you like people would ask me does anything make me mad i'm like it's like it makes me mad and there's there's a few times where i'd sit down and I would film a video and I would like, I would just fucking kill this video.

1:10:11I'd crush it speaking for like half an hour. Oh, you forgot to hit record or something? No, like the microphone wasn't on. And I'd be like, I had that. I would just like scream. I've had that before with, when I was making the academy, I've got this, there's this thing in like week two. It's the sort of portion, like where we talk about like discipline, mindset, how to do the work, how to be consistent. And there's a video in there that's three hours long. um so they're all like pretty long and there was this video and i i did it for three hours and i've and and you do not want to reshoot that fucking video like you because it's like i've already said this and so then you've got the you're pissed off because you've got to re-record it but then you've got to say the same thing again it's just like i i've been there man and i think everyone who makes content has at some point had that experience yeah like if loom crashes or something like recording a loom for like a team member or like a prospect and it corrupts yeah your eye just starts twitching you're just like you know i've had a few times with it's luckily not very often but cameramen have been filming this moment which cannot be repeated yes like a vlog yes but they were filming in slow motion you try to speed it up like i don't watch it back and then you just see the look on their faces where they'll be like what's the um of all the vlogs you've done and like all the sort of experiences you've had for youtube specifically what's been like the the highlight experience where you were like that was fucking awesome like the best experience i thought that's a good question it's cool on camera um don't say fucking chest day and no no no i think it's definitely some trips which i've done one trip which always stood out to me was to japan yeah i saw that like when i was in osaka watching sumo wrestling i was like this is fucking cool yeah because i don't know anyone who's watched sumo wrestling in person in japan yeah and i was like this is freaking epic i'm going to japan in may yeah like unbelievable place um and then as well i think this had been related to the the clothing company the thirst um we would do these campaigns where we just get like a load of models together because we needed other models to wear the shorts bikinis things like that and we would just go to some crazy location like one that stood out was when we're in capri and i was on one of these reaver boats what's a reaver it's like a wooden old school okay yeah like a sort of vianney yeah and i was like just on this boat was really hot chick who i liked and this like capri in the background and i was just like i can't believe i'm i'm doing this this is the thing i wouldn't have done yeah if it wasn't for you know this this this piece of content that we were trying to get you feel like you're in some sort of like beer ad you know see those like yeah yeah like the like the freaking david david gandhi like blue commercial thing so yeah there's and it's the same thing with the podcast not that they were necessarily amazing experiences but the people i've met the conversations i've had yeah would not have happened if i wasn't doing the podcast i think there's a lot about like joe rogan and how if you if you had to ask like who's the most connected person on the planet like if you said like like you should pull up your whatsapp and like who's got the most famous people it's gotta be joe rogan because it's like that dude has had like 5 000 conversations with unique people who are all seriously interesting which is major yeah um you've said recently that you want to you want to become a billionaire yeah why is that probably because i have a crippling lack of self-worth

1:13:47um i i don't know i mean the the answer that i tell myself that i'm consciously aware of because the the reasons why there's probably a hundred just buried away that i don't i can't access or understand but one of the main reasons why i think of consciously is it's like to me it kind of comes back to that whole video game addict thing i feel like when you're a billionaire like an actual but not necessarily in cash but just an equity value in company it's like or at least you have a company valued at a billion dollars which is kind of is that the thing that's what i'm looking for obviously i feel like if you get there and you keep growing that thing you get to a point where you just become a billionaire anyway but i feel like becoming a billionaire personally or having a company that's valued at a billion which is kind of a cheat because if you have a software company doing like a hundred mil a year then you that's then valued at a billion so that you can sell it for that level which means you whatever yeah the semantics don't matter past like 500 mil either way but i feel like it's it's like being a billionaire is like that's the highest level of the game it's kind of like yeah it's it's probably as a status thing but also maybe like a self-worth thing or like an achievement thing um but the difference is is like i always used to say it as like just like a because i thought it sounded cool it was like a virtue signal like yeah i want to be a billionaire but now like i actually that's what i'm sort of optimizing and engineering my entire life for if that makes sense um and it isn't what have you realized so far what about the the pursuit of becoming a billionaire that maybe people don't realize i think the ruthlessness that you have to you have to be a dick like not that that's that's direct that's direct not in like a not in like all your social interactions and stuff but i've spent a lot of time um like one thing that i did is i want to did this with software so one thing i did is i i've got a spreadsheet a google spreadsheet of um i think 1400 interviews with software billionaires so whether that's the founders of stripe or the founders of shopify there's i i collated like the top 100 softwares new age sort of new money softwares do you just want to do that for you yeah yeah and um and one of my team members did it for me and then he got he found all the public interviews and i've been going through them and what i've what i've kind of noticed is like they're that they're just all so ruthless like and what i mean by ruthless is like you'll stop at nothing to achieve your goal and it's like it's like you know you're you're not afraid to upset people or offend people i'm sure that this is in a business context so in the confines of your home or your friendship groups it's obviously going to be different you don't want to be a dick to everyone but i've noticed that like you know um with my business and how i've built things is i've always been very involved and very agreeable and very sort of friendly and i think making that switch to becoming because you like when i think about how like hormosi would run a team meeting for example you know you can imagine what that would look like so that that sort of you know conquer archetype where you're sort of on a mission and no one's gonna you're not gonna take any shit from anyone you're gonna be completely ruthless you know with people and so that's something that i've i've noticed um but but that and also all of them had some sort of vision like something that they really wanted to do it It was never about, and it never has or will be for them, or specifically hopefully for me, about the acquisition of material wealth or even power.

1:17:05It's kind of like, you know that, and it's going to sound cringe, but you know that Peaky Blinders scene where Tommy Shelby is like, if we can, we do, or some shit. I can't remember if I fucking butchered the quote. You know what I mean? It's like, if you can do it, why wouldn't you? Because to me, I'm like, what else would I do? like what's the biggest possible imaginable achievement from a commercial business standpoint it's the status of billionaire because there's only like 3 600 of them in the world or something like that so that's the top top top top top echelon that's like for me right now the way i look at business is kind of like look at like a sports league so you know how like um let's let's take american football right so you've got um you've got the nfl which is the billionaires that's the top, top, top.

1:17:47Then below that, you've got college football, which is your sort of like nine figure entrepreneurs. And then below that, you've got the sort of division one high school league, which is what I'm in at the moment from a business perspective, but like eight or multi eight figures. And then below that, you've got the guys that just play on Sunday for fun. And so it's like transcending those ladders is kind of the game. And it's like you get to play the game, the business game at just a higher and a higher and a higher level. And the thing that I like and i kind of explained this to a client the other day is the further you go when you start thinking like that you start becoming a lot more tolerant of risk you start becoming a lot more ruthless with your time you start becoming a lot more direct but the cool thing is it it it makes it puts you under this pressure where all your decisions matter a lot like you're three bad decisions and you're fucked like when you think about like elon musk for example like if that guy makes like let's say he's running tesla and he makes like just two or three consecutive really bad decisions like bad hires or bad pr decisions the entire business falls apart so the higher you play it's like walking on a tightrope and you're sort of like balancing this thing and like one misstep and you're dead and i like that and it sounds it sounds psychopathic to enjoy that that idea but i think the higher you go the more risk there is associated with it and yeah you know it's it's not, it's, it's not for everyone, but I love it.

1:19:10How have you managed that with, you said you, you know, in a relationship? Yeah, we can talk, this is in track and I knew this was going to come up. So it's, it's really interesting because my, my girlfriend, um, routinely calls me autistic, right? Which is just fine. It's like, it's not like a, you know, it's a, it's a funny kind of joke. And, um, in like an endearing way, she's lovely. So when I met my girlfriend, which was six months ago i we we went on this first date um and i said to her i was like look i need you to understand that like if we have i said this on the first date like within 20 minutes i was like look if if we're going to have any sort of relationship i need to understand something and i said point blank i said my work will always come first i will always put it before anything even my own well-being and sometimes yours as well which is like a and you the look on her face was sort of like oh but i was just being honest and it was she looked disappointed no she was she was like yeah i actually respect it and i actually understand it and she's been ever since then she's been i feel like if you don't set that expectation at the start yeah it's it just it sort of feeds in and so you know you don't want to start the relationship off by being like the ultimate boyfriend well this is the thing is traveling around give them all your time i did i made that mistake because you make yourself so available to them at the beginning and then they then that expectation is set and then when you start withdrawing they think that you know you don't like me anymore yeah exactly you don't love me anymore and it's like i've never had that with with with my girlfriend i'm not going to say a name because it's you know it's personal whatever and so you know there's that but then also with my relationship now it is um it's it's something and it sounds it does sound autistic and it sounds freakish but it's something that i manage so we have a scheduled date night we have monthly relationship check-ins where i've got a 20-step google form but i will answer like are you know i'm like she'll answer it and i'll answer it and it's like are our needs being met are we communicating properly is there anything underlying that we haven't discussed because like the thing is this is like again this isn't normal and it's not something that i don't i don't think it's recommended for any normal person to do because it would probably help quite a lot of suffering marriages what you do if you systemize communication and if you if you create these systems for like like you know know for example like if i'm um my girlfriend knows because she lives with me now and you know um days that she's not working or days that she's around the house she leave me well i've i've we've got we've got this sort of heuristic where it's like it's like a rule it's like between the hours of 7 a.m and 7 p.m no disturbances and i say to her because you know what girls are like they want to talk they want the attention and for in order for us to have a healthy relationship she still needed to receive affection and love and all these things and so like i say to her if there's anything you want to talk to me throughout the day whether it's about you know the color of nails you should get done or something someone said to you at work or this this this put it on your notes app and we'll talk about it in the day and that way it might sound like weirdly autistic yeah it is it is it is but the thing is is that it actually works out better because that means when i sit down to talk to her at the end of the day or when she wants to talk we i actually hear her and it's like i'm not i'm not on my phone or trying to do a meeting or whatever while she's trying to talk to me it's like it's actually allocated and i think that you know i'm navigating relationships and stuff um when you have that weird obsessive work thing can be difficult and i think that a lot of you know you see billionaires their marriages blow up all the time you know just because they're hyper disciplined men of of extreme intelligence doesn't mean that they're they're getting everything right you know bill gates and melinda gates break up um jeff basil's breaks up and stuff and you know their relationships are far from perfect but i think like i've got a hunch that if you can if you understand each other really well and what you both need and you can systemize communication another example is we have this date night and then what i've done and this is autistic is i've got a spreadsheet for movies and dinners so every restaurant we go to we will rate it and every movie watch will rate it because what started to happen with with my girlfriend and she'd she'd send me these restaurants like these these tiktok she's seen or she'd say i really want to watch this movie so i'd start adding them to spreadsheets and then we'd we'd we'd do it and then rate it and and it's it's things like that that that's my own weird way of it's it's kind of like it's like almost like a little business like you track it and you manage it and you you you have the the sort of items and the minutes and the meetings but that works for me and it works so you you enjoy the process of reviewing things yeah well it's not it's not because it's not because it's like an enjoyment thing it's just more like if i don't my calendar is so packed and i'm so regimented with it if i don't make time for something i won't do it yeah that makes sense and it's not that i don't think you can systemize or automate a loving relationship there have to be there has to be elements of it that are fluid dynamic you know and it has to move like in sort of organic mechanism but i think my hunch is that relationships fall apart when you don't communicate or when expectations aren't properly set so those are those are two i think that's a very good point like at the beginning just saying like hey this is who i am the work's the priority like yeah you can be there yeah or join me or just you can leave but i think a lot of a lot of women obviously the majority of women they love the idea of being with a man that is very wealthy you know and i think you know not to call not to call out gold diggers but like if you took a if you're a woman and you had two identical men man a and man be they're identical in every way same height same build same look same everything but one guy's rich and one guy's poor you're going to pick the rich guy just by default but the chances are is a guy that is in his 20s or 30s and is wealthy if he's made his own money you he's not going to be as available because you know there's a reason why he's that successful and that's because he's put the time in and so my girlfriend's amazing she's so um emotionally responsive and she's she's so good at communicating and managing her own emotions and stuff that it's like it works really well i've been looking for that for like a long time yeah she's she's got her own thing going on as well with work yeah yeah she's she's doing her own thing and she's you know she's got her own sort of life and you know she she and i have the same values in terms of what we want additional relationship you know sort of i pay for the house she makes it home i pay for the food she cooks it like all those sorts of things um and i've always wanted that i've never wanted the power couple thing because i feel like when i come home i need it to be home not work if that makes sense yeah yeah what about you what's your experience been like in dubai recently well it's pretty good i mean i'm enjoying myself yeah like and i know i don't know i don't allow myself to get disappointed i don't overly get my hopes so i'm just i'm enjoying it and i think that's down to the experience that i've had i've had the heartbreaks in my 20s and i've made the mistakes and it's very easy now i can look at someone and just be like okay i know what type of girl this is and then i know like is this someone you have fun with is this someone you maybe you actually take something you have something serious with them yeah um and you can tell very quickly if they're lying full of shit or like what they like to do in their spare time are they the next score like all of that so as i said i'm i'm having fun i feel like i'm 35 i feel i'm definitely i don't know if this is my prime if the prime is still yet to come um so i'm enjoying it and i know when the when the time comes i want to have some kids at some point yeah um i can make that happen i think i was overthinking it that if i have kids my life is drastically going to change i think if you are you know you're successful you've got great things going on work-wise and most importantly you have a lot of money you can do a lot of things that a lot of other men can't do with men with less resources they don't have the same freedom and they can't they can't run their life they want to because like oh you know i i can't afford a nanny or i can't it's funny because i haven't spoken to a single guy that has a kid that's regretted it yeah because i feel like i i had this same fear i have this same fear not not to the degree at which i used to have it i think it depends the partner with and how good they would be of a mother and how what they were they want that but i think like i feel like life probably starts when you have kids yeah because like what could be more meaningful than that you know but it is it's a question of finding the right person to do that with because it's like a kid is like it's like you're it's like you've got to raise this thing for like 18 years and then some you know i think the most important thing is finding someone who genuinely wants to be a mother like it is even where they're they're literally you know they've got their own thing going on they're making money or whatever but they're just literally they just cannot wait to be a mother and they're going to throw everything into being a mother yeah that's exactly what i want i've had some good relationships with uh some women where i've thought about i'm like i wonder what it'd be like if i had a kid with this person and i i can see that they don't they're not really into that like they don't they're almost like i don't really want kids or they would have to be persuaded into having kids i think that would yeah yeah when it's going to be like a negotiation it's like i think that like Like if you, the way that they treat you is pretty indicative of how they would raise children.

1:28:22They're very maternal, very empathetic, very sort of emotionally sensitive to situations and stuff like that. But then again, like there are mothers out there that don't have those traits that still make incredibly good mothers. And, you know, like I remember my mom told me this, like when you, like when I was born, so I'm the first born in our family, like when you have kids as a woman, like your entire psychology and hormone system just completely shifts. I had a family member who I was a little bit concerned because she's married to my brother and she was like, I do not want kids. I'm not, I don't want to have kids.

1:28:57I was like, have you fucking listened to my brother? Have you made a mistake here? Yeah, I want to be an uncle. And then they ended up having a kid and she got pregnant and she's literally the best mother ever. And I was like, wow, what a turnaround. like i wasn't expecting this i think the same thing probably happens maybe not with guys because you see a lot of the absent father things might be quite a common like thing at the moment but yeah i don't know man i just feel like for me specifically like dubai the the sort of the the dating in dubai just didn't really give a sense to that ideal and and that's not to say that there's not girls in dubai that would make fantastic mothers or that there's the only girls in Dubai are gold diggers or escorts that's not true at all but it's again it comes back to the the transient sort of nature of it and the other thing as well is it's like you know if you meet someone in Dubai then that's the that's the expectation they have you know it's the it's the it's the Michelin star dinners and it's the it's the trips and it's the palm and it's the it's the villa and it's all these things and it's like you know you kind of just want almost a degree of normality in your relationship at least the beginning but you know it's like a lot of guys say that they wish that they'd met someone before they came up and had like a day one but i don't know if that would be a good thing or not like yeah because it's like you don't know yourself and you don't really know what you want until you are successful enough to have the option to figure it out you know yeah and you're probably going to do a little bit of exploring yeah as you go through that phase of yeah winning which i don't know day one is probably not going to be happy with yeah well one thing one thing that's interesting i think is when you get to when you're a guy and you're like late 20s like early mid 30s like you making friends is strange yeah because it's like you've got you've got all of your day one friends from like school or college and i've still got like four or five of my very close friends that i'm good friends wouldn't even work with me at this point but making new friends in a way that is like non-transactional is hard man because you always like how much how much money is this guy making yeah like how many followers has he got and what does he do and what's on his wrist and it's like it's really hard to like form or nurture like normal healthy friendships like i met this guy in the gym his name's will and um he was um we've seen each other in there a couple of times and he's the same age as me and um i went up to him i was like hey mate like do you want to get a session he was like yeah yeah fuck it why not no one does that these days yeah like no one's like sociable and this is in nice guy just has he's like just normal guy doing he works like the police and stuff sound guy and i was like that's the first time that i've done that in a while and i was like yeah that's that's how you make normal friends there's instead of approaching it from like a you know like some sort of transaction and that i struggled with that in dubai the sort of the the only way to sort of socialize was to have those dinners and then you end up sort of like being this it's just not real and you can't you can't you don't know what jokes to make and you don't know if you can really be yourself or not and it's it's tough man yeah luckily i found a good group of friends out there but it took a while yeah a couple years to find that yeah and even then at the start i was thinking about i mean do they really like who i am or wow yeah yeah the cloud is associated with it or like being tagged in my pictures or on the youtube videos or whatever it might be i was like do you really think about that i used to have that thought of like you know when you'd used to watch like um like jake paul's vlogs yeah and even david dobrik's vlogs yeah and you were like are you guys actually friends or is it just is it you just follow the leader like you know for the for the pop tag the instagram handle or something like that man but because a lot of them they ended up building businesses off the back of being in the vlogs it's like corinna copphe like the the girl from david's vlog she's like did the only fans thing and she's now like making cake she's making like an obscene amount of money which is like you know like i mean hats off to her for doing it you know like i don't i don't necessarily know if i respect the only fans decision but it's like you know just by being around the right person you can have that sort of trajectory but i don't know man i think when you get to a certain point though you just kind of realize you just you know who's real and who's not yeah and i know what you mean because i had the same thing in dubai i made some good friends and we play like five a side football and stuff and it was like a proper laugh but that took like serious organization yeah and and that's the other thing as well is then you've then there's ubers involved and it's you can't just go down the pub for a pint and just chat some shit for like five minutes it's like it's a proper mission man yeah yeah yeah you got good friends here loads of good friends yeah yeah but i've got like because i got family here yeah and then i've got like my my three closest friends will work with me um so i've got one two guys on our sales team one guy on our r &d that just happened it was yeah it was kind of like a it's it was something that shouldn't have worked but it it did um because all of my friends from college like we all kind of went our own ways and then i went like when i had when i dropped out of uni i kind of lost contact with everyone because i was so like a ashamed but be just in this weird like work 100 hours a week and just don't talk to anyone mode and then like after the apprenticeship i came out with the the agency and sort of made that work and then i kind of started talking to my old friends again and to me i was i'd been on this sort of sort of lone trajectory just doing my own thing thinking that everybody else was making something of themselves and then like i would go back to like all of my old friendship groups from college and everyone was just like same conversation same pub same pint same same same town and so that and until like a couple of my very close friends from college sort of like wait what have you done what are you doing then i kind of got them involved in it and that that that's like three years ago and they're all still involved yeah but yeah it's all good and it's all good and well until they do anything wrong but they never have it's like you know i said to them all i was like when if i'm hiring you please don't ever put me in a position where i have to fight you it's like that would suck and ruin our friendship yeah is it so i'm not really experiencing what it's like to live in london anymore obviously i've been in dubai for six years is all this stuff that's going around social media true or is it like what just like all the negativity about all london has become a complete shithole well to frame it i live in kensington yeah so you know it's like the the royal borough of kensington and chelsea like there's no crime there like i've been here for six months i've had a lot more of a life and a lot more social interaction stuff the worst thing i've seen happen is someone's bag got stolen like some guy in a bar tried to like grab some guy's rucksack and then the bartender like pulled him back and it's like you definitely like when i when i got back to london um it was actually quite hilarious how frightened i was because i landed off of my fucking emirates first class flight and got got my ramo out and started dragging it down the thing you know as you do and then like um i didn't need to mention any of those things whatever and um and we were we were waiting in this in this airbnb for this airbnb outside and the airbnb was locked and we'd arrived in i would be in april the 10th or 11th or whatever it was quite cold it's getting dark and it was like you know like 6 p.m and then like my business partner we were outside and we were waiting for this airbnb we're trying to call the guy he wasn't able to give us the key or whatever we went for half an hour and every time a group of guys walked past like hoods up like hands and pockets i was like oh fuck we're gonna get started and i was like wait i've i've lived here for 25 years prior to this and that's never happened but the thing is is it's like the the the social media vacuum of like london's bad london's bad it's definitely not as safe as dubai and it's definitely not as like clean as dubai and all these things but i i had to catch myself like what what am i scared of happening i just became so brainwashed into thinking that i was going to get stabbed but i love him yeah and you know the the taxes suck and there's 101 reasons as to why london isn't amazing and stuff and why the uk is not amazing and you know things like that but for me for my commercial interest my business london is where i kind of have to be um why is that because i want to have an office oh you've got a team engineering team sales team etc um on top of that also as well as time zone yeah stuff um and yeah you know it's not it's not without it's so you you currently trying to build a piece of software right now yeah yeah okay it's it's uh so i'm not we're keeping it on the on the old dl but we're basically in the process of building a b2b software um specifically to begin with for our clients so our entire business is about helping um businesses with client acquisition so like you know we help agency and as coach consultants with like sales funnels appointment booking and like we're the we're the fucking best at it i love it to bits it's all i care about it's all i think about so we're really good at it but there's there's a specific like issue that a lot of people face from a sales and marketing perspective and i'm not going to i'll tell you after that i don't want to give it away to everyone otherwise i'll know what i'm doing i keep it secret and um steal your idea yeah i know it's not the it's not the idea that i just it's just more like to cast close to your chest yeah yeah um and there's there's a problem that we have um that no software currently solves that's quite big and if we solve that problem it would mean an extra you know 500k a year for us so i'm like i can build a software and develop something that albeit is actually quite hard to do because you know we've had to find like a whole technical co-founder and build an engineering team to solve it but that's in development and we're going to try and launch that probably march to june next year and we'll start with our clients but it makes a lot of sense and that's also why we made the academy free yeah it's because like by that point of launch we'll have like 150 000 people in there um 25 to 30 000 of which will have actually gone through and done it got results to some degree and can then register for the software because when you get enough people to trust you and you know love your content anything you release as you're well aware is going to be well received and so that's that's my sort of plan to bootstrap the software and at least get to like 10 to 20 million a year which then gives you a 100 to 200 mil valuation which then you can loan against and buy anything you want and raise and stuff but that's that's kind of the the phase one plan who owns school at the moment sam ovens so has he got 100 or did you know well hormosi's got um got a chunk of it we we also invest in school so it's interesting because what sam did at the beginning which was really clever is when school was kind of like a little twinkle in his eye wasn't really anything you know significant at least not as much as it is now um he he he sold lots of equity to or not lots but a minimal amount of equity compared to how much he owns to all of his mastermind clients um and so a lot a lot of them have equity and then every now and then one of them pops up and we'll try and buy it because obviously school shares at the moment are amazing but then he brought hormosi on i don't know well i there's there's it's it's rumored as to how much hormosi owns but it's none of my fucking business quite frankly um but hormosi has a chunk which then obviously brought school to the point where it's at now but they're they're rounding out the year with 20 million users and like they're valued at like an obscene amount of money now oh yeah it's it's gonna be like i think this time i would estimate that this time next year school will probably have about a million 100 million users which then puts it into the category of the largest fastest growing social media platform except from like facebook and stuff like the fastest new one because there's not really any new social media platforms that of blown up or no well as obviously iman got involved with wap um i don't know the figures of wap i'm doing quite i know they process like three billion or something like they're also a big player like you know respect to those guys because i've realized the software thing like it makes info look like a walk in the park yeah like it makes the agency space or the info business just look so easy because like now you've actually got to like program this thing and like you know and it's not as tangible but it's it's interesting it's fun yeah because you haven't you like you have an idea of how you want something to work and you're like make that and that the developers like nah yeah it's it's it's because i've had that experience with that i'm like yeah why can't it just be why can't it just be like yeah you know how much time it takes to to create that yeah that little function yeah because it's all so because what i've realized is it's all non-linear so everything connects to everything so if you make that little change there you've got to change 10 things here and three things down here and then if you don't do it properly it fucks up the whole thing yeah and then suddenly now it's in german it's a hard shit all the bugs and stuff man but yeah it's um it's good awesome man um i think we're gonna wrap it up here because we have to uh yeah we've got to vacate vacate the studio but it's been good good conversation and um i look forward to seeing what you're building we'll have to do we'll have to do this again next year yeah and then we can see if my predictions are right and if everything works out yeah but nice stuff man awesome man where people find you uh just youtube it's charlie morgan oh yeah all the hat this is this gonna be flipped or like is it obviously you can read it right no i think it'll be fine i'll be fine school.com forward slash academy yeah if you want to learn how to start a business or make money online it's completely free um go and check it out the youtube channel is very good as well yeah or just charlie morgan on youtube yeah nice one cancel me adios cheers guys