Mailbag: Are Wolves the worst team in Premier League history?

0:00Jingle bells everybody. Welcome to the Football Ramble Mailbag. Wolves, ultras, culture and secret Santa gifts of the odds of the day. It's Tuesday 23rd of December. I'm Marcus Speller. I'm Jim Campbell. And I'm David Cartridge.

0:24Hello, everybody. It's mailbag time. So close to Christmas Day. David, are you looking forward to the big day? Yeah, I'm quite excited. As always, as always. It's a great day, you can't deny. Now, we are going to plough on with mailbag things. Remember, you can ask us quite literally anything for this show. It may or may not be chosen to go in the show, but as you've heard over the weeks, months and years, some things do get in our show that may not appear on others. So do get in touch on xbluesky or Instagram at footballramble, comment on YouTube or email at show at footballramble.com. And of course, friends of the Ramble, you guys get priority.

0:57Patreon.com forward slash footballramble or sign up on YouTube. Let us start with this question from Michael on Instagram. it's the season of goodwill of course and everyone's in festive cheer Michael asks this do you think Wolves could be the worst team in Premier League history? I mean it sounds harsh doesn't it but it's a reasonable question they're on for it because they've now equaled the longest start without a win which was held by Sheffield United in the 2021 season and I mean the next worst record in Europe is held by Paralimni who if you don't know are in the Cypriot League and only have one point.

1:37And the Cypriot League is, I think, ranked 15th in Europe. It's as high as 15th. Yeah, and Cypriot football is apparently where it's at, isn't it? I remember us hearing that a little while ago. It is historically bad, the situation at Wolves. And obviously the comparison everybody makes is Derby County in 07-08. But this is really different, isn't it? Because Derby came up and they weren't ready for it. And this happens all the time. There's no shame in that. They were just a particularly extreme example of it. We saw it twice last season. Yeah, indeed. And we will see it many times again in the future.

2:07But this is different because the ownership at Wolves are really the same owners who led them to their more successful modern periods as well. But it's just kind of fallen apart through their own kind of negligence and their own kind of lack of coherent thinking and application. Now, Jeff Shee has stepped down as the chairman recently. So that's obviously a step in the right direction. He's a big part of the problem. there was talk that he's actually more interested in their esports team and having quite a strong brand for an esports team. So clearly, you know, the fish rots from the head, right?

2:45It's surprising that, as I say, that it's the same organization that have had success with them. But I think you have to think that they're on course for it. Rob Edwards hasn't won a game yet. They're bleeding out. It's as simple as that. to use quite an unsavoury analogy. As you say, Jim, it's different to a side who have come up and suddenly they're a bit rabbit in headlights and come in, oh my goodness, this Premier League, this is different and we're not ready. Wolves have been in the Premier League for a long time now. And yes, Jeff Shee has gone, Nathan Sheed namesake. It's no relation. Which they didn't clarify in the statement.

3:25It's a cosmetic change. But it's a cosmetic change. I mean, there was like a flicker of hope on Saturday morning, apparently when he addressed the staff. Apparently, oh, he's not a bad communicator, etc., etc. He himself has said he's not a football expert. He's come from a club med. He was on the board of a club med franchise operation. So that's who's been parachuted into a club that is fighting for its life. Still a club, to be fair. Yeah, still a club. Yeah, and the players are on the beach. so yeah so he's been parachuted in to a club fighting for their Premier League survival who look at this stage the best thing to do is probably prepare well for life in the championship you've got a head start over a lot of clubs over how you can prepare for next season in the championship I think yes but I think that is so firstly imagine being a Wolves season ticket holder and hearing that when you've got how many games left at home to play you're a bit like do I even bother going to the stadium.

4:21It's so depressing there. And also, I mean, I understand Wolves fans staying away because it's protest, isn't it? It's not them being sort of disloyal to their team or whatever you want to say. It's not a completely reasonable kind of show of dissent. They're very loyal. They're a good group of fans. They've just been completely done over and everybody has a limit. They haven't got football men within the club running things. Like I said, I've just said where Nathan Shire's come from. I think that's an insult to the supporters. There's a bit of talk about apparently some Chinese regulations so they can't spend more money at the moment or something as well.

4:57But if you're a player, so let's say if they were focused on the Premier League. If you're a player, are you going there in January? No, no, no. No, of course not. You'd only go there for the money and therefore you would get your mercenary times. You know, they're buggered. It's as simple as that. Burnley have three more wins than them in the Premier League this year. West Ham have got three more. Well, they've got zero wins, haven't they? I'm sure everybody listening knows that but they've got two points They've scored nine goals Nine goals in 17 games conceding 37 At the start of the season everyone's looking at Matthias Kunja and Ryan Aitnori thinking they're going to struggle without the kind of creativity of those two players even though Ryan Aitnori is ostensibly a fullback he's a very creative presence I think I even saw them play him as essentially a number 10 at one point but you're looking at Jürgen Strand and Larsson as being the guy, the only guy left where you think, well, they're going to have to really, really lean on him.

5:53And obviously he took a terrible penalty that comes from a complete lack of confidence at the weekend. I think he's a better player than we're seeing, but for whatever reason, he's not doing it. And there's really no one else, is there? I mean, Matthias Mane looks like he's got a bit of quality, but he's like, yeah, he's really, he's young and untested. But you have a few Premier League players in there. I think Andre is in the centre of the pitch, is a decent player and so on. So it's not, as I say, it's not quite like a side coming up. So like Ipswich, you had a lot of championship and a few League One players in there, but gave a reasonable account of themselves.

6:27Yeah, the proper core of it. Yeah, the reason why this is so bad, and we're slightly going over all ground, is because of how this has just been allowed to drift so, so badly. You go all the way back to, say, Nuno Espirito Santo was of course there for a few years. Now, this ownership group has been in what, since 2016, if I remember correctly? It's nearly 10 years. Well, Nuno, a combination of Nuno and them seemingly getting all of George Mendes' agents, it's kind of made it boom time for Wolves in the Premier League, and they got themselves into a European competition. Which was canny, right?

7:08It was, yeah, and they were a good, solid Premier League side. Bruno Large came in, and he left, and after he left, Lopetegui came in. and Lopetegui did okay. They weren't scoring a lot of goals, but they were pretty good defensively if I remember correctly. But when Lopetegui left on the 8th of August, 2023, he could see the problems and the problems had been mounting up, you know, with Lars Levin and then Lopetegui, you know, it was clear that there was something not quite right. When Lopetegui left, it was like, ooh, they're in trouble. Gary O 'Neill comes in and actually does okay, all things considered, and manages to keep them up.

7:41This has been in the post for a long time this season for Wolves. Because Gary O 'Neill, when he got sacked eventually, which was at the end of 2024, they get in Vita Pereira, another firefighter. All right, okay, because things are not going well. This is not going to improve. You can't just change the manager. You're losing, you're hemorrhaging your best players. You're not replacing them at all. And then we, you know, fast forward to now, Vita Pereira leaves for one thing or another, you know, under a bit of a very, very angry cloud, understandably from his point of view. and with the appointment of Rob Edwards that appointment itself no disrespect to Rob Edwards you know he was doing well with Middlesbrough the only reason why he went there was because of the emotional ties to the club it shows you that is the type of manager they're going to get the guy whose only season in the Premier League was relegation and that is totally symptomatic of what's going they were being linked with Eric Ten Hag you remember should have got him in yeah it's funny as well because this is just drifted and here we are when you look at Pereira, at the end of last season, obviously everyone knows at that point that Cunha's probably going to go to Man United.

8:50But despite that, you're still thinking, you know what, he's really turned this around. If they get some decent players in... It was all short-term with Pereira. Yeah, but the drift from there to this is still shocking in quite how extreme it is. And I suppose the question is, are they on course to be the worst Premier League team ever? And the reason I think they've got a good shout of actually managing that, so to speak, is that I don't know if I've ever seen a team as demoralised as this. It's like Matt Doherty's comment at the weekend. Do we want to be remembered for fighting until the end of the season or do we want to be remembered for being cowards?

9:26Cowards. That's a strong word. And he's not angry, is he? He's not even angry. He's demoralised. I thought it was a very measured response in light of the current situation. It was a really emotionally honest response in that moment. and I hope for their sake that that can be used as a catalyst. But I mean, so they need to get 11 points to not be the worst team in Premier League history. You don't know where they're getting a single point from at the moment, but it only takes one result, right? To turn that around. Well, no, it takes a few results. Sure, but to start building that momentum, you know what I mean?

10:03I mean, this is the thing. When other teams, as I say, come up, you think of, say, Ipswich last season or Luton, for example, when you think they're going to struggle. We know this. But there's a bit of spirit. There's a bit of, bloody hell, we're up in the big leagues, et cetera, and so on. With Wolves, again, that's not the case. We've spoken about that.

10:29Momentum, vibes, all this sort of stuff, whatever better word. It's so important. And now, every time they play a game of football, Wolves, it's kind of like, I don't want to be here. I just want to get out of this Strand Larson when he misses that penalty a great shame for him because he's been a good player for Wolves and last season you know his goals were crucial it's I think it was on the BBC where you know they were doing the old ticker on Saturday afternoon they were going well he's got to score for vibes is what they were saying and that penalty again it's just like that sums it all up even if they lose that 2-1 but a home game against Brentford Brentford not good on the road particularly no only their second win I think all season on the road it's just one of those games they had to win it or they had to do something and they showed not even just in the fact they lost it the manner in which they lost it it's one of those games as a fan you'd look at and go look I know we're shit the squad isn't very good but we should be winning that game and there's been a few of those now for Wolves whether there's going to be a few more that they actually will win I don't really know but they definitely should have had more points than they have now they had a really good showing at the Emirates as well they gave Arsenal a scare and then you're thinking okay they defended really really well there for long periods of the game.

11:39That's something to build on and then immediately that's just gone. That momentum's down. There is some talent in that squad. Absolutely. They've been completely asset-stripped but the nature of their recruitment means there are always going to be some players there. Well, that is the only argument really I can think of saying are they going to be the worst team in Premier League history? You would say no because they've got a better squad than that Derby County side and I think they've got a better squad than that Salampton team of last year which we thought could be the side who would take Derby County's unwanted record.

12:11But thinking about teams who have really struggled when they come up, their squad you would say is probably a little bit better. But is the manager equipped to go in and win a handful of Premier League games from now to the end of the season, particularly given the circumstances, given how demoralised everybody is? Realistically, they're playing for pride now, which is what Matt Doherty is suggesting. And also the pride is like, let's not be the worst team ever. Yes. Which is probably quite hard to motivate yourself for when things start going wrong in the game, right? And especially as every single player, well, not every single player, but Doherty himself mentioned this, so many of those players have been thinking, get me out of here.

12:47To their agents, they'll be like, get me out of here. I don't care where. I wonder if that was pointed from him saying that. Well, probably. It was interesting. But I don't necessarily blame those players. I know this is a very sort of unfan-like thing to say, but if it's going to crap and the ownership have been the architects of this downfall and so on and so forth. You can't necessarily blame a player going, do you know what? This is so poor. We're not doing anything. I want to get out of it. It'd be disappointing from the fans' point of view. I totally get that. You know, he's jumping from a sinking ship and so on.

13:18But clearly Doherty, yeah, there's leaving well and there's leaving badly. And I think Doherty is trying to say, let's not, well, quite literally, let's not be cowards. What are we going to be remembered for at this club if they rallied and finished the season with, you know, a points tally, which of course will still get them relegated but the fans think well do you know what you gave us a teensy bit of cheer and no one's ever going to talk about us in the same bracket as that Derby County team then do you know what it's right now they probably take that whether they're going to do it or not I'm I'm not convinced will they be the worst team in Premier League history just 10 points would do it yeah I don't think they will yeah I think they're going to be I think they're going to be mightily close but I don't think they are sorry Derby County Stu has been in touch on X Stu asks what is your biggest ick in modern football in regards to what players wear mini shin pads low socks boots holes in socks gloves in summer etc snoods Jim snoods I did hate the snoods did you I understood why players wanted to wear it but I just thought the aesthetic looked stupid would you prefer if like a player had a scarf on or around the pitch remember Carlos Tevez's Tevez's used to be really thick I honestly thought He's bigger than any other snoot.

14:34He's got a thick neck though. He has. He's got a very chunky neck. The shin pads players wear. The little custard creams. Yeah. Yeah. I just worry. You know what it's like? If you just get even the slides and neck on your shin, it kills. It's really strange. It's been banned at non-league level as well. Has it? Yeah, yeah. You can't wear them then. It's funny. My wife, who's not a big football fan, she pointed out, she goes, why have they got those silly things down there? Yeah. And she goes, aren't you going to get injured more? And I'm going, well. Yeah. I mean, clearly though, because they're the ones who play all the time.

15:09So if clearly they were getting wax on the shin and it was hurting a lot, they wouldn't wear them. So, I mean, I understand that, you know, at grassroots level, when you'd wear sort of quite big shin pads and especially with the ones with the ankle protons. That's right. Yeah, I used to wear them. Like a WWE wrestler. Yeah, the old Son Deagle ones. Totally, yeah. It's weird to think of that because, again, you could not imagine Premier League players in this day and age where you can't just scythe people down like you could do in the 90s and so on. And more's the pity, David. But that sometimes happens by accident, doesn't it?

15:40Well, indeed. That's what makes me worry for these players. Yeah, I wonder if Virgil van Dijk will wear them on the reverse next time when he faces Jarvie Simmons. But the future is full body armour. Just robots! Yeah, you can't hurt robots. Well, robots come later. Yeah. Okay, fair enough. Against our will, presumably. But yeah, so... They just turn up with their own ball one day. Fuck. the singularity it's here and it's come for football well yeah so mini shin pads I just look at that and I'm like you're gonna get hurt but again quite clearly not I think it's the holes and the socks for me really yeah I think it's a bit silly it is really really silly and I don't know who was the first player to actually do that because a lot of people say it was Bellingham I think it was Kyle Walker you know Mark Bellingham says it was Jude then it was Jude Bellingham then it's Jude yeah we like it We like it.

16:31In all seriousness, all right, I didn't know that. So the idea is to maximize blood flow, which I think is probably pseudoscience. But I think I saw an interview with Kyle Walker where he said he tried it one day and it felt better. So he just sort of kept doing it. So that was, I mean, I've not done a huge amount of research on this, but he was the first person I saw talking about it. Wouldn't you just wear looser socks? Like a size up? Yeah, I don't know. I have no idea why this is such an issue it is a strange one yeah I do agree but I mean I suppose for him maybe for him he just felt like the size of the socks whatever that'll do and then as you say being one of the quickest players as he was people think oh maybe I'll get on for all of that I think my other one I also thought it was strange wearing gloves with short sleeves yeah that's odd that's always an odd one to me yeah I get that again the 90s goalkeepers kit had loads of padding on the sort of lower part of the sleeve didn't they and on the elbows but you're not just talking about keepers you're talking about players oh outfield players yeah I always found that really really strange the keepers are always going to wear gloves I think you're talking about if it's cold why wouldn't you wear the long sleeve if it's cold because I've got goalkeepers gloves in my head there because that's one of mine as well it's the little spikes they have on them now and I know there's a practical reason for this apparently on goalkeepers gloves all over on the back back of the hands and I think it's apparently to do with preventing hyperextension in kind of high impact moments.

18:00So there is a practical reason that they're on there, but I just think it looks weird. Because I always remember when the Adidas finger save came out. I remember when a mate first bought them and it had the spine in the finger. I was like, oh my God, this is amazing. It's not those floppy gardening gloves we used to have, basically. Like the goalkeeping version of the Adidas Predator. Do you remember in the 90s everyone was like, oh, it makes you kick it harder, but you can curl it more. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe that's what it is. When they punch it, they can curl a punch. Yeah. Yeah, or maybe not, Jim, I don't know.

18:28So there you go, Stu. Get in touch with what your biggest icks are in modern football. Coming up after this, do we need ultras in English football?

18:47Ben has been in touch on Blue Sky. And Ben says this, there has been talk recently of English fan bases needing to develop an ultras culture to create more of an atmosphere at matches. Is this a worthwhile idea, or is it something that simply isn't part of English footballing culture and can't just be wished into existence? What do we think, David? I don't even think it needs to be an ultras culture as such. I think it can be something as simple as clubs making sure there is an actual singing section inside stadiums. I think that helps considerably. There's been a lot of changes with ticketing and such and then prices come into it over recent years where a lot of people aren't sitting next to the same person every single game for years and years, how it used to be.

19:37You used to see the same people all the time. So you don't have that anymore now. So it's very hard to build something, build a bond, build a group like that. There's obviously examples where fans have taken it upon themselves. Crystal Palace is an obvious example. obvious example here they got together in 2005 I think it was a third generation group of supporters who used to be on the terraces back in the day and they craved that in the modern game and they had to fight a lot of people to do that Croydon Council tried to get the safe standing shut down there the Premier League obviously have their measures in the police also I know for a fact that they had a lot of trouble with the police there around that area as well so a lot of things are weird against fans in terms of trying to create that so to see Crystal Palace do that more recently I think and Jim will go into this a bit more about Arsenal as well and Arsenal have been I think their atmosphere of the Emirates has changed considerably yeah it has the Ashburton Army are the Arsenal version of that they started in I think it was 2019 they started but they became a bit more prevalent after that and they had their allocation cut a little while ago actually so they're not as kind of the group isn't as big as it was and obviously they you know they bring the drum in and it did make a difference to the atmosphere I think actually and I think not everyone that sits in that section loves them because you're always going to get sort of kind of people are a bit grumpy and a bit crotchety and I think that the drum obviously some of the criticism they get is that they kind of prefer to lead their own chance and don't necessarily join in with a chant that's kind of started somewhere else in the stadium but I think we've all been in this situation if like you're in an away game and there's a chant going on somewhere else you're not really aware of it so I think maybe they're not actually yeah they're not doing that on purpose and that's probably just the nature of being sat by a massive drum I think it's really interesting that it's quite it's a very new thing and I'm intrigued to see where it will go and I know they want to grow it and they want to kind of essentially have as big a presence as they can behind the goal I don't know how likely they are to succeed in that because it's essentially down to how much the club wants to encourage it.

21:46But it's in its infancy. They're really dedicated as well. You can't just sort of turn up in black and sit with them and you're in. You have to do like a bit of charity work locally and kind of turn up to the social things and help out with the banners and stuff like that. It's a proper commitment and that is how you foster that sort of atmosphere. And I think generally, I think ultra culture, if you want to call it that, from abroad is never quite going to be exactly as it is in Europe, in England, just because we support football very differently. And I think the idea of there being somebody not facing the game with a massive drum telling you when to sing what is never fully going to catch on.

22:25I think we'll have elements of it here. It's just not going to fly with British. We're just far too cynical of things like that. And we like spontaneity, right? We like silly kind of off-the-cuff chants. Absolutely. And I think it's important for... it's going to be young people who are going to have to do it as well. It's funny enough, I was reading before we came on, the Premier League supporters and fans who go to stadiums, on average, it's apparently around the age of 40, 41. So it's quite an old group. But look, that's the people with disposable money. With money now, yeah. That's the point I was going to make.

22:54I think the price of Premier League matches is a factor in this. It's not the factor, but I think it's a factor in terms of how far can this go or will we see more of it? Because abroad, there's a lot of countries where football will be a bit cheaper and so on, for whatever reason that is. So I think if a younger generation was going to football a lot more and they fancied a bit of this, then that would be phased in. But these things take time. You mentioned Palace, obviously, the obvious example here. You know, was it 2005 when they kind of got together? That's when they got together. What are we going to do now?

23:27I know Palace fans would say, oh, but this has been a long time at Sellersburg. Yes, of course. This particular group in 2005, yes. Yeah, but it's taken a while to really, and obviously in the last few years, obviously last year when they won the FA Cup, the spotlight was on them hugely, but in the last handful of years, people have become more aware of this palace. But it takes a while to kind of bring it in and foster that kind of culture. Now look at the TIFO culture. That's coming in to the Premier League a lot more, as you see. That's not happened overnight. No, but it feels a little bit like it's just arrived and we're all on board with it.

24:01Whereas I think initially there was kind of opposition to anything that seemed a little bit European and people would think things like that were a bit forced. But I think there's been a change in that recently. Possibly it's just that a generation have grown up with it. And maybe just because the world is a bit more, naturally a bit more global because of the internet and how much exposure we have and access to other cultures. And obviously you see teams in Europe doing it when English teams are playing out there. But I like the TIFO thing. I think it's cool. Me too. Anything that encourages a football culture that is aware from sitting on the couch and watching everything through a prism of sky is vital to me.

24:34It's vital for football to survive in this country as well. Otherwise, in 20, 30 years' time, these people who are young now are not going to be able to afford to go to games. They're not going to be going to games. And every single seat is just going to be a prawn sandwich box. Well, I'm afraid, David, I don't think that lots of young people are able to afford games. And also as well, in certain huge clubs, and this is the price you pay, right? So we can talk about, yeah, but I don't know, at FC Basel they do this. or at, I don't know, I don't know what the fans are like at Utrecht, but, you know, take a club like that.

25:08But actually, they're a better example than Arsenal, you know. The kind of, so to speak, smaller clubs tend to have those more fervent kind of groups. They do, and that's because you get fewer tourists turning up. The ticket prices aren't as big, blah, blah, blah. One thing I would say, but it can be done, because when I went to see Arsenal versus Bayern in the Champions League, the Bayern fans, you know, there is a different sort of culture there of watching football. They're singing all the way through the game. Yeah, they are. But the Bayern one in particular is quite weird because one of the songs that they sing is to the tune of the entertainer.

25:39The da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. And some of them, some of the chants almost feel like nursery rhymes. There's a sort of strange innocence to it as well. Yeah, but a lot of the chants here were old hymns, weren't they? Yeah, I guess so. I suppose so. And chants come from odd places, don't they? Like people still singing that Beach Boys song for a long time. You don't hear it so much now, but that was a big one for a while. but yeah I think he scores when he wants he scores when he wants that one yeah that's that tune I think probably the most extreme example I've seen of an ultras group at the Emirates was FC Zurich who were as loud as the PSG fans when they came to town and if anyone who's seen PSG come to your stadium know that that is you can't compete with it even if you outnumber them by so so much it even happened at Anfield like it is absolutely crazy and FC Zurich were just the same it was like, oh my God, who are these people?

26:32It felt like an army declaring war. A fairly good-natured war, but a war all the same. A lovely war. It's quite incredible what fans can achieve when they organise it like that. I'll go back to PSG as an example. The way they do it, they have a guy who is essentially coordinating the chants. So you get half of the crowd singing and there's someone with a drum and then he'll move it over to the other half so those guys get a rest. And for big moments, he brings everybody in so suddenly the volume goes up. But it is mostly the same song. So after a while, it actually kind of loses its potency and it just becomes background noise.

27:13It's weird. I personally think that's quite boring. And I think it would get very boring very quickly if it was something that we saw more often here. Yeah, I think that ultimately it goes down to the question, the question is it not just simply part of English football and culture and can't be wished into existence it would take a long time but it can be done but it will take a long time because again that idea of the organisation of it I think people are very sneery in this country and it's just not how it happens what the fucking hell is that but again that is part of our culture isn't it we are a piss taking moaning people yeah Palace fans Arsenal fans for doing this have been widely mocked for what they're doing and it's just like but they still retain some of the you know when I say I mean I'm not necessarily saying I want this to happen I think if it does happen great but I don't want anybody I don't want us to lose that good old English football I mean when I saw Palace v Fulham the other week you know at the end of the game you know right dying seconds of injury time obviously a few Fulham fans start leaving you know you've seen the Palace now fuck off home you know all that kind of stuff like it's funny we don't want to lose it we've got four sides to a stadium I'm just saying one end needs to be this I think it can be done and I think what inevitably happens is you need a very, very dedicated group of people, as Palace have, they're the example we're going to a lot.

28:32Very dedicated example. There's also another example in the, I think it's in the Scottish Championship or maybe Scottish League One, and I forget which club, sorry about that. But again, a group of them just decided, we're going to make flags and banners, we're just going to bring a bit of life. And it breathes, especially if you're a lower league club, it makes your footballing experience just that little bit different, that little bit more attractive. Yeah, someone turns up for the first time and they're like, bloody hell, I want to do this every week. There's something going on here. And I think that that, I think, is really good.

28:59So if you can get a group of people who are seriously dedicated and do it, what then happens is, you know what it's like? If there's a good thing going on, people, their cynicism erodes away and they go, I wouldn't mind to be a part of that. And that's what it's going to be. And Palace are the obvious example here. So it can be done, but it'll just take a fair bit of time, Ben, and a lot of convincing. But again, once you get a bit of momentum, there is a tipping point, so who knows. Right, coming up after this is another Ramble listener cursed.

29:37Okay, we've got another question. This is from Fresh and Mindy, who sound like a dubstep act. Fresh and Mindy, love that. Yeah, yeah. Presumably Mindy from EastEnders is one of them. So yes, from Fresh and Mindy on Discord, if you could buy a secret Santa gift for any Premier League player which player would you choose and what would you buy them? Buy Rob Edwards three points. How would you go about that? Bribery. Fair enough. Yeah. I think I'd get some sort of like muscle soak for Bruno Fernandes. I know he's injured now but like is there any player in the Premier League who feels more like a mum who needs a treat at Christmas than Bruno Fernandes?

30:16Yeah, true. I think I would I I mean you couldn't buy this so I'd start a company and I would basically try and give Ruben Abram a new job he's just not having fun is he my serious answer would be though Fresh and Minty is I mean really enjoying Unai Emery throwing his jacket in the air but I would want to make that a bit more in fact I might I may even get him one of those hats that they have at universities where they will throw them in the air yes because I think the jacket is a cap yeah inevitably that's not going to happen all the time because it's a bit tricky I think save the jacket for a particularly great goal or big goal like the one against Arsenal in the last minute but give him one of those university caps because every time a goal goes in get that in the air man or maybe like like a coat rack to have just in the end of his technical area so he can throw his jacket onto it oh and that's all weather as well but loads of different jackets so if he chucks one away it doesn't matter yeah you can sort of you know if they're 7-0 up it's like who knows down to his pants what's he going to do now he's got every single one on the stand he's going to be like Robbie Williams in Rock DJ they're 10-0 up so yeah something like that David any player or manager I think I'd get Manninghain's defenders you know those leashes that children the parents have for their children right and I'd get them that so they could put a Manu Agathe because he's always just running off into mad positions that nobody wants him and Delict yeah yeah and Delict and Joruk and just go Manu back here and bring him back good I like that okay that's I think something we could all get behind there yeah and also it would you know give them further opportunity to be literally tied up in knots wouldn't it so that'd be good excellent excellent Jim you got the next question I do it is from Type1Pat on Discord who says I would like to bring the spellsy curse to the table oh on three occasions this year I've rocked up to a match wearing my favourite Speller thrusting a trophy t-shirt.

32:16A little bit of explanation on this. As you may well know, when we won the FSA award in 2024 for best podcast, Marcus did the Emmy Martinez thrusting at the trophy celebration. For the record, I did that on stage. On stage. But the photo of Victoria Derbyshire. And Sam McLeod face who had him in the world, and lots of other people, because I'm such a legend. But the actual photo I did was the official with the board behind me. Sure. But Type 1 Pat, being the hero that he is, has made this moment into a t-shirt. So he continues, the first time I wore this at a match was in Albania in January where the home side KF Tirana lost 4-0 to Ignatia.

32:55September came along and Speller brought bad luck to the mighty HNK Zadar as they fell 3-2 to Sloga at home. Now, come December and a trip to the famous old San Siro to watch top of the table AC Milan take on Sassuolo. Alas, defeat was avoided by the home team this time but a 2-2 draw was still a poor result and further extends the Speller curse. To add insult to injury, the evening before that, I attended the New Balance Arena to watch Atalanta against Cagliari without the aforementioned t-shirt. Lo and behold, the home side snatched a victory. If anybody needs me, Speller and I will be attending St.

33:28James' Park every other week watching those slugs decompose. I like decompose. You could go for melt, but no, decompose. You need to pay for this amount to go to the Etihad gym. well I always thought I had a huge influence on the game and it's quite clear that I do why have you done this? let's not let you off this lightly well I thought that I was doing a good thing that would bring a lot of cheer when I thrusted that trophy and quite clearly it is bringing a bit of cheer to away fans and they are the true fans of football and I'm a good footballing man Jim you are and you like the underdog don't you?

34:06I love the underdog I think we really need to keep track of this to see if it carries on. Well, yeah, Type 1 Pat needs to let us know whenever he... I mean, he's done a good job of letting us know all these examples, but please do keep wearing the T-shirt. I would say as well, Type 1 Pat, if you could start wearing it for games you're watching, particularly when you're a neutral, choose a game that you want to win, put the T-shirt on, see how they get on. How powerful is this garment? I wonder if it's just restricted to football as well. I wonder if, say, there's a day there's no game on and he wears it, that he perhaps has a mispack.

34:39I thought you were going to go for elections then. Or stands on a plug or something like that. Wear it out, pick a stranger, start a fight, see how you get on. By this, you might get battered. We'll know if he wins, we'll know that the curse is lifted, right? Maybe that's the way to lift the curse. I mean, I would be careful, Top 1, Pat, because, again, presumably you're not a huge fan of KF Tirana or one or two of the other sides that you've been going to see. So, yeah, like go and see your side. Well, I mean, he did say he's going to be attending St. James' Park, so maybe that's it. I don't know whether that's some clue.

35:16I can't work out whether he's... He needs to go and see Fulham play, surely, to really test it up. Maybe that's it. So he sounds like he's a fan of you more than anything. Yeah, and you can't blame him for that. Possibly Villa for the Emi Martinez reference as well. Is he a New Girls' fan or not? Because that suggests... That suggests I'm thinking, oh, he's obviously a Sunderland fan. He's a Sunderland fan, surely. He's wanting them to decon for us. Well, yeah, you would expect. But I also think he might just be pissed off with his side. So I assume he's a Sunderland fan with that. But do get in touch again because we ask people about this with certain coaches.

35:49We say that when Pete watches West Ham with his partner's father, Frank Champion, yeah, that they always lose. Or they don't win, they're poor. admittedly not always on peak that one is it yeah I was going to say this season on football curses I'm sure a lot of our listeners will be aware of the curse of Bella Goopman yes but if you're not to give a kind of brief overview of it he was manager of Benfica he got into a dispute about pay it wasn't resolved he apparently stormed out saying Benfica will not win a European trophy or the European Cup for a hundred years or something like that and then they, since then, they've had a lot of heartbreak in Europe and it's like, well, I mean, I don't believe in curses, but this one is doing the business.

36:38You know, it's doing what it promised. You have to remember, this was in the late 50s, early 60s when this happened. So it was a long, long time ago and Benfica, as you say, had won the European Cup, what, a few times probably? They were a European powerhouse at the time. Yeah, well, he himself won back-to-back European Cups as manager of Benfica in 61 and then 62. So it was quite a bold statement. but I think if you said it now, you might go, yeah, okay, safer bet. But when he did it at the time, when he sort of talked about, because, you know, I mean, he was a mad bastard. Interesting addendum to this though.

37:10Apparently in 2022, after they'd lost three UEFA Youth League finals, Benfica's under-19 team became European youth champions in 21-22. they're ever there. Yeah, well, apparently so. They're claiming it. I think you would, wouldn't you? You'd take anything you can get if you've been cursed. Well, because it was even, or whatever. Because they've been in Europa League finals. As England would. Yes, they've been in Europa League finals and I think they were going, oh, a chance to break the curse. Even though Europa League wasn't even around when Bella Goodman was. But they didn't do it and that only added to the myth and the legend of the great Bella Goodman.

37:43Why didn't they just do what Barry Fry did? What, piss in the corner of the ground? He pissed in all four corners of the pitch. Was there a reason? It was a neutral venue, David. I quite like this as well. For a final. And it wasn't quite as lengthy of a curse as the Benfica one. Got this quote from Barry. We went three months without winning. We were desperate, so I pissed in all four corners, holding it in while I waddled around the pitch. Did it work? Well, we started to win and I thought it had. Then they fucking sacked me, so probably not. Do you know what, right? I was aware that Barry Fry did that, but I never thought about the logistics because you know he pissed in all four corners.

38:18It's a long trudge. Well, it is because you would have to kind of just do a little bit of wee. And to do that four times, was walking around a football pitch. You've got to give him a bit of credit there. The man was an athlete. Yeah. It's great piss control. It is. Something that we don't associate with, you know, anybody. It's an odd approach to ending a, you know, a losing streak, isn't it? I do understand why the club thought, yeah, his answer to this was piss. I think the win might just be, might just be luck actually. Well, there was, I mean, I was about to say there was a reason why he did it.

38:51There was a, there was a, what was, you often say it was, it was the, the football ground, built on an old graveyard all these sort of bollocks you know but I forget it wasn't his original thought of yeah I think pissing in the corner of the grounds yeah the spirits are angry I mean it's about as logical as that I'll give you that I think it was a curse on the ground itself because Derby had one as well but who said it? where did this come from? I'm not too sure I think Derby's another one apparently Derby County's old baseball ground was cursed by 19th century gypsies so that was another one as well I see I see so you can curse the ground yeah but what's happening at Molineux then it could be anything yeah they need to do something George Mendes just needs to go and take a piss somewhere sacrifice Steve Ball a sacrificial ball stop giving that yeah very much that's very much what I was referring to I thought you were George George we don't want a 20 year old Portuguese winger from you this week we do need some piss yeah some Portuguese piss might do it and if that won't work then some good old English piss.

39:58Merry Christmas everyone. You know us by now, you know what you signed up to when you clicked play.

40:07Thanks for listening to the Football Ramble, part of the ACAR's Creator Network. Please do send us your responses, opinions and questions for next week's mailbag. Become a friend of the Ramble too to join the conversation over on our Discord. If you have pissed on a pitch, you know, Premier League or otherwise, then do let us know if you've got any pisscapades that involve football don't frown at me Jim or if you've gone even further have you defecated at the ground do you remember that Sunderland fan I don't think he actually did a job there was a photo of him with his trousers that was really that was really strange I don't know him don't you alright I didn't think you did I was quick to deny something there that we hadn't accused him of alright well indeed if you're that guy or you know him then get in touch but until then have a lovely Christmas and we'll see you very soon

41:09The Football Ramble is a Stack production and part of the Acast Creator Network