Book Club Meets: I could have been radicalised! ISIS brides and teen angst, with Nussaibah Younis

0:00My sweat turned cold as a group of women walked in wearing long abayas and headscarves. Welcome to the Happy Place Book Club with me, Fern Cotton. I was terrified. Today, Fundamentally, by Nuseiba Eunice. What bait-spying shit is this? said a girl from East London. The familiarity of her accent drained the tension from my body. There's nothing scary about a hijabi rude girl from Mile End. Nostalgia summoned an image of Whitechapel Market, Rosie and me weaving through, eating our brick-lane samosas after a Saturday at Spitalfields. I used to think it was the biggest dump on earth, but that was before I came to Iraq.

0:42The girl leaned on her forearms, her severe facial expression incongruous with her diamante-trimmed headscarf. I too had loved diamante headscarves back when I was religious, bringing a hint of the 90s wag to my glamorous Islamic life. Um, not spies, I promise. I said, not the most professional way to open a focus group. I took a breath and started again. Hello everyone, thanks for joining us. We're from the UN and we'd like to share some ideas and proposals with you today. But first, we'd love to hear from you about your immediate needs and concerns. Everything you say is confidential and we encourage you to be open and honest.

1:26I tried to shift my gaze around the room, but East London girl had me transfixed. Oh! She rubbed her hands together. Obviously I should trust you. The UN is definitely not a colonial conspiracy that gives fake legal cover to Western war crimes. I covered my mouth to hide a smile. I'd used those exact words as a teenager. God, my teachers must have thought I was such a prick. Fundamentally was our Happy Place book club read for December. Happy New Year, by the way. Oh, my God, it's 2026. What is going on? Let's talk about Fundamentally. It tells the story of Nadia. She's an academic who's been disowned by her puritanical mother and dumped by her lover.

2:14So she decides to get away by accepting a UN job in Iraq. Our other protagonist is Sarah. She's a precocious and sweary East Londoner who joined ISIS at just 15. And Nadia is astounded at how similar they both are. They're feisty and opinionated. They're from a Muslim background and they both love a dairy milk and rude pickup lines. This book is so, so funny. I know you might not have expected that from that description I just gave, but it really is. We've been reading along together and chatting about it on Instagram at Happy Place Book Club. loads of you adore this book come over and chat about it with me if you're a fellow book nerd now fundamentally draws on Naseiba's personal experience as an NGO worker in Iraq and an expert who was tasked with creating a de-radicalization program for ISIS brides so it was very fun getting to chat to Naseiba about this book it's her debut by the way as well we covered everything from how you'd react to having to hang out with your teenage self, to the joy of crying with laughter at a book on public transport.

3:25Right, let's do it. Here's the show.

3:49Hey Naseba. Hey Fern. I just finished reading your book, Fern. Scripted. Oh God, I absolutely loved it. Oh, it's so terrifying. It really made me laugh. Honestly, there's this scene at the rehearsal dinner where I can't remember if it's Lily or Jade. Maybe Lily says, is that salad featuring cheese? And then Jade's like, featuring. It's not a record. That's ridiculous. I am first of all I'm so kind of you to read the book it's always the most nerve wracking thing to have not only an author but a bloody good author read your book and I don't know about you but I I'm very excited when I'm writing a book but as soon as I'm writing another one I'm like oh I'm not happy with that I can do better and I'm constantly like almost putting down my old books because I'm wanting to climb the ladder of writing better each time?

4:46Oh my god I feel the exact same way so I'm writing my second book at the moment and I'm really trying to like up my game and so I've become so critical of my own writing and I miss those days. Did you feel like when you were writing your first one this kind of unbridled freedom and optimism where you were like I'm writing a book how amazing is this? Oh, yeah. And now, yeah. Wow. Now I know too much. I wish I could go back to those days. Well, it's a real feat to write a book in the first place. But yeah, a second one is certainly a tricky thing to navigate. But I need to talk about your first book because, first of all, we have just adored reading it throughout the month of December.

5:36It was, I mean, I raced through this book lolling my head off throughout the pick for December is of course your debut fiction fundamentally which is just the most sensational book and what I would love to do is do actually first of all a bit of backstory as to how this came about because Happy Place Book Club had an event in November yeah and I was interviewing Elizabeth Day and we had this lovely chat and then at the end we asked for audience questions and you put your hand up and Elizabeth and I I was so mortified because you asked us for advice and we gave you advice. And then when you came to meet us at the end and gave us your book, which we had both seen everywhere, we were like, oh, my God, we've just given you advice.

6:18How outrageous is that? We were so embarrassed. You gave really good advice, actually, because I was asking you both about how, you know, it's funny when you go from writing a book on your own to suddenly having a whole team. time you know I now I suddenly for book two I have an agent and I have an editor and I have a publicist and you know when you're writing the first time you're really on your own and now it's a question of like when do I trust my own intuition and my own goals and my gut with what I'm trying to write and when do I like listen to feedback and both of you had really good advice which was mostly about like taking everything in that people are offering but also trusting yourself that what led you to write your first book and your first book to being a success will lead you to that again yeah without a doubt yeah not to like doubt yourself which you see you guys gave me great advice well we felt like we overstepped the mark with it slightly but but we I asked exactly but we were so thrilled to receive a copy of your book and I literally got home that night and I normally go to bed super early but I was like I need to start this book I'd heard so much hype around it and I couldn't put it down from the minute I started it and I've just flown through it and it's such an amazing book for so many reasons not only is it is there some very vital storytelling within it about some subject matters that are vastly interesting but also you've managed to navigate these quite heavy subjects at times with immense humor I mean I rarely laugh out loud at a book but I was laughing my head off throughout did you know from landing on the themes and the story and the plot that you'd worked out when did you land on the tone because it could have been just a straight up serious book yeah well why didn't I lay out a bit about what the story is and then I'll talk about how I decided to write it in this bonkers way.

8:22So the novel follows a heartbroken academic called Nadia from London and Nadia's just been brutally dumped by her girlfriend and you know when you're in that situation where you're going through an awful breakup and what you should do is A, stay single and B, maybe get some therapy and what you don't want to do is any of those things um nadia decides instead of facing her demons to accept a job with the un in baghdad and i mean i can tell you from experience that like if you take a job in baghdad you will get over your breakup you will be distracted yes trying to stay alive is a great way to get over your ex and so she goes to baghdad and when she's there she is asked to design a program to de-radicalize ISIS brides.

9:18And this is crazy. Like, Nadia does not know how to do this. And so she's sort of turning to her UN colleagues for help and advice. But they are just such a ridiculous cast of characters. And they were so fun to write. I bet they were. You kind of have nepo babies and party boys and like do-gooding warriors, but not one of them is actually good at their job. So Nadia doesn't have any real support amongst her UN colleagues. And she's about to give up and just go back to London declaring defeat when she visits the refugee camp. And there she meets Sarah. And Sarah is a young ISIS bride. She joined Isis when she was 15 years old and she's so vulnerable but also funny and precocious and Nadia becomes captivated by her and just becomes committed to saving Zara, kind of regardless as to whether or not Zara wants to be saved.

10:22Now, I wanted to write a funny book. You know, I love reading funny books. Me too. And it's so rare. And your book is really funny. Scripted is so funny and it's so rare to have a book that makes you laugh out loud. I remember once going on holiday and having a Nick Hornby book on the plane. It's the one called, I love all of his books, but there's one called A Long Way Down, which is literally a comedy about a bunch of people who keep trying to commit suicide. It's just the most phenomenal book. You would think that that book would be so bleak. I was crying and shaking with laughter on the plane to the point where people were turning around I was like I actually can't read this book in public and I just knew at that point my goal in life was to just embarrass people on public transport to the point where they were like I can't read this book in public because I am making a fall out of myself and I can't tell you how many people have DM'd me saying people were literally moving away from me on the tube because I was snort laughing.

11:36If Nick Hornby can write a funny book about suicide, I can write a funny book about Isis Brides. If that's what you want to do and you're setting out to be funny, then I think you can really pull it off. It's just most people aren't trying to be funny. What's brilliant about both of those examples, your book and Nick Hornby, is that it highlights that humour is so important when it comes to actually diffusing really tricky situations in life. It's like the biggest catharsis to be able to have a laugh or at least look at the situation through the lens of humour rather than just spiralling into absolute despair.

12:16And Nadia manages that, or at least has like the one-liners that can, you know, infuse that into a situation. And equally with Sarah, I mean, their dynamic is so brilliant and they they clearly saw a bit of each other in each other and that dynamic was just such a a wonderful friendship literally from day dot what did you feel was important to explore within that friendship yeah so Nadia and Sarah are almost like sisters or like different versions of each other so when I was thinking about them I think of Sarah as like a teenage version of myself and Nadia as more like the adult version and I thought what is funnier than having to hang out with yourself as a teenager like that person would be so annoying imagine trying to tell the teenage version of yourself that they're making the wrong choices and that they need to be smarter or they need to grow up or that they're being too idealistic or that they're being naive.

13:24Imagine the way they would just chat back to you. So much annoying chat back. I can picture myself doing it. Exactly. And so the funniest scenes that I wrote are just that like chat back from Sarah to Nadia. And Nadia's just trying to help, but has that like quite patronising older sister slash UN worker vibe and tone about her. and Sarah can really annihilate her because she knows where all of her weak spots are because and I think a lot of people really identified with these characters even if they weren't child Islamists because you I think so many of us are idealists as teenagers we like have a really black and white view of the world and what's right and wrong and how we think we're going to be different and better than our parents and better than the adults around us.

14:22And then we grow up to be exactly like everybody else. And that kind of, that teenage disappointment in seeing yourself, you know, compromise and having to work at a big institution like the United Nations that, you know, you don't get, you don't get to have a job like that. and you don't get to run programs in an institution like that without giving up a little piece of yourself you know and you see that with Nadia as she's trying to make this program work and anyone who's ever worked at a big organization totally identifies with this part of the book you know you're trying to get permission and sign off and people to agree to what you're doing and you're trying to get support and at every stage you're sort of compromising a little bit and giving up a little bit and you know I think it's also a real source of comedy that big kind of those institutional nonsenses that we all have to put up with it reminded me when I was writing it of you know the thick of it yes or yes minster or even that show w1a about the bbc so many like big organizations have the same kind of infuriating procedures and they almost seem set up to make you fail at whatever you're trying to achieve yeah just dead end after dead end and seeing that in the world of international aid is is quite sobering because the work is so important and it has a real impact on people's lives and the stakes are so high but when it comes down to it you're still just a person who's working in an organisation with colleagues and having those same institutional battles and ego battles that people do at every place of work and I think people have been surprised when they have never worked abroad and certainly not worked in peace building or in the Middle East how much they've like identified with how ordinary these struggles are.

16:30Yeah. I mean, the human experience is so similar across the board. Oh, my God. I mean, absolutely. But, you know, Nadia's got this other layer where she's also culturally up against it because the rules are just different. And that there's bits of the book that are so frustrating. And you're sort of with Nadia going like, what are we going to do about this? You know, which also, Lee, I don't want to give too much away in case people haven't read the book as yet, but for anyone that's read along with us, there is at some point in the book a bit of an escape scene that had me on the edge of my seat.

17:04I was literally like, I couldn't read it quick enough. And it felt very important to have that part in the book where actually there was this immense, very fast-paced movement after Nadia had been, you know, literally bashing her head against the wall for weeks on end. Yeah, I do think, it was fun to have Nadia break free from institutional constraints people often ask me how similar Nadia is to myself and honestly I wish I had the balls I wish I wish I had the guts because I think a lot of us reach that moment where we're at the end of our tether we're trying to do the right thing and no one's letting us do the right thing and in those moments we turn to fiction where people can just throw caution to the wind and take the bold insane move that we wish that we could but yeah I mean honestly if I behaved like Nadia I would be in prison I mean it's without a doubt it the risks taken were like oh my god I was getting stressed before bed I was like um I mean obviously some of this this plot and or the theme certainly are autobiographical where's the line what did you experience what did you not experience right all the parts that make Nadia look like a terrible human being are not me important to put that out there quite quickly and all the things about her that are like funny and sexy and great that's like exactly autobiographical that's a good rule of thumb okay honestly people when i've been on this huge book tour and like i've had readers come up to me or sort of ask questions in in um at the events and they say you know it's interesting because nadia's such an unlikable character and she's so frustrating and I just wanted to shake her and I'm like all right that's me you're talking to like is this why I don't have more friends because I think she's great me too but that seems to not be the universal conclusion no because she's got a wonderful rebellious streak naturally and and what I love about her is any of that rebellion comes from a place of good heartedness.

19:36Like she wants to, she's doing all of it because she genuinely cares, not because she thinks she should. She's got this connection with Sarah and that becomes the most important thing to her. So I think for all of her faux pas, like we all have, or, you know, mishaps along the way, I was rooting for her from day one. Well, thank you, Fern. I appreciate that. Because I actually think one of the things I enjoyed doing is because I'm really like not a nihilistic person at all, even though there is real cynicism because it's a satire and, you know, it's helping you to understand the flaws of how the international aid system works.

20:16But I tried to give almost all of my characters a really big heart. And at some point, I think each of them are really trying to do the right thing. And that does feel to me true to life that, yes, people can get waylaid in all kinds of directions. But often there is like a very human and positive motivation, or they're acting from a place of pain. And, you know, it's a tricky one, because obviously, I'm writing about these young teenagers who were radicalised and were persuaded to join ISIS. And it's such a personal topic for me, because I grew up very religious, but I also grew up very politicized.

21:01You know, I was growing up at the time when we were invading Iraq, and we were invading Afghanistan. And it's funny now to think back to that, because, you know, we did kill hundreds of thousands of people across the world, for no real reason. Like, we don't even talk about it anymore. What was the put, what did we get out of invading Iraq? What did we get out of invading Afghanistan? And to me, it felt very personal because I was a devout Muslims and I was watching Muslims being killed every single day. And the people around me at school didn't care at all. It's a bit like today, if you're a teenager today, who's watching on Instagram or on TikTok, watching videos of the genocide in Gaza.

21:49It's so upsetting and so hurtful when you care about seeing these young kids being murdered and you don't know what to do with all of that pain and all of that upset and when you're very young it's so easy for you to be taken advantage of and not because you're a horrible person but because you're a person who's deeply moved and I've always been someone who's been so moved by suffering that I can imagine had the wrong people got to me at that age I could have been persuaded to do something insane like travel halfway across the world but I could have been persuaded that that was the right thing to do to help people and in the end I grew up and I did travel across the world to try and help people I just did it as an aid worker you know not as not as somebody joining a terrorist organisation because I have the chance to go to university and to learn more about the world and to figure out what the right way to do this is but when you're 15 and you're just really upset and you're seeing horrible videos online you're so vulnerable and I've always wanted to tell that story of how easy it is to fall into something like that and then how impossible it is to get back out yeah oh my god well you've got a such a sense of that with Sarah's journey I mean more than I could have even imagined.

23:17When did this idea for fiction start to form? Was it when you were out working for the UN? Was it after with a moment of reflection? At what point do you think, I've got to tell this story and it's not autobiographical and actually I can do this with humour to appeal to lots of people that might not necessarily be interested in a book like that initially? because I think it is you've landed in this amazing space where you've created an incredibly mainstream book about a subject that isn't talked about in this way at all yeah well I wrote because I used to be an academic and I wrote I wrote an academic paper and seven people read it heartbreaking and I was like oh and by the way I knew every single one of them because they're just my colleagues brilliant and like I knew I was good at writing it's just when you're writing for an academic audience that you have to write in a way that's like deliberately really complicated and I was like do you know what everybody in this country has an opinion about Isis Brides but they don't really know anything about it because you know you read a headline here and there and maybe you catch 10 minutes of a talk show but it's something lots of people are interested in and have very strong opinions about but don't really understand the emotional truth of the experience at all and so I wanted to write something that was really easy to read and really fun like I just want to write something that you want to read that you that you stay up too late reading that you're laughing at on public transport and that by the end of it actually without realizing you've thought really deeply about this topic and you understand it in a way that you didn't before so clever that you've married the two of those things because that is not easy to do like having a book that makes you deeply think but laugh out loud I think is incredibly rare and you know I worked really hard to make it happen by I literally took a stand-up comedy course I like tried out all my jokes on my like stand-up class yeah and I can tell you it was like very humiliating oh I can't think of anything worse whenever I've interviewed comedians I'm like I don't know how you do how how do you do it I don't know how anyone has the stomach for it honestly it's been quite a good um preparation for book tour which has in various times been very humiliating as an experience i've been there i get it you're like okay this audience not be laughing at my jokes today that's fine i've definitely definitely experienced this before honestly no one talks about the privilege of being at a book event and not having to be funny because people are there to listen to what could be quite a serious conversation about a book but if you are funny that's just a bonus now that's the kind of level of stand-up I'm comfortable with but I was so I was so keen to make sure that the book was like properly laugh out loud and not just a wry smile oh no it's laugh out loud you nailed it that I did actually before I sat down to actually write the book I had like pages and pages of jokes and like funny characters and funny observations like I started with the humor that's so interesting and then I took it from I took it from there because I knew that the serious stuff and the emotional stuff with this topic that was going to come easily yeah yeah yeah but I didn't want to lose sight of this being really enjoyable because I do feel like okay this is going to be a bit of a controversial take um I feel like part of the reason people are not reading so much anymore is because so many books are so boring is that bad to say i feel like the literary establishment rewards very dense and very poetic language and to the at the expense often of plot of good storytelling of wit of humor and that's not always the case there's some amazingly funny storytellers like Percival Everett and Paul Bearty absolutely hilarious no I hear you because I if I'm not if I'm not totally invested within I'm gonna say actually I'm gonna say the first two pages but actually it's the first page I I cannot continue I need to be all in with the protagonist I need to be either deeply intrigued initially or entertained.

28:09Otherwise, I'm out. I don't want to read on. Yeah. And I also think there's so much snobbery. Like, what is wrong with somebody actually really enjoying a book? Why? Reading shouldn't be hard. I don't think reading should be hard. That's something you're doing in your free time. You could be watching Netflix. You could be watching TikTok videos. But if you're sitting down to read a book, that should be a really enjoyable experience. And I just, I'm not a snob. I'm someone who, you know, I'll watch documentaries and I'll also watch reality TV and I read all kinds of different fiction, but I really value novelists who aren't trying to prove in every sentence how clever they are, but are actually trying to entertain a reader.

28:58And I wanted to do that. Look, at the end of the day, I have a PhD. I don't need to sit there in a book and be like I'm clever I'm clever I mean that's ridiculous I want to actually make people have a good time but but you've done it anyway by by managing to cover this subject with humour like that's the that's just the highest form of intelligence sort of be able to emotionally read the room and I think also knowing when humour can be applied in parts of the book, but also when it's really important that it's just bleak and there are stark moments where you feel something. I think that's so intelligent.

29:38You know, I agree. I don't want to sit there going, wait, what does this mean? Or equally, I don't want to go, God, this is slow. Like, can something just happen? I don't, I'm not a patient person. I need stuff to be happening from the get go. So yeah, I'm with you on that one. I don't think it's interesting or useful to describe the shape of a cloud for 10 pages no it's a cloud it's a cloud let's get back to the human action exactly so I'm very intrigued that you started with a notepad of characters and jokes and bits and bobs like that I wouldn't say I'm necessarily as thorough I'm writing another fiction at the moment and I've got all sorts of ideas but but some of them come out of the blue like yesterday I was having a hot chocolate with my dear friend Reggie Yates and we were in a cafe and someone very nearby us, an adult, ate a sandwich and left the crusts, which I was obsessed by.

30:33I was like, what adult leaves the crusts? I don't understand. Like, this is what my kids do. This is fascinating. I actually still do that with pizza. Oh, pizza may be slightly different. But sandwiches, I was like, so I was like, I've got to remember that for a character because that's just such a weird little quirk that I've never picked up on before. What was your experience like whilst writing the book? Like, were you kind of hypervigilant to everyone and everything going on around you? Well, do you know what was so great is that I decided I was going to write the book a year before I actually did.

31:07So I was still working in Baghdad and I was actually doing this job. I was asked to design a deradicalisation programme. And so I knew I was going to write about it. And so I spent the whole time. whenever something funny or interesting or weird happened I was writing everything down and so when that job came to an end and I had the time to write I had so much material that I'd collected but from you know from actually my time in Baghdad and so yeah it was incredible and now I'm writing a second book where I'm actually having to do research I'm like having to read books and write about something that isn't something I've exactly done it's um it's quite a different it's quite a different process I'm finding it a lot more time consuming yeah well I'm I'm sure when there's research involved without a doubt I mean this is what you alluded to at the happy place book club event that you are veering off on a tangent that perhaps the people that you're working with in the publishing world aren't expecting and that's what you want to you want to go with that's I guess got to come from an intuitive place where you feel that excitement in your gut which motivates you to write the book this next idea was that something that landed immediately something that's been percolating for some time so the new book is about a husband and wife who are fighting for control of an international peace process wow and it's also a dark comedy and what I was really interested in exploring the dynamics of a relationship overlaid over the dynamics of an international conflict and I have worked on a peace process before and it was so fascinating watching how individual egos and behaviors were having an impact on like massive geopolitical conflict.

33:07And we see this now every day because we have President Trump in office in the US. We see the capriciousness of an individual and how impactful that can be on global markets, on global conflicts. And that's something I witnessed a few years ago when I worked on a peace process. And I was like, oh my God, is this how these things happen? and I was so interested to explore it in fiction and yeah my team you know I think at the beginning I had not a very clear way of talking about it so I think they were a bit confused about what I was trying to do but I think they've left me to it which is awesome and I'm just really hoping so I'm actually about to send my editor the first 20 ,000 words and I've got all my fingers and ho's cross that she likes it but I actually have no idea how exciting I'm thrilled for you I mean for anybody out there who is either thinking about writing a book has started to write a book for their own pleasure and enjoyment obviously with the hope that they're able to do something with it have you got any advice for someone in that position I so I think it's really important to get yourself a writing group.

34:20It's so useful to have friends who are also writing and who you can share your work with for feedback. So, you know, I did a writing course when I left my job and I met a group of writers who were all in the same position as me. All of us were writing our first books. All of us were really committed to it and their feedback on my work was really helpful. and also the more you have other people reading your work really early the less precious you become and you're willing to listen with an open mind to to feedback and so I think and and the other thing is it just it can be so lonely to you know it takes so long to write a book and you're writing on your own and if you have friends who were doing it at the same time as you they love to talk about it and they love to listen to you complain yes and your non-writer friends are like mate yawn I don't care I just don't care how long you spent trying to find that adjective today this is not interesting to me I think you're so right on the feedback note because it is I found with my first book you know whenever that was eight nine years ago I was taking everything so personally like oh god why have they said that and why are they challenging me and now I'm like tell me if I want you to tell me exactly what you think of all of it so I can shape this to be the best version of this book that it could possibly be and I think you do naturally build up an immunity to it just through the experience people saying have you thought about that have you tried this this isn't working it's so key because we can get so bogged down with our own idea of like but this is how it's got to be i've imagined it but actually that's not always the best way to go about things yeah and it's also it's really nice especially when you're an early writer to have feedback from people who want you to succeed and it's like it's kind and it's helpful and it's and you're all in it together and you're all trying to achieve the same thing and that's very different from like being published and having horrible reviews on goodreads never read them never those those people don't want you to succeed which you know it's a different experience there's no point reading that stuff it's no it's nice to have that kind of because they're championing you as well and they see your potential and they want you to achieve your potential exactly so get writing friends and it's so easy there's so many writing groups online there's so many writing courses you can do and you'll meet your little team yeah and going through it with a team is much better than going through it alone yeah that's bloody good advice because it is a very lonesome activity i love that um to finish up naseba i'd love to ask you where is your happy place it can be writing or reading related or not i have a really nice bed now you're talking my language this is my this is my thing okay i have two different throws and six cushions yeah and i have a little dimmable lamp that's like i've actually installed on the wall and then i just have a big stack of books and oh most importantly now it's winter i have an electric blanket this is what i need to invest in this has been on my wish list it's gonna change it's gonna change your life yeah i can sense that's the case you might never get you might never get out of bed that could be a problem that could be an issue and especially on a wintry evening if it's really bright and sunny and cold outside and you're snuggled in bed with all your cushions and your electric blanket and you have a really good book that you're really absorbed in and it's quiet that is my happy place and it's coming up because you know I live I live in a flat and there's lots of flats around so it can be quite noisy but around Christmas everyone goes home and leaves me alone in the quiet and I can have a few days of silence to read before I go off to my own family so dreamy yeah that's it for me I love that well look what a joy it's been to talk to you and just your book provided me with so much escapism laughter learning everything in between I just loved it So thank you for writing it.

38:46And we all wish you the best of luck with your second novel. Thank you so much, Bern. This has been such a nice conversation. Naseiba, thank you so much for your time. As I said, it's just one of the best books I've read in a very long time. I raced through it and just congrats on all of your amazing success. All right, what are we reading next then? Our first book of 2026 is Hamnet by Maggie O 'Farrell. You might have seen the trailer for the film version of this story, which is out this month. It's a reimagining of the life and death of Shakespeare's son, Hamnet, and the grief his parents go through.

39:23It's completely beautiful. If you want to get properly involved in the Happy Place Book Club this year, and I really hope you do, then you can find us on Instagram, conveniently at Happy Place Book Club. OK, we're going to be back in a couple of days with someone who has a connection to my own novel, Scripted. you can see if that helps you guess who I'm going to be chatting to until then a massive thanks again to Naseba to the producer Anushka Tate at Happy Play Studios and to you I love you little bookworms

40:11Thank you.