Scott Mills: “Doing nothing is ok!” Stop feeling guilty for resting

0:00Hello, I'm Fern Cotton and this is Happy Place, which today is brought to you by British Airways holidays and I'm chatting to one of my absolute faves it's Scott Mills. I think sometimes my mind can veer towards negative rather than positive. I mean social anxiety I get a lot now and my social battery is low. My head feels a bit full up with whatever's going on and it's a well-trodden path but the gym has really helped me. When I first knew you the only arm exercise I was doing was lifting a glass of wine. Are any of you thinking, how the hell are we in late November? How the hell is it nearly December?

0:44It's basically Christmas. This year has whizzed. Like, I know it's a very cliche thing to say, but it's gone by so quickly, especially the bit between summer and now. That bit seems to have evaporated really quickly. I don't know what's going on, but whenever I feel time slipping away like this, which can feel scary, I think we can all think, oh, bloody hell, it's going too quick. Like it forces me personally to be a bit more in the moment and just not race ahead too far and think about, oh my God, what's going on at Christmas and what's happening for New Year and what's going to happen in January and what is the whole of 2025 going to look like?

1:21And actually to go, right, it's today. And in this very moment, I am feeling like this and the weather is like this and the clothes on my body feel like this. That forces me to be a bit more present. So I'm hoping I can spend December really sinking into all those lovely Christmassy smells and feelings and not race too far ahead because it doesn't do any of us any good. I think it panics us and freaks us out. So if you're with me on that one, let's be in the moment together. That's all we need to do right now. So it's handy today that British Airways Holidays are sponsoring this episode because they are trying to encourage everyone to definitely be in the moment.

2:01and for all of us to take our holidays more seriously. It's so important. There are some really shocking stats out there about how few people take their full annual leave allowance or decide to partake in a little bit of email action on a work phone while they're away, guilty as charged. We all do it. We all do it. We know we do. And that's not what a holiday is for. We've had countless chats on this show about the importance of switching off, recharging your batteries and spending real quality time with your friends and family. But I know full well that work can feel incredibly important. I get addicted to it, quite frankly.

2:40And that is definitely stopping some of us taking time out. That is something that Scott Mills knows about all too well. He talks about this a lot. Scott is, of course, a broadcasting legend. We first met, well, I think we first met on Blue Peter many years ago. might have been the late 90s I think he was doing some sort of make or something and I was on there for some reason as a kids tv presenter doing something and then of course we got to know each other way better when I joined Radio 1 and let me tell you as I'm sure you can imagine we had lots of fun because Scott and I were on Radio 1 in the era where it was the wild west anything went we had so much fun we had so many parties that would start on air and then go on into the wee hours i've got memories of scott dancing on my sofa singing into probably a phone or a hairbrush to mariah carey all i want for christmas we've had some right laughs and he's currently the reigning winner of celebrity race across the world alongside his husband sam so oh my gosh does he know a thing or two about traveling and switching off from the real world because they take your phone from you.

3:49Right, here we go then. This is the show.

4:13Hi Scott Mills. Hello. Scott Mills, I am so happy we're doing this today. So am I. You're the first guest. We've been going for over six years. I think it'll be seven in the new year. And I have never before had a guest bring their own set of notes. I do like to prepare. Do you know who absolutely berates me for that? Ryland. Right. When we do Eurovision. He's like, put the notepad away. I just like to prep. I'm the same as you. Yeah, I know. I mean, I'm not a screen person. I have a pen and a paper. I have to have it written down. Is that something that you would still do daily for radio? Yeah.

4:49Really? Yeah, yeah. I mean, there is a lot on screens now. Yeah. But I still weirdly feel safer with paper. Do you know what I mean? I do. It's more reliable. It's not going anywhere. No, exactly. And there's something lovely about the process of writing. And I think it helps your memory hold on to those words. If I write it down, I can remember it. Same. Yeah. We are the same person. We are the same. What's going on? Well, we've known each other many a year. So, I can't work out how long. I was trying to think about this the other day. It's over 20 years. It's over 20. It's over 20 years. And this is why I'm excited about today's chat, because I feel like I know you.

5:27Yeah. But of course, like anybody, even close friends we've had for years, even members of our family, there's still stuff that we are yet to uncover because you haven't had that particular conversation or you haven't got onto a certain subject matter. And that's what excites me about chatting. And also, that's what's great about this show is because when are you ever going to really have that chat? You don't. You're not going to have that on Christmas Day, are you? With your family. It's too awkward. It's a bit in depth. But it's even weird with your friends because you'll have like a certain type of pattern that you know you go to.

5:59You know, you'll chat about something you saw yesterday. A bit of gossip. But actually, to get down to not just like the nitty gritty, but to really know someone. It's a really extraordinary conversation to have. I'm very lucky that I get to do this regularly. But I wonder, obviously, there'll be many listeners of your radio show. You've been doing daily radio since, what, 1998? No, before that. Before that. Radio One since 1998. Unreal. My first show was on a local station where I'm from in Southampton when I was, I'd only just turned 16. So this is the thing. there will very likely be people listening to this that have listened to you since then that feel like oh I absolutely know Scott he's with me every day but of course for your own sanity you have to keep stuff back there has to be parts of you that are not for work I think on a daily show a lot ends up on air but you are you have to keep something back for yourself you can't put it all on what bits of yourself do you hold back or what which bits of yourself don't people see or here i think sometimes and we cover this on um i did a race across the world this year yeah um with my husband my now husband and that was quite an exposing show i think sometimes my mind can veer towards negative rather than positive kind of glass half empty a little bit so i wouldn't have now and my dad is a bit like that too it's kind of like oh worst case scenario stop worrying about everything so worrier a worrier and can also sometimes i have to be snapped out of it i can go a bit negative sometimes which i said on the on the show as well on race across the world um you probably wouldn't know that about me i wouldn't i mean i saw glimpses of it on that show there was a bit that's jumping out at me now is when you missed a bus and you had like a nine hour wait yeah on race across the world and you were being really down on yourself about it whereas sam your husband was like trying to G you up and go like it's going to be okay but that's what he does not on a daily because it doesn't happen every day but quite a lot where he's like I think you're saying this that maybe look at this a different way so yeah that that's probably something you don't know I want to talk more about race across the world in a bit but I'm I'm interested in this mindset because with the job that you've got doing radio daily it is sort of I mean obviously there's like lots of prep as we know and there's a structure to it but it is the wild west in terms of where things go anything could happen yeah you could think of something randomly a caller could say something a guest could say something it is quite terrifying doing live radio i think you've got a practice level of comfort with it but if your glass half empty when things aren't going well how are you keeping on course with the job at hand um you're right to a certain extent it is planned but there is a lot that's on the hoof we had somebody watching the show this week who was quite high up at the BBC and they just wanted to see how it all works and uh and um they came away saying I'm quite surprised how you know on the hoof a lot of it is because you don't know you can start with a subject or or a certain direction but it could go that a different way compared like with a caller yeah or anything that happens but I love that spontaneity and you have to remember I've done this every day pretty much since I was 16 years old.

9:26So to me, it is like breathing. It doesn't terrify me at all. I love it. It's the best part of my day still. And let me say this. I have a confidence on the radio that I have never had on the TV. Really? Yeah. And see, and this is where we are different because I would watch you on television and go my god I wish I could do that as well as her because it feet I don't know if it's true see we're already finding out stuff I don't know if it's true but you were so effortless at it and it appeared even if it was live that you have no fear now that's what I'm like on the radio until very recently. I mean, the last five years, I have achieved it if and when I do a bit of telly.

10:24But it used to terrify me. And if you watch old, I did do a couple of Top of the Pops, but if you watch, and they were recorded, but if you watch them, you can see the fear in my eyes. I was dreadful at it. I mean, it's no different. If anything, it's easier because like you say, on radio, it requires you being really quick thinking and sharp and dynamic. Whereas in TV, a lot of it, you just read an auto cue. You just switch off. I know. I don't know why. And I think it's because it's the self-consciousness of they can see me. And I've not always been comfortable growing up with how I looked. Maybe it's that.

11:00It's definitely a confidence issue. But there are clips of me where I'm literally gripping hold of a mic and doing this. and I look terrified because I am. Well, it's scary. My first Top of the Pops was when I just joined Radio 1 because I think they were like, oh, you're on Radio 1, you look young, you've got spiky hair. You're musicky. Yeah, you look young. You've got frosted tips. You've got frosted tips. And I was like, all right. Was recorded. Even though it was recorded, no one gives you that training. No. No one told you. I mean, I knew how to do the radio, which is why I'd got to Radio 1 and which is how I got on Top of the Pops.

11:37but no one tells you how to do it before. They just assume. Yeah, I know. So I remember this massive, huge, they're called a jib. The cranes, they're so scary. The jib camera, like, coming towards me, and I was like, oh, I better speak. And there was a crowd around, remember, at the beginning. Oh, yeah. And I went, it's Thursday, it's still number one, it's top of the pops. And then everyone cheered, recorded Link, and then I went to the loo, and I was sick. No way. Physically sick. wow yeah it terrified me that much and then obviously it was on air the next night and I couldn't get my head around it like how am I on the tv after EastEnders and I was watching it like this like I couldn't watch it and still now I don't I'm not that comfortable I don't like watching myself back no I mean at times you haven't got a choice because you've got to watch something for an edit but I think we're so cruel to ourselves and like nobody else would be picking things apart that nobody else would even see I'm really interested so with this I'm it made me so happy hearing you say how much you still love doing radio every day I think that is such a joyful thing to hear and that you've cultivated over the years this natural confidence where you feel so comfy in your skin doing that role I do do you have the same level of confidence in your everyday life not at all really no I am naturally quite a shy person I I would normally hold back.

13:07Sometimes, I mean, social anxiety, I get a lot now. And I don't know about you, but I get to the point where my social battery is low. Oh, yeah. and my head feels a bit full up with whatever's going on not the radio life you know like my mum's not been well recently or there'll be something else going on or something else to worry about and you and then combine that with quite a lot of work because I do work hard you are a machine I like to think so you really are though I've never seen anything like it so you've got all that going on and you're doing the radio every day and sometimes people will say hey do you do want to like if it's a group of people it's different to one person if it's a group of people of late i'm like i don't i don't really want to do that because i just feel do you know what i mean by my social battery being low daily yes like i absolutely have to be totally on my own yeah my counter it and i also have to have times like last week i went on holiday because i just call it my head being full up do you know what i mean i can't i can't put any more in Oh, I can't have any more in there.

14:19So me and Sam literally went somewhere sunny for a whole week. I locked my phone in the safe. Best thing ever. And he only he had the number to the safe. And it was the best thing ever. Can you relax? Because I think, you know, I can definitely be a bit of a workaholic. I'm for sure. I feel extremely lucky that I really enjoy what I do. And I'm constantly excited and challenged. I don't feel anywhere near complacent. I could always do better. I could always work harder. And I could obsess about it all day and frame it as quite a positive thing. So then when I switch off, I can find that tricky.

14:57Can you totally relax? Takes me a few days. Last week, Sam was like, I think it was maybe the, so we went for a week and it was maybe the Tuesday or the Wednesday where Sam was like, you literally just need to do, like doing nothing is okay. Because I was starting to have a little thought of like almost feeling guilty that I was spending my days doing nothing. Because actually what we did do was go to breakfast. Then I went to the gym because that's my thing at the moment. And then we just laid on the sun lounger all day. And then sometimes we didn't even make it to dinner. We had room service.

15:40Oh, the dream. The dream when your head's full up, right? but even then I reckon it was Wednesday before uh and you can tell because I bite my nails but they are there are no nails so even on Tuesday Wednesday I'm like yeah he's like you need to chill but I'm like but we're not doing anything he's like that's okay that's the point of it but I think you get so used to being on this um and I I love it by the way and I always have but you're on a treadmill of a lot of work and stuff and it's hard to stop it's really hard to stop I think when and especially when you've done it for as long as we have you're almost conditioned that this is how I operate but actually I think as we get older we do change and we do realize we've got to look after ourselves you know when you're younger you can obviously just like keep working go out partying you can have a dead social battery and you're fine but actually I think as you get older do you go, do I want to feel like that?

16:35I actually would like a bit more balance rather than this crazy rollercoaster the whole time. I need to, and I do factor in, time for just me. And that can be something really simple for me. Not involving Sam. It'll be, okay, I've got Friday morning free. I'm literally going to pop to Rickmansworth and have a little look. My nan used to live in Rickmansworth. He got the aquadrome. Right. walk around there with my dog or just go on my own like i mean this i was gonna say have a mooch there's not really any shops anymore but just have a coffee and just chill it can be something as simple as that where i'm just doing it or go and have massage or something but i do do this now whereas even 10 years ago no i would not but you've still got that little niggling voice that says, ooh, is this alright?

17:28Is this okay to relax? I remember thinking it last week. I was just sat there on my balcony and I was like, I should be like, wow, this is weird. We're not doing anything. I think so many of us have fallen into this trap. I mean, this episode is sponsored by British Airways Holidays and their whole thing at the moment is how do we take holidays seriously? Because if we're going to bother to book them, we might as well really lean into it and really take it seriously. So putting your phone away is one thing how else might you take it seriously well holidays i think are one of the most important things in this job that you must do yeah i know that a lot of people i mean you know when we're not working in kitchens for 12 hours a day we're not we're not nurses but it does require a performance you're on every single day and more goes into it than people think i don't just turn up for two hours we're on from 7 a.m going what should we do today because it's a treadmill it's a show every every day and i want to put on my best show every day and then you'll go from that to doing a podcast or you'll be like i had some photos to do yesterday for comic really like There's more stuff than the listeners ever hear and more prep than the listeners ever hear.

18:50And I think if you don't take a holiday, for me personally, I get stale. Yeah, you can't beat your best. I'm not on my A game. And that week off that I just had was really simple and it was only a week, but I needed it. And I feel the benefit of it now so much. Do you know what I think you also need a break from? and I do in my own way, and I'm sure many people who work in a public facing role need, is a break from feedback. Because one of the things that I found shocking going from TV as a teenager to then moving into radio in my 20s was that the feedback is instant. You know, what people I suppose might not know also is that not only do we usually, well, I used to have Twitter open when I was on Radio 1 or X, whatever the hell it is now, but you have a text board which is constantly coming in with messages.

19:42Of course, you get loads of amazing feedback and super engaged listeners who want to be part of the show and know you and know how the show works. But also, of course, you get dickheads. You get people who just want to, like, cause you stress for no reason. And I think it's really hard to not take that on board. Well, I found as part of the not having the phone thing, which, by the way, I learned from Race Across the World, because they take your phone off you for five weeks and I was fine. I don't know what you think is going to happen to you when your phone is not there. like we never used to have them I know and we got on fine when we were kids we never had them right we just we just came in when our mum told us to come in for dinner and we stuck to arrangements that we made when you were two and you would go so that during that show where someone actually puts it away and you don't know where it is that has now allowed me to do what I did last week and put it in the safe which I have never done before my phone is always next to me my screen time Fern you would hate it It can be 10 hours.

20:42I mean, mine's not great. Mine's not great. Especially if I'm trying to multi-skill and do this and answer emails. Eight hours is minimum. Really? It can be up to 10, 11. What's your thing? What's your weak spot? Is it Instagram? It's actually a lot of doing work stuff. Prepping for work. Wanting to do the best show. But then I can go down a bit of an Instagram road. or just scroll absolute nonsense on TikTok. Yeah, yeah. But we need that as well. Do you know, the other day, I was talking to Will Young. We love Will Young. I love Will Young. And we were just voice noting and he said... He does really good voice notes.

21:26Really good. And I can't remember, he was like, oh, he was like, I was feeling a bit rubbish recently, so I just bought loads of stuff. And I'm like, oh, I can relate. Yeah. Because that's what you do. Let's just be honest. It's like COVID. like buy something crap. Yes. Like I don't need a duster that goes between the blinds. No but I'm getting one. But I'm getting one from TikTok. Actually I need one of those. Right I've got one. Okay. I've got two. So I've become obsessed with TikTok shop. Do you know there's a shop on there? Do you know what? I've refrained from getting TikTok on my phone because I know how my brain works and I would be hooked.

22:03I wouldn't do anything apart from watch it. Mate it's like I can't. They know what you like and they throw it at you. I know that's called an algorithm. But it's like, let's say that, mate. Let's say I love sequins. Literally, they're listening. You'll be scrolling and it'll be like, here's some sequins. Oh, you like these sequins, don't you? Then there'll be someone, remember like QVC back in the day, on a live, TikTok live, going, sequins, you want some? Here they are, half price for you right now. Like on a market store. I'm such an old person, I don't know any of this. This week I introduced Will Young to TikTok Shop.

22:39Now he can't get off it. You are an awful person. He was like, what do you mean TikTok's got a shop? And I was like, if you just go on the left at the bottom of the screen, there's an icon. So sorry. Good luck, Will. I like the honesty of that because I get asked a lot when I'm doing panel talks or talks in workplaces, whatever, about, you know, like what my wellness routine is, whatever. And I'm like, well, some days I'll do yoga. But then I will go and eat peanut butter out of the jar with the spoon. And then go and buy two pairs of shoes I don't need. And then go on Instagram for way too long.

23:16We're all just trying our best. The pressure is too much. Yeah, we're trying to work it out. And I think, I tell you what, I know it's a well-trodden path. But the gym has really helped me. Has it? It actually has. When did that start? When I first knew you, Fern, I definitely wasn't going to the gym. No. I mean, the only arm exercise I was doing was lifting a glass of wine. A little vino. Uh-huh. So it started actually probably in my 30s. Right. First time I actually did some exercise. But then I did half marathons. I got really into running. And now I have a trainer and I try and stick to as much as my schedule allows three times a week.

23:59Brilliant. And I do it not, it's not actually aesthetic. It's to, I just feel better when I've left mentally than I do sometimes when I arrived. So that has been, I see last week, I would never go to the gym on holiday. I went every day. Wow. And people are like, why are you doing that on holiday? I don't know. It just sorts me out. Yeah, it makes your head feel good. I'm the same. I'll do some sort of movement because I know I'll fall into the trap otherwise, especially on holiday without all the distractions of overthinking everything and if i can feel a bit more like i'm in my body if that makes sense like i'm more physical than i am cerebral then i am going to have a better day it it makes sense so that's brilliant that it's working i love i love it because it's an hour where your phone's in a locker um i'm with a trainer or i've been getting into like doing uh spin classes or boxing is really good because it's all you are thinking about for one hour you if you're doing that you haven't got time to or do this exercise and there's someone telling you and chatting to you you're not thinking about work you're just thinking about that in that moment and for me it works there's also probably something quite nice about for you specifically having a trainer because when you're on the radio you are sort of conducting the whole thing and you're telling the audience how it's going to go you're having to surrender in that moment to an hour of being told what to do which is probably quite refreshing well I introduced my trainer who's just literally around here um to Zoe Ball and she she just calls me her fixer so she's said it's one of the best things she's done yeah like she is she thanks me all the time thanks so much for introducing me to JT because um you know Zoe's not had a great time of late And once again, it's that thing where you go in and it's an hour for you.

25:58And she says it's changed her life. Well, I mean, this is probably no surprise to anyone, but I think it's really important for us to tell everybody listening that she is as lovely as you could ever have hoped or imagined. And I grew up being obsessed with Zoe. Me too. And she was my hero. How can I be like her? And she is the loveliest human ever. I think what you see on the television is it. And sometimes that's not the case with people. Sometimes it's the opposite. That's not for on air. But it is. But I love her. She is chaotic and she's funny and she's brilliant. But at the heart of it, she is a lovely, lovely person.

26:47I mean, when I was at Radio 1, four days in, She didn't turn up for the breakfast show. So I had to do the breakfast show. I love that era of Zoe. Four, I know. Four days in. And we, obviously, we laugh about it now. But... That era of Zoe was so fun. So good. Do you remember the kind of... Reckless. Yeah, the cowboy hat. The cowboy hat. The bottle of Jack. The bottle of Jack Daniels. It's iconic, that picture. I need to put that on the mood board. It was in the 90s. She is so amazing. So, look, when we were... Well, I was planning this chat, which is always a weird sort of start for me research-wise when I know the person.

27:24What are the rules here? What are the boundaries? Where do we go? And I actually ended up voice noting you and just sort of fleshing out what we might want to talk about and where we might go. And one really interesting point that you brought up was, first of all, that actually this year is proving to be the happiest of your life. I think, if not the happiest, it's definitely top two. So good. But if you think about it, so I did Panto last year for the first time. I loved it. You loved it. Right. I can see how that's up your street. Oh my God, I loved it. Yeah. I'll tell you who told me to do it.

27:56You wouldn't force me. Gok, I didn't speak to, but I know that he would have been a real advocate. He's like a merman this year or something. I know, but he loves it, right? He loves it. Vernon Kay said to me, Milsy, you'll have the best time. That's a terrible impression. He's like, do it. You will love it. And I'm like, ah, did it. Loved it. Loved it. So you were on Swansea this year. So Swansea this year. Last year in Leicester, I met a whole group of people that I would never have met. I would have met them. Like people that now I still speak to. That's so nice. Shout out to Jack Ballard, the dame from last year.

28:32We're like that now. So good. But like, you know, I wouldn't have met people. I'm not from a theatre. We don't do theatre. It's still theatre. People can be sniffy about Panto. They're still working actors. Of course. So I did that. That ran until first week of January. Then in February, I found out I was doing Race Across the World. Then in March, I did Race Across the World. Then it was Eurovision in Sweden. Then I got married on the 1st of June. Then there was a little bit of a dip. Yeah. And then Race Across the World went out on the TV. So then all that that you did months ago is like, then you're suddenly like on the telly every week.

29:14then I did Zoe's show for six weeks and this has been the first time this year that I've been able to which is why I went on holiday last week where I've been this year has been a mad one but it has also been I think one of the best how brilliant now one of those reasons I'm sure is because of your amazing husband Sam amazing and we I mean you can see your he's so lovely I've not even met Sam I need to meet Sam. You do. But even watching him on Race Across the World, just you can see your lovely dynamic and how you're so perfectly matched. And we were actually saying on voice note when I was prepping this that he's really gotten you into a good place or certainly been instrumental in you tweaking a few things that you felt weren't quite right.

29:58Absolutely. So quick background. I don't want to bore you. Not what this is for. I met Sam eight years ago. Friend of a friend situation. And I was smitten. immediately he was funny he was kind so handsome handsome smile welsh oh the dream um and we started chatting his friends for actually ages and then it kind of it became a little bit more but it was kind of victorian a bit more oh i like that slow it was like there was nothing going on it was sometimes you know slowly moved on to occasionally you'd be in the back of a taxi and I'm like, oh, we're touching hands. This is my favourite. A very slow build.

30:42Heaven. Yeah, so it was all very kind of conservative. Yeah, proper. We were courting. Courting? It was that. Like all your gran used to say. I was courting your granddad. We were courting. I was courting him. And that was it. That's so good. Yeah. And then, so that went on for a while. We just used to, he was still in Wales. We used to meet up most weekends. It was Gavin and Stacey. I'd go to Wales or he would come here on a coach. And I wasn't on the coach. No, darling. I was on the show.

31:20But then he found it all too much. He'd not long come out of a relationship. And I went in too much too soon because I had fallen. So did you think that was the end? here's what happened i really messed it up and i thought that i was doing a lovely thing i said to him shall we go on holiday just for a weekend weekend away and he was like yeah so i took him to nice lovely but then when you get to nice you have if you want to go to monaco you must have done this, you have an option to get a taxi or a helicopter. Never done this. To be honest, this is true, the taxi is more expensive than the helicopter.

32:12Whoa. So before you know it, Sam's in a helicopter flying to Monaco. Too much. That is very extra. It's extra. Oh my God. But I was like, I'm in love with this guy. I'm doing the right thing. But he was panicking internally? Right, he was panicking. What are you doing, Fifty Shades of Grey? what are you doing? Now, I'm like, it was too soon. I mean, I would have loved it. I know. Invite me next time. Right. But it was all going too quick and it was too much. And so, fair play to him. He said to me, I'm finding this a lot. And then, I went into, shut down. I was like, I actually remember going, it's like me and girls, I've got enough friends, thanks.

33:00Oh, yeah. That. Yeah. we've all said that you're protecting yourself yeah does it hurt and then I absolutely took him off my radar for six months did you I was like I'm afraid I was like I was honest and so was he but I was like I I know you're finding it too much but I feel a lot for you so I'm gonna have to step back here and for six months I did not text him or call him and I don't know how and it was horrible horrible horrific i was in tears you're still having to go on the radio hi everyone that's the downside to this job i've done that it's horrible things happen life happens you split up with people people get born people die you're on the radio every day i mean obviously you can take time off but yeah but can you i think that pressure is so much that you don't i mean i i went through all sorts of horrendous shit and we're still going morning and dying inside and it is it's so jarring and quite draining so but you've got that heart aches that is the thing and i was going through major heartache but weirdly somewhere deep down i thought to myself he he's gonna have a break now and he's gonna actually i don't know why i thought this it was like a gut feeling he's gonna go away and think, oh, actually, that was really fun and I kind of miss it because we were so good together.

34:29And I thought that if he did do that on his terms, then he would be the person I would marry. And so he reached out to you? I want to say almost to the day, six months later, I got a text going, hey, it's Sam. um i'm just in so and so place today where we had been together and uh i really miss you then since i found out that um he spoke to his mom who he's quite close to and she i mean you do not mess with susie oh you don't mess with her not with susie born and he she's like what's going on with Scott then and he was like oh texted him and she was like don't you dare mess that boy around again if you want to do it go and do it but if you are not sure about it don't do it because you've messed him around enough I love her you're a good mother-in-law aren't you I really have she's got your back but she saw how upset I was yeah and she did like me and i'm i'm so close to them that's so lovely and like we literally there's a whatsapp shout every day i speak to sam's dad more than sam speaks to his dad every day um but she was just looking out for me and she wanted to make sure that sam was in the right place and i knew i knew that if i if it could work i knew i would marry him And I used to think that was something from some rom-com.

36:15Like, that doesn't happen. And also, what's quite interesting is it's happened a bit later in my life. And people that I speak to, friends, and also when Race Across the World went out, viewers were messaging me going, do you know what? This has actually given me a bit of hope. Because at the moment, I feel a bit lonely and I'm on my own. I'm in my late 30s, 40s, 50s, whatever. And I haven't found that person. And it made people feel, oh, that can happen. Because it's happened to me. But I was getting to the point where I didn't think it would. Yeah, well, I think that's weirdly our culture pushes us to think that if we haven't met someone by like 20, we're fucked.

37:04I think it's different in our industry because and in London, I think people have kids later. their career career but definitely outside of London it's like well what you're 28 and you don't have a partner yet yeah it's you know what we have babies yet I know we had Zandra Rhodes on a while back and she met the love of her life at something like 58 59 right and was passionately in love with him and I just think it people need to hear those stories and need to hear agree that sort of messaging that they should hold out hope and that they will find someone so when you got back together and you realized okay this is probably it now what did you experience changing in yourself for the better turns page um gets his notes out uh yeah um before sam i just think i was feeling a bit lost a bit like what now work is has always been great i've been so lucky um but i did have this feeling of like as we were just saying like when am I going to meet somebody because I am better together I think with the right person not with the wrong I mean no one is with the wrong person and that's happened but um I was starting to think as a lot of people do well when is that ever going to happen and how what am I supposed to do am I supposed to go out to a to a bar am I supposed to go on an app or you know dating online am I supposed to go to some party in London which I'm not being rude will be full of media people that's only because once again going back to my social battery I find it too much and actually I don't particularly want to date somebody who's in the London media scene I don't know why I just don't it's too close to home Yeah, you need something outside of that.

38:56So I'm not being rude on that at all. I just thought, well, how can this happen? And do you know, when we got married this year, Ryland was there. And he's kind of, and he won't mind me saying this, he said it publicly. He's a bit in the same boat. He's been single. He was married. He's been single for a while now. And he came to my wedding and he was like, he cried a lot. And he was like, this is so lovely. and then I saw him tweet recently like where where do you find is there some where's all the nice boys at like where's the nice men is there some town square that you go to or a town square I think that's what he put on the message and he would like he is one of my best friends he is the most loyal kind funny generous people you will ever meet I love that man so much and I would like him to meet the right person but I think the wedding was like he was really happy for me but also I felt like it was a bit tinged with but that leads you on to the next thing and I was feeling a bit the same if you're in the public eye how does that happen how he's really famous yeah so if you and i a bit the same for me but less how do you trust people who what do they what do they want who are they you're you're right to be suspicious yeah but you don't want to be suspicious because you want to let your guard down for somebody otherwise it's never going to happen them but how do you know that they don't want to be with you because you're that person and that they love a bit of fame because it happens a lot of course I mean you don't know you have to take a risk you do have to take a risk um and you know he he's been a bit burnt already so yeah so um And I was feeling the same as that.

40:59I was like, with a certain level of public profile, however big or small it is. I mean, people know my voice more than my face. And I'm, by the way, really happy with that. I can take my bins out in my pajamas. No one cares. Just don't open your gob. Literally. That is true. Yeah. Until you, also, when you go on TV, like Race Across the World, suddenly, it's instant. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I can see how it used to be, like for people on X Factor how overwhelming that would be. It's like that the next day. You'll be in the coffee shop and people are like, I saw you last night. The next day. But until then, here I am on the radio every single day since I was 16.

41:38No one cares. Go out with Rylan for a night. Oh my God. Crazy. It's crazy. And he's really tall. He can't hide. You can definitely see him coming. He can't hide. Right? And I love going on nights out with him. It's the most fun. But over 50 % of it is him having selfies. Yeah. Or us having to leave an area because it's getting too crowded. He's not going to meet someone like that. Probably not. No. I mean, I hold out great hope for him because, as we all know, he's an amazing catch and he's going to meet the love of his life. But he's always to me, and he won't mind me saying this. He's like, yeah, but when?

42:19And that's what I was like. My friends would say, Scott, it will happen, and it has. Yeah. But in your head, you're going, yeah, but when? Or you're saying to your best friends, yeah, but when? And they don't have the answer to that. No. You've got to trust. And thank God you have, because it seems like you are in just the most divine place. Well, as I said, I was feeling like I was doing the radio every day, Radio 1, working with Chris Stark, who I obviously he was like he was the celebrant of my wedding. He's one of my best friends. I still miss working with him every day and miss seeing him every day.

42:53He actually texted me last week saying that he misses working with you just in our passing converse. Oh, did he? Yeah. I do really miss him. Yeah. But the radio was fine. Always fine. Work fine. But it's that thing where you're coming home in the evening and you're like, right, what now? So, and I'm not very good at being like, right, I'm going to sit down and watch Bergerac. Not that because that's not been on for years. Bergerac. I'm going to watch the Vicar of Dibley box set. I'm going to watch all of Heartbeat on my own. I'm just not that guy. So of an evening, you know, you phone people and just like, it's not like a poor me situation.

43:37I just felt like something was missing, that it was time to meet somebody. And then, of course, so what I would do instead, and you will remember this so well because it's what we did. You just go to the pub. This is interesting about our age category is a lot of people, not necessarily people that just worked at Radio One, but I think our generation. We did grow up with drinking being such a huge cultural part of how you socialised. And now that we're that bit older, that is where there's this interesting sweet spot of you're not an alcoholic. You haven't got a drink problem per se, but you're drinking too much, too regularly.

44:17More than you realise. More than he was and more than is making you feel okay. Yeah. That's a weird one because there's no label for that. No, but it's not like, you're right, it's a weird in-between bit. You're not an alcoholic because I don't need it. I'm not craving it at eight o 'clock in the morning. But I am probably drinking every day or every other day. and we grew up in the lad ladette culture where it was like i'm also like i'm not this is not me being on my high horse because i hardly drink anymore i still do and i have got not got a horse to get off i mean as you know i was the i was the first one at the bar and the last one there yeah um but i've read recently i was i was thinking about this the the heaviest drinkers now are age 40 to 65 that makes sense and this is I think the reason that nightclubs are on their ass that night clubs don't really exist anymore there's a few yeah but not really not like back when we were at no and and we are of this time and I'm not making excuses for it but it was celebrated as well it's like you were wasted last night and it's like and it was really funny and it was funny we had really good fun but things have changed and they had to change for me what you also notice is when you go into any card shop still for adults cards for grown-ups are like have a gin-tastic birthday.

45:57It's beer o 'clock. Prosecco ladies night. Happy beers day. Yeah, how weird. Or, you know, people of our age, mums with the signs up in the kitchen, like it's wine o 'clock. Wine o 'clock. This house runs on happiness and Prosecco. Oh Christ, it's so a thing. It's a thing. But I think it's so good. It's not a bad thing. No, it's not a bad thing. But I just couldn't continue that. No, and Sam's really helped you, which is so wonderful. I'm just at a level where, like last week, I didn't drink at all. I don't need it. And it was making me feel horrible sometimes. And I had a brilliant time. We all did.

46:39But I couldn't continue that. No. And I just knew if I wanted to make it work with Sam, which I do and did then with all my heart, it would end up having a negative effect in the relationship. And this happens a lot. Oh, yeah. It happens so often. So I stopped for a while and now I'm in a place where I can have one glass or two drinks and then all good. Or I just don't. Yeah. And I have that control. And, I mean, as you know, I used to, I mean, I was the white wine queen. You were the white wine queen. I was known for it once again, celebrated on Radio 1. It was like we talked about it all the time.

47:28All the time. But then I saw Annie Mack and she was like, babe, white wine is the devil. It is. It's the devil. It brings up the worst in all of us. I want to talk a bit more about travel before we wrap up because we've touched on the importance for you certainly with your hectic life, having that break and that holiday. It's a must. Are there still places you would love to go to that you've not visited? well I tell you when I did the CV show South America was on my list so lovely oh my god it's amazing so on the race across the world show if you've never seen it they give you very little money they drop you somewhere they fly you somewhere and go off you go take your phone away so you've got a bit of money and a map and that's it and you've got to navigate your way around in In our case, South America.

48:17And also South America doesn't really have trains. So it's all buses. So we were on like 25, six hour buses, which they didn't show on TV. Annoying. Oh, that feels pointless. Boring, boring to watch. Right. But they do it in the voiceover instead. It's like Scott and Sam take a 26 hour journey on a bus from Brasilia to Sao Paulo. It's like, show that bit. It was horrible. It was awful. But I get it because it's just me on a bus. Sitting there. It's not interesting to watch. No. But I saw a lot of South America. We saw all of Brazil pretty much, then into Argentina, Uruguay, which I absolutely loved and would go back in a heartbeat, like colonial, completely different to Brazil and Argentina.

49:00And then it all ended on the coast in the west of Chile on the top of a volcano. Wow. Brilliant. What an experience. And it made me think, I was too busy trying to be or being on the radio. It made me a bit jealous of people that did the gap year or went traveling. I didn't do that. I know because we were both the same. I know. But that, I mean, it was like a gap year, but more moments of darkness. More overflowing toilets on buses. More moments of darkness. But it was the closest I'll ever get to having that gap year. 20 or more years later than I should have done. But it has made me want to see more places.

49:49I've been lucky enough to, I think I've seen most of Europe. I also get to travel to places that you wouldn't necessarily think of because of Eurovision. Yeah. Sweden, I love Sweden now. I've never been to Sweden. Oh my God, you would love it. I'm desperate and everyone's so gorgeous. Yeah, but that, I only discovered that through having to go there for work. Yeah. for Eurovision. I've been back countless times since. Really? Because I love it. So it was in Sweden this year in Malmö. Malmö. Malmö, which is in the south. Stockholm, you would love. Why have I not been? I don't know. That's going to be my next one.

50:26It's right up your street, though. That's my next trip. Everything is clean and organised. Everyone is so beautiful. The clothes are... Everyone is well-dressed. I mean, they're all in black and grey, but... But fine. Fine. Get me there. Monochrome. Where else would I like to go? Well, we're going to Switzerland next year. I know that because Eurovision's in Basel. I've been to Thailand. I would quite like to go a little further. I've never been... That's a lie. I've been to Australia for four days. And that is because I went on the I'm a Celebrity Extra show. Oh, yeah. Where they fly you out.

51:04And you're not in the show. But they... You just chat about it. They flew you out to Australia to chat about it. But you don't see anything apart from where I'm a celebrity is. Yeah, it doesn't count. I would love to go back there because I have been Australia obsessed since I was about 11. Neighbours? Because of Neighbours. Sure. And Home and Away. Yeah. And then everything since. Yeah. I am obsessed, obsessed with Australia to the point where me and Sam are like, that needs to be our next place. And it needs to be a bit, because it's far. A long one. It's a long one. And a visit to Ramsey Street.

51:39is that still there right so listen how much I love it I've already planned the whole trip so the cast of Neighbours came in recently yeah to my show Dr. Carl I love Dr. Carl and Paul Robinson yeah were in they were like because it got cancelled but now it's back on it's back on they're like mate anytime you're in Melbourne we'll give you a personal tour so that's already in the bag and sometimes I message Stefan Dennis and he's straight back on. Your life is amazing. May, anytime and because of being at Radio 2 I've also made friends with Delta Goodrum and she's going to take me around Sydney.

52:24Well I can hook you up with Jason Donovan if you want. I've already got his number. Oh, okay. I'm obsolete. You're not used to me. Well look, it's been so lovely talking to you today. I have loved this so much. I've loved this so much. Thanks for having me. And I'll see you for dinner Monday. See you Monday, babe. Lots more to talk about. Oh, I love you, Scott. I love you, Scott. And I'm sure most of you know from just listening to Scott on the radio and hopefully from that podcast that he is the loveliest person. But he's exactly as you'd imagine him to be. He's just a good egg to the core. Now, look, if Scott and I and British Airways Holidays have inspired you to take your holidays more seriously, and I hope we have, You can head to ba.com forward slash holidays.

53:07And the good thing is British Airways holidays are making it so much easier to enjoy your holidays without all the stress. All their holidays are at all protected. They offer a 24 hour helpline should you need them while you're away. And they allow you to book with a low deposit and flexible payments. Jammie. Plus, all their holidays include a generous 23K baggage allowance per person. So no surprises when you book. alright a massive thanks again to Scott to the producer Anushka Tate at Happy Play Studios and to you go and have a good rest my loves

54:02Thank you.