OFF AIR...EXTRA (with Coventry Building Society)

0:08Sue Hayward: This episode of Off Air is brought to you by Coventry Building Society. Joining me today are Kat Robinson, Head of Family and Everyday Banking at Coventry Building Society and journalist Sue Hayward and together we're going to be discussing how saving can be about much more than building an emergency fund. from future goals and family priorities to everyday habits and the power of planning ahead. We'll explore how small financial decisions today can help create more of the opportunities and experiences we'd like tomorrow. So what is your sunny day? Let's find out. Sue, I'd like to start with you, please.

0:45Sue Hayward: Have you always wanted to be a financial journalist? It's quite a specific thing that I've never heard maybe a seven, eight, nine year old say,

0:54Jane Garvey: oh yeah that's what I'm gonna do do you know what I have always had a passion for money saving and as a kid my sister used to laugh because I was the one who was putting my money in the money box when she was going to spend hers and as I grew up there was this wonderful shop in Watford where I grew up called the reject shop which was sort of seconds end of line discontinued stock and I think that's really where my money saving habits were kind of honed on a Saturday afternoon and probably where most of my teenage Saturday money went and pocket money and things. So I think it was more practical.

1:27Jane Garvey: I certainly didn't wake up one morning and think, I want to be a financial journalist. I think my earlier ambition actually was to present Blue Peter, to be honest, which sadly I never got the chance to do, but I got to chat about money instead.

1:38Sue Hayward: Well, I think you come out of it well. Not every Blue Peter presenter's career has ended superbly, so let's just leave it at that. Kat, what about you? Were you always interested by money?

1:48Fi Glover: I think so. I'm naturally quite a nosy person. So being in product marketing, understanding what motivated people about money. And money is one of those really funny topics where it's really important, but it's a category people really don't engage in. And I find that sort of challenge really interesting and have done for sort of 20 years, how you get people to engage, how easy if you work for Apple. But you know, I've always worked in a category that people aren't interested in, but it's really important. And I find that fascinating.

2:14Sue Hayward: What is the most go to question that people ask you when you tell them what you do? People don't understand.

2:21Fi Glover: My mother still thinks I work in a branch. I mean, it's quite theoretical and quite hard to explain, isn't it, what you actually do? Yeah, so no, I think I can bring it to life. I've got 11-year-old twins. I can bring it to life for the twins now in terms of talking about they've now got a current account, so I can explain. Mummy manages that product. But it's quite hard to actually explain what that means, isn't it, kind of behind the scenes. It's all a bit sort of theoretical.

2:45Sue Hayward: Yeah. Yeah. Let's talk about having children and talking about money with them. So I think as parents, it's a natural go to position, isn't it, to encourage saving. But then would I be right in thinking that actually those brilliant lessons of the early years, they just fall away for too many people?

3:06Jane Garvey: I think sometimes that can be the case. I mean, I can remember with my daughter when she was younger, we would go into the supermarket and I would try and, I guess, give her early financial lessons where I would let her choose her favourite breakfast cereal. And then when she chose the one probably with the free gift or the glamorous picture on the front of the brightly coloured packet, I would then say, OK, this costs X amount. Actually, we could buy two of these. One's on the bottom shelf, own brand. Or we could buy one of these and something else to try and show her how much, you know, the difference in money.

3:36Jane Garvey: But I think you're absolutely right, because I think although financial education is taught in schools, it's often it's not always the practical, you know, how much tax you paying? What's this on my first pay slip? So things like that, unless you have parents, family or people that have a really good relationship with money and teach you about money, managing money, saving, all those kind of things as you grow up. sometimes you can get to the stage where your first pay packet you think wow this is fantastic and you suddenly realise that gosh I have got to pay some tax and national insurance and what's

4:08Sue Hayward: this all about and we do this funny thing don't we where we say you're either a spender or a saver

4:13Jane Garvey: I mean you can be both absolutely I mean I would I think I would say that I'm probably slightly more of a saver and I can sometimes get a bit mean where I think should I buy that or should I save something but I think it's really important I think saving is about a financial mindset as well it's not just about the practical putting money away for your new car your holiday rainy day I think it's it's getting in that financial mindset and financial habit and once you develop that habit hopefully it will last a lifetime because it's just so important to to do that I mean so few or so many of us rather don't have much in savings I think the statistics something like two in four have less than 200 pounds in savings depending on whose research you look at so you know it's it's a huge amount of people that actually don't have very much at all.

5:03Sue Hayward: And you've used another key phrase there which is the saving for a rainy day but Kat I love what you've done here because you approach saving from a different point of view why not save for the sunny days?

5:16Fi Glover: No absolutely I think saving for rainy days is really important so almost all financial resilience if things go wrong but then equally thinking about what all the fabulous things you want to do in the future what the things you want to be able to say yes to time you want to spend with friends and family or things you want to do at home and almost then visualizing that and setting starting small and setting yourself a goal and then consistently kind of working towards that I think's a really sort of really positive quite empowering actually makes you feel really good and kind of confident and in control and and you're so right that actually if you're

5:50Sue Hayward: saving for something joyful or for the opportunity or for choice it's actually easier than the saving for necessity doom armageddon you know it's in a different place isn't it and i love the fact that nowadays we can name our savings jars can't we which you didn't used to be able to do back in

6:10Fi Glover: the day before digital banking no agree i think and i think that's fab i think anything you can do to bring it to life and visualize it just makes it more meaningful otherwise it's a kind kind of a theoretical thing you're doing over here, isn't it? If I can call it, I'm saving that moment for one of those fancy hot water taps. So being able to, you know, I know that every coffee I don't buy in London is contributing towards my fancy hot water tap at home and it just brings it to life, doesn't it? Right, you're a very brave lady.

6:34Sue Hayward: I can't go near those. I'm just terrified of them. You've got an amazing statistic. 15 % of people say they'd rather deep clean the oven than have a detailed conversation about money. We're daft, aren't we?

6:48Fi Glover: Absolutely. I think, well, definitely in the UK, it's kind of the last great taboo, isn't it? I think another stat we have is 30 % of people would rather talk about sex, politics, their health than talk about money, which is just a real shame. I think there are, and you don't have to go straight to, you know, what's your net worth and what have you got in your will? You can start really small with, you know, where do you want to go on holiday? Or if you suddenly came across£500, what would you do with it? And just opening up those conversations about money. I think we can share and learn from each other if we talk more about money.

7:21Fi Glover: Otherwise, I think to the previous point, you can suddenly find yourself in the early 30s, like, crikey, I'm not saving anything, and what's a pension? But if you can start talking about it earlier, you can share experiences and kind of learn from friends and family. Particularly, I think, now we're all living longer, you know, there are more sort of different shaped families, and not having conversations about money with family and friends, I think, sets us all up to fail, doesn't it? in the future in terms of the difficult conversations you might have to have at a really awkward time. Like, why not practice and have them earlier?

7:53Sue Hayward: Yeah. Do you feel that that's changing at all, Sue, that actually there's a different way of talking about money amongst young people than perhaps there was in our generation?

8:03Jane Garvey: I think there is, because I think the whole taboo on saving money and maybe using voucher codes, and instead of feeling embarrassed that you've looked for a deal, people are now proud to admit, hey, I've got a great deal with this. And in fact, there's so many of those refer a friend incentives, which obviously the companies are cashing in on cheap marketing, if you like, because they can pay you 50 quid if you've got your friend on board for their product. But I think so many more people are thinking before they buy something, actually, let's shop around. Let's look for a voucher code. Let's download an app.

8:35Jane Garvey: The fact you can get a freebie, maybe, you know, with your coffee, if you're going to a new coffee bar, download the app, you might get money off. So I think definitely it's become much more of a way of life, if you like. And just going back to Kat's point, I think it's really interesting about, you know, within families and dynamics, because I think one of the things I see is a lot of people say within couples, sometimes there's that fear of the secret debts or they don't talk about money. Or maybe when they get together because one of them's earning more than the other, they never really discuss money.

9:07Jane Garvey: And then further down the line, you can sometimes get to a situation where if somebody is struggling or they've lost their job and the other person is paying the bills and it can all erupt and go horribly wrong. So I think it's really important, however you manage your money in any relationship, but just to have those conversations, whether it's going to be joint savings or whether it's how you split your bills as well. Yeah.

9:29Sue Hayward: Kat, do you have anything to add to that? What's a good way of starting a conversation about money if you are in a household where you really don't talk about it?

9:39Fi Glover: I think you can start small and literally at the dinner table, I was saying before, maybe just think about, OK, if you had£500 tomorrow, what would you do with it? Are you a cash person or a card person? How do you feel about debt? You know, almost find your way into it and kind of build from there and be clear on the things that matter to you. so I'm all about, you know, experiences and people. They're the things I want to spend money on. My husband spends his money on different things, but almost having those conversations about the kinds of things that you value and you want to spend your money on and almost establishing those shared goals together, I think, is a great place to start.

10:14Sue Hayward: I wish that the one thing that I'd been taught at school was the value of compound interest. I mean, once you understand compound interest, I mean, it is sexy talk time, isn't it? It is.

10:26Jane Garvey: And I think this is the thing, there's so much, it's not quite jargon, compound interest, but words like this that get bandied around and people don't understand them. And then there's the fear of actually asking about how it works. And I know that obviously you can go on all sorts of websites and find out about things like this, you know, because I think that's the great thing about saving, that also you get interest on your money. It's not just, we're not suggesting people just shove some money in a bank of women's society. you get the interest back so you can make more as you go along, which is really important as well.

10:59Jane Garvey: And especially if you're someone who wants to save rather than invest, because, of course, with savings, your money is always going to be safe. You know, you're protected under the financial services compensation scheme. So, you know, your money is safe there and you make some interest as well. So I always think that's a really good grounding.

11:16Sue Hayward: So what do people who are listening to this do, Kat, if they think, OK, all of that sounds like me, or there's a little bit that's made their ears prick up. They come to the Coventry Building Society. Where do they start? What's the go-to destination for the person who thinks, right, savings for me now?

11:36Fi Glover: I think I'd say, regardless of product, three things. The first thing is kind of picture it. So what are you saving for? Start small. Saving isn't just for people who have wards of cash at home saving is for anyone so start small and be consistent I think and it's surprising where you can get to if you start that habit and then to the previous point you kind of then embedding that habit and build over time so picture it and start small and be consistent okay there will

12:01Sue Hayward: definitely be people listening to this you've had a really bad time with money the cost of living crisis has made people's everyday lives so so difficult for a long time so if you are listening and thinking that's just for somebody else you know I don't have any spare cash what would you advise Kat?

12:19Fi Glover: So I think definitely I mean at times of acute financial stress you don't want to be worrying about savings you don't want to add to people's worries but I think for most people most of the time saving is achievable it's just about starting small and having a small goal in mind and being consistent and just being realistic about your life and how much you can save but But equally, I think it can be quite empowering how quickly that money can add up if you kind of stick with the habit.

12:47Sue Hayward: I'm sure that you've had many queries over the last decade or so about how to cope with real financial hardship. What's your advice?

12:55Jane Garvey: I think, as Kat said, it's starting small. I mean, there's lots of places, banks, building societies have apps and devices where you can do things like save the change or save the pennies. And it's a really easy, quick way to start Kickstarter savings habits. So let's say, for example, use your debit card to pay for a coffee, say£4.20, then you'll be charged£5. Your bank will whisk the extra ATP into your savings. So you kind of don't miss it in that sense. And it all starts to add up. And of course, then you're getting interest as well. So I would say that's a good way. And also regular savings account.

13:31Jane Garvey: Think of yourself as a bill payment. So the day after you get paid, set up a standing order that goes direct to your savings. for however much you think you can afford. And I would always say don't be over-realistic because if you think, wow, I'll stick a few hundred quid away, come the end of the month, you might be pulling it back, you might risk going into the red. So put a small amount away. And a regular saver account, you know, you can get sometimes 7%, 8%. So it's worth doing. And you can usually save up to around£250 a month doing that. So I think that's a good way for people to kickstart a savings habit and maybe promise yourself that if you get a bonus or if there's any extra money, maybe, dare I say, get a tax rebate or something.

14:11Jane Garvey: If you're lucky enough to get one of those, I think you put the money into the savings just to top it up and keep an eye on what you've got. So each year, give yourself like a mini financial health check so you don't just think, right, this is what I've got in savings. Check you're getting the best deal because sometimes if you're on a fixed deal, that may have ended and the rates may have plummeted. So it's worth keep shopping around.

14:33Sue Hayward: And presumably your customers can ask CBS to help them to do that, to give them a little bit of a financial makeover.

14:41Fi Glover: Yeah, no, absolutely. So I think most banks and building societies would support customers either with digital tools or kind of in branches or call centres. But there's equally lots of other organisations who can help you do that. And I think just having that regular view, whether it's quarterly or annually, just on what you're paying is really powerful because things, particularly the things you're paying for by direct debt and standing order, go up, they rarely go down. And often you can save yourself quite a lot of money by switching around.

15:07Sue Hayward: I feel particularly sorry for our younger generation at the moment. You know, they are being bombarded with these doom-laden messages about the future of the planet and the future of their working lives. And many of them leave university with a massive amount of debt too. For that person who's listening or a parent of that person, they may well think what is the point in even putting a fiver away you know it's it's so dark out there I'm not part of this kind of financial journey at all I think there's I absolutely sort

15:42Fi Glover: of hear and understand that I think there's something about feeling confident and in control which is probably just engaging with and being a bit more deliberate about what you're spending and what you're saving and that can start right now so you know if I'm in my first year at uni can I be a bit more thoughtful about what I'm spending money on versus not but then also looking forward when you finish uni and you're into you're working and you're starting to pay off this debt I think it's just about taking more sort of ownership and responsibility and being more deliberate about spending so we're not saying don't spend any money I think it's just being conscious and deliberate about the choices you make yeah and know that you might end up being one of those smiling grey-haired people on the balcony of a cruise ship that we see in the

16:26Sue Hayward: advertisements but you you have to kind of rewind that dream don't you that's what we're talking about put some money away now if that is the thing that you hope to be able to achieve later and you've revealed your love of the hot water tap cold water tap does it have the sparkling

16:41Fi Glover: that's the one I want but they're more expensive okay well I mean I presume you're good at saving

16:45Sue Hayward: so I'm sure you'll get there. And so what would be your sunny day fund? What's it about?

16:51Jane Garvey: Holidays, definitely holidays. And I'm the kind of person who will actually spend hours researching, once I've got the money, researching the best deals, whether it's flights, whether it's Airbnb, places to go. And I love finding the whole sort of travel swaps where you can go to different places, see the sights for less. So, for example, in New York, I found out the Statue of Liberty, it's amazing to go up, absolutely fantastic. But obviously, you can get the free Staten Island ferry, go past it, take snaps and everything else. So I love doing all the research for things like that. But definitely my money, it's holidays and travel for me.

17:26Sue Hayward: OK, thank you very much indeed for talking to us today. I feel quite optimistic and empowered by that conversation, actually. So many thanks. Before we finish, I'd encourage everybody listening to think about their future self. What would they thank you for? We often think of saving as sacrifice, discipline and cutting back, but perhaps it's really about something way more positive. It's about confidence. It's about choice. It's about having things to look forward to. Successful savers aren't necessarily those who earn the most. They're often the people who make saving a habit and keep taking small steps towards the life they want to live.

18:05Sue Hayward: So what is your sunny day? And what could you do today that your future self might thank you for tomorrow?

18:30Kat Robinson: congratulations you've staggered somehow to the end of another off-air with jane and fee thank you

18:35Sue Hayward: if you'd like to hear us do this live and we do do it live every day monday to thursday two till

18:42Kat Robinson: four on times radio the jeopardy is off the scale and if you listen to this you'll understand exactly why that's the case uh so you can get the radio online on dab or on the free

18:54Sue Hayward: times radio app off air is produced by eve salisbury and the executive producer is rosie cutler

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