A Traveler’s Guide to Awamori in Okinawa

0:20Thank you for turning into another episode of Sake On Air, the world's first podcast dedicated to expanding the dialogue surrounding Japan's iconic beverages. Sake Shochu and Awamori. My name is Miho and I'm joined today by Madoka and Maurice. And together we'll be talking about Awamori in Okinawa and where people can find good Awamori spots in Naha and beyond. Thank you for coming today, Maurice and Madoka. Bye. Hey. We all met in JSS's Sake and Shochu Academy 2021. I guess so. Long time ago. Yeah. It was like COVID, pre-COVID, post-COVID. Post-COVID, I guess. It was during COVID. It was pre-COVID because no one could come from outside of the country.

1:19Yeah, yeah. They did it with all domestic. We were all masked and everything. yeah um so could you briefly introduce yourself to the audience uh maybe let's start with madoka um okay so um i'm madoka i'm originally from toyama but since i used to live in hong kong for like 10 years, I couldn't stay with the cold weather anymore. That is why since 2015, I moved to Okinawa and since then I am a resident here in Naha. Great. I didn't know you were from Toyawa. Yeah, I'm from the sake world actually.

2:10Great. Maurice? Hello everyone. I'm originally from the United States. I grew up in New Mexico and then I joined the Air Force and moved out here to Okinawa. And I decided I liked it here and wanted to stay. So that's what I did. I'm happy to be here. Great. So what's your relationship with Abamori? How did you get into the Abamori world besides being in Okinawa? to me i'm originally a big fan of awamori and not just awamori but any sort of alcoholic beverage is made with rice so sake is my favorite too but awamori is one of my favorites from the very beginning even before i start to live in okinawa so yeah so basically i love awamori i I love to drink awamori and other than that part of my job is introducing the charm of awamori to overseas people so currently I am like introducing some nice brand to someone living in Okinawa some someone not living in Okinawa to help some kind of connection make some connection between the awamori distilleries with the overseas market something like that so that's how we started i mean how i started the kind of um interaction with awamori great yeah what about you maurice kind of similar but um well of course when i first came to okinawa i did not know what awamori was and it just took me you know going out first the first experience i think was at a club and the free drink was awamori but it was like it was like very you know bottom of the barrel type stuff and it was it was it was free so it was just like oh what is this this is awamori and then that was kind of my perception of awamori you know and it didn't really taste very well right but then going out with friends uh japanese friends um to izakaya's uh i kind of learned more about Aomori because that's most people, the guys especially, were drinking.

4:32So I said, you know, I've had it before, but what is this? This tastes totally different. Oh, that's also Aomori. But so that kind of like began my interest in Aomori. And I wanted to learn more. And then eventually I wanted to help teach. And like Madoka said, you know, help export as well. Yeah. great some of our listeners may not know what awamori is so can one of you explain what awamori is do you want to take that no please go ahead oh what it is on the basic sense is a rice distilled spirits. So it's made from rice, flag koji. And typically, traditionally, we use Thai rice, but it doesn't have to be Thai rice.

5:22It can be any, it can be Japanese rice as well. So rice, koji, and of course, yeast. And it's a one-time distillate, one-time fermentation. Basically, the range of alcohol percentage is between 30 % to all the way up to 44 % is the most comment range did i miss anything you want to chime in or uh and also there are like 44 or five distilleries in okinawa including ishigaki or um miyako islands yeah yeah so there are at least 44 or five different types of brands yeah uh yeah the consumers consumers can enjoy and they of course they make you know various different products including liqueurs as well so yeah rice koji based spirit i guess that's what yes it is um which is kind of hard to imagine what the taste would be like right what does it taste like to you um i guess there are many different varieties but what's the most common type of what do you have what does it taste like it's it's funny because the last time i was on on a similar podcast i kind of stumbled with this one because it's like uh it tastes like rice you know but it was hard to describe the taste um for people who are have never tasted it before but i think you get a lot of um to me you get a lot of earthiness and of course it depends on on the brand and also on the distillery in the region from they're they're producing the product so earthiness and if it's especially with aged alamori you get a little bit more of the a lot of people say a lot of the caramel caramel notes some of the sweetness but that it doesn't it's not limited of course to age alamori and recently some type of abamori does have a very fruity note you know like apple, pineapple, mango such kind of flavors yeah you see a lot of like more recently some more experimentation with different types of yeast so some of them are using like sake yeast or hibiscus yeast and that kind of brings out more of the fruity flavors and aromas too like a lot of different aromas come off of that as well it's a lot more diversified i think so how do okinawan people drink it usually in izakaya usually uh mixed with water or also you can mix with soda soda soda water is also really popular or black coffee at home i I also drink it on the rocks or with water with a little bit of lemon slice or just kind of add some citrus flavors to it.

8:31Right. Also, recently there are some bars offering cocktail base. They're using awamori as a cocktail base. Yes. There are a lot more kind of creative ideas that the travelers also can start with.

8:51yeah nice destinations here and there these days so i think this could be a very good touching point very important i think um as an entry to our mori is a cocktail because you know it's kind of is it's similar to whiskey in that it's a spirit of you know over 40 degrees abv but for people who are not used to drinking it's a clear spirit of course so people who are not used to drinking a clear spirit on the rocks or straight or it may be a little bit too much for them so to start them off with a cocktail i think is a good idea yeah for me uh because it's an okinawan drink awamori always has this cultural uh image of i don't know like when i drink awamori i think of this warm tropical island, you know, in the very distinct Okinawan traditional music.

9:48I associate the drink with, you know, the local izakayas where, you know, this music is always playing. To me, it's a very special drink that has so much culture attached to it. Oh, yes. So as a tourist visiting Okinawa and not knowing anything about Awamori, where is a good place to start? I think I can start by saying it kind of depends on how deep they want to go. So if you want to go like really deep into it, I would say start with a distillery tour, like schedule a distillery tour. a lot of them are really open to the public and some of them have they start you off with a film typically in english or are subtitled with english and some of them have have translators there for you as well really kind of like so i think uh i would say zui sen and the reason why is because it's right next to you know really close to shuri castle agree so and then they have they have the video they have you know the last time i was there which was recently they have a translator there so we can do the distillery tour and then close to uh is shikina so shikina is like is a very small distillery so you can see the the big difference between a large distillery and then a much smaller one from zuisen and shikina you kind of get a good idea of the range and of course Ryukyumura at Sakimoto Distillery.

11:30That one's good because you get a lot more of the culture. It's a cultural theme park, I guess. So you get so much culture immersed at Ryukyumura as well as the distillery tour for Aumori. Herios is also another fun destination. They have a very beautiful bar inside the store, I mean the shop and I remember they have a translator as well probably by request but yeah so someone could help translating, especially if someone wants to taste different kinds of awamori so at these distilleries you can see the actual production or do they explain how Awamori is made? They do explain. Of course, it depends on where you go, but the videos do well to explain.

12:33And I think as far as production, it kind of just depends on the time of year that you're presenting and what stuff in the process they're doing. A lot of them have viewing rooms that you can actually see. You might not necessarily be able to go in, but you'll be able to see the production process. Right. Is there a season for Awomori production, or is it usually all year round? It's usually all year round, but I think different phases within the production are limited to seasonal. Am I right there, Madoka? Do you know? If someone really wants to go deeper, maybe Chukuo Distillery is offering the making experience by yourself but by reservation so you have to pre-book but they have a smaller facility for experiencing all kind of the process so this could be more advanced level I should say the more you know probably the more you want to touch and yeah they will provide you the final products a few months later you can receive it something like that so uh the one that you're like wow yeah so i think this could be very interesting experience i want to try that yeah yeah maybe we should do that yeah I had an opportunity to help translate there.

14:16And it was like so detailed. I was like, oh, wait, wait, wait, what now? Because, you know, my Japanese is not native. So I was struggling with that one, but it was fun. You know, I think I learned a lot from that experience. Very detailed. Wow. How long is this Awamori making experience at Chukuo? Do you know? I have experienced once, not me, but I was a translator to help some kind of overseas guests to experience it before. It was about two hours or so. Yeah, you could book online or you could make a reservation by call. Yeah. Definitely within the one day thing. Yeah, yeah, within the few hours thing.

15:08so nothing too serious but you can really touch base experience it so um i would like to try that it sounds like a lot of fun yeah i didn't know they were actually doing i knew that you know they i thought that they make it for you and i think they do also do that like um you can buy your own cask or jar or something oh yeah jar the clay pots yeah right I thought that was all they were doing, but that's interesting that you can also experience it. Oh yeah, they are still running this handcraft experience. Yeah, that's a good idea. It was kind of paused during the COVID time, and they just restarted.

16:00Could be one option. After the distillery tour or distillery visit, what would be a good place to go taste it in or outside of Maha? Outside of Maha tasting. So for example, if someone wants to taste a wide range of awamori, would there be a good bar or a shop? Awamori Plus is good. It's in all half. Yeah. What's the one? Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, the three left. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. What's the other one, Madoka? I always mispronounce it. Ono-ire. Ah, Oni-no-ire. Oni-no-ire is a very fun place. Yeah, yeah. You can experience a wide range of awamori and very traditional karakara and chibua which is a traditional serving containers and also the company and well they're a beautiful selection and yeah and also his food are really nice too yeah Oninode is a must go destination for yeah it's been a while since I've been there I need to go because I follow him on social media.

17:31So I often see his posts like, man, I wish I could go. His food is getting more and more creative. So I think, yeah, it's worth the visit. Yeah. He does well with the food pairing. Yeah. Yeah. It's really interesting. So I think those two, of course, Our Mori Plus also has food. So they have a good selection as well. Yeah. Yeah, it's definitely more of a casual kind of vibe. There was another one that you took me to, also in Naha. I don't remember that. It was like an older... Oh, Omoro? Yes, yes. Yeah, Omoro is also one of the very traditional Okinawan-style izakaya, where they serve very traditional Okinawan food with a lot of good aged awamori, kusu.

18:25I think most of them are in... Kome could be one of the casual choice. Kome? Kome is the neighbor of Elekyo. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. They also serve most of all awamori available in Okinawa. And the way they serve is quite casual in a way. like they serve awamori with the sparkling soda sparkling water and also with the shikwasa in special tailor-made glasses so i think it could be also fun and very approachable for tourists but it is an izakaya type yeah did i i think maybe i went there too yeah i think i've been there once and the cocktail destination Elikyo I was actually at Kome yeah they are neighbors so I think two in one night is the best yeah they are really innovative cocktails especially with the awamori based cocktails as well you know very interesting and Rikyo Labo drink lab Nahas get all the fun it's very compact so i think you can visit one after another in one night oh yeah that's the beauty of you know partying in naha we're all so close proximity to each other yeah maurice uh you're based in okinawa city right yes are there any recommendations there there's one I think it's called Kusu I think we went together with it yeah I remember

20:22I think it's called Kusu Kusu or something like that yeah Kusu yeah very interesting also that one's been there for they have a huge selection I just kind of one night stumbled upon it and I was like oh wow this is all Aomori. It does have a very long name. Kusu Rakuen, Nakano Machi. Kusu Rakuen. Rakuen, yes. No other specific Aomori bar comes to mind at the moment. I think that's pretty much, especially around this area, maybe the only one. Others, of course, have Aomori, but not specific to Aomori. So when you go to these awamori bars, what do you usually order? Is there an order of awamori you usually do?

21:16Or how do you order your awamori? good question I think for me I kind of have more of a familiarity with awamori so it's kind of like maybe I want to try specific distillery or region within Okinawa I want to try from northern Okinawa or something but if I were thinking as a beginner I think I would start with the alcohol percentage. I would look at the alcohol percentage and see maybe if it's a 30 % or below. I think I would start with that first. Just kind of get a feel without getting too drunk off of a sip. You've got to pace yourself. I think that's how I would start. But without knowing anything else other than that, then that's how I would start.

22:18Of course, beginners wouldn't necessarily know. I actually had people ask me, if they're all using the same ingredients, what differentiates one from the other? I told her, yeah, that's a good question. You just kind of have to jump in and just try different ones, I think. Then you kind of decide what you like and what you don't like and then go with that. Do you have any recommendations, Matapakam? It really depends, but depending on what you are eating or depending on the situation, if you are after meal or before or together, it depends. But to me, I usually ask for something light or something rich and let the restaurant or the bar to choose a good one for me.

23:11recently I do that so waiting for their recommendation but give them some sort of my feeling like I feel like drink something light or I feel like drink something very heavy usually they will give me some suggestion or recommendation so I basically follow Do you also ask recommendations on how to drink the awamori as well because it's a lot of awari or mitsuwari or straight yeah I will also mention that I need something with the bubbles or yeah I already had my dinner so I want to go neat so give me something strong or maybe something you know finish my I mean clear my palate something like that yeah then usually professionals can give me nice one I think that's why it's important to go to those awamori bars because they can they listen and they kind of can give suggestions yeah I usually go for something rich and heavy tasting I like vizuari with no ice so I used to order that but Madoka-san you introduced us to danboru oh yeah and that was amazing Danboru is so approachable and so, just really friendly awamori, I think.

24:46Yes, do you want to tell our listeners what it is? Danboru is a kind of a whiskey soda, similar concept of whiskey soda, but Danryu is one of a brand produced by Kamimura Shuzo, Kamimura Distillery, where the location is right in the middle of Okinawa, Uruma City. And they're the one who started to release awamori, I mean, aged awamori in a cask barrel. So they're the first distillery who start to sell awamori flavor with a little bit of whiskey kind of oki, woody flavor. And yeah, it gains a lot of fans. and the most popular way to serve it or enjoy it is with soda. So we call it danboru, just like a highball.

25:40Right. And danboru in Japanese means cardboard. Yeah. It's a pun. I remember. So there is one restaurant. It's also a very classic Okinawan-style restaurant with a lot of awamori selection. It's called Karakara to Chibugua. It's also a very nice place where they are also promoting Danbor really well. That one's also in Naha, right? Yeah. It's an interesting drink because it's refreshing, but at the same time, it has such a warm taste. It's a little bit casky but also very vanilla-y and like caramel-y. So yeah, it's so easy to drink and yeah, wonderful. Great starter drink. Yeah, I think I totally agree.

26:35I wish I had one right now. Oh, yes. I went to Okinawa Antena Shop in Tokyo to get sandu so I could make that water at home. yeah it's a great great drink yeah are there any other bars so um if someone wants a more cultural experience with awamori with maybe like uh music and traditional dance or something are there places that you recommend because awamori is not just a drink it's it's so ingrained in Okinawan culture so I think you have to have a full experience you have to go to a local izakaya with local drinkers I think the best location for that is Kokusai Street in Naha, so along Kokusai Street there are several izakaya that do the live folk music so the traditional Okinawan folk music they'll do a lot of performances are in Naha of course some are here in Okinawa City as well I think Okinawa City tends to be especially this area tends to be more blues rock of course music live music is very popular here as well but it's more of kind of a modern live here do they drink awamori with modern rock Yes, I think the older generation, maybe some young people too, but I think it's more the older generation will drink awamori.

28:26Young people drink, you know, the lemon sour or beer. Is that true for all of Okinawa? Are young people not drinking awamori as much? I think so, especially if I compare, you know, 20 or 30 years ago when I first got here, it's been people were drinking more. I think that's just not just our worry, though. I think that's in general. People were drinking more compared to now. People tend to drink less or lower ABV, with the exception to this is Nakonomachi area. I think this is an exception because there are a lot of bars that tend to stay open late or early in the morning around me. So I think this is...

29:19For heavy drinkers. Right. I think this area may be an exception. But overall, in general, I think people tend to drink less nowadays. I see. I also just, sorry, slightly off topic, but I just remembered about awamori kohi. You know how that whole thing started? Because it tastes really wonderful, but very potent. I think, don't quote me, but with awamori, of course, there is no second fermentation. So there's no adding of ingredients like shochu. you can add mugi or kome or whatever you know whatever shochu that you're going for but with aomori you're kind of limited um to one um fermentation so there is no second fermentation so i think people at the izakaya if they don't want to drink mizuwari they kind of experiment with different mixers so that kind of like you can mix you mix it with milk when i first I was like, why would you mix it with milk?

30:24But it's actually really, really good mixing with milk. I think people just kind of reach for whatever's close by and then coffee of course goes well. You know? Like I mentioned before, the citrus, like lemon or the local the local lime. That is also a common mixer. Sparkling water, of course. I've heard some people mix it with tonic water. There's a variety of mixers and I think coffee just kind of, especially black coffee, kind of just went well as it goes well. Continues to be a popular mixer. Yeah, they even have a pre-mixed like RTD coffee awamori. yes yes yeah it's uh it's uh it's almost like a guilty pleasure because it has this like a really nice sweetness to it and then nothing from awamori makes it taste so good but one's an upper and one's a downer so it just feels so wrong so in okinawa i also see a lot of um is ready-made awamori, so like 12 % ABV, already mixed with water.

31:47Are they popular amongst the locals, or is it more for tourists? I think the target is tourists. I do see them a lot also in the convenience stores, whereas you just grab it and go sit on the seawall looking at the ocean or something and you just want to sip slowly, they cut it for you. So it's just like perfect for sipping. Right. And the price is so reasonable, you know, just a few hundred yen. And all you need is just buy some ice. That's a very easygoing drink. Yeah, very convenient. You mentioned some of the more recent movement in Awamori, diversifying, for example, a variety of yeast. I recently also saw an article in InFlight Magazine about how Zampa came up with a banana yeast.

32:53What's the current trend and what's been happening in the past, say, like five years in Awamori? To me, I think experimentation with different yeast or different production times and durations. I see more experimentation on that. Right. So, for example, in shochu, there is that little boom of aromatic shochu that has more like lychee, tropical fruit, like aroma, that is very different from traditional classic shochu. Is there something like that in Awamori as well? Yeah, I think, say, like, Shima Uta from Masahiro Distillery or the Akari from Hikunotsuyu. Those two are kind of new trend of Awamori, which does have a lot of fruity aroma and a lot more refreshing kind of aftertaste.

33:59so unlike very traditional awamori strong character is just being covered instead have more fruity light kind of easy more approachable flavor I think those two specifically I think they are also targeting the younger generation especially trying to reach is it also lower ABB is like 20 25 I think they really thought about who they wanted to target, right? So it was like, okay, we'll make it a little bit more approachable specifically for the younger generation. So you'll see commercials on television with the younger crowd. They have comedians as the ambassadors, you know, so they're kind of trying to push for that.

34:54Do they have a different type of packaging? because Abomori has this classic Abomori has a very certain look and label design. Are these new products do they look a little different? It's much more eye-catching and you can remember you know when you see it you can remember it. They're clear bottles you know very modern labels very attractive. Interesting. How did they how do they make this fruitiness in awamari? I'm just wondering. What I heart is they use some special yeast to give some fruity aroma. Okay. And maybe do vacuum distillation. I guess so. Some of them, I think like another one is Shima Urada from Yaesu.

35:48Yeah, they do. I think that's vacuum distillation, but also it's made with Ishigaki grown rice. So I think that's maybe another trend. Some brands are using the Japanese rice. I think Masahiro also makes one. And then, of course, you know, Zui-sen makes one. Yeah, so. Interesting. Does that affect the flavor profile? I don't think, I don't, yeah, maybe there may be a small, minute difference, but I don't think it's very noticeable for most people. Like you can't really attribute that alone. There are other factors, I think, that maybe stand out more. I think it's more of a, you know, kind of wanting to boost the local economy is another drive for that.

36:36And just kind of more of experimentation, like, let's try Japanese rice as opposed to Thai rice. Right. Yeah, I forget, but maybe we didn't mention that awamori is usually made with Thai rice, which is a long, thin-grained rice, as opposed to what we eat in Japan, round, sticky type. But the newer trend is to use more Japanese round-grained sticky rice. or even some islands they're producing indica rice in Okinawa like Izeana or the Igea island they're producing local grown indica rice so some distilleries are also using those Japanese I mean Okinawan grown indica rice to make awamori yeah this is also another kind of trend I guess that's interesting it's still Japanese rice but it's not Japanese indica rice

37:45Are these indicated on the label? Can you tell when you're buying a product? I think so. I think they are mentioning it. It says just Japanese rice though, right? Maybe some of them. It kind of depends. Maybe they just mentioned local grown rice. yeah like i remember shinzato is also producing something uh with the local grown indica rice i guess but so there's quite a few of them that use it then that use or yeah yeah that's that's very cool okinawa definitely has that history of uh trading with surrounding areas and countries so i'm sure like you know rice has been imported for centuries centuries yes so so for that i don't really feel so sometimes with gi uh i feel a little doubtful when they don't really use local ingredients but i think for in case of gi duikyo abomori i think it's okay but i also really want to support the local industry and you know farming as well so that's a very cool new move that's very important but i I don't think many people want to farm rice, right?

39:06The young people. I'm not going out there. That is back-breaking work, right? Yeah, and it's very hot. And, yeah, was rice cultivation big ever in Okinawa? Do you know? I don't think so. This is why they had to import, you know, for centuries. Because it wasn't. I think it's very difficult to grow rice here. right because the soil doesn't like soil drains water very quickly right right well but um yeah i support this new movement new movement yeah i'm always interested in in you know you know what type of right i think that's kind of like one of the questions that we ask now is like you know where's the rice is it Thai rice or that or local growth yeah but whereas before that was you know oh it's of course it's Thai rice you know but not so much nowadays and so now that less and less young people are drinking what's the future of awamori industry are distilleries closing down or are people still going into to make awamori like is there a new generation coming up I think the new generation maybe not they may not drink awamori but they work for awamori distilleries or they work in promotions or distribution or so awamori distilleries are doing more or trying to do more outreach, build awareness globally, not just within Japan.

40:57I see that a lot of distilleries are attending exhibitions overseas or trying to participate more in global outreach. I think they realize that we can't relied solely on domestic distribution. We have to kind of expand and grow and continue to innovate, continue to experiment. Right, and what's the general response when you take Awamori outside of the country? How do people like the take? I think, you know, recently I was able to go to Poland and participate in an exhibition. That event was specifically for whiskey. It was the Warsaw Whiskey Line. And so people were expecting Japanese whiskey.

41:55And they came up asking, is this Japanese whiskey? No. What is it, gin? No. What is it? What? What is that? So that was an opportunity to explain what armory is and then give them a taste. And of course, the Polish were more familiar with vodka. So they said, oh, this is very good. And a lot of really good questions came from that, a lot of really good thought-provoking questions. I was impressed with that. And I think, you know, similarly in the U.S. or other areas that I was fortunate to travel for Aro Mori, the same thing. A lot of people seem to be really interested in it. They just didn't know or maybe heard of it but never tasted it before.

42:47So I think we're still in that phase of getting the word out and spreading awareness. awareness. I guess the easiest way to promote it is to the people who come to Okinawa, I guess. And I hope this episode can help that. Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I hope so too. Is there anything else that we should add? I think, you know, I just kind of welcome people if they have any questions or if they have plans to visit Okinawa and would like to visit a distillery to reach out to myself or to Madoka and you know we'd be happy to help great so it's 7.30 in the evening on a Friday if you were to drink Abamori right now what would it be?

43:44I think I would go for you know what we were talking about Dambolder yeah same yeah because I had some awamori last night but I drank mizuwari with the lemon slice and a little cucumber oh cucumber too I forgot to mention that it's really good but so to go a different route I think I would go for a downboarder right now no lemon needed yeah Mariko-san it's the same for you yeah I was about to say the same thing but let me think another thing then but i would definitely need something with a sparkling water as well so maybe i would choose no let me go easy shimauta with soda yeah it's very simple easy kind of not even a cocktail but it's a very easy drink that you can make at home yeah yeah i'm definitely gonna go for example i I can really use a glass of damp water right now after a very long break.

44:50Yeah, you sound like you're ready for one. Yeah. Yeah, I'm ready for a good damp water. Yeah. Hopefully. Thank you so much for coming and talk to us today. And I really hope that this helps people to experience awamori when they visit Okinawa get more interested to learn more about awamori. So and that's it for this episode of Sake On Air please take a moment to review and rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you are enjoying the show feel free to send your questions and comment to questions at Sake On Air or at Sake On Air on Instagram and Facebook You can also find our shows and more on our YouTube channel.

46:13I'm Sebastian Luan and me, Frank Walter. Until next time, kom-pai!