Carrick Can’t Fix United, Players Under Fire & Glazers Must Sell | Stick to Football EP 155

0:00Gary Neville: Stick to Football is brought to you by our title partner, Disney+. Watch a lifetime of great stories on Disney+.

0:10Mod.com is changing the way people battle excessive fatigue. Ever hit a wall in the middle of the day and a third coffee just doesn't do it anymore? Here's what's actually happening. Coffee only briefly blocks adenosine, the chemical that tires you out. When it stops working, your system is flooded and you crash. Modafinil is a prescription treatment that works in a completely different way. Modafinil works by stimulating multiple receptors in the brain associated with wakefulness, including dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine, histamine, glutamate, and orexin. It's a more complete solution that gives you 10 to 12 hours of steady focus and energy.

0:53To learn more, go to mod.com. Fill out your intake form, meet with a licensed provider, and if approved, Mod Alert ships straight to your door. Go to mod.com to get started. That's M-O-D dot com.

1:13Gary Neville: Ian, I got stitched up virally. Kieran, we got stitched up. They did it to me as well. We don't normally do this, do we? No. Right? But last show I went viral because it looked like I didn't know what song the line was. Whilst we're living the dreams you have as children. Yes. Yeah. They cut the edit as if it was from the master plan.

1:35Ian Wright: Right.

1:36Gary Neville: But I'd already said before that it was from fade away and they cut it as if it was from master plan. So basically everyone's now hammering me online because I don't know Oasis songs and it's because the edit went. Why did they do that?

1:46Ian Wright: Why did they do that? Honestly, that's so good.

1:49Gary Neville: Can you come in and explain the edit please? What went wrong with the editing?

1:52Ian Wright: Why would you do that to him?

1:53Gary Neville: You literally made me look like a fool, and I do know my Oasis lyrics and songs. Basic Oasis knowledge, innit?

2:02Gary Neville: He did it to me as well, cos they made it sound like I said... I do it with edits. Editing stuff, anyway, you put it straight out. Exactly. The interference of production and direction. We were just too excited about Don't Look Back in Anger, a Disney Plus original, to do a proper editing. It's important to you, isn't it, girl? It's just my pride. Yeah, I'm sorry, that was a fuck up on our behalf. It was a pride. It was a pride. But thank you for messaging me on Sunday morning about it. I appreciated that.

2:26Ian Wright: It's the Salford Massive. You're happy at the moment, yeah? You're winning games and everything. You beat Fleetwood, yeah. So you're champions now.

2:36Gary Neville: Yeah, Salford. Hey, did you watch the Monday Night Football? You all watched it, will you? Salford and Walsall on Monday. Oh, it's a really good game. Yeah, it was really good. Both teams, Walsall are fantastic as well. Right, I was surprised last night at Fleetwood.

2:51Ian Wright: You know something. I mean, well done to Fleetwood, by the way. Yeah, but like, you know what you've got to expect when you're going to play at Fleetwood, because they're going to get stuck in. Yeah, yeah. Their game plan was perfect, wasn't it? You know, let's go out there, put them under pressure, see if we can get the early goal, and then defend. But if you're going to miss chances like we're going to miss chances, then of course you're going to give them more impetus to keep going. And they did. Have you seen the tackle? The tackle, yeah. I... It wasn't a sending off. No way. That was a bad tackle.

3:21That referee just jumped straight in. Yeah, it wasn't a red card, wasn't it?

3:24Ian Wright: Jesus, he just needs to just... He was on the line, right? He's on the line. The guy knows exactly... You saw it, didn't you? Roy, you didn't see it? No. He's on the line, and it's one of those where he's getting ready to turn like that, and the fella's just flown in. Knows exactly what he's doing. He's using his ankle ligaments there, can't you? Honestly, you know, once he sent him off and everything, I was like, OK, no problem. I was worried that that could have been a real massive problem.

3:49Gary Neville: Was it the petulance, do you think, of the reaction that does get a red card? You know what, girl? I don't keep... If you were a tackle like that... Foden against Bruno Fernandes, remember in the derby?

3:57Ian Wright: You know, it's the kind of tackle that you know that he's trying to hurt me because Max reacted like anyone would because, what did he do? And then he just went like that.

4:06Gary Neville: I'm just pleased that he... To be fair to our boss, he would kill us for stuff like that, to be fair, Roy. He would be quite vulnerable. He would say get around. He would say make sure he would say something. Your boss, who's your boss? What do you mean? Let's move on.

4:20Ian Wright: We're not going there yet. I'm just glad. He's Caddick's boss. Fleet would have got to get credit for the win. How good were their penalties? I know. The game plan went perfect. Take them to extra time, get to penalties, beat them. And they'd done it. But the only thing about it was that, how max was. And I think that Mikel before would have said, like they would say to me when I was 28, 29, listen, they're going to go for you. Of course. You've got to mix it with them. I didn't mind that.

4:44Gary Neville: But ultimately, we'll learn from that, won't we?

4:47Ian Wright: You know what else we'll learn from it? Marley Salmon got taken off at half-time. We're talking about somebody who's played a lot of football in that under-23 Premier League. That's not football, really. That's not football.

4:55Gary Neville: So in playing in that... Centre-backer got Ragdoll for goal. Yeah. That's League Two, that. You're going to get rolled in League Two if you saw it.

5:03Ian Wright: Yeah, but the thing is, again, it's a massive learning curve for him. It would be a massive wake-up call for him as a centre-half, because he's a good player. But you do need to have that kind of experience.

5:11Gary Neville: I wasn't going to go here, but I felt quite strongly on Saturday. And I looked at the stats of Rodgers and Palmer the last four or five games. They've not done a tap. And the first five games they did, they did really well. Do you think there's a problem? I just thought their petulance on Saturday, the reaction of Palmer and then... Cole Palmer could have been sent off for that. I thought that was a bigger reaction than Max. Yeah, 100%. What do you think is happening here? because it's not Rogers having to go for somebody Everton lads so I'm just a night again is it I didn't it wasn't just a United game no no not the United game side just spurs game yeah the previous week he was having a bit but you think that's something that I just they're not performing right now just thought is a bit of petters a bit of a worry I don't know what you mean between yeah just I did something I left the game I didn't think Chelsea played well I was really disappointed in them and I suppose were fantastic just a problem There was a problem there with Chelsea.

6:03That was a big thing of bringing some of the experienced players in, sort of like Henderson and different people. Because they got so many red cards, like she's in Chelsea. I think Rodgers, did he leave one on Conor Gallagher? Because I think he was trying to stick up for his mate because he thought Conor Gallagher overreacted to Palmers. That's what I felt when I was watching the film. I might be wrong.

6:25Gary Neville: He caught Conor?

6:26Ian Wright: Yeah, it was bad.

6:27Gary Neville: It was definitely...

6:28Ian Wright: Yeah, he caught him. Yeah.

6:38Gary Neville: Harry Kane, let's do Harry Kane. Let's do a positive thing before we go into here. How great was that? You were there, weren't you, Jamie? Yeah. Was it good? You look well, Jamie. It was good. You love a gig as well. Jamie's a gig. You love a red carpet. And UEFA. You do pub UEFA. I was supporting my team, mate. Who invited you to Ballon d 'Or? Thierry Henry. Thierry Henry was hosting it, wasn't he? Yeah, CBS. So he asked us to come along. Come along. Ewan, the producer. Obviously, Kate was doing the... Yeah. So it was more... It was the producer. Where was it at? London Palladium. Oh.

7:08Ian Wright: I heard there was a lot of... Like, the auto-cue was going down. It was like a nightmare. No, no. Because it was on TV, it was going to a break. So it was like a bit of a... So what happens on the red carpet? What do you do? Just walk? Did you have to walk and get a photograph and bend your leg and whatever they do? Side on, side pro-crime. Side on, is it? I hate them people. I see people at these functions. I'm like, what are they doing at this function? I wouldn't go again.

7:29Gary Neville: Who did you see that was there, Roy, that you thought, why are they there? Me. You want to get a tuxedo and go to a gig in London if you're not obviously involved in it. Yeah. You must be crazy. I thought it was in London. I thought there was a good chance that a team was going to win. But there's other people there getting on their photographs and you go, what are you doing there? They love it. But to witness that moment, I think, Harry Kane, was that, like, it must have been a special moment. You know what? I was so happy for it. I don't know him that well. I don't know him that well. He's not a Liverpool player.

7:59Right. He's a good player.

8:01Gary Neville: You know the thing is... Roy, even you say he's a good in this one, eh? Come on, in every way. Absolutely. But the way you're sitting there, I'm so proud of...

8:09Ian Wright: You know what was really nice, Roy? Thank you. The reaction. I don't even know when you were... I worked with him for three years. Gau. Three minutes. Gau, you know what it is? Three years! You know what I like? And he had them on corners. He had them on corners.

8:22Gary Neville: Hey. Yeah.

8:25Ian Wright: That was a building block towards the Ballon d 'Or. What I loved about it was everybody's saying, he's favourite, but his reaction felt very real. He still wasn't expecting it for some reason. It was nice. You know what I thought was unbelievable? How they keep it that secret? Yeah, we know I know. He must know, because he pulls out a spin.

8:46Gary Neville: I know, but I think Alfanzino kept a multi-billion pound deal secret. You keep looking for the Ballon d 'Or secret. So you think as he sat down for them awards, he didn't know?

8:55Ian Wright: I think his reaction said that he was surprised. It all hit him in one.

9:00Gary Neville: There would be a leak if he knew. You'd just find out, wouldn't you? And the fact that the other people who think they're going to win it are there. So if everyone knew who won it, you wouldn't get Mbappe or, you know, they would turn up. I must say one thing, and obviously you'll know better than me, but when I was at England camp and Harry Kane was there, He was always so professional. Nobody... LAUGHTER I think for young players, you said the other day about maybe players not being professional, I think he does do everything right.

9:29Ian Wright: He's getting his reward. Which is great to see. It's a brilliant story. His story is brilliant.

9:34Gary Neville: Going back to the awards thing with the PFA players... Everybody's got a story. Of course he's got a story. Chris Waddle used to work in a sausage factory. Everyone's got a story. We walked in a building site, we walked in an off-licence. We've all got a story, Ian. No, but I'm saying... Bob Dylan's got a great story. I watch Bob Dylan, I say, what a story that is. It's a great story. Amazing.

9:51Ian Wright: Yeah, but the way Harry... The way it went for Harry, though, is what he's turned into and the amount of... How hard it was for him with all those loans. I just think, brilliant. He kept going. You know what I saw? It was AI. But I thought it was... No, no, no. No, no, no. Wait a minute. It was AI, but it showed him with the Ballon d 'Or sitting down with eight-year-old Harry Kane. You know what I mean? It was just nice. Even though it was AI. I don't tell my missus my girls because there's AI but it's beautiful let's go back it is a team game

10:20Gary Neville: yeah right I think the teams will be happy for him though I was gonna ask about that because the Ballon d 'Or to be fair I have never cared two hoots about it for the last 20 years I don't care about it's an individual award it's been something but it's actually got it seems to have got more bigger and prominent and more and I always thought that and I've said this before Ronaldo was the first person I ever heard our Ronaldo the United Ronaldo he was the first person that I ever heard speak about wanting to win personal honours in the Ballon d 'Or I remember him saying I want to be the Ballon d 'Or winner and I thought that is just so against the sort of grain of what we'd heard at United everything's collective if you win the PFA play this because of my teammates and at the time it was like no one was a problem with it but I get it now a little bit in terms of the prominence that it's given Ronaldo Messi that it's become a massive But that's fine if they say, Gary, as long as they're still putting the team first.

11:08Yeah, yeah. Of course, that'll be the back on doing stuff with your team. They're not going to win it unless your team are competing to win big trophies. Even Bayern last year, obviously, they came close to the Champions League, Dunbarin obviously domestically, like they always do. Amazing with England. So you do have to put your team first, and then you will get them rewards. Yeah. But not the other way around. Lads, you still get players going, I want on with this, what about the team? No, no, you've got it the wrong way around. Yeah. We've seen it last year with United. We've seen players getting bogged down by individual awards.

11:34It's too much. But a very popular winner. Yeah, he was. He dedicated it to his teammates as well, didn't he? He recognises the service he gets and everything. There was quite a few of them there, but I'm here. Can I... You go back to something... Is that my hat over there? No, that's too small, surely. That's my hat, man. Is it? What's my hat doing over there? That's my hat.

11:53Ian Wright: I've been looking for that hat. Give it to me. Does that fit on your head? Yes, sir.

11:57Gary Neville: What should I have been on set?

11:58Ian Wright: Because it's my hat. It's supposed to be on my head.

12:01Gary Neville: Oh.

12:02Ian Wright: You've been looking for this hat for ages. I just looked, I just saw it there. That's my hat, bro. How many hats have you got at home? I don't know. But this is mine. Is this my hat or not, Ben?

12:11Gary Neville: Well, no one else.

12:11Ian Wright: How would you notice one's missing if you've got 3 ,000? I've only got one orange one. All right.

12:16Gary Neville: It looks good. I don't think it's anybody else's.

12:18Ian Wright: Thank you. I can't see you in this one. Did you do something showing people your hat or something? Did I pop up my... Did I see that something? You're missing at home on your own business and someone pops up and shows people their hats. People were interested in what the hats were putting. People would say, let me show them my hats. So I showed them a couple of hats.

12:37Gary Neville: Could you bring next recording your ten favourite hats?

12:41Ian Wright: All right, yeah. We'll all wear one of your hats. My ten favourite hats?

12:45Gary Neville: Yeah. Going back to awards, the PFA Player of the Year, they did used to get, because if you remember, like, let's say we were playing on a Sunday or we were playing on a Saturday and you had to get down to London for it, they would give you a little nod, like two or three weeks before, they wouldn't say you've won it, They say, Roy needs to be there. You know, as an example, you know what I mean? Your teammates won't be there. It's true. You all go to London for dues. You don't even know the players apart, but players want to come to my one who I play with. Did they come? They didn't come. I'm not one to hold a grudge.

13:14You're a weird guy.

13:18Ian Wright: Honestly, I would never let you lot forget that one. But then, guys, they want to know. Roy's not coming down if he don't know his one. Roy, would you come down if you don't? I didn't want to go down when I won it. That is a big one to win, though. Is that voted for by the players? Yeah, yeah.

13:31Gary Neville: I think the PFA Player of the Year is the number one award that you can win, I think, in this country for an individual award. It's one of the players. Yeah, but you've said before a lot of players don't have little hang-ups with players, you know what I mean, who they're voting for. You've said that before, haven't you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it always seems to work itself out, Roy. Yeah, I suppose so. I've never really seen there be an undeserving winner, you know what I mean? I get that. You could argue maybe sometimes 50-50 or whatever, but the team of the year usually represents the team of the year and it usually works itself out.

14:00Gary Neville: There can't be many of them. Yeah. We used to get a nice trophy if you were in team of the year. It's like a nice little trophy. But I think because it's voted for by the players and like opposition players, it does mean a lot, definitely. This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Disney+. Right, shall we move on to... What's this? Is this another chat GPT? Is this the running order? So we've decided to do... I really like it. So basically... It's a change of colour this week, isn't it? Basically, rather than just sort of... Is that the green and gold? Yeah, I like what he's done there.

14:41Really clever. You can stick to football and go for the green and gold. It's layered. It's basic knowledge. It's basic knowledge.

14:49Gary Neville: Hurricane stats, Cain Ballon d 'Or, biggest cup shot. We had the biggest cup shocks on there, just in case we wanted to get into Fleetwood. And then, what's the biggest Carabao and FA Cup shocks? It was the Hereford one, the York one against us, Northampton against Liverpool. What was the York one? York beat us in the... I remember Arsenal. Really? You lost the Wrexham. You lost the Southampton, that was a big shock. What's that doing there? Carra Charity Toro? You missed it last night about it. Carra... Oh, you made me guess. Oh, sorry. Have you got a charity you want to promote? Do you want to do it?

15:20No, we've got some guests here from charity. We raised some money. The guys at the back there. Well done. Well done, guys. What charity is it? What charity is it? Go on, give them a shout-out. What charity? So, Paul, what was your charity? Or the ball? The what, sorry? Sedulo.

15:34Gary Neville: So his own foundation. Oh, Sedulo. Paul, I know Paul. There you go. Sedulo Foundation, there you go. Yes. Right. Well done. Right. Right. Right, Manchester United. Wow. I'm just going to throw it open. All we do is talk about Man United. I know. I know. I think we should this week. Isn't there a stick to United so that we don't speak about United? Why do we just put that old clip in? Man United's done work. Man United back.

15:59Ian Wright: Man United have got City off the back pages. They're always on top of City.

16:06Gary Neville: Roy, I'm going to start with you. City off the back pages. You don't have to. I'm just going to start with a general question. What do you make of what's happened in the last week, going from Como through to Bournemouth, and then obviously the news yesterday that Michael Carrick would continue. What do I make of it?

16:26Ian Wright: Can I just say, do you think they're just getting him through? Because these next run of games are quite tough. Do you think they're getting him through those runs? You hope, obviously, like any manager, when you get a little bit of extra time, you hope, obviously, you can turn it around. The game's coming, though. But again, the performances, obviously, recently have been shocking. and there's been a lot of whatever the media spins it's obviously towards the manager now obviously a lot of maybe not sympathy people taking pity on him a little bit which I've said before I don't think that's a good place for a manager to be the performances against Como even that was kind of forgotten about because of Bruno's comments after the game do they care enough to players people talking about the board level and the owners you can start talking about fucking Rocky Gibraltar if you want how far do you go back and that's not a quick fix but I think for a starting point for the players again just show a little bit that you care that's the starting point obviously the sort of stuff has to be fixed you think last week we're all watching football we don't like sitting around watching managers get sacked but that's the first thing when managers get sacked we say well it's a results driven business everyone says that Burnley manager lost his job Bromley manager lost his job Crawley manager there's people who've done they lose their jobs and I bet you the first thing they say is well the structure no no I didn't get enough results so he's a he's in trouble with that group of players isn't he he's in trouble and the problem is we're not talking about the players he needs the players more than they need him they got him the job last year he got a two year deal on the back of it they're now obviously whatever's happened pre-season energy levels Bruno's not performing Keeber's making mistakes all these basic things they were doing really well last year they had a bit of momentum they can't get it this year don't know what happened pre-season did they come back too early Bruno has come back off the World Cup keeper made a big mistake at the World Cup have they lost a little bit of confidence whatever all the stats about running I know it's not good look at the goals far they've won one game get well beaten by Brighton in the cup it doesn't look good but I'm glad he's been given time and I don't mean that in a nasty I would say that for most managers if he's getting another opportunity but as soon as they lose another game if they lose to Chelsea on Saturday it'll be the same conversation on Sunday people are watching the TV looking for a man to lose his job that's what you're waiting for

18:42Gary Neville: were you expecting it after Sunday probably yeah I did and even with the managers with his reaction walking on the pitch again I don't get that bit walking on the pitch after every match but that's a bit of a side issue Roy I thought I was in the stadium I thought that effectively was a farewell lap I thought it felt like to me but even the one in Como the stuff in Como seemed a bit weird and it's I don't listen I don't get all that I don't know why managers do that but that seems to be the part piece of the moment lots of managers we go back to it are the players playing for him Also, the players are contracted to Manchester United, not contracted to Michael Carrick.

19:16Managers will come and go. But if the players aren't, and they don't... When people go, they might care, but they don't care enough. They don't care enough. And we talk about stats. I've always said to people, your stats are important, of course, particularly for goal scorers or whatever. And I always felt if you're a midfielder, if you just cover the yards, even if... You have to be smart with it, I get it. Surely that's on the manager, isn't it, Roy? The runnings... Well, I don't know about that.

19:38Ian Wright: They've got to be fitter than they are. But I always think if you run a bit more, you might get the break of a ball. You might get a little bit of luck. But the goals they're giving away, the gaps in the team. When he got the job last year, and Carrigan in there, people said, we said it from day one. We didn't think he was probably good enough long-term. It's all right, we've said. It's all right, managing a few games. All of a sudden, you've got to manage the football club. That's pre-season, expectations, recruitment. You do. You are involved in that. And they were getting results last year.

20:02But now, all of a sudden, and when he got results last year, people said, you've got to give him the job. Why? Because of the results. No, they're not getting the results. Oh, it's the board. it's Wilcox it's somebody else it's all part of the package I get it all the culture the training ground I'd love to know what happened pre-season but Michael Carrick his coaches have Johnny Woodgate Holland they're still lucky boys to be involved at Man United but they have to they have to grow a pair and start getting results on Saturday get a result at Chelsea they kind of had it at Leeds but we're hearing again we're hearing lots of stuff coming out players are training well last week they're a good group someone's apologised blah blah they went to Leeds After the match again, this idea we've got to draw at Leeds.

20:41You're like, what's your expectation? But then I give them a thumbs up. Yeah, you dug in, you got a result. Then what happens in Como? The mighty Como. I watched Como the week previously away at Feyenoord. They were desperate. I think Feyenoord beat them 3-1. Then United go there and lose 4-1. It could have been 6 or 7 against Como. Then you think, like all of us, setbacks is part of sport. What do you want as a manager or player going, lads, we need a reaction to lose at home. We're not getting a tackle on anybody. Then you leave your best player out, Bruno, who people have sat on air going, he's great, he's the greatest, he's a great leader, blah, blah, blah.

21:14But you know what? People have the right to be wrong. Your best player last year... I sent him that message, now he's using it. No, no, no, I would have said that anyway. Truthfully, you're looking at your best players out of the team, you're thinking, if we win, it's two fingers to Bruno a little bit. But then there's a bit of a circus act, statements from players after the match, statements from the manager. and all the other Carrick he's now doing speeches to this press he's the press he'll be like no we'll answer the question don't come up with speeches about the past you have to show that you care a little bit that's the bottom line we've always said it was a business United always we knew it was a business when we played but we know the football hopefully the football is the start but now it's all about the business maybe United deserve all this they're cutbacks they're with their tree people fans protesting getting rid of season ticket holders ex-players funds do you know what Suck it up.

22:06Saturday, just show you care. Show you care a little bit. I think the players need to take responsibility. When I was watching that Como game, I messaged in our group saying Bruno's just going to get frustrated. But I don't know, did you have managers where they give you the game plan, but when you go onto the pitch, they're like, if you see a problem, solve it, you're all footballers. And he just kept pressing and obviously the others aren't going with him because they're thinking of the players on their shoulders. But I'm thinking if I'm in that game, like, I think he was nine years old, at times I'd be like who's going just sit in let's just sit in get to half time stop running around throwing your arms around and let's just shut up shop get to half time and then readdress it but there doesn't seem no communication or anything when they got the job last year the first thing they were a bit more compact in Brune and Brune had runners and people were playing well and they keep making good saves they've stopped doing all that now they're not compact Bormick Bormick are having a field day hey we're not talking about Bayern Munich here someone ripping you apart other teams are going Como play a coma after the game I must have been thinking, wow, how easy was that?

23:05The thing that when I saw the team, we were doing the game at Sky, when the team come in, you're wondering whether Bruno's playing or not. And whether you like him or not, he's a talented player, he's a perfect player of the year last year. But when you looked at United's front four, Bournemouth's front four was better. And I said that before the game, and I wasn't just saying it to like, oh, create a headline or something. You're actually looking and thinking, Ray-Anne, he's better than what United have got. The lad's up front for Bournemouth, better than what Man United have got. And you're thinking, that can't be right.

23:31that just the lack of quality with Man United last season I'm still you go back to last season in some ways probably finishing third was the worst thing that happened you think of Martinez's comments where he said we had a great season last season oh my god thought he lost to Grimsby 12 months ago now wasn't he a manager got sacked and they think they had a great season because they finished third then Carrick gets the job if he's unfinished third he doesn't get the job does he really going forward but I just can't believe how much it's dropped off I never believed Carrick was the man to Manchester United back but I thought could he do what he did last season?

24:05It wouldn't be as good because he had more games in Europe and Cups but could he get them in the Champions League again? Could he finish fifth? And then you go past the baton on to a Champions League manager. I'd love to know the stats of the last 15-20 years where a manager goes in as a caretaker and then he gets the job and things change drastically. Maybe the players see him differently. It might happen with all the good dressing rooms. whoever comes in the new manager a good coach and staff you do you look and go what have you got for us and whether the players are now looking at Carrick the novelties were off last year because he's they've lost that momentum and whatever happened pre-season were they at a pre-season we heard Tillemans going to run it's not too bad compared to Villa all these little they're not great messages to be listening to so what's happened all of a sudden is he trying to manage more is he doing too much or is he going well I couldn't just keep doing what I'd done last year because no I'm no manager I have to do something different his staff his staff must go in every morning and go whatever happens even if they got sacked next week.

25:00They must be thinking, we've won the lottery.

25:02Gary Neville: This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Disney+.

25:09Some travelers want the charm of an independent hotel. Others want the confidence of a trusted global brand. With Series by Marriott, you get both. Each property is uniquely connected to its destination, delivering local experiences and memorable stays, while being backed by the quality, reliability, and Marriott Bonvoy benefits travelers know and trust. Experience the destination without the compromise. Series by Marriott is part of Marriott Bonvoy. Book direct at Marriott.com or on the Marriott Bonvoy app.

25:40Gary Neville: Active Campaign is the marketing automation platform built for big swings and big dreams. With intelligent suggestions powered by AI and your data. Generate ideas in seconds, import your brand, and create full campaigns with simple prompts. Send personalized messages backed by real-time feedback, smart segmentation, and effortless reporting that tracks every win. Let's redefine what's possible together. Get started for free at ActiveCampaign.com. Mod.com is changing the way people battle excessive fatigue. Ever hit a wall in the middle of the day and a third coffee just doesn't do it anymore? Here's what's actually happening.

26:22Coffee only briefly blocks adenosine, the chemical that tires you out. When it stops working, your system is flooded and you crash. Modafinil is a prescription treatment that works in a completely different way. Modafinil works by stimulating multiple receptors in the brain associated with wakefulness, including dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine, histamine, glutamate, and orexin. It's a more complete solution that gives you 10 to 12 hours of steady focus and energy. To learn more, go to mod.com. Fill out your intake form, meet with a licensed provider, and if approved, Mod Alert ships straight to your door.

27:03Go to mod.com to get started. That's mod.com.

27:14Gary Neville: Rivals is back and Danny Dyer. I love Danny Dyer. I believe you're a fan of Danny Dyer. You're a fan of Danny Dyer, aren't you? We should get Danny Dyer.

27:24Gary Neville: That's what Ben told me this morning, the Fountain of Knowledge. You know what? I said Danny Weber. Danny Dyer's so nice, you know. Rivals is back. Is that the Rudy Shubon? No, Rivals. No, I'm saying Rudy. It's a bit Rudy, isn't it? Yeah, there's sex in it. Yeah, is that what you mean? Rudy Tubes, I said. What did you think I said? I don't know. Have you never seen it? Rudy, what did you say? Rudy what? Rudy Tubes. Is that right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Rivals. There is sex scenes in it. I'm sure they're playing tennis, topless. Yeah, so is that. I've not seen the rivalry. They are, they're playing tennis, topless, so get tuning.

27:58Gary Neville: And the score was lovely. So basically, what makes a brilliant rivalry in football? Who's the biggest rivalry that you've ever had? Club and personal-like player that you've played against. Who's the biggest rival? What, like, on the pitch?

28:11Ian Wright: I think as a club, it's obviously Tottenham, isn't it?

28:14Gary Neville: And then there's a player that you played against. Who's your biggest rival?

28:19Ian Wright: Not dislike him, just... Yeah, dislike, rival. Is this a good question? Oh, God. Remember Keith Stevens from Millwall? Rhino. That's what he said. Rhino's going to get you. He was my biggest rival. Because I genuinely thought that he was going to hurt me. But, like, you just get on with it. But he was easily the right... And the thing is, he went to Australia. We get on really well now. He's a lovely bloke, but I genuinely thought he was going to hurt me when I used to play against Reiner.

28:43Gary Neville: So Tottenham and Keith Stevens. Roy? Arsenal, probably. Arsenal, because of the years. And Patrick, probably. Patrick? Patrick, probably. And now you're friends? No, I wouldn't go out there.

28:54Ian Wright: Yes, you are. You're friends. I've seen you. You're close enough. I saw you in... He was probably like, was he at that gig last night? Yeah. All on door.

29:04Back from Senegal. He was a good one. Yeah, so...

29:09Ian Wright: It's just had to be... Biggest rival? Biggest rival, when I was at City, definitely Chelsea, because it was always us two going for it, and Katie Chapman, we used to just kick the shit out of each other. Literally. So, yeah. Good. Katie Chapman. I'd probably say Chelsea and Everton. Everton just did Merseyside derbies. And just Chelsea, because they were probably the one team... Obviously, we've got a rivalry, but we were never competing with you, really, for the league. But we had that competition with Chelsea for three or four years, Champions League semi-finals and big cup games and that. So I'd probably say Chelsea.

29:43In terms of, what's the player? The player. Bigest rival. Bigest rival. As in like... Thierry. Drogba, was Drogba happy? I'd probably say Drogba as in, cos Thierry was a one-way street. That was just like, there was no competition. No, no. With Drogba it was a good battle. Played lots of games against Chelsea, I'd probably say Drogba.

29:59Ian Wright: What about you, Gal? Gary?

30:00Gary Neville: I'm going to say... Liverpool. Liverpool, without a doubt. And I'm probably going to say Robbie Fowler. We used to have some stuff going on on the pitch with each other. And he scored a lot of goals. He didn't have great banners. Kara sometimes at times. Kara was always obviously... Did you ever think about it the night before? If you were like, was there some players that would get in your head a bit? I knew if I was coming up against Chapman, I'd be thinking about it a bit the night before. Like more than other games. Yeah, I was there. Like a lot. Like a lot had done you a few times on Crass, didn't you?

30:35Remember getting... He's now going through a bit. Oh, God, you always talk about Gavion.

30:39Gary Neville: Roy strikes me and he's like, I didn't see him. Swivel, swivel, Roy. Roy remembers one moment. Oh, no. And Fowler. Did you a few times, then it was once, Roy. Fowler? It was once. Fowler. Oh, in once. No, Fowler. The award-winning series returns to Disney+. New episodes of Rivals, a Hulu original series streaming from 11 November exclusively on Disney+.

31:28Friday from 4pm. Watch on YouTube. And listen wherever you get your podcasts.

31:36Gary Neville: It's just laughing. It's football. Football. Football. In that order. Overlap Daily. We'll see you soon.

31:49I said something the other day, so I was thinking about it. And I use Liverpool because it's my team as an example. Liverpool and Manchester United probably did the teams with one of the most trophies, level Peggham. But over Liverpool's history, Liverpool have had lots of different managers who have won. You've had two giant figures, obviously, Samat Busby and Sir Alex Faggson. But it's not just now. You go back to that time in between Sir Samat Busby and Alex Faggson. What is it about that club? You've been inside it when it was successful, I get that, but there's just something about it. And we say, oh, the structure's wrong, the manager's not what he's doing.

32:23But for that amount of turnover people in so many positions to continually get it wrong. There's something about that club, actually, it's almost... It's that big, people just can't handle it. You've not just got to be a great, you know, a talented manager or a player. You've got to have a huge personality and a figure and like a... You know, like Klopp was. He's not just a great manager. So Slott comes in and wins the league with Liverpool. He's not Jürgen Klopp. But you almost need... Statesman life. Statesman. It's almost too big. You've had managers there who've been very successful and still can't get it right at Manchester United.

32:59It just feels that much of a beast of the size of it. To get hold of it. You go back to whether you're a player as a manager, again, for any big club, obviously a big personality. But you think United's a level up from other clubs in terms of the attention, people can't handle it. There's us, there's TV, there's the press. It's just, I don't know. It just feels to me like the people and the players in Manchester United just can't handle it. You want players to embrace that, obviously. Going back 20, 30 years ago. People obviously, when Cantona came in, Cantona embraced all that and had to call up.

33:30People would go, he's fine on this stage. You know, but when we played, obviously, your memory can play tricks. We had games where we'd be up against it. You go, again, whatever talent we had, we go, whatever happens to it, let's be hard to beat. Yeah. And then hopefully you've got enough character when you're playing in front of 60, 70, 80 thousand. If you make a mistake or you're 1-0 down, you can cope with it. As soon as this team has a setback, it's like, it's over. There's no Bruno or the other players, no one getting together and go, let's just tuck it in lads. I always say that, even if we're against it.

33:59Against Man City, don't be beaten today. Find a way to get a result. I think Ferguson said years ago, when he's looking to sign the player, would these lads be comfortable? Have they got courage to play in front of 60, 70 thousand? Same for Real Madrid, I'm sure Barcelona. That courage to go, we're under the cosh, we're wandled down, fans are restless. No, we're fine. Courage comes in different ways. I'm not going to discourage you. Give me the ball when I don't really want it because we're under pressure. But these lads go under too quick. Are some of them not good enough? Absolutely, they haven't got the quality.

34:28But I still look at Europe and go, just try and win your tackle. Have a bit of pride in your defending. I couldn't imagine walking off, imagine getting beaten 3 or 4 in the little home and you're walking off and you're like, hey lads, let's leave that to do. Because you know how fans, people go, we show appreciation to the fans. Do you know how you really do that? By getting results. That's what fans really want to see. I think when you've been well beaten, you've not tried a leg, and you're going over and you're like, if I was a fan, would I be going, no, no. Should have done it after 55 minutes when you were missing that tackle.

34:59Gary Neville: Fans have turned more than ever before, haven't they, in terms of the booing of the players. I've never seen that level of booing before. Of course. Of course.

35:06Ian Wright: You said a few weeks ago, Gowan, that these will turn quick.

35:09Gary Neville: Yeah, they've turned. I mean, the players have turned. I thought Fulham five, six weeks ago, I was worried for Michael because I thought they'd just walk around the pitch. But why are you worried, truthfully, why are you worried about Michael so much? I told you loads of managers have been sacked over the last week or two. It's not a case of being... No, but he's got... I said he shouldn't get the job, Roy, so I was quite categoric about that. So he's got to turn up and do something about it. Everyone's talking about the problems. Roy, I'll be really honest with you. Michael on Saturday, I think, did a farewell lap around the pitch.

35:35Gary Neville: He walked around that pitch and it was a resigned... It was effectively a public resignation. He was basically saying, I don't think I'm going to be seeing you again. They're going to sack me. I'm sorry, I love you. That was what I saw on Saturday. No one's going to take that away from me in terms of my interpretation of what I saw. I was stunned yesterday when they... I was happy as well, actually, that they hadn't sacked him, but I was stunned.

35:58Ian Wright: Why would you be stunned from that kind of administration? I was stunned because what it tells me

36:02Gary Neville: is that there is almost like a paralysed effect above. It tells me that basically they can't make a decision. And when you can't make a decision as a leadership group or as a leader or as an owner of a club, you're in real trouble. you've got to make really uncomfortable decisions they made the wrong decision we both said last year categorically you said it as well I think they should go and appoint the best manager that they possibly can Michael didn't have the experience to be able to deal with this football club he's only very young in his journey he's done a great job as an interim but pass the baton give it to a Unai Emery or a whoever it would be Ancelotti or whoever it would be that they could get go and find someone with the experience and the statesman like sort of what would be positioning it might not be Carlo Ancelotti it might not be Unai Emery there might be someone else there.

36:44Gary Neville: But on Sunday, they're now in a situation whereby I think they've looked at Eddie Howe and they thought, you've got to remember they got rid of Dan Ashworth. Yeah. Supposedly, because of he suggested Eddie Howe and Gareth Southgate, his manager, they got rid of him. So they can't go back there really. It's a difficult one for them. Psychologically, when you dug yourself in as an owner and you've said basically, no, that's not inspirational enough. We can't go there. That's not the one we want. And then you end up... But it's a strength of an owner as well to say it. We might have got that wrong.

37:10Gary Neville: But that's what I'm saying. So they're paralysed. And then there's obviously Nagelsmann. And you can see why they might be a little bit excited, but a little bit like, is that an Amerim? Is that a Ten Hag? Is that going to work? So I reckon what's happened in the 24 hours after Bournemouth is that they've literally debated it back and forth. I don't know this, but they've debated it back and forth to a point where they've basically got themselves into a muddle. And they thought, well, just stay with him. And I think staying with him is a result of the lack of planning, the lack of probably available options, the lack of decision making around the two people that probably are available and that's when i think you're really struggling because what you've got now and i say this with there's sometimes a manager needs sacking for their own good i needed sacking at valencia i was happy that they put me out of my misery and do you know something i went to see the owners and to be fair i know them and i knew them really well they'd invested with me they were partners of mine and i said i completely understand it and said i would make that decision if i was you because i I would.

38:07Gary Neville: Because that's the way we do it.

38:08Ian Wright: So what are you saying? Michael should say that to him? No, I think what you're saying, I said on Sunday after TV, I think he can never say publicly, I think Michael Carrick would want to be put out of his misery. I really do. I think the thought of going into that training round now, with Bruno, and trying to get them, and trying to do that team talk before Chelsea, when you know the players just aren't having it at all. Those players know that Michael Carrick's not going to be there in two or three weeks. He knows it. They know it.

38:34Gary Neville: Everybody, we know it. Do you know something? A football dressing room, we've all been in football dressing rooms and they're quite brutal places. They are, when lads start speaking about managers, and I didn't have it with United because we never had that level of sort of what would be discontent in the dressing room, but with England I did. And particularly I think around Glenn Hoddle, when Glenn Hoddle sort of turned on Bex and he turned on Teddy and he turned on a few other players. The toxicity and the sort of what would be the sentiment in the dressing room had gone. If Bruno Fernandes, the captain of the club, who actually has been, to be fair, a great performer for the club for six years in terms of his assists and his goals, He's been the one outstanding performer.

39:06Gary Neville: If he comes out and questions the manager's tactics after a 4-1 defeat in Como, where he's played like a drain, and he's been playing like a drain for three months, and the rest of them have as well, that is only 1 % or 2 % of what they're actually saying internally. So what he says about... Those comments helped him. Yeah, no, Michael. Oh, absolutely. No one spoke about the performance against Como. That performance against Como. By the way, the way in which the team was set up against Como was poor. It was really poor. I still don't understand on Sunday, and we're going into tactics here away from sort of bigger stuff but Juri Tielemans was a six he sat in midfield at Villa right and Mount at Chelsea was playing like off the front Mount's sitting in midfield alongside Balaba and Tielemans is playing basically as like a I don't know what he's playing like a centre forward almost what are we doing?

39:52Gary Neville: I know Tielemans can't play with Kobe Main we've established that we don't think he can get around the pitch but he can play with Balaba maybe and certainly on Sunday when they needed to get back into the game in the second half and they need to play through midfield Carrick got the job. Steve Holland was a great appointment. What are they doing? If they're not doing the basic coaching but players in their best position, being compact and hard to be... I can vouch for... Steve Holland is a fantastic coach. He probably is. He's a good assistant. So you can vouch for that because you've seen his work, right?

40:15Gary Neville: My point is I was happy when he brought him in because originally he had just Jonathan Woodgate and Johnny Evans and it was Michael. And I thought he needs something else that can be a little bit more sort of experienced on the training pitch, right? You know, he's worked with top managers. He's been at sort of what would be high-pressure environments. I thought it was a good appointment. The reality of it is now I think Michael was leaving on Sunday night I think Michael was resigned on Monday Morehidton For basically losing his job And they've not made the decision I think because they're paralysed He needs the players more than they need him When you think about football And this is it in a nutshell We're going about The players They know he's gone But these are the same players Who got him the job last year So they're running the show Do you think he likes them now Roy The players There's no way he likes them No way Not when you're watching them perform like that.

41:00No way. But do you think any manager can fix this? Like, I know you're saying about Eddie Howe coming in. I think the way the structure is, it's just like, you keep changing the manager, it's just the same outcome all the time. Eddie needs legs.

41:12Ian Wright: The way Eddie plays, he needs people who can run and... But do you think it'll change the way Man United is at the minute? I was trying to think of an analogy the other day, and I was thinking of Formula One, and I was thinking, you know if you've got a shit car, like shit structure, you can change the driver as much as you want. You're not going to get ultimate performance. Yeah, but you still think United could be doing better than what they are? I don't think we've got the players in it. Why do we focus so much when he got the job, Carrick, even Terpoli manager, and then he got it, we're going, Steve Holland, if that was any other manager, we wouldn't have been talking for hours about the number two.

41:41If the top manager came in, you'd go, he's sorted. But we're going, hey, Steve Holland, he's been a good... No, we wouldn't be talking about the number two.

41:47Gary Neville: But, Roy, the reason that we said last year... Because you'd be looking at the manager and going, he's the man. He was never the man he'd be doing it. But the reason we said last year that Michael shouldn't get the job was nothing personal, it was because we thought this might happen. We didn't think it would happen so quickly, but we thought this would happen, didn't we? We did, we did. Yeah, because what happens, like in anything else in sport and in life, when he's done well for, what, 15, 16 games and he gets it, the key for any of us in terms of, I don't care if it's when you're with your children or my...

42:12It's been consistent. It's doing it for years and years. That's what makes the top managers and players. You keep doing it. So as soon as he got the job, you're like, I know we've had a bit of fun here. And listen, he just knew it wasn't going to work. He just knew it. Because your backup, you go, what's he got? We're talking about other managers. you go, Eddie Hale, whatever, good or bad, whatever you might think, you go, there's a bit of a CV behind him. He's won a trophy. He's won the Champions League. He's managing the premiership, 6-700. There's experience there. With Carrick, you go, he's been in the championship.

42:39He knows the place. He loves the club. People go, I don't have his personality. This has nothing to do with his personality. If I hear one more person, he's a great guy. He loves the club. What's that got to do with it? What's that got to do with it?

42:54Gary Neville: Spoken up a new job. Ultimately, you've got to get players to run for you. Look, Liverpool did this for years, didn't they, where they appointed sometimes managers who basically sort of are emotionally tied to the fans and then they sacked them and then they brought in. Liverpool went through this cycle. Manchester United did between Samat Busby. Manchester United went from Samat Busby to Wilf McGuinness to try and keep it in-house. It didn't work. Then you go to Franco Farrell, I think it was, and it was a Tommy Doherty. Tommy Doherty was the bit more spiky one. Then they went for the safe one with Dave Sexton.

43:21Gary Neville: It was a bit boring. Then they went for a flamboyant one with Ron Atkinson. so you're doing this all the time when you're trying to get it right I've done that I've solved for myself where you think right okay we're going to go for a football man then we're going for a tough man then we're going you try everything and that's what this ownership I think of now but our argument going back sorry our argument was going back who was the best options out there we could pick a few it doesn't mean it's going to work out but you still have to look at the best option that's the thing for me Manchester United the only thing the job of the owners of the football club is many things but they have to pick the best in class manager for the football club because the manager is the most important appointment in a football club.

43:54Gary Neville: Fact. Because the manager can actually cover a lot of ills. If he's a great manager and he can know what a player looks like and he can get the best out of them and he can put patterns in play and he can get what will be a system of working, it can cover and let you build behind other things. If you've got a manager that's not getting results in the first team, everything else gets highlighted. And that's where the spotlight now comes on to. A sporting director who's never done the job before, a CEO who's never done the job before, Owners who, to be fair, have been failing for 20 years. And so the fact of the matter is now we've got a real problem.

44:26Gary Neville: Just want to bring it back to Bruno, right? Because I remember a debate on the show 18 months ago. You had a massive argument over Bruno Fernandes. How have you felt about how he has handled the last week and what he did after the co-month?

44:37Ian Wright: I sent you a message. He's done me up. He's totally topped me up. He's topped me up. Listen, I backed him because of what he'd achieved up to that point. He's dragged that team himself. He's done a lot of work himself and he's probably frustrated now. He's probably given his best years to United and he's probably not going to...

44:57Gary Neville: Does he wish he left, do you think, now?

45:00Ian Wright: There's no way he wouldn't be thinking. Should he go where? It's not even a case of to go where, James. It's just that you think to yourself... He would be thinking, I could have done this, I could have done that. The fact is, his attitude and the way he is, I thought that he would have changed in the way he is. I thought his example on the pitch and dragging him through would be something that wouldn't be poisonous in the dressing room. because I genuinely still believe that he was the one that was loading the gun. I said that he's loaded the gun for McMartinez. It's the way that he came out afterwards and he was so...

45:27Ian Wright: The way he threw Michael under the bus, that you just see that he must be a nightmare in that dressing room. It was because he got brought off. You know what I mean? It's just like... There's the petulance of it. What doesn't help a player? You know, good players like Bruno, when they're taken off and they're on the other side of the pitch... It is a long way around it. A lot of thinking. At least if he's just there, I can go down the tunnel. Even for the managers, I've viewed for the managers whose tunnel isn't behind. You don't want to have the walk down the side. I had a son that was great, he had a bad result.

45:55He walked down the side. Same as follow him and Bernie had to walk across.

45:59Ian Wright: With Bruno, I always thought, bring the players in, bring the kind of players in him that he would respect as well. Because when you watch him, everybody, he's upset with everybody. No one in that team that does something, they might pass it over there and he'll go...

46:13Gary Neville: Let me just play devil's advocate, right? Bruno Fernandes, a fantastic player, PFA Player of the Year. Now, you would put him in that sort of what would be category of the top midfield players in the world. You'd have to. They've just gone to Leeds and they've effectively played like the underdog, Manchester United. They've sat behind the ball. They've played without centre-forward. They've played with Bruno and Tielemans in this sort of what would be strange position. He's sort of sat there thinking, what the hell am I doing here alongside Juri Tielemans in this sort of what would be false centre-forward position?

46:43Gary Neville: My centre-forward's actually playing... At least, Gary, I trust you. You shouldn't be thinking. No, my point is that obviously they've gone to Como. You just said, Como were a bag of shit. They've lost to Feyenoord. The week earlier, the one career. Yeah, so they were a bag of shit against Feyenoord. And he's thought, they've gone to Feyenoord and they've just literally retreated into a ball and played such a defensive tactic. Is he just sat there saying, I'm the captain, we're Man United, what the fuck are we doing here? We're so defensive. Because I didn't like the tactics. I said in the group very early on in that game against Como, I don't like the way we're set up here.

47:10Gary Neville: You're saying that, Gary. No, no, I'm not saying... But you're a goal down to Atletico after a minute. You're a goal down against Coma after a minute or two. So whatever way you're set up. It's not a great start, is it? Exactly. No, I get that. But is he just literally, Roy, thinking about the fact that... And you did a famous interview after we lost to Bayern Munich. It's a completely different day. It actually came up on my phone yesterday. I nearly sent it through to the group. That was the AI stuff. No, no, it was you. It was definitely you. So basically, we win the treble in 99. We win the league in 2000.

47:37Gary Neville: We win the league in 2001. But we lose to Real Madrid in 2000 in the Champions League. and we lose to Bayern Munich in 2001. And it's a real disappointment. And Roy said, this team has basically sort of got to the end of the road. I can see there's a few players who've dropped off. As Bruno got to that same, different circumstance, because we were still winning leagues, by the way. Thanks, Gary. Yeah, exactly. Draw that in there. You had a good front. Bit of context. As Bruno got to that point where he's thought, what are we doing here? This is just not good enough. You know, the tactics aren't good enough.

48:05Gary Neville: The fucking player... No, I think that's totally different. No, but as he got to a level of frustration, I think it's unforgivable to have got Michael Carrick and throw him under a bus. Has he got to the point of frustration? Of course it is, but it's because he got brought off. And this thing in football, we're not saying he's wrong, by the way, as such. It's just that we all know in football, you get a microphone stuck in front of you. You've got to protect other people. And it's not just players to the coach. How many times as a manager, you get beat away from home, 3-0 or 4-0. You've had a bad day.

48:36What about Jamie Carrick's mistake at the back? Oh, it's not like him. I know he doesn't think that, but we've all got to tell lies in football to protect us as a football club, to protect the family that we're in. We'll sort it out in the team meeting the next morning. But he done that because he was embarrassed, walking round, and brought off in the Champions League. I'm the best player. He brought me off. Bruno probably looks at half of them players and thinks, what the fuck am I doing playing with these? That's why he's always throwing his arms about. And that's where it's come from, that embarrassment.

49:03He's thought, you're going to embarrass me. And then Carrick's going, you're getting one off me then. You're just going to see. He was never bringing him on. No matter what the game was, if that game was 2-2 with 10 minutes... I think whenever Trinidadon, I think he should have brought him on. With five, ten minutes to go. If he's trying to put a marker, don't go, I'm going to put you on with Trinidadon. Let's see what you can do.

49:18Gary Neville: He put the young kid on, didn't he? Yeah, of course. I thought he should have brought him on on Sunday. I'll be honest, I was in the stadium. The feeling of it at half-time, you said it in the studio back in London. Him and Kunia had to come on, I think. That was my feeling. I know you're going to make a point around discipline, but you don't have him in the bench. If you're going to make a point around discipline and you're going to discard him from the actual team, put him in the stand. Don't have him on the bench if you've got no intention.

49:41Ian Wright: Yeah, but we don't know what he's put Michael Carrick through in the time he's been there. We don't know why Michael Carrick's done. Exactly, don't mind.

49:46Gary Neville: You've turned on him quickly enough, haven't you? You defended him six months ago. Jesus.

49:52Ian Wright: You were crying here six months ago. He's the Messiah. He's not the Messiah. I was trying to put a case forward for him of how well he'd done up to that point. Obviously, now I've been shot down, but at the same time, Why should Michael Carrick bring him on just because? We don't know what he's done with Michael Carrick. Day in, day out, he must embarrass him. Can you imagine, maybe in a team meeting, he might have called you. You look at Michael, right? There is no way Michael's not in that dress saying, you... Having said that... He's doing that. Having said that, in fairness, apparently he's trained really well.

50:25Look, when he has one session... I'm saying, yeah, if I'm Michael Carrick, I wouldn't bring him on as well.

50:29Ian Wright: I'm going to make my point. Because like you're saying, Michael Carrick, whether he should have gone or not, Maybe, like you said, Michael, the lap. Maybe Michael thought, I'm going to go. I'm not bringing him up. Fuck him. But Michael's got to manage all that as well. We can't keep digging. We can't keep saying character great. That's part of his job is to manage. That's part of management. But Roy, you've been a manager. Last year was football results. Again, the last few months he's got to manage. I go back to, honestly, I'm intrigued. And maybe I overthink things. I'd love to know what happened pre-season.

50:54What were they doing pre-season? That they've started the season so badly. Did they come back too early? Did they train too hard? Do they not train properly? is their intensity in their training the last few games when you're starting where they're starting slowly or they're running out of steam in the second half against Brighton there's every aspect of football you're looking at going they're short in that area you've not seen United yet you're going hey they're not great going forward but I tell you what they're rocks all at the back or the other way around there's nothing where you go there's nothing to hang your hat and they go they're athletic they're big and strong they look like a good group nothing we've spoke to loads of managers over the years going we've spoke to loads of managers over the years I've worked with managers and go do you know what They were a decent group, I give them that.

51:31They rolled their sleeves up. We survived on set pieces alone. People would find something to survive. What will they go to Chelsea on Saturday? How will they survive against Chelsea? Who got well beaten by Spurs last week, by the way? It's not the mighty Chelsea from years ago. What are we all sitting here? Truthfully, every week when you watch, you think United going, what are you going to get? That's no good to anybody.

51:53Gary Neville: Roy, as a manager, you've been a manager. If your World Cup winning centre-half, who is probably the most experienced player in the defence, along with Harry Maguire, comes out and launches into the ownership and the recruitment and the players and the sporting director. Then the week later, your captain throws you under a bus. They are trying times, those. Absolutely. And that's why it's a testing time for the manager. That's part of his job. What's a testing time for an experienced manager? Exactly. Let's just throw it forward now. Because I am struggling to imagine how this is playing out internally right now in that training ground.

52:28Gary Neville: Oh, well. Gary, that's the million-dollar question. Because the players on Monday... You said, Roy, before, we were all waiting on Monday. We were refreshing our phones, thinking, this has got to come in the next couple of hours. This is coming. Everyone, everybody in the country thought that it was coming. And the players will have thought it was coming. And then they go in Tuesday morning, and Michael Tarek is leading training. And then he's leading training today. what is possibly what can he do in the next few days before Chelsea what can he possibly do what does he do tactically what does he do to change it go back to the players right go back to the players at some stage when you play football or you're playing when you're you don't remember Harry Kane when he was eight years of age all of us when we were younger playing football something has to come from within at some stage you have to go what am I playing this game for the manager I might have a different manager next week that has to come from you have to have that pride first and foremost Michael Carrick gave a speech last week, he mentioned Giggsie and all these boys and Bobby Jones.

53:24I tell you what, they had a bit of pride. They had performances.

53:27Gary Neville: I think that's the point he was trying to make. Of course, that's the point he was trying to make. But that's... But for these current international players, you're on, but Bruno, that's something we're going, what's he going to do for Carrick? What about yourself? Yeah. At the bottom, even if you're 2-0 down. I remember years ago, you used to get advice off different people. People were always going, you've got to do this. My dad used to say to me, Whatever happened, they get stuck in. Best bit of voice I've ever received in my life. Whatever's happening, get stuck in. I don't get that playing for a manager thing, mate.

53:56I don't know if it's because I only play for one team. I'm the same. Play for a manager. But I never played for a manager. Players do play for managers.

54:04Gary Neville: But I don't get it. What I don't get is, like, I'm taking back to when I was a kid playing football. It's when I stopped playing. Whether it was because I only played for one club and no one bought me, if you like. But if a manager bought me and he was having a bit of a problem, and I'm just about to step onto the pitch to play, am I more tuned in? Because the fella there bought me, or I'm with the next manager who didn't... I play for myself, not in a selfish way. But I always play... Because if I played well, I know I'd go home that night and I could sit and go, fuck, I had to go game there.

54:33Made me feel good. But the thought of going onto a pitch and thinking I'm not going to be really at it now, because I don't like that fella sat there. But if I don't play well, that's going to piss me off when I get home that night that I haven't played well. Well, that's what a service comes into.

54:48Gary Neville: But, Cara, with England, I did see players who, to be fair, found it... Well, that's bad on them. That's not the matter. No, but found it difficult and switched off with managers sometimes if they didn't buy into them. The one thing that I think could keep me going, though, is looking at the supporters in the stands and thinking about what they're thinking and the fact that... Exactly. That's right. I'd say I played more for the supporters.

55:08Ian Wright: I remember myself, me with... It's a good point. With RIOC. when I was playing for Rio I knew that if I went out he was picking me if I went out and I'd just done it sometimes we didn't even speak to each other never spoke to me he spoke all week didn't speak but he put me in a team and I knew he's waiting for an excuse to leave me out of the team so I made sure that I was doing it for myself because if I'd done it for myself I'm going to score I'm scoring and then the fans would see it the fans would still sing in your name it seemed the same with George Graham George Graham sometimes he didn't speak for weeks I had it with Ireland I was never having Mick McCarty, whatever.

55:45Mick wasn't a big fan of mine, but I'd never go into pits and go, hey, still want to win, still want to qualify for stuff. That's where you are selfish. You're a bit of pride. Yeah. Want to do it for your teammates and for you. Sometimes you have to remind teams, when you go there and people go, do it for everybody else, do it for yourself. Do it for yourself first. It's great. Always do it for yourself first.

56:03Gary Neville: Are these players capable of doing that in these next few days? Well, from what I've been told, the modern players, they're a quirky old bunch. I don't mean just United, they're other clubs. It's a funny old bunch, Dan. It's a different one. Different upbringing. Unfortunately, you've got to manage them. It's not about doing coaching sessions. It's about managing a group. Managing a group to lads who are thinking, I'm not having him and he's not having me, but we have to manage it. There's 20 odd players we'd have to carry him. That's management. Doing a coaching session is... Most people can do it.

56:26There's hundreds, there's thousands of people who've done their air badge and pro licence, but managing a group of people and getting them all inside, that's what makes great managers. You get them all inclusive and go, you're part of it. I know you're left out today, but you'll be ready for next week. All these little snippets. Ferguson used to give Ollie and Butty and all these lads who said when I was left out hey don't worry you'll be ready for next week when you get on next week you'll score the winning goal and Ollie was sitting there going yeah yeah I'm part of it whatever hey I'm upset but I'm upset but I'm still part of it nothing wrong with getting upset and being angry as a footballer absolutely not but you still have to carry that still carry your presence onto a football pitch going I didn't like to when the manager spoke to me fined me last week for a nightclub incident but I tell you what it's not going to tarnish my efforts on a football pitch but you know the good leaders the good players this is what I think sometimes when I see the good leaders if you're left out and things are going shit for you things are going shit for the club are you still being the one going giving advice to Shea Lacey on a Monday or a Tuesday like that's a sign of the good leaders when things aren't going well for you are you still giving to the team and I don't see that I see these players where it's only when things are going well but good leaders don't have to do it all that no but I think you should help the environment and the younger players but you do that when you're training and you're winning most weekends and you drive the club forward but are they doing that now listen if you're cranking on Monday morning the last thing you want to do I'm going to put my arm around the young lad I'm looking after myself today that young lad has to survive like all of us sometimes you know the other players they need the young lads to give them a lift it's not all about the arm around the shoulder and this corporate stuff and bullet points and people with their cameras it's about what happens on a football pitch when the referee blows the whistle I've got a bit of care I've been brought up in what it stands for wearing a certain jersey and we talk about the big clubs we played for we were very lucky but I'd like to think we'd done that at school by level I think if I played League of Ireland, I would have done that for core ramblers.

58:12The fact you're doing it for... It's the same principles. It doesn't matter because it's Man United or Nottingham Forest for the great Brian Clough. If he ever came into me after a game or Stuart Pearson and went, are you putting a hard yard in? I'd be ashamed of my life. Don't ever come to me with that. Make sure they never come to you with that. But I think a good leader should still be doing that. I do. It shouldn't just be when things go wrong. But action is when the referee blows that whistle. I've played with other players, by the way, who are good leaders off the pitch. forced to jump out of a tackle.

58:41And they're like, let's have a quiz tonight. Let's have a game of bingo. And I go, no, no, no, I don't want to play bingo with you. When you're jumping out of a tackle after two minutes, people go, what a great lad he is. And he speaks to all the media and he's got his own contacts. No, that's not my type of leadership. My leadership is people on the pitch who do the business. People, Stuart Pearce. Yes. Percy Canton, all these lads. Adams, make sure you mention it. Tony Adams, yeah. Roy Keane.

59:06Gary Neville: This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Disney+. Two more things. You talked about working hard or you just talked about working hard and your personal pride. I can't still get away. I mean, I know that Michael has dismissed the running stats argument, but their total distance covered, they're 18th out of 20. Their maximum speed in the league, they're 20th out of 20. The high speed running distance, they're 18th out of 20. They basically walk more than any other team in the league. Can I ask you something? Between all of us. What I'm saying to you is, My quotes at Fulham a few weeks ago, when I saw them walking around, I thought that's an unusually high sort of what would be amount of time for a team to walk.

59:46Gary, what's your biggest worry? They can't run or they don't want to run. Can they run? Are the midfielders, are they dynamic? Can they get around the pitch? At the moment, there's spaces everywhere, there's gaps everywhere, or they don't want to run. Which do you think is worse? They can't run or they don't want to run? You can always run. Even the players that weren't the fittest could run, if you put your mind to it. Or do you think they can't run?

1:00:04Ian Wright: Yeah, but the managers that they've been linked with... I've been run properly. whether it's Conte or Nagelsmann or... Eddie. Or Eddie. Their teams have to run.

1:00:14Gary Neville: Do you know what I think? But I can't believe we're sat here. So they're going to need... Even if one of them came in, they need... Just to pick up on a couple of quotes of Michael's. One was that he dismissed the running stats as being... He finds it strange that people are looking at running stats. But in response to Bruno's interview last week, his response was, if they're not going to run forward and not going to run back, then we're not going to win football matches. So he's almost, in some ways, he's actually outed it himself. Yeah. So. Eddie Howe, Conte, Nagelsmann. I played with Michael Carrick.

1:00:43Gary Neville: Michael Carrick, believe it or not, was a positional player, but he wouldn't think that his football team shouldn't run. So those running stats are an absolute stain on that group because the reality of it is, you can be clever and say that we're a positional team and that we're winning football matches and we don't run. But if you're losing every single football match, which they are, and you're not running. And that's on him, right? Surely. That is on him. I thought they switched off on him at Fulham. I thought they switched off and they basically looked disinterested and for the first time actually under probably any manager because I think I've never accused him of not running and if you're on about Carrick's strengths you're on about Klopp personality rock and roll football from Dortmund brings it to Liverpool took years lads getting used to the injuries trouble sessions Pep and astute what are we saying about Michael Carrick what is Michael Carrick good at from his time at Middlesbrough and obviously his time at United what would he say listen whatever he's quiet but I tell you he's astute Are we going to say that about him?

1:01:36Or is he a big personality? His team are going to be amazing at set-piece. They're going to be big and strong. No. So if we're talking about managers working at the big clubs or the managers I've worked with, what would you say a carrot has if you're saying he's kind of dismissing this running stuff? They're not amazing at looking after the ball. They're certainly one of the worst teams out of possession. So what are we saying? What's his traits as a man? What does he stand for? You said he's a great lad. He was in the England squad. What was his personality like when he was in them groups where people are going, I tell you what, listen when he speaks, he doesn't say much, but I tell you what, when he does say, I'm all ears.

1:02:10What does he do? Besides being a great lad? There won't be so much there, right? That goes bad. That's not a criticism. It's the fact that he's not the level of manager on an elite manager. That's what we're talking about. But he must have something, though, Jamie. He's managed middles over 100 games. He seems level-headed, doesn't he? He doesn't get too emotional. He will understand the game. But it's his face, but when you're talking about the... He's level-headed. When we're talking about the running stuff. Is that a good trait? I like a manager who loses the plot every now and again. When we're talking about the running stats, we all know sometimes, no matter what training you, you've got someone in your team who's a flying machine or is a great athlete and somebody who can't run.

1:02:43So basically, if they've got players in the team who actually, you look at someone like a Tielemans, no matter what training these do, he's not going to be an athlete. Okay, then you look at the organisation of the team. So if the organisation of the team is poor, it means Tielemans has got to run more. So basically, he's having to cover more space because this team's all over the place. When you see Tielemans at Aston Villa, you don't have any of these teams like that. So Tielemans doesn't get exposed. So you've got the set-up of the team by the manager. Then have you got too many players in your team who can't run?

1:03:08And then you go back to pre-season. And you mentioned it before, Roy. But actually, what was happening in pre-season? Now, there was a clip I saw. I think Gabriel Ferdinand was interviewing Tielemans in pre-season. And he said, what are you doing? Has it been tough? Has it been hard? And Tielemans almost smiles and laughs a little bit in jokes. Now, I don't know what they did. now it doesn't smack of a team who have been pushed to the absolute limit when you've got Michael Carrick in his autobiography I think he had a pop of David Moyes after Ferguson left about saying Moyes was talking about our running stats and he said we were never bothered about running stats at Man United and he said last week in the press he said everyone's talking about this pressing at the moment everyone's obsessed with pressing and he told them dismissing so whether you like it or not when your team's not doing well I think as a manager or a coach as you've said before you better not be at the bottom of that now it's not the be all and end all but if you're not doing well as a team you think well okay that's almost like let's make sure that's right and I don't think he believes in it and I think about what's happened pre-season that's his chance to put his thing into the team physically tactically because I'm not Ruben Abernens didn't go well but I think there was a feeling they were worked as a team and maybe on the back of that with one game a week they've looked fresh finished the season well but he doesn't believe even the sort of, it seems to me, going off a quote, going off a biography.

1:04:31Ian Wright: No, I was just going to say, see, when you say about the running stats, the reason why you said Man United never worry about the running stats, because it's not something that they had to worry about, it was something that was just done. Exactly. If you went back to any of our training sessions, back to when we all played, and if you could hear communication with the players, right, whatever, and we were in teams who were successful, to be fair, I guarantee if you could just listen to the players chatting in training or on a match day, if you could, I bet you it's get back in, Tuck in Run the lines You'd be like Tuck in Get back in Goal side The first thing You win a header And that other midfielder Picks it up And you go Your ranks That would be the communication So this idea That there's a magic wand out there That some manager Is going to come in and go I'm going to turn these lads Into unbelievable players They might get a bit more confidence A bit of momentum Huge in football Like Kyra got when he got the job But a lot of our chat Where people are saying Don't worry about the running stats I bet your communication Back to our training sessions Get back in Nip Tuck in What are you doing over there that's communication Old Trafford

1:05:28Gary Neville: Old Trafford always feels like a massive pitch I'm on a button training as well but Old Trafford feels like a massive pitch and Manchester United to be fair identity has to be that they're a running team they've always been a running team and I'm sorry it isn't changing now for any coach or any manager no matter who they are running is absolutely paramount for Manchester United players from box to box you have to be able to basically as wide players go up and back you have to be able to sprint forward you have to be front at full speed the fact that you're 20th in high speed distance or in maximum and running speed is shocking I'm just going to say it there no Manchester United manager can have that record of the lowest running stats and lowest running speed because Manchester United is a running football club the wide players the full backs the midfield players they have to run the forwards have to run I don't care I'm not listening to anybody who's going to tell me anything different so that's an absolute nonsense this running stats they have to be higher than 20 and 18 and 16 I want to move on to the ownership because I know that ultimately you can say the players have got to do better the manager's got to do better the executive have got to do better but if we look at the ultimate owners of the football club and that's the Glazer family and ultimately they've been there now for a long time but they've not been to Old Trafford now for five years since Super League and by the way every Super League owner should have been fined 150 million quid the 11 million quid they got fined and they're smart by the way not going to Washington the last five years yeah smart cookies that's mad but they own the football club there's 1.2 million pounds worth of there's 1.2 billion billion pounds worth of debt in that football club right now they're hamstrung in some ways but they've spent an absolute fortune also on players they've spent just under Man City City I think in the last 15 years they spent 1.4 billion on players the second in the spending but a lot of it's on the never never a lot of it's on the you know it's a lot of it's debt a lot of it's they've got a lot of them.

1:07:04They still owe about four to five hundred million. I think they

1:07:06Gary Neville: owe hundreds of millions on players they've owned hundreds of millions on their overdraft and they got hundreds of millions in debt that's Manchester United. How did the Glazers get involved in the first place? We know that Roy right the Glazers the Glazers the Glazers have to sell now yeah They have to sell. I'm sorry, time has come.

1:07:24Ian Wright: So you buy a football club and then you buy a football club and you sell the football part of it. Someone else... That's what I'm saying. Sell the football part? There's a horse involved in this. No one wants to talk about the horse.

1:07:38Gary Neville: Can we talk about the horse? They've now... Horse is key. They've subcontracted the football department out to Ineos. Ineos are now trying to run the football department. The football department have now had three years of struggling and failing and now, to be fair, it looks like they're struggling again. Right? Surely, the Glazer family, over there in America, in Tampa, they're very popular over there. They go to every game, apparently, I hear. They go to all the NFL games. They've never been to Old Trafford, hardly, in 20-odd years. Well, they won the Super Bowl a few years ago, so they're going to be popular there.

1:08:07Gary Neville: So my point is, they have to sell now. Enough is enough. You know what? The club's in debt. You've not spent a penny on the stadium. You're basically trying to borrow now$2 billion for a stadium that you don't know how the hell you're going to borrow. you've got basically a failure of a 13, 14 years in the football side you've subbed it out to someone else which is just ridiculous and knocked up responsibility are they business people Gary? but the point is alright but Roy do they now is it now their point Roy where they just have to sell? who owns Valencia? Peter Leib when was the last time he was in Valencia truthfully no but his son's there all the time yeah but him yeah but he's not been there but his son's there all the time yeah but they keep on to these things because they're they're business people I know but Robert this is an asset if you said to you know all the United fans hate you to go 20 years, Roy.

1:08:49So you don't worry about that. Right, 20 years. I'm by sitting in my pool in my Speedos. They're not worried about being able to. That's a sign of all right. They're making millions every year.

1:08:57Gary Neville: I'm not worried if a few people are upset with me. They're not even making millions anymore. Go on. Just one second. Up until three years. They're short their shares. They must have made money. Up until three years ago, they were taking dividends. They stopped taking dividends. They've obviously sold the shares. But now enough's enough. They have to sell the whole club. The whole club has to be sold. The fans have had enough. They've had the go. Stop it, James. You know what I heard? I picture him in the Speedos, aren't it?

1:09:22Ian Wright: The Speedos. You know Harrison with the breakdown? Big Darby on him. Brilliant. Every Manchester United fan should watch Harrison in the breakdown. He said something. He said he would rather Man United in the championship for five years without these owners. They have to go. They have to go. They have to go now. They're not going anywhere.

1:09:41Gary Neville: But you've been there, Cara, where you've had owners. So how did they go, Gary? Would someone come in and give them a chip? Yeah, a lot of money. Like billions. They'll get a lot of money, but, Caro, you've had owners at Liverpool, I think. You had, obviously, was it Gillet and... Hicks and Gillette. Hicks and Gillette, sorry. And you had, obviously, ownership. If you've got... I mean, Manchester United fans now, for 13, 14, 20 years, have not liked the Glazer family, but they were accepting, in some ways, under Sir Alex Ferguson because the football was still successful. There's now just a complete and utter failure for 13, 14 years.

1:10:08Gary Neville: Enough's enough. If this was Liverpool, they'd be protesting on the streets. They'd be literally... They wouldn't last this long. There'd literally be a ship going over to Tampa, right, of 50 ,000. There would be. You'd be protesting in this. I mean, United fans have protested. The bank, the supporters and the banks, I think, at the time... Listen, I can't remember. I think it was like the... Was it a credit crunch of 2008? Yeah. I'm not saying that's basic knowledge.

1:10:37Here it is. Basic Rocky knowledge. Where's the basic Ben?

1:10:40Ian Wright: Leave it on. Basic Ben. I was going to know when he's lying, when his lips are moving. So it's the supporters and the banks, you know what I mean? But even though you're saying the old 1.2 billion, it's still a successful business for them, isn't it? They're still raking loads of money, aren't they? How? Because they're not getting dividends anymore.

1:11:01Gary Neville: Actually, to be fair, now are really struggling. They're just sitting on their investment. They're now making a lot of money in the first place. No, it's gone down. They're struggling. I think to get any money out of it right now... They haven't made money, don't you? Surely go. Ian, of course they've made money, because they took dividends out for 15, 16 years.

1:11:15Ian Wright: Yeah, but then why should they sell it? They're making money, they've made money. They've made a profit.

1:11:19Gary Neville: So you're saying they're not making money, so you should sell it. Ian, you've seen how the Kroenke family have turned it round. They were popular with Usmanov, was it? It was Usmanov. But they've turned it round through, basically, the Kroenke family taking control, Josh Kroenke's taking a real sort of what would be...

1:11:32Ian Wright: Once they've gotten 100 % control, bam, they've started to...

1:11:35Gary Neville: So my point is, a change of ownership is the biggest thing that's going to impact Manchester United now because a change of manager, a change of sort of like Jason Wilcox or Omar Baradar, that might have an impact. It could improve things, no doubt, and they could be doing a lot better. But this is a systematic failure now for 15, 20 years. It's systematic failure. It's shocking.

1:11:54Ian Wright: Surely they should be, you know, because the due diligence with them coming in in the first race, with the Premier League saying, yep, yep, you're good enough to be managers here. Surely they should put a kind of time limit and say, you've done nothing for this football club. You've actually done nothing. Yes, they've spent the money, but they've literally fleeced it. Are the fans happy? Oh, no, the fuming. Exactly. So at some stage, when did they start thinking about the feelings of the fans and what the fans want? Because Man United, the way it's going now... They don't seem as fans, they're customers, man.

1:12:23Ian Wright: It's just they don't care, doesn't it? So bad. And you know the thing is... You can't see... They won't sell, will they? They'll just... What am I selling for? You lot don't bother me. I'm over here in Tampa, in my Speedos. What can happen with...? I can just see him by the pool now. Can you see him by the pool? They don't care enough. They just don't care. When we put the social stuff on, we've got to get an AI out of one of the glazes. Like that with a pair of Speedos on. Do AI with all of us in Speedos, obviously, except Jill. I don't mind. Plus in Speedos with a cigar. You probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

1:12:57But, Gal... They've got a big ranch and they've got a horse in there as well. A horse, yeah.

1:13:02Ian Wright: Gal, the question I wanted to get to, a long winded to her, Can they be forced out now? Because it's theirs, isn't it?

1:13:09Gary Neville: The problem is, Ian, that you've got a fan base that is loyal beyond ridiculousness because they'll fill the stadium with 75 ,000 every single week. I think ultimately, say, for instance, there was 20 ,000 in and all and there was basically an empty stadium. It was losing money. The sponsors walked away. That's when they'd have to sell. They'd have to dump it. But the fact of the matter is they're still filling the stadium. Fans are still there. They're still thinking they can get... Look... But who could buy Man United? Just one more thing. Gary. need a new stadium one more thing Roy in America now sports clubs NBA NFL I think the last transaction was at Dallas Cowboys was 12 billion or something like 10 billion they see over in America the Washington Commanders have gone for 6 billion or 7 billion so they look at Manchester United and think 5 billion 6 billion that's that's more important than Washington Commanders or whoever else they're thinking they want probably 9 or 10 but they're thinking that level of money I think I think they think it's cheap still the reason they're not selling and getting them on is they don't think they've maximized it yet that is it I think they're thinking that sports clubs and investments are going up and that it's worth maybe seven Liverpool I think have just raised money at through Jeff Bezos is thinking at 6.57 yeah so if Liverpool 6.57 they'll be thinking we're seven we're eight you know we're not five six anymore that you know Liverpool just done this transaction with Amazon and there it's seven something like that although five is five five six but they'll be thinking well we're more so why would they sell then my point is Why would they have said if they think there's more to come, Gary?

1:14:35You're saying they have to sell.

1:14:37Gary Neville: I get it, but surely there comes a point whereby they have to sell now. You think there's something inside their conscience is going to say, we should sell now. They're not going to do that. The thing with Ineos, though, is that, obviously, you're talking about subcontractors, they're running the football club. Yeah. Can the Glazers get them out? I don't know the structure of the deal. They're making really poor decisions there, aren't they? Every manager's decision they've got wrong. How did they, in terms of their own, could Ratcliffe sell his? I suspect... Can someone buy that and put it in?

1:15:05I don't know how it works.

1:15:06Gary Neville: Look, when he came in, I think he put in 350, 400 million, Jim Ratcliffe. Bloody hell. Of cash. He's obviously paid them 1.2 billion or 1.5 billion, whatever he paid them as well, by the way. So he's put in a lot of money. He's got cash on that. He has got cash on the table, so he'll be hurting, because obviously if it's going down in value. But it's a mess there. Ineos have come in, they subcontracted the football division. That's not going well. You said it the other day. Ten Hag, keeping Ten Hag on, appointing Ruben Amirim, getting rid of Dan Ashworth, now having Michael. That's four big calls that have gone wrong, badly wrong.

1:15:37Gary Neville: So the Glazers must be there in Tampa thinking, what conversation is going on between those two? That must be difficult.

1:15:43Ian Wright: That's a lot of money as well. The Glazers can't be. I don't know. What to spend on them managers they're getting rid of? I know, I know.

1:15:49Gary Neville: And again, is it... They could have bought another player. And then they haven't got the players they wanted, like Anderson to Nali. Is it because, look, they didn't sign the players in the summer that they wanted because of money right if they wanted Anderson they wanted Tonali they wanted Fernandez but they didn't want they didn't have the money even if they could have okay so number one they didn't have the money they didn't buy a defender they didn't have the money is now the decision not to change the manager because if you bring Conte in or if you bring Eddie Howe in or if you bring in Nagelsmann they're going to cost a lot of money and by the way you've got to get rid of Michael and pay all his team up so that's another 10 or 15 million and then

1:16:28Gary Neville: Michael so is that is that the reason that basically the changes I don't can it be that it could be money that they've not changed the manager that's why they've got to give him a better chance right I haven't got the money soon it'll cost them it'll cost them right Ian if they're getting rid of Michael and his coaching team let's that cost 10 million and I'm making it up well let's say seven a million let's say seven or eight million but also let's say Michael's on X Eddie Howe Nagelsmann and Conte are on triple X so it's going to cost them a lot more money than they thought and the coaches will be a lot more as well so it'll be 10-15 million if you had Michael's payment and the coaching staff and then the uplift on the new coaching staff you're talking about a massive what if there's an uplift in results like Carrick got last year and all of a sudden you get those people go we're known to Champions League that's bringing extra there'll be a benefit of somebody coming in and getting better results I think the league is so poor this season I think they're thinking I can give them another three or four weeks and still probably finish with like I think we can still probably get to like top five I think I need to get this you were talking about a year or two away from the league I never forget that United right now

1:17:41Ian Wright: Top five this season. Really, Lee? Top five. We've got to have a bet. That's a point to finish on, isn't it? After all that.

1:17:49Gary Neville: If they stay with the manager, Gary.

1:17:54Ian Wright: There we go.

1:17:54Gary Neville: Statement. Michael Carrick and Bruno Fernandes have met face-to-face to clear the air, with both men vowing to focus on turning Manchester United's season around. It's all sorted, I think. Wow, great. You're on top five, Gary. Is that changing the manager or sticking with the manager? Well, if Michael's results don't pick up, they'll obviously change and I still think they'll go on a run and finish top five. Wow, Gal. Where do you think Manchester... All right, OK, let's finish with this. Oh, God. Let's go on record. I think Manchester United will finish fifth this season. Where do you finish?

1:18:21I think Manchester United will finish eighth. I was going to say tenth.

1:18:26Ian Wright: Me too. I'm going to say tenth, twelfth, tenth. No chance. Not eleventh.

1:18:31Gary Neville: I'll donate to a charity over here. How much? I don't know, what we pay? What's the bet? Bag of sand.

1:18:37Ian Wright: A bag of sand Give him that I'm going to say I'm going to say that You said 12th

1:18:43Gary Neville: 10th or 12th

1:18:44Ian Wright: 10th, 12th What is it though? 11th

1:18:51Ian Wright: 11th? Then I'm going to go 10th 10th It's still shit for United It's not like

1:18:56Gary Neville: Oh 12th 10th stop half 10th Roy He's with me You and me No no There's no way If he says They change the manager Yeah Where will they finish This season? You're going to be in the bottom three going into the international break. Yeah. Wow. Do you think they'll lose the next couple of games? I think so, yeah. Do you think that's why they haven't brought a manager in? The thing about United, how bad they are now. They've had the easiest run at the start of the season. They've played two promoted teams, Fulham who were bottom of the league, Spurs were bottom of the league when they played them. They've only played one of the big boys and that was at home against ten men.

1:19:33So the next three are Chelsea away, Villa at home and Liverpool away. I reckon the way they've done their pre-season is they get stronger. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you want to put another manager? Gary! They get better again.

1:19:45Gary Neville: Hey, you've not given us a position yet. If they change their manner, I'd still think they could get seventh or eighth. Seventh or eighth. Yeah.

1:19:53Ian Wright: Which one? Seven and a half. Do you have to go with one? You have to pick one. I need to add some more into mine. So anything further than ten, you have to put extra grounds. So if they finish 11, 12, 13, 14, you have to put more. You have to put an extra grand on.

1:20:07Gary Neville: This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Disney+.

1:20:16Mod.com is changing the way people battle excessive fatigue. Ever hit a wall in the middle of the day and a third coffee just doesn't do it anymore? Here's what's actually happening. Coffee only briefly blocks adenosine, the chemical that tires you out. When it stops working, your system is flooded and you crash. Modafinil is a prescription treatment that works in a completely different way. Modafinil works by stimulating multiple receptors in the brain associated with wakefulness, including dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine, histamine, glutamate, and orexin. It's a more complete solution that gives you 10 to 12 hours of steady focus and energy.

1:20:58To learn more, go to mod.com. Fill out your intake form, meet with a licensed provider, and if approved, ModAlert ships straight to your door. Go to mod.com to get started. That's M-O-D dot com. Some travelers want the charm of an independent hotel. Others want the confidence of a trusted global brand. With Series by Marriott, you get both. Each property is uniquely connected to its destination, delivering local experiences and memorable stays, while being backed by the quality, reliability, and Marriott Bonvoy benefits travelers know and trust. Experience the destination without the compromise.

1:21:39Series by Marriott is part of Marriott Bonvoy. Book direct at Marriott.com or on the Marriott Bonvoy app.

1:21:49Gary Neville: The Super 6£1 million jackpot is still waiting to be won and will stay at£1 million until someone predicts all the correct scores. All you need to do is predict the correct scores of six football matches this weekend. Get all six correct and you could be walking away with a life-changing£1 million. And it's completely free to play. 18 plus, terms and conditions apply.

1:22:16Last week, Gary and Stevie got nine points. That's good.

1:22:21Ian Wright: That's good. That's not bad, I'll take the first. If we got eight or nine, I'd take eight. We're at ten or sixteen. We've got one of the highest scores ever. Top 52 % of players, you beat 400 ,000 players. Wow. That's brilliant. So, Ian and Jill, you got 16 points. Wow! How many people did we beat? They got two correct scores. Top 3 % of players, you beat 810 ,000 players. We are murdering them. We've come back stronger this season. Top 3%, that's good, our gal. We should have had Newcastle Villa. They missed a chance. They missed right at the end as well. Will anyone take home the million pounds this weekend?

1:22:58Ian Wright: We're doing so well. Right. City Brighton. Brighton... Who's first? Will's have fallen off. City 2-1. Yeah, City 2-1. Not with our goalkeeper. He's throwing him in at the moment. Oh, they need to keep a City. He's not as good as whatever. Should have stayed with the young lad. You said here, there. Trafford. Trafford. Make a few mistakes. Patience, Jamie. Good for him. Everyone's in a hurry, pal. Erm... Liverpool had a good result, didn't they, against Brighton? I think Ireland might get a few here. I think you'll get at least two Ireland. It's a three o 'clock Saturday. They should have scored a couple against Liverpool.

1:23:32Brighton plays really well. It was a good result for Liverpool.

1:23:36Gary Neville: What's that? Liverpool have picked up.

1:23:37Ian Wright: I know.

1:23:39Gary Neville: He takes too many risks on the ball.

1:23:40Ian Wright: It's just... Yeah, but all of a sudden... It's got to be a City win. Just brought that in now. We've got 3-1. Yep. We can go 2-1. I always think we've come to this, we finish him. Yeah, 3-1. No, no, no, we've got to give him a goal. 3-1, 3-1, 3-1. City, yeah. Yeah. Can I say something about... This is your team, Bournemouth. This is your team. Leeds are hard, Leeds are decent. Leeds are decent. James Hill, Bournemouth, centre half. How good is he? Yeah, yeah. I've seen him, he was celebrating my mum. I think he was from Fleetwood. He was from Fleetwood. He was from Fleetwood as well. The band.

1:24:11Ian Wright: Honestly, have a look at him, bro. James Hill, Bournemouth, centre half. I think he won't be there. You know when a player has a couple of good games, you do go overboard, don't you? No, no. You know what it is, mate? I wouldn't want to play against him. I always look at it like that. He was so aggressive. I like that Ryan. What is he, 19-20? Yeah, he's a good player. James Hill won last year. Someone's going to come and get James. Bournemouth leads. Going back to United as well, the keeper's casting him. I think Dominic... He was a very good last year. I think Dominic Cowellewy nicked a goal in this game.

1:24:41Leeds-Sunderland 0-0 the other day, Barnard.

1:24:45Ian Wright: Dominic's in that five. I want to give Leeds a goal, but I think Bournemouth will beat them. I think Bournemouth might win with them being at home. 2-1, do you want to go Bournemouth? Yeah, Bournemouth. I'm going Bournemouth 2-1. Why didn't you say something then? 1-1. Love that. Right, Brentford Forest, 3pm.

1:25:01Gary Neville: Wow. That's you guys. I think Brentford at 4pm are better than the... Yeah, it could be 2-2. Brentford, I've got a call. 2-1, Brentford. I can never call them teams. I don't know what to say. 2-2. I saw Forest at Palace then. 1-1? Yes. We've got one one. Yeah, let's run one one. Farrah's got a result there last year. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Spurs Palace, Saturday 5.30. This is a big one. Spurs are beating them. Spurs going up the league. Spurs are playing well, you know, they're at home. Tottenham, I think this could be a big win. This one Spurs let you down when you go, hey, it's Dorano run. No, they're playing good, you know.

1:25:35Ian Wright: Hopefully this one is, hopefully it is Spurs-y for Palace. I think this could be like a 3-0. I think Spurs might beat them. I think Spurs win. Two? OK. We've got 2-0, sorry. No, no, no. I just think they're close to a big... 3-1. As mad as his injury, is it a bad one? 3-0, I think. Is it a groin? It's because he's out for so long, isn't it? Have I just made that up? Villa Fulham.

1:25:58Gary Neville: How well has Unai Emery done again, by the way? You think to yourself, oh my God.

1:26:02Ian Wright: Are you saying they want Unai Emery to go to United or something? I can't see him. No way, why would he do that? Why would he do that? Why would he do that? He's done so well. Ibby what? He has done well. Why would he turn that down? Why wouldn't we turn it down? He likes his people around him. Exactly. And he needs time. He has a say, doesn't he, at Villa? Like he didn't get at Arsenal. He needs time. United wouldn't give him that. No. What's the score? It's your goal. I think 2-0, do you? We finished on Tottenham, so has it there? No, no, no. We've crossed. Oh, Villa there. 2-0. Matty Cash, 2-0 against Ducco the other day.

1:26:37I'd always give Fulham a goal. That was a bad one. That was 2-1. We give Fulham a goal. Too bad on it. I can't call this, right?

1:26:44Gary Neville: Liverpool Arsenal Sunday. There we go.

1:26:45Ian Wright: You know, the thing is, I think we beat them. Righty, I'm really sorry, but I would have gone Liverpool. Why? I don't know. You know, the thing is, I think that obviously this is the one that kind of defines Liverpool if they're coming. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're looking at McAllister. It doesn't have to be a win. I'm thinking a draw. Liverpool don't want against City, obviously, up to the end of the night. I'm going to go draw. I think we'll get a draw out of this game. 1-1. Yeah, but deep down I would have went 2-1 for myself. but going 1-1... I would have gone... I really think we'd beat them.

1:27:15Ian Wright: What's your good feeling? I'd have gone 3-2 Liverpool. Go on, go 2-1 then, Arsenal. Yeah, go on. And you're up there in the studio, so you'll feel it. If this is 1-1, you know, he's going to be messaging in the group. I love you, Swat! 2-1 my ass! That'll be me. Come on, you. Go, Jamie. Jamie, what do you think? I actually do think 1-1, but should I just go for Liverpool? What do you think, Gary? 2-1 Liverpool. I'm too biased. Come on, 2-1 Liverpool. Liverpool are bad. 2-1 Liverpool. That's good. If this is 1-1, I'm... Thank you. If it's 1-1, we've rubbed it off.

1:27:53Gary Neville: This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Disney+. Right. Right. Is Nicholas Jackson the most improved player in the Premier League this season? He's doing well, isn't he? I always thought he'd be a good sign, because he's a handful. I'd hate to play against Nicholas Jackson. That's what I'm saying.

1:28:10Ian Wright: I'm sure Ben should have rolled that back. I'm sure I mentioned Nicholas Jackson at the start. I think I said I'd hate to play against him. You know something, when you watch him at Chelsea, right? Yes, he missed chances, but everything else about his game, the way he's on the shoulder, he's touching everything, you think, if he could just start nicking the goal, he'll be fine. And you're looking at him now, he's starting to score the goals. You could actually see the confidence in him now, and you think he could go on a run now. It's up to him now where he goes. Does a striker need, like all of us, you need a certain club, without a job.

1:28:39Time in the manager of Villa. Do you know what I mean? Honestly, I'm not giving you a... A good fit for him. You know what? I go... The reason I'm moving this to sort of the manager because on Sunday I said, you get thrown, don't you? If Michael Carrick goes, and I mentioned Unai Emery, so I've had loads of Villa fans on my case on social media, which is absolutely fine. I think Unai Emery is just unbelievable what he does year after year and that amount of change and we say, it takes time for players to settle and manage to get his team. And he just does it year after year. But my thing about it was, and the reason I'm probably going to have a little go back here at Aston Villa is I can't believe that a manager who's so successful at the Europa League let's say you were a player and you won the Europa League three or four times surely you'd want to win the Champions League that's what I get in my head now I know Villa fans are coming back saying well we could win it we're in the Champions League I get that but Aston Villa will never be Manchester United and I just think he didn't do well at PSG or Arsenal and maybe that's because of the egos of the players maybe lots of different it was younger then Jim it was like younger Yeah, but I just think surely he would want that opportunity to manage a giant again.

1:29:43I'm not trying to annoy Villa fans, but the reason I'm saying it is, there is a chain in football, whether you like it or not. So, Real Madrid will take Man U's best player. They'll take Ronaldo. There's very few above United. Same with Liverpool. But the big teams below Aston Villa, they'll take their manager. They'll take their players. So shut the fuck up, Villa fans. We can't hold the fucking point. You know what I mean? Honest to God. Man United, actually Villa will never be Man United. You know what, Jim, sometimes you're on about United going for certain managers. Managers that do suck at Villa, they're on mega deals.

1:30:15Yeah, yeah. And he's got the control there. He's got all that stuff. Somebody's manager, I've tried that out a bit, I've done the PSG, and he might go, I've done all that, at Villa, I'm calling the shots. Yeah. They were slow to the blocks last year, they were slow to the blocks this year. There's no panic with all of them, because you're going, I'm running this, I'm in charge of all this. He's in control. And again, they're on a mega deal. United probably think, we can't even match that. I get it, and I might be totally wrong, and he might go, oh, no, I'm running the show. I get that, but I just think from Man United's point of view, surely when you hear these names that you get mentioned, you think, OK, he's in the Premier League.

1:30:46He's obviously, I mean, for me, the job he's done, I don't think anybody else could do in the Premier League. I know we talk about Teta's won the league now. People might say he's the best manager. But when I look at a body of work, you're right, Emery, for me, what he's done is crazy. He never seemed to panic, did he, when he lost the players in the end of the season? He doesn't want to lose his best players. He makes the best of it. But surely a manager, you want to keep your best players. You're unfortunate Villa with the rules. I think part of these brilliant coaches, or probably classed as a coach at Villa, he's walked his way up to where now he's got total power and control.

1:31:20I guarantee if United came in from him, bring from Villa what you've got and come to United. You don't want to talk about that. None of that happened. He's thinking, why? Why wouldn't they do that, Roy?

1:31:28Gary Neville: Villa fans will get pissed off with us, but why would United not say bring your five, six, seven people with you? I think it'd be a lot more than that. Oh, eight then, nine. People above him. Yeah, yeah. Because he manages upwards. Yeah, yeah. Because we're told that United aren't going to be changing the structure, are we not? But that's what makes sense of these clubs, and I'm with you, and most clubs now, this director of football, I get it. But when it's that bad? So you're talking about a Manchester United sort of hierarchy. They've made three bad decisions managerial-wise. Recruitment in and out.

1:31:56Why wouldn't you give a guy like that an opportunity? Everything.

1:31:59Ian Wright: Bring everything. Right.

1:32:01Gary Neville: Apologies to Villa fans for being told to shut the fuck up. They're going to come at you more now.

1:32:06Ian Wright: I'm sure that'll be saying, I'm sure Worse will come back.

1:32:33uniquely connected to its destination, delivering local experiences and memorable stays while being backed by the quality, reliability, and Marriott Bonvoy benefits travelers know and trust. Experience the destination without the compromise. Series by Marriott is part of Marriott Bonvoy. Book direct at Marriott.com or on the Marriott Bonvoy app.

1:32:56Gary Neville: Thanks to our title sponsors, Disney+. We'll see you next time.