Elizabeth Rutledge (American Express) | The Customer at the Center of Everything

0:00What if the smartest marketing play is not to move forward, but to zoom out? Deloitte believes the most powerful move a CMO can make is to look beyond the next step and see the broader perspective. That's what the Deloitte CMO program is for, a place to gain fresh perspective and connect with leaders who've stood where you stand. Together, Deloitte will help you see the bigger picture so your next move isn't just fast, but right. Learn more about the CMO program at cmo.deloitte.com. Hi, everyone. It's Jim. I have Matt Spiegel of TransUnion with me. Matt, I want to start with, What do you love about your job?

0:34Yeah, it's a great question, Jim. You know what? I love the fact that I get to be out at events and conferences and working with clients to really think about how marketers solve problems that matter at scale. The job of a marketer is as challenging as ever, and we get to do some interesting things to make their job easier. When you work with a client, where do you get the most satisfaction? You know what? I think seeing ideas come to reality. We ultimately are an enable of great marketing, so we don't do creative. We don't do media planning. We provide the data, the identity insights, the measurement tools that make great marketing possible.

1:03So when we get to see the end product, sometimes later, it's really cool to see. Well, super to have you here. Super to be a partner. Thanks for joining us today. Thank you, Jim. So if you want to turn data into understanding and understanding into growth, visit transunion.com slash clarity. Hi, everyone. It's Jim. I'm here with Matt Spiegel, EVP of True Audience Growth Strategy at TransUnion. Matt, you've spent your career helping marketers understand people through data, and that's harder. and more important now than ever. It really is, Jim. There's really just so much information out there.

1:32And unfortunately, it's often disconnected. Marketers typically see fragments, maybe a purchase here or a click there. But what they really need is clarity, true full picture of who their customers are and ultimately how to reach them. Well, tell me how your solution strategy comes in and helps CMOs and their teams bring clarity to chaos. Well, Jim, we ultimately do that with a 360 view of the customer. And so it's about ultimately combining data, truly trusted data, identity resolution, which is a deep analytical problem, and measurement that actually helps understand performance. So ultimately, we work hard to help marketers move faster, to deepen their insights, and to ultimately make every dollar work harder.

2:11We believe strongly that when you truly understand your audience, you can build a real brand and real relationships with customers that last. Where were you when I was a CMO? I don't know how to answer that. Learn more at transunion.com slash clarity. That's transunion.com slash clarity. So the first brand you remember making an impact on you as a young girl? It's the Ringding. The Ringding? Oh my. Mine's Tasty Cake. So why is Ringding meaningful to you? Child of the 70s. There's a special reason why the Ringding. My dad was always responsible for making lunches for myself and my two brothers.

2:47He had a secret life as an artist. And so he would make these elaborate designs on our lunch bags. But we got to pick between the ring ding, the devil dog, and the Drake's coffee cake. And I always went for the ring ding in terms of what, when dad asked me what he was going to put in the lunch bag, it was the ring ding. Hi, I'm Jim Stengel. I've helped hundreds of major brands discover and activate their purpose. Because when a brand's purpose is clear, compelling, and authentic, Profit Naturally Follows. Each week, I welcome the CMOs, the chief marketing officers of your favorite brands, to speak to how their job is so much more than marketing.

3:28These leaders share their inspiration and challenges, along with how they try to build a full, healthy, and happy life in and out of the office. And it's that energy that reaches everyone they touch. And we're glad you're here to feel that energy and to learn from these remarkable leaders. So here we go. Don't leave home without it. Membership has its privileges. My life, my card. Don't live life without it. These are, of course, some of American Express's most famous ad slogans across history. Today, our guest on the CMO podcast, recorded in person at the Cannes Lions Festival of Creativity, is Elizabeth Rutledge, the Chief Marketing Officer of American Express.

4:05Elizabeth is a unique CMO. She has been at Amex for her entire career of 35 years, and she has been CMO for seven of those years. Amex stock was about$4 when Elizabeth joined. It is about$300 currently. More trivia, American Express was founded in 1850, one of the oldest brands in the world. My guest Elizabeth graduated from Princeton and then earned her MBA from the Stern School at NYU. She serves on the boards of the ANA, the Ad Council, and the YMCA of Greater New York. Here is my conversation with the CMO of a 175-year-old brand that is certainly not behaving that way. here's Elizabeth. And special note, earlier in the day, I interviewed Elizabeth on a stage in the Palace or the Palais at the Cannes Lions Festival.

4:51We will refer a bit off and on about that conversation we had. Again, here's Elizabeth. Elizabeth, welcome to the CMO podcast, Cannes Edition. Awesome. Awesome to be here. Now, this is our second time on stage today. Today, yes. So I interviewed Elizabeth on stage in the Palais this morning as part of the CMOs in the spotlight. You were with two colleagues and you were in a different outfit. I was. So you've changed into purple. So what's the thinking here? Purple's my color. Okay. And I got my kicks on as well. All right. I'm feeling good. Happy to be here. How many outfit changes a day in Cannes?

5:28Usually three. Even for guys, right? It's just sometimes you're so sweaty. You're so grubby. It's been hot here this year too. How's your week going so far? I mean, we're the end of day two. How are you feeling about it? I mean, you're meeting people that are inspiring. Is your team having a productive time? And what's been your strategy this year at this big, big festival? So first, I'm going to start with this morning because it was just a really great opportunity. So thank you for being on main stage. And why I mentioned it as the starting point, I made two new friends, you know, this morning.

6:03And I think that's what some of this is all about in terms of, as we talked earlier, in terms of unexpected conversations, trying to meet people that I wouldn't meet somewhere else has been the focus. I also have my team with me, and I think it's just so important that they get out there, see what's going on in the industry, and learn, meet people as well. And then lastly, you know I'm incredibly passionate about the work. And for me, that's the most important part of coming here. And I think I shared this earlier, but I'm just really impressed with what I've seen. In particular, a couple of the Titanium Lions shortlist really captured my attention.

6:46You know, one in particular in terms of Heineken, in terms of their pub succession campaign. Small business. And you know how passionate I am about small business as well. But what I love about that campaign, it's just like rooted in, you know, legacy, connection, innovation, community. It speaks to me and speaks to our brand as well. So it was fun to see that. I mean, the point you made about you meet people unexpected here. I mean, I think that's I mean, there's lots of benefits of coming here to me. That's probably the Uber one. I mean, for our listeners, we had the CMO of Nestle, who you probably don't hang around with every day and the CMO of Infosys.

7:23And so these are people out of your category, probably out of your normal circles. And we had a great discussion this morning. And this is what happens here. You meet people that are, you know, you leverage lateral thinking, right? And we walked away actually from that conversation, actually making more meetings, you know, sort of to connect about some things that we are passionate about from data and insights, you know, and our core customers and even some of the assets that we know and love and share. So it was great. And I appreciate the opportunity. What did you enjoy talking about most this morning?

7:56For me, it's about the team. And I get really, really passionate about just making sure that we're learning, growing together and, you know, focused on innovation, the capabilities, the insights, knowing the customer. And anytime I get a chance to talk about the team and how to grow and develop others, you know, I'm all about that, Jim. You know, we've done, I've done 370 or so of these shows and building a great team is about the most talked about conversation we have in the show. And it's just people, when I often ask them what they're most proud of, they quickly go to their team. And you did today when we were talking.

8:38So, I mean, my counsel for our listeners is if you don't build the right team with the right culture and the right way of working together and the shared goals, you won't make it. I've coached people in this role and saw them slowly adopt, bring on a team and they failed. So as quickly as you can with love and with care, because sometimes it involves changing the team, you know, build that team. And I think you talked about that this morning. It's such a powerful lesson. I just came from a big P &G reunion. What do we talk about a lot? Teams and people. We were talking earlier this morning about something that is really near and dear to me in terms of the creation of Amex Marketing U and why I'm just so proud about it.

9:26Yes, it has the tools, it has the curriculum, it has the foundational learning for a new marketer as well as a tenured marketer. But what I'm most proud about is actually just the community that it's created out of those marketers across, you know, Amos, we're a global company. I think that that ability to be able to talk to someone else about the passion of your craft and to sort of get inspired from each other, you know, that that's been the most important thing for me in terms of the time in the seat. So you have 35 years and I'm an expert. We're going to talk about in a minute. You've been to Cannes Lions seven or eight times.

10:03So do you consider this the best industry event or the most must attend event or not? When you think about events that you really try to get to, I know we can't do it every year. Is this on the top of the list? It is on the top of the list. And I think it's just the reasons that we talked about before, in terms of in one week, having, you know, all of these amazing people. And it's not only it's just agencies. We were talking earlier about creators, artists, musicians, sports legends, you know, it's just the breath and depth. And I think the scope of the kind of conversations that you can have here as well, I always take away sort of one or two things every time I come as well.

10:47And the last thing I would say, given when we're talking about talent, one of the things that we have been focused on is actually inviting kind of our next generation of marketers to can with us. So to take some of our newer Amex colleagues so that they can have that personalized agenda and experience and go back and, you know, spread the love, you know, in terms of the learnings and to try to be action oriented about what we're going to do out of it in terms of one insight, spark a new brief, you know, drive a new idea, drive a new partnership. And I definitely can tell you that those things have come out of coming here.

11:23I'll tell you a few years back, SC Johnson sent seven young people. I mean, that's a commitment. And their charge was go learn as much as you can and come back and you will have an audience with the CEO about what you want to see the company doing differently. What a brief. No, it is right. And so important that it's not just about here, but how can you pass it along so that those that couldn't go can feel like they were here, you know? Yeah, absolutely. Okay. Well, let's talk about your CMO tenure. You're 35 years in one company and seven years as CMO. So that may be unique. Okay. I mean, I guess Mark Pritchard beat you in years on both, but there aren't many, you know, you're - Shout out to Mark Pritchard.

12:05Yeah, shout out to Mark Pritchard. You're in rarefied air and you're the first woman CMO of this 175 year old company. Now, I want you to go back to 1990 when you joined Amex. and tell us about that decision. What compelled you? What was it like to interview there? Was that a job that happened serendipitously or you were very intentional that this is the company and brand you wanted to work on? Okay. So before I answer that question, we're going to go back two steps to get there. I was a biology teacher when I started out. Oh. Taught ninth graders. Wow. Well, that's good training. Absolutely. In terms of your ability to communicate very succinctly, to pivot.

12:55And also, I think, you know, just lead definitely with empathy. A lot of lessons learned in the two years that I was a biology teacher, inspired by my mom and my grandma, who were both teachers as well. And I made a conscious decision to pick my head up and sort of look out there and an opportunity came my way in terms of working for a company called 9x back then, now Verizon. So I spent some time in telecom. And that's where I first learned about advertising and advertising agencies, a brief, all the things that we've been talking about. And through being there, if I was going to stay in this field, I wanted to work for a company that was led by marketing and who had a brand that was, you know, back even back then, iconic and well known.

13:46And I was determined to make sure that that was my next step. So I spent time sort of networking and ultimately got referred into Amex through a friend. And just, I remember the first day, like it was yesterday in terms of those interviews, the sun was shining. There were, you know, downtown in this beautiful building where we're headquartered. And it just, it like felt right from like almost the first moment in terms of the people that I met. And to this day, and this is really the truth, just the customer at the center, you know, of everything that we do as a brand. You know, I just felt like it was meant to be.

14:30First job there was? Was leading products and benefits for the green card and has evolved since then. And I've had a lot of global jobs, a lot of local jobs. And it's not been a straight path at Amex either. It's not been just marketing, Jim. It's been business development. It's been, you know, focus on sort of product, focus on insights. I've been on the B2B and the B2C side of things. And this is what's so great about Amex in terms of the opportunities, just understand different customer segments, have different opportunities in terms of the functional expertise that I gained along the way. And that's why I've stayed in terms of those tremendous opportunities and the people.

15:14Well, when you were teaching, was it sort of a economics of this don't work or it's not, you know, not really my thing or what do you? Oh, it was definitely my jam. Definitely my jam. But I think, you know, at the time I was just trying to, you know, to figure out how to pay the bills, you know, as well. I think so much progress has been made in terms of what teachers are paid now, but it was tough. And it was a really thoughtful decision because one of the things that I liked about teaching And to this day, like in my job, it's just that immediate impact that you can have. And you probably hear it in terms of the things that I love and talk about now in terms of when someone just, you know, they ultimately got that genetics concept, you know, that you like, and you just saw the light bulb go off and you're like, I helped someone else understand, you know, or unlock something.

16:10So it's something to this day I'm passionate about. And hopefully I have left a little bit of a footprint in terms of trying to train the next generation of talent at our company.

16:28Everyone seems to be chasing the next big thing, the fastest answer, the quickest win. But great CMOs believe the real power isn't in the speed. It's in stepping back to see the bigger picture. That's why everything Deloitte does in their CMO program, from their industry-leading capabilities to their connected network of CMOs, is designed to help you zoom out and gain fresh perspective. Deloitte will help you see the bigger picture together. Learn more about the CMO program at cmo.deloitte.com.

17:02now that in that 35 year career as you look back on it what was uh the most or at least one of the most developmental assignments for you where you kind of were stretched out of comfort zone you know i think about my career at png certainly my first eastern european international general manager job like i was dealing with stuff i've never seen before so what was it for you which assignment kind of put you on sort of rapid drive? So there are a couple that come to mind when you ask the question, but if you look back in our 175 year history, one of the bold decisions about our brand, and it was to push beyond it just being known as a travel and entertainment company in terms of the ability to have the utility to use our products and services in everyday sort of situations.

17:53And, you know, that was not what we were thought of as a company. And for me, it was all about the data, trying to sort of demonstrate the power of when someone was going to use it at the grocery store or the gas station in terms of both the growth and impact for the company and the utility for the customer as well. It was a tough challenge, but I think one that gave me confidence in terms of the data lead the story in terms of, you know, where we went next. And as you know, we certainly, you know, grew to be a card that can be used in all different, you know, for all different experiences and types of spend as well.

18:32But it was a defining moment for me in terms of some of those presentations and conversations I had in terms of us branching out. And not just me. I mean, an entire team. But I learned a lot in terms of the data leading the way. It's a reframing the market, right? It's a company repositioning. That's a company-wide idea. Yes. And you've certainly done that. So well done. I want to talk about three things that I find impressive about your company and sort of get you to riff on those a bit. And the first thing is this, I've known your company as a customer for a long time, and I've known a lot of your leadership.

19:04Your CEO at one time was on the P &G board. But your company has a very strong belief in brand. And that's been true for as long as I remember. It's been true through many CEOs and CMOs. It's just kind of baked into the culture. So I'd like you to talk about that. How'd that happen? Why does it continue to happen? So 175 year history. service security trust. And I think it's back to what I said before, like the customers, like at the center of everything that we do. And that brand promise is something that we take so to heart. And since I've been at the company in terms of the 35 years, it is just ingrained in everything we do from our colleague, what we call blue box values.

19:56And I think it's important, actually. I think the reason why it's enduring, it's sustainable, is while it starts with the customer, it also starts, we call our employees colleagues. I think it all starts with the colleague at the end of the day, because if they have a belief in the brand, then they're going to just extend that to our prospects and to our customers. And so for me, when you ask that question, I think really at the end of the day, it sort of comes down to the colleague first and then everything extends from there. And I think that's why it's been enduring and it's in the halls and the water of, you know, American Express.

20:36It's just it's just ever since I was there from from the get go. And I think it's also just our powerful backing platform that we launched a bunch of years ago, I think, is demonstration of that, both for our colleagues, our card members, and our communities. It's just a strong brand. And you always want to put dollars into that brand bank, you know, sort of along the way. And I take that as a responsibility for all of American Express, but particularly myself and the team in terms of just making sure that we sustain it. Is there anything to do with your rituals, with your awards, with your KPIs, whatever it might be to just keep in front of people that, you know, we're about our customer.

21:20We're about this brand and we're stewards of this brand, but it's bigger than us. It's a big promise. It's meaningful to people. It's meaningful in the world. Is there anything you do to just keep that front and center? Talk about it all the time and remind people of their job, both as protectors and defenders and innovators of the brand and role model that, you know, at the end of the day. And then I think, you know, create these types of programs where people can learn. I'm just all about like, be curious, ask the questions and push the boundaries, but also sort of remember that you have a 175 year old brand in your hand, right?

22:01And you have to treat it with care and nurture it. I think that's what it's all about, Jim. Well, the second thing I thought was impressive. You've already gone there and this is how you think about your colleagues as ambassadors of the brand. So I want you to talk a little bit more about that. You're 70 ,000 or so employees. So that's, you know, not a small lift. And so anything you do, because I think it's a very powerful idea for any company, but you know, how do you make sure that happens? I mean, you say you talk about it a lot, but having 70 ,000 ambassadors of the company who talk about it, who have a similar feeling about it, who express it in their own way, you know, just doesn't happen.

22:37It has to be cultivated. So what do you do to - I'm going to give you an example. When you ask that question, I told you about the powerful backing platform that we launched, I think in 2018. And I made a decision with the team to share every piece of advertising collateral and sort of that core customer centricity with our colleagues first. I think lots of times that doesn't happen. You might be, you know, sort of listening to a podcast, you know, watching your favorite show, and then you see American Express, and that's the first time you've seen it in your own home or in your own living room.

23:10I felt really strongly about the fact that there are 70 ,000 brand ambassadors. They need to understand how they are the powerful backers. And if you're going to live that promise. You need to be part of it from the get go. And so I think it's just one example, Jim, in terms of where you have to make those conscious decisions to share, to learn, to give guidelines, give frameworks, but they need to be first. And so just a good example of, I think how that can come to life, even in a large company like ours. Third area that I want to talk with, I think is impressive is you're an old brand, right?

23:47Legacy brand, but you're not complacent. You're growing your business among millennials and Gen Z, you know, probably getting ready for Gen Alpha. That's not easy. I mean, earlier in the day, we talked to a woman who had been at Cadillac in a marketing job, which is now at Mercedes Benz, Melody Lee. She's amazing. But we talked an awful lot about that. How do you respect their tradition but not be restricted to it? Keep your core customers but expand into new segments. And at least from what I've seen, you seem to have done that extremely well. So talk about that, Your strategy, your thinking, your learning, what could others learn from what you've done and continue to do?

24:23You're absolutely right. And the thing about this is it all comes down to the insights and we've been forward leaning and I'll give you, you know, a couple of different examples. And one that I shared, I think on stage earlier this morning, you know, in terms of something like partnership with White Lotus, a global cultural phenomena, right? For sure. Sure. Everybody's watching it and great partnership with Max. But for me, as I said before, it was not just about trading that IP. It was about creating curated travel experiences. It was about another passion point for our customers is dining. And so are there ways that we can take that into our lounges in terms of specialty cocktails?

25:09We've created great custom content as well. And I think that's where you've got to be where your customers are. No surprise with messages that are going to be relevant. And if you think about our sort of expansive experiences that we've created, you know, we just started a partnership with F1 as well on Global Footprint. They are really proud of that partnership because I think we're showing up in unique and different ways, not only in terms of the access, but the fact that you can get an Amex radio, if you're at the event, and just all the things, all the perks that come with being an Amex card member.

25:47You know, we want, at the end of the day, our ambition is for our customers to say, the only place I could have gotten that experience is through American Express. And it's about, you know, just understanding what the customers need, understanding the, as you well know the media landscape is so fragmented. So sort of figuring out where are the best places for our messages to be, having that relevant, you know, content, working with great partners around those passion points of travel, dining, you know, entertainment, sports. I think that's what's, you know, kept us in the cultural conversation, kept us in the moment.