Ep 641: Creator-Handle Ads Ran 70% More Efficient: Aves on Creative Coverage and Hyper Relevant Ads

0:00Aves:Before we jump into today's all killer, no filler episode, a quick word about who makes this show possible. The D2C podcast is brought to you by Pilot House, the performance agency behind some of the fastest growing D2C brands in the world. Creative, media, and customer journey all under one roof. Performance and brand without the trade-off. Every Friday, we hand the mic to a Pilot House operator to break down what's actually working in their space right now. Want a team that treats your growth like their own? That's Pilot House. Head to pilothouse.co and now on with the show. You either have to be camp volume or camp strategy.

0:34The real magic is actually when you combine both. When you're focused on volume, you don't take your head up out of the weeds and look at things to make sure that you have coverage. And then with the strategy side, you just can't keep up with the amount of content that it takes to remain relevant. Creative is the be-all end-all. It shows you exactly who you need to be talking to, how to talk to them. And then once you start getting that into your product development pipeline, you're printing money. It's too easy.

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1:43Aves:Back in under two business days with no sales pitch. If you're clean, they'll tell it to you straight. They say one supplement brand they worked with was down$162 ,000 a month to foreign infringers, and they helped claw back$131 ,000 of it. Grab your free brand audit report at esqgo.com slash free dash audit. That's E-S-Q-G-O dot com slash free dash audit. The link's in the show notes. It's all killer, no filler. I'm Eric, and I am here with Abe's. we just had a good 10 minute riff on all the memes that we love. So we won't, we'll maybe clue you in on some of those at the end. But today we're talking about a subject we talk about all the time, creative coverage.

2:24Aves:And there's so much discourse going on in the DTC Twitter world right now about velocity and people chiming in on what's needed in the space right now. I'm always interested in Abe's take on what you mean by creative coverage in 2026 on Meta. Yeah. So something I'm noticing and sometimes I think contributing to the DTC discourse on volume versus strategy, but coverage is a really good way of thinking about it because I think, I mean, this happens in all conversations on the internet today where it's like you either have to be camp volume or camp strategy, but the real magic is actually when you combine both.

3:06So if you have a ton of volume, I don't see that working for people right now. Like I've seen folks in this space who have said, okay, whatever, let's use Grok to make a thousand ads that will launch in one month. And their CPM spike, they stop finding their right audience and nothing is really happening. And it's the same with like, if you're too precious and you're developing content for paid media, like people, I've never seen Mad Men still haven't seen it, but I imagine in a very Mad Men-esque way where we have like the whiteboard and we do a ton of thought and research and then we put together a singular piece of content every two weeks doesn't work either.

3:51And so coverage is really about thinking about like what needs to be covered and so not going based off of like what is just my opinion on volume or strategy like what do I believe. Coverage is like really invoking what will actually work from a tactical point of view while addressing the larger strategic swings that people need to make.

4:15Aves:Let's talk about some of the layers in coverage, because coverage refers to both the format coverage. That's maybe traditionally what we might have called coverage, was you need to make sure you're covering all your image sizes and types. But then there's also the ad format coverage, like making sure you have stills and you have UGCs and you have maybe founder content. And then there's the dimension of the Andromeda arc of like the, where the customer is in their journey and what, who they are as an avatar, like coverage covers a lot. Is that accurate? Yeah, for me now, it's like the things that you mentioned first, so when we're thinking about like sizes, that should just be second nature to most people marketing.

4:54And now for me, coverage, the definition is really like, are we making ads for the right people, for the right product, with the right angles? and right is sort of defined by a predetermined strategy, right? So you start up the ladder by figuring out like who are the right people? Who do we need to talk to to continue to grow as a business? And something that I've noticed a lot is folks will default in this part of the conversation to, well, these were the initial personas that we built out and these are the people that we think we want to talk to. And I always try to challenge brands to give me a sense of a person and an avatar who we need to talk to to grow the business because it's all well to do to talk to the people who already love your product and are fully aware of it I feel like last time maybe we were talking about Doan I'm in a Doan dress right now they don't have to hit me with like 900 ads you know like that's not really covering personas because I'm already in there I don't know what I would show up as on paper it's like I'm already there and then what you really need to think about too is like what are we using paid media for most of the time when people come to talk to us at the house or when you start running ads it's because you actually do want to grow your business so again it's like adding that layer of not only who do we need to talk to that already purchases this product but where's the opportunity for growth and expansion in audience so are you even talking to those people because again when i start talking to brands most of the time it's like our bread in her 20s and so we only make ads that appeal to women in their 20s but if you want to expand maybe upwards in age a little bit and we're just not addressing it then you're not covered in that way and the same goes for product too product has actually been a really big part of how i've been making tactical decisions for accounts and so i've got a couple of different reports that i'm pulling in where i'm sort of cross-referencing this is a lot of acronyms but i'm looking at like what products are functioning from an end-tack perspective so what's like bringing people in for the cheapest and then also what is the most efficient for us to ship and where are the margins to find extra profitability for brands in the focus on product it's something that i see get dropped a lot as well so we tend to ignore like net new personas and we also tend to ignore that part because it's very nuanced and you need to have a lot of data but the sort of benefit of how we're all working with AI now is that we have these insights all the time.

7:27We're just not necessarily using them in the most productive way. So yeah, I found like huge efficiency gains by focusing on, do I have my product coverage handled? So maybe there's something that is, we tend to think of it as like a returning customer only SKU, and we've never really experimented with showing it to folks on the like paid top of funnel side and trying to really test into those products and find that extra bit of profitability is huge. I think too, in this like unsure era when it comes to D2C and Ecom, like when we did the in-person, we were talking about meta has just been acting kind of funky for the year 2026.

8:08So finding, um, not only like efficient scale, but also just efficiencies within the already existing folks through like creative coverage. So again, looking at the data and then looking at your suite of content in your creative program and saying, oh, shoot, we're not even talking about this product. And it is substantially more efficient if people come in and buy it. Thinking about that kind of thing too. And then again, with the angles, just really taking a step back, looking at your creative library, looking at your what's live right now and just saying like, are we even talking about all of the benefits that we know work?

8:41I think the problem with both volume and strategy as a two unique guiding stars for people is when you're focused on volume, you don't ever like take your head up out of the weeds and look at things to make sure that you have coverage you're just like sometimes making your business less profitable by focusing on the wrong things through volume and then with the strategy side you just can't keep up with um like what is going

9:05Aves:on on platform and the amount of content that it takes to remain relevant yeah that was a very long-winded answer that's a great answer i mean there's so many it's like it's not even 40 chess It's like space chess. Space chess. That's where we're at. Super interesting. So give me maybe the anatomy. So I liked your example of the finding a product that maybe it's like a linking product or it's a product that brings people back the most or whatever. Some metric, most cart abandoned product or something. And then you're creating custom ads for that product. And then walk me through the product. Like, is that ideally a creator ad?

9:38Aves:Is that like when you're talking about a product, for instance, is that often going to be like, what's your go-to suite to like address that niche or that opportunity? Yeah, that's a really good question. So I look at it from less of a like static motion creator and more of a like delivery perspective. So it's like, where do we tend to find people that are actually net new cold traffic? It's typically stories and reels. And so usually I fall into short form video. And then it really depends on like what the issue is. So cart abandoned, like the most cart abandoned product is a really good one as an example.

10:15Because typically what that tells you is there's not a lot of trust and there's something that's like stopping people. They're excited about it at the top of funnel, but something stops them from actually converting. And so usually what I've seen lately is whitelisting. So ads that come from a creator's handle are performing sometimes. Like I think the last set of ads I was analyzing, those ads, so running it and thinking about delivery, having it run through the creator's handle was 70 % more efficient than running the same piece of creative from the brand. And so what that usually means is it's just generating more trust and buy-in from an actual person because the ad looks like it's coming from an actual person and it is, they put it together.

10:58so I tend to think about like what seems to be in the way of this product doing well so if it's card abandonment then I'll usually lean on like a whitelisting partnership and then try to back that out with content that I know works middle and bottom of a funnel and so usually that's static content branded as well as like overlays addressing those conversion pieces but really thinking full funnel again and it's like okay so someone's going to see this first coming from an actual human being, giving a testimonial that they like it.

11:29Aves:So they'll already have a first touch point that revolves around building trust and removing those conversion barriers. Because a lot of the time when we're briefing for your content, we just think like, do something fun and exciting because it's going to live at the top of the funnel. But trying to close the gap a little bit quicker and really focus on what is the problem with the product we're trying to solve rather than what do we do for like say the top acquisition product for that brand we're probably going to have a whole different suite of creative because we just know that that's exciting and people buy it off of one click so when we're trying to get that same performance out of a product we know is harder to get people over the line on it's going to be way more like technical from the creator's handle and then a lot of return policy type of conversion friction removers in the middle and bottom of funnel content.

12:23Aves:And I imagine with the economy constricting as it appears to be, or just while it's tightening a little bit these days, that just really drilling in on pain points is got to be more critical than ever, essentially, just because you've got to agitate people. You really have to help them understand what their life will be like with your product from multiple angles before they're pulling the trigger, maybe more than they would a few years ago. Yeah, the interesting thing that I'm finding is actually delivering more on the selling the cloud type of stuff is working quite well. Because I do think when things tighten up economically, folks like to imagine days when it won't be.

13:03Aves:And they love like almost inspirational, aspirational value rather than just USP and problem agitation, which is kind of interesting. and the um easiest point of entry that i found is making really hyper relevant content and it's something that we're like actively right now rolling out a system for our pilot houses which is really cool um which is just like i've talked about there's a ton on adventures here but we are all spending so much time um on our own rhythms that the echo chamber that we all live in is getting like smaller and it's basically like airpods right like we were just talking about memes and some memes that I have seen every three videos on TikTok you've never heard of.

13:45So really baking that into your creative approach and understanding like, I know the Chanty Beluga inside joke, you know, like the mango chutney song, there's just different things happening for different people. And so what's really like breaking through, I think, as things tighten up economically and especially heading into Q4 is content that is bespoke and like hyper relevant

14:09Aves:to a human being. It's no longer just like, okay, these are pain points that someone like yourself might feel. It's like, this is the exact type of font that you're expecting. This is the audio that you've been hearing everywhere. This is like the camera angle that people use even. It's really interesting work. And I will say it's been very fun to systemize, but also very difficult. This episode is brought to you by Triple Whale, the AI operating system for e-commerce. Just a quick gut check for brand owners and media buyers. Have you started your Black Friday, Cyber Monday planning yet? If the answer is not yet, you're not alone.

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15:22Aves:Free tools to set goals and forecast outcomes. Strategy guides and checklists covering ad performance, retention, and conversion. And AI-powered tactics you can put to work before BFCM week hits. The best part, it's completely free and there's no login required. Just go to triplewhale.com slash BFCM and start planning today. One day, I hope you can just publish the like a whole book of ads that you've made over this period because you also just leverage humor in such an interesting way. Like I think, is it accurate to say that I like hyper relevant creative, a lot of it comes down to being really knowing with the audience or that's one approach.

16:00Aves:One approach that I think you've used really well is being really knowing with the audience in a way that also ingratiates yourself. Cause you, you'll call out a memory or a sensation of like a particular avatar that you're going really deep with a nostalgic font or image or, or whatever. Right. Yeah. It's interesting. Cause it's like, this is more pie in the sky, but it's like, we are also all getting a little bit less human in a way, not in a scary way, but just in like a, We're all very, like, I even find it sometimes I'll, like, I do a page of journaling every morning. And sometimes I'm, like, trying to, like, be more efficient about my mindfulness.

16:37And it's like, what is going on? That's not how you do this.

16:41Aves:I studied cyborg theory in university way back in the day. And it's like, technology does change you. And we're using, we're deeply integrating with technology right now. So it's not, you're not far off. Yeah, yeah. We're all becoming less human. And so I think that like being able to really understand and speak to someone, it creates like a little sparkle, I think, in people where it's like, this is activating something in me that I wasn't necessarily expecting. I was also, there's this creator, I can't remember her name right now, but she's got a master's thesis in like cyber psychology. And she was talking a lot about the distinction between people who make content versus like quote unquote lurkers.

17:22and most people are just lurking on the internet like most people do not 98 yeah yeah they don't create they just consume and so i think about that a lot it's like they're only here to look at stuff which is a very interesting thing to think about and then when we think about too like this is again really like by the sky but most of the time people are doing something else when they're on their phone that is something that really has shaped the past year of my work it's It's like most of the time someone's on the toilet, they're waiting at the doctor's office. Hopefully they're not driving, but often they are.

17:56Aves:They're waiting for a Claude answer. They're waiting for a Claude answer. It's got to be the number one fastest use case of people jumping on their phones. And it creates a really interesting way to approach the work. Because they're not doing this. They're coming on to consume content passively. They're not going to the movie theater. By the way, I went to see The Odyssey and I saw a woman on Instagram the entire time. Oh my God. The entire movie, which is a long movie. And it was a good movie. It like keeps you engaged. No. She was like not even doing anything, just passively scrolling on. Also really interesting.

18:39I will say she was like probably boomer aged.

18:42Aves:Like not even young. Interesting behavior though. You know, it's like they're not, except for like unskippable YouTube content, which most of the time you've got YouTube on in the background. But I've been saying too, it's like app loving, if you're doing any mobile game stuff is the only time that someone's like watching the ad truly. Yes, their content locked in that case. Yeah. So crazy. Super interesting. That was a great riff. I think we've kind of talked about this a little bit, but you have a note here as well. We've been saying creative is the new targeting. since 2021 or so, I think. And it's become true.

19:19Aves:It was true back then, but it's even more true now. So how do you parse that phrase when you hear it? Yeah, it's a really interesting one because I think we all just started saying it, but no one knew what we were saying. And now it's true. What happens in this bit, yeah. Truly, I feel like sometimes with e-com, we manifest our own destiny because we all just started saying it and now it's the truth but for me you can't know these two truths which are creative is a new targeting and then if you're on the volume side of things thinking okay well i'll just make a thousand ads a month and that will find the right people it's obviously not going to do that and it's the same with saying that creative is a new targeting but i'm only going to make one really gorgeous video ad a month and ship that i think i i made a note that i And we'll say now it's like you can throw a bunch of spaghetti at the wall, but that's not going to bring someone in the restaurant.

20:13And you can also painfully make a single strand of like homemade spaghetti, put every piece of saffron you want in that dough. That's not going to bring anyone. You have to think about how you are dressing the product, which is like the like I wouldn't eat a red sauce, but I love pesto any day of the week. so it's like knowing what the right sauce is to put on top of the pasta is how you actually unlock that idea of creative is gonna be your targeting because if you're just doing a bunch of stuff who are you talking to like it's all different it's all random and like I said before you're never coming up to think about am I talking to everyone I need to speak to am I talking to the new people you're just making stuff and hoping that it finds the right people but with this new approach that we're taking on the pilot house side of like hyper relevancy it's like I know for a fact that this is going to reach the right people because I've done their research and then automated a system that allows me to pump out content at scale that you know like three weeks ago everyone was saying kind of chic don't know what that means still but I was using it in ads to address people sort of in that cohort of like millennial women still no clue what it means to be kind of chic like genuinely don't have an idea.

21:26But for them, it was like, right, this brand knows the language. They know what we're talking about. So trying to like figure out what the right sauce is for the people you actually want to talk to and then just getting the reps in and throwing it over like a bunch of short form video or using it in your ad copy, really doing the research to figure out the sauce. And then that'll bring the people to the restaurant.

21:50Aves:Check back in, ask if they want some fresh ground pepper. Exactly. Make them say when with the Parmesan. Give them the full experience. I think that analogy came from, I've been watching a ton of old Gordon Ramsay. Nice. Really on the Gordon Ramsay train. But yeah, it's like, if the creative is going to be the new targeting, then the creative has to be made for the people you want to speak to. It's not just going to magically find someone who's going to purchase from your brand. Like you need to first know who you want to talk to and then how they want to be spoken to and what is the language that they use.

22:23Not like English versus French, but kind of chic versus Chanty Beluga, you know, like sports.

22:32Aves:That's the name of the podcast. Just confuse the hell out of everyone trying to listen to this. No, I'm with you on the pasta metaphor for sure. And it's just about that intentionality. do you have anything else you can offer the audience on how they can think about creating a system by which they can pump out hyper relevant content uh come talk to me yeah come fill out a pilot house lead form and talk to me because like i said we were ruling out a like standardized system to do this for everyone but i think the first thing is in knowing uh what your personas what are they consuming is step one and anyone can do that you don't have to come talk to me to do that.

23:13I will say like when I started doing this work, I would often be too focused on the biggest creators in the space. And then I would look to them as inspiration of sort of how do I make relevant content? And since then, I've really started looking into like other brands and then also sort of small to mid-level creators who fit into the bucket of persona that I'm speaking to. And so I try to really focus my efforts on looking at what people are doing who are talking to that similar audience and then doing that at scale. Again, I'm not going to tell you, come down to figure something out, but really start with just figuring out like, what are they watching?

23:57What is funny to them? Do they know Chanti Beluga? Yes or no? Yes. And then going from there.

24:03Aves:Do they know Professor Sendy? Yes. because we're all in our own spaghetti strands well that confuses things but yeah in different restaurants yeah we are all in different restaurants i think yeah it's like a really fun time to be someone who likes to make i kind of just got a lucky bounce in life because i like making a lot of content and i also like making highly indexed on my persona content and it just so happens that that's what works right now so yes i'm in a good spot i'm having a good time but It's definitely like Daniel, our VP of performance and brand here at Pilot House, we always joke about like, you now need more content that's better than ever.

24:39Aves:Easy. Yeah. It's too easy. I just, this is going to come out two weeks from now, because next week I have one with Daniel about the landing page experience. And I would just want, like, I think, you know, when you're building all these really creative concepts, curious on your side, how you see landing pages being used or storefronts, like dynamic storefronts or storefronts that are based on creative or based on avatar. Any comments on those? Yeah, it's really like, it feels almost full circle because I remember dude, we're talking about this like so long ago, but doing it all so manually and it would take so long.