Michelin-Starred Chef & Sushi Master: Endo Kazutoshi – Destiny, Discipline, & The Art of Omakase

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0:43The Gstaad Guy:Well, Chef Endo, Endo-san. Hi. It's a true honor to have you here. Thank you very much, Aninba. So I much appreciate it. You know I'm a big fan of yours. I know. You know my big fan. That's very kind of you. Always. so we know already over five years already over five years since I'm open exactly I was one of the early customers of your first your first restaurant we made a very fun video we made the video over five years ago now wow yeah before your first Michelin star yeah it is yeah it is it is honestly it was one of the most exceptional culinary experiences of my life oh thank you very much really really special special moment thank you very much and now you have over five restaurants you're involved in London or six?

1:30The Gstaad Guy:it is six now plus five plus one in Kobe in Japan wow yeah congratulations thank you very much I do my best you know that I know you do your best around the world with your host the Stardguy we welcome you back to the Stardguy podcast sharing stories of excellence with those in the know for those who just know so you've been in the UK now for 10 years? No, maybe already 14 years. 14 years. Yeah. And before that you were in Japan? Yeah. Before Japan, I work in Spain. Spain. Yeah. And always with a desire for sushi mastery. Yeah, because this is like a sushi, you know, my job is my destiny, you know.

2:20So I'm third generation sushi chef. So I was born. Already, my life's decision is like I have to sushi chef.

2:31The Gstaad Guy:Can you tell me more about that? Okay. So my grandpa opened a sushi by 1940 in Yokohama. Wow. So Yokohama is next Tokyo. Yeah. It's like Hammersmith to Knightsbridge. Okay. It's not far. So my father also take over. But now my young brother take over in his family business. Wow. Yeah. Then I was a child. My mom told me I was five years old. My mom started to educate me about chef. Wow. Yeah. So when you were five, you knew you were going to become a sushi maker, weren't you? Yeah. Already, I was, I go to primary school. I understand by myself. Maybe I'm a little bit different like others. For example, after school, all kids, they play together, go to the baseball or something like that.

3:27It's very popular. But my memory in primary school, never ever I played with my friend. Always after school, I studied calligraphy, also Japanese tea ceremony of the flower arrangement. my mom always bring me so many things you know I know freedom it's like very concentrated how to achieve to the sushi chef and is that

4:00The Gstaad Guy:typical of the young lad of the sushi chef? totally not totally that's why I'm thinking by myself why I'm different yeah everybody very enjoy life you know they play together friends but I never zero experience well have you spoken to your mother about that out of an older age I'm scared you know I never speak I never ask but after junior high school I'm stopping she's stopping to like that kind of things so I'm starting judo so little bit different life as well amazing so when did you because now I know you have personal deep love for what you're doing at what point did your destiny that you in many ways inherited from family yeah become a personal love yeah i think for me the most important things of course first 10 years i'm training so you know i'm starting chef is 31 years ago 31 years ago i'm starting chef well so that time you know no no one has a iphone no one has like a nothing pc is nothing like uh no youtube as well i believe my master only no choice so i believe him but always he told me like what's the purpose of the cooking what's the purpose of the why i work in sushi restaurant why i want to be sushi chef always he he always told me i speak by myself.

5:43First 10 years, I don't understand at all. Just working, wake up 5.30 in the morning, I go to the market, prep, service, I'm sleeping like 11.30. That's my routine every day. Wow. Yeah. Maybe now, I really understand, last 10 years, I think, I really understand little by little what Master's talking about it. So the last 10 years, I understand about what my Master told me. So about sushi master, why I love that job, not job, that why I love make sushi, why I'm a sushi chef. So that's kind of like, normally just I don't want to say destiny. Maybe I understand you know what's the purpose is for the guests.

6:35For their culture wise, for the history, appreciate everything. like a produce farmer fisherman is everybody so now used to be i speak to many guests i am very honestly i respect everybody but now last 10 years i really really understanding in deeply my heart that's maybe totally different i think who was your your sushi master was that you so i have a three masters, including my father. So first I'm in Tokyo. One is Tokyo, one is Nagoya, one is my father. Nagoya is, you know Toyota. It's very popular. It's like a Tokyo. Nagoya is like a two-hour Japanese blue train, subway to the west.

7:25The Gstaad Guy:And what's the relationship like between a student and a master? That's many people asking me. that's sorry still I'm thinking but maybe now used to be I never speak by myself I'm master but now very popular sushi master sushi master but I never call by myself the sushi master but I'm looks young I'm already 50 this end of the month I'm 53 wow yeah I'm doing sake every day looks very young now Now, since last year, I'm a sushi master. The reason why, of course, my target is my father. Maybe two masters. They have already top of the mountain. So sushi chef has 10 sushi chefs, 10 different. Maybe that mountain also, I don't necessarily go to that mountain.

8:28But I make that by myself. I go to the top of the mountain. I really want to see the same view. Different mountain, but the same view. But now, since last year, my feeling, maybe coming to ready to see similar level to the view. That's why maybe I have to start in cold. I'm Sushi Master. Also, life experience. unfortunately 20, 25, 26 years impossible to make it called a master.

9:06The Gstaad Guy:How many years do you think? I don't know. It's a sushi master forever. For example, this is like, for me, it's a very shocking story. And but shocking meaning like a journey of the sushi chef. Ten years ago, unfortunately, my father passed away. Then all the ceremony is done. me young brother big sister we cleaned up to my father's room then all family didn't know he writing diary 20 years wow then all brand new note we are surprising i of course he passed away already that's okay let's read little bit then i took no no my young brother to he he shouting Oh my God. The last one, last page is three days before he passed.

10:02The Gstaad Guy:Wow. What he's writing, three days before he passed. Life, people's life, and cooking sushi rice is the same. Meaning always inconsistency. So difficult cooking rice. This is three days before he passed. Wow. He's starting sushi chef. He's 15 years old. He passed 78. Can you imagine? Wow. He's still difficult. Me and the young brother are thinking about when it's going to be finished. It's so far. It's perfect. But that's why we can work every day, you know. I think that for me is the most shocking thing. Absolutely. so perfection is never achieved yes we understanding of course my master as well they told me everyday daily based for me it's like everyday my feeling like a brand new day yesterday is yesterday today is today today is most important day is different weather, guests everything is completely different that's why for me always I speak by myself today is a brand new day and are these beautiful philosophies are they things that you learned over time or things that your masters taught you you know for example first four years my job is very simple make tea clean up restaurant clean up fish after three years later I was washing sushi starting that's every day but My always youngest people make tea for my master every morning.

11:52Four years, I make tea to him. He never finishing everything. Sometimes just touching, finishing. Sometimes one drinking, finishing. Sometimes middle. Then I speak to my senior chef. Why he never drinking everything? He told me, easy to reason. my tea is long but how I understand how I know what's a perfect tea then he told me this is like an answer you have to learn yourself how no charge GBT so that's why I'm challenging starting every morning I check the temperature weather, everything his feeling, his face he looks okay today he's very energetic like that energetic time, I make strong tea I'm starting adjusting maybe he won't teach me like that this is omakase's starting point many people totally misunderstanding omakase omakase is no prep lab omakase is no ego from the chef chef have to achieve to the guest that's omakase I understand that's why chef need life experience only nice sushi billion sushi chef can do billion why you know oh this guy is the best sushi chef oh why everybody said this sushi chef is great I think that's totally different I think and it's studying

13:37The Gstaad Guy:the person across I think so we have to reach out to the guest the guest is alive because always I will so exciting because guest in my restaurant fortunately it's very difficult booking guest is very exciting the day oh maybe today's good end or maybe nice dress up little bit more nice shoes everybody ready to come then guest is alive I'm 100 % smiling to welcome to the guest I'm thinking how guests make great memory of the night. That's my target. Of course, nice sushi, nice service, but basically heart to heart. That's my educator from Tokyo, I think, my master's book. And what are you looking for in the guests?

14:32Okay, so first, how to eat. The left hand side, right hand, all day what they're drinking how many biting that many people don't misunderstand very misunderstanding oh endo why are you watching me no i'm not watching the guest i'm watching to the how to eat but i don't want to watching too much too focused to the mouse but roughly talking i watching how many biting so sometimes i put on salt on top each person different amount different point upon putain salt. Wow. But this is normal for me. But this is omakase. Omakase is lived to the chef, of course, but chef have to accept what day more exciting and happiness to go home.

15:27The Gstaad Guy:What, in your opinion, is really the definition of omakase? That's very difficult. Because so many ways, so many, because I told you in the beginning, 10 sushi chefs, 10 different, 10 different mountains, I think. But for me, it's, omakas is, it's more kind of like a tea ceremony feeling, like a, more like a legacy from the guests, from the chef, to resharing to the great night. That's why I have to make the best sushi rice. That's why I choose the best fish, all things I choose the best, I think. Sorry, I'm really difficult about omakase. Omakase is like, I really don't want to say just omakase.

16:22Omakase is more mental than life like. Is, how can I say? That's memory.

16:30The Gstaad Guy:can you walk me through the process of preparing for an omakase serving at what point does it start for the guests uh this stinks as well i really i speak to many people as well if ready to decision decided open lesson by myself first step have to have to look for the good rice farmer great soy sauce people, great seaweed great wasabi great fishmonger that five things is the first step to search it no, first investor investors later but if five things is not ready cannot work. So maybe your favorite dish is my course, is a business card. That's why I sub to business card first. Business card is everything.

17:35Soy, wasabi, rice, tuna, seaweed. So everything one together. So if everybody is happy, they'll handle the meaning. This is completely, I deliver it best for you. It's like my message, you know. so this is first I think after preparation to the how organizing the restaurant there's so many so many steps you know for example my restaurant is like I design design wise as well I join as well how sushi chef to the guest not too far not too short is always 1 meter to 1 meter 10 centimeter It's the best dimension. So this is like a sense of 100 years before. So like that kind of things as well. You know, in time, they're never teaching me.

18:33I learn from my master, a working experience, you know. That's maybe that's very important too. And while you build the teams that you work with? I'm lucky enough because many guests are surprised if my restaurant is like a very international. so in tanosa not only japanese for me always i don't mind experience how much experience oh i work in japanese less than 10 years i don't mind i don't care most care about it how much passion and humble i don't want to say how long hours everybody work in the restaurant every day But it's tough. You know, also I speak to my team. Please don't do the draw the line.

19:24Life, private and work. It's always, I understand. My master told me as well. I totally agree. Private is first of all work on top is private. Sushi chef's heart cannot draw the line. It's all one set. That's why, you know, first my restaurant, my master's restaurant is not far to my house. But he won't, I leave restaurant. Ground floor is restaurant, first floor is my accommodation. I ask him, why? I have the 24 hours thinking about sushi. Then also I speak to my staff. It's a restaurant kind of union. So each different company, okay, my team is like a lot of different country, a lot of variety, a lot of variety of the country.

20:22Also, background is different as well. Some people work in three-star French. Some people work in two-star, like Italian. Everybody's background is different as well. That's why always I speak to my staff. Restaurant union. Different country. Different mentality. But we have one of the rules. We have to work together. Each person has to deliver it to achieve the restaurant policy. But that policy is I have to make it. Everybody looking for the goal together. I don't want the same mentality. I don't need everybody the same like me. Everybody is different, fine. But everybody working the same law, same goal.

21:14That for me is very important. That's maybe what everybody says to me is very easy to understand.

21:20The Gstaad Guy:When you build your teams, is there something you look for in people other than passion that they have in common, like within these teams? Because they come from very different environments and experiences. Do you see anything in common with their personalities? is i don't think so but always some people come to interview to me always i tell them if you don't have any target you cannot walk here because long hours i don't want to say too much i'm shouting because i'm honestly i'm serious because the guest is very exciting we have to You know, everybody misunderstanding, of course, enjoy. Of course, enjoy.

22:10But how to enjoy? We have a role. We have a rule. But we have to share how we are humble. How to make, you know, even sushi. Only simple, like rice, fish, or sabisoy. Only this. But some people make great. Some people make not great. Same ingredient. Of course, you know, if no passion, no humble people make it, that sushi goes the wrong way. Sushi is very like Miller. Like if I'm not wrong, I'm wrong. Sushi goes too wrong. So I always interview time, I speak to everybody. If I have a passion, if I'm humble, I'm welcome.

23:00The Gstaad Guy:I remember during COVID when you gave me the most amazing opportunity and gift of all by allowing my friends and I to experience an amakase with you at home and it was still one of the best memories of my life I never forget too we had the best time yeah me too I'm the best time too I'm so that time especially COVID you know is very difficult time yeah that's why for me it's like always after these kind things always I appreciate to the guests, the people humans we had the best time with you, we really had such a lovely time thank you very much I remember that day we actually had a conversation that stuck with me for a long time and it's about which pieces of sushi I found to be the most meaningful while dining with you and that is when you can use very simple ingredients in a very simple fish and make it profound because when a chef uses like the cheat codes of lots of uni and caviar and otoro that's very well sourced you can sometimes mask some of the arts but if you're using a very typically simple fish like i think you gave the example of a mackerel yeah and presented at a very high level yeah then that's true artistry so this is maybe this is great for example now why I call to my by myself the sushi master since last year I really worry about it now sushi is basically really we try to every day is a more less touch less touch less touch but now I saw I see the London like more plus more this more da plus this like totally go to opposite way but now it's very popular Omakase restaurant in London it's very it's amazing seven years ago I opened a restaurant in London Omakase is maybe only three or four but now I don't know how many it's a lot it's a lot but it's great then now seriously not just movement it's of course popular but it's not movement that's why someone have to say like what's a sushi what's a tradition so I don't want to too much plus plus plus for example macro

25:39fisherman caught from the ocean starting qualities going down that's how we call the Japanese but many people feel it washing water after dry washing water again so many using water for example I fill it I've started fillet mackerel I'm using water only once finish wow I put on salt after I'm not washing keep the flavor in there it is why this is like a sushi chef is ego salt I don't want salty that's why I wash it have to thinking what type of salt good for the mackerel my staff is always laughing I have over 20-30 different salt I have this is normal this is I say this is humble

26:40The Gstaad Guy:is it because some are more porous it is so actually last month I went to Berlin his chef Duran, he used to be handling restaurant names, Ernst. Exactly the same feeling. He also no washing at all. It's the same things. We have to develop by myself how to keep the original flavor. Because sushi is the purest. We don't need caviar truffle, uni on top. Of course, this is like guest is happy, it's okay but when you come to my restaurant I never do I had a guest on the podcast a dear friend his name is Giulio Bergamaschi oh yeah and he's the CEO of Aqua di Parma and he just like me really appreciates purism when it comes to luxury yeah and I think Italians and Japanese have that in common the purest and desire when it comes to luxury and creativity which for example the French don't share in France it's a lot about decadence and adding ingredients and adding presentation and you can see that in all elements of French history of luxury but in Italian luxury and even cuisine there's this art called Esprezzatura which I learned from Giulio which is the art of making the complex simple and making the profound simple and I see lots of that in Japanese culture and in sushi and while dining with you, you will take complexity and depth and flavor and complexity and process and try to make it as simple as possible.

28:30I'd love to know more about that thinking

28:34The Gstaad Guy:and what that means to you. That's totally like a concept about sushi. This is exactly the concept. But Mr. Chef Nakazawa from New York, the Sushi Show Nagazawa the two three star mission in New York he came to my restaurant last year after we chat one hour about how to make simple he also he tried to make simple because New York is a lot of sushi restaurant is available everybody same same like London plus plus more and more and more but Mr. Nagazawa told me he tried to more or less make more simple mature so for me now the key is mature but someone have to show in this country no one knows so that's why I really don't want everybody oh go back to go to Tokyo go back to Japan oh Japan sushi is good no everybody totally misunderstanding it's not everything great Tokyo also some of the restaurant is good some of the restaurant is not good I agree so when I go back to Japan of course I try to eat sushi as well now it's changed a lot used to be more a lot of simple restaurants available everybody loves but now more like I do Instagram of course I'm not complaining but like an SNS how people love but of course that's important but chef have to think a little bit more step back what's the purpose what's the simplicity I think you know we have to touch your heart for me that's very important I think I agree with that and I think the storytelling also I find very special Oh, yeah.

30:42The Gstaad Guy:Like when you serve me a piece of your makase and you tell me where it was sourced from, the process of you connecting with the fisherman to source this particular type of fish, I think that's also a huge part because I can be onboarded on the journey with you. Yeah. So this is like one of my specialties as well. I decided open by myself in London. My target is as much as I can. are using local produce. But now, literally, my name is popular. But, eight, nine years ago, no one knows. I emailed to fishermen, maybe 200 emails to fishermen. Reply back only five or six. Wow. Yeah. Then I'm starting, I go to Cornwall, I jump in the boat together.

31:33No one does Ikejime. Now it's popular. That's my starting point. That's why, how about old story? Also, history. I know everything. Who look after, who drive, when you're coming, when they caught. So that for me is very key. Also, a long time ago, I go to one sushi restaurant in Tokyo. Without me, all like foreigners. They cannot speak Japanese. Chef only speaks Japanese. then they the guests all guests they don't know what eating for everybody asking asking themselves what it is what it is what it is I really thought that's why when I decided when I opened a restaurant by myself I explained to everything why I do this how to cook how to marinate so that's the guest that's more comfortable because Japanese the sushi is very now is popular but seven years it was still like very notherty like very unusual food raw fish

32:44The Gstaad Guy:yeah I'd love to talk about the priorities you have for each of the core pillars of the great sushi what makes exceptional rice what makes exceptional seaweed exceptional fish exceptional soy sauce and exceptional wasabi that's first tip have to that's why every morning go to the market with my master first years you know we don't know anything then next year my master choose a small fish we learn why he choose this you know shop like fishmonger as well they know what my master want so that's like conversation is very key that we learn that's why we go to everyday market so that's now no much people don't go to the market for example two months one time I go to Cornwall of course Scotland, Ireland that's normal for me everyday talking fishmonger one hour we chat that's normal normal.

34:02They have to understand what I want. Not just best fish, best fish. What's the best fish? Many people say best fish. Best they think maybe is most expensive. Yeah, but for me, best things is good for me, best for me, because 10 people, different sushi rice. How to decide the best? For me, I don't speak like that, but that's that's true

34:31The Gstaad Guy:with regards to the wasabi I know there's so many different types of wasabis yeah and many people don't even discuss no the wasabi root yeah I'd love to talk about the importance of wasabi to you and the different varieties so I'm using Mazuma the the red wasabi the color is really red on top but that one is growing up to near Mount Fuji only wow whole japan only grown enough to there well it's a very very small harvest also i don't want to say like that but this is super expensive yeah but so creamy like sweet after that yeah many guests asking may speak to me after after eating wasabi and your wasabi is not spicy the wasabi is not spicy.

35:23That's, for example, seaweed. Everybody feeling like very soggy, but everybody say my seaweed is very mild. That's my job. It's explained to you about a real story, you know.

35:37The Gstaad Guy:What about the rice? Rice is my own rice farm. Okay. Of course. Water as well. I borrow from the same place. Your own water? The rice grown enough to this water. Wow. Yeah, I checked all pH level. That's better than what I bring to London. That's only one choice. And I know the seaweed, you always have the coals. Yeah. Keeping the seaweed crunchy. What are the names of those coals you use again? Charcoal. Yeah. Yeah. But you use a special charcoal. Yeah, binchotan. Binchotan also. A lot of... They say binchotan, but not from made in Japan. so my wine is from Wakayama Prefecture Wakayama Bin Chodan is maybe best best Bin Chodan charcoal in the world why is that important?

36:28it's like it's very funny fire is very soft keep longer temperature is not up and down too crazy very consistency that's why if like a little bit toasted oh wow Wow, aroma also. Really, really nice.