William Hanson: Author of Just Good Manners – Etiquette, British Dining Codes, & The Art of Grace in a Noisy World

0:00Well, William, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me. I'm delighted. I'm really honoured. This is a big moment for me. It's a big moment for me. This has just been mutual love in. It is mutual love, but I have to say I'm the bigger fan here. I'm a big fan of your work. I'm not going to compete with you. Big fan, big fan of your book. I was telling you before we turned the cameras on, it's the only book I've read where I've genuinely laughed out loud. Oh, well, that's very kind, but you need to read more because there are significantly funnier books. But I won't be too self-deprecating, but thank you.

0:31And I genuinely, like, you know, I've done one or two interviews about the book and around the book. And they often have the book. But it is not literally, I can tell from that book, as you were keen to prove to me, that is a very well-thumbed and well-read version of Just Good Manor. It is. It's been through it. Indeed, yes. It looked like you've thumbed through me well. So thank you very much. Around the world with your host, the Stardguy, we welcome you back to the Stardguy podcast, sharing stories of excellence with those in the know for those who just know. I have been following you on social media before reading the book.

1:10So my introduction to you is you as a content creator before an author and podcaster and also as a expert of etiquette, expert of manners. But I know that you also are a comedian. Well, I wouldn't call me a comedian, but you can call me a comedian. Why don't you call yourself a comedian? Well, I did a solo show earlier this year, and I sort of... Act one was just me telling stories on stage, and as I said in some of the interviews about that at the time, look, I'm not a stand-up comedian, so if people don't come and laugh, if they arrive and they don't laugh, well, I'm not a stand-up comedian.

1:50And if they come and they laugh, well, that's a bonus, because I'm not a stand-up comedian. So I felt it was a win-win. But I think stand-up comedy is a completely different discipline. I have a couple of friends that are stand-ups and I couldn't do what they do. They're also not particularly funny in their own personal life. I always say there's one friend I'm friends with who doesn't bring his work home with him, which sounds cutting and is meant to be. But he, you know, he's quite, they're quite serious. You've met myself as stand-up comedians. They overanalyze everything. says the etiquette coach but yeah anyway i wouldn't call me a comedian i just sort of fine comedies is the language but the product is not comedy yeah yeah i would like to say i don't get too serious about it because that's boring but i would like to say there is a serious message behind always what i stand for but i think people respond better particularly brits uh if it's packaged up in a fun way.

2:56I am a great fan of any form of Mary Poppins-ness, whether it's the books, the film, or the stage show, which I have now seen 42 times. I know. And we can unpick that another time. And a spoonful of sugar does help the medicine go down. That's basically my philosophy in life. That's great. I also know that you have a philosophy about peas. Yes we should say for those listening That we are sitting here in a gorgeous Crimson basement With an entire plate Of very verdigris Peas in front of us Replicating the front cover of the UK edition Of my book And it's so kind of you To present me With so many peas I thought it's only fitting We're in London in Mayfair At the 22 Members Club's Basement with two plates of peas on a white tablecloth.

3:52I mean, it's popping. I think the contrast is something. It's lovely. And would you like me to test you on how you eat peas? You hadn't thought this through. I wasn't planning. It was more of a visual cue. But we can. We can. Turns out people have very strong opinions on how to eat peas. I mean, it's literally one of my most viral videos that we have done. And all I was doing is just saying the British way to eat peas. It doesn't bother me whether people do it or not. So I think I remember the video. I think you said that you should scoop with the knife onto the side of the fork. Yeah, so use the knife as sort of a pusher to aid pushing the peas.

4:35I shall demonstrate now for you. I'll napkin as well. So in British dining etiquette, when we're using a fork and a knife together, we don't turn the fork upside down like this and do that like they would do in europe or parts of america uh always the tines face downwards and so we would just sort of spear the peas almost individually onto the tines of the fork transfer and eat which i think is a lot easier to do than sort of this and then have to balance them um and that was the point i was trying to make in the video and um as but i mean we can talk about our own respective comments on social media that we get and and the strong opinions some of them are really hilarious yeah exactly and they're all taking it too seriously so some of them take it too seriously and also some of your comments are people asking you for etiquette advice on how do you think how do you think that can never be done with etiquette well who knows yeah um maybe when things dry up i'll do that video but for those that don't know there is there are some um well there are some perverts out there let's be honest who uh like to ask me what the etiquette is for rubbing one out under the table which generally when those comments appeared i did have to urban dictionary it to find out what the heck they meant i sort of thought i knew but i was like i should just clarify and then i made the fatal mistake of responding to one of them because i thought it was the same person and I think maybe back in the day it was the same person and I responded saying you ask this on every video please could I suggest you seek professional or medical help and a meme account called are you aware of the Archbishop of Banterbury yes they screenshotted that and posted it and that was like lighting the blue touch paper for everybody to comment to the point where it's now getting a touch if I'm honest it's getting a touch boring because it's like, yeah.

6:32And I don't engage with it beyond that. We have done videos on hand placement at the table because there's a difference between Britain and Europe and America with what you do with your hands. And that's the closest we've got to it. But yes, rubbing one out. I presume you would know what that meant. I know what that means. To add in dictionary it. And we won't spoil it for anyone that doesn't know. I was actually recently at a dinner. You weren't rubbing one out. I was not rubbing one out. but I wished you were there with me. Oh, really? I was in a dilemma. Okay. I was at a beautiful dinner in the south of France.

7:06Beautiful long dinner table. Very well staffed. That detail is important for the next part of the story. And they served a filet mignon for dinner. A filet mignon is usually a great thing to serve at a dinner because it's usually not very chewy. I got unlucky. It was a bit too chewy. And I was sitting there chewing, chewing and chewing. and I just, I couldn't get it small enough and mushy enough to swallow the chewy piece of filet mignon. And I thought to myself for a second, for a second, what would William Hansen do? I think I ended up doing something you wouldn't do. But before I get to what I did, I'd love to know what you would do in that moment.

7:49Yes. Okay. In effect, this is the spit or swallow question. So it's an important question. and really you want to sort of, particularly with sort of pieces of gristle, things that you cannot swallow or digest, fish bones, gristle, you need to get it out of your mouth as quickly as possible. Particularly with bones, actually. That's going to do, if you do swallow that accidentally, that's going to do a lot of harm. And really with your, you use both your hands, spit it into the dominant hand, use your non-dominant hand shield and put it on either the sort of the discard section of your main plate or a bread plate if you've got one.

8:22You cover it with something? you can do if you want to, but you don't need to. If there's a sort of a piece of bread or something, you could put it on there. There are some etiquette books, particularly older etiquette books, who say the way it went into your mouth, it needs to come out of your mouth. So for example, an olive stone. An olive has gone into your mouth with your hands, so you can spit the stone out into your hands. But a piece of fish, for example, has gone into your mouth, I would hope, with a fork. And so you would spit out that fishbone onto the fork. It's actually impossible to spit a fishbone out onto a fork.

8:55And actually, by the time you've done that, everyone's seen what you're doing. So I would say, forget that rule. That's a complete nonsense rule. Just take it out to your hands as swiftly as possible. What did you do? I looked around the room. Yes. Just made sure I could do whatever I was about to do discreetly. I picked up my napkin. I spat it into my napkin. I folded the napkin twice. Yeah. And I actually hid the napkin under my thigh. And I was hoping that by hiding the napkin, the very well-staffed room would notice that I'm missing a napkin and then replace it with a clean one. What ended up happening is I sat on the napkin for a while and the mashed up piece of filet mignon was safely secured in the napkin, but I actually forgot it was there after a while and I was really enjoying conversation and leaning forward and back in the seat and the napkin somehow slipped from my seat and it went onto the floor and one of the waiters noticed the napkin fell over and he came running.

9:57And he said, Signore.

10:01And he flings open my napkin and a bullet of my mashed up compressed filet mignon from the weight of my thigh goes flying across the dinner table. And people saw something fly by. I pretended I saw something. I was like, whoa, where did that come from? But it was my mashed up filet mignon. Right. Yes. Awkward. I would like to say, actually, in your defense, whilst I am not going to say that spitting into a napkin was great, the worst crime is, regardless of whether there is something in your napkin or not, if your napkin has fallen to the floor... Replace it. Replace the napkin. His fault. Yes.

10:44That's not mine. That's not mine. And also flicking the napkin is in it at the start of the dinner and during is a bit affected and grim. So, wow. Well, you'll never spit anything into an app again now. And I was a victim, clearly. You can call it a victim. If you want to call yourself a victim in that instance, you do that. But, yes, you were a victim adjacent. I was a victim adjacent. Well, thank you so much for making me feel better about myself. Have you always pointed out the right and wrong manners in your friend groups and social events? I try to do that now for a living with some humor.

11:24Not anywhere near to the level of granularity that you managed to. Well, I don't really talk about my job in my social life, but not, you know, I went around to a friend's house the other night and, you know, there was no fork for the pudding. I'm not going to sit there and go, why is there no fork for the pudding? which was not ice cream I should just hasten to add it was something you needed a thought for um so I don't do it in a social capacity I don't have many friends as it is so I'm not I'm not going to have I'm not going to have many if I keep going on about it um and I'd like to think that my friends are connecting with me not because of my job they are connecting with me on a on a on a human level um but yeah I mean I was always this would be hard for you to believe I was always an uptight child so i think the um thanks for laughing the um i think the writing was on the wall from a very young age that this was probably going to be what i ended up doing because i have no other talent so i don't really know what i would i would do if if etiquette dries up i'm stuck and when did you realize that there's some there's an entertainment element to the etiquette and you're going to go podcast route social media route versus um books so i i i mean i started teaching etiquette when i was still at my school um to the young years so i started teaching when i was 16 i had no interest or even knowledge that this was a proper job it's just like oh this is literally it was a way for me not to do sport at school this entire my entire career has just been 18 years of avoiding playing rugby and I then sort of started as I taught it reached the end of my school career I started to sort of google and see that actually there were people doing this and off I went to university to read English and got some press coverage completely by accident in Tatler and the Telegraph in Britain and the company I now run the English Manor which used to be finishing school wrote to me and said well look if you're going to do this please come and do it for us i mean i think it was basically a very clever way to neutralize the competition and so i met the founder of the company uh who was ex-royal household we had we got on very well and still get on incredibly well to this day and uh yeah and that sort of so i sort of i read english at university i wasn't rushed off my feet um doing an arts-based degree and i've seen my first job for the englishman was teaching mba students in milan and i thought oh this is fun this is quite nice um and i didn't i mean i took it too seriously if i'm honest and i did a bit of sort of tv and sort of you there the few pieces of footage that there is of my earlier television appearances i'm taking myself so seriously which is odd because i never did when the cameras weren't rolling um and i can remember doing i we had a show over here in 2012 on ITV called Let's Do Lunch with Gino and Mel and don't ask what's happened to Gino or Mel since because that's another conversation but it was there, literally I made a joke at one of the hosts expense, he was Italian and the studio audience fell about laughing and I got my first laugh and I went oh I could do this but play it for laughs So that's probably when I had the wake up call that I didn't need to be too straight in any senses of the word with it.

15:01And that's that's probably that was my epiphany moment. Amazing. Yeah. And did you play into a role that you were kind of putting together on camera of this comedic version of William Hansen or was it an authentic version of self? I mean, I think now it's a slightly dialed up version of who I actually am. Back then, my now husband, in fact, we met when I was doing that show, will say that I had my TV voice. And I would sort of put on this ever so slightly affected voice. And this is my actual voice now, which some people think is affected. But it was odd. And I don't really know how I even found that voice.

15:45And I quite quickly ditched that. and didn't and yeah but I would I would say yes what you would see now on social media on tv not so much on my podcast I would say that's relatively authentic me um is sort of me plus 10 % maybe well I I probably turn the dial a few more times around of what I try to play on how does that now how do you feel doing that do you like that or is it a hindrance I think it's great because I separate myself from the role I play. Okay. So it feels like two different worlds, two different hats. And I can engineer who my character is and then protect myself in the process.

16:31So it's a nice separation. That's nice. Yeah, on one of the podcasts I do, my co-host has for years done impressions of my parents, but it's not actually my parents. It's sort of who he originally, before he actually met my parents, thought my parents were and at first it was a bit he basically thought my mother's this russian alcoholic a little bit like jaja gabor and um she isn't she's far far from it and um but actually it's quite nice because it's sort of it's it is like like you say it's that sort of slight privacy like actually we can talk about my parents but we're not talking about my parents who are not in the public eye so i don't feel our fair game um and yeah it's that slight sort of privacy without being privacy, which is good because it can be all-consuming.

17:20Well, speaking of your parents, for many, their manners or lack of manners often start in the household. Indeed. Was that the case with you? Were your parents very strict on the... I wouldn't have called them strict, but they were traditional and are traditional. And, you know, we had to say, please leave the table. When we had finished eating, we all ate together as a family. Um, I was dragged kicking and screaming into the study after Christmas and birthdays to write thank you letters. Um, I, if I, when I had gone over on a play date to a friend's house, if, as we were leaving, I was being collected, I did not say without prompting, thank you very much for having me, Mr.

18:02And Mrs. Whoever, you know, I had a slight jab in the back to remind me to say it. Um, so that, and that was sort of, and you know, my father liked setting the table nicely, still does and yeah so I sort of got it and then but it was my maternal grandmother to whom Just Good Manners is dedicated that sort of heightened my level of etiquette by giving me my first book when I was 12. And which part of daily life that you take part in or observe do you think needs Just Good Manners and etiquette the most? Well where do I start? The thing I can't stand currently and i'm hoping i'm hoping i'm trying to be philosophical about it i'm hoping we'll finesse it as it and it's it's not just britain it's literally every country i go to is playing music or watching videos even if they're yours or my videos um without headphones oh my god like that's the worst or video calls in public when you're sitting on the tube or the subway or whatever it is it's like they're looking at the underside of your chin does that person really need to see that at that point i would say a video call is you know when you actually need to show something and just because our phones are enabled with that technology does not mean to say we need to use it that's true and especially when you're doing it without headphones like if everybody on this carriage was doing the same no one would be able to hear anything and it is that that arrogance that some one person probably i would say to give them the benefit of the doubt they're doing it not knowingly they haven't made a conscious choice I'm going to annoy everybody on this tube is doing it actually whatever they're doing is more important than what the rest of us are doing it's very irritating and it's a good job I'm not in charge of crime and punishment in this country or indeed the world because I would do you know certain things to them.

19:58What would the fine be? Fine? Oh no no we're way beyond fines yes I'd taser them or something I just You know, you've got to fight with fire. It's true. I'm a big wired earphone guy. Okay. I'm always wired him. Yeah. Great. I love them. And then it's just between you and your phone. And it doesn't... You can use your phone. We all love our phones. They're great pieces of technology. Nobody else needs to sort of know what's going on. I agree. I actually even whisper. The nice thing about the wire is the microphone is so close to your mouth. You can really whisper. No one hears a thing. It's very discreet.

20:31The wireless earphones... Oh, you've got to shout. Yep, you have to shout. Yeah. Especially the wind train. It's not for me. I'm hoping in 10 years time the technology will be a thousand times better. I hope so too. But yes. No, I'm agree. Wired headphones are great. Wired are good. But hey, if you want to wear wireless headphones, that's also fine. As long as we can't hear it, that's fine. That's fine as well. I agree. I get lots of inbound and my most engagement on my videos about dating. I think people are struggling to find partners that either match their expectations when it comes to manners and etiquette or exceed them.

21:04which is everything I guess everyone wants someone who exceeds their expectations I've seen a lot of good I've seen a lot of less good when it comes to dating where do you see the voids when it comes to dating etiquette from the start of asking the person out to I would say how people meet people now is very different from how it used to be and so So, you know, for a lot, I mean, this dinner that I was at the other day without the forks for the pudding, it was generally people were a bit younger than me, which made me feel terribly old. And, you know, they were chatting away about, they were very open about how they meet people.

21:50And they've all slept with each other. It was extraordinary. There was no taboo with it. And, you know, I'm all for sexual liberation. That's absolutely fine. um it did put me off a little bit the crumble but you know we went we went for it and um yeah and so there's almost there's almost like you know there's no is i did think is anything sacred here um but yeah i think people don't quite know what is appropriate and what is not appropriate because thankfully we are a lot more educated and we have realized as a society and called out really bad slightly toxic behavior we still have a lot of way to go but generally it's getting a bit better than it used to be but i do think in a dating world it then is quite hard to pick up on what is flirting and a signal that you know maybe we'd like to meet over some pasta and chat or enjoy knocky on another occasion um versus what is actually just now i'm just being your friend yeah um we were my husband and i were in berlin over easter and he was in a gym and there was i will tell you afterwards who it was but there was a in fact my husband didn't realize it was this person that he was on in fact it was a dessert it was easter so it was really quiet and he was on a treadmill and my husband was watching wicked on a treadmill as you do the film and uh this guy got on the treadmill next to him now from an etiquette point of view and then there's a gym, like, pick a different treadmill.

23:21It's like a urinal. Yeah, exactly. It's weird. At least one apart. Exactly. If it's all busy, okay, fine. Yeah. There was like 10 treadmills in Rome. And this guy kept looking over at him and it's a bit, a little bit intrusive, but maybe is he just, is he just trying to watch Wicked? It's a good film. Whatever. What's going on? Anyway, and sort of, he could sort of see a sort of tattoo, tall tattooed, moustached guy. And that's all I will say. and yeah then he sort of got off and got an exercise mat to do his floor workout whatever you do and this guy about five minutes later got off and put the workout mat next to my husband are you watching this whole interaction no i was upstairs i was in the room reading and um yeah this this guy then sort of taps my husband on the shoulder because there was a weight on the floor as it and says she's me using this weight it was only when my husband looked at And he went, oh, it's da-da-da-da.

24:19And anyway, my husband was telling various people this story. And they're like, I think, and knowing who this guy is, I think he was sort of ever so slightly, probably slightly coming on to you. But I mean, my innocent husband was like, he's just being a bit too close. Like, does he want to work out? Does he want me to be his workout buddy? What does he want to do? But I think it's that sort of example where people are sort of confused as to signals, as to what is a signal and what is not. And I'm not completely convinced I have the answer because I was not very good at dating when I was on the market and I am now married.

24:54But yeah, I think as long as people are communicative and are genuine, I'm a great believer in not people shouldn't play games. That sounds like a game to me. I think it was a bit, yeah. And I mean, when this is not recording, we can have an entire discussion on that. but yeah I think it was a bit of a game and I think games are for kids and it's the same as like oh you know we had a date do I text them back at 9am the next day 10am should I leave it a whole 24 hours just like just be impulsive just do what feels right yeah I agree don't sit there and you know what was that book that was written about 10, 20 years ago about the rules of dating it's not really the rules of dating the game was it the game that was written I've only ever read Just Good Manners by William Hanson Thank you very much Which there is nothing about dating But yeah it's that you know Oh just don't do that Just be yourself And actually looking back at my very unsuccessful dating history When I was trying to sort of Modify my behaviour to appeal to somebody Ended in catastrophe Or not catastrophe but it didn't end successfully Whereas when I actually went No this is who I am I'm just going to be me I'm sure we have a listener today at a gym contemplating the treadmill game yes see someone on the treadmill there's five empty treadmills beside them and they're thinking should I take the treadmill next to them or should I take the one a few treads down and then make a move my advice would be to keep a safe distance and then approach with kindness but with clarity and this is when you are you know you want to exercise with them type of thing or or not or see them for a gnocchi okay you know yeah but just to be very clear about the i'm approaching you because i'd like to see you some other time versus accidentally rubbing shoulders quite but also i would say whether you're going to you know make advances on someone or even if you know them socially and you just want to say hi in the middle of a workout probably not the best time to do it it's true probably do you think lingering and waiting for the workout to be done is also weird though no yes yes but equally actually the gym I go to I don't go to the gym very often I just would like to point that out but the gym I which I know is a shock the gym I'm told is now on a Sunday evening they've had to put a bouncer on the steam room door because it's cruising 101 and apparently it's absolutely it's rife for it I mean I keep turning up on the Sunday afternoon but I mean I can't nothing's happened to me but um now i'm told it's like by management it's it's become a real problem quite quickly it's a relatively new gym oh um but yeah so it all goes on i mean there's my little innocent mind going well this is a nice gym what about um the art of asking someone out i think a lot of people now as you said are meeting online dming each other yeah all with the right intentions maybe sometimes the wrong yeah process yeah i'm a i talk about this in my videos very often i'm a big fan of just being clear and then yes picking the person up showing and showing intent being as chivalrous as one can be without being excessive yeah do you have any tips in that category confidence like you said confidence and clarity i think ambiguity and maybe this is where brits in particular go wrong because we we can obfuscate and sort of talk around an issue um and not to be very clear but actually it is just nice just to go like here are the cards uh lay them on the table allow the other person you know you got to allow them some say of the matter um as to what they want to do but and i also think people need to you know we all we all get advances from people that you know we're maybe not interested in or or we only see it as a friend or whatever.

28:59That's fine. We've got to let these people down gently. I mean, at the end of the day, you're being paid a fantastic compliment, almost the best compliment there could be. And, you know, some of us beggars can't be choosers. So you've got to be nice with it. And they're not doing anything wrong. Obviously, if they sort of make physical contact with you unsolicited, that is a different thing. But if they are just sort of going, I'd like to see more of you, great. lovely that's very kind of them yeah so we need to you know we've got to be nice we're to let people down gently but being confident being I think confidence is sexy I think so too what do you think the ideal first date setup and arrangement is short shorts yes okay it goes wrong okay I don't think you know let's not do a girl for a seven course tasting I completely with wine flight because god if they turn up and you think no do you know what they're a very nice person but they're not for me you're stuck you need to see the exit exactly great believer in a coffee date or maybe one drink i agree um a walk yes something where there's an easy out yeah and then a walk with potentially maybe you've cleared the evening yeah and then if it's going well should we go a bite to eat that's fine but something where you are you know you're both hedging it and i think you have to everyone has to go into that first date knowing that probably the other person is thinking that as well as they're doing regardless of how attractive you find each other you know and i'm thinking of the dates that i used to go on and they're you know they were great on in fact there's one person who was a phenomenal text to be text for three weeks i was out in the country so we couldn't actually meet up great chat on whatsapp or whatever it was in real life could hardly string a sentence together um so you do you do need to was quite attractive but actually do you know what I would actually quite like a I'd like a conversation the inverse is ideal I call them reverse catfish reverse catfish so online not so great but then you're really impressed in real life I think it's actually the greatest compliment to someone in this generation yes because they people now oversell online and underperform in real life more often than not what do you think is the ideal flow of that first date let's say you met the person on Instagram Yep That's how so many people now meet For sure Or maybe you meet them on the treadmill but you get their Instagram You say hey let's go grab the coffee Time of day Good, bad I would say for the first day I probably wouldn't do late, late Especially not for coffee for the obvious reasons I would I would probably do late afternoon, maybe.

31:49Depends on what day of the week it is. I mean, I function really, if I ever, I mean, I hope I don't go back on the market, but I'm probably my best at 8 o 'clock in the morning. So if someone would like to date me for breakfast, lovely. You'll get the best out of me. Past 7 o 'clock in the evening, no. I can't really be bothered to talk to anyone. So particularly someone I don't know very well. So I think you've got to ask questions about them. focus on them i think people love talking about themselves so ask questions about them don't try to match their story and this actually goes for non-dating context as well so many people think oh well you're telling me a story about a holiday you had in africa on safari i will what story do i have about when i went on safari it's like no ask follow-up questions about their story focus on them people like talking about themselves it's a really easy way it's almost a sales technique to bond with somebody is to just focus on it and give them their moment and if you've got a better story about a safari don't don't try and trump them yeah i agree with that let them have their moment yeah i fully agree i think it's also difficult for people to navigate these sorts of situations when they're trying to not be themselves trying to be a version of themselves that they're not completely yeah yeah and like if if you're well the story I think possibly I write about in Jessica Banner I can't remember maybe it's in another book I did but this date with a guy who actually is now quite a close friend that I really liked at university he invited me to his birthday party which was in a nightclub I've been into two nightclubs in my life one of which was for his birthday and I I'm not a nightclub person.

33:40I don't see you as a nightclub person. Generally, I would rather die, is what I've decided in life. They're too noisy. You can't have conversation. Nobody says anything interesting. Everyone's posing. They start far too late. I would be interested in going to a nightclub if we could go at 7. Dayclub. Yeah, a dayclub. And actually, they are becoming quite popular. Someone was telling me about them the other day. They are becoming quite popular. Because I think people are going, why are we waiting to go out until 11 o 'clock at night? And then get home at 3. And then the next day is a write-off.

34:07You can do that when you're a student, but when you've actually got responsibility in life, you can't. But if you still want that function, you know, something's got to give anyway. I was a student. I thought, OK, I will go because I like this person. We'll call him Alfred. I like Alfred. Alfred will not like me unless I can show that I like nightclubs. And I think it became quite obvious quite quickly. I didn't even drink back then. I do now, but I didn't back then that I was not comfortable. And actually, Alfred and I became great friends once actually sort of just relaxed. I was like, yeah, this is me.

34:43I don't like that. And we don't all have to like the same things. It can be different. And Alfred may like you regardless or even more. Yeah, exactly. Probably likes me better now because we know I think it's very easy to even if you can't put your finger on it when someone is trying to trying too hard. and obviously a lot of your videos you're sort of pointing out what is you know, what is perhaps a bit much versus what is, you know, actual I actually have a list of things I wanted to ask you on this topic, of what is too much what is too little Actually it was on dating I think it was the topic of dating you put me in one of your videos didn't you, a while ago, my face flashed up your face did flash up you're my professor I'm your student I learned so much from you That's fine Could be rapid fire Could also stick to them Last time I was in an interview And they wanted me to do rapid fire And they asked me the first question I did a five and a half minute answer So I'm just warning you Okay Since we're sitting at a dinner table Yes For those who are just listening And not viewing I'll start with table etiquette Yeah Should you finish everything on your plate Even if you're full Right here we go No, if you don't want to make yourself ill, you want to try to finish everything on your plate, but it does depend if you have helped yourself or you have been helped by someone else.

36:06If you have helped yourself to it from a communal dish from a buffet, yes, you want to try and finish it. If someone else has served you and the portion is too large, then try and eat as much as you can. That's a short answer. Okay, how do you feel about taking the leftovers home? So I have changed my view on that. look if you come to my house no that's that unless i sort of try and portion it up and say look take rid of the get rid of it yeah yeah but you can't go i can't i can't finish all these peas but i'll take them back with me that's that's no that's your house yeah you can't you can't do that in someone's house because probably the leftover lasagna or whatever i've made you is probably my lunch tomorrow to be perfectly honest and you're depriving me and but in a restaurant particularly for things like afternoon tea um where there's so much wastage a lot of these places will now offer you a box or something not so much for the sandwiches but for the cake and that is fine now i think in a world where so many people are going without it would be ridiculous to sort of go just chuck it in the bin i think that's a bit irresponsible very fair is refusing to toast at a formal dinner ever acceptable i don't drink so sometimes i if you are i mean you can toast with anything okay anything cold not not with tea or coffee but you can toast or hot chocolate but you can toast with water orange juice etc there is my father in particular used to sort of i've sort of told him what's what now used to go you can't toast with water it's unlucky it's unlucky to toast with water absolute rubbish the the the unlucky with water thing was back in a day when the water was full of cholera and disease and you didn't drink water because you were dicing with death but that is going back into medieval time we are very lucky in this country that our water is fine it might be a bit limescaly but it's fine um if you are buddhist if you are muslim if you are pregnant if you're a recovering alcoholic you're underage you just don't want to drink because you don't want to drink it is fine to toast with water um but if you have got champagne in front of you and no water i would just go through i would just pick up your glass and just go through the motions you don't need to sip it but just raise your glass which is what you do that's what I do I feel socially accepted by you now I also love I'm not a massive drinker my husband is teetotal as well so I'm on the side of the non-drinkers I'm teetotal good well I think it's much healthier to be that way yeah okay is double dipping in the dip truly a faux pas or is it overblown it is a faux pas if it's a shared dip if it's your own dip You can quadruple dip I don't mind, you dip whatever you like in it But if Don't make your own jokes But if it's a communal dip Then yes, I mean maybe Look, if it's you and your partner Or whoever you're with You know You're probably snogging, so it's okay In that instance, because You know, whatever What if you dip one side Bite it, and then you flip it around That's okay, that is fine That's fine.

39:14That's absolutely fine. As long as there is no, there is a gap where it is sort of sanitized. Yeah. And there's no overlap. That is okay. Fine. I do that with fish goujons. Oh. Because they're usually pretty long. Yes. So you can take a good bite, flip it around, double dip, and no one really minds. No. But the French fry is difficult because you can't really see that you flipped it around. True. Yeah. And you don't want other people to think that you're double dipping either. Even different. Yeah. But I think take ownership and just say, look, I am double dipping, but I've turned it round and I haven't touched this bit.

39:45And I think most people are absolutely fine. That's true. I like that. I have never double dipped or indeed single dipped a fish goujon because, as I say in some of my videos, nothing fishy touches my lips. I'm quite anti. Anti-fish? I don't like fish. Wow. Makes me feel physically ill. All fish? I can do tuna. Do you like smoked salmon? No. No. Which I know is odd because people assume I like smoked salmon and caviar and all that, but no. Or fish and chips with your peas. Yeah, can't stand fish and chips. Just peas. I can do sushi, tuna. I can do tuna sushi. But beyond that, nothing fishy touches my lips.

40:22Nice, okay. Similar topic. Should you ever correct someone's table manners? Again, I think it's best to lead by example. So, for example, let's take the plate of peas that you have kindly provided. if there were peas either in this quantity or or fewer uh in front of us i would and someone didn't know how to eat i mean forget me being me just as a normal person um but i did know how to eat peas i would probably sort of do it properly and go all these peas are delicious and hope that they picked up on the fact that i was sort of subtly showing them this is how we eat peas and we don't pick them up or whatever use a stew and eat them off the knife or whatever okay i have a friend who was on a first date recently yeah and she had a piece of spinach stuck in her teeth and the person that she was on a date with wanted to let her know but he didn't know how to do so without embarrassing her so he put a piece of spinach in his own teeth and then she said yes finish in your teeth and he said oh you too so there was this shared shared that was an excellent example of manners and doing the polite thing rather than you know and that's the difference in manners and etiquette you know it's always better to be more well managed than sort of doggedly follow the rules of of etiquette um so yeah i love that's great well done well done to that person in my videos i often talk about my disliking for people who are loud not just in the volume of their voices but i generally like people who are a bit more volume low yes What you mean is not Americans?

42:05There's some low-volume Americans out there. Some Americans can be quite loud. Some Americans can be quite loud. I have American family, so I feel I'm able to say that. I've grown up going to America. That's true. I mean, go to Spain over the summer. The English. Well, true. They're not so quiet either. No. No, no, no. But they are the English that go to Spain. The English that go to Spain. And there is a difference between the English that go to Spain and the English that go to France or the English that go to Italy. You said it, not me. Yeah. Although they're very nice parts of Spain as well.

42:33There are. Let's not tarnish all of Spain with the same brush. That's true. Some parts of Spain where English police have to go take care of the English. Mm-hmm. Yes. Again, we're back to tasering. You know, taser more. So that leads me to my question. If someone is too loud, maybe your family across the pond, how do you ask them to lower the volume? And this is why I think British etiquette sometimes can be best because we can use humour to deflect it. If we were Dutch or German, we'd probably just sort of go, speak quiet, may not even put on a please at the end of it. But I think we can sort of say something like, oh, I'm only standing half a metre away from you.

43:19Or, oh, do you want to talk up a bit louder because I think they can hear you in Bangladesh? That sort of thing. We can say something funny to just try and lighten the moment, to convey a serious point. I love it. It's true. How long should small talk last? At a wedding, at an event? Oh, I mean, look, if it's between two Brits, it could be 45 minutes. But if it's in Germany, it'll be about 45 milliseconds. So again, different cultures. People from the Middle East are very good at small talk, really. I would say people in the Arab region and Brits are particularly good at small talk. Ten minutes is fine, maximum.