She's 20 and Her Parents Want Her To Buy Them A House

26:39But you can steer him away from scams and traps and commodities that will not actually benefit him. And we have. And that was the gold. And I said, listen, if you want to put money in gold, imagine, like Dave says, put it in the middle of the living room, light it on fire. Are you willing to lose that much money? Yeah. And, you know, so awesome. Yeah, that's good. Um, when I, I mean, when I do acquire this, since none of it is an investments, well, the 200 in the thrift savings plan, but for the most part, we sell the house that's cash. Everything else is cash. Um, will I be also looking at taxes on this since I'll be inheriting it or, you know, I'll just, or just get with a smart investor pro on stuff like that.

27:18I believe it would just go against his estate. And so as long as, you know, he doesn't have liabilities and you're the beneficiary on these accounts, I don't believe that you would be paying taxes on that because you're not selling off a stock. And so there's no capital gains here to be paid. If it was in a traditional account and taxes haven't been paid on the growth, then you might be liable for taxes. But I would get in touch with a tax attorney. And does he have any professionals working with him in his life across any of this tax, financial advisors? He just moved and he said he needs to go to a lawyer and get his estate, not his estate, the will all redone and everything with the new estate.

27:56So he's at least willing to do that. He is. And him and I have got a fantastic relationship. And we're actually, he's very open to talking about this with me because he wants to know that not only is everything going to be handled correctly, but also he wants to know that I know what to do with it too. That's wonderful. Well, I was going to say, it'll be worth seeing if he would sit down and you go with him and sit down with a SmartVestor Pro, you connect with one on our website, and just have an outside professional look at it. And maybe they'll convince him of, hey, you have a lot of money sitting on the sidelines.

28:29You're losing purchasing power every day. Inflation is eating away at this. You could really do something with this money to leave a legacy. And that might convince him. And maybe he does some of the money over time. He does$50 ,000 this year, another$50 ,000 next year. He gets more comfortable with it. And over time, we start moving these two investments. Yeah. And one of the things I was concerned with him for was that some of this money is not FDIC insured. Maybe at a minimum we move that over to something. So awesome. Oh, 100%. Yeah. Thanks for the call, man. We're seeing more and more of this for sure of just – And he sounds amazing, Martin.

29:03I mean – He's done a great job. Yeah. And just the fact that he'll even dialogue with his son. There's so many – And be willing to create a will and talk about the estate. Honestly, we talked to so many adult children who say, like, my parents will not do X, Y, and Z. Or they're having to take care of them. I mean, so the fact that, yeah, you hear something like this, like, man, just incredible. Absolutely amazing. We got a call, I think it was yesterday. And he was like, hey, my dad won't make a will. We have 10 siblings. He has a ton of real estate. Oh, man. And he refuses because he thinks Jesus is going to come back before he dies.

29:34Oh, no. What an M. Night Shyamalan twist that was. And you're like, how do I convince this guy? I'm like, I don't know. I don't know what information he has. We don't know the day or the hour. He somehow knows when he's going to die and when Jesus is coming back. Those are two pieces of information that nobody knows. I think you should just climb Mount Rushmore and call it a day. You have a better chance of climbing Mount Rushmore. I know. That is so true. But think about it. If you truly love your family, why would you leave it to chance? Why would you leave it to the government to decide what happens?

30:03That and the relational strain it causes on the family of them trying to make the decisions and decide. And it ends up tearing families apart. It really does. So the clearer you can be, the more communication you can be or you can have before you're passing. I'm like, that is such a gift to your family. It really is. And it sounds morbid and it's not fun to talk about. But golly, it is such a gift for everyone to know exactly what's going on. And yeah. And when you die, you just say, okay, press play on the plan. Everybody knows. And it's, yeah, and it's smooth. You said it much nicer than I would.

30:37I like to say, if you hate your family, don't have a will and make it as confusing as possible. If that's what the route you want. That's what you want. If that's what you want. Yeah, it is. Yeah, I don't know. It's interesting, though, the people that truly don't even want to engage on any level of a conversation when it comes to death. And again, it's not fun to talk about. But you guys, having life insurance, having a will in place, like these things. Making sure your beneficiaries are correct. Yeah. I mean, genuinely, it is. And it takes some work. And again, it's not always fun to think about, but that it's irresponsible not to do that if you have a family.

31:16Well, then you run into the issue of, well, now they can't cognitively make these decisions and we never got financial power of attorney. And now you have a real nightmare on your hands. So just do the work. Be an adult. It's not always fun, but we got to do things that aren't fun sometimes. I can't wait till I'm 80 and senile. My kids are trying to tell me what to do. That's going to be a good time. You're going to be the grumpiest. I'm already there. Poor Mia and Henry. I'll just be settling into who I was made to become. That's all that'll happen.

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33:34All right. The all new EveryDollar is here. And now it's way more than just our world-class budgeting app. There's a ton of advanced features to help you make faster progress with your money. and the average person finds thousands of dollars in margin in just the first 15 minutes. So start every dollar for free today. You can get it in the App Store or Google Play. Jenna is in Boston up next. What's going on, Jenna? How can we help? Hi, thanks for taking my call. My husband and I recently have become just huge fans, and so we've had an employment for a while. We went through the life insurance you guys recommend.

34:09Oh, my gosh. So proud of you guys. Good job. Well done. We did the budgeting app and we, so we've been comfortable, like we've been fine, but we're in debt. So I feel like we've just been paying our minimums and going along with it. And through your show, I've been getting like that sick feeling that like we are doing this all wrong. So that's what kind of encouraged this. and we do okay, but we have about combined$98 ,000 of debt because of mostly student loans. I have about$36 ,000. My husband has maybe$50 ,000 and then$10 ,000 give or take in medical bills, by car and stuff. Okay. So any, um, and we, any cars, Jenna, or is that just no, no cars.

35:08Perfect. Okay. No, um, no car payments. So with, um, the small, like 10 ,000, I feel like we can do real quick and then it's getting into, um, the student loans. So we budgeted it and I kind of, um, mapped out it looks like we could say have it paid off in about under three years it looked like i think so what do you guys make with that though um combined somewhere around 230 typically okay all right um so the reason um i originally my plan was like a five-year plan i really wanted to knock down faster than that. So my husband puts like 6 % of his salary and he makes more than me in, um, his 401k.

35:59And so we talked about him stopping doing that. So I make less than him, but I, I like have hold the benefits and things like that. And I work for a really big, um, investment firm and I get a 7 % match. So I do have a decent 401k with them. Um, do I stop getting like do I should I stop putting money in that even though I'm getting that seven percent from them by doing it yes yeah okay yeah all all of your focus needs to be on paying off this debt and Jenna I would I would challenge you guys because of what you make um I would think you would only need a deposit for maybe two years because I think you could pay this off in a year You guys make$230 ,000.

36:50You have$100 ,000. What if you guys lived on$95 ,000 a year and you did nothing with your life? So I definitely think we need to cut back on our spending, and we could pay things off a lot sooner. But we own a house. We have our mortgage. Our mortgage is about$2 ,600 a month, which for us is affordable right now. That's fine. But we also have a son, so we pay for daycare, which is about$300 a week or so, so about$1 ,200 a month. So that's kind of where the bigger expenses are. But you guys are bringing home, what, like$15K a month? What's your take-home pay? When I was doing the math in the budgeting app, originally it showed like$11 ,000 or so, but I think that was before we touched the 401k.

37:47So what does he make a year? What's his gross income? He makes about 155 without his bonus. Okay. And then what do you make? I make about 70 without overtime and without my bonus. Okay. So we'll call it, can we call it 80? Yeah. Yeah. Give or take around that. And you're doing 7%. So here's the amount that you would free up to throw toward your debt per year. you're looking at 9 ,300 plus 5 ,600. That's pretty sizable. So you're talking$15 ,000 a year that could go toward your debt on top of all the margin you have. And that's why we're saying, what if you pause for one year, go down to zero, and you come back guns blazing in 2027, investing 15%, both of you investing 15%.

38:30You will well make up for any lost employer match, investing 15 % for the rest of your life versus the current track, which is, I guess we'll just invest up to the match forever because we're going to have this debt for a long time. So do you see the intensity that we're after here? And by the way, going down to 0 % investing is going to make you both mad, isn't it? Mad at your debt. Yeah, yeah. No, absolutely. Not mad at each other. So that's going to make you get out of debt faster because you want to get back to investing. And so it's kind of like a carrot you dangle in front of you saying, man, I want to get back to that.

39:02And that's going to fire you guys up. Okay. So it's part math, part psychology. Can you pay that off with daycare and the mortgage in a year? Yeah, I don't think daycare and the mortgage is your problem here. I think it's the other things that are – Yeah, because that added up to$3 ,800. Out of her$11 ,000. Yeah. So it's like can we live off of$5 ,000 for the rest and throw the other amount at the debt? Yeah, and that would get you all paid off in a year and nine months, more than just two and a half years. Right? So like maybe make it a year and a half. See if someone can take on a part-time job for a couple of months, bring in – And we talk to people making side hustles and they make two grand a month just on side hustles.

39:38If you know, if you guys did that for even just, you know, three months or something, right. I'm like, it's just crazy what all of this can compound and create. And when you guys do that and then you get an emergency fund in place, then yeah, you are, you are good to go. But it's just the decision you guys have to make. And everyone does that, that does this and chooses to pay off their debt is the more intense you are, the more you sacrifice, the faster you get out. And so it's just a decision of, are we going to just live like crazy people for a year and four months and get this just taken care of?

40:12And it's just insane, but it's done. But it's done for the rest of our lives. Or do we want to drag it out for three or four years? Life's going to happen. You're going to get comfortable and complacent and go, well, four years is okay. I want you guys to have such an aggressive, specific goal to where you go 98 ,000, that's 81.66 a month. We have to throw out the debt. We're going to pause investing to free up $12.50 a month on top. If you start doing it like that, that makes me believe you'll actually get out of debt in a year. And people end up getting out of debt faster than what they originally calculate, Jenna, too, because there's things that you don't see and you don't know, like bonuses or raises, you know, or you pick up this thing or this thing you forgot you had over here and you throw it at the debt.

40:50I mean, it's just - You're just willing to work harder. Yes. Stuff ends up coming up, which is amazing. And then you get a promotion and get the bonus because they're like, man, Jenna's on fire this month. I don't know what got into her, but she is crushing it. And that, I think, will truly propel you guys into this debt-free journey. And then once you're debt-free, you're never going to go back. And you'll get that emergency fund. Do you guys have savings right now that you could use to start this process? Yeah. How much? Yeah, we usually have between five and 10 in savings. Okay. Oh, that's wonderful.

41:17So what if you used a bunch of that to knock out the smallest debts right now, just to kind of kickstart it and say, you know what, this is us putting skin in the game. Yeah, that's like a month or two of not having to pay off debt that you could subtract from your timeline, which is awesome. Yeah, that's not a bad idea. Thank you. Yeah, I will definitely run this all by my husband. Is he going to be convinced? I feel like he's still going to go, babe, we're not doing that. No, he's pretty – the only thing he doesn't like is just the – he's on a page with me on all of it. He wants to pay it off.

41:47He's kind of dove into it all with me. He's been great. the only thing he likes is having a bit more of an emergency fund than a thousand just with kids and stuff. Sure, sure. Other than that, like, he's pretty much good to jump into all of it with me. Yeah, that's awesome. Well, I'm glad you guys are, you know, on the same page for the most part. And that's a normal fear. We hear that usually from, if it's a couple, especially with kids, that is kind of a thing that we have. But the truth is, too, if something were to happen and you guys had to pause it at Snowball, you have eight grand freed up per month.

42:17Do you know what I mean? You guys could get cash really fast if something comes up that's more than$1 ,000. And again, with that emergency fund, that's going to add another fire lit under you. You pause investing and you take your savings down, you're going to go, oh my gosh, we need to get out of debt ASAP. And that's going to, again, get you out of debt even faster. And so I encourage you guys to go all in on the plan because it works. And if you do it a la carte like a buffet, it's not going to work as fast. And you're going to say, well, I guess the Ramsey plan doesn't work. No, you just chose your own plan.

42:46So just try it our way. Let me say, though, kudos to you guys. I mean, y 'all are at the very front end of all of this. I mean, just even doing the life insurance and the will and the budgeting app, every dollar and everything. Keep the momentum up. Yeah, you guys are doing awesome. Love to hear it.

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44:44Welcome back to The Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union studio. I'm George Campbell, joined by my co-host on Smart Money Happy Hour, Rachel Cruz, and we're taking your calls at 888-825-5225. Anne is in Jackson, Mississippi up next. Anne, welcome to the show. Thank you. Thanks for taking my call. Absolutely. I'm 60 plus years old, starting life over again, or supposed to be. Just got divorced. He was the breadwinner of the family. We had been putting like 15 % away in 401s and savings and all of this, or so I was led to believe. And it turns out we weren't. and found out about that and affairs.

45:36And I told him that this wasn't acceptable, and he told me I could get out of the house, which I did. It became very abusive very fast. I got an apartment. I dug a hole, got in an apartment, trying to get my life back together. I walked away without nothing from the marriage. We had no kids together. I have a couple of kids from a previous marriage.

46:12And my car broke down, and I'm that person. I can't pay my rent this month. I don't know where to turn or what to do. I'm using the everyday budget. But when I just put, like, my expenses and everything, it works out okay. But then there's always the other shoe that seems to be dropping. And I can't get ahead and catch a break. And I just really need, like, advice. I've gone back to work, so I'm getting a little bit of income that way. But I'm just, like, terrorized. I just feel like. Your whole life is turned upside down completely. I don't know who to turn to or where to go or what to do. Oh, Ann, I'm so sorry.

46:53How long were you guys married? 14 years. 14 years, okay. I'm trying to help my daughter raise her two kids, and it's just, I feel like I can't breathe. I'm drowning. Yeah. Well, you're in a state of grief completely. I mean, it's almost like someone has died, right, is that feeling. So you are, from an emotional standpoint, turned inside out, which is horrible. I mean, much less a divorce, but the reasons why of the infidelity and the secrets and the law. I mean, it just seems to just be piling on. And so, and I've heard Dr. John Zoloni talk about this, that, you know, in that case, it's almost like you question yourself.

47:39Like, how did I not know, right? You start to feel like, am I the crazy one? A lot of shame and guilt. I can't trust myself, right? And so I just want to free you from all of that, that you made the exact right decision on what you did. And you still have another quarter to go in life, which is amazing, right? Like you get to now create something totally new. And while it's so scary because you would never have even dreamt of being where you are today, it is the reality. And so it is what are you going to do literally one day at a time is kind of where you're at when I'm hearing you talk. And so, okay, so you got nothing in the divorce because there was nothing.

48:21Is that basically it? Yes. Okay. Correct. Is the divorce finalized? Yes. Okay. And did you have an attorney? No. Why? I didn't have money to hire one. But you should be getting alimony from this, some spousal support, something. No, I'm not entitled to it. The house was in his name because he owned it before the marriage. Was there a pre-nup? I wasn't entitled to that. I did talk with an attorney, but no. I just don't see how you're married for 14 years, he's the breadwinner, and you get zero from this divorce. Yeah, usually there's alimony until you get remarried, if you do. And there's no child support because they're not his kids, so that's probably not.

49:10What did the attorney say when you spoke to the attorney? And he said that I could hire the attorney, hire a forensic accountant to go through to prove everything. I mean, at this point. That would be expensive. and he said that I could spend$10 ,000 and walk away with nothing. Yeah, which is true, but I would be curious on the— I still think his future income needs to play a part in this, regardless if he had anything in the bank account. What are you doing now for work and how much do you make? I'm on disability because I have a disability, and so I get$2 ,000 from that, and then I'm making about$800 in addition to that.

49:55And what's your rent every month? $1 ,075. You're making$800 a week or a month in addition? A month. Doing what? A month. What are you doing? A part-time substitute teacher. Okay. And what's the nature of the disability? Is there something where you can't do certain types of work?

50:19Correct. Okay. So could you do, if you're a substitute teacher, that's fairly physical. You got to get up, go there, stand all day. So I'm wondering, can you do something different that pays more that is more regular and stable? I'm looking. I am. I'm looking. I've got applications in a lot of different places. And why can't you pay rent this month if you have the$2 ,000 and disability plus your$800? I put$700 to get my car repaired. Like I said, when I moved out, when I got my place in May, I have been one foot in the hole the whole time.

51:08What kind of debt, Ann? Yeah, Ann, what kind of debt do you have? I don't have any. Okay, okay. When you say in the hole, are you just saying there's emergencies that come up? Yes. Okay. So you have the car repair 700. You paid that. What else is on the horizon? I'm also helping my daughter raise her two kids. We can't do that right now. You can't do that, Ann. You're drowning. You don't have a life raft to throw at her. Yeah. When you're saying that, are you saying that you're doing that with your time, or what does that mean? Or money. I'm doing it with my time and helping out with food and things like that.

51:45Okay. Because they're with me a lot of the time. Okay. so and I'm telling you and we can you can get back to I know that's your heart and that's probably where you want to be as a grandmother I want you to get back to that place you just can't probably in the next two years so you need to have a conversation and your daughter doesn't want you in this situation like what you're what you're describing to us is you can't even pay your rent if you get evicted you have to live with her irresponsible okay it's irresponsible to be watching your grandkids right now from a time and money perspective it just is and we can get back to that place because I want you to be able to do those things.

52:18But right now we have to get you stable financially. Okay. And so you're, and she, your, your daughter will, has to understand that. Like if I would, I would assume if you came to her and said, I can't pay my rent mom. Okay. So then she, she needs to figure out another plan for herself and her kids for the next 24 months. Like that's what I would say. Um, and so that you have the time and the bandwidth and the money. So, Ann, your first things are food, shelter, utilities, transportation. Those are the only things that get paid, okay? And then beyond that, we have to be upping the income. And hopefully with some time bandwidth back from not being super grandma, that we can start funding and actually getting some savings, looking at retirement, and starting those steps.

53:02But if you hold on the line, Ann, Christian's going to pick up. We're going to get you with one of our financial coaches to help walk with you through our next couple of steps. because I know that, I mean, I know you probably just feel like you're in a complete fog because, yeah, it's just horrible, horrible where you're at. But I know you can get to the other side of this. We have talked to people just like you and your situation and they get out.

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54:58faith is in cleveland ohio up next faith welcome to the show hi thanks for taking my call um my question is how do i save up for an upcoming wedding while i'm in baby step two um my only debt is my car loan cool what's left on the car loan it's about 29 000 and what do you make um 42 000 a year perfect we need to get rid of this car don't we faith yes um i've convinced myself that the car is necessary to keep because my family is very unlucky with cars we currently have two cars in our driveway that don't run and i drove no car i borrowed cars for over a year and then i bought this car i have and it's like fully on the warranty and stuff and i'm like cool i'm good to go now but now it's also taking up a good chunk of my pay and i'm like as much as you bring home after taxes is what you owe in a car so we can't do that yeah we gotta we gotta to get rid of it but the good thing is we can always learn how to have better luck with cars and learn how to buy uh use cars maybe more responsibly with more uh intention and know what we're looking for and all of those things because i don't want you making a really stupid financial decision on quote unquote we have bad luck so um i understand what you're saying like did your family was like an ancient king there was like a curse a curse that was put on faith's family faith is like actually probably yes no i feel that okay what's the wedding gonna cost what are you looking at right now um it's our budget right now is 15 we do have a family member that has set aside 5 000 for us that's nice does that bring it down to 10 member that has huh does that bring it down to 10 yes perfect and what about the fiance say.

56:59Are you guys going to split this 50-50 or what? We're going to attempt, I guess. He currently isn't working right now. He's full-time in flight school, trying to cash flow that with, he's also in the Air Force, so he uses whatever money he makes from that to cash flow his schooling. Smart. That's great. When does he finish school? He's, if the weather permits, he's supposed to graduate the December after we get married, which we're getting married next September. Okay, so we still have a year to deal with all this. Yes. Okay. I have tossed around the idea many times of getting rid of the said car.

57:37Yes. My fear, though, is that I'll get a car, because I'll be upside down on the Jeep, and I fear that I'll get some cheaper car and it'll immediately break down and then I'll have an expensive repair, because that's what's happened. All these other cars I've had. Sure. How much are you underwater on? What's the car? If you sold it at a private party, what could you get for it? I haven't looked that up. I know that I bought it in July for$23 ,000 and my loan is$29 ,000. How did that happen? They sold you a$6 ,000 warranty? Yeah. Okay, here's the good news. You can get the money back from that warranty.

58:13Mm-hmm. So you can get the majority. It'll probably be prorated, but you can get that money back. Okay, that's good news. So try that and then see what the car is actually worth. And if you're underwater by a little bit, you can come up with the savings to cover it. Let's say it's$1 ,000 that you'll still owe. Car is worth$22 ,000, you owe$23 ,000, for example. Did you buy it brand new or was it used? No, it was used. Yeah. Because Jeeps don't have the best resale value. Yeah, what's the model of it? It's a Wrangler. Okay. Okay. So the only reliable car you could find was a Jeep Wrangler. Everything else was a crapshoot.

58:51can we just admit that faith just wanted a newer jeep wrangler oh yeah for sure i feel so much better if it was like a honda accord we'd be like yes we got a jeep wrangler has i want this energy you know so faith wants that vibe the good news is we can get your reliable car that's fourteen thousand dollars that's not going to be riddled with repairs and here's what you need to do. Research the make model year, look up what the common recalls are, common repairs are, and then pay for a pre-purchase inspection from a mechanic that you trust. It's going to cost you maybe a hundred, 150 bucks, but that's going to give you the peace of mind that you're not buying a lemon.

59:32And so this bad luck was really just impulsive car purchases out of desperation when we didn't do the research to make sure we weren't buying a lemon. So I want to encourage you that you can break the cycle just by pausing and being a little bit intentional. Okay. So what you could do, Faith, is, again, you probably are underwater on it a little bit, probably not a ton because it's used and it's only been since July. Is that what you said, July? So, I mean, you may be able to get, I don't know, private sale. You might be able to, or I guess if you get the warranty back, do you got to go back to the dealership?

1:00:07Yeah, I'm wondering how that works. I also work at the dealer I bought it at. Oh, my. Well, that makes this real fun. Would they take it back for what you bought it for? Or maybe a little bit less? I mean, maybe. If it's your employer, I would hope you tell them, hey, I can't afford this. Yes. Yeah. Which is so, I mean, I hate to say it, Faith. There's, like, all these Instagram videos of people that work at car dealerships, and they're, like, bragging about their car payments, how broke they are. Yeah, all of it. So, yeah, you'll be kind of an uphill battle there a little bit. But it's so worth the conversation.

1:00:38because, yeah, it can just be a flat business. Do they sell$14 ,000 cars at this dealership? I'm just scared. Faith doesn't have$14 ,000. Do you have any money saved, Faith? I only have my$1 ,000 dollar emergency fund. Okay. So you get out of this, you free up the payment, which is how much? The payment plus the insurance. It's$530 a month. Okay. So you'll at least free that up. If you just put that in a savings account for a year, that's$6 ,000. Well over that. Yeah, that's without having a car, though. Could you get a loan from your credit union to cover the difference plus some for a little bit?

1:01:13Like, it's going to be, it's not going to be a super nice car compared to what you're driving now. But it'll get you from A to B until the wedding, at least. Okay, I guess I could throw this in there. I could probably do that. But my fiance also has two very old trucks that both still run. Yay! Ding, ding, ding. Faith is now a truck driver. She is driving a truck. It's great. Do it. Do it. This is like the biggest ego play though for most people is the car. To go from where you're going to to an old truck, you're like, oh, golly. It's going to be an ego play. But I'm telling you, Faith, when that money is freed up, you save it.

1:01:54You get a side hustle. I think you and I think even though your fiance is in flight school, I think at night he could drive. You guys could save up$2 ,000 to$3 ,000 a month and easily fund this wedding really quick. and I would just keep going until you're married and you guys start off marriage debt-free, start off marriage with actually a couple of thousand dollars or more above the wedding when it's all said and done. You guys have some money to start out your emergency funds with. And yeah, you guys are on like a really great path financially. It's just putting the ego aside for a bit. Just one year.

1:02:28That's what it is. You deserve a Jeep Wrangler, Faith, but you deserve to be debt-free even more. Yeah. And so one day. I'm like, it's your third Jeep. And you've had bad luck with the other two Jeeps. And you decided, well, it's not the Jeep's fault. Faith is not a Jeep. This is not your identity, Faith. Just say that over and over again. This is not because when you get in that truck, you're like, I am not a truck. And you got to get rid of the rubber ducks. If you're going to drive that truck, that's going to hurt. You can't do the Jeep wave anymore. Oh, yeah, that's true. You'll get back there, though.

1:02:57I think it's a good goal. But I want you to do it the wise way. I mean, honestly, making forty two thousand dollars a year before taxes, what you bring home is close to what you owe on this car. I mean, like, that's just not smart. And that thing's going down in value. What's your interest rate on this? 7%. Eesh. That's not terrible. I'm just shocked that dealership lets you do this. Like, the debt-to-income ratio just hurts my soul. Do you know the salesperson well? Can you talk to them? Yeah. It's probably Faith. Faith is the salesperson. I don't know. Yeah. Well, I would. And again, it's going to take a lot of humility to go in there.

1:03:33but it is worth it. How old are you guys, Faith? I'm actually going to be 25 on Thanksgiving Day. Okay, coming up. My young day is 24. Awesome. Yeah, if you guys can start getting these habits in place and you can start actually living this out, and I'm talking about the humility, like putting the what I want and what feels good and what feels normal aside, and you start living in a little bit of this discomfort, I'm telling you, that discomfort is going to cause you guys to persevere in life. Like when we just live comfortably 24-7, and that's what debt helps you do. I want it and I'm going to just live there.

1:04:07We actually don't gain any level of perseverance and grit. We just kind of sit in what feels right and then we get screwed financially. So let's be smart, Faith. When you guys can get this this young, I'm telling you, y 'all can be multimillionaires. When you start investing, you start living on less than you make. Like it is insane what you guys can do, especially when debt is not in the picture.

1:04:36You

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1:05:25Exclusions apply.

1:05:43welcome back to the ramsey show open phones at 888-825-5225 are you staying on track with the baby steps we've got a quick quiz to check your progress and get a personalized plan simply head to the show notes click on the link titled are you on track with the baby steps and complete the quiz. Drew is in Kansas City up next. What's going on, Drew? Hey, so I really want to get an electric bike, but I still live at home at 28 with my wife. Whoa, what happened? Nothing really. We just got married a couple of months ago. We were looking at getting a home prior to the marriage, but decided to hold off due to the interest rates.

1:06:26and my parents offered for us to stay with them to save some extra money. Okay. How much are you saving currently per month by living with them? Like what's actually going into a savings account? So$3 ,000 a month is going into the savings account and then I have other money being set aside into like an employee stock purchase program. Do you have any debt? No debt. Two cars paid off, 2020 Camry, 2009 Mazda 6. Good for you guys. What do you guys make a year? Combined a little bit over$100 ,000. Drew, why aren't y 'all renting somewhere? We just wanted to be able to buy a house and not pour more money.

1:07:08You'd rather live with your parents than not rent? The situation is not bad at all. Drew, can we just be honest? Y 'all are newlyweds. Nothing in me wants to be in a house with parents or in-laws for an extended period of time. Do we agree? Are there some codependency issues going on here, Drew? I don't believe so. No, we're just trying to save as much money as we can. Okay, I know, Drew. But do you, I mean, is there any part of the dignity in y 'all that are like, I just want to get up in the morning and make cereal and not open the refrigerator and look at the milk and there's my mom in the kitchen making eggs in a robe?

1:07:46Do you know what I'm saying? Y 'all are married. It's not ideal. How does your wife feel about this? She actually doesn't mind it. We have a great relationship with my family. Okay, but you can have a great relationship with your family and also not live with them after you get married. And you called about an electric bike, Drew. You have a vehicle. You've got to have fun while you're young. Okay. But you can't tell me you're doing all this because you really want to be a homeowner and then we're blowing money on toys. That's a valid point. How old are you two? 28. Okay, let's play this out. What would a one-bedroom cost in the area?

1:08:25$1 ,200. Okay, perfect. Drew, I just imagine you. I'm so sorry. Can we just be honest? Like, I love you guys. Like, if we were out having a beer, I think we would really get along. I just can't imagine Drew riding your electric bike pulling into your parents' driveway. Honey, I'm home. No, Mom, I'm home. I'm home from my electric bike ride around the neighborhood. Like, Drew, you're a man. You're a man. like you got this like you gotta like come on come on anything anything nothing all right okay i mean does it not kind of make you laugh we have does it kind of large of money saved up so go rent an apartment how much money do you guys have saved currently so right now we have about sixty thousand dollars drew what's the goal what is the number what's the number before you go all right mom i'm out uh the goal is just to move out at the beginning of next year so we're planning on saving three thousand a month until then um while we look at a house and then find that and move out okay what's the what's an electric bike cost these days uh it's four thousand dollars it's like a dirt bike but it's electric dude the motocross dreams need to go for now like we need we need to put$4 ,000 towards our deposit for an apartment.

1:09:43You can afford both, Drew. Like, buy the bike and move out. Like, you can do both. How about this? If you buy the bike, can we force you to move out tomorrow? I feel like that's a fair deal. Yes, that's fair. Congratulations. You're the owner of the bike. I think that's it, Drew. You can buy the bike, but you have to move out of your parents' house. And, I mean, please, I'm telling you. Real question, though. Does she fold the laundry? She does not fold the laundry. I do all the laundry. Proud of you. That's our boy. That's our boy. Drew, it's just good for y 'all. You just, y 'all need to spread your wings.

1:10:17You're leaving Cleve. Y 'all got to figure out how to pay the bills and get the water turned on in the new apartment. Like y 'all need to be self-sufficient. Yeah, jumping from living with mom to being a homeowner is just too big of a gap. It's going to be a rude awakening. Yeah. Well, and I guess I think I would feel a little bit better about it if y 'all were like, we're$300 ,000 in student loan debt and we're both lawyers and we're about to get our law. I don't know. Like if there was some like big reason, but there's not even that. It's just to quote unquote save money. And I think your dignity is more than that.

1:10:52I mean, genuinely, you and your wife together. I think you just learn a lot when you are not sharing a wall with your parents. It's true. Yes. And you'll still have lived alone before and with roommates. So it's not like it's our first time, you know, spreading our wings and flying. But well, it will be as a couple. It is as a couple. And you are going to now have to share a bathroom and you're going to have to like. Yeah. I mean, yeah, you guys are. It's a different situation than the dudes living in the rental house together. So, no, it's your wife. And yeah, y 'all will y 'all will run into things that you're not running into relationally when you are out on your own, which is a good thing.

1:11:31It's how it should be. It's how it should be. So, yeah, Drew, get the bike and apply for an apartment this afternoon. And fly away on that bike to your new apartment. Make sure they have e-bike parking at the new apartment. That's the big question. Where are you going to park that thing? If you've got to store it, this might be a nightmare. I don't know the visual. I just can't. There it is. Into the driveway. Right into the driveway. I'm home. Oh, man. I love this so much. That was a fun one. Y 'all are awesome, though. And you've been very smart financially. I will give y 'all that. Y 'all have a lot of money saved.

1:12:05You make six figures. You're debt free. Y 'all are very capable people. I think that's what's driving me crazy about it is you're so capable. If it slows you down six months to buy a house, I'm okay with that for the sake of your dignity. Yes. Yes. Yes. That's it. I know. All right. Nick is in Kansas City as well. Maybe Nick knows Drew. What's going on, Nick? They can ride bikes together. They're in cahoots. Not much. I do not know Drew. Okay. Sorry to say he sounds like a great guy. I'll connect you to him. So my question is, is my wife and I are recently called in to do some missions work. Cool.

1:12:38And we are in the waiting period between the call and going. Now, God hasn't given us a timeline as to when that call is, but some financial stuff has been brought to my mind as I'm kind of processing this call. So I've worked with one of your Ramsey pros as far as real estate goes. and I know the value of a new house to sell, but we also have some student loans and some other debt as well. My question is, should we sell the house knowing that we are leaving the country to be called omissions and live in a renter's market knowing full well that the rent we will pay is two to three times what we are paying for our mortgage right now, or do we continue to attack our debt aggressively as we have been doing for years and wait to pay off the rest of that debt when we sell the house and leave?

1:13:36I'm confused. If you're doing mission work, how much are you getting paid for that? So I am – here's the thing. If I am a disabled veteran as well, I'm sitting at 90 percent right now, which is around 2820, the country that we are called to. This is more than five times the median income for a family our size to be able to live in the country. Okay, great. So what you will make on disability, you guys can cover your costs living. Oh, yeah. Okay. That's great. I was just confused. You said we're still going to aggressively tackle our debt. I've just never heard of a missionary being able to do that.

1:14:15Well, before, they're not on the field now. So today, what should they do? Yeah, no, we're not on the field yet. And do you know timeline when you will? No, we don't. I would just stay in the home, Nick. Actually, you could sell the house to Drew because he's looking for a house. But no, I would stay in the house aggressively paying off your debt. And then when you guys are in a position to move and start the missions, I would put the house for sale. Do you guys have family in the area? We have my wife's parents. but the relationship's kind of strange. Okay, I was going to say, because if you guys go, you're going to have to sell this house kind of long distance.

1:14:50You'll just need a great realtor. And then when you sell the house, the equity of the house, you could pay off the remaining debt. But I would stay in the house, continue to aggressively pay off debt. Yeah, I would do that. I would just stay in the house, aggressively pay off debt. And then when you guys move, sell the house, even if it's kind of a long distance purchase, I would do that. I like that plan. I wouldn't hang on to it while living across the world long term.

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1:17:32So pre-order now for$24.99. and you'll get over$100 in free bonus items like the audiobook, early access to the e-book, an exclusive video from Jade on financial checkup, and a book-exclusive three-week online book club with a live Q &A with Jade. So pre-order today, ramsysolutions.com slash store. If you're watching on YouTube or listening on podcasts, you can click the link in the description of this episode. All right, Renee is in Miami up next. What's going on, Renee? Hey, thanks for taking my call. Sure. And we are struggling right now with deciding if my daughter is going to go to graduate school or not, and if the ROI on the fees and the cost of graduate school is going to benefit her.

1:18:16Very nice. What's she studying? She is studying business and entrepreneurship. She is a great student. She went to a very expensive four years of undergrad that was all covered with merit scholarships. Wow, good for her. Yeah. Great. She's doing amazing. Yeah, that's so awesome. So why the grad degree?

1:18:41She's really liking the classes. To be completely honest, she doesn't have anything lined up yet as far as work goes. So I think it's kind of weighing on her. And I know how early it is. I have another child that already went through all this. So it's very early. She shouldn't be worried. But I think this is kind of her secondary plan. And we're trying to, you know, we're just trying to weigh the benefits here. If this is what she, I think she really wants to go. She loves school. She loves. I'm sure she does. I'd rather go to school than enter the real world. Right. I mean, I'd rather kick the can down the road.

1:19:15Applying for jobs is a real buzzkill. That's right. I'd like to go back if I could. So who has the money to pay for grad school? So that will be on her. And how is she going to pay for it with no job? Is she scholars? I mean, she's smart, obviously. Is there any programs? Yep. She did get a merit scholarship for school, which was a surprise. We didn't know that was coming. That just happened this week. Good. I think it's going to be the one year. It's a 10-month program. She's already got a couple classes under her belt for it. So it's only going to be 10 months. Okay. They're looking at about$75 ,000 for the whole thing, for the whole year.

1:19:51She got 30 in scholarship. So I can probably help her with 10. we're probably looking at around$30 ,000. Who's we? As in student loan debt? Me and her. Her and I. Yeah, I'm student loan debt for the grad program. Oh, boy. She doesn't have any debt for anything undergrad or anything else in her life. For someone who loves business, this would be a terrible business plan if I walked into the bank. Hey, listen, I can't get a job in business after I went to school for four years. I need$30 ,000 to study more business. I think that's the problem. I know. I know. What if she just got a job and used – I'd rather her take$30 ,000 and go to Europe and experience culture than go to another year of grad school to hope that a job appears.

1:20:40I know. What is at the heart of her loving business and entrepreneurship? Does she want to start a business? Yes. She's in the process. So why not invest money into the business she wants to start? Yeah. I'd rather you take your$10 ,000 and put it into that. It's a$30 ,000 kick the can down the road for 10 months. And then what's going to happen, Renee? She's going to have to apply for jobs. I mean, that's a 10 month later. Again, I feel like, not that my answer wouldn't change on the student loan portion, but there's a part of me that's like, okay, a three-year thing, whatever. You get all these certificates.

1:21:13You get this one thing and it kind of narrows down a path and it gets you like, this is just 10 months. Like you can grow a baby and have a human in that amount of time. Do you know what I'm saying? Like it's not that long. It's very short. So the same problem and it's her that's going to follow her 10 months later. She's not changing. So to go$30 ,000 to basically be the same person and have the same problem. No, thank you. I'd rather come out financially on top and go and deal with the fear and the problem of not being able to find a job. Then go and have that fear and problem of not having a job and be$30 ,000 in debt.

1:21:50I know. So she's averaging it out in her mind that the undergrad was around three hundred and seventy five thousand worst. Holy crap. Well, then take that knowledge and go get a job. I'm sorry, but if you can't get a job after all that, then what's the point of anything? I know. What did she learn over four years? So it's a it's a common thing we see in this and that's you don't know what to do next. So you just go to school and then you make really bad financial decisions and it takes years, years to get out of this. And it's not worth it. That is not worth it because nothing is really going to change in 10 months.

1:22:28If she loves textbooks and homework, let's go ahead and buy her a textbook. But we don't need to go$30 ,000 in debt to do it. That's the truth. Seriously, Renee, it would not be smart. If she needs to talk to real entrepreneurs and they'll tell you, you don't need an entrepreneurship degree. You need tenacity. You need to have a good idea. You need to know how to serve people well to create something called revenue. And so she needs to sink her teeth into that. So if you want to honestly give your 10 grand to invest in her business idea and you become the bank and you're like, hey, I'm willing to invest in this idea because I believe in it.

1:23:00Or even help support her for a few months while she goes and interns somewhere. Right. And doesn't get paid. Help her there. And then six months later, it's like, OK, now she does have to apply. But now she at least has on her resume that actually real business leaders and people actually look at, which is experience, which looks better than a 10 month program. I mean, honestly, if they knew that she was working in a field in that business and being able to plug in like that to me. She's going to become what they call overqualified because they're going to go, listen, you have an MBA and you have no job experience.

1:23:34We can't hire you. That's my fear. And so I would rather her go do something, get some experience. Maybe she tries to start her own thing. Maybe she ends up being, you know, an executive at a company somewhere. I don't know. But I just know grad school is not the next step she needs to take. And again, if she had a full ride scholarship and that's what she chose to do, that's I mean, to me, that's a different story. It just makes no financial sense. No financial sense to go$30 ,000 in the hole to deal with the exact same problem she's going to deal with. And to your point at the very beginning of this call, Renee, which was so wise.

1:24:06You said it. She still has time. I know this is really early because it's not till May. I mean, yes. Right. By the time. Oh, my gosh. Is she living with you? Yeah. Well, no, she's been, you know, in another state for the last four years. She's an athlete, too, so she's got to be up there year round. Good for her. She sounds awesome. Yeah. Like, she really does. I just don't want this decision to put her back financially for three years, you know, is what it could be. too um so i think as your as her mom i think you're really wise and i think you can keep encouraging her to apply and what's causing it is it sounds like it's more running away from reality because of fear than oh i actually really love this one program and i can't you know i mean well i know she loves school so maybe she does love it but maybe she should work at a school she loves school so much and she could work at a job at a university yeah she could work at the school for a year and see what they'll pay her.

1:25:00Yeah, I don't know if that's what's driving her. I think it's a little bit of everything. She's just trying to figure it out. Yeah. Her brother's got his MBA, you know, so she's like, you know, there's a lot of other little factors there. She sounds competitive, too. But I do agree. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. She gets that from her mom.

1:25:18Probably. Well, you raised a great daughter. I'm glad you're calling in with this question. I hope you can convince her. Do you think she'll be convinced to avoid this? Well, because you're not signing anything, Renee, as her mom. Do not co-sign. If she does this on her own volition, we can't stop her. She's an adult. But I hope that you have influence over her life. Right. I do. And that's exactly it. We're right there on that balance beam. And, you know, I think she'd be fine without it. I really do. So I'm hoping we can, you know, we can just decide to start working, start working on something else.

1:25:54Work is scary. I think that's the smart thing. That's a tough one, especially in this job market. It's not a job market where you just leave college and everyone's knocking on your door to hire you. No, no, it takes a lot. And it's in a lot of who you know. Ken Coleman talks about this a lot. Proximity principle. Yes. Who you know, the connections. I mean, all of that is really big. Matters more than the piece of paper and where you went to school. And you can't just apply online and they just look at resumes. You usually have to get your foot in the door another way. So it does take some creativity for sure.

1:26:22But she sounds smart. I think she could do it. I hope we talked her off the ledge of grad school for the sake of grad school. If we did that, we did one good deed for the day today, Rachel. Thank you. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books.

1:26:56Hey guys, it's Rachel Cruz, and I've got great news for you. The Ramsey Christmas Cash Giveaway is here. We are giving away$500 every week, plus a grand prize of$5 ,000 in cash. Listen, you can enter daily to boost your chances of winning, and there's no purchase necessary. Just go to RamseySolutions.com slash giveaway. That's RamseySolutions.com slash giveaway. Good luck, you guys.

1:27:34welcome back to the ramsey show in the fairwinds credit union studio i'm george camel joined by best-selling author rachel cruz open phones at 888-825-5225 ashley is in idaho up next what's going on ashley hi thank you for taking my call absolutely how can we help I have a question. I have a daughter that just turned 21, and she has a horse, and we, her parents, pay the$400 a month in boarding. Tell me more. George and horses are not a good. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, keep going, Ashley. I'm just preparing your heart. This is her life. She's been riding horses since she's been six years old. and we pay for her insurance her gas for her car everything and we're kind of wondering not to be so mean and tell her hey you need to kind of start contributing now the backstory about this is we don't want to be too hard on her because a couple years ago she went through depression pardon me i'm gonna start crying um start cutting self-cutting self-harming oh my was very very depressed um yeah so you want to be sensitive that makes sense literally literally yeah literally had a plan for suicide so this horse i'm so sorry did she get some help the yeah she's she's in therapy now she hasn't cut in probably two years it was one of those when she was like 15 through 16 just trying to find out who she was and confused and so we we kind almost walk on eggshells.

1:29:15Yeah, as I say, you have PTSD around it. I mean, you know, as a parent, you're just like, I don't want to do anything. Right. Exactly. Yeah. So we can't afford paying for her horse every month, but just telling my husband, she's got a second job. She's going to be making a lot. Did she go to school? What happened after high school for her? um she does not go to college she basically it helps give lessons at the barn with the main main trainer how much does she make we never she doesn't make a lot um i don't know a couple hundred dollars a month and she just got a job um a second job okay and now she should be bringing home close to a thousand a month do we really feel like she should yeah for some well i mean Well, I'm trying to think of like five years from now, are we still doing this?

1:30:06Is she still making$1 ,000 a month at 25 years old living with mom and dad? Because otherwise we need a totally different plan. Well, we just need a trajectory and it can be baby steps, Ashley, because I totally get your caution around it because of your history and what you guys walk through as a family. Like that's horrible. It's every parent's worst nightmare, right, of something like that happening. So I can totally understand that. But I also think it's two different things. I think helping her become an adult is not being mean. I think it's actually the most loving thing you can do because it actually is going to give her self-confidence.

1:30:45It's going to give her some dignity. It's going to give her a reason to wake up in the morning and be productive. And these things are good for all of us, right? We were created to work and to make and to be part of society. And so how that looks and how that plays out over time, we can talk about. But that in general, that principle, that's not harmful to her. If anything, that's actually a gift. And again, if you do it in the right way, we want to be cautious in the sense of how you handle it with her. And I totally understand that. But that avenue is the best thing for her in general as an adult.

1:31:24So just hear that. That's a loving thing. That's not a mean thing. How do you approach going about it, considering you feel like she's been spoiled her whole life? I would start with you guys. Don't make it about her. Say, hey, we really love you. And part of that love has caused maybe some enabling. We've covered your expenses. We wanted to give you a great life. But part of becoming independent means you need to learn how to handle money and contribute on your own. And we're not going to throw you in the deep end. We're not going to say you need to pay all these expenses tomorrow, but you need to start taking on more responsibility so that you're not 30 years old, still not not unsure how to live as an adult, because that's unfair to her.

1:32:05Yeah, I like that approach, Ashley. I mean, honestly, taking accountability for your actions, because as the parents, y 'all chose this. You know what I mean? Like, this is what you guys implemented. And so I think on that end, talking to her of, hey, I'm sorry that we have failed you, in a sense, of how to set up your life as an adult. And again, she's 21. So I think there's a lot of grace here. She's not 31, right? If we're talking, I mean, like, you guys have not screwed up as parents by any means. but I think it is a hey we want in the next season maybe over the next six months we want to start working with you on finding some more income finding a schedule that that you know is sufficient as an adult you know and a whatever it looks like um and then the money you're bringing in we want to write down a budget and have some things that you're going to start contributing and again that can be slowly over time every two months or something you know you add something else in or whatever that looks like.

1:33:04And then eventually a plan, Ashley, and again, I'm not in a rush with this. I don't know, George may be more urgent than I am. You know, but where you guys feel comfortable as a family to say, okay, and our goal is by next July, you rented apartments. And we will be with you, you know, every step of the way in these transitions. But starting to make a year plan, I think is really great from November to November. What does that look like? Yeah. She has a 17-year-old brother, and now he's a little bit more of a small woman than her. But, for instance, he wanted this winter baseball thing, and it was 150.

1:33:42And I feel we have to give it to him because, look, we're giving your sister 400 a month for her horse. So, yeah, we have to say yes to you now for certain things, too. I wouldn't do the tip-for-tat thing, but I think brother is 17, So he needs a student checking account with a debit card. And you guys can put a certain amount of money in that account. And he needs to start budgeting his life. And that he needs to start. He does. Okay, perfect. That's great. That's a great start. Does he have a part-time job? Yeah. Yes, he does. He's very hard. They're both very, very hard workers. It sounds like.

1:34:18I think we just need to. Yeah, I would just kind of up a little bit of the pressure of, okay, let's find two things that you're going to start paying for. because we want her to start experiencing real life. And it can still be under your roof for a period of time, which, again, is a soft place to land, which is great. But when she starts to learn these things, then when she goes out on her own, it's part of who she is. She knows how to do it, right? That's equipping her really well. How does the horse situation work? If you guys stop making these payments, what happens? Are you leasing the horse from someone else?

1:34:54No, she bought it. She actually watched Mama give birth to her, the people at the barn, her family. That's a bonding experience right there. Yeah, like eight years. Okay, so the expenses for the horse just to keep the horse in good shape is$400. Well, it's at the barn, and all her friends are at the barn, and that's boarding. Boarding, feed. I mean, she works there, too. They should give her a discount. It's her life. They should give her a discount. Is that a discount? But her life can't be that forever, Ashley. You know what I'm saying? At some point, she's going to have to say, wow, that makes me really sad.

1:35:26I can't be where all my friends are. I'm going to have to go get a job. Right? Eventually, that's what's going to— She just got another job. She needs a full-time job that can support all of the expenses in her life. That's where we need to get to within a year. That's the goal. Otherwise, she needs to go to school and pursue something that can actually pay the bills. So that's the hard truth that you're going to have to unravel with her over the next several months. but this idea that we're just going to work part-time at the barn, not making enough to even cover the expenses for our horse is not a winning plan.

1:35:58There's only two types of horse people, broke horse people and super wealthy people, and she's about to be a broke horse person for the rest of her life if we don't change this ASAP.

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1:37:13All right, let's get to our question of the day. It's brought to you by Why Refi. If your private student loans are in default, it can feel like the end of the road. But Why Refi helps you find a way forward with a low fixed rate payment plan that fits your life. Go to whyrefi.com slash Ramsey. To learn more, that's the letter Y, R-E-F-Y dot com slash Ramsey. Not available in all states. Today's question comes from Ethan in Ohio. I'm in my mid-20s and recently became engaged. My fiance has over$100 ,000 in student loan debt. And since we have lived together for the past year, most of our expenses are joint.

1:37:44My salary is roughly$100 ,000 while hers is$80 ,000. I have no debt. So this$100 ,000 debt is the biggest obstacle to building long-term wealth. I also roughly have$100 ,000 in non-retirement investments. Should I set aside a percentage of my income to pay off her loans or is it a better option to sell those investments and pay them off? Ooh. Good question. Here's the thing. He's going to be upset. debt, paying like selling off his investments to pay off her debt. That's going to sting a little bit because he worked really hard to invest all this money and have it grow. And now it's just wiped away.

1:38:21But that's what I would do. If you're combining all, if you just clear the deck and go, okay, now we make$180 ,000. We have$100 ,000 in debt. And then what do we have on the plus side? Well, we have$100 ,000 in investments we could sell. That's right. I mean, at that point, your when you get married your net worth is combined you know and it's like okay well as a household now we are a negative plus 100 minus 100 you're at zero right so what do we yep so what's the what's the best way to uh go about that and it is to pay off the debt but like you said it stings you know we talk about couples that you become one when you get married and her issues are your issues and your issues are her issues that's financial and otherwise um but it doesn't come without emotion and it hurting a little bit, but that means that you guys together make$180 ,000 so you can build it back so fast, you know?

1:39:13So that's the good news. You can get back there so quickly. You have a dual income. You're really young and you've got time on your side. Compound growth will do its thing. And one day you'll be multi, multi-millionaires looking back at that going, oh yeah, I remember that day. I remember that day. We did it. I don't think you'll regret paying off the student loan debt. Now you could try to attack it and keep your investments, but you're just, that's going to be a different sacrifice on this side. So you just got to choose your heart in this case. And I personally, if you got non-retirement assets, I would just sell it.

1:39:42You'll have some capital gains potentially. Make sure you account for that, but then knock out the debt ASAP. Thanks for the question, Ethan. All right, let's get to Jordan in Pittsburgh on the line. Jordan, what's going on? Hey guys, honored to speak with you today. I can dive right in. At the beginning of this year, my wife and I were transferred an energy stock, about 200 shares. It's valued between$16 ,000 and$18 ,000, depending on what month you look at it, and wondering how I can best use it to progress through the baby steps. Awesome. What baby step are you guys on? We are over the halfway point of baby step two.

1:40:19We've been really going at it this year. So we have about$40 ,000 in student loan debt left. Good for you guys. That's great. Yeah. Do you know how much you'll owe if you sell the stock? I want to say I would need to set around$2 ,000 a side to cover the taxes. Perfect. So you got about 14 that you could net from this to throw your debt. What's left on the debt? See, that's glass half empty. You said between 16 and 18. I put 18. That's Mrs. Optimism. Okay, but you'll have$14 ,000 to$16 ,000 left to throw out the debt. And what's left on the balance? on the balance of the debt? Yeah. $40 ,000? Yeah, we owe about$40 ,000 left in student loans.

1:41:03How much do you guys make a year? Our household gross is about$148 ,000. Oh, awesome. Fantastic. Okay, great. So this debt's going to be gone fast no matter what. The selling of the stock just kind of helps expedite that. That's kind of how I'm looking at it. Maybe I can use this to progress faster through one of the next baby steps, whether it's two or three. You know, just trying to find the best way because it is an energy stock. So I've kind of seen it, you know, go up and go down. And I know there's always that risk with the stock, but I just wanted to get a second opinion on, you know, is it worth hanging on to for another few months and then waiting till we only have that$14 ,000 to$16 ,000 left to pay off in our debt?

1:41:43Or is it best to just use that and set it aside as our down payment for a house or our emergency fund considering its value? I would still do exactly what we said. and I'd sell it today because we just don't know what the future holds. And you're going to be heartbroken if the stock suddenly takes a dip and you go, oh my gosh, now it's only 10 ,000. What do we do now? Do we keep waiting? Do we keep waiting? Do we try to time the market? So I don't do single stocks for that reason. I just already have too much anxiety about other things in life. So I stick to mutual funds and index funds, giant groups of stocks.

1:42:15And likely that energy stock, if it's any good, is probably somewhere in the mix. It's just not all your eggs in one basket. Yeah. How much extra a month, Jordan, do you guys have going towards paying off debt? We set aside in total about$3 ,000 a month and put that toward debt. I think our minimum payments right now add up to about$500. Honestly, I hardly pay attention to the minimum payments anymore. I just throw whatever I can at it. But yeah, about a little over a third of our take home goes toward our debt. That's great. Yeah. It'd be about eight more months if you guys just through all of this at the debt, which is, I mean, gosh, that's what, June by summer?

1:42:54Debt-free by summer. And then keep that momentum of that$3 ,000 going into an emergency fund. And by this time next year, you guys could be on to baby step four and start back investing, which is really exciting. So to George's point, yeah. That would be fantastic. Yeah, the single stock, regardless, even if you didn't have debt, you're like, I have the single stock, we'd probably say, go ahead and cash it out and move it into an index fund anyways. So I would get rid of it regardless of your situation. But it's even better that when you get rid of it, you can actually apply it to your life today and get you guys jump-started, which will probably be a breath of fresh air because you guys have been grinding to get out of debt.

1:43:29So it kind of feels nice to get a big jump-start. Just skip a few levels. Yeah. How many debts would you knock out if you threw$14 ,000 at it? $14 ,000. So the student loan debt, we actually just paid off my wife's student loan debt last week, which was awesome. So it's just my student loan debt. Half of it is federal and half of it is private. And the 14 to 16 would likely knock out the rest of my private student loan. So we would be down to just my federal. Oh, that's awesome. And then it frees up some payments to apply to the next ones. And so you really get that debt snowball rolling with that, which I love.

1:44:01That's great. Okay, let's get to Sarah in Denver. What's going on, Sarah? Hi there. My main question is, so I owe about$15 ,000 on my car loan currently. And my husband and I, we've been padding our emergency fund. So we have about$16 ,000 in our emergency fund right now. We actually just found out that we are now expecting. That was just last night. Oh my gosh. Last night. Well, early congratulations, Sarah. Are we the first to know? Thank you. You guys are the second to know. Oh, I knew we were probably high up on the list. That's a win. Thanks. Thanks for letting us in there. Yeah, absolutely.

1:44:46Okay, so you have the money saved to pay off the car, but you guys just find out you're pregnant, and so I'm assuming you're probably a little nervous to do that. I'm super nervous. I'm actually really terrified to, you know, just throw it at that debt. My vehicle is not the only one that we have. My husband currently has a truck also. So we're paying his down as well. I think he owes about$25 on it. But we're throwing all that we can at the debt right now. I'm just wondering, do I use my emergency savings or do I just continue making the minimum payments and then just throw whatever extra I can?

1:45:24How much do you guys make a year? Combined, we make about$120. $120, okay. What's the payment on your car? uh 382 okay so you'll free up about 400 bucks which is you know that's five grand right there if you just pay it off a year from now you'll have five grand in that account and you make 120 so the question is could you guys pay off both cars and have a fully funded emergency fund by the time baby's here um i mean i think so um as of right now it is um our duty is expected in july okay i'd start crunching some numbers if you want to pause we call it stork mode where you kind of pause the baby steps to stack up cash if you don't have any.

1:46:05But you guys have the cash. But if you have the cash already, now we're just going to attack the debt, then you're kind of already there. So I would also look at your health insurance, look at your out-of-pocket max, your deductibles, get a full picture of what it would really cost if you had to go all in on the medical stuff. And that'll give you a little bit of peace in the chaos. But congratulations. Thank you. I appreciate it. Yeah, we're rooting for you guys. And maybe he sells the truck. If you want to expedite this, you've got a baby on the way, Let's speed things up. Life is happening.

1:46:33I think we can get another truck later on.

1:46:58Hey, you guys. Rachel Cruz here. Look, I know you want to do better with money, but let's be honest. Life seems to be getting more and more expensive. And lately, you hardly have any breathing room in your budget to do anything but cover the basics. You work way too hard to feel broke. Our EveryDollar Budget app can help you free up margin fast. Most people find an average of$3 ,015 in their first 15 minutes of using the app. Think about it. That's thousands of dollars just sitting right there in your budget waiting for a job to do. With EveryDollar, you'll find the margin and the motivation you need to start making real progress fast with your money.

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1:48:02Everyone needs insurance, but it can be hard trying to find pros who aren't just looking to make a buck and agents who know their stuff. With a Ramsey Trusted Insurance Pro, you'll never have to deal with sleazy businesses or slimy salespeople because they're all interviewed, vetted, and coached to make sure they're market experts who have your best interests at heart. So go to ramsysolutions.com slash coverage to find the type of insurance you're looking for and connect with a Ramsey-trusted agent or click the link in the description if you're on YouTube or podcast. James is in Manchester, New Hampshire up next.

1:48:32What's going on, James? I've been taking my call. Sure. How can Rachel and I help? So I'm 19 years old. I currently make about$150 ,000 a year. I have$60 ,000 saves,$20 ,000 of which is invested into retirement accounts. But my question today is that I'm interested in buying a house or a multifamily unit next year. But I'm honestly not sure if that's what's recommended to me since I'm so young. I see on other Dave Ramsey videos, it's 50-50 split between whether they're okay with younger people. What do you do for work to make$150 ,000 at 19? So this is, honestly, you have to believe it, but I'm a casino dealer.

1:49:14So I deal high-stakes blackjack and high-stakes poker games for a living. You play them? I keep all my tips. Oh, you're a dealer. In Manchester, New Hampshire? Yes. Okay. Well done. I was unaware that there was a big casino ring over in New Hampshire. All right. How stable is this? Like, is this what you want to do long term? So that's one thing. It's stable in that I'm basically guaranteed$100 ,000 all the year. So my income, like month to month, varies quite a bit. But for the most part, yeah, this is what I want to do for a career. For the most part. Okay, so you see yourself, you're 35 years old, you're dealing at a casino.

1:50:02Well, hopefully I'll be financially well off enough to be doing what I want by time I'm 35. That's my question, is what is the thing you want? Because I want to make sure that this money shouldn't be used to fund education or an investment in a business. before we just lock it up in a home just because you feel like a home is the next step? Honestly, I am very passionate in it, and I really haven't ever thought about going to school, thanks in particular. There's nothing wrong with renting. There's nothing that says in this situation where I'm going, wow, you really should get a house. You're 19 and you got money.

1:50:38I would just pause and get a house when it makes sense for you because you're renting right now on your own or what, or living at home? I'm blessed enough to be living at home still. Okay, so you got no expenses. There's nothing wrong with just stacking cash, live at home for now. And then once you're kind of out of this phase where you kind of know that you know, and you're 21 maybe, then we go, okay, I'm going to go rent on my own. I've got$300 ,000 saved up. You think making$150 ,000 a year, he should still stay at home? You could go rent tomorrow. You could rent yesterday. You make more than most adults in the U.S.

1:51:11You probably make more than your family does. Yes. Are they like, dude, pay rent? You make way too much? Yeah, I'd pay them$1 ,000 a month in rent. Oh. Well, then just go pay$1 ,000 and go rent somewhere. Yeah, I almost would go move out, James, just from what you're making and what you're paying in rent. You sound like a very mature dude who knows his stuff and very entrepreneurial. Yeah, so what I would say, James, is I would not be in a rush to buy a home. I think you've done an incredible job saving, and I would continue to do that. and maybe just wait two, three years. I don't know. I'm kind of making up that timeline just to kind of see from a career standpoint where you want to be.

1:51:54And if it still looks like, okay, in the near future, this is probably where I'm going to be is this area, then I probably would buy. But I just don't want something coming up in the next one, two, three years that for some reason you cannot take an opportunity because you've just bought this home, if that makes sense. Okay. And I wouldn't just get a duplex and house hack because, you know, TikTok said it's a cool thing to do. So I just don't want you jumping on it just because it sounds good. I want you to do it because it's the right move for your future. Okay, thank you. That's why I called you guys.

1:52:28Absolutely, man. Happy to help. Yeah, well done, James. Yeah, I'm impressed. Yeah, a lot of people go, I can do the duplex. But he doesn't need it. He makes great money. Yeah. It's not worth the$700 a month from a renter. Right. To have them next door. So I would just live your life and figure out what that next thing is. All right. Thomas is in Seattle up next. What's going on, Thomas? Hey, guys. I am recently married, and my wife and I are trying to combine our finances. And I just found out she has a condo with a tenant, and the tenant isn't currently covering all the costs of the condo. And so I want to approach a conversation with her about potentially getting out of this condo just because it's not a great situation for us.

1:53:09But I'm concerned because obviously we're newlyweds. I don't want to feel like I'm overstepping or anything like that. How did you just find out that she has a condo? Well, I didn't just find out. I knew she had the condo, but I didn't know the exact numbers of everything, so I'm just finding those numbers. You didn't know it was like a dumpster fire that she's losing money on, but you knew before you got married, hey, she has this property over here. Yeah, yeah. Okay, so what's the math ending up being, Thomas? Like what is she charging for rent, and then how much is she having to pay? Yeah, so she's charging$1 ,291 a month for rent, and she's short about$312.

1:53:43And that's roughly, well, not$312, it's roughly$200, but that's primarily HOA fee she's paying out of pocket. And what's the market rate for that condo? Is she undercharging on purpose? No. Well, yes, she is undercharging on purpose. Okay. And how much is the mortgage payment a month on this? The mortgage payment is$1 ,171 a month. Okay. Yeah. So she's barely. She's not breaking. And that's without maintenance, repairs, vacancy, taking all that into consideration. So why is she undercharging again? Why did you say she is? The tenant who is renting from her, she said she's in a tough situation, so she doesn't want to increase the rent.

1:54:32Okay, but this person can't afford to live there, so they need to be evicted if they can't pay rent. They need to go find somewhere they can afford to live. Right, and that's sort of why I want to approach the conversation of selling the condo. If she's into charity, let her give to a charity, but this is not the way to do it. And I would be okay with it, Thomas, for like a period of time, but usually these situations are ongoing, and then she's going to look up in three years and is not able to up the rent because this person that she is being generous to now is staying and she's like oh gosh and now if I up the rent in three years how much more they're for sure gonna have to move out like at some point this person's not gonna be able to afford to live there is what I'm assuming right yeah so it's kind of like it's gonna think about it yeah it's gonna happen today or it's gonna happen in a few years when your wife looks up and she's like oh my gosh I can't even yeah I mean it doesn't make mathematical sense um so So she either needs to have a conversation with the tenant, which is probably gonna be hard to do.

1:55:32And she may not want to do that. But even I would possibly sell. Do you guys have a lot of consumer debt? We do. Yeah. Yeah, we do. Okay. How much would the condo, how much does she owe on it and how much could she sell it for? I don't exactly know what she owes on it, but she bought it three years ago for$195 ,000. And I looked on Zillow today, and it looks like it's roughly worth$177 ,000. So I think she's underwater on it. Oh, boy. Does she have any equity in it? I can't. I wouldn't imagine a lot. Yeah. Okay. I would find out the balance. I mean, you guys are married. I would run through all these numbers and go, hey, based on what we're looking for for a financial future, which is to become debt-free and have our own financial stability, it would be wise to sell this condo.

1:56:24because right now you're losing money on it so even if you sold it and broke even it would still be a net win for you guys yeah but yeah so i i probably wouldn't have a second property if you guys have a lot of consumer debt anyways but on top of that she's she's not charging enough to make it make sense and it's not even like she's you know it's like there there's a there's a formula out there where it makes sense right if she's charging market rate and she's making a little bit on the side i'd probably still sell it but all that say that would at least make financial sense. This makes double no financial sense.

1:56:56And even if she breaks even, she's still losing money when you factor in all the maintenance and repairs and vacancies. So we need to get out of this. And you have some influence now being the husband to go, hey, this does not make sense. It's moving us backwards financially. We're trying to move forwards. And this is one step of - Yeah. And it could be a kind conversation. I mean, you guys can go into it and just be curious, ask her some questions, tell her what you've found. and be like, hey, you know, this is kind of what I'm seeing. Like, help me make sense of what you're thinking. And we just want to be on the same page financially.

1:57:27Like, that's the main goal. But I think, yeah, you can be kind. George would probably be like, here's the numbers. We're selling it tomorrow. We're selling it tomorrow. I'm calling an agent.

1:57:49Thank you.

1:58:07Our scripture of the day, Jeremiah 29, 13. You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart. Abraham Lincoln said, you have to do your own growing no matter how tall your grandfather was. Ain't that the truth? There you go. Wish I could keep growing. Be nice. Lynn is in Eugene, Oregon up next. What's going on, Lynn? Hi. I'm 75. I quit my job to take care of my mother who had dementia the last seven years. Oh, wow. And yeah, it was, I'm glad that I did it. But I find that, and I did get an inheritance when I was caring for her. She had money invested and it was bringing in$1 ,200 a month.

1:58:53And then we had her Social Security and then my Social Security of$1 ,055. And so now that she's passed, I have inherited half of what was invested, which is$1 ,000—sorry,$105 ,000. I've never invested before. I'm very frugal. I began tithing when I read the Bible and became a believer 47 years ago. And I'm a weirdo, I suppose, as far as I've counted on God for things, and there have been miraculous provisions like an inheritance that paid off my house a year before my husband left me and my seven kids. So I kind of, and I've always worked. I've never depended on others. And I mean, there have been gifts of love occasionally through the years.

1:59:36But my point is this. It's hard for me to ask for, like, wisdom. I mean, I'm asking for wisdom. I need it because I've never invested. To me, it's always looked like gambling. But I recognize that the income actually that was important as I was caring for mom was coming from her investment. And so that was certainly a good indicator to me that it does work and your money doesn't get gambled away. It was because that's what it's always felt like when I look at it. Feels risky to you. Yeah. Yeah, very. And being I am 75 and I didn't I became rather sedentary caring for my mother. And so I'm not in the best shape right now.

2:00:19I don't really want to go back into the workforce again if it's possible. I understand it may have to happen. So my question is, do you have any recommendation as to what you would think would be best for my present situation as far as to bring in some income from my inheritance? Or should I just, I mean, I figured out I need past my income. I laid out all my expenses. Yeah, what are your monthly expenses? My monthly expenses are$2 ,417 a month, including tithe. I'm very blessed to pay a very low rent of$1 ,045 a month, and then I have storage. And just regular, paying for my Wi-Fi, paying for my car insurance.

2:01:05Okay, so$2 ,500 a month covers you comfortably. It does. And you have$1 ,055 coming from Social Security. Yes. And no other money, no other assets other than$100 ,000 from this inheritance. Right. Well, I actually, I have, I have, I saved myself$16 ,000, but I had used, anyway. Is that your savings essentially, your emergency fund? Yeah. $16 ,000? Okay. So we won't touch that. We're not going to count that on the income side. We need to protect that. So you're really asking, I make$12 ,000 a year. I need to make, you know, you need an extra$1 ,500. And so can we squeeze$1 ,500 a month out of$100 ,000?

2:01:45Not for a long time. I mean, how old was your mother? She was 93. So let's assume you go to 93 at the very least, right? Yeah. We'll give you 95. We'll go 20, 20 years. Rachel's very generous. So 95, we need to make 100 grand work for 20 years. Right. The math on that is tough. Yeah, it is. Even invested aggressively, I don't know that you could make that last without running out of money. so I do think it would be wise to find work that you can do as long as your body allows you to do it and make as much as you can. Right, yeah. I think I'm gearing up for that, for sure. What would you do, Lynn, in a perfect world?

2:02:27What sounds like giving to you? Well, I wrote one book. It was of my first 50 years of life, raising 10 children, becoming a believer through reading the Bible when I was 28, all the supernatural things God did. My husband leaving us was after 27 years of marriage. And it was well received by the people who read it, but it's not gotten much reading. But writing is my love. And I still have another 25 years. I'd love to write more about how he has done so many awesome, God has done so many awesome things through being in youth with a mission with my five youngest. and I just wonder with that gift of writing, and you may have to be a little flexible on topic or whatnot, but the ideal world for me, for you, would be to do something that you love, that you're good at, that you're passionate about, and you can make some money.

2:03:20And the good thing is, Lynn, you don't have to be making a ton, right? I'm like, even if you're making, golly, two grand a month, you'll be fine. But to George's point earlier, the more you make, even if it's above what you need, can be put away with that$100 ,000. So that in 10 years or in five years, you are able then to slow back and live off those investments, right? Right now, the goal is to not touch that$100 ,000. That feels like your worst case scenario because truthfully, you could probably live off that for six years and then it's gone. That's what I figured already. Even if it's invested, yeah, you could make a little more, but it's$100 ,000.

2:04:03It's not a million. So even invested, if you're making 10 % instead of 4%, it's$4 ,000 versus$10 ,000. It's still not enough to cover our bills forever. And so you're going to need to get support elsewhere from working, maybe even from the kids. You have 10 kids. Do you have a relationship with them? Would they be willing to group? All of them, yeah. Like group? Everyone put in$100 and let's help mom? That I don't know. I don't know. Most of them are homeowners. Some have rentals, but they have to ask rent higher than I can pay. They had hoped maybe to be able to help that way. But I've never asked them before.

2:04:37Actually, one has already given me their gas card after my mom died and said, please use this. We want you to let us pay for your gas from now on. That's sweet. Very, very kind. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. So I think, Glenn, yeah, I do think work is in your future. and again finding something that you can do ideally again towards the fact that you're 75 I would love for you to be at a job that you love and enjoy it doesn't have to be something miserable but we do need to be making some income and the more income you can find even though you're so humble and so grateful I can hear it in your voice you may feel like I don't need that much but just remember if you're making extra that's money being put away so that you don't have to work, hopefully, for the rest of your life, right, that you can be living off some of these investments too.

2:05:29So I think that's the goal. It might be worth getting a third opinion from a financial advisor, Lynn. So if you want to jump onto RamseySolutions.com and click on SmartVestor Pro, they can just crunch the numbers for you and go, hey, if you did this, here's how much money you could make with this investment. If you put it over here, here's potentially how much you could make in the market if you put it over here. and at least they can run that to show you you got the best shot if you do xyz to let this money last as long as possible but they're probably going to also go income is going to be a big factor here if we can get to work for a little bit to at least cushion that yes but that's tough and i think it's a you know it's a good point that she made that a lot of people we've taken a few calls i feel like today about this of the caution around investing um so whether it's people are nervous.

2:06:19And it's usually the older people we talk to, the more cautious they get, which makes sense because you're like, okay, I have this money. I don't want to lose this money. It feels overwhelming. Yes. So just remembering you guys to focus on the facts when it comes to money is so important, especially that side of looking at what really has happened when you put money in the market. And that's what you have to bank on, right? You have to focus on the facts, not this idea of what could happen one day. Could Jesus come back? That was... Oh yeah, I took that call. That was a wild one. And a good reminder that Social Security is not going to be enough.

2:06:52It was never meant to be enough. It was meant to cover a portion of your salary. But in this situation, as we can see, a thousand bucks, it's a nice start, but it's not going to cover all the bills. And so do not rely on Social Security as your income in retirement. You've got to stack up your own nest egg. And that's through investments in the stock market, through mutual funds and index funds. And if anybody listening wants a guide on how to do it the Ramsey way, in a wise way, without falling on your face, you can go to RamseySolutions.com slash guide. We've got a free investing guide that walks you through all of this.

2:07:23And it's a great resource, regardless of your age, to learn. Because we tell you, don't invest in anything you don't understand. But it's still your job to learn it and understand it. So go check that out as well. That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show in the books. Until next time, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.