There Are No Shortcuts To Building Wealth

26:20So it can't all fall on you. It can't all fall on her. But together, you guys are in this and understanding what's our main priority. Why are we building what we're building? why are we doing the things we're doing because it can't just be for um uh the exterior right that's right the house and the cars and all those things uh-huh yeah the two things I would say from like beyond just the nuts and bolts of the math side of what got you guys there which I think you know um but two things we run into a lot and I and I commend you first of all I applaud you for even asking the deeper questions because a lot of people will just kind of get through it and not really think through what got me here in the first place and what's going on within me because we're the ones handling the money.

27:01It's the people, right? It's not the math and all of that. Like we're the ones making the decisions. And so understanding ourselves is really important. And so I would say isolations is negative. No more isolation. It's kind of what Jade just said. And I think you isolated yourself from your wife and from the reality of what was going on. And you were just trying to do it yourself, which again, I commend you for doing it. There's a lot of wives listening right now, they're like, I wish my husband would step up. But it was too extreme that way. You know, like you can't be isolated in it. And for your sake, Louis, but also for the relational.

27:33There's so much to be said when a husband and wife work together as a team with their money that does far and far and above more than just the finances. So there's just something really big relationally that you miss. And you do it to protect her. I hear you. But it almost can end up not even just hurting, but it can continue to put a wedge a little bit because you feel like you have to hold a certain level of truth with her to protect her. But yet she's a grown woman, Lewis. She's a grown up. And so she has to be able to handle the reality of her situation too. And you may feel the brunt of it because she gave you a lot of the responsibility, but she doesn't need to do that either.

28:11She needs to say, Lewis, I'm so sorry that I put all of this on you. I have a functioning brain. I'm an adult and I can handle it. I'm going to have my strengths and weaknesses just like you do. But together as a team, we're going to sit down together as a married couple and lock arms and be a team. And then the second thing I would say, Lewis, I'm going very stereotypical here. So forgive me if I'm totally off base, but I'm going to put the dudes more in this category that I'm about to talk about. And then I even see West Palm Beach. I see, you know, I see Florida and I see where you're going.

28:40Yeah. And, and the ego hates going backwards. Oh man. Yes. And so when you feel like I have to sell a car, a nice car, in that lifestyle, yes. Hello. And then downgrade a house. Yes. The ego is shot to the extreme. And again, stereotypically, I think guys feel this a little bit more. Like I think there's something about saving face, like what you're saying. Um, so those are the two things I would watch Lewis next time from an internal perspective. Am I isolating myself and is my ego in charge or am I in charge? Yeah. Yeah. What do you think? I think you guys are great. Well, thanks. Definitely for sure.

29:19And I think there's something to ponder and kind of sit on there on the side of the wife. I think it was one of those things when rock bottom head, I said, okay, cool. I think I can manage this and I don't need to put her through. But you're right. Maybe it would have been better to go through it together. So there's a lot to chew on there. And there is something to be said for, I mean, selling a house is a huge deal. And if you felt like, hey, I'm going to ride this out for X amount of months. And if I'm not here, if I get to that stopping point and it's not any better, then I got to let go of the house.

29:50Right. But if you made it there, then it's great. You got to keep the house. So I don't know. Did you do that? So just to give slightly more context, again, I hate to take up too much time with other callers needing help as well. It was, you know, when I was younger, I moved 30 times. We were super unstable, you know, as a family when I was younger. So I just said, hey, it was absolutely no ego. I just didn't want my family to ever have to feel unstable. I hear that. Yeah, that's fair. That's totally fair. And it wasn't about the car or whatever. Like, you know, yeah, I was dumped by a car, but, you know, for whatever reasons, it was just about having stability, especially for a young child and not having her love this home and make friends and a school and everything.

30:27Sure. Sure. And go on out somewhere. So that was. Listen, Louis, I think at the end of the day, you went through something and it was a learning experience for you. And that is part of most of our stories. Yes. And I'll say this. Dave says this a lot for himself because you sound very entrepreneurial. I mean, you're a very smart guy. I mean, he's growing businesses and doing all this stuff, but you can't out earn your stupidity. Dad says that a lot. And I think that could be another thing to think through because you kind of out earned it. You probably worked your tail off to get these businesses revenue to be able to cover up some of the mistakes.

31:02Yes, that's right. which in one way is fantastic because you know how to work and yes and you can bring in revenue and all of it but you can't out earn it and so that's a little bit of the band-aid over the situation is that you earn so much that you could get out of it which again one side of the coin that's fantastic but we got to deal we got to deal with the root issues of how we got there in the first place from the nuts and bolts and then from just the perspective of who we are as people and like checking ourselves because we can hold ourselves back a lot and make really stupid decisions.

31:34Yeah. Based on what feels good and what we want in the moment. And we all do it. We've all made those mistakes, but kind of tempering that side of it too. I agree. And I do think that when you've hit a certain layer in your income, which it sounds like Lewis has making those sacrifices, it does hit different. I'd almost rather someone call in who's, you know, not hit that point yet, it's almost easier for that person to go, okay, yeah, I'm just going to take to the streets and work hard and sell my stuff than the person who's kind of been living that life. Then yeah, you're right. Your ego does take a hit and that is tough, but it's good for you.

32:06It's good, good medicine for the soul.

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33:54It's going to help you find that money. So you can start every dollar for free today. Get it in the App Store or on Google Play right now. All right, Sebastian's in Richmond, Virginia. Hey, Sebastian. Hey, how are you doing today? Doing good. How can we help? Well, I just have a couple questions. So a little bit about my situation. I'm actually a recent college graduate. I graduated technically in August, and I've just landed my first big boy job, as I would call it. So I'm going to be making 70 grand. Cool. Congratulations. Thank you. What are you doing? Starting very soon here. I am a associate research consultant for a real estate company.

34:32Oh, good for you. Great. Yeah. So just a couple of questions. And so my plan going forward is they have a 401k with no match. And so I'm actually planning not to contribute to that. Okay. Okay. So my idea is I have a Roth IRA currently have about 4k in it. And I'm thinking about doing about like a 580 bucks a month into that so I can max it out. Right. And then I want to save the rest because I want to start right now. I have about 20K in savings and completely debt free, by the way, as well. Good. And I want to get into house hacking maybe mid, maybe like June, July next year if I can. OK, so let's talk about the investing part first.

35:21I would rather you invest based off of a percentage than based off of a limit or a certain amount that you want to spend. Okay, so walking the baby steps. I don't know if you're familiar with it, but after you're out of debt, which you are, and after you've saved up three to six months of expenses, maybe you save up three or four months, whatever you decide. Have you done that yet? Just asking. Yeah, so I have like$15K in a Roth IRA, like$2K in a savings account. and then like 4K and a Roth IRA. So the three to six months of expenses is non-invested. It's non-retirement. It's literally a rainy day fund, Sebastian, for if something were happening, if you lost your job, if you had an emergency, this is liquid money that you can get to.

36:04So I would suggest that needs to be your first order of business because here's what happens if you don't have it. If something happens and you need to get your hands on, I don't know,$5 ,000, you would have to unplug your investments to get to it. and you're working way too hard to be doing that. And you'll get penalized too for bringing it out early. Exactly. So you need separate money. Let's start on that first and just stack that up. You can do that fast with$70 ,000. It's just you. Then after that, Sebastian, 15 % is the number we're looking for. Now, I'm with you on maxing the Roth first because for you that's the better advantage since your 401k doesn't have a match.

36:40But depending on what you have, after you max out that Roth, if you still have money left to invest, yeah, then go ahead and throw it into the 401k. That's fine. But do it based off of percentage of your gross income, not just, you know. Yeah, I guess the number I gave was just because I think it's what, like 7k a year is the max for me at this point. So yeah, seven to eight in the Roth. And then for you, 15%, yeah, it will be around 10 ,000. Yeah, you have more to go. You should be able to max it out with a couple of thousand left. And Jay's just saying, put that two to 3 ,000 just in the 401k.

37:14Even if you're not getting the match, it's still a great retirement vehicle just to put that 15 and then if you want to do investing beyond that then we can talk about the house hunting or house hacking thing but yeah the the yeah maxing out the Roth and then putting a couple thousand more into the 401k every year is just a great starting baseline for you I like that you're thinking like that yeah that's amazing so what I'm thinking is because I'm currently living at home so my idea was you know purchase that first property, you know, as I'm moving out, right? It's like when I have obviously the baby steps done and then I'm obviously investing and saving, right?

37:50The idea is to just kind of move out into that first house hack opportunity, which I'd hope to acquire sometime. Which is what? When you're saying house hacking, what do you mean specifically? Like you're living in one side, the other person's living in the other? Yeah, I was probably going to do a probably single family rent by room strategy. So yeah, Yeah, so probably just purchasing a single family and then having a couple different tenants living in there with me. Here's the thing, though. I'm going to give you two words of caution. Number one is, let's say you do this. You've got to be able to cover it without them.

38:26So, for instance, let's say you buy the house and the mortgage is a couple thousand, you know,$2 ,500 a month. You've got to be able to cover that on your own to know that, hey, if for some reason these tenants don't pay. Or I can't get tenants. Yeah, or I can't get tenants. It's not going to jack me because I can cover the mortgage. Does that make sense? Yeah, I 100 % agree. And that's what I was kind of hoping to call about. Like, I know kind of, you know, there's a little bit of caution with, you know, the Ramsey steps and whatnot around, you know, like leveraging yourself in real estate. But I'm kind of trying to figure out, like, to me, there's no real difference between buying a single family home as a primary residence just for myself and then doing it as a house hack as well.

39:07Well, as long as at my baseline, I can cover that mortgage. Yeah, that's great. We're fine with that. There's more to it, though. And that was going to be my second word of wise. Yeah. If you on the financial side, if you're doing what we said, sure. But just remember, this is your first entrance into homeownership and you're doing it with two or three other people strapped to your back. So for the layman, like for the layperson, the first time they buy a house is already stressful because they're realizing for the first time it's all on me. And so you're not only doing that for yourself, but now all these tenants are going to be counting on you if something happens with the AC, if something happens with the roof, if they get a leak in their bedroom.

39:45Right. So there's part of me, Sebastian, I think I'm not mad at this idea, but there's part of me that wouldn't mind you if you did get the house. You hang out there for a minute before and just like get your bearings about you before you're just up and having all these people. Yeah, because I think it's just, okay, yeah, you got to paint reality, which is always hard to do if it's not been a reality. But what Jade's saying is, because my line of thought, honestly, Sebastian, is that's great. You're a single guy. If that's what you want to do and you can cover it even if they don't pay and you're like, listen, I can make so much money off of doing this and I'm going to save here and do whatever, whatever.

40:21That's your prerogative. That's what you want to do. But I'm telling you, Sebastian, when you start making, you start going to work all day. You're making your income. You're coming home. You're dating someone. you're doing this and that, you're going to get tired, I think, tired of the roommate situation if it's just to get extra money. Now, if you're going for a goal to be like, hey, I really want to make an extra 20 grand this year. This is a way I can do it. And maybe there's like an endpoint in your mind. I don't know. But just the endless idea of it overall, I just think you're going to look up and probably maybe a year, maybe less, maybe a little more and be like, I'm a grown man.

41:03I'm a grown man and I work and I pay my taxes and I want to come home to a house that I can I get to do what I want. It's clean. The kitchen is clean. I don't have to deal with roommates. You know what I'm saying? So like they're just always remember that. But I think that's the line that I feel safe with you doing it is that you've already said I can cover the mortgage without anybody. I'm going to just do it to make some extra money, maybe to hit a, you know, maybe it's a goal or whatnot. So so we're not against it. We just know. I don't know. Just want to encourage you to think about it from every angle.

41:32Yeah, and I definitely agree because I think I have because the end point for me is, you know, maybe house hack, you know, over the course of five years or so, four or five years, maybe do it, you know, two or three times, acquire multiple properties that way. And then at that point, I'll be able to get, you know, my own primary residence where whether it's whether I just want to rent somewhere like a condo or do whatever, but I haven't thought that far ahead. But the idea is, of course, I don't want to live with random people forever, But even as you expand wealth building tool in this aspect, it seems kind of like I mean, there's there's there's two alternatives.

42:05It's either do this or go out and just afford the mortgage on my own or go and rent and just throw money at the wall. The thing is, so it kind of seems like the optimal idea to me. The thing is, you've got if you do this, I like it for the one house thing. But if you're thinking about expanding this and going above and beyond, you do know you got to do that in cash, right? Yeah, so that's the thing where I'm thinking of because you have some people who will say, like, you know, just over-leverage yourself like crazy. Then you have Ramsey's side, which is, you know, pay cash. So then you already know.

42:37You've got to pay cash. Don't put on the risk, Sebastian. You're young. You are, you know, going to the wall with all these ideas, and it's great. He's got a lot. But slow and steady wins the race over time. People that keep wealth, they do it slow and steady. It's not a get-rich-quick thing.

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44:05welcome back to the ramsey show we're here in the fairwinds credit union studio continuing to take your call so call in the numbers 888-825-5225 and we will do our best to get you on the show I'm next to Rachel Cruz today. I'm Jade Warshaw. Let's get into it. We've got Kim in Memphis, Tennessee, right down the road. What's up, Kim? Hi. So glad to be talking to y 'all. My husband and I, we have combined finances and Christmas is coming up. And I want to know how to give and receive gifts from your spouse when you have combined finances. I love this question. And it's such a it's such a marker of someone who's really trying to do this the Ramsey way.

44:49This question. I'll tell you what I've done. And I know probably Rachel has her own take on it. I am a lover of gift cards this time of year. I'll go to like Costco or wherever I can get like the dollar of like Visa gift card that I can then take that money and spend it on whatever I'm trying to get for Sam. And then he doesn't see it. He might, of course, he'll see the gift card purchase. So he might get an inkling for what it is based on the amount of the gift card. But he won't know what it is because he won't be able to see that transaction roll in through every dollar. What is that? What do you do, Rachel?

45:24Yes. A couple of things. One, honestly, well, Kim, we're terrible gift givers to each other. So I'll say that first and foremost. We're not great at it. But the times in the past that we have two things, either it's an obvious holiday, like an anniversary or a birthday or Christmas. and so Winston will be like hey I'm gonna buy your gift just don't look at the bank account and he'll delete it off of the every dollar yeah you know what I mean like make a mark like I'll just put it back on just don't look at it online and we're fine and I'm like that's great like I know it's coming so like you're not snooping around yeah no and I don't care I don't know I have I have three kids do it I'm like I don't care that's fine thank you nobody got time so that or he did buy me a very nice ring um for our anniversary two years ago he got me a band and And well, you got to have some friends in high places.

46:09For sure. You can't do that on a gift card. Yeah, but he had a friend that bought it. And then Winston paid him back after. I love that. But you got to have a friend be able to do it. And I did concert tickets one time and my mom bought them. And I just told her I'll write you a check after because Sharon does not Venmo, which makes me laugh. So I still like we'll write her a check if something happens. So, yeah, we'll do we we'll get around that way. but you gotta have like a good like you know you gotta have like a trustworthy source to do that so I don't know I don't know if that helps but there's ways around it and I'll tell you this too Kim for people listening we will hear this randomly as an excuse not to bring in um to combine finances like well we give gifts and we can't because we give gifts and all this and I'm like y 'all it's like three times a year and you're a really great spouse if you're getting like anniversary birthday and Christmas like I don't know are y 'all gift givers Sam Warshaw has made me a gift giver.

47:03Okay. See y 'all are great. His family is gifty and yeah, he's gifty and Sam, and he has an expectation. He's got an expectation. He's like, I want a good gift. Yeah. And this man has expensive taste. I'm like, man, I gotta, I gotta raise my game. What am I gonna do? Oh my gosh. Yeah. But we'll, we'll pull the parent or the friend card sometimes to, to cover something. Yeah. I like it. That's such a good question. That, that is the true mark of somebody who's trying to do this. All right. Thanks for the call. We've got Kenny in Jackson, Mississippi. Hey, Kenny. Hello. How are y 'all doing? Good.

47:38How can we help? Awesome. I have a, yeah, I have a question about life insurance. So me and my wife have four children under six and we do have life insurance for them. It's a lot more than what y 'all recommend. We have 150 ,000 on each of them. And some people have told me that they're really like, you don't need to be spending that much and some people are like, well, that's totally fine. My thought process on having the$150 ,000 on each child was it's A, going to be probably the most interesting thing if obviously a child passes and having to be able to take significant time off work. And then if we do have any debts at that time, we're able to pay that off.

48:16I know you guys recommend$20 ,000 and no more than that. And I know that because I called and their insurance and that they won't even sell anything over 20 ,000. Kenny, I got to break in. I think you either got a hold of some wrong information or I think you may be a little confused about how we teach insurance. Can I explain it? First off, I do want to say I love that you're thinking about that and you're thinking about how can I protect myself, my family. The thought process is right. The method for how you did it is a little off, but we can fix it. So the purpose of life insurance is to help the person who is dependent on your income.

48:59It's an income replacement. So let's say your family, for instance, you've got the four kids under six, and you've also got the wife. They're all dependent on your income. So if something were to happen to you, Kenny, the insurance needs to be on you and your wife. So you're the breadwinner, or maybe your wife is, but if something happens to you, your kids need to be able to have a source of income that they can say, okay, we can pay for dad's funeral, hopefully that never happens, and we can afford to continue the lifestyle we've had because this nest egg is there. And same thing if your wife were to pass away.

49:33She's contributing something, whether it be in the form of taking care of the kids and being a household CEO, that needs to be replaced with money because if she were to go, yes, you would need childcare, you would need help around the house. So that's the purpose of the insurance. And we don't do it by lump sum. We do it 10 to 12 times your income. So whatever you're making, Kenny, we would say 10 to 12 times that amount. And if your wife is a stay at home mom, maybe four, you know, four times your income, something around that, that number. And we want term life policies on the two of you. so not on the kids we have we have uh we have life insurance ourselves and that's that's great um and i understand about the replacement of the income okay i guess just my thought is like i'm not going to want to have to work for i would i mean i've never had a child pass and god forbid that ever happens but like i know you all have kids like you wouldn't want to work for a substantial amount of time while you're grieving that so i'm my thought process is just like have you know a decent little you know you know uh lump sum of money for the kids in case you know one of them passes.

50:36So we actually have, like Dr. John says, to grieve and just miss them and figure that out. Where are you in the baby steps? Yeah, so we're on baby step two, I think, baby step two. So you have our emergency fund and we're going to pay off debt right now. So my goal is once we pay off all of our debt, then, you know, scale back on the life insurance. You know, we don't have a huge emergency fund right now besides our$1 ,000. But, you know, once we get that taken care of, then we can kind of back off on the life insurance. So what do you think about that? Do you think that would be good or no? I don't think it's necessary, Kenny.

51:09I mean, I do think it's one of these things. As an adult, you get to get off this call and do what you feel comfortable doing. And if that's what you want, that's fine. My word of caution is, because I mean, they have to probably be cheap policies. How much are you paying per kid, like per year? How much is going to this? Well, per month, it's about 40 bucks a kid. Okay. Because to me, that's, I mean, you know, 160 bucks a month. Yeah. So I'm like, if that, if you, we don't recommend this, this is not the way we would go about it. We would never tell someone to do this. But if this is where you choose to spend some of your money, because it makes you feel better, and you want to, that's fine.

51:51But also, word of caution, there's so many, which I don't think you're in because you're working with Xander, but there's so many bad philosophies around kids and life insurance of things. of like, oh, you get them wealthy here. You're doing it for a financial strategy, not really from what you're saying is if they actually did pass away, you would need that money to not work. But just be careful that you don't go down this rabbit hole of life insurance because I'd say it's more crappy things out there about life insurance than good. Sure, sure. The good is very slim and the good is good. Like the good is good.

52:25But there's weird stuff with life insurance policies that are really expensive for kids and all of it. And we just don't play that game. So I don't think it's necessary. But if you want to spend, you know, 160 bucks a month, you can. But that's, you know, thousand or so dollars not going to the debts. Yeah, I agree.

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54:25All righty, we got Ashton in Austin, Texas. That's a bit of a tongue twister, but it didn't get me, Rachel. What's up, Ashton? Hey, hello. How you doing? So thank you for taking my call. So I want to ask you guys a question. Me and my wife are on baby step number two. And so we started with$130 ,000 in debt at the beginning of the year, and we got it down to$23 ,900 and some more dollars. Oh, my gosh. Good job. Yeah. And so we both, we've been blessed enough to work at a company that we get ESVP stocks and stuff like that. So that really helped us get this push. And we thought about$5 ,000, anywhere from$4 ,500 to$5 ,000 a month at our debt every month.

55:06So what I'm trying to figure out is this, though. I'm like, okay, we have, so with the ESVP stocks, we have about, we're going to owe about$14 ,000 in taxes, right? so I'm like okay should we take that money throw it at the car and I'll be I'll have the car if I do that I'll have the car done because that's what the last that is I'll have the vehicle done by like uh right before well maybe even Thanksgiving time okay I'll have the car done and then we can I can we can go back you know start the pilot stack stock piling cash and then be ready for before April 15th comes. The 14 ,000 taxes. You get what I'm saying?

55:46But I'm like, should I leave it? Or should I just, you know, because either way it's going to get done. Because like now, like I have the tax money, but which direction should I go with it? Have you run out the number? You're positive that with just your income alone, you'll be able to cash flow the tax bill when it comes? Yeah, because once again, we're blessed enough to be able to live off of one income. So basically we live off my wife's check My check is about anywhere from my overtime,$4 ,500 to$5 ,000 a month. So I'm like, I'll be ready. You know what I mean? And the taxes are coming from, I'm sorry.

56:24They're cashing out stocks to pay this. And they're single stocks? Yeah, single stocks. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, we tell anybody to do that. I was going to say, I would go ahead and do it anyways, Ashton, because I wouldn't have single stocks anyways. so I would probably tell you to do that and move some stuff to mutual funds or index funds anyways let alone pay off the debt so I think it's a good move in general it does hurt with the tax bill like what you're saying it's all it's like but in the long run yeah I'm scared I'm scared I know I think we all kind of have a little bit of fear you want to play it out with your accountant first and like just be double sure that you know what the number is going to be I think regardless of I mean if you're in the ballpark I think you'll be fine with your income and cash flowing that.

57:05But if you want just that extra knowledge of just tell me, you know, get as close as possible to it, I would do that. The other question I had for you is I thought you said you had$22 ,000 left to go, but you said... Like$23 ,981. So you've got other money that you're putting with that to finish the car? Is that what you're doing? Or is there another debt? So every check, like last, I just paid$2 ,000. I'm paying$2 ,000 every two weeks. if I get a little more, like I say, it's about anywhere from$4 ,000 to$5 ,000 a month. Got it. It's my wider ballpark of what I'm putting on the debt. Gotcha. Regardless, I've been doing that since the beginning of the year.

57:44Way to go. Good. Yeah. Well, I'm with Jade. If you're able to double check that you can tax flow, or I'm sorry, cash flow the tax bill in April, I'd go ahead and cash it out. Yep, be done. And then build up some savings to invest in like a good index fund or something. But for some reason, if you can't, Ashton, I don't know if they, I don't know if you guys from the numbers for some reason, then you're going to get this car paid off in five months anyways. So you could pay it off, save some cash on the side after that, and then sell the stock and pay it. You know what I mean? Either way, I would be doing both.

58:14It's just the order you want to make sure that you're good at. But if you are 100 % sure you will have that money saved for the tax bill, I would go ahead and cash it out and get this car, get it paid off. Because when you don't have that car payment, and Ashley, y 'all did crazy. Y 'all did so good. That was fast. That was so amazing. Those numbers you just gave us. So well done to you and your wife. I mean, y 'all are like textbook, exactly what we talk about. And so, yeah, you guys got a bright future ahead. So good. Thank you for the call. That's so good. All right. Now we've got Austin in Charlotte, North Carolina.

58:46What's up, Austin? Hey, Jade. Hey, Rachel. I'm 25 and I make about$60 ,000 a year. I'm about$35 ,000 in consumer debt. and my payments are around$800 per month. The largest debt is what I'm most worried about and that's a$22 ,000 truck at$400 per month. And I just got this truck about five months ago. That hurts. Yeah, and the KBB value is$18 ,000. Yay, yay, yay! Good night. You've already lost$4 ,000. Man. Wow. yeah i am not very good when it comes to no you're fine at all yeah well you're learning you're 25 you're learning um yeah our friends kind of side note austin um our friend bought a new tesla and he bought it with 4 000 miles on it so like it was literally a brand new one owner all of it oh really 22 he got off of what he bought that fourth out like with 4 000 miles versus what if he went retail brand new so i'm like that just shows you guys how quickly cars drop.

59:53So you're not just the only one, Austin, we, we see it all the time and it's real how their value drops. So, you know, the truck, we would always say if it is half of your annual income, you need to sell it. So you're not there. You're close, but you're not there with the 22 ,000 versus your income. But the question is, I mean, yeah, the depreciation of what you would have to pay in difference and get a, and get some money to replace the car, It kind of ends up being a wash. So I probably would just keep it and pay it down. Yeah. What are the other debts? What's the other$12 ,000? So I have just under$10 ,000 on a personal loan.

1:00:35And that was for another truck, actually, that it has a lot of motor issues. And that's why I went and bought this newer truck. So you spent$10 ,000 on a truck, still didn't get fixed, so you spent$32 ,000 on cars very quickly? Where is that truck right now? I still have it. I have a welder actually coming this weekend to help fix the frame. Okay, how much can you sell it for once it's all done? Right around$8 ,500. Okay, well, that'll help bring down your$22 ,000 car payment. And what's the other$2 ,000 debt,$3 ,000 debt? That is what's remaining for my fiance's lawyer. She is in the process of going through a large custody dispute with her baby's father, her son's father.

1:01:40Okay. And she was having some trouble trying to come up with that. And it was something very big for her and very important to myself. So I told her that I would go ahead and take care of it. And we will handle that, handle everything at the end. When do you guys get married?

1:02:05We haven't set a date. So I started listening to you guys about nine months ago. and that that is something that has been heavy on my mind and it's something that I definitely want to get the ball rolling towards um we both she I'm ready to go to the courthouse yeah and and just get this over with um because I also just bought a house about six months ago oh my goodness um hey hold up hold up I'm gonna stop you for a minute you've been listening for nine months You've been listening for nine months. Thank you, Rachel, because I was. I think here's what I want you to. I don't want you to keep going towards debt.

1:02:51I want you to start practicing patience because I see a guy who's like, I need to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. And I just think that it's going to start to compound on you. I'm glad that you called now before it's gotten too crazy. but I think Austin you gotta just slow down a little bit um I do the truck is too much the the loan for the other thing is too like if it's not on fire we should certainly don't need to be going into debt for it yeah um so just take a little bit of a chill pill um I agree with you if you're gonna start paying for things for your fiance you probably need to get married or you You guys need to decide what that line is because I think this could get messy really fast.

1:03:33And it doesn't. It sounds like she's got a lot of loose ends to tie up and it might not be time for her to jump so quickly in. But also you can't be saving a ship while yours is sinking. Yeah. And so you got a lot on your plate, Austin. So I would I would focus first and foremost on paying off this debt smallest to largest. And so you're going to do, you know, the fiance's debt, personal loan for the truck and then the car payment. get that taken care of get a good emergency fund and start cash flowing your life all together

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1:05:40All right, guys, thanks for listening to The Ramsey Show. And if you are an avid listener, and even if you're not, make sure you're sharing the show, because I believe that the content that we're sharing is so very helpful. I mean, after all, it did help Sam and I pay off$460 ,000 of debt. And I truly hope and know that it's helpful for you guys too. And it's something that you can do to just spread the word of the Ramsey way. That kind of sounds creepy, but it's not. It's just a way to spread the information so other people can have help with their life and their money. So just, you know, hit the little paper airplane if you're on Instagram or, you know, copy the link on YouTube and share it with some friends.

1:06:18We also have a really cool playlist that is easy to share. So just make sure you're like subscribing and sharing. That really helps us out. And it's something that you can do that's free. That doesn't take any time at all. All right, let's get back to the phone lines. Ryan in San Antonio, Texas. What's up, Ryan? How can we help today? Hi, yes. Good afternoon, everyone. How are we doing? Everyone good? Oh, yeah. Doing great. Yeah, awesome. Glad to hear. So really what I wanted to call and ask for is how I can just tackle my debt at a fast and efficient rate. I want to be debt free. I love that you want to be debt free how much debt are we looking at so my wife and I just got married August 2nd so our combined debt is $40 ,000 what did you say right before that Ryan you said something about wanting to be debt free did you say a musician they just got married we just got married on August 2nd we just want to be debt free I'm sorry I thought I heard something else Okay.

1:07:20That's great. Yeah. So how much do you guys make a year together? Household income? Combined. Yeah. Combined before taxes, we're looking at$100 ,000. Okay. Good. And what kind of debt is it? Is it from the wedding or? No, the wedding we paid out of pocket, nothing that we owe for that. It's student loans and a car loan along with credit card debt. Okay. How much is the car? How much of the$48 ,000 is the car? For$26 ,000. Okay. And what's the student loan? Student loan together,$16 ,000. Okay. In the credit card. Correct. Yes. Okay. Got it. Okay. So is this, did this come mostly from one side or is this just really both of you together?

1:08:09This is both your debt? The loans under my name, my wife didn't come in. She has no car payment. And the student loans, I owe a little bit more as well. And then the credit cards together, for sure. Okay. Okay. So all yours, Ryan. Bringing all this to your debt-free wife. No, I'm just kidding. That is funny. That's wild. So, yeah, I mean, I think that you have the right spirit. This is something that is great to tackle head on as you guys are combining your finances. So, yeah, that's the first thing is combining everything together. I don't know if you've done this or not, but you guys together need a joint checking account that both all your money is going into.

1:08:50So that's there's complete transparency there. Do you guys have that? No. So we're very new to this whole to the real world. So, yes. How old are you guys? I'm 26. She's 25. OK. And that's what I wanted to call. Yeah. Yeah. That's great. Perfect. Yes. Yes, well, Jade's right. So combining everything that can be combined. So that's going to be any savings in a high yield or a money market. If you guys have any of those accounts, put both names on it. Checking account. Yeah, the most efficient way of combining is that joint checking account. And people get all squirmish about that because they want their own money and all of this.

1:09:33But we've just found financially, not only do you get ahead faster when you work together as a team, when you say, yes, all this money is coming to our household as a household, as a family, what do we do with this pile of money? Regardless of who brings in what, this is our money to run our household. How do we most efficiently do that? And then just from a dollars and cents standpoint, just working out of the same account, because Ryan, I mean, it's, it's still kind of amazes me, which I know I'm the weird one probably in the world today, but that people Venmo or split grocery bills as a married couple.

1:10:02You're just like, oh my gosh, y 'all like you, you're both adult. Like, let's just, let's just call it what it is. We're a married couple and we're sharing our life together. So they have the joint, the account would be all of that. So that's kind of the tactical side. And then, oh, go ahead, Jade. Well, I was going to say, does your, I know you're calling, but your wife is on board with this. She, she knows that we're doing this. We're paying it off of aggressively. Does she know this or is this just you talking? So I'm the more financially savvy one. I'm the one who's trying to find strategy.

1:10:31She's all on board though she's all she's all on board well we say the most financially savvy ryan but you are the one bringing in all the debt i know yeah what's it mean spade a spade here um no so yeah and then i would sit down for you guys and do a budget we'll give you as a wedding gift from jade and i yeah um we'll give you every dollar which is our budgeting app but it also you plug in all your numbers so you see your numbers as a household um which will help you start working your way out of debt giving you a plan and giving you some guidance that way and i also throw in my book know yourself, know your money, because understanding how you guys function separately, how you grew up, your money personalities, you know, I made fun of you, you said you're the savvy one, but you're probably the nerd.

1:11:12You probably enjoy this stuff. She's probably a little bit more laid back, which is great. Like all of that's so normal, but working together and seeing each other's strengths is really big. And you'll probably get those conversations doing a budget. So when you guys do your first monthly household budget together, that's a great, I mean, some people have a lot of bad memories around that. You know, I think it's a great starting point to be like, Hey, here's what I think we spend on groceries. What do you think we spend on grocery? You know, you really start to get a handle on where your income's going.

1:11:44And in that budget, Ryan is where you guys are going to be listing out your debts as well. And you guys will start working on tackling the smallest debt. So it's probably one of the credit cards, uh, paying that off. And then you just, you pay minimum payments on everything, but you start attacking the smallest one first. And if you guys together, Ryan can get fully on board. And if you guys go crazy with this, and when I say crazy and Jade, Jade lived this out. And so you could probably speak to it, but I mean, it's not only, yeah, not, not only cutting expenses, but you both getting extra jobs, working nights, working weekends, like you just go all in, you could get this 48 paid off.

1:12:17I think at 18, 18 months. For sure. I think with you guys being newlyweds, you're going to have to basically live like your college students. Like don't mistake getting married for an hour, you know, about that life. Now is the time for you to be like, okay, we're eating peanut butter and jelly because we're newlyweds and everything is fun, right? Like make everything fun because you're newlyweds. And also I would say, Ryan, don't mistake. And this is for anybody listening because sometimes a wife or a spouse or a husband can say, yeah, sure. Do whatever you want, right? Don't mistake that for being on board.

1:12:50Make sure she's on, like wants to be a part of it. Because I think sometimes if you're the nerd, it can be, that can be interpreted as, oh, she says I can go do this. Yeah. And you may be excited about it. And Ryan's like, oh, I'll do it. I'll do the budget. Don't worry. You got to do it together. So you, you, you got to make sure that this is not just, hey, she said it's fine. So you go off to the spreadsheet and, you know, just dive in there on your own, make sure that you're both, to Rachel's point, contributing. She has a say in the budget. You might be the one who makes it, but she's the one who's commenting on it.

1:13:22And you guys are both tracking transactions. Everything's transparent. I think that's the part of this that's super duper important going down the line. Yeah, for sure. Ryan, can you already tell if you guys are opposites with money, meaning like, are you more of the spender or she's more of the saver or vice versa? I think we're both pretty conservative. It was just actually writing down the desk where we were just like, holy smokes. Okay. We need some advice on how to do it. But I think we're both a little bit on the conservative end. I don't want to splurge as much. No, that's great. Yeah. And I'll say this, Ryan, you know, the faster you guys can get out of this debt, the brighter your future is because we would tell you like, stop investing, stop everything until you get this debt paid off.

1:14:08And then you guys build up an emergency fund after that. If you guys want to buy a home or I'm not sure if a home is in the equation, that would be after that. But it is amazing when you look up and run some numbers. If you go to ramseysolutions.com in our investment calculator, if you start investing at 30. Oh man, oh man. And you start looking ahead of like what your income is going to be and the compound interest and where you guys could go financially, like it's insane. And just put in your car payment from age 25 to age 65 and see if you live to the car payment your whole life. Instead of investing, you paid a car company that payment, what you're missing out on.

1:14:42So together, just like start building this dream of like, this is what we want to be. We want to be about this and we want to be out of debt. We want to be investing. You know, that's the fun part of all of it. When you're working together, which I think couples miss out on when they keep it so separate. It's like, you don't get to dream together and be like, here's what we get to do as a couple and as a family. So there's a lot of upside, Ryan. So I so, I appreciate you calling and trusting us with this. because I think you guys are you're on the right track and you guys are you're gonna do incredible things so congratulations on the marriage

1:15:29I love entrepreneurs don't forget guys I started my company on a card table myself So I know what it's like to have people counting on you, your team, your family, not to mention your customers. And when you're the one signing the paychecks, you can't afford to fly blind. But I'll be honest, early on, one thing that nearly sunk us was wasting time with spreadsheets that didn't add up because business units didn't talk to each other. I finally told my team, just fix it. And they did. We got NetSuite. That was years ago. And we've never looked back. See, NetSuite isn't just for tech giants. It's built for growing businesses like yours.

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1:17:00So you guys, we're always giving you advice on obviously how to manage your money and the components that go along with that. So of course, we're always telling you things like you need to get on a budget. A budget is a huge part of managing your personal finance. You need to be paying off debt. That's a huge part of personal finance. You need to carry the proper insurance, a very big part of personal finance. Obviously, we care about saving for the future. We care about things like generosity. But another big part of managing your personal finances is what would happen if you were to leave this earth?

1:17:30What happens to your personal finances, your assets, all of those things? And so, of course, that falls under wills and estate planning. And it's kind of one of those topics, Rachel, that's a little bit like, I don't know, it makes you feel some type of way to talk about it, but we really do need to talk about it. So we get questions all the time about wills. Can I just make my own will? Can I do it online? Do I need to get with a lawyer? How do I do this? So let's kind of pop through this, Rachel, and answer the number one questions, actually the top four questions that people tend to ask us.

1:17:59So the first one, how do I know, Rachel, if I need a trust or if my state's too complicated for doing the online thing? Oh, yeah. Well, we always say if your estate is worth less than a million dollars, then an online will is just sufficient. That's fine. Anything past a million probably can get complicated with passing down assets and taxes and all of that. So at that point, you may want to look into more of estate planning, which may include a trust. I love that. Okay. What about this one? What do I need to start my will online? Well, making a will online or not, some big decisions you got to think through.

1:18:32So think through who do I want to give all my stuff to? You know, where does my stuff go? If you have minor children, children that are minors, who's going to be taking care of them? And also who do you want to make decisions for you if you are incapacitated. If you're not available or conscious enough to make these decisions about your finances, and then there's even power of attorneys for health decisions, all of it is there in the will. So important. And it may seem a little morbid, but you do, I mean, this is part of the planning, part of the risk there. Number three, is an online will legally valid?

1:19:11Yes, it is. But just not any online will that you find on the internet may not be legally valid in your state. So again, it has to be a state specific will. That's one reason we recommend mom and bear legal forms because they do a great job with that. Yeah. When Sam and I moved from Florida to Tennessee, we had to change our will because state law applies. Okay. And finally, number four, why would I want an online will versus a traditional one that's made with a lawyer? Why would I even bother with that? It's more convenient. You're able to kind of do it at your pace. You're able to get to it.

1:19:42I'd say it's less expensive as well. It takes less time. Yeah. So, again, it's very doable. And again, our world today, the way we've made things accessible. So whether it's, you know, even brokerage accounts or index funds, you know, you can do through Vanguard, you know, your will you can do online. And so there are times that you can just do these things yourself. But when things get more complicated, whether it's investing, again, your estate, even like we're talking about making a will, bring in professionals to help you with some of this stuff, especially if you have anything that's a little bit complicated because it's worth getting an expert opinion.

1:20:16Yeah, I agree. So if you heard us talk, but you're still not sure, why don't you take our Wills quiz to find out kind of where you fall on either side of the fence? And you can do that by going to RamseySolutions.com slash Wills quiz and you can find out which approach is right for you. All right. Thank you, Rachel. Let's go to Gina in Jacksonville, Florida. Hey, Gina, how can we help today? Hey, ladies, how's it going? Doing great. Awesome. So my question today has to do with investing, but also insurance. My husband and I have gone through Financial Peace University and we've taught it two times.

1:20:55We're debt free. We're but we are also saving for a home. We sold our home like eight years ago up north and moved to Florida. And we've been saving since then, bought new cars and all that stuff, completely debt free, cash flowing everything. Good for you guys. We are awesome. Thank you so much. So we are at this point maxing out basically all of our retirement accounts. And my husband recently got a new job and the health insurance has doubled. Our high yield health insurance has gone from$3 ,000 a year to$6 ,000 a year. And we don't use it ever. So we cash flow all of our health expenses because we do all alternative health.

1:21:43So we have a chiropractor, massage, acupuncture, nutritional therapies, everything. And they don't take insurances traditionally. Correct. Yeah. And I've even tried to like, I've taken hours even like, you know, sending in receipts trying to see if I can somehow like build up that deductible. And nothing has ever been. So did you drop your policy? Is that what you're thinking of doing? Letting it lapse? Well, I just keep going back and forth because technically it's in play like right at this moment. Like we did sign up for it, but now open enrollment is coming around again. And I'm thinking I'm going to lose out on the investment portion of the HSA, which we've been maxing out the last few years, but have never taken any money out of.

1:22:26And so I'm like, which you can keep until you can keep until what is it? 62 and be able to, I mean, it can work just like a investing vehicle, like your 401k or any type of investment. Like you can actually use that money and invest it, which is great. But you're worried about the premium, the 500 bucks a month? Is that what you're worried? Are you worried about the premium? You just don't want to pay the premium anymore because you don't really use the insurance? Is that what you're saying? I can just invest that and continue to cashflow my healthcare and just invest separately. I mean, we're also doing about a thousand dollars a month in an outside retirement.

1:23:03What's your nest egg now? What are you guys worth now? It's not huge because it's only been the last few years, maybe like 500 ,000. I don't know if I would drop health at Gina. I wouldn't because, because the truth is if something, if a car, I mean, if something get in a car accident tomorrow and need brain surgery. And it would be, yeah, millions of dollars. You know what I mean? Like it just, I mean, the healthcare costs are just, it's extreme. And so if you don't have health insurance in place, I mean, it's worth it. it would be worth it even if I don't use it year to year it's an extra padding if something big happens um a diagnosis I mean anything yeah you're gonna you're gonna want health insurance I would not I would not risk cash flowing that you got to remember it's basically what my husband thinks too but I'm like yeah and I'll tell you you talked to you talked to Sharon Ramsey Gina and even my sister and they are on your train they are oh man activated charcoal with stomach bugs i mean they're into the whole thing i think that's great but they all keep health insurance yeah because the truth is yes if something really bad happens to you when your children are like you know i i don't know i don't yeah we don't get like in a medical debate but but i think you're gonna want surgery or charcoal can't fix certain things i'm not against that for sure i get it i just i guess i was just thinking like would the auto insurance just come into play at that point.

1:24:22The umbrella insurance, like there's other insurances that we have that I thought, okay, if something like that happens, I don't know. Tell me, tell me the problem you're trying to solve. What, what I think what you hate paying the 6 ,000 every year, is that it? And you'd rather invest the money. Absolutely. So what I would do if I were you, if I was so hung up on that$500 a month being invested, I'd go out and find another$500 a month and invest I'd earn it if that's what you're trying to do. But yeah, I just see this and insurance too. I'll say this, Gina, like, you know, home insurance, ours keeps going up and it's just, it's, it's, it's a little bit of a pain.

1:24:59No one likes paying it. No. Yeah. But it's for the just in case the worst case scenario. That's what insurance is for. And, you know, even life insurance, right? You have life insurance in case something happens to you for your kids and like, and God forbid nothing does happen, but it's the just in case. So I, so I would keep, yes, I would keep it. for the just in case category and you're paying for peace of mind if something really, really bad happens that costs literally hundreds of thousands, millions of dollars of whatever may happen, that you have that in place. So that's right. At least my husband's peace of mind.

1:25:32Yeah, that's right. I know. I know. I hear you. I hear you. But but yeah, I don't think I would let that let that go. No, if anything, think of it as there are certain things in life that feel like a pain in the butt sometimes like insurance or when you, you know, people call and they're like, I don't want to go to the next tax bracket. And I'm like, guys, at the end of the day, actually, these things are a blessing to be able to afford and to be able to shoulder the weight of that payment. And to say something like, oh, man, if I could have that money, I could invest it because some people, you know, they they can't even afford the payment.

1:26:08That's right. That's right. Kind of try to keep it in perspective like that. It's great to be able to transfer that risk. it is a pain in the butt but at least you can handle it it's not causing you to miss out on dinner or anything like that and you guys are killing it in other places too so I would take the abundance approach like what Jade's saying it's a good thing to have it and it's great that you can afford it and god forbid you never need to use it

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1:27:37All right. Well, welcome back to The Ramsey Show. We're here in the Fairwinds Credit Union studio, continuing to take calls about your life and your money. I'm Jade Warshaw. Next to me is Rachel Cruz, and we're just chopping it up with you guys. So call in, 888-825-5225, and we'll do our best to get you on the phone line. We've got Jasmine in Raleigh, North Carolina. Hey, Jasmine, how can we help today? Hey. Yeah, so I'm calling kind of on behalf of my husband. We live about two hours away from Raleigh in a small town. But basically, my husband is a wonderful guitarist, and his income has decreased pretty steadily over the past few years due to not to his part, but the people he plays for.

1:28:26So I was calling to see exactly how he could increase that income and be a better contributor because I feel like it's difficult for us because of the stress of not being able to play as much as he wants to. So what level was he playing on? Was he touring with a major artist or was he doing session work? Explain what that was. So he's not touring with a major artist, but he is touring with a guy based out of Nashville. So he commutes back and forth between our little town in North Carolina and Nashville quite, or used to, a couple of times a month. Now it's like once a month. In the winter months, it's hardly any.

1:29:14At the height of that, what was he earning when he was doing that, like at the height of doing his thing? so at the height he was actually still living in nashville majority of his time and also working with another music company as a sound engineer okay and so he probably at the height was doing i don't know maybe 75 how long ago was that jasmine that was three years three and a half Okay. And what's he been making since? Why did y 'all move to Raleigh? Sorry. Why did you move to Raleigh if he's a musician and he's doing music work in Nashville? So he moved back home. How long have you guys been married?

1:30:00He never wanted to live in Nashville. We will be four years or three years this coming November. So he made the choice that it was more important to be home than keep this gig, the sound engineer gig and the playing gig. and now he's in Raleigh and can't find the work. He's still playing with the same guy. It's just that guy doesn't play at all. Yeah, but he was also supplementing, touring and doing sound. Because we know Nashville, I mean, there's like tons of musicians and they do all kinds of things to be able to supplement a full. And where we live, there's no. Yeah, so that's his choice. But you do understand, it would be like, you know, we have some students from Pennsylvania, I think.

1:30:39So I'm like, it'd be like working at Hershey's and being like, oh, I still want to do chocolate, but I'm going to move to Atlanta. So I'm thinking, you're like, well, there's not a lot of trouble. You know what I'm saying? You moved out of the work. Not that you can't be a musician anywhere. But what was the plan is the question. What was his plan? The plan was to still work with the musician and then another guy that has a band here and that he does sound for here. And so he still works with these guys. the problem lies that they are, yeah, they're not working as often and not making as much money.

1:31:16So I'm going to tell you, I'm going to tell you as a person who lived in this lifestyle, A, it feels like he's got all of his eggs and one to two very small baskets. And that gets tough because he's reliant on these people because to do their job. And if they're not doing their job, he can't do his job right so because of that he's got to have diversify and have his hand in a lot of different things and that is a full-time job that alone he's got to be on this all the time he should be out marketing you know networking every single night he should be at everybody else's live shows getting to know people so if somebody's sick that they're like oh i know a guy who can sub and he's great on guitar like that's has that been his full-time job because if it has been and he's still not getting anything, then he's got to consider where his strength lies.

1:32:06If his greater strength is in sound engineering, maybe he needs to veer more towards that side of things. Do you see what I'm saying? I think as a musician, as an entertainer, you have to have a lot of tough conversations with yourself and you have to be very realistic on what you need to be doing next, especially when there's money involved and a family involved. So what have you observed? is he grinding or is he kind of like uh he has been distracted with a new baby so um i we had our baby not almost 10 months ago so that has definitely taken um a front seat to his work and being that person that is always going and networking and making phone calls and all that you just talked about.

1:32:56But it's been four years. You said four years ago he was making$75 ,000. And what's he making now? This year, last year it was about$45 ,000 to$50 ,000. This year it's$30 ,000. Yeah, he's on the decline. So you guys, you said that you're calling in for him. Did he ask you to call? Is that what you meant by that? Or you're calling for you? No, I'm calling for me. to kind of see how I can help him. I think you need to sit down and I think you have to frame this not around his talent, not around what he can or can't do. You have to just frame it around the reality and say - And of your reality too.

1:33:38Yeah. What I'm feeling. Yeah. It's about, yeah, you're talking about it from your perspective, which is we have a brand new baby. It's been four years and I'm feeling a shift. I'm feeling a decline and I'm very scared because I haven't, you're not talking about it And I don't see what the plan is. I don't know what the plan is, but I know that we need one. Right. Have you had those types of conversations with him? Yeah, we've talked about the plan and it's, oh, well, once we, you know, get new babysitter well established, because he's kind of being a stay at home mom while I was working because my income is more.

1:34:15Oh, and what's your income? And so mine is 83. 3-3. Okay, so I will say I thought you were, I thought his income was the only income. So it's good that you are working. Got it. Do you enjoy your work, Jasmine? Is that what you're wanting to do? Oh, I mean, ideally, if I could be a state-owned mom, that would be amazing. But I can't do that. We can't do it financially. But I do enjoy what I do. Okay, so your concern, though, with him, because, you know, household, you guys are at over six figures right now. Yep. Even with him making 30. And he's replacing child care, right? I mean, he's not, you guys aren't paying for child care while you work.

1:34:57He's the one watching. He was. He doesn't do well with child care because, like, he feels like he needs to be the provider. Then he needs to go out and provide, respectfully. Like, you can't have it both ways. Yeah. And we had discussed, like, what's the plan? and his plan as a whole once we get, you know, somebody in, I'll be able to focus and work and bring, like, get more gigs and bring up the income. This is what you need to remind him. The baby's 10 months old, but this decline has been happening for four years. So the baby might be a distraction, like a further distraction, but it's not the root of the problem.

1:35:40And I think that's what you need to talk with him about is say, I get it, we do need childcare. I'm not saying we don't, but this precedes that, and that's what I'm worried about. And you sound like a really kind, sweet, you know, a little bit more soft-spoken, but I think that you need to lay this out in very clear terms that he's going to understand that you also have dreams here, which is to stay home. So your dreams matter and his dreams matter and you've got to come together on a plan and a tipping point that's like the go-no-go on this music deal.

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1:37:24All right. Today's question of the day is brought to you by Y-Refi. So if your private student loans are in default and if you're feeling stuck, just know you're not out of options, okay? Y-Refi specializes in helping borrowers just like you find real solutions with low fixed rate financing. So go to yrefy.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y-R-E-F-Y dot com slash Ramsey. Remember, it may not be available in all states. Today's question comes from Ryan in Vermont. He said, I'm 40 years old and engaged to a lady who is 37. However, I'm struggling to see how to move forward. I own a house and I've been using cash to upgrade and repair the home.

1:38:05She believes that I should put her name on the house without her putting anything into it. I disagree and have asked that she at least match some of the equity before her name goes on the house. She makes significantly more than I do, but chooses to own horses. And we need George on this card. Her hobby causes her not to be able to cover her own bills because she spends so much on them and their upkeep. I'm at a loss about how to approach this issue. I have studied the Ramsey principles on how married couples should approach finances but i can't figure this step out for us how do couples merge finances when they completely disagree on how their money is being allocated it's a lot there ryan i don't think you're worried about the house i think you're worried that you're marrying someone that can't do math there's a lot there right yeah i'm like girl you're 37 like i'm sorry that you're yeah you're i'm with him on this your hobby causes you not to be able to cover your own bills yeah that well well i i do okay let me let me i don't know if it was just the way i heard it but i also feel like he has a tone yeah with the house yeah but i think it's deeper i think it's because he's seeing her not being able to function as a human being and then she's like just gonna jump in and he's like are you gonna be able to help function as a married couple or am i gonna be drowning in irresponsibility the rest of my life because my fiance isn't even covering herself like I think that I think it's a deeper fear I think it's coming out as the house which I don't agree with Ryan I don't agree with you on that yeah from a principled standpoint I agree I I didn't 37 and she can't pay her bills because of her body of horses I didn't know I don't know and I may have misinterpreted this but I didn't know if he was saying like she can't even cover her cover her bills saying like her putting the equity that he wanted is one of the bills that he wants her to cover.

1:39:59Like I, I was trying to understand if she really is like not paying her utilities. Yeah. She's not able to cover her own bills because she spends so much on them, the horses and their upkeep. Yeah. Yeah. I guess so. I guess so. I think if she was, I think if she was a, I think if she was successful, responsible, she's investing, she's doing this and that she's got her own place. She's going to sell. I mean, sure. Yeah. You're right. You're right. I don't think he'd be worried about it. No, I don't either. I think that you're marrying, I'm sorry a woman that's not like you're she's not responsible yeah you're a little uptight Ryan so you probably need to like you both need help have a yeah have a glass of wine and chill for a second but like man I I think the I need marriage counseling well you do and I think and again not from like the x's and o's and the in the math side but from a reality of what you're getting of genuinely money is a stress point for couples big time and if you guys do not see things And again, you don't have to be the same person.

1:40:57She can still be more of a spender. You're more of a saver. For sure. But if you're not aligned on a value system at which you approach money, you're going to have an uphill battle to climb. Yeah. 100%. It makes it harder. And so - 100%. Yes. You're marrying, again, I'm so sorry, but a 37-year-old. Yeah. Like, I just, you can't, you can't live like that your whole life. And so - No, you can't. That's what I would worry about. and that her it's it's a it's a um prioritization of importance in life yes and and that would yeah their values are not aligned what would worry me yeah so no ryan when you get married you don't need your new spouse to bring in the equity that you put it well that no you're all the same when you get married you are together you are one you're choosing a life with a partner so get that off but again i think he's highlighting that and worried about that because of this other stuff i agree.

1:41:50I agree. That's like his guarantee that he's not going to get burned. 100%. 100%. Yeah. Oh, man. Oh, good luck to you. Good luck, Ryan. Again, you got to have these conversations when you're in like before you're engaged, like you got to know who they are financially. Yes. So you don't get this straightened out. I don't know if I'd I don't know if I could do it. I don't know. I could at 30. You know, I don't know if this is her first or second marriage. But at that age, I have I was just telling Rachel in the break, I couldn't be out in these single waters at 40 because the stuff that i could not tolerate yeah is very high the standards go up oh my gosh i don't know if i want to deal with that man i couldn't do it short at 40 at that point i know that's right we got a solid 30 years we could travel the world i don't know yes it's like i can't say it on the air but if you've seen lethal weapon danny glover's famous line i'm getting too old for this yeah you know anyway it feels like keaton is in Chicago, Illinois online too.

1:42:47What's up, Keaton? Hey, how are you guys doing today? We're doing good. How can we help? Awesome. So I am currently 24 years old. I don't have any debt. I don't own a car. And recently just found out from my job that for my new location, I'm going to have to buy a car. And I'm looking for direction on should I lease a car based on my salary? Should I buy one? And just exactly how much should I spend? And I have to make a decision like the next four weeks. So I decided to give you guys a call. Yeah, that's great. Well, you got some time. That's good. How much are you making per year at your job?

1:43:32I'm making$81 ,000 with probably like another$5 ,000 for bonuses. Okay, great. Good job. Do you have any money saved right now? Yeah, so I have like five grand in my checking and then like another 24 ,000 in investments that I can sell off at any moment. Are they single stocks? It's all just the S &P I put all my money into. Great. So I would say, you know, the rule of thumb here is, of course, you don't want the car to be anything with an engine to be any more than half of your take-home pay. And honestly, I mean, you're young, you're starting out. I probably wouldn't even go that high. I would try to keep this frugal.

1:44:12You said you have no debt, right? No, I don't owe any money. No debt. And this$24 ,000, is that your only savings anywhere? The$24 ,000 and the$5 ,000, that$30 ,000, right? That's it? Yeah, then I have another probably like$30 ,000 in retirement, but I don't really want to touch it. Right, we don't need to touch that. Okay, great. So what do you have your eye on? What are you looking at? I mean, if you tomorrow were to choose something, what would you spend? I'm like thinking, I think I want to spend like 15 to 20K. Because if I, in my mind, I'm like, if I buy a cheap car that like is just going to have problems and stuff for, you know, for like 7, 8K, then I'm worried that in like another two years, I'm going to have to buy a new one.

1:44:57I'm going to spend a time. I agree with you. You're not in a position where you need to have a beater. You're not in debt. You've got a nice savings here. I'm with you. I think if you spend 15 or 20 on a car, that's not a bad thing. Yeah, I literally wrote 15 down. I think that's great. What's the commute going to be? Are you driving a lot? It'd probably be like, I'm in Chicago, so the traffic's insane. But probably like, I think it's 13 miles there, 13 miles home. Okay, but just traffic. Okay, I was going to say, because if you're putting a ton of miles on it, that's something also to consider of not just like wearing down a car.

1:45:31But that's not going to be the case for you. You're not getting brand new. You'll get used. Yeah. And leasing, it is the most expensive way to finance a vehicle. Like from a mathematical standpoint, you'd be better off getting a car payment than leasing because of the baked in interest and all of that and all the fees around it. But we don't want you to get a car payment. We want you to stay debt free and cash flow the car. So yeah, so I would put those options off the table. And yeah, and I would just yeah, I'd buy a 1520. I think that's exactly right. 1520 ,000. I think that's great. You'll probably have to pay some taxes on when you're pulling money out.

1:46:06So be thinking about that. And then my next step, Keaton, I think from a financial goal perspective, is I would probably just have some cash available, like three months of expenses. And just putting that in a high-yield savings account. Don't invest it. Just have it over there. Liquid in case you need it as just kind of a standard emergency fund. So, yeah, that would be my goal, I think, in the next few months is to get a car. make sure you got the taxes covered in April if you gotta be paying that and then have a quick savings goal of about three months of expenses just to set aside so if you run into an issue like this like anything in life that you just need some cash that way you're not pulling out your investments because what you're invested in is probably great and the rate of return the past few years has been fantastic so I hate to pull it out of a great index fund but you need the car and at least you have the cash so we'll see it as a blessing

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1:48:28RamseySolutions.com store. Or if you're watching on YouTube or podcasts, you can just click that link in the description to get one today. All right, we've got Anne in San Jose, California. Hi, Anne. How you doing? Hi. Great. How can we help today? Well, I've been listening to Dave Ramsey. I look forward to hearing him every day. And I just would like to have your opinion on how should my younger sister take title to a house that I sent her the money because she didn't have any money. and so I sent her$245 ,000 to purchase the house in South Carolina. And I just want to make sure that if something happens to her, I would get the house so I can get my money back.

1:49:19Oh, okay. So I just want to make sure I got the story straight. You gave the money for the house. She purchased it. And the house is for her to live in? Yes. And then at what point were you hoping to get the title back? Is it just if she were to pass away or was there another circumstance that you would want to get that house back? Well, she's looking for a job. She said if she's looking for a job, she'll start paying me back. I don't really need the money, and I trust her. So if she pays me, fine. The only thing I worry about is if something happens to her, if she was to die suddenly or she's 60 years old, and I would then like to have the money or the house back without her husband getting it or her son.

1:50:10Oh, so you would want her to will it to you over her immediate. Does she know that? Yes. She said she's willing to do a will, but I was told if she does a will, it's going to be in probate and all that. Not if she does a will. Well, it may go through for a little bit, but I mean, yeah, the will, if it's a state-specific will, it'll go through any legal. But I do want to, does the husband know this and the son? Yes. Okay. All right. And they're okay with it because they get to live there. Right. As long as she's alive. Yeah. And then if she were to pass, they'd have, what would you do? Would you kick him out and get the money?

1:50:52Oh, I didn't think about that. I mean. Probably not. That would be a little heavy handed. but my I guess what I'm saying is you said you don't need the cash is that right no okay I don't what are you worth Ann what's your net worth um five six million without my two houses okay so yeah you're doing well um why do you want the money back like it's a lot of money it is but also you're setting up a life for your sister which includes you know her family um and if she passes away and it says in the will that it's titled to you then um yeah you got to think through are you giving them and it needs to be all communicated that needs to be all in the will to be able to say yes within 12 months and aunt ann expects us to find a different place to live and you take the house back, which again, if it's everyone's wishes, that's on you guys.

1:52:01I was wondering if we could do like tenants in common. Do what? Say it again. Tenants in common. Tenants in common. Where they are the tenant of the home, but you have the title. Right. But I don't really, I don't want to be responsible for insurance and taxes she'll take. I don't want those in my name. Oh, boy. If she passes, you don't want those in your name? Or just today? Just today. Just today. I guess I should have think this out a little more. It's complex. I think you have to make a couple decisions. And whatever you decide, you're the captain of the ship, right? Because you paid the money.

1:52:48and it sounds like your sister would go with whatever you said. It sounds like it. It's the husband that you need to make sure also understands. I just think the main thing is whatever it is, it needs to be in writing. If it ends up being the case that she wills it to you, you need to know about that. Yeah, why did you do it in the first place, Ann? Were they in need? Did they need a place? Yes. Okay. Yes. Because of her and her husband can't provide enough income to sustain a home themselves? Right. Yeah. Because her husband was with the military. He's got PST. He's not working. And the money he gets, they can't live on.

1:53:29Okay. Is the house in San Jose, too? No, the house in South Carolina, which is not a community property state. Okay. Understood. I'm trying to think currently I'm just, I'm thinking of the best solution because, and I also don't want this whole idea of, of owing people money, especially within family. It just kind of changes the dynamic. So I'm just thinking out loud here, and I wonder if you tell her, Hey, you don't have to pay me back. I mean, you're worth a lot and you gave this as a gift, but maybe you say instead, I need you to be in charge of the bills of the home, the property tax, all of that.

1:54:14That's what she's in charge of. Because she paid for the home outright. There's no mortgage on it, correct? No mortgage. She bought it cash with the money I sent. Yes, I hear you. So legally, everybody thinks it's hers. Like, you're not on the hook for anything right now. Correct? Correct. So does it hurt you? Like, does it bother you if it becomes a gift? No. It's just that I kind of, my poor husband and I worked all our lives. And now my husband, I just have helped my family. I gave my mother a house, my brother a house. Oh, wow. And handing out houses. Oh, my gosh. How do we get on the list?

1:54:58I know. And Jade and I are great people. We're great people. And I would will it to you. I'm just kidding. So is it that you just feel like I've done too much? Maybe I need to pull back on this? Is that what it is? You're having like a little regret maybe? Not really. The reason I do it is that she rescued old dogs, rescued greyhounds, and they cost a lot of money for vet bills and to feed them. So I'd always help with that. And, you know, anybody who rescues animals to me, we give. You give them a house. You give them money to all these rescue places. Yeah. Oh, wow. Okay. I don't have kids. Anne, we got to work.

1:55:41Okay. What I want you to work on. So I need you and your husband to get on the same page. And if he wants this paid back because he feels like it's off, then that's y 'all. Sure. Y 'all go for it. In the will, it needs to be very clear. Anne gets the house back if she passes. Husband and son have to be out within 12 months. And they have to find the place to live. And we're done with it. Right? Everyone needs to be on the same page. But also, Anne, you sound like a very kind person, but you are on the edge, if not the textbook of an enabler, maybe. Right. Some boundaries. I know. I know. And I want you to work on that, Anne, because solving problems with just money doesn't always work.

1:56:17Even though it feels like it does, it still can leave people in a cycle of irresponsibility. And that's not good for them. And so I love your generous heart and your spirit. And I think it can be taken in such a better, healthier way as a recipient if the recipient is actually doing the work to take care of themselves as well. Right. You pair that with generosity. And it's a really beautiful pairing if you're able to do it, which you are financially, which is so great. But you just need it next time you want to give a house away. Just pump the brakes and just you and your husband need to get on the same page and just think, OK, what's the situation that we want to give to?

1:56:54And again, I love the generous spirit. When you got$6 million net worth, like to be able to do stuff for people, I mean, it is amazing. But you also want to give in a way that it's not a burden for both. Yeah. The pattern of giving houses away. Yeah. Well, it's creating it's a blessing on the front end, but it's creating a burden on the back end. So yes. Thinking through those things is very, very important. And yeah, I'm with you. Borrowing a house is probably not the way to give. you probably want to either give it or some stipulations yeah you need stipulations

1:58:04All right, our scripture and quote of the day. Job 3432 says, teach me what I cannot see, and if I will not do so again. Simon Sinek said, appreciate when things go awry. It makes for a better story to share later. I know that's right. That's funny. That is good. That's like, well, I told Rachel my story that went awry. I was in New York City this weekend. And it's true. When things go awry, it does create a better story. That's right. Anyway, let's go to Lewis in New York City, New York. There we go. What's going on, Lewis? Hi, thank you so much for taking my call. You're welcome. Awesome. What's going on?

1:58:43My question is just a little backstory. I'm 23. I've been hustling nonstop since June after graduating to pay off my debt. Okay. Now I'm struggling with whether hustling so much and not really being home as often, if I'm losing time, quality time with family, while health isn't good. Oh, whose health is not good, yours or somebody in your family? my parents okay i'm sorry is is um is there something immediate happening or is it just kind of like they're just getting older and their health's declining exactly just just age getting older losing that time how old are they 70 okay okay are they again is there like an immediate health concern or or are they generally healthy you just see them getting older generally healthy, but we do have like a time on it.

1:59:40The doctor said like within eight years. Oh, so there's a diagnosis. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay. How much debt do you have left, Louis? So I started with$130 ,000 and I'm down to$90 ,000. Good for you. Okay. And what do you expect if you were to stay on this pace? How long it would take you to pay off that$90 ,000? so it's nice i live with my parents right now i'm a little old to still be there but i'm able to throw about seven thousand a month at the loans amazing be able to have it done by the by next christmas okay okay so well let me say okay yeah um okay so i mean i can't can i just from someone that's not emotionally entangled in the family, just from an outsider's perspective.

2:00:32June, we got July, August, September, October. We have about four months of hustling. You live with your parents. There's possibly in eight years a diagnosis of something. So you do have time. time. So if you stayed on the track that you're on for one year, I think you'll be okay. I mean, and I think you'll probably pay it off sooner than that. But just from like a time perspective, like let me say this, Liz, if you had called and your mom had a diagnosis and she had four months to live, I'd say pause everything. Yes. And do what you got to do with your family like that. You would never regret that.

2:01:17But it doesn't seem necessarily urgent. And I think if you got out of debt faster, it would free you up not only to get out on your own, but also to have the ability to actually save and build wealth and do some things in these next seven years to maybe even be a blessing to them in some way. Yeah. I'm also thinking about, okay, so you're living with them now. Let's pretend that you weren't living with them and you were just, you know, as a 23, right? Yeah. As a 23 year old, you're just in your apartment, right? What does what does quality time look like? Is it, we do a family dinner every Sunday?

2:01:55Is it, I want to challenge that because living with them now, I'm like, you see them every day. You probably see them in the morning. You may be probably see them when they come home or when you come home. So I'm wondering what is it that, what's the specific thing that you're like, man, I'm missing out on that because that might, maybe there's a remedy there sooner than later. So if it's like a family dinner thing, maybe instead of family dinner, we do a thing on Saturday. You know what I'm saying? Is it something that you can shift around where you still feel like I'm doing the special thing with them that I feel like I'm missing out on?

2:02:25Or is it just in general, I'm just used to seeing them more throughout the day? Because then I would just challenge that and say, hey, if you didn't have this debt, I'd be like telling you to move out anyway and start your life and go visit them when it makes sense. Does that make sense? Yeah, that does. And that's been like part of the question is I feel like I should be moved out already. but they're not rushing me to move out and my mom's always saying what's the rush for you have no bills here we pay for your food and whatnot but it also i listen to you guys a lot and it dwindle my growth as a man sure yeah and i do wonder are they are they questioning how how how hard you're working yes okay they're putting some guilt on like a dog i what does that mean How many hours a week?

2:03:17Probably over 100. Oh, wow. I make about 110 to 120 ,000. Okay. What are you doing? Is it a bunch of side hustles put together or one main job? I have a main job that makes 70K base. Okay. And then I do a bunch of side hustles. I do freelance work. I'm a dog sitter. I do Uber. Yeah. I teach at my alma mater. Golly, Louis. Well done. Way to go. Yeah. Yeah. And I wonder, is some of this feeling like I need to pull back because of my parents' health and spending quality time with them, that's coming from them more so than you? Yeah. So there is an interesting season of life that I think happens naturally if you, and again, not that this is right or wrong, Luce, I'm not saying this at all, but if you're out of college and you get married, there's a natural break that happens.

2:04:11or there should be, right? Or you get a job in a different city and your first job is in Dallas. You're like, I gotta move. Independence. There's some natural breaks that happen and when those don't naturally happen, which again, it's not a bad thing. It's not that you're staying near your parents or still working. None of that is wrong, but there's a harder dynamic to happen for a natural break to happen because it kind of naturally sets back into the norm of what you were like at 15. 15 year old Lewis versus 23 year old Lewis. And there's a difference there. And yeah, 15 year old Lewis is at dinner every night.

2:04:47You know, you're around expectation. Yeah. And I think too, for some parents, and I don't want to put this on yours, but there's a there's a codependence there that you're around and you're there and they need you and all of this. And I'm still vacuuming the house. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm like, man, that's a hard do you have? Do you have good friends in your life or any like older men that are not family in your life? Not outside of work. Okay. I just wonder if there's like someone that knows you well to help kind of guide this. Because I feel like this next season for you is really important to gain that independence.

2:05:22And there's going to probably be some harder, uncomfortable, sad conversations with your parents. And listen, I have a son and I joke all the time that Charles can live with me forever because I just, it's so great but when rubber meets the road I'm like no I want him to go out and become his own person so I'm like there is a natural bent towards a mom and her son absolutely but the fact that they're putting a lot of weight on you Lewis in this and and that makes me sad because you're gonna have to untangle that yourself um and there's gonna have to yeah be some harder conversations of some boundaries of what's good for you and not what's good for us as a family unit at this point in life, right?

2:06:06I just think that there's a... Yeah, the unit changes over time. It morphs and it changes. And it's all for good because you have to be able to go out in life and do what they've done, which is they started a family and they built on what they had. And you need to be able to go out and do that too. And I honestly would probably challenge you to do that sooner. Like you don't need to have paid off this$90 ,000 in debt before you go live on your own. I would say to rent, like you can't go buy something because you're in debt, but you can go rent an apartment and have a roommate and kind of get that taste of independence.

2:06:43And I think at the core of this, this is no longer a money question. I think it was more about you feeling good about going out and being Louis. And, you know, yeah, our parents age and they get older and the time shrinks. and we figure out what that looks like in our life as adults with other things that we're balancing. And that's kind of like the facts of life. It's just kind of the way it happens. Yeah, you're not a bad son, Louis. Nothing's on fire. But I would start, I'm with Jade, I would start kind of pushing some changes for you, right? And this is all for you. And you're not doing anything wrong.

2:07:22So hear me say that. Everything that you laid out, I'm like, nothing here is wrong. That's right. Well, that does it for this hour of the show. Thanks for hanging out with us. And remember, there's only ultimately one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.