309: Abena Anim-Somuah & Margie Nomura

27:04So cool. Which is like, it's like food and science. And I just, it kind of healed my heart. I was like a kid in the candy store there. But Modernist Cuisine is this publication that was started by Nathan, I'm going to butcher his name. But he was like an OG at Microsoft, but had this deep passion for food and research. and couldn't find the things that he wanted. So naturally, he started to publish volumes. They're sick. Yeah. We have a set at home at my parents' house, and there are these volumes about the fundamentals of cooking. And so they're working on a book, I will not say. I think it's out there so you can Google it.

27:45But we got to see a lot of that process. And it's just so fascinating how these scientists think about, you know it's just a cake but how do you look at a cake and think of like all the components as they're working together like what type of baking soda do you use what kind of granules and stuff like that so yeah no I think it's so fascinating um and I'm very behind on my New Yorker reading so this is a good a good way to get me back in there with this Taco Bell article yeah I'll drop you a link yeah I love hearing about what you'd like to see more of on the podcast and I'm curious like talking about food media more broadly um what would you like to see more of yeah no that's a great question I think we need to see more process I think I think a lot of friends are feeling quite fatigued over Instagram especially food friends I think there's a lot of pressure to be perfect and a lot of pressure to kind of figure out what style does and doesn't work it's almost like someone can post a really good video and then it's like the algorithm brings you down or you post like something that you did like just with your eyes closed and it does really well and it's hard for a lot of creatives to really know what is successful when you you can't control how people are seeing your stuff and so I think seeing more process more writing I love reading I think that's it's been a huge joy of mine I've really loved how a lot more people are also going on to sub stack so seeing like a lot I love Alicia Kennedy's sub stack um Nicole Nicola Lamb with Kitchen Project So I brought back my Substack partly for that sort of inspiration.

29:17And yeah, I think more writing, more process orientation and just more fun. I think like people should have more fun on social media and also more appreciation for like different sectors of food coming together. Like I love collaborations. I love seeing collaborations like more artists painting croissants or more winemakers doing more pop ups and tastings and things like that, too. More artists painting croissants. Definitely. Yes. So tell me a little bit about your sub stack that you just brought back. Yeah. So I've this sub stack has lived so many lives, but I obviously I'm obsessed with food and I also love to share food.

29:55I gatekeep to a certain extent. It's more of like a vibe check than a gatekeep, I would say. and so my sub stack is called simply your friend and food and I just love sharing so it's it's part like the things that I've done that I'm really excited about so like recipe things that I'm testing out at home things I love to riff on and like links that I love so I'm still figuring out the format it comes out on Sundays I've realized Sunday is a day that I enjoy writing and yeah and so there's just sort of different things and I'm hoping to grow it just not in like oh I need like 50 bajillion subscribers by the end of the year but more just like I love sharing food with people and I feel like I've gotten to experience so much food in such unique ways and I want people to feel a connection to that so yeah definitely more to come yeah I love the sound of that and I think like it reminds me of what you said earlier about traveling and how you literally have to eat I think that recommendations for recipes or techniques or just concepts or something that we all could use more of just because there are sometimes I feel like all I do is do the dishes and cook yeah this is like all I have time to do but I feel like anyone that can have you like be thinking about things differently it's worthwhile yeah and also like I think something that I'm really priding myself on is honesty I think there's so much content and there's so much reviewing out there and I want to be like look everything that comes into this newsletter I have tried like even if I'm getting I am not getting paid for anything or any sponsors yet but everything that goes in the newsletter, I have like put to mouth because there are a lot of sub stacks where it's like, okay, you're recommending a gift guide, but how many of these things have you tried?

31:29Or you're recommending this, but how many things are you really like, have you really gone to experience? And so it's almost like, let me be your experience concierge. So to put it in like a light way. And these are things I generally enjoy. If I don't like it, it's not going to be in there. So yeah. Also, I'm always looking for ideas. So if there's something you want me to go experience, please let me know. Hit her line. Yes, it's open. I love that. And to close today, I want to play a little like rapid fire taste check with you. So I'll give you some categories. You can tell me what comes to mind.

31:58Okay, let's do it. Okay. Go to bodega snack. Oh, a chopped cheese with a lot of spicy mayo. Nice. Favorite podcast? I'm going to be boring and say The Daily. I like to know my news. Yeah. It's important. Favorite cookbook? Ooh. Hmm. It's a tie between Salt, Fat, Acid, Heat and I will say The Food Lab by Kenji. Nice. Both by Salt. Yeah. Okay. Favorite food TV show? I'm a barefoot contestant girl through and through. She's the best. She's everything. She's everything to me. Yeah. Shout out Aina. Okay. Most underrated New York City restaurant? I would say Wu's Wonton King. I think it's so hard. I have a really big group of college friends that are blessedly still in the city.

32:52And sometimes it's really hard to find a place that will fit a party of eight without you booking in advance. And if you're smart about it, you have a friend go at like 4 p.m. to get a spot at 9. You bring some bottles of wine. There's no better place in the city to just eat with homies. Yeah, I just went to a 30-person 30th birthday at Woo's last weekend, which was kind of insane. But they made it happen. I mean, they pre-booked. But the fact that you can do that at a restaurant in Manhattan, I think is kind of special. And also not like I'm someone that doesn't love like expensive birthday parties.

33:23I think it's nice to be able to have everyone come and be comfortable. And I think that's a solid place where the food's really good. You can be a little extravagant, like get a giant pig or a bunch of giant crab legs. But still, like if you just want to order a bunch of rice and meat dishes still, that's no problem, too. Completely. And they do like kick you out when your time is up. So we did our cake in the park across the street, which I would just say is a hot tip. That worked very well. Yes. No matter the time of year. It's also not that cold, unfortunately. Yeah. Okay. I know we talked about Mexico City, but favorite Mexico City restaurant?

33:56Oh, I'm going to have to say Contramar. It hits good Sunday lunch. Good friends are in town. Bring the parents. Impress someone. Perfect. Okay. Most used piece of kitchen equipment? My microplane. Yeah. I think I can use that for every single meal for the most part. Definitely. And to close, a fictional food that you most want to eat? Anything Studio Ghibli. Give me it all. Yeah. The Spirited Away. Yes. I would turn into a pig for sure. Yeah. That buffet goes crazy. Yeah. Well, I'll manifest that for both of us. Yes. Vina, thanks so much for coming on. Oh, thank you so much, Eliza. This was such a treat.

34:41Margie Nabura, welcome to This Is Taste. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here. Oh, well, you know what? We rarely get to talk to chefs and content creators, writers, journalists in the UK. So I want to like I'm going to be a little selfish and we're going to tap in about what's happening in London and throughout the region and the country. But but first, I wanted to get a sense of your background. Tell me a bit about what was food growing up for you? Absolutely. So I think I was very lucky looking back that I grew up in a family that really cared about food. My mum is an amazing cook.

35:16And so food was always this really important element, but not just the food itself. It was the whole process of sitting down to meals together. And I think that's where I learned that food is so crucial, not in terms of just needing it for sustenance and being this amazing thing that we can enjoy, but it's bringing people together and the conversations that you can have over food and how important that is, which actually, when I think about it, is like the very premise of what my podcast is. It's the stories behind the food that we love and why it's so important to us. so I have these lovely memories of being with my mum in the kitchen, podding fresh peas, making scones, licking the cake bowl as I'm sure lots of people can remember from when they were little but my mum, there were six of us on my mum's side, six children so it was quite a lot of children to cook for so we had all the classic you know lasagnas and shepherd's pies and things that probably slightly easier to make for a crowd.

36:21But then I don't know, she was just such a good cook that there are a few standout dishes that I still make to this day. And when I think about them, I just feel so nostalgic about them. Did you ever get a sense growing up that you were like living under this weight of British food being bad? And I say this with all respect. My grandfather was born in Liverpool. I have a British family and really as Americans, we have this like this like thought still to this day, like maybe it goes back to Monty Python and how food is bad in the UK. Did you did you feel that pressure? I think when you're a child, you're not really aware of any of that.

37:01But definitely as I got older, I mean, I think it's very unfair. I think it started out being quite fair. that that was what people believed but but I think now to say that is is really very unfair because it's so varied and I think I think if people are saying that they haven't really been here and they haven't actually experienced what British food is because British food is great and there's so much to celebrate and so many traditions within that like if I you know one of the things that my mum used to do without fail and she was very militant about was a Sunday lunch And I feel like that's quite a British thing.

37:39Having a roast lunch every Sunday, always roast potatoes. In winter, it would be, you know, a delicious roast chicken with wintry leeks and cannellini beans, homemade bread sauce. And then in the summer, the same occasion, it would always be this special event, but it might be roast chicken with roast potatoes and a gorgeous salad instead. so I think no there's so much to celebrate about about British food and yeah I feel I feel quite upset but yeah well it's an extreme tell if you're like an uncultured person if you have that take that British food is is quote-unquote bad because obviously it's it's further from the truth and really if you visit you see the multicultural nature of the country but also how you know know, some of the best chefs in the world have been trained in Europe and are cooking there.

38:34Yeah. I love the Sunday roast and tying food to a time of day and a week. Reminds me of, I'm a Jewish, so like the Shabbat tradition of Friday night. And it's something very special when everyone in culture can come together and have a meal around a specific time. So you were every Sunday, were you getting family together? How does the Sunday roast work? yeah so it's just well it's it's either Sunday lunch or Sunday supper and I think different families do it differently but for us it was always Sunday lunch and there's something really comforting now just as a grown-up even if I'm not with my mom I know exactly what she's doing on a Sunday at lunchtime and I find that's just a really comforting lovely routine like I think someone I was speaking to someone recently about how how routines like that throughout childhood that your parents sort of instill in you, it actually gives you this huge sense of loyalty.

39:34Like your parents are teaching you about more than just a delicious food or an occasion. They're actually teaching you about loyalty and what you can expect from them in more ways than just that isolated incident, which I thought was a really interesting way to think about it. But yeah, that's just what it's, But that's how we've always done it in our family. And it's something that I now am doing with my husband and our children. And it just, yeah, it feels like a really special thing that I actually look forward to it all week. Yeah, no, definitely. It's to have those traditions codified in your life is special.

40:12You studied at the world-renowned Ballymaloo Cookery School in Ireland. But before that, you were at Oxford. and I'd like to get a sense of what is Oxford food like. I know that Oxford has secret societies and dinner societies and dining and food plays a role at the university. What was it like? Well, Oxford was amazing and I felt very lucky to be there at the time. I mean, this is a generalized statement, but I think so often late teenagers, early 20s you don't fully appreciate what you're what you have if that makes sense so you know you hear so much about Oxford when you're growing up and it sort of has this magical element to it and then you get there and you know how lucky you are to be there but you just sort of soon take it for granted so I definitely when I look back now I I definitely have that slight feeling over it in terms of the food I mean we were students so going out to eat at amazing restaurants all the time wasn't really something that we were doing.

41:20But what it did have was this amazing sandwich culture. So sandwiches played a really important part in student life. And there were these amazing sandwich shops scattered all over the town. And they'd all have huge queues outside. Just like absolutely amazing creations, like not a boring sandwich in sight. Yeah, are we talking like Donner kebab? Are we talking about like ham and cheese, a jambon bear? What's on the menu? We're talking like bespoke, like a sandwich bar. So you can have any kind of filling that you want. It would be, well, you'd get different ones. So there was one amazing one where it would be like delicious chicken with pesto and then all fresh salad.

42:04But you choose exactly what you want. And then there was another one really near our college that was more like a delicatessen. but these like amazing like the best baguettes you've ever tasted just like perfectly crispy on the outside gorgeous in the middle and not too thick so sort of perfect for a mouthful and then it would just be filled with like the best the best cheeses the best hams um and we talk about them I mean it's I'm such a dinosaur it was actually quite a long time ago that I finished university but we still talk about those sandwiches all the time they were so good and the hardest thing was just deciding where you were going to go that day like which sandwich shop you're going to visit well as a reminder to our listeners uh the earl of sandwich uh born and bred in the uk the sandwich potentially invented in your country well there you go how can people say that um british food is bad yeah right the sandwich we did yeah i love that story the mythology of the sandwich and that guy who was i think he was playing cards and needed something to eat and and and it called his uh probably servant is a word they probably use and said give me some food and they ended up wrapping some mutton or something meat and bread and there you go the Earl of Sandwich namesake what a great invention I'm a huge sandwich fan so yeah I'm very grateful for that day that he did that tell me about the Ballymaloo cookery school what's what's that like you know it's one of the world's you know most renowned spots and I know some of uh You know, our greatest chefs in America have trained there.

43:36Abra Behrens comes to mind, a great chef in West Michigan. She was there. Tell me about it. Oh, it's just amazing. So I guess there's like a bit of a story as to how I ended up there, because I actually was training to be a lawyer. So when I left Oxford, I thought that, I don't know, having gone somewhere like that, I should go and do something very serious and carry a briefcase and wear a suit. and I tried I did try quite hard to become a lawyer I wouldn't necessarily recommend getting a master's in law as a good route to becoming a chef but it got it got me to where I was eventually and yeah so I had a decision to make as to whether I was going to carry on doing law or whether I was going to focus on my you know true passion which is food and I went to Islay which is this amazing island off the west coast of Scotland.

44:31And it's so beautiful. And it's one of those places where you just feel a million miles away from anything else. And when I was there, I just had this, I don't know, it sounds a bit woo woo, which I don't think I am in general, but I just had this just overwhelming feeling of why am I trying so hard to do something that I really don't care about law. It would only ever be a job. And yet food is all I've ever really cared about. And I love to cook and I love to try different dishes and it's, you know, it consumes my whole life. So why would I not try and make that, you know, we're at work more than we're not at work.

45:07So it makes sense for that to be what I did for work. But having decided that, I really wanted to go to Ballymaloo. So I rang them and I told them this beautiful story of my epiphany and they said, oh, well, that's great. But we're oversubscribed. We've got, you know, hundred people on the waiting list you'll have to come this time next year um which was devastating in that moment and yet an hour later they rang back and they said this never happens but just after we put the phone down someone came into the office and they've dropped out and if you can come on a plane tomorrow morning you can come wow proud by fire at the highest level honestly jump right in but it's just um it's the most amazing place so for anyone who doesn't know it's this it's um an an incredible cookery school set on an organic farm.

45:57So it's really immersive. You stay on site in these little cottages. So you get up really early in the morning and they set you to work making stock and, you know, making bread and all the things that the students are going to need throughout the day. And then you're cooking all morning. And then in the afternoon, you're basically at lectures watching people cook what you're going to make the following day. and it's just uh it's just it's amazing it's only three months so it's quite intensive and it's definitely a jumping board for what you want to do afterwards as they they say all the time when you're there if you really want to take cooking seriously then um you need to go and work in a restaurant and consolidate everything that you've learned whilst you're here but it definitely it felt really exciting for me personally because it was really nice to realize that I was really passionate about something and having spent time reading geography at Oxford where I just you know I missed I missed a lot of lectures and I just wasn't fully engaged yeah you found your love you found your real love yeah which is such an exciting thing and I think lots of people find that when they go to Ballymalook it's just such a special place and the food the food in Ireland itself is amazing the produce um and yeah it's just such a beautiful place to spend time so i was just in london and i just want to go over what i what i ate so i want you to give me a sense did i do it right what am i missing and follow up is gonna be like what can't we miss so i went to rambutan oh my god just love love that new spot in burrow market and we've had cynthia on um i St.

47:36John Bread, great. Obviously lunch there. The Beagle Bake, which is, you know, the brick beef or the salt beef bagel shop that is like a close cousin to Katz's, I would say, in New York. Oh, do you think, would you rate it up there with that on a level? It's a very unique thing. So this salted beef, let's get into that. I was new to it. So basically it's an uncured salted beef on top of a bagel smeared with a very spicy mustard. um you could say yeah it's kind of like like corned beef in a way um no i wouldn't put it up there to be honest it wasn't wasn't on the level cats because cats is pretty much the top of the mountain well yeah but hard yeah but i liked it i like and that that jewish section of brick lane is really interesting to me what do you think about it uh that that dish yeah i mean i've been to cats and so and like as you say that's a high that's a high bar so i was just wondering where it's that in comparison to that but no i agree delicious i think that as a concept is always going to be delicious um i mean i'm sure you can get bad ones but uh but yeah nothing can compare to cat's deli can it and so i went to brat and i had i thought that was like an outstanding meal like all wood fired open fired cooking is brat still so good in your eyes or are we moved on from Brat.

48:58No, no, we'd never move on from Brat. Brat's incredible. No, it sounds like you, how long were you in London for? 48 hours. I went pretty hard, I must say. Yeah, you did pretty well, I think. Yeah, and then I went to Jolene, too, and Jolene Bakery, to me, cool-ass merch, for sure, so that's one, but second, wow, exceptional. The one on the east side that I went to was nice, so. Yeah, really nice. Oh, no, you did really well. you fitted a lot in. So Margie, what did I miss though? I want to get your take. What's what's happening right now with the food scene in London? Wow. I'm not sure about the food scene in general, but I have, I have been to some amazing places recently.

49:39Um, I don't know. Have you ever been to Giaconi? No, I haven't. What is that? Oh, it's, it's incredible. It was started by the chef called Ravinda Bogle about five years ago. And she describes the food as Asian fusion food, but it's sort of Asian comfort food with British and African and Middle Eastern twists. And it's so incredibly good. I think one of their claim to fame is that they're the only carbon neutral independent restaurant. But what that means is that they've got this amazing relationship with a local farm. And so the produce is incredible. And she's also she's a brilliant food writer as well.

50:17And I've followed her for years. But she's so creative and really delicate with her cooking. And that was that was a standout meal. It was amazing. I think it's actually one of Stanley Tucci's favorite places to eat. Oh, wow. Yeah. Local. He's living there these days. Good old Stanley. Yeah. And and and also in general, is there like is there a trend happening right now with style of service or with it with like is there like a big cuisine or culinary movement that you're seeing? um I don't know whether something interesting that I think is happening that I've been reading about a lot and just observing is I think African food is beginning to have a moment which feels really exciting because I don't know about you but I feel like it's definitely been underrepresented underrepresented in the UK for a long time and that feels like it's changing like there's um Ikoi, which is, it's got a Michelin star.

51:15I'm going there next month. So I haven't been, but I've heard amazing things and that the foundations for that are all sub-Saharan West African, and it sounds amazing. So I think that's something that's really exciting. It's definitely getting, as a cuisine, it's getting more airspace and more words written about it, which, yeah, it's always good to see something like that happening, I think. Yeah, same in New York. You know, sub-Saharan African cuisine is certainly getting more attention from media, which thankfully it's been long overdue. Restaurant in Brooklyn called Department of Culture is a place run by Nigerian chef.

51:49And I feel there's just we're just starting this era. So I'm happy to hear that's happening in London as well. Let me ask you, what was the best thing you ate this week? The best thing I ate this week? There's a really amazing restaurant near me called Chet's, which I actually, I need to look it up because I think the guy actually started in LA. And it's amazing. It's fusion food. So you have like an amazing burger, but it's spicy. It's got heat. And they do an amazing fried crispy rice salad, which is super spicy. it's got all the contrast of flavors going on and and textures and it i that rice crispy rice salad at chet's is one of the best things i've had for ages delicious chet's is on the list um have you been to d 'ambrosie do you know andrew d 'ambrosie he has a a restaurant in chelsea um and he's a former he's an american chef he was on top chef season like three do you know about this place no i don't i feel like i should do you should know and i'm just going to shout it out now i went and visited him and i should have mentioned that on my on my visits but andrew is um he's doing he's got a place in the cotswolds that's like his main home base but he's got his place near the chelsea high street and it's really you know he's such a tactical chef and in the best way no that doesn't read delicious but it's it's beautiful food that's so smart he's doing um a fried chicken sandwich that i felt was exceptional and just like the amount of salads that he's putting out there in the case um there's it's really exceptional work um and forgetting some of the other dishes he's doing but yeah just wanted to give him a shout yeah there's another amazing young chef um called jackson boxer um and he's got a beautiful restaurant which is just off portobello it's called orise and the focus is definitely it's seafood heavy but like the most amazing quality and he's just he's he's like i think he's a real I mean, he's not a rising star because I always think that's actually quite insulting.

53:54Like he's already he's already arisen. He's a star. But yeah, his food's absolutely amazing. And I think he's now opening a few different. Well, he has different restaurants of different names and he's got one in the countryside somewhere. But yeah, he's definitely one to look out for. Jackson Boxer. Jackson Boxer. Well, this is great. We're giving our listeners a sense of what's happening in London right now. Let me ask you, who do you read in British food media? I feel like there's definitely been a real swell of quality journalism coming out of the UK. It wasn't always that way. But I'm curious who you're into right now.

54:31That's a good question. I mean, I read cookbooks kind of like they're novels. So and I spend a lot of time researching all the guests that I've got on the podcast. That's like a really important aspect to me. So I get really engrossed in whichever food writer I'm interviewing. so I've just interviewed Diana Henry who I don't know is Diana Henry very well known in the US? Yeah for sure we've published Diana Henry's books for years and definitely has a following I think some of the imports to the US have different levels of success like Yota Matalangi is like obviously the most successful recently same with Jamie Oliver but yeah she's great yeah She's amazing and I think she's written 13 cookbooks now But I love her food writing.

55:19I love her recipes. I love her way with words. And the same with, I mentioned Giaconi in the restaurant with Ravinda Bogle, but I always really enjoy reading anything that she's written. But in terms of like food media, there's a really great food newsletter in the UK called Vittles. Have you come across Vittles? Absolutely. I was hoping you would mention Vittles with Jonathan Nunn, who I've interviewed several times. I had dinner with him when I was in London a few weeks ago. So let me ask you about Vittles. I think it's been a huge moment for food media right there with Vittles. Yeah, it definitely has.

55:53A newsletter that gives voices to people who might traditionally have been ignored by old school food media and just talking about really interesting topics that wouldn't be published anywhere else. I think it's definitely, it feels very exciting. Like it's I think people have not necessarily in terms of the content, but in terms of the importance of of what they're doing. People have compared it to the beginning of Lucky Peach. And it does it does feel like a big a big moment in the food media space. Yeah, the scope, too, is expanded. And now there's a lot of local coverage and restaurants in the UK, but also the big sweeping features and packages that Jonathan and team are doing.

56:33It's it's great work. And I'll definitely link to that in the show notes. Let me ask you about your own home cooking. I have two questions. One, you know, what do you like to make when you have only 30 minutes? So I've been a chef for over a decade now. But, you know, when you come back from a really long day standing on your feet cooking for other people, the last thing you want to do is spend ages cooking. So I actually think I've mastered the art of very quick, delicious dishes. And I think that's what we all need on a weeknight to the point where I'm actually about to launch a newsletter around that very topic.

57:09Just easy weeknight recipes that you can make when you're short on time and that just maximum results for minimal effort. So it's my favorite kind of cooking, I think. And my favorites being maybe a butter roasted salmon served with giant couscous that you've tossed with plenty of herbs, really garlicky bursting olive oil tomatoes, and then maybe a dollop of tzatziki on the top. That's pretty hard to beat. or a very good steak just cooked perfectly pink, basted with lots of garlic and rosemary and then served with something like a really quick cannellini bean mash and some lemon chili tender stem broccoli.

57:52Oh, the mash. We got to the mash portion of the program. I'm really happy you brought up the mash because the mash is something that I think we all love when it's done well and has a nice amount of butter in it. And I love that you're roasting salmon and putting a sauce on it, creme fraiche or any kind of tajiki or yogurt sauce to me is a great way to you know make a salmon that maybe is like mid to maybe not so great in quality which does happen all the time I cook it myself I'll get a frozen piece but it makes it really good when you can add a little nice sauce to it I think that's something like when I was cooking in the restaurant we always had whether it's creme fraiche or yogurt loosened with a little bit of lemon juice and seasoned and that drizzled over salad, salmon, grilled meat, whatever, like it can completely elevate a dish and it's such a simple little trick.

58:44Yep, it's really smart. Okay, so Mark, tell me when you want to ball out and you have a dinner party, which is certainly part of your show is a guest dinner party and all of the beauty that goes into a dinner party. Tell me, what are you making when you want to really just, you know, go big? okay well my dinner parties always tend to be quite relaxed and informal affairs and I I like doing a dinner party where I bring lots of dishes to the table and then everyone helps themselves so there's always going to be a main course but then there's always a whole load of really gorgeous salads and sauces and everyone can kind of make their own plate that's the kind of food that I just I love to eat and it's the kind of food that I I love to serve I'm definitely very guilty of being an over feeder so there's always a lot of food yeah um but something something like a slow cooked shoulder of lamb i just think that's quite hard to beat when it's melting off and melting and falling off the bone maybe served with something like dauphinoise potatoes buttery greens a garlicky yogurt and then something a bit earthy like a beetroot and balsamic salad just to counterbalance all of that richness I love potatoes I love that you bring that up that is if you get the mandolin going you've got a nice amount of butter in your fridge you're going to be set with that dish it's a good one and and those are also great things like I definitely I have everything prepared the day before um so yeah definitely things that you can get ahead with and then then it's just a case of putting it in the oven or like even with the lamb you just want to get that whole thing done you can shred it pop it in the fridge and then when you're ready you just gently reheat I think people are scared of reheating food but we shouldn't be scared because you know when you're working in a restaurant you know say you're serving a risotto you've you've prepped that earlier in the day and it's 95 % cooked and then when someone orders it you're just finishing it beautifully in the pan so I think people shouldn't be afraid of like Reheating is like a bit of a dirty word and a bit unappetizing.

1:00:50No, no. You're just making your life easier. It's the trick. The same with roast potatoes. You want to get them done and then you just warm them through when you need them. And then there's no stress. Okay, let me ask you about that. When you roast potatoes ahead of time, how are you storing them? Just cover them, put them in the fridge. Like nothing bad will happen. Bring them out to room temperature, really nice hot oven. And yeah, you'll be good to go. I do that all the time. Get that oven to like 450. Make sure it's clean so you don't smoke up your house. And then the reheating of potatoes is definitely super chill.

1:01:23You just also never microwave potatoes. Please. No. Please. You can have a very sad potato if you microwave it. Yeah. On This Is Taste, we asked guests about their discerning taste. So to close this interview, here's a little rapid fire, fast and furious taste check. Are you ready, Margie? I don't know. Okay, yes, I can do this. I'm ready. I know you can. The best AM pastry with coffee. An almond croissant. The best dessert? It has to be tiramisu. Oh, nice. I mean, what makes a good tiramisu? Is it the booze or is it the cream? Not too much booze. The cream is obviously very important. And I don't want the fingers too soggy.

1:02:01Agree hard. I think they need to be crisp and you need to actually realize your fingers so they don't disintegrate, you know. Yes, yeah. Totally agree. The best bread, hands down? Ooh, I think that's got to be a freshly baked baguette. like a really, really good one. I think that's hard to beat. Real hard. Your favorite dinner party dish to make as a host? The slow roasted lamb I've already talked about or something like my go-to is roasted chicken thighs with the bone in, the skin on, lots of salt on the top, get them really nice and crispy. They just, they never let me down. I'm so glad you brought that up.

1:02:36They're pretty much idiot proof when you get like that high fat content cut, like the thigh and the bone, always on the bone, not the boneless, if you can help it. You can like definitely mess those up, like cook them like 30 minutes over and they still taste great. Yeah, they'll still be perfect. They're so good. And you can just serve them with so many different things. Yeah, they, as I said, they never let you down. Never let you down. Your favorite dinner party dish to bring as a guest? I think maybe it would be a pudding or dessert. Because I think that's something that can stress people out when they're hosting and maybe they haven't always got time for.

1:03:09So taking maybe a big tray of brownies, that always goes down well. Brownies. Wow. I feel that is like truly one of the most American pastries around. Yeah. Do you think so? Maybe not. If you want to claim ownership, let's go. Let's do it. No, no. That probably, yeah, you're probably right. No, I'm kidding. I have no idea. I could be like, it could be something that was created in like, you know, in like in Manchester, you know, back in the day. No, I think you are probably right. But I think like a little, like a canapé-sized brownie filled with white chocolate chunks, just like nice and squidgy in the middle and crispy on the top.

1:03:49Just perfection. Soigné, chef. Wow. What a brownie. Dang. The absolute essential bottle of booze to have on hand. I love a gin and tonic, so it would have to just be a really good bottle of gin. I love Hendrix. Nice. the Hendrix choice I like that one not Plymouth okay that's good too that no no no it's it's a good choice the most overrated piece of kitchen equipment oh the most overrated okay I don't have an air fryer but it's all anyone's talking about and I have to wonder are they worth the hype but then I kind of want one so I don't know um but yeah maybe an air fryer mileage will vary with the air fryer.

1:04:33I'll just say that if you if you literally don't have an oven, it's amazing. If you like are on the road, you just have a plug. It's amazing. But you know, that's true. I hadn't thought about it. Yeah, that would be very useful. Yeah, totally. Super useful. The most underrated piece of kitchen equipment. I think it's got to be my microplane. I use my microplane every day for lemon zest, parmesan, garlic. Just it's out all the time. Love a good microplane. Great call. We've actually asked this question to dozens and we've never had the microplane come up and oh you haven't but i use it myself all the time and i feel so connected to my microplane or that's like a proper noun what's the is it called a grader oh yeah you're right it's like a the hoover the dyson right exactly um yeah no they've really captured that market they sure only know it as the microplane no it's it's a great tool um do you like it do you what do you what do you use it for let's just go there what's the utility there well do you know i think like this is a very good tip when you're doing when you're grating garlic on a microplane you don't even have to bother peeling it if you just start grating it the skin just comes off which is a very good time-saving hack but yeah like i said i mean zesting citrus uh grating parmesan like i mean garlic i use so much garlic in my cooking up so you love garlic yeah grated garlic is the is the jam and not having to deal with knife cuts yeah totally yeah totally totally a couple more your favorite recent cookbook discovery?

1:06:00Wow, I'm very lucky that I do get sent a lot of amazing new cookbooks because of my job. So I feel a bit spoiled in that sense. But I've actually recently been going back over old favorites, reading lots of early days of Nigel Slater. And I'm reading Nora Ephron for the millionth time, which I just never, never get bored of. But there's something about the classics and the old school way of writing that I just it just really appeals to me yeah uh what about a classic cookbook is there one that you just always go to um I I wouldn't say I like I don't use this for cooking a lot but I do refer to it a lot for its it's uh writing and that's got to be Nigella's How to Cook I think if I could pick one cookbook that meant a lot to me.

1:06:50I think that was the first cookbook that I really read where it just, her way of writing really resonated with me. And I realized that all of the things that I thought about food, I wasn't alone. And actually there was this whole world out there and that felt really exciting. So I think that book will always be very important to me. Yeah, Nigella, her chops, her writing skill and style is underrated. You know, we know her as this personality, Friends of Bourdain, all that stuff. But man, great, terrific writer. Absolutely. Amazing writer. Yeah. Last question. You invented this, your country, men, your culture, the sandwich.

1:07:31We're back to where we started. Your favorite sandwich of all time. Matt, this is such a hard question. And it's one that I ask every guest. So I feel very hypocritical to say that it's hard, but it is. I love all sandwiches. And so I have a lot of favorites, but I think if I had to pick one, I would pick the BLT because it's just one of the first proper sandwiches that I remember having. And I feel like the BLT was a bit of a gateway sandwich for me and it just opened up this whole world of delicious sandwiches. And I think the secret to a really good BLT is a very garlicky aioli and then just a little bit of basil in there.

1:08:11Yeah, so fresh basil leaves. Yeah, the BBBLT. I was going to say, we're adding a letter there, but to Italianify the BLT is certainly not a bad choice. Absolutely love it. Margie Nomura, thank you so much for joining This Is Taste. Thank you so much for having me.

1:08:34This Is Taste is hosted by Matt Rodbard and me, Eliza Abarbanel. The show is produced by Shalia Harris and Pat Stango and edited by Clayton Gumbert. Theme music by Steve Rydell. Visit Taste Online at tastecooking.com and make sure to subscribe to our newsletter for updates on all cool things happening.