408: Great British Baking with Benjamina Ebuehi

0:28This episode is brought to you by Resi and American Express. Especially when I'm thinking of my main audience, which you are based in the UK, there are lots of things that I just know that they will get. And it's just really comforting to make recipes that people can connect to in that way. So yeah, I really love to, when I can, just kind of add in those elements of nostalgia and homeliness that people love. This is Taste. I'm your host, Eliza Barbanel.

0:59Benjamina Ibuechi is a London-based recipe developer and food stylist who rose to fame as a quarter-finalist in the 2016 Great British Bake Off. She's also the author of three baking cookbooks, including the new release, All Bring Dessert. And it's so fun to have her on the show to talk about the differences between London and New York City bakeries, developing recipes, and more.

1:29Benjamina Abuehi, this is Taste. Thank you for coming on the podcast. Thank you so much for having me. So excited. I have to admit something to you, which I almost decided not to say, but I used to fall asleep watching specifically your season of makeup as a comfort thing when I was having insomnia. So I feel like your voice is very calming to me. I love that so much. But I'll stay awake during this episode, for sure. If you can. How's your trip to New York been so far? Oh, it's been amazing. way too short. I wish I could have done like another week at least. Yeah, I have to hear about some of the eating highlights.

2:02How has it been? It's been good. I've tried to squeeze in so much as possible. So every day I've gone to different places. But yesterday I got to go to Fan Fan Donuts. I love I live kind of close to Fan Fan. And whenever I'm trying to take a walk, I'm like, well, maybe I can like go get a guava cheese donut as my end destination. It was delicious. As soon as I opened the door, the smell, I was like fried dough smells so good. So they were incredible donuts. Loved them. What was the best donut you had of the crop? Because you must have had a few, I imagine. Yeah. So I bought a few to try, like the classic glaze, the Iranian, I think it's called, the Danny Boy, which was like, I think that was my favorite.

2:37It's like really buttery, caramelly, like nice and sweet and salty. And like some, I think it was pecans on top as well. So that was my favorite, followed by the classic glaze because I just love a simple glazed donut. So that was great. Yeah, I love that. For me, I feel like I grew up with Krispy Kreme donut. Is there an equivalent in the UK of like the quick and ready, like warm glazed donut chain? Not so much. I mean, we do have Krispy Kremes, but I think like donuts aren't as big back home as they are here, which is why I was so eager to try as many as I could. But they're very American. Yeah, we don't have donut culture like you do here, I think.

3:11No, but you have like Pret culture. We love a good Pret. I mean, there's amazing other baked goods in the UK also, I have to say. But I feel like when I went to London for the first time, my running joke was like, oh, meet me at Pret. and then I wouldn't specify which one. And there's like a thousand. On the same block also. So many Pretts. When I saw it here, I was shocked. I was like, oh my God, there's Pret here. It felt a little bit out of place. We set it up just for you across from the office because Midtown, I think, is Pret Central probably. Yeah, makes sense. It's all the offices around here.

3:39It's so funny. So did you have any other eating highlights from New York? It was Donut number one. Donut was good. I did try and get some burgers in, some smash burgers. I got to try, quite a few people recommended Gotham Social Club, I think it's called. for Smashburgers and they were good like very oniony but I like onions nice and squishy that was good and I also tried a 7th Street burger because quite a few people said try that for Smashburgers as well I still haven't been but I've heard good things it was good it wasn't like my favorite burger I've had I think the bun was probably the highlight because it was really like soft and squishy and a little bit sweet but not my favorite burger I've had well on your next trip I'll tell you that here at the podcast we're big fans of Hamburger America which is Greg Mott's Smashburger place and you can sit at the counter.

4:24My dream afternoon is like, it's just me. I have a smash burger and like a lemonade and I'm at that counter. Oh, treat me. I know. Next time, next time. Okay, but we're not here to talk about burgers. We're here to talk about baking and specifically your new book, which is called I'll Bring Dessert. And it's just such a beautiful book. I was taking photos of it and because just to have like inspiration and I was taking photos of like half of the book, which was maybe a bit too far. And I know this is your third book. So I'm curious, like how did you approach the development process differently for this book being your third?

4:54I think there were quite a lot of similarities but with this one I actually quite liked having more I guess boundaries with this one so for my last one it was a bit more broad it was sweet it was savory I could kind of put anything I wanted in there but for this one it really was a nice little like challenge I guess of my recipe brain to think of things that kind of fit within that it has to be a dessert but also something that can be taken somewhere so like I didn't get to do many like ice cream things or things that would just like melt um so it was fun to kind of approach it in a way that felt a bit more like restrictive but in a good way so I quite liked that yeah I can see that being useful and I feel like the transportation element is so key because we both live in cities I don't know if you have a car but I always find myself transporting like things in the worst possible manner on the subway and it like smells or it's just like a little stressful so I guess I'm curious like what is your pantry situation like do you have a lot of like cake carriers or how does the transportation element work for you i so i used to i think i've really got like one or two like traditional cake carriers so the big ones with a nice like the handle it's a real like lady about town yeah they're very practical but i just have a lot of different size tupperware that i find has come in very handy i have so many shapes and sizes like rectangular square deep shallow and then I'll just usually like line them with some like greaseproof paper, baking parchment and place what I need inside.

6:21And also having things in separate Tupperwares. So and then like I can just assemble things when I get there, I found has been very, very helpful. So I might have like the fruits that I've already prepped in one Tupperware. I might even already rip the cream depending on where I'm going and have that in one Tupperware and then like the main thing. So having things separate, I find is very helpful. Yeah. And I think that's almost a good reminder that just because you're bringing dessert doesn't mean you need to bring the final product. Like you can assemble it when you're there and it'll be easier for you.

6:51And also everyone will be kind of poking their heads into the kitchen and seeing what you're making. Yes. Trying to bring a finished dessert can often be more stressful and like just so much more room for things to go wrong or to like slip and slide. And so I like to not for all things, but for a lot of things, if I can finish it off when I get there, it's just so much easier. I have to tell you about my like New Yorker move for transporting specifically like galettes which is the most kind of pastry I will do is I will go to like the pizza place near my house and just see if I can buy like a pizza box off of them.

7:23That's very clever. They normally just give it to you and then you can carry it in the pizza box and then everyone thinks you brought a pizza. And then you open it and it's like wow surprise. Yeah well mine are kind of ugly so I think it's a little bit of a letdown but for you it would be like a really fun like highbrow surprise. I'm going to use that idea I like that a lot. So I guess out of all of the recipes in the book or maybe something that didn't make it into the book, what's like the most ambitious dessert you've ever transported and how did it work out for you? I think layered cakes can be quite tricky.

7:52Not like, you know, buttercreamed ones where it's like fresh cream and fresh fruit. I've found that the most disastrous to bring. So things like like gato type bakes where they're just a little bit more delicate and they're not something that I really would want to finish off when I get there because it is a bit faffy and you've got to bring your equipment and all of that stuff. So I've tried to take that. I tried to transport that once finished. And it was just by the time I got there, it was just it was slipping. It was sliding. It was it was not fun. So didn't include any of those in the book because I wouldn't recommend bringing something like that for dessert.

8:29Yeah, or you have to keep like an offset spatula in your pocket at all times, maybe. So here in New York right now, we're getting into spring and summer. I finally have seen rhubarb for the first time. I'm curious what spring-summer baking recipes are kind of on your mind the most these days. I think it's nice. Like spring-summer is when I try to start getting like the fruits involved and things just feel a little bit fresher, a little bit lighter, a lot more floral. so I use a lot of like lemon like lemon tarts are really nice poaching fruit it might be a little bit early for like the best fruit produce especially like stone fruit but I think recipes where you get to poach them like I've got some poached fruit recipes can still kind of highlight how good they are even if they're not at their like optimum so poached fruit is always a really nice one and anything that's just like nice and fresh and creamy is what I'd like to go for this time of year yeah i agree you wrote about apricots something that i really related to which is just that like they're never quite as good as you want them to be raw but when they bake they really do become like so good the best version of themselves so good and just like juicy and jammy so yeah apricots are fab for this time of year i love that and also like a baked plum moment have you made the marion burroughs plum tort recipe this is like an iconic american summer baking recipe i think the New York Times began publishing it I should check this maybe in the 70s and then they stopped they would run it print it every year in the newspaper like pre-internet baking even and then they stopped running it one year because they'd run it so many years in a row and then they got so many letters in from people that were upset that it wasn't oh wow I think it was like a reminder to make it I'll send it to you after this it's a very simple like one bowl like kind of flat tort cake but the plums in it yeah they're kind of like sliced and arranged on top it's like a very July, August kind of recipe for someone to make.

10:20Oh, delicious. Yeah, I love a good plum. I got a plum cobbler in the book. And that is one that I like have on repeat quite a lot. And it's got like tarragans. So it's really like herbaceous. And yeah, I love a good plum. I love that. I'm curious when you're working on the book, like you have a column in the Guardian where you do recipes and you have your newsletter and you have the book, there are so many different homes for your recipes to live. Like how did you decide what recipes would live in the book and what would go elsewhere it's so tricky yeah it's very very hard because I might be like working in like my column mode and thinking okay what do I want to do for this like next batch and then I'll come up with something and be like oh my gosh I love that so much I want that for myself or I want that for my book or for my newsletter so it's very tricky separating what goes where so I really try to like get in specific zones like okay I'm in book zone I'm in dessert zone and have like separate notebooks for them where I jot down sort of different ideas I might want to you know put where and there's I guess slightly different audiences for each one so for the Guardian column I have a rough idea of I've been doing it for a few years now so I have a rough idea of what usually goes down well what readers quite like.

11:29What are like some of the things that they're drawn to? So things are on the simpler side with I guess little twists nothing that's too too time consuming. So nothing that's going to take like the whole day to kind of make something that you could quite easily put together on like a Saturday afternoon. You're very likely to have all the ingredients already. That kind of thing tends to go down quite well. So like one bowl cakes, cookies and biscuits, but maybe have like a little bit of a twist. And then for my newsletter, that's, I feel like that's a place that I guess has the least restrictions.

12:02It's very much, this is what I'm just craving. This is what I just really want to make this weekend. And I want to share it with you guys. So that's a place where I can just, I guess, be a little bit more experimental and just this is what was on my brain this week. And I'm going to put it here. Yeah. And then for the book, I guess, because I have a few more boundaries for that, especially for this one, that does kind of help to filter out what goes where. But it is tricky sometimes when you want to like pinch something from somewhere else. Yeah, definitely. And I would imagine that the The people that subscribe to your newsletter, they're like your most loyal, diehard fans and also maybe the most likely to attempt something that's ambitious.

12:37So you have less restrictions because if they are showing up for you in that space, in addition to all these other ways that they can be getting your recipes, like maybe they are more like a baker's baker themselves. Exactly. And they're more willing to put in a bit more time and invest in things. And so, yeah, it's nice to give them the things that don't quite fit elsewhere. Yeah. Where do you find yourself finding inspiration for recipes the most these days? I think recently a lot of it has come from travel and also just eating out a lot. I just like I do. I love getting inspiration from like savoury side.

13:13So from cooking and from just regular meals that other people have made for me or that I eat when I'm abroad and I'm travelling. And thinking of ways I can like use some ingredients from the savoury side and like think how could this work in a cake or how could this work in a sweet setting. and I love kind of yeah letting my mind go in that way because it just you get like the most unexpected things and I think yeah there's just so much room for like those sorts of ingredients like spices that you wouldn't normally associate with baking there's so much room for that in the sweet side so it's fun to yeah just have a meal and be like oh my gosh I loved those pink peppercorns on that chicken how could I take that and put it in a cake yeah I just had a really good pink peppercorn cookie moment um abby balingat who's a filipino like dessert cookbook author her book mayumu has a adobo chocolate chip cookie in it that yeah when you said the title i've definitely seen that yeah with the pink peppercorn on top i mean there's so many cool things in that cookie it has bay leaf and soy sauce oh that's a lot of savory things but the pink peppercorn to me was kind of the most surprising maybe because i always think of like pink salt or something as an aesthetic move which it kind of is but it really had so much distinct flavor that I totally had to reframe my expectation.

14:27I love pink pepper. I've got a pink peppercorn cookie not in this book and it's like pink peppercorn and ginger in a shortbread and it is just one of my favorite cookies I think I've made. I love that and I think shortbread is kind of like a UK dessert that doesn't necessarily have as much love and respect here in America as I would like because I would like to be able to have shortbread everywhere I go and I think it's not quite as common. which is a shame because it's and it's such a simple biscuit as well it's not like complicated at all everybody and their mom could make a good shortbread um and yeah i think it's it's super popular back home that's just like a good staple biscuit yeah i know someone a canadian who got married and their mom made shortbread for everybody for the wedding but brought her own butter from canada to america to make it because she said that's what makes the difference this is true you need good butter you need a really good butter for like a good shortbread oh it's delicious Because that's like the main flavor.

15:17Ingredient, yeah. The reason for the shortbread itself. I love shortbread. So I'm curious about the tour that you're going on for the book right now. Where are you going next and what things do you want to eat there? Do you know? So going to Seattle today. So fun. That's the longest flight you could do. Oh, my gosh. When I didn't quite like I didn't quite realize how far it was. And then I saw my itinerary. I was like six hours. It took me six hours to get from London to New York. So I wasn't quite mentally prepared for that journey. but we're going to do it. It's going to be fine. You just have to let you go on the plane and just disassociate.

15:49It's just where you are and you can't be anywhere else, you know? And just try and sleep for as much as possible. But Seattle has phenomenal food. I've heard, because I've never been to the West Coast. This is my first time ever on that side of the US. So I'm hoping again to just squeeze in as much as possible. So we'll do Seattle and then Portland and San Francisco. So all quite different cities but I'm very intrigued to learn a little bit more about them. Yeah, I love all of those places. I'm from L.A., so I'm sad that you're not making it all the way down. I'm sad that I'm not making it there.

16:20But that would just be an even longer trip. But I feel like going to all of those places and getting to eat all the different things there will probably be a fun opportunity to get ideas for all the recipes as well. Definitely. I'm looking forward to just like diving in, eating all the things. I want to talk to you about London, though, because that's where you're from. You're from South London, born and raised, right? Do you still live there now? Still live there now. Yeah. Absolutely love it. If you were going to take someone who had never been to South London or London at all before on an eating tour, where would you take them?

16:48That's a great question. Because South London doesn't often get as much love as places like East London. But South London is just so joyful for me. So I'd probably start at my local brunch spot. It's called Juliet's. And it is absolutely amazing. They make some of the most creative breakfasts and brunches, I think, are happening in the whole of London. amazing eggs, amazing baked goods and they do this really cool curried egg dish. It's like poached eggs in curry butter and yogurt and it's really herby, absolutely divine and they've really got fantastic Anzac biscuits and this amazing yuzu hazelnut cake.

17:30We need to talk about the Anzac biscuit for a second because I don't think most people know what those are and that's originally an Australian biscuit, right? Yeah, an Australian like biscuits cookies and they are so good so they're made from uh coconut so desiccated coconut flour um and golden syrup so they were like a little bit chewy and oats as well i think pretty sure there's oats in there yeah um so it's like really chewy and like buttery and that golden syrup is just like such a specific flavor that i think you don't really have golden syrup here and it's hard i don't think there is a direct substitute for golden syrup in terms of like flavor yeah it's the brand is lyle's yeah i mean i you see it at like the british grocery stores and things here and i think of like maple syrup but it's not like that no it's such a different such a specific flavor so that yeah anzac biscuits a lot of golden syrup a lot of coconut and oats and it's just chewy like a flapjack like a british flapjack in a cookie form kind of a flapjack meaning a pancake no i was like oh i know it's different here what's a flapjack the flapjack Like in the UK, it's a very, very simple, like old school bake.

18:37And it's just oats, golden syrup and butter. That's like in its most simplest form. And you just like melt the butter and syrup, pour it into your oats and then bake it. And then you cut it into squares. And it's just like oaty treat. It's like such a classic what you make when you're like little. Oh, I love that. Yeah. OK, big detour. That's stuff went on the tour. So that's stuff one. Go to Juliet's Cafe for brunch, coffee and cakes. and then probably where's really good oh like literally two doors down from juliette's is uh like a west indian bakery called mixed blessings and they do amazing like fresh hardo bread which is this like traditional caribbean bread so soft so thick and they also do these patties as well um like meat patties beef salt fish just so much flavor and my favorite thing to get from there is patty in cocoa bread.

19:27I love that. So it's carb heavy, I'm not gonna lie, but it's just like delicious. But it's like the squishy cocoa bread and then the flaky patty. And then the filling inside and it will knock you out, but it is delicious. Really good. Do you have a go-to patty flavor there? I always get cheesy beef. That's like my absolute always favorite choice, cheesy beef. There's a really good patty placed by me in Brooklyn that their vegan lentil patty It's just so well spiced and delicious. And there's something about it that I just, I have them in my freezer actually. Because I think that they can just toast her oven very well.

20:01Yeah, and they reheat well. So mixed blessings after there. And then just walk it off a little bit. And there's a restaurant I really love in South London called Llewellyn's. And it's just this really like chill neighborhood, local spot. But the food is amazing. It's like, I guess, modern European kind of vibes. really simple but just executed so well and it's just really cozy vibes in there so i love that and then just to get something sweet after that maybe a quick stop at toad bakery who do incredible pastries like really really innovative flavors um they do like an everything bagel croissant pastry and it's like got cream cheese in the middle and herbs and it's divine i've heard a lot of good things about this bakery actually when i was in london in december i wanted to go but i just didn't have enough time similar to your New York trip, I guess.

20:52So, yeah. It seems great. And they're, are they only open on the weekends? No, they're open during the week, but it's just, I never would go, I just don't go on a weekend because you will queue for a very long time. Go on like a Monday morning, like a random time and then you'll get in. So yeah, Toad Brokery and then just to end the night, there's a really lovely pub called Prince of Peckham and it's like this amazing black home space, really good food, good vibes, good music and just get a drink there to end the day. Wow, I love that. That's like my dream day because it has seven pastry shops.

21:24Very pastry heavy, but delicious. I love that. This is not related to food, but did you watch the movie Rylane that came out? Of course. Like two years ago, maybe? Oh, it was beautiful. This is like my favorite rom-com that I've seen in recent memory. I love that. And it's all set in South London, so anyone is listening and they're trying to get an image or a visualization. I don't think any of these places you mentioned are in that movie, but it's around there. No, around there. Prince of Becken's not far from there. Yeah. So, yeah, Rylane was just beautiful. It was just so nice to see like places that, you know, on the big screen.

21:52Oh, my gosh, I know. I know that place. I've been there. So that was a stunning film. I'm so glad that you liked it because I feel like for me, it's like I'm not really from there. So it's so fun. But I feel like when you are from there and it feels authentic or lived in some kind of way, it's better. They did such a good job with it. Loved it. So we've talked about Anzac biscuits and shortbread and some of these kind of British baking staples. I'm curious, in your time in the US so far, what would you like to nominate to be a regular in the American pastry baking scene that maybe is not quite as popular here?

22:23I would definitely say custard. I feel like custard isn't as huge over here or as popular over here as it is in the UK. And in all forms. So with desserts back home, custard is just standard. like a cake or a I don't know a hot pudding you're gonna pour you're gonna drown that thing in like hot custard and I don't think that's as done here um or even like a cold custard like a cold creme anglaise with certain desserts is delicious or like custard filled things or custard tarts I think custard is very very very popular back home and just doesn't have the same kind of like cult following I think you're right because when I started watching Bake Off I think is when I realized oh wow people really like custard and I don't even know like the powdered custard like what is that is that is that actually good or no no I mean it's what everybody grew up with and everybody will probably have a tub of powdered custard in their cupboard like just you just have it there it just lives there in terms of like it's a very nostalgic flavor I would say like you like it because you've kind of grown up eating it kind of thing but yeah not it's not my favorite type of custard.

23:32I think homemade custard is great, but you can also buy great custard in the stores back home as well, which is like just like got vanilla in it and it's really nice and creamy. So it's very easy to get good custard. Yeah. And I appreciate you saying that the nostalgia is probably a factor with the packaged custard because I imagine, you know, I think that's true with all food, but I think especially with baking and dessert, there is so much of that kind of romantic appeal for what you grew up eating or what you fantasized about having as a kid at all do you feel like that nostalgia plays a role in the recipes that you develop I think to an extent because there are some things that like the custard if I if I introduce if I probably gave you a bowl of that now you'd be like oh this is not very nice but this is like this is okay but it's a bit nothing's neither here nor there um so I think I like to especially when I'm thinking of like my main audience which who are based in the UK there are lots of things that I just know that they will get.

24:26And it's just really comforting to make recipes that people can connect to in that way. So yeah, I really love to, when I can, just kind of add in those elements of nostalgia and homeliness that people love. With baking and desserts, there are so many recipes that are a family recipe or something that's been passed down. How do you approach developing recipes that people will want to try as something new instead of maybe going to the family favorite at the standby? I think it's important to have like recipes that people are still familiar with. But I love introducing like little extras or little twists that still feel approachable and easy to do without straying too far away.

25:06So I want people to see it and say, I'm familiar with that. And I kind of know that I already like it. but I love just introducing something that's just a little bit subtle but still feels like interesting and new without straying too far just for the sake of straying away from it and I think that helps people be more open in at least trying it because it's not the things I add to it aren't particularly super technical or need like a great level of expertise but it's just like simple ways that make it different, that's so approachable. I think that helps people kind of be open to trying it. Definitely.

25:44Even the plum crisp that you mentioned earlier, like I've made a crisp so many times I've never put tarragon into one before. But I like the idea of that because I already know that I like the plum crisp school of baking. Yeah. And it's just this extra thing that, oh, actually I'll be open to trying that because it's not too difficult. Right. And yeah, open to giving it a go. So if somebody was opening, I'll bring dessert for the first time, what's a recipe that you would maybe suggest they start out with? Oh, I mean, it would depend on how much they bake because I've got friends who do not bake.

26:12And then what I would suggest for them and what I would suggest for someone who's been more comfortable would be very different. Can I get one of each, maybe? OK, let's one of each. So if you're someone who you want to get into it, you want to be someone who can be a bit more confident in bringing dessert or you don't bake much currently. The one that comes to mind might be the sweet and salty cheesecake, which I really, really love. It's so simple and it's inspired by a restaurant in London called Black Lock. They're like a meat chop house, but they do like only two desserts. And one of them is a white chocolate cheesecake and it's like scoopable.

26:46So it's just said in a big dish and they come around to your table and just like scoop it and dollop it into your bowl. Out of the big dish? Out of the big dish. Wow, that's very cute. It's fantastic. And I love it so much. I wanted to do something like that, like just a scoopable, very rough and ready cheesecake. so the sweet and salty cheesecake it's got a base of like ritz crackers and butter and then the filling is made from like just cream cheese condensed milk a bit of sour cream in there as well and some vanilla and then flaky sea salt on top super super easy but like everybody loves it because it's just so homely you don't have to slice it and set it do it in a big dish spoon it and done so if you're someone who doesn't bake a lot or is a bit intimidated by baking that's a good one to start with because it's very straightforward it doesn't need to look perfect and it's just delicious and is it a baked cheesecake or no big no big cheesecake no bake so good for summer also very good for summer just in the dish in the fridge boom love it done and let's say like i do bake a bit already and i want to make something from the book i would what comes to mind what comes to mind so let's say it's like this time of year it's getting a bit warmer perhaps the oh gosh there's so many going from my head am I which making you choose your favorite baby they change all the time but at the moment I might say the oh gosh I'm literally maybe the cherry slab pie well I guess if you're going somewhere where there's a lot of people then the cherry slab pie I really really enjoy um it's quite the pastry it's like a rough puff pastry so you're not making like a full puff pastry puff pastry from scratch because i don't even do that myself no oh that makes me feel a lot better you did like pastry week on bake off like never again no that's fine we don't need to do puff pastry from scratch we don't need to do that um so it's very like rough and ready pastry you make it in a big like tin it's just a really nice slab pie the cherry filling is just juicy with like some balsamic vinegar um so if you're comfortable with baking and you're baking for a crowd that's one i would And you can use like frozen cherries and you can make it out of season as well, which is helpful.

28:53I love that. I don't think I'm going to have cherries for a couple of months here, unfortunately. It's always later than I want it to be. So I'll be like keeping that in my mind as I stalk the farmer's market. Yes, do it. I wanted to ask you about Luminary Bakery in London, which I know you're an ambassador for. Could you maybe explain what that is for people who are unfamiliar and kind of what draws you to working with them? So they are a social enterprise bakery based in London, mostly North London. And they work with disadvantaged women across London. And these women come on like a six month course and they learn to bake everything from scratch.

29:29So they do cakes, breads, pastries, desserts, everything in between to a really high level. And they also have like employability training and like holistic training and work skills and everything. So it's very like holistic course. and yeah the bakery supports them in teaching and with employability afterwards yeah and it's just an incredible initiative incredible social enterprise that I kind of just stumbled across years and years ago before Bake Off I found them on Instagram thought it was cool just like followed and then after Bake Off I think I just maybe liked a couple of posts and they were like oh my gosh whoa yeah I've been here guys I've been here and then we just got talking came down um went down to visit and just loved what they did and as someone who loves baking and who also like is you know loves women women empowerment and being able to use your gifts in a way that can help other women it just like really resonated with me and so I've been working with them for quite a few years now and I do some of I teach some of the classes um on the course and just like shout about them whenever I can and support in any which way.