In short
Podcast Notes: This Is TASTE Episode 531
Episode Overview Title: Korean Food Explodes Outside Koreatown with Kisa’s David Joonwoo Yun Description: David Joonwoo Yun discusses his journey in redefining Korean cuisine in NYC through his restaurants, C as in Charlie and Kisa. Additionally, journalist Mehr Singh shares insights from her reporting on Gen Z cheesemakers.
Key Guests
- David Joonwoo Yun: Partner at C as in Charlie and Kisa
- Mehr Singh: Journalist, TASTE contributor
Episode Highlights
David Joonwoo Yun's Journey
- Background:
- Grew up in Korea; moved to Atlanta, Georgia.
- Influenced by childhood cooking experiences, leading to a unique fusion of Korean and American cuisine.
- Restaurant Ventures:
- C as in Charlie: Opened two years ago, blending Southern U.S. and Korean influences.
- Kisa: Opened four months ago, offering a more traditional Korean dining experience focused on seasonal banchan (side dishes).
- Inspirations:
- Personal anecdotes about family meals and adapting Korean dishes with American ingredients.
- Emphasis on authenticity in cooking and the importance of community and friendship in his ventures.
Kisa's Concept and Menu
- Format:
- Fixed price for a meal featuring a selection of banchan and a choice of entrees.
- Features seasonal ingredients, showcasing traditional Korean flavors in a contemporary setting.
- Signature Dishes:
- Oxbone Pasta: A fusion dish born from childhood memories.
- Seasonal banchan sets that vary with the seasons, highlighting fresh ingredients.
- Culinary Philosophy:
- Aims for his restaurant to be a place where both Koreans and non-Koreans can enjoy authentic flavors.
- Focuses on the quality of banchan, which is critical in Korean cuisine.
Mehr Singh's Reporting on Young Cheesemakers
- Introduction:
- Discussion on the new generation of cheesemakers and their impact on the cheese industry.
- Singh shares her observations about the creative and marketing strategies of young cheesemakers, influenced by social media trends.
- Key Findings:
- Young cheesemakers are blending traditional techniques with modern flavors and marketing approaches.
- They are building community and representation in an industry historically dominated by older generations.
- Notable Cheesemakers:
- Vito Di Checa: Known for innovative cheese wedding cakes and unique flavor pairings.
- Kayla First: A young cheesemonger who emphasizes community among women and queer people in the industry.
Key Takeaways
- Culinary Evolution:
- Korean cuisine in NYC is evolving, with restaurants like Kisa pushing traditional boundaries and appealing to a wider audience.
- The blending of cultures (Southern and Korean) is becoming a hallmark of modern Korean dining.
- Community and Representation:
- The rise of young cheesemakers highlights a move towards inclusivity and creativity in the food industry.
- There is a growing appreciation for high-quality ingredients and unique flavor profiles among younger consumers.
- Future Trends:
- Expect a diversification in dining experiences, with more focus on regional and traditional foods as chefs reflect their heritage in innovative ways.
Closing Remarks
- The episode encapsulates the vibrant and evolving landscape of both Korean cuisine in America and the burgeoning community of young cheesemakers, showcasing the importance of storytelling in food culture.
Call to Action
- Listeners are encouraged to visit and support the featured restaurants and explore the stories of young culinary innovators in their local communities.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00This episode is brought to you by Resi and American Express. Resi is a digital platform that connects restaurants to restaurant lovers by elevating dining experiences, providing original industry content, and helping to fill some of the country's most exciting dining rooms. Because restaurants have always been more than just places to eat. The amazing world of restaurants is just a few taps away in the Resi app and at resi.com.
0:31One day my mom decided to make Seollongtang for us which is the beef bone soup with the wheat noodles but because she couldn't find the janchigooks or the wheat noodles she bought the spaghetti noodles and just threw it in there and you know that actually became one of our signature dish that says in Charlie called oxbone pasta because that just brings back my memory This is Taste. I'm your host, Matt Rodbard. David Junwoo Yoon has a great story to tell. As one of the partners of New York City Korean restaurants Sia's and Charlie and Kisa, he's been at the center of Korean cooking in New York City for a minute.
1:11But how did he get here? And how did he and his partners eventually redefine Korean cooking one panchan at a time? We dig into his great story on this terrific episode. I hope you enjoy it.
1:34David Junwoo Yoon, welcome to This Taste. How are you doing? Very good. Thank you, Matt, for your time, for inviting me over. You're absolutely part of the rise of modern Korean cuisine and cooking in restaurants in America. and your two restaurants are really at the top. I mean, just the work you're doing. And so thank you for saying that. Before we get into the show, though, I want to ask you, where are you dining out right now restaurant-wise when you're not working at your restaurants? You probably are hitting up some spots. So the first question is actually going to be the hardest question for me.
2:04Now that we have two restaurants on board and they're fairly new. Season Charlie is only two years old. Kiza's four months old. So I've been really busy lately. I don't get to go out a lot as often. but you know thankfully my in-laws are here from korea they came here three days ago and i had honored to check out peter luger for the first time of my life and i was a little bit worried to be honest because you know they're living in new york for like 15 years everyone says there's a lot of people shit on peter luger nowadays but i was a little bit feared but it was a place to go if your in-laws are from korea to usa so i took him out i actually had one of the best email ever So, you know, I think for now I could say Peter Luger was an amazing experience for me.
2:48Well, David, I appreciate you saying that. This is not a place that shits on Peter Luger. We love Peter Luger and we have had, you know, a family member on the program in the past. I love that. And your family from Korea, when they're in town visiting, where are you taking them? Like not just restaurants, but how you've shown them New York? Usually, you know, we do visit a lot of restaurants that are like, you know, maybe, you know, a lot of the tourists go like Grimaldi's, like, you know, Peter Luger, Wolfgang, all those kind of places. But I actually take him around to some of the good Korean restaurants because I believe New York City has one of the diverse and best Korean restaurants in the United States.
3:27So, you know, my parents are from Atlanta, Georgia. So there's not much as option as or variety as what New York offers. So we go to a lot of Korean restaurants. Of course, we do a lot of the tourist stuff as well. We go to Rockefeller, Central Park, all that stuff. But I think mainly, you know, especially older generation, our parents or my in-laws, they have to have Korean food at least once a meal, once a day. So I take them to a lot of Korean restaurants. Yeah, what's a couple of restaurants that pops into your head that you want to take them to? Okdongshig is definitely on the list. It's one of my favorite restaurants in New York City.
3:58They have simple, just one menu, the 돼지 곰탕, which is a soup. I know they're going to love it already There's definitely some of the fine dining That they cannot enjoy in Atlanta Like Atomix, Jungshik, Naro All those good Korean restaurants Or Goat, even Goat, like Korean barbecue There's no other Korean barbecue like Goat So there's a lot of options out here That our parents would love I love Okdungshik That's a cool spot, one menu I think Gomtang is such a cool dish It's one of the best soup you can ever have Let's talk a little bit about your own food history. You grew up in Korea. You were raised in Atlanta, Georgia.
4:37So, David, what's food like in your household growing up? So, you know, mostly it was Korean food at home. My parents would cook Korean food. So, actually, a lot of the inspiration of C.S. and Charlie comes from our childhood home cooking. Because when we first came to USA, we lived in Salisbury of Maryland, where there's not much Korean people. There was one tiny Korean supermarket, but that was it. So when we first came here, you know, my parents couldn't speak English. We just went to American supermarket. And, you know, my mom would try to find American ingredients to cook Korean food into.
5:10So at the time, you know, it's 2000, so there wasn't a lot of like Asian ingredients out in the American supermarket like nowadays. So one day my mom decided to make seollongtang for us, which is the beef bone soup with the wheat noodle, janchigooksu. But because she couldn't find the janchigooks with a wheat noodle, she bought the spaghetti noodles and just threw it in there. Yeah. And, you know, that actually became one of our signature dish, as says in Charlie, called oxbone pasta, because that just brings back my memory. A lot of those things happen, like, my dad thought the bacons were samgyeop-sar, the pork belly.
5:45So he bought those, and we actually cooked it on the grill with the lettuce. Oh, yeah. Bacon on lettuce and samjang's pretty good, actually. If you ever have a chance, you should try that combination. You know, it's similar ingredients. I love that idea because we think about Samjib Sal as like, you know, an unsured, thicker cut bacon or pork belly. But then using like, you know, grocery store bacon with a great Samjib. I've never like done that. I don't know why it's never come into my head. I love this idea. So cool. My dad was arguing this is Samjib Sal. But as I was tasting it, this tastes very different.
6:17Dad, but it's like this is the same kind of meat, same meat, just have like Samjib Sal in, you know. That was, that's one of the biggest memory I have. when I grew up in Salisbury. So cool. And let's talk about moving to New York. You end up here, and you have a long career before opening these restaurants, working in restaurants. What were some of the restaurant experiences that really informed the way you're running your operation now? Well, the first restaurant that I ever worked in New York City was called Crystal Belly. Now it's not there anymore, but it was owned by a Korean celebrity named JYP.
6:52At the time, I think it was the first upscale Korean barbecue. And Chef David Shim of Gold is actually one of the founding chefs of Crisabelli. So I started as a food owner at the Crisabelli. And eventually I got my way up to event manager, bar manager, and then a general manager. So that was my first time ever working in the restaurant industry. Honestly speaking, you know, in Korean culture, working in a restaurant isn't something your parents would want you to do. You know, they want you to be doctor, accountant, but I was never book smart. you know working in a restaurant my parents always they were not really happy but as i was working at chrisabelli i saw that you know restaurant industries more more than just serving guests but there are so many cultures underlying within the industry like get to you know participate in james we're our foundation i got like private catering we got all the celebrities coming in so i was thinking wow restaurant industry is like more than just a 식당, which is, you know, how Koreans refer a restaurant into.
7:55But I don't think there's really a positive meaning behind it. But I felt like, well, a restaurant is something that I, there's every aspect in it is something I love to do. Like it involves music, it involves hospitality, involves food, involves interior design, everything. So I was, you know, I fell in love. You know, Crisabelli was my beginning of the industry. It's such a cool moment in time when Crystal Belly opened, which I remember vividly. And really, I love how you lay out your passions and you're so talented at all the elements because you see it in your restaurants. But let's talk about JYP having this big music star in Korea.
8:37Be the owner, be, I mean, dude, parties. There must have been some parties at Crystal Belly. We did family outing every night. And the first year was, you know, we did a company outing every night after the shift. And I think that's one of the reasons I loved working at Crisabelli as well. Back then I was only 23, 22. So, you know, just going out, having drinks, like we rented out a nightclub and just, you know, we were having fun and we meet all this like celebrities. Like I met Leonardo DiCaprio once. Like, you know, it was just crazy for me. Like working in a restaurant, you get to meet with all these people, hang out with these cool people and you do parties.
9:13Like we would end up at Koreatown until six in the morning, you know, just drinking soju and barbecue. Fun times. Super fun times. Let's continue talking about this era that Crystal Belly opened. Because at that time, you know, Korean food in New York was still really emerging. You know, you're not, there is no, you know, JP and Elia running their restaurants at that time. Barbecue is still the focus. Did you get a sense that there was something special happening in K-Town? And we're talking like eight years ago around, right? I definitely saw a movement because when I first landed to New York, Korean food was all about in Koreatown, 32nd Street.
9:51But as Chris Sabelli opened at 36th Street, I saw all these restaurants like Cheongshig at Tribeca. Corey was there at the time. Like there are all these different restaurants that are catering non-Korean market. And I was very amazed to see those kind of movement happening. I just thought that Chris Sabelli may have been a little bit faster than how the Korean cuisine is working right now. But I was just shocked to see, like, there are so many Korean restaurants outside of Koreatown catering to non-Korean U.S. consumers. So, you know, I definitely saw the movement there at the time. Yeah. And then this leads into Sea as in Charlie opening and really kind of being one of those early, you know, modern Korean American restaurants that that took things out of K-Town spiritually, geographically.
10:42Tell us a little bit about how you you kind of concepted Sea as in Charlie and also about the team behind it, because you see you guys are friends. It's obvious that your buddies, these are your close pals, and there's a lot of love there, which I really, really, really respect. Yes. So shout out to my friends, Steve and Eric. So they're actually one of a couple of my friends that I grew up with since I was 12 years old from Atlanta, Georgia. We all came to New York together because we felt like a frog in a well not knowing about the ocean in Atlanta because, you know, we were never book smart.
11:18At the time, we were called FOB, which means fresh off the boat. So we never adopted American culture that much while we were in Atlanta, Georgia. So we were sort of those outcasts, even in Korean church. Like, you know, there's English-speaking Koreans versus like us speaking Korean. So we never felt we were fitting into American culture. That's how we thought, hey, like if we stay here in Atlanta, we might end up as a dry cleaner owners. You know, that's what most Koreans do for the business at the time. So we're like, hey, let's go to New York and see what there is for out in the world. So we all came to New York with a few hundred bucks.
11:54So we rented out a small studio. There was five of us at the time. So just one studio, all of us just living there. So we had to make a living while we go to college. So we're just working in restaurants, bars. And communication started there. We're like, hey, Eric, you like to cook? He always cooked for us. So at home, we had different chores. So I did the laundry. Steve did the dishwashing and Eric did the cooking. So we're like, Eric, you know, you should be a chef one day. That's incredible. Tell me about what was Eric making in your studio at the time. So he used anything that's in the fridge pretty much that didn't expire.
12:31He would just throw it into a pot, make it into a soup. It was mostly simple and humble food. But he would always create something pretty new out of one of the worst ingredients you can find actually in the fridge and just turning it into a right dish. So we always thought, hey, you know, you should be a chef one day. We called him chef at home. That's amazing. Now he became a real chef. Yeah, now he's a real chef. He's really successful in restaurants. Did he end up going to culinary school? He did, actually. He went to ICE. I don't know what it's called. Yeah, ICE. Yeah, he went to ICE. But he actually worked as a line cook with Chef David at Crisabelli at the time for about maybe like six, seven months.
13:10And he realized that, you know, that working in the kitchen versus working in the kitchen at home is a little different. So he took different paths. and he came back. But that's how we started. And while we opened, while we thought about our first restaurant, we had so many ideas, like what we wanted to do. Like once we thought about doing Spanish tapas, like Korean fried chicken, but Ki-hun of Hent Hospitality, so he's one of our mentor and our role model. He actually sat down with us, and he was telling us, you should really think about who you are, and your background and speak that through the restaurant instead of trying to do something that looks cool or is trendy.
13:53So we sat down and we talked about the food we ate as we grew up, our shared background in Atlanta, Georgia. So we thought, hey, why don't we just mix Southern and Korean because that's what we grew up eating, Korean food and Southern food. And they're both soul food. Korea was one of the poor country back in the days right after the Korean War. So, you know, Korean food is mostly with the ingredients that were left over from, you know, U.S. military or Japanese or whatever. And, you know, Southern soul food is also, you know, a lot from the ingredients that are left over from, you know, like, you know, chicken thighs or chicken gizzard, those kind of foods.
14:33So we thought it was a great mix. It could be a great ingredients that could be mixed together. So that's how we, you know. So you opened Sia's in Charlie and, you know, people go berserk for it. It's a popular restaurant from the get-go and it still operates today and business is good, I would imagine. Yes, fortunately very good. You know, I think two years ago, like when we first opened, it was pretty slow for about first two months. And then they picked up really fast. But, you know, God bless us right now. It's still very good, very busy. So, David, tell me about the menu at Seas in Charlie and some of the dishes that have now become, you know, iconic for this restaurant.
15:13Right. So I've mentioned about the oxfone pasta. I think all of our dishes are similar in that sense, like Salisbury steak. So Steve and Eric's parents owned American deli in Atlanta, Georgia. So they had a lot of the leftover foods like from the restaurant, such as hamburger patties. So using that, there's a similar dish called 떡갈비 in Korea. It's like Korean emperor cuisine. So their parents made into a ddukkabi using those patties. So they grew up eating those kind of patties. So Chef Eric turned it into a dish called Salisbury steak, which is one of the very popular dishes, as says in Charlie.
15:48I think it's one of the signature dishes that represents our restaurant. Yeah, turned it into a Salisbury steak with the grits. So there's a little bit of Korean, a little bit of Southern. And there's our immigrant history in the dish. So let's transition to opening Kisa, which, you know, I got to visit early. And from the get go, I recognized a lot of things. I've been to Korea many times and I recognized a panchan centric meal that has a fixed price. You recognize that a lot from visiting Korea. I recognize also just very, very, very sharp culinary skills and just really understanding how panchan can be can be kind of substituted in and out by the seasons.
16:31but just the creativity you're cooking with there. So what inspired you to open Kisa also on Houston Street, which is super cool to see a Korean restaurant in the East Village? It all came together in this beautiful place. I highly recommend visiting Kisa. Tell me about it. So, yeah, simple thoughts. So as we were operating C.S. & Charlie, honestly speaking, C.S. & Charlie is more of 80 % American, maybe 20 % or less Korean. At the time, it's only two years ago, so Korean food has been very, very popular. It was very hot, trendy cuisine. I expected that everyone that came to see us and Charlie must have tried the Korean food before.
17:15But I encountered many customers saying, hey, you know, this is the first Korean restaurant I ever had and it was amazing. And more and more I hear that. I felt very sorry about it because, you know, it's nothing really 100 % Korean. So, you know, we're sitting down, we're saying, you know, if we ever do a second restaurant, it should be 100 % Korean, not in K-Town. But, you know, we should speak about our roots, our heritage. So, you know, we started from there. We wanted to do something very traditional and Korean. And I got married in Korea last year. So, you know, I was able to go visit Korea back and forth for past two years.
17:54and a lot of those Korean casual restaurants, we call it no-po-sik-dang. So it's owned by like mom and pop's 20, 30 years old restaurants are now disappearing. And now the younger restaurateurs are opening more of the Western cuisine or fine dining Korean. So I think, you know, that trend totally makes sense. You know, surviving as those no-po-sik-dang in Korea is very difficult, especially now that previous owners are retiring. it's disappearing all of a sudden so i realized hey you know if we bring this kind of concept to new york and make it work somehow new york is like the capital of the world so if we bring it to new york make it work somehow maybe next generation even in korea might think it's cool it might continue on with this heritage so we start off from that idea and we were looking into nopo and boom driver driver's restaurant gisa was you know everyone in korea thinks you know the taxi drivers knows the best restaurant in town so we follow the restaurants that taxi drivers go to in korea so we brought the concept right over to us i love it and the format works so well um to do these clash to do these classic dishes uh but doing in your own way talk about the way the format works at kisa right um so yeah like you have mentioned in korea we have stuff we eat every season.
19:19Summer, we have to eat this. Fall, we have to eat this. Winter. So, Korea, we're very, like, strict on what to eat during each season. So, I wanted to kind of showcase that to USA. You know, here the land is really big. So, of course, there are some seasonal ingredients. But I feel like in Korea, you know, relying on seasonal ingredients is much more heavier. So, we wanted to showcase a seasonal banchan according to korea so we started off with the banchan set during the spring now we actually released different set of banchan for summer season and uh you know you know i don't want to say this to for all restaurants but a lot some of the korean restaurants i've been to side dish works as a side dish it's something on the side so some of the side dish when i taste it sometimes tastes funny because it could be a little bit old in the fridge um but for me or for most koreans we tell good restaurant by their banchan you know when we go to a restaurant like when we go to a seollongtang uh joint restaurant in korea the the popular ones have better kakdugi than others not the soup they're all really good oh my gosh the kakdugi if you have it at the best seollongtang spots in seoul you're gonna have like big cauldrons of kakdugi and like with scissors and you're gonna have like one item on the menu.
20:40There's one in Itaewon that I know about, but man, I love the way that you channel this ethic. I'm so happy you said that. Tell me a little bit about the panchons that you're serving right now at the restaurant. Right now, so we recently changed it out to a summer season. So we started off with dakkomtang, which is chicken soup made with chicken bone and chicken meat. In Korea, there's a word saying yirchir, meaning you have to eat something hot when is hot, something cold when it's cold. So it's a hot chicken soup with chive that are, you know, supposed to bring down your heat. And also we have some cucumbers, also very summer ingredients in Korea, mixed with perilla seeds.
21:24We also have 계란jang, which is soy marinated egg. We have 동그랑땡, which is like the Korean meatball patty. What else do we have? We have Inmari, which is seaweed-wrapped glass noodles, deep-fried with the sweet and spicy sauce. So a lot of those ingredients are like the sides that you can find in Korean restaurants. And we chose the ones that will fit to summer season for now. And the cost of entrance is like$35? $32. $32. Yeah, before tip and tax. Before tip and tax. And you can get great sul and beers and all sorts of great drinks too. But like for New York City, this is like the steel of the century.
22:05and you're getting, of course, the panchan, but you're getting one of four entree choices too. Right. Each member of the table gets that entree and then the panchan flows. It's, what are some of the entrees that are happening right now? So we got bulgogi, thinly sliced marinated ribeye. We have jeyuk, which is spicy pork. We also have a spicy squid on the menu. And lastly, we have a bibimbap, not in a hot stone, but on a steel bowl. It's called pori bibimbap. It's a barley bibimbap with the radish root kimchi. Yeah, I got to sample all of them. Onjiobokum is my, the squid is like my favorite. I love that one.
22:45And I honestly liked all of it. And I feel like if you're going to have a Korean meal in New York, you kind of go to Kisa because you're getting a selection of these panchons. Like you mentioned many of them. And you're not going to get it better in New York, the panchons. Thank you, man. I mean, I really appreciate that you acknowledged it. We want it to be a restaurant that even if Koreans come in, they would agree that it's tasty. So we make all the kimchi, all the banchan in the house. Some of the key ingredients like sesame oil or perilla oil, chili pepper flake, we actually get it directly from Korea because the ones you get from here taste a little bit different.
23:25The chilies that grows in the USA taste a little different from ones that grows in Korea. So we really wanted to bring the traditional taste of Korea. And you just opened lunch. We did. How does that work? Is it the same price? Very good. It's been only two weeks. It's actually a different price. They're at$17 and$18. So in Korea, our kisa is inspired by a taxi driver restaurant. For dinner, we have the platter set, which is Baekban. But there's actually different formats of kisa 식당s in Korea. There could be like all-you-can-e kind of style. There could be Baekban style. and also there's one staple menu that if you go to Kisa Shikdang in Korea that you can always find, which is Donkatsu.
24:06Donkatsu is like the pork cutlet fried inspired by Japanese katsu. But that's a dish that all Korean taxi drivers have mostly. And a lot of the Korean customers that came to Kisa were asking, how come you don't have a Donkatsu on the menu called Kisa Shikdang? So we're like, okay. Getting that feedback from diners. And we're like, all right, we're going to show it to you very soon. So now we have the lunch opened, which is not served in 백반 style, but we want to show a different style of gisa 식당. So we serve gamjatang, which is like the perfect hangover cure, the pork bone soup. My God, I've said on the show many times and wrote it in our first book, Korea World.
24:43That's Koreatown. That is my favorite. Gamjatang. Gamjatang is my favorite. Oh, man, you have to come try the gamjatang. I haven't had your gamjatang yet. That's crazy. We make big pot every day. We just sell it all and that's it. I love it. So you're paying 17 bucks. You're walking and you're getting gamjatang, you're getting a tonkatsu. Yeah, I remember I was in Korea recently or maybe a year or so ago, and I went to a Kisa that it was actually popping up in a barbecue restaurant, and they had myungtang. That's all they had on the menu, and it was like 10 ,000 won, and it was one dish, and people were just like flowing in, lots of cab drivers, lots of just people.
25:21And the fact that you've opened lunch just gives me this impression that Kisa is so, you're honoring this tradition in Korea in a way that you're not seeing in America, even in LA. I'm sure there are Kisa-style restaurants in LA, but man, I love this so much that you've actually opened a lunch service. Thank you. Yeah, we definitely want to show a different case, like a different style of Kisa-sikdang in New York. And I think we've only showed about 60 % of what we have to offer so far. So there's going to be a lot more fun stuff out there. Zooming out a bit, let me ask you, you have a great sense of the way modern Korean food has been served in New York, and we've talked about it a lot on the show, but I'd like to get your sense of the direction we're heading in right now.
26:05At a pivotal time, there's a real saturation. I'm not going to say over-saturation. That'd be unfair. There's a lot of Korean restaurants and a lot of talent here, more than ever, and definitely on the modern side, it's the best city in the country. Where do you see it going in five years? I think it'll diverge into two different routes. casual and fine dining even in korea i think that's where it's headed to right now so there's going to be a restaurant like us in casual format and there's going to be fine dining format like atomix or you know jungshik which works very well in both ways and of course there's style like simon's where he turned into korean barbecue or korean fried chicken into an upscale version so there's always going to be different mix of everything but way i see it i feel like there's There's a lot more casual Korean restaurants happening nowadays in New York, like ours or Ariari, Busan style.
26:56That's my number one guy right there. I love Ariari. It's really good. That's one of my favorite pieces now up there too. Another thing is now Korean food is, I think, Korean restaurant tours focusing on the region of Korea. Like Ariari, per se, is from Busan. Odore, which recently opened in East Village, they're focusing on Gawon style. So I think now more and more restaurants are focusing on each province of Korea, so different parts of Korea. So I think that's very fun to watch. One day we're going to have Jolla province food here. Oh, yeah. We'll have Jeju dough at some point. It'll be a Jeju restaurant.
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27:32How's Old Ray? I've wanted to go and I haven't made it down there. Tell me, what's the scene report? I've never got a chance to try the Old Ray's house, but I know the chef Chang Ki there. He's one of my good friends. And I think he is right in the middle where it's not fine dining, it's not casual, but he turned it into an upscale Korean, which kind of all disappeared at some point, I feel like. But, you know, he also provided a set menu, like he said, which I think works perfectly in this kind of generation. But he's offering a set menu with a little bit of banchan that he showcases. Great concept.
28:07I love it. Audrey, I'm going to have to hit that up. And I love that he's doing Gangwon Do cuisine. Yeah. Odre means, I think, welcome and come on the world. It's so cool, man. It's like five years from now, I think we're going to have a totally different landscape. There'll be more restaurants that specialize in region. I believe you're right. And also, I just think that more chefs are going to start cooking with the seasoned Charlie ethic. Like this idea of taking southern roots, taking Mexican roots, taking Chinese-Korean and blending it up in a cool way. I'd love to see all that. There are so many Korean immigrants out in the different countries.
28:43So I'd love to see all that. It'll be fun. So what's your dream concept for this group that's growing? You went from one to two in three years. I got to imagine you're probably thinking about some other ideas, maybe not. So honestly, I think right now is not our time yet. We're getting there maybe in five years, maybe four years. our time might come, but I think right now it's our way of our seniors, senior alumni like Simon Kim or Kee-yeon of Hand Hospitality. So they pioneered a Korean restaurant industry into next level. I think our time will come in about four or five years, but my goal eventually, I wanted to show something different as well, different paths like Simon or Kee-yeon did.
29:28Since I grew up in atlanta georgia i actually lived in portland i lived in salisbury so i live in different parts of usa and what i realized is that there's always chinese restaurants japanese restaurants and thai restaurants and mostly all in the united states even in like the parts of usa that not a lot of koreans live but you couldn't really find korean restaurants at the time even now all the korean cuisine has been really popular i'm pretty sure if you go to north dakota alabama there's going to be cities that not much people know about Korean food. So I want to be able to make a concept that can work in those kind of city.
30:07So that's eventually my goal and game. Broad strokes, mood board. What are you thinking? You know, I think there could be, you know, like, let's say Korean fried chicken is a good concept that could work in, you know, those kind of city. Kimbab is another type of concept that could work in that kind of city. So I think, you know, if I think about Kisa, I'm not too confident that It'll work in North Dakota or Alabama. But if you think about Korean fried chicken, it's more approachable. So, you know, I'm still looking. I'm still learning as I go on. So hopefully I'll find the right concept to, you know, open up that could branch out to all the cities.
30:44And, you know, I want to have Korean cuisine all in those parts of the United States one day. I love it. I can't wait to see what your future holds. And go to Kisa now that it's open for lunch. I'm super excited. Definitely dinner. You're on Resi? Yes, we're on Resi. That's nice. Yes, finally. Finally. I've seen a lot of guests. You know, having the line was great. You know, at first we did that just because there's some restaurants I really wanted to go, but for some reason I can never make reservation. Like, Four Horsemen. Yeah. I wanted to go. Never can I find reservation. But if it's walk-in only, I thought that, hey, you know, at least if you wait a couple hours, you will get in.
31:23And the other side of it, there are some people that couldn't wait online, like elders or people out of town. So that's why we made the decision to make reservation open for the public. Do you hold some back for the line, too, or is it a reservation? Five o 'clock is only by the walk-in. We take reservation after six o 'clock only. All right, that's the hot tip. Show up at five. I love it. I feel like the line will continue. David, on This is Taste, we asked guests about their asserting taste. So to close this interview, here's a little rapid fire, fast and furious taste check. Are you ready? Okay, let's do it.
31:55The best fruit. Best fruit. Korean melon in summer season. Oh my gosh. The yellow Korean melon, as you might already know. Jameh. Yeah, Jameh. How do you serve it? You have to cut up the peel and you cut it half and half and just slice it. So there's an inner part of the melon. There's a controversy whether you eat that or whether you don't eat that. I eat the seeds actually so that's the way I would do it I like the guts too I think like why waste it yeah some people say your stomach might get hurt a little bit but mine was okay you're wrong with it the worst vegetable I would say cooked carrot in a food like let's say if you have cooked carrot in a chicken noodle soup or like Japanese curry you can only taste that carrot in my opinion it's a carrot well said we've never had that one I think that there are carrot lovers out there but also when it just floats that sugary sweet Uh-huh.
32:48It's not my favorite. Yeah, no, I'm with you. I'm buying it. I like that one. The best dessert? Recently, I had the key lime pie at Gallagher Steakhouse. It was pretty good. Oh, that sounds amazing. Yeah, I did not expect it at all. You know, dessert from Gallagher Steakhouse, but their key lime pie was really good. I mean, key lime and Korean food matches. I think so, too. Yeah. It's very citrusy. It's very umami. Like, you know, I love it. Totally. Great call. All right. Your favorite New York City restaurant right now? Ah, it's going to be another Korean one, to be honest. I would say Okdomsik.
33:21Okdomsik has to be my favorite restaurant. Solid. What about your favorite Korean restaurant outside of New York? It doesn't have to be here. It could be in Atlanta.
33:38Let me think. Did I throw you? Do you want to just do New York? Is that better? Yeah, I mean, I think I should have given you a different restaurant. for I guess it's okay it's okay for
33:52alright when I went to LA there was agashi gopjang there's one in New York right now but in LA there's agashi gopjang that place is fire that place is just dude gopjang is like one of those like intestines and sometimes stomach and on the grill with a little sesame oil uh huh alright there was a very different I think it's even better than ones in Korea in fact have you hit up young mani in LA ever do you know that no I haven't got to actually I heard a lot of good things about it, but never got a chance to. That spot's super good. I have to ask, I forgot to mention, did you grow up going to Yetu in Atlanta?
34:29Where? Yetu. Yetu. Is that the right way of saying it? I'm not too sure. It's in Doraville, I think. Honestly, you know, I came here right after high school when I was like. Oh, word. So you're. All right, we'll cut that one, Clayton. Let's move that one out. All right, we'll keep going. Your favorite city outside America to visit for food? I would say go to Jeolla province in Korea. So, you know, I came to USA when I was 10. So, you know, for me, I'm pretty new to Korea as much as other tourists, you know, that are going to go to Korea. When you go to Jeolla province, you're going to taste real Korean food.
35:08Like, especially I would say Yeosu. Yeosu had the best raw crab that I ever had with ghat kimchi. I think it's green mustard. Kimchi with that, oh my God. It was one of the best thing I ever had. I love that. Jeolla is such a beautiful place. Oh yeah, for sure. The food there is so great. Even for Koreans, I think food in Jeolla is very well known as being very tasty and with different varieties. Yeah, we get to spend a little time there. We write about it in our book, Korea World. Yeah. Yeah, I love that. Last one, your favorite sandwich. All right. it's gonna be Chick-fil-A number one classic but you know that's something I always have it in New York as well honestly speaking Chick-fil-A here does not taste the same as ones in Atlanta, Georgia but you know it tastes you know it's something I can have a little bit of southern in New York so chicken sandwich well said chicken sandwich is and you guys do a good one too as he has in Charlie's sometimes oh yeah we do pop up for chicken sandwich yeah but yeah Chick-fil-A is very classic you know your way around a chicken sandwich my man Dave, it's so great to catch up with you.
36:14Thank you for joining This Is Taste. Thank you so much, Matt. Appreciate it.
36:26Meher Singh, welcome to This Is Taste. How are you doing? I'm doing well, Matt. Thanks for having me. It's a real pleasure. You know, first time we've met, but you've written for Taste. And I wanted to have you in to talk about this amazing reporting you did for a recent story about young cheesemakers around the world. But first off, where are you eating in New York? You know, you're out on the scene, you're writing for all sorts of publications and covering restaurants. What's good to you right now? So, you know, New York, historically, huge oyster town, but I feel like we might be in the golden age of seafood in New York.
37:03You know, whether it's Penny and their icebox, so you can try a little bit of everything. smithereens from Nick Tamburo, Cloud Alum, fantastic. They do a barbecue monkfish, which I haven't had before. Oh my gosh. And this hot fried fish collar, just perfection. And later this month, Cravette from the team behind Dame and Lourdes is opening and it's easily one of the most anticipated openings of the year. A hundred percent. They're opening a third spot. What do you think is going to go down at this restaurant? So this is exclusively seafood from what I understand. It's on 10 Downing Street, so just poetic justice right there.
37:42Yeah, yeah, fun. So I can't wait for that to open. I've written about Chimansky in the past. I think he makes the best scotch egg around anywhere. Yeah, yeah. And the second thing that comes top of mind, that's top of mind for me, is Vietnamese bakeries. Lala Bake Shop in the East Village recently opened. They do this chiffon cake with the salted egg yolk frosting. Oh, wow. And they do this honeycomb cake, which is almost like a canela in texture. It's just fantastic. So Meher, what draws you to restaurants, you know, for your own joy, but also just for reporting for when you're looking for a story?
38:22That's a great question. So I come from a restaurant family. Both my parents own this Mediterranean cafe in Delhi. And it was one of the first back then when they opened. So I grew up cooking. I grew up in a restaurant kitchen. I remember doing things like filling Branzino back when I was, before I was even writing, really. And I think with restaurants specifically, they're so deeply personal to me. And, you know, with chefs, we're seeing all their beautiful creations, but their faces are not necessarily front and center. So, you know, it just feels, it's just gratifying to me to tell their stories and, you know, where they're coming from.
39:01When you started writing about chefs, how did your family business and the industry you grew up living in, how did that affect you and how you report? I feel like it's an amazing opportunity that you know the industry. It's cool. Thanks for saying that. I think food journalism is dramatically different in India. And we're not really talking about chefs unless they're on Asia's 50 best or, you know, they have a Michelin. And I think that's changing a bit more now. There's, you know, Go Air Journal and all these fantastic small publications covering food media now. But I think it was kind of the opposite how, you know, I started my career here covering restaurants.
39:43And then I went back home and wanted to write about all these chefs and all these incredible bartenders that, you know, you know the name of the restaurant, but you don't know the name of the chef. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I can't wait to keep reading your work. And we're going to go over a number of stories that you've written for Taste and Outside. But I really wanted to have you in to talk about this new piece that we just published this week. You profile a number of young cheesemakers. And it was an incredible job in getting all these voices into the piece. And I'm going to link to the show notes.
40:14Please read it. So off the jump, you know, what made you want to write about this younger generation of cheesemaker? So for me, it started with the cheese cutting videos on TikTok where people were pairing Latour, which is like a sheep's bree style cheese with sour gummy worms and nerds clusters. And I didn't, I was fixated. It had this almost mukbang like quality where you can't look away. And I didn't immediately realize that these are young people until I saw that video of cows jamming to Taylor Swift with Kaylee and her siblings. I think that's kind of when I discovered that, you know, I think there's something going on here.
40:58And I think this generation is obviously infusing a lot of fun and energy into the business, but they're so serious about it. And they take their craft so seriously. And, yeah, it's a tough business. Of course. And the business has very low margins. It's not, you know, a job that you would take on to make a lot of money. You have to love the craft. In interviewing all these cheesemakers, did you get a sense that they were maybe creating a new style or thinking about older styles in a new way? I mean, we're hearing about the way they market their cheeses in a clever way using social media. But what about the actual cheese?
41:37Of course, I'd agree with you. The marketing aspect, it has this, they use this high-low format, which I think is so approachable, right? nerds clusters and jawbreakers even. Well, you shave it with a microplane, but it's a whole thing. But the cheese itself, you know, Vito Di Checa comes to mind. He's been making his Amore Primitivo, you know, 15 years ago is when he came up with it. We've known for years that, you know, cheese and fruit works so well together, be it cheddar and apple pie or just like the pantheon of fruit compotes and chutneys on a charcuterie board. But I feel like younger people are bringing a real sense of adventure and just going for it, you know.
42:18Very cool. Let's stick with Vito. You know, he's an interesting guy. I've actually got to meet him last summer in Puglia and I got to try some of his cheeses. But he's making these cheese wedding cakes and these celebratory cakes using these marinated cured cherries. Talk us through what Vito is doing with these very TikTok friendly creations. So I guess when I first heard cheese wedding cake, I thought, wow, you can do that. And if you think about it, chefs and bakers are already pushing the envelope, right? You know, you see these massive flat slab wedding cakes. A wedding pavlova doesn't even have to be a cake.
42:57And so why not cheese? So, you know, Vito, his amore primitivo was way ahead of its time. He says in the piece that, you know, someone, an elder scolding him, saying, Vito, it's not a pastry shop. and, you know, there's Anika whiskey, blue cheese with candied figs from his mother's garden. And it's just a true shift that we're seeing happen now. Yeah, it's cool. Definitely check them out on Instagram. All the links are in the piece. I'm going to link to the piece in the show notes. So Kayla, first to now, is a 26-year-old cheesemonger at Hilldale Metcalf's, a specialty grocer in our favorite town, Madison, Wisconsin.
43:35We got to go there. Love that city. She went to the Harvard of cheesemaking, you know, which is an interesting way to frame this school. What did you learn about Kayla? Yeah. So, well, cheese technologist was not a part of my lexicon until I reported on this. And CSU, Cheese State University, which is the Harvard of cheesemaking, like you said, it's, you know, a five hour program, which doesn't seem intimidating. but the bar to be eligible and get in is pretty high because you need to be a seasoned cheesemaker or cheesemonger and have that sort of demonstrated expertise which you know Kayla naturally had.
44:14One of the things she brought up was that the industry has all these has this constellation of dining makers and they usually know each other and how it's such a safe space for women and queer people. And Kayla, along with other sources, reached out to me after the piece. And, you know, this is maybe the most clarifying part about being a writer, where they were so happy that they found each other because there are Gen Z people making cheese, but, you know, they're not necessarily getting as much representation as, you know, a bigger company like the Dejekas, for instance. Very, very good point.
44:50And I really loved that kind of element in your reporting about how young cheesemakers are building community with each other and how, you know, with, you know, queer cheesemakers finding community through the craft, but also through the queer community is something that is going to grow as more folks take, you know, the Harvard of Cheese course or wherever, you know, cheese is being made. And I think I'd like to hear about what is it about this generation that kind of and the idea that this generation, this young generation is embracing ancient crafts. What what did they bring that maybe, you know, the older cheesemakers aren't seeing in production?
45:38Right. So, you know, I feel like they're using cheese as a complete blank canvas. Even for me, you know, I'm a millennial. When I think of cheese, I think of wine and I think of pairings and stuffier renditions than what they're presenting. They're not as concerned about, oh, will this sell or does this have mass appeal? They're thinking about it in terms of how far can we go with this? What else can we put into it? You know, what things taste good together and how do we incorporate cheese into that rather than serving these things alongside cheese? it's so well said it's it's like fuck the rules like we're doing what we want to do and and why not because if you think about it cheese was invented as an accident what's the worst thing that can happen if your cheese sucks that is great that's such a good point maher did you uh when you're reporting the story did you just want to eat more cheese like because and editing the story and working with you i was like looking around my fridge and i didn't i had sad.
46:36It was like sad face. But did you get to try some cheeses? I think I always want to eat more cheese. I will say that reporting on this piece made my Trita Joe's Roquefort or whatever a lot less enticing, especially if it's up against Vito's cheese or, you know, Kaylee's cheese. And something Madeline said really stuck out to me that everyone, you know, at least once in their life, deserves to have access to incredible cheese, right? Because you will take yourself out for a celebratory meal. Why can't you have celebratory cheese? Well said. And when you're celebrating New York, do you have a favorite place that you're buying cheese at in New York?
47:15Do you go out to any of the spots? It's a bit of a commute, but I love Bedford Cheese Shop down in the West Village, Gramercy. Yeah, it's a great, great store. Good wreck there. Let's move on and talk about another piece you wrote for taste the state of the caesar salad i think eliza and i maybe brought this to you or maybe you pitched it i can't remember but we were we've been talking about caesars for a while we wanted to really write a definitive taste piece and you really did that i'm a link to the show notes um i think like we came at it like there's a lot of caesar salad content out there there was a big anniversary recently what did you find out about the state of the caesar So first, you know, you mentioned how this idea came about.
47:58I think it was a real group project in that I pitched it as, you know, Caesar salads having a resurgence and people are putting things like kimchi and pig ears into it. But it wasn't, you know, we worked around it, we workshopped it, and then we realized, why are people not stopping talking about this? Like, why is it so inescapable? It was such a wild ride. I think one thing that sticks out to me is that so many people I spoke with had trouble precisely defining why it's their favorite salad. And like Sung, the former Savoar editor, said that a plurality of Americans are only now realizing that it contains anchovies.
48:39so you know it it could be you know maybe that it's an umami bomb of a salad but that's not quite the full picture because you know you have things like cobs and other salads that are also super savory i think just the mass appeal has a lot to do with the fact that the caesar at least to my knowledge was the first dressing to be packaged and mass sold at least the first creamy dressing because prior to that um you would have a simple green salad with olive oil or something like that But yeah, the Caesar is just sort of everywhere. It's a lot more approachable than the Cobb. It's easier to veganize.
49:14And I did mention this in the piece, but if you were to go to Dubai or Delhi or Singapore, if you go to an Italian restaurant, there will definitely be a Caesar on the menu, even though it's not quite Italian. And the server will almost definitely recommend it to you. Yeah. When we were going over that piece, we we definitely shift energies a little bit because it was yes, there is a resurgence. But the why was answered, as you said, clearly it was is one of the first bottle dressings. And I also just will add that, you know, Caesar is one of those. it's like we're conditioned as as american diners you know to to think of the caesar as this always good like i feel like i am pleased like this is a conversation i'm like there's like this idea that there isn't a bad caesar because of the umami bomb because of possibly the anchovies not really the case but did you find the ubiquity was maybe just our conditioning as diners Conditioning, for sure.
50:17But I will say that if you were to put Caesar dressing on a boot and eat it, it would also taste good. So true. I think just the popularity has a lot to do with the fact that the Caesar is a household name, kind of like Xerox or Uber. It's the Uber of salads. And it's hard to beat that. That is the line of the episode. Great. The Uber of salads. So well said. Let's move on to a piece you wrote for New York Magazine about Bungalow. And they worked on this cocktail that you're going to tell us about for months and months and you follow them. I would love to get a sense of also Bungalow as a restaurant.
50:51I know I've had a lot of people on the show who want to go there. I've not been, so I have no first-hand experience, but I'd like to go. And it seems to me that this restaurant is really – it's a moment right now. And, you know, Indian Food is having an absolute moment. Bungalow is one of many great restaurants. But first off, tell us a little bit about this cocktail reporting. For sure. So this was early last year, I think, when the piece came out. And milk punches have been having a moment for the past year, two years. You know, every bar has at least one clarified item now. And that was not the case three years ago.
51:26Right. You know, Super Bueno, one of the best bars in the country, does a sour plum and tamarind tradition. There's Jaila straight by Union Square that only does milk punches. It's a small bar with something like 13 seats. with bungalow. The cocktail is called chai pani, which translates to milk tea. It's like a loose translation. And I'll admit I was really skeptical at first because it's not the first time a South Asian restaurant's doing a chai-based cocktail. You know, you have chai teenies, all these other delicious drinks, but they're never quite great because I think so much of the emphasis is on the spirit rather than the chai or the technique.
52:08With the Bangalore Chai Pani, the owners almost gave up on this cocktail because there was so much trial and error. So firstly, finding the right chai, they sourced all kinds of teas from all over the subcontinent, made their own house blend just for this cocktail. They first tried brewing the tea with milk as is traditional in South Asia, realized that did not work well for clarification. so they brewed the tea separately. This is sacrilegious in South Asian culture, not adding milk to your brew tea. And it all came together. It takes about 36 hours to prepare from start to finish. And yeah, it's a real feat.
52:47I think my favorite thing about the cocktail is just the attention to detail, right? Because on the glass is a swipe of this Parleji and milk crumb crumble. And Jaya wrote a fantastic piece for taste about Parleji. Indian biscuits that, you know, just remind me of childhood. And also the dehydrated milk powder is just a big, a huge, if you know, you know, you know, everyone who grew up in the South Asia, in the global South, I'm sorry, just we would eat fistfuls a bit from the back. It was just great. Yeah, yeah. And about the restaurant, too. When you're dining there, what's a meal like at Bungalow?
53:24And how can you square this incredible, I would say, exposure and popularity to South Asian cuisine in New York through this wonderful restaurant? I think South Indian food specifically has finally arrived in New York. And for years, you know, it was all butter chicken and garlic naan. And it's not really a good representation of South Asian food or even how South Asians eat. What's so special about Bangalore is, you know, obviously Vikas Khanna, a great chef, with a really inspiring personal story. But it's the first South Asian restaurant in New York that serves dishes from all over India. because, you know, there is Dharmaka in all those restaurants, but they predominantly lean towards the north.
54:10And then you have something like a Kanyakumari, also a great restaurant, but that focuses specifically on certain coastal states. Bangalore is just like a good journey throughout India. There's a lot of great vegan dishes. Like, for example, there's a pineapple curry, you know, stewed and coconut milk. Great. There's a yogurt kebab, which is, you know, all these things you don't really find in New York. And I think for so long, London was sort of the champion when it came to Indian restaurants, right? We still don't have something like a Gymkhana in New York. But recently, Pasarine opened in Gramercy from the former Sona team.
54:47And I think that comes pretty close, both in ambience and in terms of the menu. I can't wait to go to Bungaloo. You've really got me excited. And last but not least, I wanted to talk to you about a piece you wrote for Eater. Akabanga chili oil. It is, you call it, it's Rwandan chili oil. That's with air quotes when you wrote me about this piece. And I'm linking to it in the show notes. Fascinating product. What did you learn about this, the cooking with this product? Right. So just the thought of Akabanga makes my mouth water. Because it's a chili oil, but it's unlike any other chili oil you've had, right?
55:23It's not like a Japanese raju or a Sichuan chili oil. It has this inherent smokiness and meatiness, almost like sautéed mushrooms. So, you know, it works beautifully with, you know, whether you're making like a meaty lasagna asugo or, you know, an Indian lamb curry. It just brings so much flavor. And it's sold in these tiny eyedropper bottles because it's incendiary. Yeah. It's so spicy, like you need to use it with caution. Yeah, and it's a super fascinating origin story as well. And is there one brand? Is it like a category? I'm not familiar with the product. So there's something called Urusenda, which is common throughout sub-Saharan Africa, mostly East Africa.
56:07And it's this condiment with scotch bonnet peppers, vinegar and oil. And this street stall vendor called Sina Girard, you know, we're in 1980s Kigali. He's a street vendor selling mandozi, which are these savory donuts. And he wanted to come up with a sauce. So he basically blended this urusenda, which is almost like a deconstructed hot sauce, if you will, and made it so spicy where it just, I think initially it was shock value. And I think other brands also make it, but Akabanga is sort of the Heinz of the urusenda world, if you will. It's the brand, Akabanga. And you can probably order that online.
56:48Of course, go to your local market and find it. Yeah, absolutely. Wonderful. What are you working on now? Like, I don't want to spoil any show, but writing-wise, we got to get you on a taste story. That's for sure. But what are you working on? I'm writing a guide to one of the most historic neighborhoods in the city, which has always been associated with certain foods. And I'm writing about how that's completely changed over the past five years. And another piece I'm writing about is an exploration of this Chinese-American classic that's having a moment. I can't tell you what it is. No, you're not going to tell me any of this because, you know, it's for other publications.
57:26And I will be linking to it in our Friday newsletter when it comes out. But I can't wait. Your journalism is incredible. And I can't wait to work with you on another piece. Meher, thank you so much for joining This Is Taste. Thank you so much for having me. This was great.
57:45This Is Taste is hosted by Eliza Abarbanel and me, Matt Rodbar. The show is produced by Shalia Harris and Pat Stango and edited by Clayton Gumbert. Theme music by Steve Rydell. Visit Taste Online at tastecooking.com and make sure to subscribe to our newsletter for updates on all cool things that are happening.
From the publisher
David Joonwoo Yun has a great story to tell. As one of the partners of New York City Korean restaurants C as in Charlie and Kisa, he’s been at the center of Korean cooking in NYC for a minute. But how did he get here? And how did he and his partners eventually redefine Korean cooking one banchan at a time? We dig into his great story in this terrific episode.
Also on the show we have a great conversation with journalist Mehr Singh, who speaks about her recent TASTE reporting digging into Gen Z cheesemakers. We also talk about her career, and some memorable stories.
Do you enjoy This Is TASTE? Drop us a review on Apple, or star us on Spotify. We’d love to hear from you.
MORE KOREAN FOOD EPISODES:
This Is TASTE 391: Koreaword with Koreaworld with Cote and Coqodaq’s Simon Kim [Apple]
This Is TASTE 390: Koreaworld with Eater LA Editor Matthew Kang [Apple]
This Is TASTE 388: Koreaworld with Doshi's Susan Kim [Apple]
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