Ebola conspiracies

0:02Noel King:It's hundreds of Kenyans in the town of Nanyuki today, protesting a plan by the Trump administration to send American citizens who've been exposed to Ebola in Central Africa to Kenya instead of bringing them home. This Ebola outbreak started in the Democratic Republic of Congo. It's since spread to Uganda. But there are currently no confirmed cases in Kenya. And so Kenyans are asking, why send the Americans here? I spoke to the head of the Kenya Doctors' Union lobby group and he was like, why would we import something that is not here? Why should we make Kenya an epicenter and then add cases and have us deal with this?

0:43Noel King:Today Explained from Vox does not appreciate cliches, but between cuts to American aid in the region, the sheer aggressiveness of this virus and conspiracy theories that threaten public health workers, this Ebola outbreak has become a perfect storm. That is coming up next.

1:01This is Today Explained.

1:03Noel King:The Wall Street Journal broke the story of the Trump administration's plan to send Americans who've been exposed to Ebola to Kenya instead of letting them come home. WSJ National Politics reporter Sabrina Siddiqui, what is the plan? So what the administration has been trying to do is set up a quarantine facility in Kenya at an Air Force base where they would essentially house Americans who have been exposed to Ebola and anyone who also tests positive. The number one priority of our foreign policy is to protect the American people. We cannot and will not allow any cases of Ebola to enter the United States.

1:40And they're kind of describing it as somewhat of a tent hospital, but there are various plans underway for also adding potentially, if needed, isolation units and biocontainment units. That is, of course, if there are people who truly get sick or need further care. But even then, I think what they see this as is an opportunity to have a place for Americans to quarantine while they're evaluated. And they have deployed public health officers from the United States to assist with these efforts. And one thing that they have also said is that if Americans test positive, they would only perhaps stay at this facility for a couple of days before being sent to another country.

2:22And they're looking at facilities in Europe that could potentially accommodate Americans if they were to truly get sick.

2:27Noel King:OK, so what the U.S. is saying is we don't want you coming back into the U.S. You look at the reaction to this here at home and there's a lot of shock. Ebola outbreaks have happened before. This is a very dangerous, dangerous virus. How does the U.S. usually handle this when our citizens are affected? That's actually been very striking about the administration's response to this particular outbreak, because in previous outbreaks, Americans who had been exposed to Ebola or who had tested positive were allowed to return home and they were monitored and cared for at quarantine facilities here in the United States.

3:09Two Americans infected with Ebola are expected back in the U.S. for treatment. For the first time in history, doctors right here in the United States will battle the Ebola virus.

3:19Noel King:And it's been called a miracle. Doctors say two American missionary workers stricken with Ebola are cured. We're going to have new monitoring and movement guidance that is sensible, based in science, and tailored to the unique circumstances of each health worker that may be returning from one of these countries after they have provided the kind of help that they need. And we do have biocontainment units as well. During this recent Hantavirus outbreak, American passengers who were aboard the cruise ship where that outbreak occurred have been quarantining at one of those biocontainment units in Nebraska.

3:56So it's frankly been bizarre to a lot of public health officials I've spoken with and epidemiologists that Americans would not be allowed to come home. And it just appears to be the case that the Trump administration is taking a very hard line against letting anyone who is known to have Ebola to be allowed back here in the United States, because what they're saying is that they do not want any Ebola cases to exist in the United States during this outbreak. Multiple agencies involved here are also very involved in tracking people just to make sure that nobody comes into this country that has Ebola and creates a problem for us.

4:30Noel King:Okay, so the plan is send Americans to Kenya. And what is the status of that plan? It's interesting because the Trump administration announced that the U.S. and Kenya had reached an agreement to stand up this quarantine facility for Americans in Kenya. And then a Kenyan high court put a temporary hold on the Trump administration's plan to set up that facility. Huh. So right now, the plan is very much in limbo. And the expectation is that the Kenyan court will reconsider this case tomorrow. But as of now, it's not clear if the plan is even going to move forward. OK, and I imagine that's in part because Kenya feels like Kenya has a say in this.

5:15Noel King:And it may be that Kenyan authorities have agreed to something, but Kenyan people feel differently. And again, I'm, you know, we're keeping in mind that Ebola is a very, very dangerous virus. How did people in Kenya respond when they were told the United States wants to send its citizens to you? That's precisely what I think the issue is here. One of the lawyers who is part of the legal group that is arguing this case said, and I quote, is Kenya being reduced to a dumping site? Wow. And I think that really captures the mood of many Kenyans who learned about this plan through news reports and were wondering why and frankly critical of their government for agreeing to allow Americans who had been exposed to Ebola to be rerouted to Kenya when there are no known or suspected cases of Ebola in Kenya.

6:11How is it that the Americans say they don't want to touch this thing? They want to stay away from it. Yet we are the ones who think we are Wakanda, that we are going to step up and fight Ebola. We are saying, hell no, take that facility to DRC, take it to where it's needed. Why would you create a facility in my country and it doesn't serve me? Yet the same, same facility is going to host people who are endangering my own life. And there are obviously a lot of concerns, including from medical groups in Kenya, that there could perhaps be an outbreak in Kenya that stems from bringing Americans to the country who've been exposed to the virus.

6:49Does anyone know why Kenya? The administration said that they were looking for somewhere in the region that is unaffected by the outbreak, where they don't believe there is as high risk of spread. And that is not too far so that people could get there quickly. Obviously, there are also just politics involved, and it seems like they were able to come to some kind of agreement with the government, even if it's been halted by the courts. And I also think that, again, this is temporary for people who actually get sick. So it doesn't even look like it was necessarily a long-term plan in terms of how they plan to actually use this facility, because at the same time that they're saying Americans can quarantine in Kenya, They also said that anyone who truly gets sick would be evacuated to a tertiary care center and that they're currently talking to partners in Europe to try and identify where sick patients can be taken.

7:42But again, these are just some of the questions that a lot of people have around the administration's plans, which they haven't been terribly forthcoming about, and which, again, have drawn criticism not just from people in Kenya, but also from public health experts here at home who simply do not understand why they would not allow Americans to return to their home country.

8:03Noel King:Let me ask you what you've been hearing from public health experts, because there is, from the non-experts point of view, there's kind of a knee-jerk sense in this. It's Ebola's dangerous, keep people where they are, or keep people elsewhere so that they don't bring Ebola into the United States. You said public health experts say this does not make sense. Why doesn't it make sense? What do they tell you? Well, I think there are a couple things that are at play. One is that public health experts do say that it is the responsibility of the United States government to take care of its own people and to allow them to return home so that they could receive the highest quality of care and that they have these state-of-the-art facilities specifically designed for outbreaks and viruses like Ebola.

8:58We built and sustained a system of specialized treatment centers all around the United States that are capable of managing patients exactly like this. Right now, those are sitting empty. I personally feel that the United States has a moral and ethical obligation to its citizens that if they're going to be abroad, especially helping out people during this global health outbreak, that we should be taking care of our own. I also think that there is the component of mental health and that in addition to just needing to receive the appropriate care, that people should have access to their support system, that they should be allowed to be in closer proximity to their families if they were to get sick.

9:39And people see that as a moral responsibility that the United States has to afford Americans that opportunity. There's also just the fact that in previous outbreaks, Americans were brought home and the Trump administration has not provided a medical rationale for why they're so opposed to Americans coming back home. Other than saying that time is of the essence when someone has Ebola. Well, time was also of the essence in prior outbreaks and the U.S. did not stop Americans from returning home.

10:11Noel King:Yeah, they're sort of acting like normies would act. normies who are worried and say, don't get this near me, which is not the same way historically that medical professionals act. Okay. So you've been covering the hantavirus outbreak as well. And I wonder whether you're seeing a pattern here or a trend here in the way this administration is responding to these public health crises, where the public is inclined to freak out a bit and public health experts might have a different idea of what needs to happen. Well, here's what's really fascinating about covering the hantavirus outbreak as well as the ebola outbreak the trump administration has been willing to embrace these very aggressive quarantine and isolation measures despite the fact that this administration is full of people at the highest levels of leadership who were so critical of what they saw as heavy-handed social distancing and isolation guidelines during the COVID-19 pandemic.

11:11Tonight, fresh anger rippling across the country. I need my job. I need to work. From coast to coast, thousands of people frustrated. Whether it's masks, whether it is statements of social distancing, statements like the things about travel restrictions, it's like, what are we hoping to accomplish with this? And they're going even further. There are a couple of passengers who wanted to leave the Nebraska facility where those who've been exposed to hantavirus have been quarantining. And the acting director of the CDC, Jay Bhattacharya, signed an order forcing them to stay there. And now, as those passengers are reaching the end of their quarantine period, these are those who are exposed to hantavirus who have been asymptomatic and do not have hantavirus.

11:55As they're now returning to their home states, the Trump administration is essentially insisting on 24-7 monitoring and not allowing them to leave their homes. So oddly enough, it's a very heavy handed way that the Trump administration has responded to these outbreaks, even though in some ways they were the ones who politically used criticisms of public health institutions and of the scientific community during COVID as a way to appeal to voters who are frustrated by these exact kinds of guidelines and rules during that pandemic.

12:28Noel King:All right. So we are waiting on the Kenyan court to make a decision on Tuesday. What are the stakes here? What happens if Kenya says, no, President Trump, we're just not going to allow this? Well, that's actually going to be a really interesting moment if it comes to pass, because it is not entirely clear if the Trump administration has a plan B.

12:51It just seems like this entire plan came together very quickly. Even the public health officers who were deployed to Kenya, when they were called upon for this assignment, they only received about three days training. And that's something that some public health officials said simply isn't enough for people who are going to go and try to staff a facility where you have this rare strain of a deadly virus. And so when the Trump administration is talking about whether or not they would be able to send Americans to other facilities in Europe, they still haven't identified where those care centers would be, which just signals that they haven't really thought through what would happen if they are not allowed to stand up this facility in Kenya.

13:34And I suspect that while they're still negotiating with the Europeans, it's very likely that people in Europe would have the same reaction as those in Kenya. Why are you sending potentially sick Americans here rather than allowing them to return home?

13:58Noel King:That was The Wall Street Journal's Sabrina Siddiqui. Coming up next, how conspiracy theories about Ebola have made it harder to fight the spread in the Democratic Republic of Congo. We're going to talk to a reporter in Kenya.

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17:18This is Today Explained.

17:22Noel King:We're back with Raelle Ambor. She's a reporter with The Washington Post in Nairobi. She's been writing about, among other things, Ebola conspiracy theories. I asked Raelle why this has become such an issue in this outbreak. Whenever there's a crisis, then people try to find reason for it. And there's always populations that are not so informed. There's always going to be resistances, quarters of resistance. We saw that during COVID also when people, we had anti-vaxxers who were like, this thing is not good for the system. This is population control for Africa and all that. So this was also bound to happen.

17:58And this is not really the first time that we are having people saying that these diseases are hoax. When you talk about a hoax, we're basically saying Ebola does not exist. It's a lie. It's something that has been created to get our minerals. It is something that has been created to harvest people in the hospitals and kill them until they can take away our minerals.

18:24Noel King:Congo is a very mineral-rich country. Exactly. And especially the Eastern Democratic Republic of Hong Kong. The eastern part of the country is rich in gold, cobalt. This specific village, Monguali, where the outbreak has occurred, is a gold mining region. And most of the people actually I spoke to are telling me this is where it started. One of the first cases was in a health center in Monguali. These are really, really poor communities. There's no running water. There's no proper health care system. The health care system was pretty dependent on aid, on foreign aid. So one of the things that people are saying, number one, this is a hoax.

19:08Number two, what I've seen from my reporting is that they're saying that these non-profit workers, They have brought this disease to get more money. That's why you're seeing there were attacks, this hostility towards health workers. I interviewed someone who got Ebola in 2018 during that outbreak. And this person, there's so much stigma that everyone ran away from them. When he got better after a couple of weeks, he went home and he found his family wasn't there because they believe that when you go to an Ebola treatment center, you're not supposed to come out alive. You're supposed to be dead.

19:49These people who go ahead and believe that the people actually operating in these Ebola treatment centers are demons like the devil.

19:59Noel King:And the reason for that, I imagine, is Ebola is a very deadly disease. So if you go into a health center, there is a chance you're not coming out. People are seeing that and they're thinking that means you go into an Ebola center and you don't come out because the people there don't want you to come out. Yeah. Imagine you're in a village deep inside Eastern Congo. And one morning you wake up and there's blood coming out of your mouth and blood coming out of your nose. And this is something that people have not seen before. And within days, this is happening to your brother and your sister. And just previous, in a few days earlier, you okay?

20:38So this, the way Ebola manifests itself, I think also has people really scared. You're looking at this, the hemorrhagic manifestations, you know, the fever, the headache, the vomiting, you know. And this brings so much fear. so we reported on a story in Rampara where there's a young man who was pretty popular he was a football player he sang in his local church and one day he falls sick and he's being treated at home and then he's rushed to the hospital and when he gets to the hospital he dies just hours after getting to the hospital so quickly the family is told that this person has passed on and the body was being held.

21:26And as with Ebola, there's procedures in which these bodies are intact and they're trying to give them dignified send-offs. And so the people are really outraged because in the culture of the place, the bodies, when someone dies, the body is brought home. They stay one, two days feasting and eating and bury the bodies. But with Ebola, this is impossible. So people were really outraged and they stormed their friends and family. They stormed into this Rampara hospital and they burnt the tents and there was a body that someone else in the tent was just passed on of Ebola. That body was also burnt.

22:04And in the process, we had six patients fled. So that means these people also did not want to be held in that center. They did not want to be treated in that center. So in the process of the Rampara hospital being lit up, We had six patients escaped. And the next day in a different hospital, there's 18 people also who escaped the hospital. So these are people who are going to go back to the communities who don't believe they are unwell. And this is how this is spreading at the moment.