#2916 LOVE ISLAND: State of the Union with Hunter Harris

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1:29Ben Mandelker: Hello and welcome to Watch What Crap Inns, a podcast about all that crap on Bravo that we love to talk about. But sometimes it's not just Bravo, sometimes it's Peacock too. And today it's a very special episode. Our sweet, sweet Ronnie Karam is not here today because he's having his eyes done. Very exciting. I'm Ben Mandelker, by the way. And in his place is the one and only Hunter Harris, who is one of the co-hosts of Let Me Say This podcast, and also writer of hung up on sub stack hunter thank you so much for joining us here today thank you i'm so excited i am dying to talk about love island well you're in luck because that's exactly what we're going to do we're going to have a love island state of the union now normally our love island content uh we do all our all of our recaps all season have been on patreon but this one's actually going on the crappin's main feed because we feel like it's you know the finale is this Sunday and we need to like stop and assess, take a breather and get a lay of the land.

2:32Ben Mandelker: Right off the bat, let's talk about favorites. I feel like I know who your favorite is just from seeing you on Instagram. And I feel like we're going to, we're going to, we're going to have to talk about this because I think your favorite is not my favorite. Oh, listen, I've had this. Who are you standing? I've had the same conversation 50 times this season. What can I say? I love Ace. I know boo his tomato, tomato, So no, Ace is a comedian for second and third. It's not Love Island. It's truly Ace running that island as if he's the landlord. And I love it. He definitely is running that island.

3:05Ben Mandelker: Like whether you like him or don't like him, he really has everyone kind of, I'm not even gonna say wrapped around his finger because that implies that they're actually doing anything that requires being wrapped around a finger. But like, because they're just lounging around. But he really does seem to be the one that they're all going to for like advice and thoughts. and you know like he's like the wise elder which is wild because he's like 21 or something like that yeah the wise elder at 22 years old but i i mean i don't know i this is only my second love island season but i'm i'm such a like bravo survivor girl so i when i see ace like truly positioning himself in every main scene at all times and kind of um you know making like ally ships and building coalition we can say um i recognize that behavior because really ace is like in the middle of a lot of big um storylines this season whether it's like him and amaya amaya and austin um huda and jeremiah um even in nicolandria ace is kind of like in the background telling nick i think you should go over her i think this i could see this working um and then in addition to that i don't know if you noticed but like everyone who does like an exit interview after they leave the villa they all said that they think that strongest couple is ace and shelly and I think that says a lot.

4:19Ben Mandelker: Yeah. I mean, it's so funny because you mentioned that Ace is in the middle of the storylines of like Amaya and Huda and Jeremiah. I'm like, he was like a terrible part of those storylines. He was like the villain in those stories. He was like the bad part of those stories, right? Like he was a total hater and kicked off Jeremiah. Like that's undeniable. Yeah. And he was like, and he was so cruel to Amaya. That was a big turning point for me because Because I was on, I was, I was ace rising at that point. You know, I was like, you know what? The season started. I thought he was going to be just like terrible.

4:53Ben Mandelker: I thought he was gonna be a total fuck boy. I thought he was going to just like every new bombshell that would come in. He would just like drop him leave for the next one. I thought he was going to be awful. And then I was like, wait a second. He's not like that. And I started to like him. And, and, you know, he is so darn cute. He is so cute. He's so cute. Like he, like the camera loves him. He is adorable. but uh so i was like oh my god i think i like ace and then he was so mean to amaya i have not been able to get over that i think it was so above and beyond cruel okay i i see what you're saying and i understand i'm listening and i'm learning but can i say i feel like yes ace was you know quite cruel to amaya's face however look at how zach treated her look at how austin treated her and ace was the one in that um mailbag like staying on business sort of calling it a challenge is honestly crazy in that activity um where he says to austin you were feeling this way about amaya for days and didn't say a word to her face you were telling all the guys a different story but to her you were saying like okay like whatever like begrudgingly say next to her and zach uh zach with a k who is i was like he's gonna like break up like shake up the veil because he's so hot but then i saw those like yes like big veneers and i was like maybe not um but even zach was like days oh truly and even like i thought his tattoos were so hot but anyway i digress um but zach was like acting like he was into a maya and then all of a sudden in front of everyone switched up and was like actually the babe stuff is too much that like affection is too much and ace was the only one who was at least willing to like not lead her on string her along which i he didn't handle it in the best way but also i don't think he handled it in the worst way okay i mean boy mom right now i feel like i feel like sure you can get credit for being like upfront and honest i don't sometimes i actually think that like honesty is like slightly overrated i think there's like something i think there's something about like um you know if you have a choice between being like sort of dishonest and like not hurting someone's feelings versus being like honest but it's gonna be like incredibly cruel i don't know i'm like i don't i don't know if that was like a huge like win for the honesty camp however i do think no i mean the worst the worst like pr rep for honesty i'm gonna say is like bethany frankel and ramona singer do people who are always honest and you're like wait but no we don't actually need honesty all the time you know but that being said i think that like ace austin and zach were like literally like they each were like so flawed about their approaches to amaya which is why i'm so happy that she has found brian because i feel like she finally has found someone who just like appreciates like the way she talks and like her emotions and how she moves like like it was it was just wild i felt like she was being shamed so much in that villa and i kind of felt like it all started with ace but um but you are right he was ace was up front in a way that austin never was and by the way thank god austin is out of that that villa because i could not deal another day with that voice the voice but also i'm like who who are you here with like who are you here for it was always so nonsensical that he was still in the villa because he had no real connection to anyone no one and like he had like a little bit the the shelly triangle in the beginning of the season yeah he just was like floating around like a plastic bag in the ocean And it was just, he was just there for way, way too long.

8:25Ben Mandelker: I mean, realistically, I think we can all agree he should have been voted out instead of Jeremiah during that pivotal, pivotal, you know, vote off ceremony. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I, I think my favorite thing about that vote is that all season Jeremiah had thought that he and Nick were like boys, like that they like were really good friends. because he even told huda like i need to tell someone i need you to tell someone that you're a mom i want to talk to someone about this and my closest friend is nick meanwhile nick in that vote was like ace is my guy i'm sorry ace says you need to go so you need to go and also nick nick coming out that nick truly again and again like just cannot stand huda and always is like voting for her we'll look at her in her face and vote her off at every opportunity is so funny to me and then but he'll like have these moments where he'll pull her aside and almost play the role of like a caring friend who's just gonna be honest and you know uh level with her and then he will go around and just be like like he'll be like yeah i'm gonna vote you off yet again it's a weird dynamic by the way going back to ace how did you feel about what during the stand-on business challenge when he kind of like humiliated shelly like right there like by writing her a letter that was also honest oh yes yeah she did not like that she was like why would you why would you just like put me on blast like in front of the entire group like that which i did not like this this is not another another case another another piece of evidence for me in the anti-ace camp anti-ace camp oh my goodness no i anti-ace case i see i see both sides i definitely see why shelly would be like don't bring this in front of the group like why would you address it but it is a reality TV show.

10:02I mean, it is like, this is what they're here to do is to settle stuff on camera. And that's how you get the best scene. I, Ace is a field producer. I don't know if you know, like he is on boots on the ground, making sure drama happens on camera. But I do think Ace was kind of right about Shelley, like wanting him to decide on her, but then wanting to keep Chris around. I'm not the biggest Chris fan either. I think the way that he's like, I mean, him and Huda together is honestly like Jeremiah all over again. Like they're both just like doing all the wrong things and pushing each those buttons.

10:30But I do, I see Ace's point, like, what is, you are kind of not rushing, but you are, as he said, I think you move very intentionally and all of us has felt intentional to me. And I think it was kind of making me sad to see people on the internet being so mean to Shelly. And it's like, okay, well, she can make a mistake and I still like adore her. I mean, and I think, you know, she and Ace have rebuilt and that is probably a testament to like how

10:55Ben Mandelker: strong their bond really is yeah the people were very mean to shelly i really like shelly a lot um i thought that was like her weakest moment of the season was like everything's sort of surrounding that like that three day or that two day period that we had of like the heart rate challenge going into like the stand-on business challenge that was like not like her strongest moment but it is funny that he accuses her of being like you know you move very intentionally and although maybe i guess maybe it's not an accusation maybe he's just saying you move intentionally because he moves intentionally right like yeah very very intentional so was do you think he was criticizing her for moving intentionally or just saying because you and move intent because you move intentionally i felt like you can't act like oh i was just exploring is that what you feel i think certainly the latter i think certainly the latter because also i think that's kind of what that's what ace is drawn to is that like i think that was almost kind of the biggest disconnect between him and Amaya is that Amaya, Amaya Papaya, she's so like, um, kind of goofy and silly and Ace likes a more serious person.

11:57I'm thinking of Coco as well, his like Casa Amor. He liked that she was very intentional and kind of serious and that she really spoke with, um, like conviction.

12:07Ben Mandelker: Oh, thumbs up. Okay. Period. Yeah. Yeah. By the way, StreamYard gave you a thumbs up just now. StreamYard is team Ace. Thank you. Um, but I, I think that, yeah, I think that Ace was really probably hurt that like, he knows how intentionally, or I should say how like certain Shelly is and that she was moving with so much uncertainty. It's like, but after all of this, you're still looking at like the, you know, alleged professional basketball player who doesn't have a team or a home. Totally. Totally. You know, I have to say like, for me, like I've, I've really enjoyed Shelly all season. And for a while, she was like my number one in the house, but I think where she started to lose me a little bit is that I felt like she enjoyed being in a triangle a little bit too much I felt like the whole thing with like Austin Ace went on like just a little bit too long to the point where I was thinking we all know you like Ace yeah you're still trying to act like you like Austin and then with Chris I felt like it was starting up again and I was like oh here we go again um and so maybe that was like I wonder if Ace was picking up on that energy that like that i know that i felt i wonder if you're like me no i i can totally see that because i i maybe there's something about shelly's previous relationships that make her like familiar with that kind of like stuck in the middle dynamic because i do think that she kind of gravitated toward trying to maybe not make that happen but like to a place in which she's kind of choosing between two men um when we all can see that she even from you know when she was coupled up with austin technically in name only was like had the most attention for and the most um emotion for ace that was by the way one of the rudest things that happened all season was that shelly had to be stuck with austin for like two weeks on this show it was like it seemed like it was eternal that she was stuck with him it was a really long time and then um i feel like shelly shelly really seemed to focus lock in as they say with ace i feel like after the uh they found out about America's views.

14:13Ben Mandelker: Yeah. It seemed almost like that seemed to bring them together a little bit more, right? Like it seemed like they were like, oh, wait, America's not like happy with us right now. And I wonder if they had this moment of like, well, we know that we're good. And that somehow made them kind of say, you know what, fuck all this other bullshit. Like, let's just focus on us right now. Did you get that vibe? No, I think that's very perceptive. I guess I noticed individually how Ace and Shelly had both kind of ranked themselves a lot higher than America had ranked them, which they are both high in my heart.

14:43I'll say that. But I do think that they sort of bonded over it. And you can also see in the same way how Taylor and Clark, after both being ranked at the bottom by America, I was like, ooh. But that's how I felt. So I wasn't mad. But I think that a lot of the couples really locked in after seeing who could be a potential winner based on America decides. Because I don't know if you noticed, but Zach also, after all he said about Amaya during that Sinon Business Challenge, then once he sees how high Amaya is getting rated in all of these little games, then he's like, oh, actually, Amaya Papaya, I have so much love for you, da-da-da.

15:22and it's like but just a minute ago you were telling her that you didn't want to kiss her in casa and i was like a peck it was just so crazy and now he's switching it up a hundred percent once he sees that like america that she is kind of like the people's princess that's when he was

15:37Ben Mandelker: totally like i was i already thought he was sort of garbage for calling her out during that challenge which i thought was was totally bullshit but then when he then then on after the stand on business challenge when they had that like they had that one challenge i want forever with it like slam through doors yeah and like then he pulled her into the ball pit for like an extra kiss and i was like oh you're a big faker you saw that she's really popular this is all bullshit i've lost all respect for you zach i'm sorry there was a moment in time where we all thought like zach and amaya were gonna like take over and yeah i was like no this is this dream is completely dead i also think by the way the reason why shelly and ace came back together after that challenge is because they probably realized like oh america doesn't like us because we're doing all this like triangle stuff like everything with huda and with chris and every like the whole thing they're probably like oh people don't like us right now we should probably stop with this bullshit just focus on each other yeah so i think again their savviness kicked in there but either way i don't want to i don't want to like fixate on them because i love that you love them because i think what's so important when you watch reality shows is that you pick your favorites and you just go with it and you have fun with it and you're like you know like you just pick you just do and like Like you defend them even when you like I have I've had so many reality stars that I've enjoyed that I can't really defend.

16:52Ben Mandelker: But I just will find ways to defend. I'm not saying you're like coming up with like workarounds. I get it. I think it's great. That's the best part of reality TV. You can tell that I was raised on Nene Leake's Atlanta Housewives where it's like, well, listen, she's not always right, but she's never that wrong. Yeah. And that's just kind of how. Yeah. did you see by the way ace's um tour of his home or is like oh i've seen a little bit of it yes but i haven't i've been watching his um his like dancing videos really teaches uh people like in foreign countries and like big zoom rooms of like 30 guys how to dance and it's so funny it is really funny um so the big thing that happened um i think last night or this morning is that sierra issued a formal apology and i actually haven't seen it yet i just woke up this morning and i read it and i actually couldn't find it instead of you know i got distracted because i found out also this morning because i'm like a very savvy internet person and i'm always at least like six days behind i found out that clark is like a meme at the moment clarket i had no idea about clark so i think i went to look for sierra's apology video but then i wound up going into clarket content instead which is not what i expected i okay listen I at first I did not like Clark because I honestly just found her kind of annoying and then I didn't like how she um we're just kind of moving in the Alandria conversation like I understand what she was telling Alandria like I don't like that you called me and like my relationship which I feel like is very valid a test which I have to go with my girl if Alandria says you're a test you're a test like okay I hope you pass I don't know um but I did start to like her more I am happy that she's gone because i could not have taylor in my villa any longer um but but yeah but i i think also clark is like beautiful too yeah i had a moment like there was one episode i think like last week where she was sort of on her side and like the light was hitting her and she she just i was like this woman is so beautiful and we were just not paying attention to her because we just hate taylor so much yeah yeah and i think that she's also an introvert so she's not really very interesting on camera i think that's very true just i think we just don't really pay attention to her and i was like she's beautiful but i was okay with her to go because you know every time like you know you've been watching the show and then suddenly it's like oh it's a taylor and clark scene i was like i can't truly it's like their little date i was like can i fast forward through this like i don't care i don't care um and every time clark says something that i love she follows up with something that i'm like eye roll to the heavens like when she during that date she told Taylor like you always tip 20 % no matter how good or bad the service is I was like okay period love that and then like the next two days later they're talking about like what their wedding would be like and she's like oh I really wanted like a sexy like lingerie shoot with my future husband I was like okay so the pick me to end all pick me is understood like I whenever I want to see it for her so bad she does something I'm like girl I can't support that I know I'm just gonna we're just gonna let them go off and have their next like taylor okay before we get to cri as long as we're talking about taylor i have to say like i kind of feel like when they cast taylor they were hoping to like capture the magic of um what's this oh serena and cordell i think that i think they wanted someone like cordell sort of scrawny and stature kind of goofy and silly and taylor did not deliver on any of those things he was to me i thought he was a painful watch he just never really developed any personality.

20:29Ben Mandelker: I've been watching Love Island for many years now. Like UK primarily. And there are people who they come in and they're odd and strange. And then by the end of the season, they have like blossomed and you've like killed away layers and you just love it. I think Amaya is like that, honestly. I mean, that's how I think of her ascendance. Yes, I think last season, you know, well, Cordell was a great candidate for that last season. But also like Miguel was a great candidate last season where he came on just like beefcake but turned out he had a huge amount of personality and silliness you know and taylor i'm telling you i mean we spent six weeks with this man and not we there was there was nothing to peel away not us not a layer not a not a thin membrane nothing right no i think you're so right even like watching taylor during the heart rate challenge that's what i was like honestly flip the table over i'm done i'm done because if you can't even it's like love island it's obviously show where you like your only task is to look hot wear swimsuits and make out and like try to like build connections with people and he has failed on all those accounts and i don't like that he just like kind of hung out just to stay around the boys and what i really didn't like which this is like actually when i was when i completely was like i have there's nothing more for me to see with him on camera was when um nick and alandria came back to the main villa after like they'd both been dumped and taylor jumps over alandria to hug over who he truly had not seen in maybe six hours like hadn't seen alandria in two days which is like months in love island time hadn't seen nick in six hours and was literally picking nick up hugging him so tightly he was like oh my god i miss you had nothing to say to the woman that he'd been sleeping in bed with for all of these weeks i was like you're so weird and this is like he's also just like yeah not very good on camera always like goofy but not in a fun way in a kind of like distracting like childish way um yes just yeah really really not good casting like yeah that was a real fail it's time for a commercial it's time for a crappin's commercial there is such a better way to spend your time than doom scrolling or watching terrible tv Get some stories in your life, okay?

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23:52Ben Mandelker: I'm surprised they weren't able to kind of like get him out of there sooner. It's because Alandria was so set on him and she is so, everything that makes him annoying and a nuisance is what makes her so captivating. She's so beautiful. She is so expressive. She is so good at talking in the confessionals, leading you through her thought process. also has a lot of friendships in the house also is like very set on showing her connection how she feels and taylor reciprocated none of that and so at the first opportunity i was like please get him out of this house i know i i was actually alandra is great like i think she's she's my number two she was my number one for the longest time but like i i have really fallen for amaya papaya i think that what i tell ronnie is that i think alandra is the one i would rather actually be friends with i'm just like rooting for amaya because i just i felt like she had such a like She really had a hard journey in the villa that I just want to reward her.

24:48Ben Mandelker: But Alandra is the one who I'd actually like to have a conversation with. I don't know if I could have a conversation with Amaya. As much as I love her, I think that might wear me down just a little bit. I get why people love her so much. But some of the non sequiturs kind of kill me. I'm like, girl, I'm sorry. What are we talking about in this conversation right now? What is the subject of this sentence? I'm just not following along as to like... I feel like I'm always dropped in the middle of an Amaya conversation. And I forget, I like lose all context. And so it's very confusing for me. But we had the comedian Devin Walker on our podcast this week.

25:21And he was saying like, okay, Hunter, I hear what you're saying. But imagine you're at a boozy brunch and you're like four mimosas in and you meet this girl in the bathroom line. And like your song is playing. And it's like, okay, in that specific circumstance, I'm like, that's my girl for life. But I do agree. alandria is more the person i'm like oh we could like really have like a nice dinner lunch we could

25:44Ben Mandelker: sit and watch tv together like yeah and watch tv with alandria i feel like with amaya like sometimes her conversations she's like yeah so what sort of bread do you like yeah that's my favorite i like that bread and i'm like what it was funny whenever um taylor and ace are like making that picnic for taylor and uh oh my gosh um clark yes to go on that date and maya is like trying to distract um clark and she's like okay so um what's your favorite color and clark's like black and amaya's like whoo i know i was like i just i feel like she tries she tries tries yeah she tries i um okay okay, wait, I'm gonna put a pin in the Maya because Sierra is the big thing.

26:31Yeah.

26:31Ben Mandelker: So you watched, you watched her apology. Yes, I did. I did. So can you summarize what she said and how you felt it was? Okay. Just for context, she is like filming. It's like kind of self tape style wearing a big sweatshirt that says either empath or empathy. I can't remember the why was at the end or not. And she begins by saying like, first off, like I, like I've left the villa. It's been about 48 hours since I left Fiji. And my first apologies to everyone in the Asian community. I don't want to center myself at all in this. I really apologize for using that word. And then she shares a screenshot of someone calling her out on it in response to whatever story she'd posted and use that word.

27:14And they were like, I'm unfollowing you. I'm so disappointed. And she wrote a pretty lengthy response saying, I'm so embarrassed. I was so naive. I had no idea. I really apologize. You'll never see me say this again. Which I hadn't seen that circulating in all the screenshots of her using this word, which I thought was like, at least she has like some receipts to back it up that she had in, at least at one time been called out and had like acknowledged and apologized immediately.

27:38Ben Mandelker: So it was on her post there, on the post itself, someone had responded. Yes. Prior to Love Island. Yes. But she didn't take down the post or? She did. It was a story post. I think she took it down. um so it wasn't like yeah it was like uh i feel like she was like at some kind of like injector's office or something um but but then what she said after that then she said that like she's so apologetic but that she understands and honestly appreciates that they asked her to leave the villa and that um it was the best decision for everyone and that she totally supports that action and then and then she like continued to apologize said you know that she wants to like the only way to really make amends is to prove in your future actions that you understand that she intends to do that.

28:23And then said that the reaction to all of this, although she understands why people are hurt, that some of the people called ice on her family, had sent her family death threats, sent her friends death threats, all of this stuff. But I don't know. It's not my apology to accept, but I did appreciate that she led with the apology and kept that very separate from like but also the stuff that's been happening to her has been really parasocial weird like similarly kind of harassment and over the top um and i think honestly it felt like a pretty good apology from a celebrity i've seen i'll say i've seen less from bigger more famous people who've done like i'm thinking like just the justin timberlake apology honestly which is like one of the crazier ones i've ever seen i tried to block that one out of my mind that's like how not to apologize

29:20Ben Mandelker: yeah well okay i'm glad that's a good apology i'll have to definitely go and look at it and again like you said it's not for for us to say whether truly whether whether it's a good apology because it's not our group that was that was explicitly uh affected by it totally it is you know it is nice to see that she did not lead with like i'm you know i feel really bad but you guys yeah yeah and i also appreciate it too that like my thought is that she's going to go on like call her dad you're like the like nick vile podcast and like really capitalize on this moment but i liked i guess i yeah i liked that she had no totally but i like that she like didn't do this like you know i'm really dramatic like breaking my silence but it It did feel like pretty swift.

30:05And also, again, leading with the apology and not like her own personal complaints about like her own treatment.

30:13Ben Mandelker: Yeah, I think the stories that have been coming out over the second half of the season, like the toxicity in the fan base is terrible because I don't. First of all, people shouldn't be acting that way. I mean, calling ice on Sierra's family is like really so vile, especially because like ice is doing such terrible things in general. And actually like, like we don't want to like, we don't want to engage with ice at all and do things like that. I just think it's, that's actually like so offensive to me that anyone would do that. And I'm just feel like that's like so shameful. but also like it makes me sad that the so much of the audience has gotten so toxic over the past half of the season because I don't want that that that messiness to get onto the show like in terms of like I don't want people to think of Love Island as like oh well I want to watch it but I hear it's really toxic you know and I don't want that to affect how the show acts I just want people to to like calm their parasocial instincts a little bit and just be like chill with with some of the stuff that that's happening but people are they're really the fan bases are out of control and i honestly have a theory and i don't know if you feel the same way about this or not i kind of think that the huda and jeremiah situation that was like poison on the show and then in the audience and i think it's just interesting since then i think that was like a really a really toxic relationship and it like uh it was really riveting to watch but i it kind of like seemed to stall out the whole house in terms of developing relationships i think it consumed everyone's time and energy yeah and i'm only laughing because it's so crazy to imagine clocking in for another day on your shift of just watching huda and jeremiah go back and forth like you're as like a person in that villa it's like oh i don't want to wake up and have to deal with this some more yeah i know and i and i think that somehow i think that's like that that's just started to affect the audience in a weird way like i i don't have any empirical evidence but i have to imagine that's where this all started and and i think that the stand on your business challenge was very messy for love island love on the messy show but that one was a challenge where they they were like let's get these islanders to directly combat each other yeah which we don't really see too often it's usually like passive aggressive yeah you know you know challenges yeah i don't know i mean how do you feel about the levels of toxicity on the season do you think they're overblown or do you think they're there no i think they're very present i saw someone say that um people try to call child protective services on huda for like leaving her child to go on this show and it's like but wait what i mean i think huda is an interesting case because as much as i do think a lot of like the ire directed toward her and the jeremiah stuff was a lot of misogyny her behavior in that relationship was almost as toxic as his like they were both kind of locked in this real just um smog of like both of their projections and like both of their um just miscommunications and misunderstandings um but still i think that it kind of unleashed a level of like both vitriol, maybe from like higher investment in this couple, because I think you're right.

33:25I think that's very perceptive. It really did draw a lot of people in because people were taking sides. And then even Ace saying to Jeremiah, this is weird. He didn't say it in the best way. He said he thought it was scamming, but it's weird that you guys are so locked in, like so only have eyes for each other and acting like this is like a once in a lifetime love, all of this stuff. And it's like, but it's day three, four, five, six. like where's this all coming from and that a lot of the other people in the house didn't you know weren't setting up for jeremiah and that it was only you know knucklehead austin i think says a

33:58Ben Mandelker: lot yeah i still think that jeremiah i think it was well we talked about before but i don't think jeremiah should have been um voted off in that situation because i think that like when the fact that they were like oh my god jeremiah but you were like you're doing it all over again to andrena i was like no i don't really feel like it's the same thing i think he just likes her i think you're allowed to like people but yeah i think that that um yeah that situation was i was so compelled by it i was like tuning in every day to watch i was like what's gonna happen but little did i realize i feel like i was also contributing to this thing that was going to really affect the whole season and because it's a shorter season it's like six weeks in on the u.s version as opposed to i think eight weeks on uk those extra weeks make a difference because they get to cost a more way too soon on the US version, I think.

34:45Ben Mandelker: And I think that last season, we had a great season of casting where we had lots of relationships building. But sometimes three weeks in, you don't have anything going yet. And I do think that the Hood and Jeremiah thing sort of took up all the air in the room and all of a sudden they had to go to Casa Amor and then they come back from Casa Amor and now they have to like, they haven't even had a bombshell since Casa Amor, which is wild to me. No, but then I think it's so weird because it feels like some people have been so locked in from the very beginning, but then you're like, but who have been the main couples?

35:15Like no one since day one, really, which is, you know, not like last season at all, I would say. But I don't know. With Jeremiah, I truly feel like the house just collectively, the mood was like someone has to go between Huda and Jeremiah. And if it has to be Jeremiah, then it has to be Jeremiah. And I think Ace saw that coming because that needed to end because it was only going to continue even after um america had decided that they need to be uncoupled it was still more drama it was still more of like have you seen people compare her to sadness from inside out oh no yeah that's hilarious

35:56Ben Mandelker: in the background of a scene like like so i have definitely seen that like definitely her so you know you know even during the baby challenge like she was like cleaning up everyone's towels after like the um like they're like baby yoga thing and it's like girl now i know that you want some attention but now is not the time she definitely pouts quite a bit too much for my taste i'm like i really can't stand huda i'm not gonna lie i think she's awful she's awful she's had some nice moments because the producers have been kind enough to give her some sort of redemption arc but yeah she's terrible terrible terrible okay so in terms of like who's gonna And then there's Iris and Pepe who are like so.

36:37Ben Mandelker: Yeah. So totally. And then there's Iris and Pepe and just silence. That feels about right. People love Pepe. I don't totally get it. I think that he's just because he says nothing that therefore like he's like a blank slate. And like a season where people have like a lot of like feelings about the men, especially he's like the best of the worst, you know? Yeah. Something about Pepe is that I think he's like 27. I think he's the oldest person in the house. and it shows because he's the one who's not like rushing into anything not like starting the most drama but he very much is just there and i think because of that you're right people can project a lot of like he's the most stable the most mature and it's like no he's just kind of quiet yeah they're just kind of boring together i mean they're fine i've i've always you know iris is nice she's i enjoyed iris i enjoyed her thoughts on crows um and one day she was like guys you know i want to do i want to get a bird i was like okay great thanks for the update iris doing that like would you rather challenge i was like this is kind of the most you've talked all season is like talking about crows talking about would you rather and telling sierra you should be mad at alandria for kissing nick i was like okay girl and also the way that she was sobbing over tj and then like a second later he was like oh you know pepe's not so bad and tj i did see a video of tj yesterday where like he was on like yes i saw this yeah he was like well at least they got to go camping i was like okay well i'm glad you're gone oh so nick and alandria do you believe do you feel this do you feel like this is a real thing or do you feel like this is a last-ditch effort i mean have you been a nicolandria person in general i know you're a landra fan as am i but do you do you ship to use the words of the young people do you ship nicolandria i will go to war over the two of them together i love them as a couple and i'll tell you why there's one scene i'm actually writing one in the newsletter right now there's one scene from when they were dumped from their houses and they went back to the main villa together as a couple and they made out in soul ties which was like so the best kiss of the season But what I really loved is right after that, they go downstairs.

38:48I think it was TJ who's like, were you guys in Soul Ties? And Alandria's like, no, we were at the daybeds. And then she sits down and she says, oh, I'm like cold. Like trying to change the subject saying she's cold. And Nick, mid bite of a cookie, takes off his shirt and gives it to her. And then Clark, it's like cinematic. Clark comes in with Taylor and Clark's like, where did your shirt go? And Nick says, oh, Alandria was cold. and then taylor of course comes in and is like oh elandra no one in the house likes you and it's like womp womp like get out of my villa um but i do think that they always gravitate towards one another and not just like um from a produced way of like they were set up after they were both dumped of course but i think at every opportunity even night one night two nick would always want to kiss elandria elandria loved kissing nick and even in like that one like random door challenge they would um nick chose to partner up with her for that challenge and then we cannot forget nick was whipping the votes to keep alandria in the house and told clark straight up it you've only been in this house for two days taylor could change his mind alandria needs to stay and i said that's love yeah that's love commercials here comes one right now

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41:20Ben Mandelker: I think that's a great, I think you just made a really strong case. I feel like I like the idea of Nicolandria. like i want i i want that to be real i just don't know if i feel like it's real like not that it's not i think everything you said is right you know but sometimes i i don't know i feel like the nicks pivot into it so quickly i just i i am doubting some sincerity behind it i feel like he was suddenly severed from sierra and rattled by it and then i felt like he said i've got a week left. I've got to do something here. I've got something sort of with, with Alandria. So let's, let's go for it.

41:59Ben Mandelker: And I totally applaud that. Like this love Island, you got to do that. But I don't know if I feel the chemistry the way other people do. And I want to, I want to be in the Nicolandria haze, you know, I'm not quite there. I mean, if they win, I'll be happy for Alandria, but, um, they're not. Yeah. I don't know. I, I want it to be, I want it to feel more vibrant for me. And it's just not happening for me. But I also think that - Is this a Ben problem? Do you think it's something wrong with me? I think a little, but I think that maybe something that you're picking up on is that Alandria has been quite guarded in this relationship because she was so set on Taylor.

42:37And even the morning after they made out in Soul Ties, she did say like, okay, I felt really bad because like Sierra is my friend. And I also, but what she didn't say is that she's still so stuck on Taylor. And it, I think required Taylor saying in that St. On Business Challenge, like, if you want me to pick between you and Clark, guess what? I pick Clark. For her to be like, okay, this is totally over. I need to like start opening my mind. Because she did not have eyes for anyone else. And that bothered me. Yes, yes.

43:03Ben Mandelker: Because she really put her eggs in that basket. And then every time she said, oh, we really, you know, but we've been building something, we've been working towards something. I'm like, what are you talking about? It was never really there in the first place. I know. And even who, I can't remember that guy, the other country boy who came into the house. Yes. I thought he was so cute. And I was like, why can't you see that he is taller, thicker, like more into you, more like curious about you. Taylor is like the definition of a guy who goes on a date with you and doesn't ask you one question about yourself.

43:32And it's like, well, how is this going to work?

43:34Ben Mandelker: like um yeah i'm concerned that alandra is someone she's very principled and i think that like she has this idea of like oh well i i see something in the sky i think this could be something and i'm not like a fly-by-night person like if i see something i'm gonna follow it through and i think she was like very much dedicated to this like idea that like you know uh if there does seem to be some potential i'm gonna do whatever i can to make like it's not gonna be my fault that this doesn't work and I kind of wanted her to just sort of assess halfway through and realize this is not going anywhere you you're like begging essentially for him to kiss you and especially when he came back from casa and was like already he connected with with clark I can't even begrudge him for connecting with clark you like who you like and she still was like it's like oh well I'm in consideration I just wanted her to move on so yeah I think that's why she couldn't that's why her um kind of monologue at the fire pit during that sit on business challenge just kind of felt so flat for me.

44:35Cause it's like, she said, I've been supporting you through everything. I've been taking scraps and it's like, but sweetheart, I say this with love. No one has asked you to do that. No one has indicated that that is going to get you any closer to getting Taylor because in the reality in which we all live, he would sleep. Have you seen the screenshot of him and Elantra sleeping in the bed together where he, Taylor is all under the covers and she is like truly in the wind, like has nothing on her he's like he just like just has everything on him yes and with clark he's cup like couple up with her and sleeping with her cuddling with her night one and that

45:10Ben Mandelker: says it all that says it all and i just want i just wish that she had explored more in the villa um and like do you i mean she's very guarded and i feel like in life it's good to be guarded when it comes to dating i mean good and bad obviously but like it's not the worst thing in the world to have some sort of standards that you keep for yourself. But do you think that you should be so guarded when you go into Love Island? Do you think you should move the way you move in the outside world the same way as you do in Love Island? No, because the Iris and TJ to Iris and Pepe thing really speaks to how you really have to be able to pivot.

45:51And I do like between Iris and Pepe how they had both been in the house together for days and days and days. And there's never a spark. And then it's like, I don't know, like the light hits just right. TJ's gone. She kind of looks at him for a little bit too long. And it's like, oh, maybe there is something here, which is kind of my favorite thing about this show. Cause wherever you think there's, oh my gosh, all is lost. What is I was going to do now? Then she's like, hmm, maybe it's Pepe. And that's sort of nice. Same with Amaya. I mean, it's like Amaya had been in the house for weeks. No one was interested in her.

46:21She's not really feeling anyone else either truly. And then here comes Brian. and it's like that's so nice um i wish that alandria had been a little bit more open but then again i do feel like it's not a coincidence that at every chance like that she could you know form another connection it was always like a little bit platonically with nick and i think

46:41Ben Mandelker: now she's like being dissuaded from that i think she's realizing that she like that she has to let her guard down if she wants to really truly do the love island experience otherwise you're gonna act the same way you did in the outside world and what's even the point of coming into the billet in the first place aside from like fame and influencers like numbers and all that stuff yeah so okay so predictions who do you think is going to win why don't we do let's let's even make it spicier who do you think is going to be in the top three and who do you who do you i think i know who you want to win but uh say it anyway it's uh predictions predictions um okay i think amaya and brian and um okay so we we see what stream yard is good actually i think it's i think it's actually apple apple does this thing for people who are watching people who are listening they don't they don't see this but for people who are watching every now and then if you do a certain gesture on like your on like your macbook or something it'll send like balloons up or um thumbs up thumbs down that like it always seems to happen when you're like giving an opinion it's like like the the internet is agreeing with you at this moment it's just like a true cosine yes yes right i think finally it's gonna be amaya and brian shelly and ace and nick and alandria i don't know i honestly feel like shelly and ace might be on the chopping block because a lot of people who i did not expect this are voting for iris and pepe and i'm like both i know it's shocking me too or i mean chris and oh we didn't even talk about chris and huda but do we think that that's over or do we think that they're just starting their first fight their first pattern is beginning i truly think it's over i think chris chris was so i think he was kind of right to be a little bit like i think huda is like over correcting from the jeremiah she's like taking all the wrong lessons the jeremiah thing wasn't an issue because it was pda it was an issue because they both would just like go around and around and have the same conversation the same fight again and again and i think everyone exactly and i think chris is already kind of um frustrated with her and has like a much shorter temper honestly because he just is more arrogant and egotistical because he is a ball player so he says um but i also think i mean did you see that last elimination chris looked like he wanted to make himself leave the villa he said get me on the first flight out of here i cannot take this anymore he was done this is the first time that i've ever seen the baby challenge on love island actually be consequential like they've done that on the uk for years it's like my least favorite because it goes on forever and like you're really affected huda and chris i i think i don't yeah i think if the show were still had a few more weeks in it i think that'd still be the roller coaster would go on for like another week or so but if they're about to get out of the villa i think they're just gonna go there so he's gonna go off and bang some randos at clubs.

49:34Ben Mandelker: He's going to live his fullest and she'll do whatever she does. Whatever she does. Whatever Hedda does. Be annoying. Deal with it. She has her own controversy she has to deal with when she gets out of the villa. Little does she know. You know what I'm talking about, right? No, what? Well, there was all... People were up in arms because... Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes. Like it's a debate about whether or not she actually said it, et cetera, et cetera. Like lip syncing along. It's, it's its own can of worms. I just can't talk about how to anymore. I'm sorry. Like, I'm like, but honestly, whatever, like, just let's move along.

50:14Please.

50:15Ben Mandelker: I don't understand that. I don't understand how she has so many followers. Okay. So, um, I think Shelley and Shelley and Ace are going to win. I think, I think the momentum has moved towards them. Just like my sense. Like when I, I always go on to, onto Twitter and I, you know, every morning I'm like on the hashtag Love Island USA and all the chatter is about them. And I think that the, I think the vibe has shifted. I think the narrative of this week, which is really all that matters is that they've gone through the rough stuff and now they're together. And you know, the truth is they, they are, they are a good couple together.

50:50Ben Mandelker: And, um, I think, I, I think that like Amaya peaked. I think that like so much of Amaya story was that like she was always getting shat on but now she found a guy and i feel like there's a sense of like oh good well that's tied up and done and i think people are going to i think it's gonna be shelly and ace i personally i think it's gonna be shelly shelly and ace number one amaya and brian number two and number three nicolandria um and although you're iris and pepe could be a weird no you know i'm gonna say iris and pepe is number three now over nicolandria i think they've got the bland vote you know yeah that's true with people who vote for bland people yeah yeah i i i mean i love shelly and ace together so much and i do think from day one you could be like that's gonna be a couple they're a couple they're gonna stay together through this whole thing which i like um i think with amaya and brian my only sort of hesitation in saying that they could win like the only thing that's like holding me back from being like definitively they're gonna win And it is that people like Amaya so much, but like the depth of her connection with Brian is really just not there.

51:57I mean, we saw them in the hideaway together. It was just like, I mean, they have fun together. That's a relationship that like you date for six months and then he simply goes to you and never talks to you again. And you're like, but wait, I still have like stuff at your apartment. Like, it's just not, it's not, it's not there. And the same way that like Ace and Shelly and even like Iris and Pepe also like, you know, not the deepest relationship, but at least they like talk about more than just like the daily drama, you know, like they kind of like just whisper together. I'm like, okay, totally.

52:29Whatever you guys say.

52:31Ben Mandelker: Yeah, I think we're all rooting for Amaya and for Amaya to be in a relationship. And we all love that Brian was the only one who stood up. Yeah, totally. ace i'd like to point out against ace for amaya against austin you mean and austin and ace and austin and zach all of them he was the only one who stood up for amaya in that moment and we all like that um and so but i do feel like we do get a deeper we do get a sense of a deeper connection with ace and shelly um and i think that the audience is going to respond to that i think it's gonna be ace and shelly are gonna win i'm gonna i'm gonna say that right now premier loves to God's ears.

53:07I love Ace. I would love to see him and Shelly winning. I mean, truly, I love Ace and I love Shelly so much. And even before they come up, I was like, those are kind of my two favorites.

53:15Ben Mandelker: Well, I love Shelly. I don't really like Ace that much. She drives me nuts, but that's okay. That's a Leo man. Listen, if they win, I will be happy for you. I'll be happy for the people in our audience who are also Shelly's fans. But thank you, Hunter, so much for coming on today. Please tell everyone where they can like listen to you and follow you and do all the things and everyone should because hunter but does some really good content i'm just thank you thank you that is so you're the shelly you're the shelly i wanted to say the shellace but i'm like not really i can't say that sincerely you're the shelly of content i'll say thank you thank you that's that really is high praise um because it the feeling is mutual but i um i have a podcast that i co-host with my best friend peyton dicks it's called Let Me Say This you can listen on YouTube and Spotify and wherever you find your podcasts and I write a newsletter called Hung Up and it comes out twice a week and we have like just the most fun conversations about everything from Love Island to I don't even know like Drake's Abs all of that so I hope you join me I love that pivot to Drake's Abs we'll have to circle back to that one thank you so much for coming on and good luck on Sunday night at the finale watching the finale.

54:34Ben Mandelker: I hope it all works out for your show. Thank you. Same to you. Bye everyone. Bye. Watch What Crappens would like to thank its premium sponsors. Ain't no thing like Alison King. It's always a party on Alison Block. Our way is the Amber way. It's the Foster and the Furious. It's Amanda Foster. She can run my country. It's Angie McGovern. It's Always Automatic with Ashley Otto. Put your hands together for Carly Clapp. Get on the right foot with Chrissy Offutt. She's not just a Sheila, she's a Daniela. We never miss her call, it's Diane Call. Aaron McNicholas, she don't miss no trickless. Hava Nagila Weber.

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