#3367 Southern Hospitality S4E11: Drama in the DR

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1:27Ben Mandelker: Bravo. We just love to talk about. I'm Ben Mandelker and joining me today is the glorious and charming Ronnie Karam. Hi, Ronnie. How's it going?

1:38Ronnie Karam: Well, hello.

1:41Ben Mandelker: Welcome to your podcast. We are just a few weeks away from our big cabaret, Forbidden Housewives. That's been New York City. It's sold out, but you can get tickets to stream it. You can stream the whole show. Go to the link. It's on our website. It's on our social media. And watch along with this madness. We'll see how this all turns out. But it's going to be crazy. We're looking forward to that. Also, join us on Patreon for bonus episodes. We did a trailer trash of the latest McBee trailer. And we also have a newsletter. And we have ad-free listening. And crap is on demand where you can watch.

2:19Ben Mandelker: So go to patreon.com slash watch for crap happens. Today, we are talking Southern Hospitality Season 4, Episode 11. This beach is crazy. The kids are going to be wrapping up their Punta Cana trip. And where we last left off, they went to church. Michaels took a bunch of them to church, where they found inner peace and thought about deeper things in life and then immediately abandoned those lessons to get into more squabbles today.

2:49Ronnie Karam: Michaels is like, I felt so empowered leaving the church. I was like, wow, like I was looking for a spiritual calling. And I don't want to sound like Grace Lily, but I really felt my grandma's presence in there. Is your grandma Bob Marley? Because no, you're not Grace Lily. Don't worry about it. You're fine. Hi, y 'all.

3:07Ben Mandelker: So, yeah, like, it's like, yeah, you know, you feel at home. You feel at peace. I'm like so proud of you. He's like, thank you. So now they're going to have a dinner tonight. And so they all get back and everything and they're like getting ready. and Maddie has some starfish earrings. So Joe's like, wow, I like your earrings. It's like really nice, a starfish. Yeah, my starfish earrings. Joe, can I ask you like what necklace I wear? I have a starfish one. Wow, you have starfish earrings on a necklace. That's like a lot.

3:36Ronnie Karam: Are you going to be doing a Golden Girls set or are you wearing giant starfishes all over? I know.

3:41Ben Mandelker: Do you have a silver dollar option? Sand dollar, I mean.

3:44Ronnie Karam: It's crazy. They're like huge Miami old lady starfish necklace and matching earrings. that's heavy ears the woman has very strong earlobes i'll say that so it's like yeah you know i was gonna say that one yeah oh so that's what i was gonna pick with starfish that's really good okay joe you know i haven't dj'd in like months and like the whole time i'm just thinking about like you know like you got a gig you got a gig so it's like so hard because i'm just thinking like oh my god what if i press play and music doesn't start or like you know like i'm like here's the music but then it doesn't come on like what's gonna happen this is so much pressure

4:19Ben Mandelker: so hard pressing play so joe's like you got this don't worry about it like okay uh like you know like i got your back and man's like i just i get my head and it's like really hard to get out of my head so i'll be like thinking about how anxious and nervous i am until the gig is over like i can't wait i just have to press play oh so he's like it's okay you're all right oh you smell it's joe it's dry shampoo joe god get with it so now charlie and uh justin are facetiming and he's like you look good the slick back's eating right now she's like yeah well look i'm breaking out all over where right where your beard was because like your beard is like oh my god it's like crazy oh my god like i don't know what to do i don't want to i'm afraid i'm afraid to tell people i

5:02Ronnie Karam: don't want everyone to know okay we got to keep it secret so now tj justin's justin hangs up and then he presses and then he goes love you and tj's like i am dead i think i love it though Shut up. So the producer's like, did you purposely wait until she was gone to say I love you? And he's like, yeah, I feel like I don't want to scare her. You know, like maybe it's too soon on FaceTime. But God, I feel like I haven't said I love you to anybody too soon. You know, it's a thing. And they're like, well, how many girls have you said I love you to? And he's like, honestly, like probably like close to like 40 women.

5:40Ronnie Karam: Are we counting that girl from behind the bar? What was her name? Ruse. Are we counting Ruse? Yeah, a lot of women. I love women. I love them.

5:48Ben Mandelker: A lot. So now in Julia and Brad's room, they're getting ready. And he's like so glad that she can be there even for just 24 hours. And then they talk about pants. And Brad's like, whenever you're on vacation, you don't have your partner with you. It just feels like something's a little bit off. So it's nice to have the other half. And by the way, since Emmy didn't say anything to you, I guess this would be now be a better, a good time to greet her. Cause like maybe she at least acknowledged your presence. And she's like, whatever. I hate the fucking bitch. But yeah, so Emmy did not say hi to Julia when she initially showed up.

6:23Ronnie Karam: Yeah. So now everybody goes to dinner and Michael's is like, um, we actually have a rule before dinner starts tonight. Okay. Give me your phones. No one gets to have their phones. So he stacks up everybody's phones and takes them away. I don't know that I'd be at this dinner, especially with these people. You might need to call for help.

6:42Ben Mandelker: No, it's going to be very important. Like we're not going to be distracted. it so that way we can all see me get upset at me um so brad is like okay no phones whoa and uh they're like he's just like um by the way how was the beach looks like you guys i got some sun and bella's like so fun i loved it wait who are you why are you at our table who is this person

7:03Ronnie Karam: bella okay everybody well welcome julia we're sad you missed the past few days okay but we're like happy to have you oh by the way everybody just collapsed except emmy okay we could have taken pictures of that with our phones but i didn't let you keep them okay so we're happy to have you for the last supper of our trip because it's last supper we went to church today i'm gonna say the last supper a lot today because i'm sticking with the theme okay so then michaels is asking have you

7:32Ben Mandelker: spoken to grace by the way maddie and maddie's like no i haven't even seen her since girls night but i feel like she's like taking like the right steps that's like i'm really proud of her and then later on i'm gonna say that she's not taking the right steps so lake is like yeah she's addressing that there's like a problem and that's like the difference i'm like i mean it's like well what's going on like isn't that the first step like i don't know the nine steps or whatever yeah the

7:54Ronnie Karam: nine steps it's not like the first step like what are the nine steps so hard it's like so many steps to remember it's a lot of steps yeah yeah well this is step one a lot of people do step one like

8:06Ben Mandelker: 300 times i picked up like 10 white chips before i stuck with it so like you know what i mean right do you guys like my starfish earrings no be honest be honest all right guys i want to just

8:17Ronnie Karam: give a toast to my beautiful girlfriend maddie because like i'm so proud of you i'm so proud of starfish i'm so proud of your earlobes are so fucking strong you know it's your first show in a long time and i'm like really proud of you but more importantly i'm proud of this group like i'm proud to be your friends i'm proud to be opening a restaurant with levin lamar soon probably most likely that I'm going to own. It's going to be great.

8:38Ben Mandelker: I'm calling it Joe Acherie's Daquiri's. So hope you guys all come. So hey, then Mia's asking everyone, what's your favorite thing that everyone ate? And then Justin goes, Michael's probably say TJ's ass. Everyone's like, and Mia's like, Michael's, did you pray for me at the church? I prayed for everybody. I prayed for everybody and I cried a lot. and they're like really he's like yeah it was like very nice i think that like my biggest thing is like i carry a lot of pain and i feel like sometimes i don't release it and like being there i just felt like i got like a lot and it was like really nice to just like cry and release

9:19Ronnie Karam: and pray and man he's like michael's like you know what like when i met you like you weren't that secure about your sexuality but now like your sexuality is like a superpower it's like crazy Like you're so gay now. Like you're super, super gay now. Everyone's like, oh my God. Yes. Michaels, you're so gay now. Congratulations. Like, yes. Biggest guy I've ever met in my life. You did it.

9:40Ben Mandelker: That's funny because I'm like on the cover of so gay magazine now. So that like, like works out really well. Sorry,

9:45Ronnie Karam: but it's so dog game.

9:48Ben Mandelker: So not gay. So dog gay. Dot. So, so dog gay. So dog, the dot stands for the dot. But, um, by the way, I just want to reiterate that like, I brought people that I just felt were closest to me and really supported me through this journey. So yes, it was a spiritual moment, but it was also a passive-aggressive way for me to get at Emmy. And in case people didn't realize that, I'm just going to underline that one more time right now.

10:13Ronnie Karam: I know. And just in case this didn't start a fight, I'll start a fight about it right now. I used my church moment to get at Emmy. Okay? Emmy, are you going to say anything? She's like, oh, I mean, it's like heard loud and clear. I mean, we all have best friends here at this table. like you know like or we're loyal to so i mean mia's like well he just said it that it's his

10:35Ben Mandelker: closest friends he brought to the church he's like oh i heard i heard um i just don't think i'm in a place where i'm like ready to be silenced or like shut down and i think that like my outfit's honestly a great representation because like you guys probably what looks like fishnet for you it's just actually something to match the sound because i feel like you let like i let you walk all over me and they're like oh like you rehearsed that didn't you i love that they all took turns calling him out on rehearsing that stupid line i just wanted to match the sand because i feel like

11:09Ronnie Karam: i've let you walk all over me then why are you dressed like sand because then you're dressed like someone who's continuing to let her walk all over you right you should why wouldn't you dress like a broom you know i'm cleaning up the sand so now you can't walk all over me or like dress

11:25Ben Mandelker: like rough terrain i'm dressing like rough terrain which is historically difficult to walk across

11:30Ronnie Karam: or dress like a bear trap you know and be like you you walk all over me again i'm gonna catch your

11:36Ben Mandelker: ankle i am dressed like hot coals because if you're gonna walk over me at least have a spiritual

11:42Ronnie Karam: moment that's why i'm wearing an outfit made out of nails so you cannot walk all over me without

11:48Ben Mandelker: making your feet bloody i am wearing broken glass that way if anyone walks over me it's

11:55Ronnie Karam: gonna be any linux and so they're like wow i really thought about that line huh he's like yeah michael's kept that in his notes out for like three months waiting to use that super gay super

12:08Ben Mandelker: gay i told you yeah well i was thinking about it when i was getting ready because it was like either wear a fishnet or open uh button button down shirt a or open button down shirt b or blazer with nothing under it, see? So, you know, I went with a sandy fishnet.

12:25Ronnie Karam: I mean, like, that's how you feel. Like, I mean, so, like, you think, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, I mean, like, what do you think? Like, what do you think, Michaels?

12:35Ben Mandelker: But you think I'm, like, a bad friend? Then fine. No, no, I never said you were a horrible friend. Those words never came out of my mouth. I just said you walked all over me, and you were terrible to me, and you made me cry, and you were, like, the worst person I've ever met in my entire life, but I never said you were a horrible friend.

12:49Ronnie Karam: like you don't think i listen to you like like like like what do you think like like what

12:58Ben Mandelker: because you don't okay you don't really like sit down and like think about how other people are feeling like you did the exact same thing with brad and like my biggest thing is like you need to stop trying to defame him like i feel like you're saying that you were like threatened and

13:09Ronnie Karam: stalked is like kind of a reach oh and julia's like have you considered an apology she's like I'm like, I mean, like, what? Like, what are you talking about right now?

13:21Ben Mandelker: Guys, I mean, we got to like pinpoint it. Like, I just need to know. Like, at this point, I've like said a lot of bullshit. So just tell me which one you want me to apologize for first, okay? Because like, I mean, you need to be held accountable for the things that you say. Even if you think you're saying it in private to people, it's Charleston. And sometimes that doesn't happen. And I've heard the same story from like multiple people that have nothing to do with this group. And some of the things that you're saying, it's like my jaw drops. and like a lot of things that you're saying happen, like never even happened.

13:46Ben Mandelker: And like, like you were saying that he was like trying to break down your door. Like you said that.

13:49Ronnie Karam: Uh, I never said that he was trying to break down the door. What? What? What? Uh, not, not, not, not any conversation that I've had with this group. Like, I mean, yeah, I mean, there was like the baker down the street. Like maybe I said that, but they're a baker. Like you're allowed to tell people bakers. Yeah. You're allowed to say whatever you want to a baker. Yeah.

14:09Ben Mandelker: Bakers. It's like, it's in the name. Like you bake up some shit for them. Right. it's obvious so julia's like okay well instead of putting words in your mouth can you just maybe tell us what you think you've said and then he goes well um all i know is that you were very upset in your text message to me and you know i was not naked crying on the bathroom floor brad never banged on my door i did have a panic attack after you not banged on my door when i was naked on the floor though but i but i wasn't either of those things i just was i called the police i said hello is this the shower police because someone's outside my door i think maybe i'm not sure it could be a clean lady it could be actually just like like nothing but i don't know that's that's all

14:46Ronnie Karam: that happened i mean i did have a panic attack after you texted me so like i can tell you that she's like did you have a panic attack because you realized that we heard everything that you said she's like um i i didn't know you guys were out there okay like i did not know that you guys were out there okay molly's like yeah you're kind of missing the point and brad says okay look you've been going around the streets of charleston thinking you're having private conversations saying all these things about me to the point that it made me cry at me okay and then you stab me in my back and you twist the shit and then you keep going deeper and you just keep going deeper and deeper and she's like okay brad brad i'm so sorry that you stalked me i'm so so sorry

15:29Ben Mandelker: like for i he's like but what are you apologizing for um everything all the above every yeah uh crosswalks crosswalks are so hard like who even like those those are so stupid like i'm trying to drive like why do i need to make the sign of the cross when i walk like that's stupid why are you telling me to do that like i i apologize for that because there's other religions

15:53Ronnie Karam: than christianity so i apologize i'm sorry for the word that i used to describe my feelings um because i was like triggering and like i should know to like get a dictionary to like say what's another way to say stalking or like what's another way to say like terrified by a black man i mean i don't know like maybe i should do that but um you know like i sparked deep emotions in you and like i never ever wanted to make you feel that way like until you were behind bars um and um so like i just like it's just like how i express my emotions so like sorry sorry

16:27Ben Mandelker: he's like i just want us to coexist that's all you're gonna get out of me right now it's just that's good. No, that's all I want. I mean, what I'm realizing now is I think I let my frustration about with Brad, not having a conversation with me, make me harder and more stubborn. And like, I have to put on my armor and be like on defense. And I never wanted to get to that point because I thought if I'm getting engaged to a defense lawyer, if he would do it for me. Right. But I regret deeply the pain that I caused. I regret that I caused some pain after he banged on my door while I was naked in the shower.

16:57Ronnie Karam: So I just, I never wanted to make you feel that way, But like, I like, we all know, like, I'm, I'm pretty like an emotional person. And like, I feel things like so, so deeply. And like, I don't, you know, like, I don't think like having anxiety or like being in a bad place with other people, you know, like, I don't like that. And Michael says like, but it's not about what you need. Okay. Like, you just like, like self-awareness. Like the other night, like you and I had a conversation, but you made it all about yourself. Like, you know, I'm sorry. Like, I love you, but like, I don't want to make it about you.

17:25Ronnie Karam: Like, I'm done. I'm over it. And she's like.

17:35so then everyone's like every single time every single time it's the same thing

17:40Ben Mandelker: yeah it's like i feel like like what's the point of giving you the opportunity to speak if you're just gonna like give me the runaround and bal's like okay you're like guys let's take a breath yeah everyone let's breathe let's breathe and michael's like lake like don't please don't speak okay like the thing is that you only speak whenever it's emmy having an emotional reaction and like i said you in the van today i said i wish you rode for me as hard as you ride for jordan and i said that and i said like that you straight up and like i don't want to hear it like i don't

18:09Ronnie Karam: want to hear it i don't want to hear it i'm just like but i do ride for you he's like no i don't want to hear it okay i don't want to hear it lake but also like michaels you treated her like like

18:20Ben Mandelker: like such shit a few weeks ago and now you're expecting like blind loyalty from her i mean i kind of do think that she should ride for michaels in this situation i don't think emmy is the one that anyone should be riding for but sometimes i feel like michaels doesn't realize how like when when he shuts down when he's when he's upset at someone how like that is like maybe like like it's like i don't know if i want to ride hard for you because i don't know when this is going to

18:43Ronnie Karam: turn against me yeah and emily's just over there hyperventilating and me and julie are cracking up across the table like whatever so lake says you know when michaels is upset with somebody he just Just like, well, straight up, shut them out and like ignore them. But like, just talk to her, you know, he's like, I'm not in a place where I want to have a conversation. I just want to like bring it up at dinner and like yell at you about it and then not talk about it. Like what? You're the one who keeps bringing it up. So if you don't want to have a conversation about it, then stop bringing it up every episode because it's now episode 11.

19:15Ronnie Karam: I mean, frankly, I don't even know why Emmy's here. I feel like they should have just gotten rid of Emmy. Like if Emmy's not going to be able to like come, just come out and apologize and do whatever she needs to do to get through it, then she shouldn't even be on the show because this is pretty bad, you know?

19:30Ben Mandelker: Yeah, this is like a microaggression that has like continued for the entire season. It's like shocking. I mean, even like Ramona is able to, when she has a microaggression, usually within like one or two episodes, she's able to like throw some sort of, you know, perfunctory apology on it. That way they can all move on. But Emmy is like, I feel like I've never seen the microaggression drag on this long for an entire season on one of these shows.

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22:02Ben Mandelker: We'll be right back. location. See associate or Lowe's.com for details.

22:11Ronnie Karam: On the other hand, you've got Michaels who's like, keeps bringing it up. And then he's like, Oh my God, why are we still talking about this?

22:18Ben Mandelker: I was wondering what, like, this is a weird one because Michaels was trying to explain to Emmy a few episodes ago, like his lived experience as a man of color at who has like dealt with microaggressions and things. And he's trying to explain it to her. And she just kept on making it about herself in that moment. And it was like very, very frustrating for him where he's like, you know, we're not getting anywhere. And so I feel like I understand why he's like really upset and mad at Emmy because she's proven to be like a really insensitive friend in that moment and maybe not even a friend at all.

22:54Ben Mandelker: And so I get that. So I think it's weird that like everyone's saying to Michaels, you've got a sock. You've got to talk. You've got to talk to her. You've got to talk to her. It's like, like how much does he owe her? like he doesn't have to educate her on like at this point like what have we learned anything from 2020 i mean in some ways i think we have her learned nothing but also like at a certain point emmy just has to do the work and it's not up to michaels to like babysit her the entire time so i thought it was a little weird that everyone was telling like michaels you have to talk to her you have to talk to her you have to talk to her i mean maybe they were saying you guys really love each other so like hash it out but like i think it puts him in a really weird position to be honest

23:31Ronnie Karam: yeah well it's just like causing it's just it's starting another thing in another episode where it's like let's try and talk to emmy about this thing again it's like she's never gonna learn this she's just never gonna learn this i think you guys just need to stop hanging out with her because at this point it's like okay here's another trip okay let's ruin another dinner by like coming at emmy about this thing she's never gonna admit to you know yeah so um i just think it's like beating your head against a wall basically um so um anyway he's like i don't want to hear it lakes and now he's he's coming for lake kind of and so tj's is like michaels i need the i hear you but you need to talk and they're like yeah just straight shoot it and be done just be done with it so this is where they're like talk talk talk talk talk and tj's like yeah i don't think you can tell everyone else they have to make up but then like you can't talk to her and so Lake's like

24:22Ben Mandelker: I almost wonder if like maybe this is like a reaction to that situation with Lake where he was mad at Lake but he wouldn't actually tell Lake why he was mad at her and so they're like okay we have another situation like Michael's grow from the previous situation with Lake and this time talk say say what's on your mind but I just feel like this is like a little bit of an extenuating circumstance where I'm like I actually don't think he's really that obligated I think he really did say it and like he's allowed and yeah i think he just tried to say like you make it all about yourself it's really frustrating for me and i think it's sort of i think in this specific situation with emmy i kind of don't know if he really does he owes her like a whole conversation he's already

25:03Ronnie Karam: given her the conversation he said yeah talk to her she wouldn't cop to it then he got upset with her again over dinner then that didn't work out then it's like again you know and they're like talk about it some more i think a lot of it too is just they don't really have anything else going on this season except for this like that's the only plot really except for like maybe justin's gonna fuck that rouge girl or like they don't really none of the cast that's sitting at the table has anything right now so they're like do it again talk some more and it's like okay guys you're just you're just uh do something else you guys have a responsibility to do something on this show too for christ's sake so he's like okay then you can speak i mean i'll listen to you and she's like i'm i don't like like i don't think you will like i don't think you will yeah because it's

25:55Ben Mandelker: always about what you need meanwhile mia's cracking up because emmy is being so hysterical she's being so over the top with her and like mia just cannot stop laughing julia cannot stop laughing and he's like i just don't know like why you're so upset with me and michael's like because it's always about what you need yeah but like i'm sorry like i'm going through like you know like

26:17Ronnie Karam: Like, I didn't ask for anything to go this way. Like, I didn't ask for my life to be like this. Like, I did not ask for my life to be a shit show. You know, like, I didn't ask for those past two fucking years to happen to me. Like, I'm so sorry. Like, I'm too much as a friend. So, see, I mean, there you go. It's like, oh, it's so hard for me. And this whole two years has just been so hard for me. Yeah. Can't do it. She is incapable.

26:43Ben Mandelker: Michaels is like, I never said you were too much as a friend. I just said that you, like, I said that, like, you lack self-awareness. I'm like, you make things about yourself, okay? And he's like, I know, I know who I am. I know, I know I can. But like, look, I listen to you, Michael. Like, I know, it's like a lie. He's like, Molly goes, I think there's a difference between hearing and listening. She's like, and Michael's like, what? That's what my issue is. And he's like, I just like, I don't know what I've done to be a bad friend. All I do is listen to you. Like, you don't know how hard it is for me to listen to you.

27:12Ben Mandelker: Do you know how hard it is for me to listen to you? Will's not even here. because normally Will listens for me and then he tells me but now I've got to listen. It's hard.

27:18Ronnie Karam: I didn't say you were a bad friend and so now there's a cat there. There's one of those neighborhood cats and it's just sitting there and watching them and Maddie gets this terrified look on her face. But Michael, you said that you wore a shirt because all I do is walk all over you? Like, what?

27:38Ben Mandelker: He's like, um, that's your interpretation of what I said. But that is what you said though. you said that michaels that's like literally what you said you literally said it it was a whole

27:48Ronnie Karam: thing she's like okay then what kind of friend do you think i am he's not the best one right now okay so i'm not like the best friend right now like ow ow oh my god step deep that like step deep that kind of vein you know like how am i being so like like how am i making about me right now like i it's like i'm not at all like maddie are you by the way are you scared of the cat because there's like a cat right there.

28:10Ben Mandelker: Maddie's like, I am, yes. So Maddie says that she's afraid of cats. And Maddie's like, no, like Joe, Joe, go after the cat, go after the cat. So I mean, it's like, okay, guys, I'm still crying. So Michaels, I just, like, Michaels, I think you're like missing the point of the conversation, which was actually that, like, I'm going through a lot right now. He's like, no, you're missing the point. You're the one missing the point. She's like, no, no, it's like, it's just like, no, I've done everything for you. Like, I don't know. I like, I've done so much for you. I'm doing everything. But everyone's totally distracted by the cat now because Maddie is like making a scene about it.

28:39Ben Mandelker: So now no one's paying attention to Emmy.

28:41Ronnie Karam: Maddie's like standing up on the chair. Like, oh my God, I don't know where cats have been. Like, where have the cats been? Like they've been all over the town. They're like street cats. You hang out with this cast.

28:52Ben Mandelker: Yeah. Emmy goes, trust me. I mean, I've had my faults and my friendships with people at this table, but like you think I would do anything to like try to like hurt and disrespect you? Like I love you. You don't understand how hard it is for me to love you because it's so scary. I'm someone who gets stalked in hotel rooms. Okay. And so for me to open my heart is very hard because I'm, I'm afraid to open up even my hotel door.

29:12Ronnie Karam: Oh my God. The cat's running. The cat's running now. The cat's running. Oh my God. Oh my God. Get the cat, Joe, Joe, don't be nice to the cat or it's going to keep coming back. Joe. Okay. It's like grace. Lily. Okay. Give it a lunch. Give it a lunch. Shoo. Shoo cat. Go.

29:27Ben Mandelker: So Emmy is like upset. Now, now Matt, now Michaels is just totally not listening to her. I mean, He's like, not only is Michael's not even listening to me, he's publicly humiliated me. And I would never treat my best friend like that. So, yeah, she's like, I just need a moment. I need some time. I need a moment. I'm publicly humiliated.

29:47Ronnie Karam: So, yeah, she goes. She's like, I need a moment now. So she leaves. And Joe's like, you want to go like on a walk or something? And she's like, yeah.

29:58Ronnie Karam: No tears as usual. and uh he's like okay is it just too much for you and meanwhile maddie's like oh my god that

30:06Ben Mandelker: thing looks like a cheetah it is a cheetah it's secretly a cheetah run run it's as big as a fist by the way it's so small it's like this cute little kitten yeah it's a cute little cat so joe and emmy are walking and emmy is of course sobbing she's i don't know why i do this to myself I don't know why that. So Joe's like, it's too much. It's a lot. Every year, every, every year, every year. I do this to myself.

30:34Ronnie Karam: Yeah. And so back at the table, everyone's telling Michaels he needs to talk to Emmy. Enough. He doesn't need to talk to Emmy. Jesus Christ. He's like, what's the point of having a conversation? Like, she doesn't give a fuck what you have to say. I'm wasting my breath. Enough. And TJ's like, well, I understand what you're saying. Not the listening part, but I don't think she can walk all over you. I mean, you are pretty loud. So he goes, God damn, I'm loud. And he's like, yeah. They're all like, yeah, you're loud. So then Molly's like, well, I do understand what it's like to be screamed at and embarrassed in front of a group of people from Michael's.

31:08Ronnie Karam: So I sympathize with Emmy. Oh, what a shocker. Yeah.

31:13Ben Mandelker: Yeah. What a shocker.

31:14Ronnie Karam: Nancy Grace is going to sympathize with Emmy. I get didn't see that one coming.

31:20Ben Mandelker: So Emmy tells Joe while they're on their walk, just because I don't have my fiance here to fucking defend me, it's just like I'm just this easy pigeon for people to pick off of me. You know how people pick off pigeons? They go up to pigeons and pick them up off the ground and just pull their feathers off. That's me. Classic city pigeon life right here. And if he was here, he just fucking, if we were here, he'd just fucking destroy all these people. Just like he did last year in my honor. Remember when he did that in my honor?

31:46Ronnie Karam: Remember when he showed up to the reunion and laid everybody out for me? Oh, yeah, that's right. He ditched it because he was a wuss. And Joe's like, well, I mean, yeah, I don't think Joe really, I mean, I don't think Will has the best track record of being there for Emmy. Like, he's never, like, looked at one of her necklaces and been like, whoa, that's starfish, right? So, like, I think the only thing Will can do is, like, you know, advise her to remain silent.

32:14So Mia's like, look, Michaels,

32:16Ben Mandelker: I don't know if this is the way that you talk because you talk kind of in riddles, like whatever. Like I don't have a voice and I feel walked over. I think that like if I had an issue with TJ, if I had an issue with Molly, if I had an issue with Bradley or anybody, I would just say, hey, you fucked me by doing this. I don't like it. Fix it. And then we'd be friends again. He's like, yeah, but like riddle me this. Okay. I am a doctor and I'm, but I'm not the dad of the patient, but the patient's my child. like how's that possible so you're doing a riddle that the doctor is the mom that's a very old fashioned riddle where people were shocked that doctors were women you got to really keep up with

32:54Ronnie Karam: your riddle game michaels i'm actually really impressed that you got that okay but the point is like you you have to like just say what's on your mind i mean i get it but he did say what's on his mind didn't he i think not so i'm wondering if there's something else you're good you gave a microaggression then you refuse to apologize for it and i'm black so you you acting like microaggressions are no big deal affects me as well because it's like you're shitting all over me by denying that it would be hurtful or you know i mean i think he said that in so many words

33:30Ben Mandelker: did he not i think he pretty much said it he's like this is an extremely sensitive topic we're talking about race right now and this is going to be bigger than whatever it is that you're upset about but you're somehow making what you're going through bigger than this moment and like you really can't do that and she just was not able to hear that at all

33:49Ronnie Karam: yeah so then uh joe and emmy are still talking and she's like oh my god like who the fuck wears a shirt that says this represents you walking all over me like who does that and he's like well you know it's because he's a drama queen you know he just wants to make the trip about himself so that's why

34:07Ben Mandelker: so i mean he's like yeah i don't need a person like that in my life you don't need someone who makes every moment uh about them in their in your life got it at me so joe's like yeah the difference is i think that like with michaels he actually like loves you he does yeah he actually like he when we were coming to this trip he said he originally packed that fishnet because he felt like you could see right through him to his soul so yeah he changed it up through the sand and like you walk on sand but like at one point it was soul so he loves you

34:36Ronnie Karam: So he's like, I understand if you don't want to make it to Maddie's thing or whatever. So back at the table, they're talking about Maddie's gig. It's almost time to go, but she needs her phone. They got to go because it's time. Shot, shot, shots. So they give a cheers to her in her gig. And then Julia's like, I'm not taking that shot. And DJ's like, pussy. So now everybody gets up to leave and go to this gig. And Emmy's like thanking Joe for talking to her. He's like, you're going to be fine. You're going to be fine. Like I hate to see you at the dinner table like that. It's like so hard. Yeah.

35:09Ben Mandelker: Well, I'm fucking like easy pickings. Like God forbid, like will we're there? Like everyone would shut the fuck up in two seconds. Right. Cause classic will always shutting people up all the time. Cause he's a lawyer.

35:21Ronnie Karam: So now they go to this gig and Maddie's anxious, but everyone's dancing and she's having a great time. So she does her gig basically. And everybody dances around and they have a lot of like synchronized dancing like a lot of choreographed dancing so i found very was line line dancing yeah they have like it's exciting yeah and it's cool i would love that if i was doing something and there was like choreography so they're like whoa look look at that that's amazing and bella

35:51Ben Mandelker: goes bella goes yes that's that's mad that joe that's your girlfriend and he's like yeah we haven't had sex all week but that's my girlfriend yeah for sure like one more day we probably won't be boyfriend girlfriend but like for right now still doing pretty well she threw something on

36:06Ronnie Karam: my desk that i needed it was like a pencil eraser i haven't been able to erase anything in a long time but she's my girlfriend she's she still is you guys yeah yeah so then molly goes to check in on emmy and molly's like hey i want to check on you and emmy's like thank you because like

36:22Ben Mandelker: do you want to sit right here like us us white blonde girls have to stick together you know and molly's like yeah i mean i don't know what you're going through but i understand the wrath of michaels when it comes to having your friendship like torn apart so like i'm here for you and she's like oh good i need my best i need my best friend and it's like me and tj like at our worst never talk to each other like that and like me and brad are worse like i know i'm reactive but like i'm reacting to people who've hurt me and like i don't yell at my best friend like when you care and you love a person you reel it in or you accuse them of stalking your hotel room it's one of those two

36:55Ronnie Karam: things yeah you know like i just think like michael's like he has like a hard time like taking accountability for his actions oh okay okay i mean i'm always like yeah everything you're saying i feel the same way about michael's and i always knew there was something fishy about him because a girl from that neighborhood went missing and i'm sure if you look in his trunk you will find that little girl okay that's a crease okay calm down okay i just like i think you were i Look, I just want to say this. I don't think that you were wrong with a lot of the hurt that you felt with Michaels. Because what I was told by him, you were very valid.

37:34Ronnie Karam: I'm just going to say that. I'm just going to say that.

37:38Ben Mandelker: So Molly's like, well, what do you mean by that? Was that proper English? She goes, okay, well, your whole issue with Michaels being a part of your firing, he's the AG. He's the attorney general. I had no idea. No. assistant general manager AGM. He didn't let me finish. He's a managerial position. And he was asked his opinion on if you should be fired. And it was a yes.

38:01Ronnie Karam: And Molly's like, he has told, he told me he had nothing to do with it and he fought for me. And so we see a flashback of Michael's being like, Oh, I'm like, I've been like defending your honor, even when you're not there. Like I did not even find about, find out about your firing until the morning of.

38:17Ben Mandelker: Now, why is Molly going to just like believe this, this face value from Emmy? Someone that she has just recently, like last episode, reminded us that she's always had a frosty relationship with her. They never got along. Emmy always treated her like shit. Emmy called her like a fucking bitch on TV. And now all of a sudden, Emmy gives her this information about the person that she's beefing with. And Molly's just going to take it face value.

38:41Ronnie Karam: And yeah, she knows what Emmy's doing here. I mean, she should be smart enough to know what Emmy's doing here. But, you know, Molly has always loved to jump on anything to try and make a story. She's trying so hard. I mean, Molly, God bless her. You can look at Molly and be like, Molly's boring or like Molly sucks or Molly's like Nancy Grace, whatever. But you can't say Molly doesn't try. And Molly is going to try. You give her a little inch, she's going to take a mile. And she's going to go. She's going to run with it. So here she goes. She will.

39:13Ben Mandelker: She will. So she's like, I fucking knew it. Michaels has been lying to my face. And if there's anyone who would know this information, it would be Emmy. Emmy is the closest person to Michaels, and I'm pissed. I'm hurt. I'm heartbroken.

39:30Ronnie Karam: Why was she fired again? I forget what she did. Why did she get fired? Do you remember?

39:38Ben Mandelker: I don't remember.

39:39Ronnie Karam: I thought it was because she was missing work too much for her other job. Her event planning.

39:44Ben Mandelker: I honestly don't remember. I really don't remember. Why did Molly get fired? They should have brought this up one more time in the middle of the season so we remembered.

39:54Ronnie Karam: Yeah, I think so too. Because I don't remember what it is.

40:00Ronnie Karam: Anyway, but you got fired. I mean, ultimately, it was the people who fired you, Leva and all of them. So even if he agreed to fire you, you were apparently doing stuff that was fireable, right? I don't know. I don't remember.

40:12Ben Mandelker: Well, Emmy tells us, Emmy tells us, I know what it's like to have a gut feeling that you're in the right and have everyone gaslight you telling you that you're wrong. So I'm just like, yeah, we're going to be honest because I've got to be honest. Honesty is the best policy. I'm like, if this is a reference to Will cheating, lady, there's a lot of people saying that he's cheated. At some point, you have to take the blinders off.

40:33Ronnie Karam: Will is cheating on you. Will has been cheating on you. Oh, my God. And honesty is your best policy. See, you were saying that Brad was beating down the door and that you were naked on the floor, terrified. Get out of here. So now they're friends. That's all it took. So Michael is, you know, everybody else is enjoying the gig. And they're like, oh, my God, Maddie's doing so great. So she finishes the gig and they all jump in the pool and swim together. And Emmy gets in there and everyone else is cheering and having fun. And she's just kind of like waiting close to them. Like, everybody's so mean to me.

41:10Ben Mandelker: yeah so um then now we're back in charleston okay it was a it was a fun trip and now we're back in charleston and tj is on facetime with his mom stephanie and she's like hey what are you doing did you just get home have you vacuumed yet he's like yeah as soon as i got off the plane oh good did everyone behave yeah for the most part and then we see justin who's facetiming his mom mary up in boston and she's like so i never even got to talk to you and she's like yeah i know mom was fun like we're drinking it's good times oh yeah i love hearing that you talk to that girl that you're in love with yeah man yeah it was great i love my mom she's a rock growing up she's a matriarch she was tough irish catholic boston woman i remember this one time this girl literally left underwear in my mom's car my mom said hey what are you doing with this underwears and i said what what underwear she goes this underwear is this your aunt's i was like yeah it is it is my aunt because i knew you had a thing for my sister it was weird it was real weird, weird moment for us.

42:08Ronnie Karam: So he's talking about Charlie and he's like, yeah, I know you love her, Ma, because, you know, the green flag for you is a red flag for me. And she's like, oh, God, it's the Taylor Swift. God, that's a definite check for me. That puts it at the top of the list. I love Taylor. Yeah.

42:24Ben Mandelker: He's like, really? It's like, oh, yeah, I can't wait to meet her. Yeah. And he's like, yeah, well, I'm sure I'll bring her up to Boston. No, I'm talking about fucking Taylor Swift. I want to meet her.

42:33Ronnie Karam: god so now it's time for a shift of republic everybody um and shows like oh here tj i'll tie a tie feel i'll show you how to do it look look at this as a mouse the mouse goes around the the tree two times and then the mouse goes up the tree and then the mouse goes into the hole and then the mouse has a couple of drinks and the mouse comes back out and the mouse's girlfriend's like you're an alcoholic it's like well nobody gave me a business

42:58Ben Mandelker: but why would the mouse go into the hole what's why is the mouse going up the tree if it's just going to go down into the whole show. Well, like, it needs to tell everyone that there's like an emo party in the hole and then has to go to the hole to host the party.

43:11Ronnie Karam: Mike's like, well, wait, you don't know how to tie a tie? And he's like, no, bitch. We know you do because you're half lesbian.

43:22Ben Mandelker: So Maddie's asking me if she and Michaels have talked yet. And definitely not. I mean, he's like, I would be doing myself a disservice if I just acted like everything was fine and the way that he treated me was fine because it's not mine.

43:36Ronnie Karam: And Maddie's like, I definitely agree. He was like a little harsh. Oh my God, you guys. What do you, he was not harsh. This was not, this wasn't one of the Michael screaming at women things that we've seen. I didn't feel like it was, did you? I mean, we've seen it a couple times this season and called him out on it, but I didn't think this was that really. I thought he actually kind of learned his lesson and kind of stayed somewhat calm through this.

44:00Ben Mandelker: Yeah, I mean, unless there was something else. I know at the beginning of the trip, before they even had their talk, he was being really frosty to her. So he was doing the same thing where he's like, I'm not going to say why I'm mad at you. I'm just going to be mad at you. And she was like, why is Michael's mad at me? So that was a thing that happened earlier in the trip.

44:15Ronnie Karam: Well, yeah, he's definitely still immature.

44:18Ben Mandelker: Yeah. So Joe's working the line outside. And he's like, I love where I'm at right now. And I'm feeling like re-energized after a vacation, after like my awesome event that I threw and I just feel like everything's like falling back to place. I like take away my chronic back pain. Like 30 is like not so bad.

44:37Ronnie Karam: You know where we should watch the game? We have a sporting club, Club Lamar. So we're going to watch it. So Leva's here now, dressed crazy. Leva needs some help with her outfits on this show, I think. So they're like, oh my God, Leva, the Queen of Republic. So Michael's just talking about the trip. And he's like, yeah, you know, like there's been drama going on, but I try to make sure that Leva doesn't hear about it, you know, like leave the shit outside of work. So he's telling her it was fun. And, you know, and Brad's like, yeah, we had a great time. And Leva's like, uh-huh. Okay. So Joe comes up and he's like, it's been a crazy few weeks, but I'm like so glad to be back at work.

45:17Ronnie Karam: I cannot wait for you to give me my own business. This is going to be great. You know, you're not going to regret this, Leva. You're not going to regret this.

45:24Ben Mandelker: yeah now that i've been like back at my job for like a day i just feel like i have this newfound fire i feel like i care more about my career so um here's my hand and you can just put the keys right in there right in there and i'll just go and start the business so yeah right i'm ready i'm

45:41Ronnie Karam: ready for something bigger now you know like after taking a four-day weekend uh during the busiest time at the restaurant to go see my girlfriend dj which is what you don't like um yeah i'm ready for you to give me a business ready for something bigger. And she goes, yeah, well, I feel like, you know, you put your mind to anything that could happen.

46:00Ben Mandelker: So yeah. Um, well, there are like other people that are hitting me up and I'm just like, there's no way I'm going to do this for the first time without people that I love and trust the most. So like, there was no land. I'm just going to like get back there. And I just think that like, you know, I could just do like two more tables, you know, like that's like that. She's like, oh, I love seeing it. And if you were just trying to make me feel like you were using other people as leverage for me like that didn't work

46:22Ronnie Karam: so better hurry up better get Joe a restaurant before somebody else does okay

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48:51Ronnie Karam: So now we have date night with Lake and Jonessa. And they're just like giggling at each other. Like, ha, ha, ha, you're cute, you're cute. No, you're cute. No, you're cute. Like, I was, like, such a bitch to you the first time we met. She's like, yeah, it was crazy because I was, like, so nervous. And you're, like, so pretty. And I was like, maybe she's bi or gay or something. And so I'm like, okay, I'm going to do it. So, like, you're coming and you're walking towards me. And I was like, you need a drink. And then you're like, I'm working. She's like, oh, sorry.

49:21Ben Mandelker: Yeah, like, wow. By the way, when did you and your ex break up? She's like, about a year ago. She's like, yeah, wow. You know, for me, I was like really young when I had my first real relationship because I would secretly date girls that they could spend the night at my house that my mom caught on pretty quick. And she would FaceTime me, which was crazy because they didn't even have FaceTime back then. But like somehow my mom just had it and she'd be like, like, what the hell are you doing? So it was like, cool. But my dad didn't like it.

49:47Ronnie Karam: Yeah. And they talk about how her dad's still a homophobe and he thinks that she's just like doing all of this to be like rebellious. and so she's just going to be patient with her dad i guess she's like well you can't change him and so then they're like oh my god your eyes are so pretty you know your eyes and then they kiss outside lake's like fuck it we're gonna do it and they kiss on camera so then grace lily time grace lily is where everybody the the you know the total environment everybody wants to get their cards read a nice dark room with some patchouli going and some candles and lots of scarves.

50:26Ronnie Karam: Nope, it's Zach's Dax. Who wants to get their cards right at Zach's Dax?

50:31Ben Mandelker: I don't know, but there she is. It's Zachary's. So Love explains to us, you know, although Grace hasn't worked for us for a couple years, she did mention that she wanted to get back to it and get back into work. And the nightlife business wasn't the best environment for her, and I just want to inspire and have her have something. But in a space that, like, isn't late night, I just don't want her to be tempted by you know booze and alcohol everywhere so we put her um in a place that has 12 different daiquiri machines flowing at once you know she's just so childlike and she's just loves

51:08Ronnie Karam: substances too much so we're putting her in a place full of substances that are childlike in color to really uh get her excited about not drinking anymore okay all right so meanwhile grace is reading the cards and she's like oh my god i sent something fiery and the girl's like oh my god that's so me she's like yeah glad i could help god this is a good one

51:30Ben Mandelker: um so then uh everyone else start well joe and maddie's uh show up because they're there to see ally because ally is going to be performing singing at zachary deck zachary's zachary's this is like the peach pit or that place on the oc where they'd watch bands like why okay so you come to Zachary's Zachary's for frozen drinks, but also to get your tarot cards read and also to watch a singer songwriter strum on her guitar and sing.

52:01Ronnie Karam: Love is just like anybody even interested in reality TV here to bring in people. Please bring in as many people as we can. I don't care. I don't care. I don't care if it's the alley girl that nobody knew from Vanderpump Rules. Bring her in here. Okay. Bring in the Bella of Vanderpump Rules.

52:19Ben Mandelker: so maddie's like i know ally because i dj'd with her ex all the time and her family lives here in charleston so i'm like excited that she's in town and that she's here singing at the premiere concert venue of zachary's daiquiris yeah james must have known that she was going to have her

52:34Ronnie Karam: big moment this week at zach stacks because he announced that he's found the wine guys he's dated somebody for like four weeks and he's found the one i saw it on some headline i was like James is still in headlines. No one asked for this.

52:50Ben Mandelker: Are they having a child together?

52:53Ronnie Karam: Are they? My gosh. I guess maybe I should read the headlines.

52:57Ben Mandelker: Yeah, I think there are. I think it says Ali Luber shocked at James Kennedy baby news. So the baby news is the following, which is that I think he's expecting some sort of I think he's expecting a child.

53:15Ronnie Karam: Yikes So Wow So then Grace Lily is now doing her reading And she's like Two of Pentacles, that's yin and yangy You know what that is Those are like two worms But they're giving each other the 69 You ever see them on skateboards or anything like that So basically you're a skateboarder Watch out though because traffic is terrifying And the girl's like oh my god Okay thanks I'll never skateboard Okay my work here's done

53:44Ben Mandelker: Wow, I wasn't expecting to see Grace here I mean, she's been a horrible friend to Maddie So it's like a little awkward I mean, the things that she told Maddie to do Like to peg me, like that was terrible So Grace is like Yeah, it's definitely awkward seeing Maddie and Joe And I do want to extend this olive branch Because I've been thinking a lot about this olive branch This is my second olive branch The first one I accidentally dropped in a daiquiri machine Real weird Yeah, I've been thinking about this olive branch And I don't know, I just want this to be a really good olive branch because, you know, I actually don't like olives, but I do love branches.

54:15Ben Mandelker: And I thought, well, take the good, take the bad, you know, take them both in there you have olive branches of life.

54:22Ronnie Karam: So, Grace, Joe's just ignoring her. Joe and Maddie are ignoring her, but Grace comes up to stand right next to them, and they still ignore her. She's like, oh, love your shirt. It's like, oh, thank you. And your pants. Okay, I appreciate that. Everything good with you? Yeah, it's actually good. I've been in a really good place. I've been thinking about olive branches, okay? really into all the branches right now. It's like, well, obviously, like, I clearly care about you and I love you a lot, but we're both pretty hurt. So, my butt specifically.

54:52Ben Mandelker: Yeah, well, I was also hurt, okay, because I showed up at a theme party and no one told me about that was slumbers. Okay?

54:59Ronnie Karam: I love that she's stalled onto this. It's so fucking funny to me. No, tell me it was a pajama party. How am I supposed to feel?

55:08Ben Mandelker: Well, I'm just going to say hi, and I'm just going to say hi. I'm going to do it. I'm going to say hello. hi, hi, hi, it's me. She goes, oh, I didn't know if you wanted to chat for a second. She's like, yeah, yeah, okay, we can chat. Okay, yeah, let's go outside. It's nice out here. Hey, so it's been over a month since, you know, I saw Maddie. Yeah, it's been over a month since Grace and I last spoke, and I'm concerned. Yeah. So, did anyone apologize to you, Joe? Did she apologize to you, Joe? He's like, not really. No, she didn't even compliment you on your star for sharing, which was too bad.

55:41Ronnie Karam: So, they sit down and grace is like i miss you like i feel it's been a while like i haven't even seen you so long like the other day i was hula hooping out on my front lawn you weren't even there clapping for me that was weird so thanks for missing that show but you know it's been such a crazy summer i mean i don't know i just really want to start off by saying i really am sorry with what happened that night at molly's house i mean yes my feelings were hurt but you know i hurt your feelings now your feelings were hurt while you were wearing pajamas so you didn't feel stupid like I did. My feelings were hurt.

56:14Ronnie Karam: So one of us felt stupider than the other person because they weren't in pajamas. But, you know, whatever. Well, I know why you're hurting.

56:21Ben Mandelker: I know why you're hurting because you did just get a new pajama set and you weren't able to wear it. But it doesn't give me a reason to feel like you can just walk all over me all the same time. The reason why I wore this top is because it's reminiscent of sand and you walked all over the sand at one point in your life in Tulum. and that's like the this is to loom sand that i'm what are you talking about i don't know i i was

56:42Ronnie Karam: trying something and just forget it yeah but okay maddie if i could go in time i would unshoot john frank kennedy because he was very handsome and handsome people shouldn't get shot okay and also i wouldn't hurt your feelings okay because i think the emotions were high you know and you didn't tell me like it's a pajama party and i showed up and i just felt like a fool you know well i feel like

57:07Ben Mandelker: I'm trying to be a good friend and I feel like you're throwing daggers at me and like trying to hurt me no that's not what I'm doing Maddie you know as someone that's been through drug addiction right you know my struggles you know the things I've been through but I haven't been I've been doing a lot better doing real good now okay and I'm not asking for help I'm not I'm actually getting help and I'm not asking for help is that nice like well I mean I do hope that that's the

57:31Ronnie Karam: case and like I hope that you do like get that and follow through so yeah but it is the case because I'm in with Isaac, okay? I don't know if you know him in the community, but he's like a drug and alcohol person. And then I've done NA meetings, you know? And that's where you just sit around and go, nah, nah. You know, I'm going to therapy. I'm doing those kinds of things, you know, stuff like that. I took the train last week. That's neither here nor there, but it was fun.

57:59Ben Mandelker: We don't have a train. Oh, what was that? I don't know. But Grace, you know what? Grace has told me a million times over the past six years that she's going to get help with this and she never has. She's always just been on a journey and this journey hasn't ever, ever come to a destination. So it's hard to believe right now that this is the time that she's clean now.

58:19Ronnie Karam: Yeah, but I've been sober though. But I've been sober. So.

58:23Ben Mandelker: I think that like where we just move from here is like me seeing those actions of you actually getting help.

58:29Ronnie Karam: Oh, okay. You want me pissing the cup and show it to you? Okay. it'll probably taste like something out here have you tasted this stuff it's terrible it's terrible

58:37Ben Mandelker: well i would have loved to have seen a drug test maybe on girls night yeah she's like well i went

58:42Ronnie Karam: on drugs that night though because i only had two glasses of wine that that night that's different you know and it's immediately like of course you're like oh you're not sober like people do not get not sober from a couple glasses of wine maddie's journey was different i think that

58:57Ben Mandelker: sometimes like she kind of envies maybe people that are able to have a drink right she sort of I was like, Maddie's just sort of like jealous of my sober journey, I guess, because she can't have one at all. But I'm like on my own journey and like I'm doing better for myself. And like, you know, God has a plan.

59:14Ronnie Karam: And it's for me to have rosé. That's what his plan is. Okay. So this is interesting because she's like, I'm totally in touch with my addiction, which is why I can still have a drink and be fine with it. Sorry, you can't. It's very interesting because there are different ways that people get sober. Some people are not really alcoholics. They're just drug addicts. So not doing the drug anymore is maybe their version. But it is interesting because Maddie is sober, sober. And she's talking to this girl. She's like, oh, I was sober that now. All I had was a couple glasses of wine. So that, of course, rings as total bullshit to Maddie.

59:51Ronnie Karam: She's like, okay, what conversation are we having right now, lady?

59:56Ben Mandelker: Yeah. So Grace is like, then Maddie's like, well, two days before you were doing something. when I picked you up. And she's like, no, no, no. That not, yeah, you picked me up. I was drinking. It's like, she's like, that's not true. That is true. No, you told me you relapsed. She's like, Maddie, no, I was considering relapsing, but I didn't relapse. No, you said you relapsed. I was like, how do you know that? You weren't with me. You don't know if I relapsed or not.

1:00:20Ronnie Karam: But I was with you. I came to pick you up. I was with you and you told me. And so she tells us a few days before the girls and gays party, Grace reached out saying she needs help and she's in a situation where she's too fucked up. So Maddie picked her up and took her to her house and took care of her and she bathed her that night and she was fucked up out of her mind. Oh, Grace. Oh my gosh.

1:00:41Ben Mandelker: Yeah, I mean, Grace's story is sad because we saw that she did get help, but we also know the real life headlines, which is that she's been arrested once or twice now since this. It's just been a rough journey for her. So she says that she wasn't using that weekend and she's like, she didn't see me have any drugs on me, anything that that pisses me off i slept over at her house there's nothing wrong with that she's

1:01:02Ronnie Karam: supposed to be my friend babe it's there is when you're so fucked up you have to be picked up and then she has to literally bathe you so god grace so maddie's like you know i give her headphones to listen to like ocean and meditation because that helps me go to sleep you know and i think she took that as me like putting her off or something but i don't know so grace is like Yeah, and then the whole time she's on her phone watching the Osbournes.

1:01:29Ben Mandelker: Maddie goes, yeah, because that was the week that Ozzy Osbourne died, so I was watching the Osbournes a lot. Like, what the hell? Maddie's like, okay, you've been up for two days and you relapsed, okay, during the Ozzy Osbourne marathon. No, I had no drugs on me that night. I was not doing drugs. I've been drinking that night. I was just wasted, that's all, but not on drugs.

1:01:50Ronnie Karam: Yeah, but Grace, if you're so wasted even on alcohol that you're up for two days straight and still need to be picked up and bathed. That's a problem, babe. Oh, I hate this for Gray Silly. I love Gray Silly. Yeah. So she's like, okay, do you want me to grab Joe? Because Joe literally was in the car there, okay? And she's like, nah-ah. And no matter what, you guys are always going to take each other's side, so whatever.

1:02:14Ben Mandelker: It has nothing to do with that. Yeah, well, I just feel like we should end the conversation. Yeah, okay, fine, fine, fine, fine. so Maddie gets up and goes inside and Grace is like yeah I was hoping for some support from her I didn't get that unfortunately and that's fine like I don't need everybody's fucking support

1:02:32Ronnie Karam: oh bummer boo I feel like it's gotta be

1:02:37Ben Mandelker: very tough to be around Grace and she probably does take a lot of energy and effort and she does lash out but I also feel like she's like a very lonely soul and I do I actually am like really concerned for her

1:02:50Ronnie Karam: yeah oh grace come on grace we're rooting for you lady yeah but in the meantime we are done

1:02:59Ben Mandelker: with this episode thanks everyone for listening and we'll catch you on the next episode of watch what crappens bye everyone bye watch what crappens would like to thank its premium sponsors she answered the call it's adia paul ain't no thing like alison king our way is the amber way It's the Foster and the Furious. It's Amanda Foster. It's Always Automatic with Ashley Otto. Put your hands together for Carly Clapp. Get on the right foot with Chrissy Offutt.

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