#3415 Summer House S10E20 Part One: The Aftermath Ain’t Mathin’

0:19Ben Mandelker: This podcast features Ben Mandelker and Ronnie Karam.

0:30Ronnie Karam: Hi, it's Mark Bittman from the podcast Food with Mark Bittman. It's grilling season and Whole Foods Market has everything you need, from their 365 brand ground meat to the New York strips and ribeyes. There are also grill-ready beef and chicken kebabs and house-made sausages. Yum. All the meat at Whole Foods Market is no antibiotics ever, and all of the seafood is either responsibly farmed or sustainable wild-caught. So fire up that grill and get all of this and more at your local Whole Foods market for in-store shopping as well as pickup and delivery.

1:28Ben Mandelker: So much that crappens.

1:31Ronnie Karam: Well, hello and welcome to Watch What Crappens. I'm Ronnie. That's Ben over there. Hello, Ben. Hi, Ronnie. How are you? Hi, everybody. Welcome to the show today. As usual, if you want this episode on video, it's a video recap. You can get it. Go to patreon.com slash watch what crappens. It's also where you get bonus episodes. We've got some Love Island up there. We're going to probably have an OC preview later. or you want ad-free listening or you want a Discord server to talk to each other or you want our free weekly blog recap of all of this stuff written by moi, you can just sign up for that for free at Patreon and do that, okay?

2:11Ronnie Karam: Otherwise, we're just here recapping. I'm so glad that we have more Summer House to talk about. I don't know if you've talked about it enough. I sure haven't. I even went on Andy's Girls, Sarah Gailey's podcast called Andy's Girls to talk about it for like two hours. So go listen to that. That's a very in-depth discussion of the part three reunion. And then we got this after sun thing, this aftermath. Yeah. What'd you feel about after sun?

2:37Ben Mandelker: After sun. I loved it. Also, by the way, yes, you ever got after sun West got aftermath, although she actually wound up on both afters. Just want to say also, I'm taking full advantage of the fact that this is our summer house episode. And so I am going to shill for the last time. My food newsletter, mbdfancy.substack.com because I reviewed a really good cookbook this weekend and I spent a lot of time so if you're looking for a good cookbook and you want to read about one I reviewed Better at Home by Kalou Henry and I really love it so go check that out like and subscribe like and subscribe guys get your sub stacked I'm exploiting the popularity of Summer House to wedge my food thing in there

3:23Ronnie Karam: um you should have made it a whole summer house post like this is what kalou henry would have thought about west this hot dog casserole i would have just shown a whole bunch of pictures of her

3:33Ben Mandelker: from her cookbook being like um also if you look at the cookbook and you look at all the pictures i love kalou and but if you look at all the pictures of her she sort of does have a look of someone who's passing judgment on west she's like hmm really uh i loved this aftermath actually You know, I was a little nervous because I feel like in the storied history of Bravo, when they cobble together an episode after the reunion, it's usually pretty shitty. And we almost never, ever cover them because it's usually some clip show. It's like unseen footage.

4:09Ronnie Karam: Katie Maloney eating raw cookie dough out of her fridge drunk while she's talking to her dog. It's like, what are you doing? Truly.

4:17Ben Mandelker: I thought this was great. I have to say. No offense. catch and strays but you catch and stress you know what that's just what that's just her role on bravo she literally catches strays and then there is that thought you were done with me you dick but um uh i loved it i really think the standout the breakout star of this was lindsey hubbard i think lindsey is like i thought she was so good as someone grilling amanda i thought she She was so on her and she was just, she was like a great interviewer. I was like, she actually could get a talk show. I think she would, she, I think Lindsay Hubbard could get a daytime talk show.

4:57Ben Mandelker: I think she could do what Bethany aspired to do. And she could have a show on. It's at like noon and she has people on. There's like, but what are you talking about? Like, do you realize that you're broken? Like, do you hear what you're saying? Like, you need to fill that void because you're being an idiot right now. And I'd be like in, I'm watching the Lindsay Hubbard talk show.

5:17Ronnie Karam: you know i uh always enjoy lindsey's energy i'm a lindsey stan um i got super pissed at lindsey during this i'm so i'm surprised we're already going to disagree on this i mean look as far as confronting people lindsey's always going to be good at confronting people she's kind of like me it's like where do you come from on this relationship standpoint that you have such opinion but she's right i'm not going to say she's wrong what she pissed me off was she immediately gave Amanda her victim storyline and not only gave it to her, like force fed it to her, you know, with the whole like, so you're saying that he came out to you.

5:52Ronnie Karam: So you're saying that he and Amanda and us. So you're saying he manipulated you. And Amanda's like, oh, well, those aren't my words. I mean, it's what you were implying, first of all. But that Lindsay was so, to me, she was so clearly steering this into the poor Amanda is a victim of all of this. Amanda's gone through a lot. And so Amanda's a victim. So we need her back on in the city in summer house to keep this to keep this gravy train going so i mean i guess i looked at it more of a cynical way like sorry that's this might interrupt interrupt your meal train but fuck amanda and i cannot believe you're gonna sit here and give her excuses and let her off so easy none of the time all her timeline is bullshit all of west timeline is bullshit and she basically got away with all of that so lindsey was doing like the tough talking thing but we still don't have any we just we still don't have any clear answers on the timeline and i feel like amanda still

6:44Ben Mandelker: got away with just lying her ass off um i i didn't feel like lindsey was was doing that there were some people online who were saying um lindsey was doing like pr 101 which was actually um masquerading as tough love but actually giving her a way out and uh lindsey responded to that on threads she was like um this is what didn't make the edit i told amanda at the end of the conversation in order to be friends with me i need my friends to show integrity character and better decision-making skills and until that happens unfortunately there's no place for people like that in my life so she did she is alleging that she um uh she did basically say amanda like

7:28Ronnie Karam: no moss uh i i but she's all that's also leaving herself open that's also leaving amanda like okay hey, here's our storyline for Summer House shooting in a month.

7:38Ben Mandelker: I don't think that she was setting Amanda up necessarily to be like, hey, I want you to be off the hook right now. But I did feel like she was saying, hey, dummy, if you're smart, I'm telling you this is your path out of this, and you can join us, and we can all pile on to West, and you can actually have a job, you idiot. and to me it was less like hey like let me oh my god she's really like it was i guess it's a subtlety to me what i was not feeling was like oh lindsey in a certain way was like secretly rooting for amanda and hoping that she like gets a glow up and for the public in my mind it was kind of like uh hello idiot like you saw even raquel could figure out how to do this what's wrong with you you know so that's how it kind of read read to me yeah i mean i agree with that i

8:32Ronnie Karam: I think that she was giving Amanda her like, hello, this is what you need to say. And if you are going to still be on this show, this is what you need to say. I mean, I almost looked at it as like not necessarily helping her look better. I think she was helping herself by saying, listen, I'm only shooting this show once every other week. West is probably going to be fired from the show, which he has been. We know now. But at the time, she's thinking, OK, we still need something going on. This is the biggest thing to happen to Summer House. You need to still be on this show, dummy. and the world hates you.

9:02Ronnie Karam: So you need to say that you're a victim. She gave her the script. And I think Lindsay's like, okay, and I will hold out on yelling at you until the first week of shooting, which is, it's like she's saving her toy. You know what I mean? She's like, okay, okay. I am keeping you in the package until July 4th weekend. And then I'm going to shoot you apart on national TV. So, but yeah, I mean, I definitely, I mean, you know, whatever the reason she did it. But yeah, I mean, I definitely looked at her being like, okay, Amanda, let's sit down and I'll give you your defense. You're a victim and you were manipulated and you're just a sad, sad emotional woman who's been victimized by West.

9:44Ronnie Karam: Which, I mean, part of that, I don't necessarily disagree with all of that. But I mean, just handing her, but I'm not going to give Amanda that. Amanda's an asshole.

9:52Ben Mandelker: I like what Louis Pitesman said. Louis Pitesman, culture commentator. he said on threads I say this with so much affection for Lindsay her loyalty is to the show it's what makes her such an incredible reality star at the reunion she seemed angriest at Wes and Amanda for the way they fucked up the group dynamics and potentially the show to me it's less about trying to redeem Amanda though I get why many feel this way and more about finding any sort of path forward for the good of the show and also why she was down to film with the man who ended their engagement on camera so um i i i agree that i think that lindsey is about the show and she's like like don't fuck up don't fuck up my paycheck and she even said on the reunion she was like you you don't realize how you guys acted could seriously mess this up because they all saw what happened to vanderpump rules um and so i i i thought it was great i think what's so dumbfounding emphasis on the dumb is how amanda and west they um at this point there have been there is like a road map for navigating a scandal.

10:56Ben Mandelker: And, you know, it's just funny to me that they're just, they're too inept to follow it. You know, it's not to say like, oh God, here comes another canned apology. Here comes another this or that. Like every time, every time a celebrity gets into trouble or winds up in a scandal, there's the tears, there's the apology. There's all, all those things that we know are so fake. And so it's like, I never, it's not that I care about those words, but I want you to at least put in the effort. I want you to be inconvenienced enough to have to go through those things as part of your punishment. You know?

11:30Ben Mandelker: And the fact that they're just not even willing, not going to watch the show. Pay your penance. Pay your penance. Go. You have to do the things. Kim Richards sat in front of Dr. Phil for crying out loud. Where's, like, you do it too. You've got to do the stupid things. You've got to, like, go to fake rehab. Sorry. You go away for three weeks to fake rehab. You've got to do those things. We know it's not going to help, but it's your punishment. You have to be inconvenienced.

11:56Ronnie Karam: I actually think it's kind of funny that they're not because like their whole, I think it's funny that they're doing the bareman. They even shooting this episode, they're like, you are going to come back and you are going to answer things. You didn't answer shit in the reunion. We're still going to get huge ratings. You're going to come back and you're going to tell it. They didn't tell shit. Neither one of them did. They just lied the whole time. And then Amanda's like, oh, I've been victimized. victimized who was manipulated because i was just sad and i was remembering what it was like to be young first of all you're 34 you are young i would still steal the stem cells right out of your spine if i was near enough you're young and second of all liar because two weeks later you went to fucking italy with him and we're spitting in his mouth so stop stop with your fakery i can't it was making me nuts but it was cracking me up that lindsey's like here's what you need to say and we're getting another season, bitch.

12:44Ronnie Karam: And Amanda just kind of said it. And then West goes onto his side and he's like, uh, West doesn't even bother. West is a failure. West didn't even bother. I mean, his whole thing, like you've fucked your best, one of your best friend's wives. Okay. And your answer is like, but I loved her. Wait, what do you, what do you mean you loved her? When, when did you, well, I said it during the season. Didn't you watch? Okay. So you were in love with my wife during the season, right under my nose. No, I just no I was just saying I love her like a friend oh come on Wes like you're not even making any fucking attempt here it was cracking me up I mean just just erase them you know not from the world but from the TV like just you're bad at this you guys aren't even good at having an affair

13:30Ben Mandelker: yeah and like what was really frustrating about Amanda was that she was acting like you know you're right I'm enlightened I'm learning these lessons thank you Lindsay and she doesn't take any she takes nothing away from that. That's what we have seen. They go to Italy. Like you said, they go to Italy. That relationship is still going strong. The red flags have been waved in her face and smushed in her eyeballs, and she still is like, I'm seeing white flags. And it's just... It's very sad. Now, the thing with Wes is, I'm sure many people have heard this clip. I'm just going to play it. This is that thing about the Knicks that some say is actually...

14:06Ben Mandelker: Well, people were thinking this is why he was fired because he was sharing more on his podcast than he was on the reunion but it seems like when they shot this episode as we'll see it seems like he was already fired all right well this is not gonna work then i apologize everyone i don't know that man in my ears that loud but uh i but the point was the way he speaks so cleanly and sort of like almost like authoritatively on his podcast i think i said this a few days ago this is the real west the guy who is making this making this you know flippant thing about like i hope the nicks lose or whatever I mean like I'm not offended by him saying that because the Knicks won but also like whatever it's stupid but like that is the real West the way is well he was saying for those of you who

14:48Ronnie Karam: didn't hear it he was saying he hopes the Knicks lose that game because then that would mean that they would have to play again on the same night that this episode aired and so less people would watch this episode and he didn't want to give this episode any eyeballs to which set Lindsay off on

15:03Ben Mandelker: her own right tell-off thing but yeah that's basically the clip yeah and and so i i think what really struck me about that and you see it tonight is the way that the way that he talks to kyle in this stuttering half-sentenced way can't even look at him mumbling half-truths slippery words uh like i'm just a good guy and i'm just like it's just like things got out of control and like oh yeah i wish it could have been better like that's what he presents himself as but then you watch him on his podcast and there's like his voice has a bit more cruelty in it i believe and i'm like that is the real west and it's like this guy is such a faker such a faker yeah i guess i

15:43Ronnie Karam: don't have to say all that conclusion that we all know right and he also needs a good conditioner i'm sorry that i'm i know i'm a bald person but you have to understand when you're bald and you see people wasting hair and it's just like what are you doing with what is this haircut why are you torturing i feel like you're just fucking with me now on so many levels he came out looking like beau bridges and like dumb and dumber it was a beau bridges jeff bridges which bridges was in dumb and dumber uh was it a bridge i knew it was one of the brothers um that guy and dumb and sorry that's really bad when you're fucking up a dumb and dumber reference dumb dumber it's time for a commercial it's time for a crap it's commercial my mom is the queen of the bargain find i mean you can't even compliment the woman without finding out how much something costs i was like mom i really love your new dress she's like it was five dollars i got this as a bargain and i found the new place to make her so happy i've never seen her so thrilled it's called whatnot

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19:27Ronnie Karam: So, yeah, so let's get into it. Let's. Because we have a lot of watching West picking lint off of his pants to do. He picked so much lint off of his pants. How does he even have any pants on? How was he not in just underwear by the end of this? Because all he did was pick lint off of his pants.

19:46Ben Mandelker: It's a great question. It's a very great question. It's a lot of lint. It is. So much lint he could have been opening up a chocolate store. Get it! Hidden D.

20:00I know.

20:01Ronnie Karam: Groans. Groans all around. If only he used more reason. Am I right? It's even were there our time. Thank God. What a Cadbury Alright so Carl We open with Carl for some reason He's like oh I've been on this for 10 years From the beginning We've been going on the last few months It's like everything we've ever Experienced Okay calm down Carl Calm yourself Seriously It's like so much Carl calm down Carl Carl's very affected

20:34Ben Mandelker: By this whole thing So then we see flashbacks the reunion etc flashback flashback flashback we'll just scroll right over to the actual show it's just nothing but flashbacks so we're seeing like the whole season and all the drama and everything and andy going should we start over so now um it's tonight on the aftermath so it's 20 days after the reunion this is may 13th i was flying off to memphis tennessee when this happened uh it's also weird how this was filmed so recently because we're so used to stuff on these shows being filmed weeks ahead of time so i'm like wow this was like two weeks ago i'm like it's like basically live this entire show is live to me yeah it's a month ago oh i guess it is a month ago

21:18Ronnie Karam: time flies that new york still i mean the tv time that that is very fast well i i guess it's not as recent as i thought yeah uh it's a month ago but yeah still uh so amanda comes to lindsey's apartment and first thing we hear is Lindsay going, shoes off, please. Shoes off. I was like, damn, geez, I'm so sorry.

21:41Ben Mandelker: God, my fucking feet duty. That was a power play. I guarantee she doesn't ask that of anyone else. She's just only going to do it to Amanda. Get her off guard. Set the tone.

21:52Ronnie Karam: Yeah. Well, I don't know because Amanda, remember that scandal at BravoCon, not this last one, but a couple ago. So like four years ago when, or what's wrong with me today three years ago whatever it was when Giselle was like I saw Amanda from Summer House in the bathroom and she was barefoot and who walks around a bathroom barefoot and it became this big scandal and Amanda was like sorry sorry she's on in the bathroom and I was thinking of that during the scene because I was like well you're telling her she's off but she walks around the public bathrooms barefoot so Gemma's gonna be getting some nastiness on her hands no matter what yeah that's true um so thank you thank you giselle for still being in my mind all these years later with that sick barefoot in the bathroom burn yeah so then uh uh it's very

22:45Ben Mandelker: britney spears early aughts so lindsey is uh just cleaning and but like amanda brought her brought some miraval of her own so uh they're like okay we're gonna start with rosie um that's interesting that you brought some. She's like, I thought it'd be a throwback to her Oji rosé. Lindsay's like, yeah. It's like it's not warm. It's not enduring Lindsay whatsoever. She's like, I was the one who planned the rosé. You don't get to be the rosé girl all of a sudden after ten years.

23:14Ronnie Karam: Rosé all day? That was their thing for years and years. So Lindsay's like, I have a baby now. Do you want like a little fruit pouch with your wine? And so she's offering her like a frozen teether and stuff. and they're like oh my god just girlfriends okay let's have a seat let's have a seat and have a real discussion girlfriend let's get some tough truth talk in here girlfriend yeah lindsey dill hubbard

23:44Ben Mandelker: you talking so uh manda's like thanks for agreeing to meet with me like obviously the reunion like the focus wasn't on our friendship and either and so it was like it was just like a shit show and And, you know, like I said in our text, our friendship is so important to me. And I know that, like, my actions have hurt so many people beyond what I even thought was comprehensible. Like, it was like the exact people were hurt that anyone would comprehend, which is why everyone is so fired up about this scandal. It's like literally the most comprehensible pattern and path of destruction you could imagine.

24:22Ronnie Karam: So we see that Amanda texted her On 424 Saying basically I know you probably hate me but I'd love to talk Because we've been friends for like 10 years So she's like I just wanted to like answer your questions And I got To a place where Like yeah And so Lindsay's like okay Well thanks for reaching out But I do appreciate that it's like a really fucking crazy position to be in. And we see a text from Amanda on 331 saying not expecting a response just texting to say sorry.

25:04Ben Mandelker: Gosh. This is like her MO is that she's just texting everyone and be like not expecting you to hear back from me. I just want to say sorry. I mean I kind of feel like you should just leave a voice note and be like I think you want to express your voice as much as possible in this situation. Not like a, I know you don't like me, but I'm sorry. It's just also simpering and like lame.

25:29Ronnie Karam: It's Amanda. And then we see that Lindsay wrote back the next day and said, I have a lot of feelings about this, but I'm just checking in to make sure you're okay. Which I thought was nice. It's like, wow, you're an asshole, but the world is ripping you to shreds right now. You doing okay over there? I'll get you later. I'll rip you up. I'll rip you later. But are you okay for now? So she's basically saying, like, I don't know. This was a pretty big one, Amanda. And she says, despite the ups and downs in our friendship, we've gotten close over the past year. Which is hilarious because it's been, like, ten years.

26:03Ronnie Karam: Finally, Lindsay likes her, you know. And she's like, but I'm here to give you some tough love because that's what friends do. So have you watched the episodes yet? She's like, um, I haven't. Now, do you believe this, that she hasn't watched the episodes? I do believe it. You do?

26:20Ben Mandelker: I believe she has not watched the episodes. I think it's too hard to... She's... Like, Amanda is a head-in-the-sand person. I think she does not want to see any of it. I think she is... She knows she did wrong, and she doesn't want to live in that space. And so I think she's avoidant, and I don't think she watched the episodes.

26:42Ronnie Karam: yeah I mean look there's no way to know for sure I think 100 % she watched all the episodes because I think in her and Wes mind and especially listening to their answers today I think they view this as a love story and they're shocked that people don't and I think that the whole all of the you know hints they were dropping through the season all the secret hand holding and all the stuff they were doing basically on camera not basically on camera they I think they were looking at this as a love story like kyle's such a bad husband we've been rooting for amanda to be free for years now she has this guy and it's like he was one of her best friends and look how supportive he is to her and they're just i think that they were building a love story so yeah i do think she watched it i think she's watched it and she's shocked that we're not reacting the same way that she was planning for us to you know and i don't believe for one second that west didn't

27:33Ben Mandelker: watch this season like that's just crazy i think west watched it for sure um i think that she probably reframed her narrative of like everyone's so mean to me i don't need to like i don't need to i'm gonna gray rock this thing that's being that's causing me so much pain i feel like that she probably did one of those things um but i think west 100 watched because he loves the attention so much um so uh lindsey's like you haven't watched it well she's like it's tough it's really uncomfortable. She said, yeah, well, not that anything was happening, but, like, that's, like, not why I can't watch. It's more like I'm off the internet.

28:09Ben Mandelker: Like, I'm not on social media. I'm staying away from all of that to try to protect my own mental health. Like, watching it and knowing what people are going to look for and what they're going to say. Like, that anxiousness, I just had to, like, I had to, like, stop.

28:24Ronnie Karam: Hmm. I do not believe you. Um, and Lindsay's like, well, I know, but I think, like, you and Wes made a very adult decision. Now you need to make an adult decision to watch the show and take the consequences. It's like 100 % young. What do you mean 100 %? You said you didn't watch it and you're not going to watch it. Why are you saying 100 %?

28:46Ben Mandelker: Yeah, that's the thing. If, in fact, she did not watch it, which is what I do believe, I also believe that she's not going to watch it. So when she says 100%, yes, I have to take responsibility. You're not going to watch it. You're not going to watch it. I'm sorry. She's not a woman of action.

29:02Ronnie Karam: well, I mean, it's watching Summer House. I'm not a woman of action either. That's why I watch Summer House. You know what I mean? So Lindsay's like, well, you can't just be an ostrich because that's stupid. And she's like, no, I know. That's why I'm not going to watch it.

29:20Ben Mandelker: You can't go over it, okay? And Amanda's like, no, I just, I'm going through it and I feel it every day. She's like, I know, but Amanda, you're like not. You're like not that way. you're not good. She's like, I made some poor decisions. And like, I was just like in such a shitty relationship. And Lindsay's like, a hundred percent. Kyle's a piece of shit. We all agree. Kyle's a piece of shit.

29:42Ronnie Karam: And somehow you ruined all that goodwill. You're really stupid. Yeah. And Amanda has a monologue where she's like, you know, I just lost myself because I didn't recognize myself. You know, I was just a shell of myself. I wasn't me anymore. And like going out, I felt like I was young. And in my twenties, I was funnigan. I mean, listen, for someone who just divorced someone because they're going through a constant middle-aged crisis, you're really talking like somebody who's going through a middle-aged crisis. You know, it's like, I get that you wouldn't want Kyle in your life, but don't steal his lines.

30:19Ben Mandelker: Yeah, and well, what I liked here is that she was doing her little, like, woe is me thing, which I actually believe. Like, you know, like, she was miserable, and she's starting to feel like the fun things again, and it's exciting and thrilling. Um, and, uh, I think at this point, I think she was expecting Lindsay to say, you know, you were so miserable and, and I, you know, I feel bad for you. And, you know, this is, you know, like you need to, you need to show yourself some more love. I mean, Lindsay gets there later, but I think Amanda was thinking we were going to get there right now. And Lindsay's like, yeah, like we've all broken up with people.

30:51Ben Mandelker: We all know what this is like. Like, hello. We've literally felt that after her breakup. up but she goes but that doesn't excuse going for the one guy that's broken sierra's heart multiple times and got it back then broke it and got it back and broke it and got it back well i was like well it wasn't that much lindsey but the point still remains well it has still feel the euphoria her you know he's been fucking with her for sure and uh the point is that like you can use some judgment and have some standards amanda despite the euphoric feeling you're feeling go

31:20Ronnie Karam: for one of his right i mean it's like we've said on here a million times you know everybody was rooting for amanda to get away from kyle that was a terrible marriage and if this was anybody else she would be having a hero season you know but the fact that she did it this way and then fucked everybody over and lied in everybody's face over and over i just can't you know so um she's like well but i didn't go for him he went for me he pursued me oh man like we see the footage I mean, either way, there was some, I just, I can't take this framing because I knew it was coming. We said it, you know, I mean, it's pretty obvious that it was going to come at some point.

32:00Ronnie Karam: I thought it was going to be, they were going to maybe date for a while and then they would have a big breakup and then she would use it as her redemption. Like, oh my God, I just lost myself. I was in this place. I was in a horrible marriage. And then this is what happened. And I can't believe I let him trick me. but that she's already using it now two weeks or a week before she goes to

32:19Ben Mandelker: italy or whatever is crazy well also like it's like he is pursuing you did you not think at one moment to say hey i should let sierra know that i'm getting weird vibes from west and like like she should know that that he's doing this right like the fact that like you know he that she's saying no no no he was pursuing me he was pursuing me but where was your instinct to like reach out to your friend who would be most impacted by this. That's what's crazy to me.

32:47Ronnie Karam: So Lindsay calls her out and she's like, well, he described it PJ Clarks. Thank you. I will be getting a free dinner there later. He described it PJ Clarks. He said it was you that was pursuing him. And Amanda just smirks and she's like, really?

33:04Ben Mandelker: Really? Yeah. And then she's like, what did he say? And she's like, well, he told Sierra that you were the one obsessed with him and that you were the one that, like, you know, had like a crush on him and like nothing physical happened at that point and that was on like march 6th so that's like also that's also crazy that he was telling sierra that like that's not before this is like the official that is so west well march 6th didn't february was when all the

33:32Ronnie Karam: rumors were out so they were being right and that the super bowl was in february so see i guess this was a meeting where sierra's like tell me the fucking truth but like how but like how shitty

33:42Ben Mandelker: as that so this they're still like covering up but he's gonna actually throw amanda under the bus to be like oh these rumors are not true but just so you know amanda has a crush on me

33:52Ronnie Karam: well yeah of course i mean this is this is what he does look at what he's doing with with me he's like oh yeah well i guess you know i was pretty honest with her but i guess she was under the impression that we were together it's just everybody's just obsessed with gorgeous West. Gorgeous, charming West. He's not doing anything, guys. He's just a boy. He's just a boy standing in a bookshop. Yeah. Picking the lift off his pants.

34:18Ben Mandelker: Yeah. So Amanda's like, I was obsessed with him. That's such fucking bullshit. You know what I'm going to do? I'm going to keep dating that man. Ugh, I'm disgusted.

34:30Ronnie Karam: So then Lindsay's like, um, yeah, but that's what this man is. okay that's my point amanda and she's like um that's funny she goes yeah well he's going around saying that and amanda's like um well he was actively texting me to hang out all the time

34:47Ben Mandelker: and i would always say no like always this is like um yeah give me the details like this isn't like like this is like the shit that i wanted to hear at the reunion i was like and someone explaining and it's me like how did this happen um so amanda's like yeah no he's texting me and so she says it was always in group text like he was always like oh come meet up with our friends or come meet up with us and you and so and so come here it's like and i would always say no and so we see some of these text messages but see this is amanda being so fucking tricky again

35:23Ronnie Karam: this is amanda manipulating manipulating shit again she's like oh no he was pursuing me he was inviting me out all the time commercial in group text well how is that pursuing you if he's inviting everybody out how is it him pursuing i just she's just so tricky with this so lindsey's like yeah give me the details so he was highly pursuing you and she's like yeah like in group texts and i always said no and so we see some of the texts and west is like um having people over for football tomorrow like open door policy no pressure there it is so he's basically glenn close and failing attraction basically but so she's basically

36:06Ben Mandelker: it's weird because amanda's trying to prove that he pursued her but she's also trying to mollify it that like she's she's also trying to pull it back like but it wasn't didn't seem that romantic because uh because if it if he was truly trying to pursue her they both would be in trouble at that early date. So she's both trying to be like, I wasn't pursuing. Yeah, I wasn't pursuing. I was being pursued, but I wasn't being pursued because it was platonic.

36:33Ronnie Karam: Yeah, because they've agreed to this. Like, we didn't hook up until we announced to everybody via the internet that we were going to be together, right? But that was like way later than obviously it really happened. And they're both trying to stick to this timeline. So it's like, oh yeah, he was pursuing me to come watch football with a bunch of his friends at his house. And he's like, oh, well, I was in love with her in the summer. Duh, I said it on TV. But I meant as a friend. Duh. We didn't hook up until February.

37:01Ben Mandelker: Yeah, come on. So then he was, she was saying that there was one time where I guess Sierra saw me at his apartment. Lindsay goes, January 17th. And I was like, wow, yes, you have the dates.

37:18Ronnie Karam: She's like but again That was like him being like come over for the game It was like in a group text With other people and we were there Like we had pizza It was weird in my mind I was like I don't know why we're here Like this is weird Why is it weird That you were eating pizza and watching Football at someone's house

37:40Ben Mandelker: One of my most supporters house Yeah So Amanda's like I'm like you know so we have like kind of we put out the split announcement and i say you know what i'm in a different headspace where i'm like okay i need to meet people i need to get out like i can't be sitting in my apartment anymore i can't be saying no it's like not as fun when it's not kyle involved right so then like wes would be like we're going here we're doing this like come and i'm like okay and then like he brought up all this like is something happening whatever and is this door open and I'm like, wait, what the fuck's going on?

38:15Ben Mandelker: Like, all these feelings and we're just enjoying like, hanging out with him as like a friend and like having fun. Are these feelings like that? Is it just friends?

38:22Ronnie Karam: She didn't think anything until he said, is there something going on here? Are there feelings? And then the door opened. And Lindsay's like, so he manipulated you. Is that what you're saying? It's like, um, that's not my words. She goes, um, those are my words and I will own the words. He's manipulating you, Amanda.

38:42Ben Mandelker: He's manipulating you, much like I was not manipulated into having a delicious meal at PJ Clark's.

38:51Ronnie Karam: Was he manipulating you like the PJ Clark's onion rings manipulate my taste buds?

38:59Ben Mandelker: Into sheer joy and euphoria, the kind of joy and euphoria you can only get after getting out of a 10-year shitty relationship? PJ Morton's.

39:07Ronnie Karam: I'm going to tell you the same thing I told PJ Clark. bj clark bj clark we did more than two recording artists um yeah so she's like uh but that's that's what happened and then just but that's what he does to all the girls amanda she's like but it was just a conversation there was nothing like physical going on and then we text and we talk about it and i'd be like what the fuck is happening okay amanda so you weren't physical but you were texting each other like oh my god do we have feelings for each other wow oh my god wow what's happening do people still text like that if people have feelings for each other are they like do we

39:50Ben Mandelker: have feelings for each other or is like i didn't know people actually like did that though they

39:54Ronnie Karam: just acted on it well i'm part of this i was wondering is this a gay thing you know like sometimes is there like a disconnect you know because we talk about so many straight relationships obviously because we're watching bravo the gayest channel in the world why wouldn't we be talking about straight people the whole time but i wonder because it's just so different with gay people you know like fucking really isn't that big of a deal the conversations that she's having with west are a much bigger deal so sometimes i'm like well is that like a gay thing so maybe i should judge it differently because to me texting people like oh my god let's talk about our feelings do you feel this way are we about to you know i'm with somebody this is a huge deal in our friend group but i feel this way what do you feel i feel this way too and then you start having text conversations about it that's a much bigger deal than sucking a dick in my mind so i'm like oh my god this is a worse admission than just saying you fucked in the bathroom that time in july in summer house

40:51Ben Mandelker: yeah so um so then when when amanda's talking about like texting about like is this really happening lindsey's like but why did you like shut it down then like why not at that point say no i'm not doing that to sierra and amanda's like because okay i'm gonna steal i'm gonna stare at the ceiling because i was like so selfish and like so focused on my happiness and like feeling good for the first time and it overwhelmed me and like the feeling of like someone caring about me someone who looks like a cartoon gerbil i just it was so adorable to me i couldn't help it

41:32Ronnie Karam: but so many people care about you mama i mean not me but there's like a lot of people out there and she's like but i mean a guy lindsey and she goes a man she's like yeah like a guy she goes with a little wee wee. Don't forget that. I've seen it. I've seen it on the internet. It's little.

41:49Ben Mandelker: So Lindsay's like, she's like, sorry, I had to throw that in there, you know. Yeah, throw some jokes in. Gotta keep it bright. And you know what, Tommy? Act two of the reunion's gotta always open up with fun and games. We just had a commercial break. So, uh, then Lindsay is like, uh, so, I mean, what's your biggest takeaway from that reunion? Or, like, in it? Like, do you remember the reunion? She's like, um, I honestly, like, I don't remember much because, like, just because, like, when I get yelled at like that, I, like, retreat and I, like, shut down and, like, disassociate. I mean, like, that's how I got through most of my marriage.

42:27Ben Mandelker: So if people were, like, unhappy about how I was at the reunion, it's all Kyle's fault is what I'm saying. Yeah, it's just typical amount of it.

42:35Ronnie Karam: Didn't watch it. And if I did watch it, I blacked out. And if I was there, blacked out. Don't remember. Of course, she was accused of being on a lot of drugs there. So, you know, maybe that too, but it's just another way of her, you know, using a victim status to avoid answering a question just like she did then.

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44:33Ronnie Karam: So she's like, you know, I married Kyle thinking I was going to spend my life with him. And then when, you know, it was so hard realizing that wasn't going to happen. And I just think getting attention from West, I felt like, oh, my gosh, you know, here's this is my person, maybe, you know, and we started as friends and we get along and there's feelings here and he cares about me and he's saying all the right things. And I was afraid I'd be alone for the rest of my life Like I felt unlovable for so long

45:00Ben Mandelker: And she cries And honestly that's all fine and well I think we actually all understand it You were in a bad relationship And this guy comes along But like why don't you have that That filter Where's your filtration system in your pool Where's your chlorine to say No get this Get this extra out of here

45:21Ronnie Karam: She's gonna need it But yeah she's selfish you know and she said it herself she's saying it in a way like i was just so completely selfish because you know she's always got the excuse but her and west both pretty much say what the answer is that everybody wants it's just nobody can hear them and it's that they're selfish and they don't give a fuck okay she prioritized her needs over anyone else's feelings you know and she admitted it yeah she just did it in a butt kind of a way

45:55Ben Mandelker: so lindsey's like you have to work on your self-love and self-worth because you're getting your self-worth from kyle and lacked our lack thereof and like that ruined you and like now you're doing it again with another guy hoping that this guy is the reason that you have self-love manda's like yeah as she wipes it here and internally decides not not to actually you know take action with any of this yeah yeah i am getting my self-love from west oh well off

46:20Ronnie Karam: italy yeah so lindsey's like why would you go for this guy like you didn't think you could get that from any other guy i mean it's not like he's god's gift to this and i can tell you i can promise you and she's basically like this guy manipulate manipulates women everywhere he goes to fall in love with him because he touches you the certain way he caresses you the certain way and you haven't been touched like that in a while and so all of a sudden you felt this tingle in your body and you're like oh and amanda goes it's not even that yes it is you just said it was

46:52Ben Mandelker: yeah yeah it is and so she's like it's the conversations the conversations with wes wilson that what what conversations are you talking about please tell me and how long did they take for him to get to the period at the end of his con at the end of his sentence it's just what's

47:08Ronnie Karam: making me what's really grating on me is this like it didn't count as bad because it wasn't physical it was just like it was just the conversations yeah but it was like romantic it was romantic you guys were with each other like she's making it like this very technical touchy it's like it didn't get to third base so it doesn't matter it's like that's not the point the point is you needed something from a man and finally this man was giving it to you so you were like fuck it i don't care who it is i'll do i'll take it yeah but like have you and wes even talked about the

47:40Ben Mandelker: future partly i mean it's his favorite rapper so i'm gonna try to get it no not future the future oh yeah like a little bit like that's what's so crazy because like you guys have not talked about the future i'm telling you that right now and amanda says i mean i knew the severity and the gravity of the situation and i was like okay if you really care about me like if what you're saying is true and if this is all how you feel like this can't be casual because you have to see a future you have to know that I want to have kids and like soon like I'm not like you know like we haven't like talked about kids but like I said to him you have to know that I want to have kids and I said it quietly and not out loud or it was internal and it was not a conversation I was alone in my room but we talked about it for sure I mean I believe that I believe that she was like listen what we're

48:30Ronnie Karam: doing here is huge and you better not make me look like an idiot like I want kids and to get married I'm not going to go through all of this for a while. And he just told her whatever she wanted to hear. But then the other part of me is like, but then he's still openly dating people right in front of her while they're together. So was she trying to be, you know, she can't have it both ways. Because in one way, she's like, well, yeah, but he's allowed to do that because we are not together technically. Okay. So are you being the cool girl and letting him date everybody? Or are you telling him if we date, you better know this is commitment and I want kids.

49:05Ben Mandelker: Mm hmm. I feel like when it started, they did not have this conversation because she's sort of been on the record saying like, whatever, I'm single. I'm just exploring things. We're not doing it. It's like, whatever. We're just like, it seems like there's potential. We're going to have that conversation. I think now that then once she started getting all this flack, it's like, okay, well, you better like, like now that we're doing this and now that I'm committing to this, like this has to be a thing. Like I want kids. But I'm just surprised he didn't just turn into a pillar of dust at that point.

49:32Ben Mandelker: the moment she mentioned kids to him because there's no way he is sticking around for kids

49:37Ronnie Karam: with amanda oh my gosh that answer in the reunion when andy's like well i mean are you guys like together together he's like well i mean we kind of have to be now he kind of answered like well

49:48Ben Mandelker: yeah i mean geez and i love that she's like but we've had conversations and that's why i feel safe in it because we've had conversations and lindsey's like do you know how many times i've had conversations with boyfriends about marriage and kids they will tell you whatever you want like whatever you need to hear they'll all say i mean look it's happening on in the city you know with what's her with with um what's her face whitney ivan whitney anyone they all say yes now as it happens ivan actually is pregnant now by the way that entire cast is pregnant so is lexi i know lexi just announced it and then danielle there's probably another one

50:22Ronnie Karam: danielle lexi and avon that's three yeah there's three pregnant at the same time on that one It's a lot It's gonna be a fun season next year So So This really did make me laugh though When Lindsay's like, um, Amanda Do you know how many men I've talked to about marriage and kids? Like literally every single boyfriend I've ever had I mean, come on That is so Lindsay And the busboys who gave me water During those dates

50:50Ben Mandelker: Every single one A lot of powerpoints So Amanda's like, but I haven't dated since I was 24 years old. She's like, well, then why don't you do that? Like, I know. You should be like, do that. You should be doing that right now. Stop doing this. Stop ruining what you have with Wes.

51:09Ronnie Karam: Well, they say that when you start dating somebody, you're also dating all the people that they fucked because, you know, you're sharing the germs or whatever. So in that way, she's dating a lot of people at one time. You know, she's getting a lot of experience at one time. So Lindsay's like, get life experience. You don't make up fucked up decisions that are going to mess up your entire fucking life. I mean, Wes is going to embarrass you. And she's like, oh, by the way, do you know who he was on the phone with this morning? Um, Mia. And why was he calling me out today? Because he's so scared about what's going to come out.

51:42Ben Mandelker: And Amanda's like, oh, like Amanda is clearly blindsided by this. And then he's like, he fucked Mia in March. She's like, mm-hmm. And he cheated on you. He cheated on her. You guys all cheated together. Amanda's like Amanda in her mind is just thinking how am I going to hear this information and then also reconcile the fact that I'm still going to continue with this man and go to Italy with him

52:06Ronnie Karam: I see I mean I'm just seeing Amanda so calculated I'm sure she knows he was on the phone with Mia she's like you better figure out what she's going to say on TV she's going to be filmed for this show today so you guys better come up you better make this right you know I'm sure she already knew that she was talking to mia because she's just like maybe she did yeah you know um so lindsey's like yeah he cheated on you and he cheated on her with you hello there may be a part of it also where amanda and wes just had

52:36Ben Mandelker: this a conversation like look i know that you were dating her up until now and they're gonna keep on throwing it in my face i'm just gonna just nod and say uh-huh i'm not gonna engage on it because i understand and we were single blah like i can also imagine she's just like i just refuse to

52:50Ronnie Karam: talk about me but well we know that um yeah i'm not even arguing with what you said i'm just thinking about every this has been so much information on summer house it's been like so much brain dead information if you think about it it's like a lot you guys but um from what we know mia was talking to sierra and kyle and probably and lindsey too not probably before the reunion so they were getting all this information from this girl west finds out at the reunion gets all pissed then sends me a um text that says you win so we know all of that so i think the fact that he was talking to her today was probably like okay you better call this girl and figure out what she's going to be saying like you better make nice with this girl because this could be this could be bad or it could be really really bad get your ass on the phone yeah yeah i

53:38Ben Mandelker: think that's probably something that that definitely happened so um lindsey uh then is like this guy's like fucking you up and and so amanda's like that's why yeah like that's what i'm like now realizing oh really really you're just realizing it now and you're gonna do nothing about it and then lindsey goes are you just yeah because that's not something that i realized yeah i feel like you're not i am because like i wake up with the most anxiety about how i I fucked up my whole entire life. Every single day. I'm like, you are being sent life rafts right now. Get on board. Come on. Rather than all this anxiety.

54:23Ronnie Karam: I just don't buy it from her. I think she's just saying whatever she can to get everybody off her ass. And Lindsay's like, oh my god. Imagine fucking up so bad that we all forgot how bad of a husband Kyle is. Like, that's really bad. You were winning. you had the best storyline ever you had a power girl storyline and you blew it you idiot and she's like um no yeah like no yeah like i'm having a lot of feelings like the tears aren't just sadness it's like what's so hard to stomach and process because i just want to be loved just say loved Yeah. And it like sucks that I fought for that for so long with Kyle and I just felt it so much from Wes.

55:11Ronnie Karam: I just feel really fucking stupid. What's your favorite restaurant in Rome?

55:18Ben Mandelker: Well, it's called PJ Clark, Clark, Clarkissimas. PJ Clarksas. Molto PJs. Pizza Clarks. It's a me, a PJ Clarksa. So Lindsay's like. Pizza Clarksa. Lindsay's like. She's like. To be honest, you should feel stupid. and the only way to save yourself in this moment is to have a delicious meal at PJ Clark's and it's to separate yourself from the sinking ship that is every other restaurant in New York City or Wes Wilson. Be the Rose on the Titanic.

56:00Ronnie Karam: It's like Lindsay finally has to dumb it down into the most basic B language she can. She's like, be Rose on the Titanic. Oh my God, I love that movie. Let go of his hand. He's got to go. Let him drown. It's like I know

56:18Ben Mandelker: But the great news is that Amanda takes none of this advice Just keeps going forward In her downward spiral I think in their mind

56:29Ronnie Karam: It's really I think they're just going to say whatever people think And in their mind they think this is like the greatest love story They're going to end up together She's going to be the one that finally Ties him down He's going to finally you know, they're gonna finally have this romantic storyline, you guys. So to everyone else, they're like, well, we really regret it. You guys do not.

56:50Ben Mandelker: Just stop. They think, like, we just have to get over this hump, and we can live happily ever after, and whatever. There'll be a new news cycle. Just take it on the chin.

57:03Ronnie Karam: Congratulations! You've reached the end of part one of a two-part recap. For part two, go look for the recap that says part two. See you over there, suckers.

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