Ask Paula: We Make $300k. Why Are We NOT Financially Independent?

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32:31Joe, I think we're up for another question. Already? Already. It's that time. For those of you catching this on YouTube, this is the first video question that Joe and I are doing in the video. Tingling. Tingling. Yes, right? This is the first question where you can see our faces. So for those of you who are watching this on YouTube, congratulations for being the first. I'm Paula Pant. Early adopter. Right? Exactly. This is only what our like 500th YouTube upload that we are like, maybe we should put some video on this. Wow. Who knew? Who knew? So Joe, whose question should we answer? I think, well, next up we have anonymous.

33:13And whenever we have an anonymous caller, that means we give them a name. Ooh. All right. So is this a man, woman, child? It is a man. Could be a man, child. I don't know them that way. No, no, I'm sure it's not. I'm sure it's not. Let's see.

33:36We've been going with things you've been watching on TV or movies. And have you watched anything? have i watched no i'm taking this question seriously have i watched anything i saw cocaine bear i saw cocaine bear last week did you wasn't it terrible it was the most ridiculously terrible awesome movie oh my it was i highly recommend it oh what one hour into it i was like when is this gonna be over when will this be oh yeah yeah oh my god i thought it was hilarious i thought it It was hilarious and stupid. It was so bad. So this was Ray Liotta's last movie. Ray Liotta, who's been in a ton of movies.

34:15He was in Goodfellas. He was in all kinds of stuff. He is the, he's the main bad guy. He's like the overlord bad guy. So maybe, maybe this should be Ray. Okay. All right. Then our next question comes from Ray. Hey, Paula. How's it going? Anonymous from Texas. My wife and I earned about 300K. We live in a pretty high cause of living in Central Texas, and we are looking for ways to get that additional money to just be comfortable around paying off a credit card or lower credit card balance, increase for savings rate, etc. Like I said, we earn about$300 ,000 a year. We have two kids in daycare, about$3 ,200 a month for both of them.

35:05We spend about$15 ,000 to$60 ,000 in property taxes. We have a mortgage of$2 ,200 every month. And our credit card balance offers anywhere from$2 ,200 to$2 ,700 every month. We don't pay in full, which we're okay with. We don't have any car payments. We own our cars in full. But again, I have some time to spare every week. I have about 15 hours to spare every week from a busy 35 hours a week job. I've read a lot that that income, the combined income, household income is enough to be fire. But obviously, I don't feel we're nowhere near fire in general. So anyways, we'd love to hear what you have to say about that.

35:49Again, we invest about$600 every month just after tax brokerage accounts, mainly in investment. In fact, in index funds, VO, QQQ, and show up dividend. dividend income is not quite there yet to a point where we feel comfortable just using it for living expenses. So anyways, we'd love to pick your brain up as far as what ideas you have that we can use to increase our monthly income. I'm okay if it's anywhere around$750 to$1 ,000. Really, I just want to make sure to have that extra gap of comfort. But anyways, thanks for the show. Appreciate it and looking forward to hearing from you. Bye-bye. Ray, thank you for the question.

36:32First of all, with an extra 15 hours a week, you can make way more than$1 ,000 a month. So I did some quick math. There are on average 4.3 weeks per month. That's 52 weeks divided by 12 months, right? So with an average of 4.3 weeks per month, We're talking about 64.5 hours per month that you can dedicate towards working. So let's take the higher of your estimate,$1 ,000 a month. If you were making an average of$15.50 an hour, again,$15.15 per hour, that alone would be enough to bring in an extra$1 ,000 a month. month, I have total confidence that you can make more than$15 an hour, right? So if you brought in on average, let's say$45 an hour in whatever side hustle you're doing, and we can talk about some of those ideas in a moment.

37:30I mean, if you brought in on average, 45 bucks an hour, then that extra time could be an extra$3 ,000 per month before taxes. You know, that said though, Paula, the first thing I want to caution, not just Ray on, because I do like the idea of using this extra time, bringing in other income, but without the right money management tools in place, a lot of times people focus on the income side. The big thing is, is to create a gap. And by the way, I also think that Ray's thinking about this correctly from another standpoint that a lot of us that listen to money podcasts, like we focus just on the expense side?

38:10How can I spend less, spend less, spend less when often the answer is exactly what Ray's talking about. However, this is what happened in my life because early on, and I was a money disaster because I didn't have good savings habits. I did a horrible job, just a horrible job of using that income correctly. So because I didn't have any systems, Paula, if I'd made a hundred thousand, I would have spent 120. If I would have made 120, I would have spent 140. And the lie I kept chasing, and it was a lie, was that I could just earn more money to solve my money issue. And that is a lie. And I think a lot of people live that, right?

38:52They're just like, okay, things will get better if I just get the next raise. Things will get better if I get the next promotion. Things will get better. Things will get better when things got better for me when I lock down some good money management systems. So I would just say to Ray, yes, I love it. And I think like you, Ray can make more than$1 ,550. I think he can as well. But I'd also want to talk to him about his systems of how he's going to make sure that that money creates a gap. And that is not, you know, a lot of people think it's discipline. Like discipline is going to be the answer, like it is, you know, working out or whatever it might be.

39:29But you know, Paula, as well as most people know better than most, that the discipline is not the answer at all with your money. Anyone who's relying on discipline does not understand how behavior works. And that's also true for working out as well. Working out ultimately becomes a habit. It's not a discipline. It's a habit, right? It starts as a discipline. But the cool thing in this case, yeah, but in this case, it doesn't even have to be a habit. Right. You set it up on automatic payments and it just goes. So it's even easier. In fact, actually, if we want to use the working out analogy, and then this isn't, sorry, this is how my brain works.

40:04All right. I've always wondered. I have always wondered. There are like Nepal, for example, we use squat toilets. And what that means is that you have to squat every time you poop, no matter how old you are. Your entire life, anytime you want to number Number two, you must squat. So it creates this automation. You have to do, I mean, assuming you poop once a day, you have to squat at least once a day, even when you're 85 years old. And so it creates the society where 85 year olds can squat, right? Right? Because you never lose that sense of movement, right? You practice it and it's automated, so to speak, right?

40:51It's automated because it's built into the very structure of society. And so even when you're 60, 70, 80, 90 years old, you can pop into a full squat just like that. Anyway. It's incredible. Yeah. So that's automation at its finest. I wasn't talking about that that's incredible an 85-year-old can squat. I'm saying it's incredible that you could turn this into a poop analogy. That Paula's first thought was, hey, I got the perfect analogy for this. This reminds me of how Nepalese people poop. That's the quality that we get here at Afford Anything. No, but it is a great analogy because it's automatic.

41:33It just happens. So I would say no matter, Ray, what you set up, what income you come in, I wouldn't just be thinking about that. I'd be thinking about how do I make it so I never see this money? So it automatically goes to what the area is. And one thing you say that you're comfortable with that I'm not comfortable with is the fact that you don't pay off all the money on your credit card every month. Ding, ding, ding. That's like 20 % to 24 % interest probably going into somebody else's pocket. Think about paying an extra 20 % on all that stuff. Right. Yeah. Forget it. Yeah, same, same. And, I mean, you know, I don't know.

42:07Maybe he's got some teaser 0 % interest rate on the credit card for the moment. even if that's the case, I still don't like it. Fix the habit. Make it a habit. Yeah. Yeah. Talking about habits. That's the habit. Yeah. Really. And that's the automation. That's the first thing that we both want to see you do is set up an automation such that the credit cards get paid in full automatically every month. Just set it to auto pay for the complete full amount. That's where the extra income comes in. I agree with you, Joe. I don't want him to start the side hustle without also simultaneously starting auto pay in full for the credit card.

42:47Yeah, at the very least. And into those investments that he has. So he has these investments. The other thing I didn't hear about was tax shelters. If he's going to need some of this money after 59 and a half, let's put that money in a tax shelter so he avoids the friction of paying tax on any gains it makes, any dividends that get paid out, any of that stuff. Get it inside a tax shelter so he doesn't have to. It's certainly part of it he's going to want for after 59 and a half. So at the very least, you should have somebody going. Maybe he does. And he didn't mention it, but I didn't hear it.

43:18Right. Yeah. Now for making more money, because he was asking about what our thoughts are there. You and I have a mutual friend, a guy named Nick Loper, who has always got just a ton of weird ideas to make money at Side Hustle Nation. Nick's podcast you can find wherever you're listening to us. I thought of Nick right away when he was talking about, you know, what could I do? Well, I think what Nick does well is he takes this big cacophony of various side hustles and he puts it into a framework. And his framework essentially boils down to three broad categories. There are the side hustles that fall into the category of gig economy work.

43:59You know, this is stuff like driving for Uber or DoorDash or becoming a dog walker. on Rover, something like that, right? The benefit of gig economy work is that it's immediate. You don't have to do the hard startup legwork of building a website, building a brand, circulating your business card around, which today has just a QR code. You don't have to do any of that. You can just get plugged into a platform, and that platform is designed to send you some immediate hit of work right away. But because of that relative ease, that low friction, a lot of people are drawn to it and there are low barriers to entry to doing any of that.

44:46It's not high-skilled work and it's readily available for a high volume of gig workers, right? And because of that, it doesn't pay very well. So gig work is fine if you just need a quick hit of cash right away. Like if you're in an emergency situation and you're like, I need something this week or this month. It's fine for that. It's fine as a short-term band-aid, but it's not something that I would want anyone to do full-time or long-term. Beyond that, there are two other categories of side hustles. And broadly speaking, you either sell your expertise in the form of time. You are an expert in knowing how to play the guitar or play chess or speak French or Spanish or Italian.

45:38And there are people who are willing to pay for that. So you can sell or maybe you're an expert in graphic design or full stack WordPress PHP coding. Whatever it is that you do, you have this very specific skill that has higher barriers to entry because it took you a while to develop that skill. Therefore, you can command a high hourly rate, higher hourly rate for having that skill, either as a consultant or as a tutor or as an expert witness, right? There are many ways that you can monetize having a skill that took you time to develop. So that's another broad category of side hustles. And then the final broad category of side hustles are products.

46:20Actually, when it comes to selling products, the real daddy of the business is Steve Chu. His expertise is e-commerce. And he was recently a guest on this podcast. Has the show aired? I recently interviewed him. I actually don't know if that show has aired or will air relative to when this episode is going to come out. It's a roundish now. Yeah, exactly. To give you a little behind the scenes on our production schedule and how I don't know what's going on around me. But Steve Chu is amazing. He wrote The Family First Entrepreneur. For those of you watching on YouTube, I'm holding it up right now because I literally have it on my desk next to me.

47:00He is the person to tune into if you want the details on e-commerce. Well, or if I think even broader, Paula, if you decide that, because I think that third category of yours could be even broader, which is where I'm going to create an ongoing business. And even if the business is not an actual product, the product might be something like we do. Even for those people reading Steve's book about creating it the right way. His book to me answered a question I used to ask entrepreneurs when they would come into my office. I would say, are you working for the business or is the business working for you?

47:39for 99 % of people, everybody knows what they answered. No, I've become an employee of my business. Like I created this beast and I worked 24 seven and it is not at all what I dreamt of when I started it. And Steve is great at turning that around at going, no, no, no, no, no. The business is going to work for you. And the systems he talks about are just amazing. Right. Exactly. Ray, I would think about when you're trying to figure out what you want to do with your side hustle, you want to find that Venn diagram intersection between the skills that you have, particularly any skills, knowledge, expertise that takes time to develop.

48:21So what special, unique skills do you have? That's one circle of the Venn diagram. The other circle is what problems exist out there in the world. And these don't have to be like nuclear war. Like the problem could be people want to learn how to speak Spanish and they need help, right? That is a problem. But you'll get paid more if you can solve nuclear war. Well, yes. Like that's an example of a problem. Like people have all kinds of, maybe their problem is that they're grappling with some kind of lawn care issue. Like there are all kinds of micro problems that people in your area need solved.

48:59So what skills do you have? What problems exist out there that other people need solved? And then the third circle is, what are people willing to pay for? Because there are a lot of problems, and some of those problems people are willing to pay to solve. Other problems people are not. So your skills, the problems that exist, and then the problems that people are willing to pay to find a solution for. That Venn diagram intersection is where you find your optimal side hustle. Last place I'd advise Ray, do not chase a cocaine bear into the forest because it does not end well for you. I don't want to give away the movie because it's an epic with layers and layers of things going on.

49:41It doesn't end well. I'll just say that. layers. Wow. Really giving it a lot of credit. By the way, did you know that there is a real cocaine bear? There was a real cocaine bear. And he's on display at a shopping mall in Kentucky. And if you go to that shopping mall's Instagram page, you can see that people get their wedding photos taken in front of cocaine bear. No, it's true. It's true. I am linking. I'm going to make a note right now. Show notes link to cocaine bears Instagram page. The real cocaine bear. Does he look like he's got his face full of powdered sugar? He does not. You know, so the real cocaine bear.

50:19So I went on internet like deep read. To see how much of this is based in fact. Like you watch the movie. Yes, exactly. Now Paula's like, is there a book about this? Can I read more? Because the depth of this thing just. So the real cocaine, because you know, oftentimes cocaine is cut with flour or with baking soda. And to the nose of a bear, that smells like sugar. And so when this cocaine was thrown from the airplane, the real cocaine bear found the bags of cocaine, probably smelled the flour of the baking soda, thought it was sugar, and ate it. And so he ate just bags and bags and bags of cocaine.

50:57He survived for about 45 minutes. And then after about 45 minutes, he had literally every system failed. Well, who knew? Who knew that would happen? Right? Just massive cardiac arrest. I mean, every organ just shut down. Wait a minute, the bear in the movie lasted an hour longer? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So in the movie, the bear goes on a killing spree. But in real life, the real cocaine bear lived for about 45 minutes and then had a very gruesome demise. And is now taxidermied and on display at a shopping mall in Kentucky. And if you're looking for a place to get wedding photos taken, you can do it there.

51:40Because where else are you going to get your wedding photo taken? You heard it first on the Afford Anything podcast. Ray is like, how did my question lead to this? He's like, I don't know where they're at. Who knows? This is what you get when you're an anonymous caller. Well, yeah, cocaine bear and the poop analogy, all in the same show. Oh, wow. Yeah. High class here, here at the Afford Anything podcast. See who's next, so maybe we can do another one. Ray, thank you for your question. Big takeaway. Please, please, please, Joe and I both really want you to set up an automatic payment in full on your credit cards every month.

52:18Do that with your side hustle income. And also, once you've done that, second priority is divert more of that side hustle income into saving in tax advantaged accounts. There it is.

52:35We'll return to the show in just a moment.

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56:12Our next caller is Anonymous. Awesome. Are we going to do another cocaine bear reference? We are not. Like we did in the... We are not. We did that. Been there. That's been done. But I do want to talk about this thing. So one of my podcast listeners actually, who I met at a financial independence retreat, sometimes I get gifts from podcast listeners. and this one particular listener sent me this thing called a squatty potty. Have you heard of it, Joe? Are we seriously? Are we seriously just bringing this back around to potty again? So if you live in a country like the United States where you don't have a squat toilet, but you want to mimic the experience of having a squat toilet, meaning you want to kind of, you know, keep your knees elevated, it can help with constipation.

57:04There's this thing called the squatty potty. And it was inspired. So on the topic of side hustles and entrepreneurship, the Squatty Potty is a$30 million business. And they have the best commercials. $30 million business. And it was inspired by a woman named Judy who was constipated and needed to keep her knees up so that she could mimic being in a squat position while using a United States toilet, right? A non-squat toilet. So in honor of Judy, who inspired the creation of the $30 million squatty potty business, the squatty potty empire, our next caller is going to be Judy. Actually, Paula, before we do that, can I play the squatty potty commercial for everybody?

57:54Yeah. Because it is hilarious. Okay. They are not a sponsor. No, no. This is just, we appreciate creativity. And when you're selling better poop. This is where your ice cream comes from. The creamy poop of a mystic unicorn. Totally clean, totally cool, and soft serve straight from a sphincter. Mmm, they're good at pooping. But you know who sucks at pooping? You do. That's because when you sit on a porcelain throne, this muscle puts a kink in a hose and stops the Ben and Jerry's from sliding out smoothly. Is that a problem? I don't know, are hemorrhoids a problem? Because sitting at this angle can cause hemorrhoids, bloating, constipation, and a buttload of other crap.

58:34And seriously, unicorn hemorrhoids? The glitter gets everywhere. But what happens when you go from a sit to a squat? Voila, this muscle relaxes and that kink goes away faster than Pegasus laying sweet sherbet dookie. Now your colon's open and ready for battle. That's because our bodies were made to poop in a squat, and now there's a product that lets you squat in your own home. Introducing... Oh, brilliant. Brilliant. Bravo. I'm, you know, I'm convinced we, we were, we were meant to squat while pooping. That's how we were built. Your soft serve comes from the sphincter of a unicorn. Like at the beginning, I'm, I remember the first time I saw that, Paul, I'm like, what the, what are you talking about?

59:17And when the Ben and Jerry's not coming out, right. That's when you learn how to squat. Like really? This poor anonymous caller is like, we haven't even gotten to her question yet, and we are already so far off the rails. All right. Let's bring it back. This is - This is Judy. Judy. Yes. Here we go. Hi, Paula and Joe. I'm a big fan of the show, and I learn so much every week. My question today is about how to think about windfalls. I'm a teacher earning 66K between salary and tutoring. I got started with saving late. I was in grad school until I was 32, thankfully not going into debt but not saving much.

59:58I'm currently 39, single, no kids, and I have a total of$126 ,000 in retirement. I contribute 10 % to my 403B and my employer contributes an additional 5. I'm currently putting another 5 % into a Roth. I now have$119 ,000 in my 403B and$7.5 ,000 in my Roth. I do have a quick question about that. How much would you put into a Roth in my circumstances where I don't really expect my tax bracket to go up by a ton by retirement? All of my funds are in Vanguard Lifecycle Index 2050. I know I'll do better soon. A year ago, I bought a house for $180K. I have$140K remaining on a 30-year mortgage fixed at$4.375.

1:00:40No other debt. I have about$34K of my own savings in a high-yield savings account. My question is really about money I've received as gifts. In the past few years, my parents have gifted me$60 ,000 incredibly generously. Right now, it's sitting in a CD in I-bonds. In addition, I have$20 ,000 in savings bonds for my grandparents. My challenge is with how to think about this money. In some ways, I feel ashamed that I didn't earn it. In other ways, I think about a society that values my labor as a teacher so much less monetarily than that of my lawyer parent, and then I just feel grateful for my parents' generosity.

1:01:16In either case, I want to use this money wisely. One thing I'm sure about is that it can't be anything I come to need to pay the bills. I've thought about putting some of it into retirement or my house, but I wonder if that's really the best use of it. I think I'm reasonably on track for retirement if I continue at this 20 % rate. Does that seem right? After pondering, I think what I'd most like to do with the money is to use it to create room for some larger occasional expenditures that are really hard when you're living on one relatively modest income and trying to save ahead for things that are likely to break in an older home.

1:01:52What I really, really want to do is to take a two-week trip to Uzbekistan for about$5 ,000 next summer. In general, I would be very happy if I could plan to take a$5 ,000 trip every, say, two or three years. I think my family would feel like I was using the money well if I used it for meaningful things over time, whether that be trips I care about or something really special for my home. So often on the show, you talk about where to put money in terms of when you need it. The challenge here is that I don't really have a set timeline. I wonder, does what I'm describing seem like a reasonable vision?

1:02:26If so, where would you put the money? How would you figure out how much to spend and at what rate. Thank you so much for any thoughts or framing you can give me. Beautiful, beautiful. Judy, I love the question. First of all, please, please, please do not feel ashamed at receiving these gifts. The work that you do is wonderful and meaningful and it changes lives. It is not highly compensated, but it is so, so valuable. Second of all, you are stewarding this gift with wisdom and thoughtfulness. The way to disrespect a gift is by being flippant or casual about it. There are people who spend their whole lives building a legacy for future generations only for that future generation to squander it.

1:03:24And that's disrespectful to the ancestors. But what you are doing is the opposite. What you are doing is respecting the gift that your parents and grandparents have given you by being so thoughtful about it. I can tell from the question that you asked, not just the words that you used, but also the tone in your voice, right? That is how you respect this money and the labor that your parents and grandparents used in order to procure it. And the third reason is giving is a blessing to both the giver and the receiver. Gracefully receiving a gift is itself a loving act towards the person who gave it, because you are allowing yourself to receive.

1:04:14So for all of those reasons, I would encourage you not to feel ashamed about this. And in fact, I love that rather than relying on this to pay bills, you want to use it for something meaningful. I think everything that you outlined is a wonderful idea. Putting it into a retirement account would be a wonderful way of signaling, hey, thank you for giving this to me. I'm going to make sure that this money is put in place so that I can take care of my future self. When I am in my 70s or 80s, and maybe my health is not what it is today, future me will be cared for. And I know that, you know, that's what your parents and grandparents would want.

1:04:54I think that's a wonderful thing to do with it. Using it to pay off part of your mortgage, if that's what you want it to do, is also another wonderful way to use it. Again, because that is just a different iteration of taking care of the future version of you. And using it to travel, like Uzbekistan, first of all, I love the specificity of Uzbekistan. Right? That tells me that you've really put a lot of thought into this. Not that there's anything wrong with going to some of the more common places that people go, but if you're talking about Uzbekistan, you have really spent some time deeply studying the globe and thinking about places that you could visit that would really enrich your life.

1:05:43So I think that's a wonderful use of the funds. And it sounds as though with no debt, with 20 % of your income going towards retirement, it sounds as though everything else is on track as far as I can tell. I think she's close enough, though, with her money. Of those three choices, I don't think I'd pay off the mortgage. I think the mortgage is at a low enough interest rate. That is my least favorite. Don't get me wrong. Studies show that people who pay off their mortgage before they retire are happier, and it's great to be conservative. So it's a good use. But the other two I find much more compelling.

1:06:20I 100 % agree. Yes, entirely. I thought right away. She said she doesn't have a timeline. That is baloney. She definitely has a timeline of when she's going to use the money, but it depends on which one of these two choices she decides on. If she decides to put it in a retirement account, well, then we know she doesn't need it until retirement. And then she's got her timeline of that money and she can invest it appropriately in investments that have the growing season that fit that timeline. Right. Stocks and real estate. Great for long term, short term. You know, right now she's in CDs, I bonds, perfect for short term stuff.

1:06:54So immediately she goes into long term mode. She can transfer it into index funds that meet that criteria. if she goes the other way into this becoming a travel fund, well, then she can break those into CDs matching that amount of time for the short-term ones. And the longer ones, the ones that are longer than maybe seven, eight, nine years, those years worth of travel that she's budgeting for, she can put again, I think, into the financial markets, especially 10 years out. Right. I think she can do that without much worry. So she's got her timelines. I think she just has to decide which of these two.

1:07:30Now, my feelings about both of these, number one is if she goes with putting it toward retirement, that means that the Uzbekistan trip is going to come out of her budget. And so she's going to have to find a way to get that money. And that might upset the apple cart when it comes to her fantastic, as my mom says, when it comes to that fantastic savings rate that she has, she might have to slow it down if she does that. That's a big trip every couple of years. So putting the money aside for the trip, make sure she continue on the strategy that she's on with her savings rate, with freedom from worry.

1:08:10Something just occurred to me. All right. So she's 39 years old and she talked about wanting to take a trip every two to three years. Let's take the shorter of that number. Let's assume that she's going to take a trip every two years until she meets retirement age. So let's just say from age 40 until age 60, she's going to take a trip every two years. So over a 20-year time span, that's 10 trips. At a cost of$5 ,000 per trip, that's$50 ,000. She has$80 ,000. So even if she were to say$50 ,000 of this is my travel money, that still leaves the other$30 ,000 that she can put into retirement accounts.

1:08:48And now she's got a timeline for all of it. $30 ,000 goes into retirement accounts and then the rest. Of the two, because she already has this savings habit going, she's got the system going, and I think it's a good system that she has. If it were me, and it's not me, and I think that we need to be clear about this. This is Judy's goal, not Joe's goal. If it were me though, I think I would work to protect that habit. just just this would protect the habit and this would be that travel money plus this is the other thing paula when i was a planner i saw people that would just never take the trips because of the guilt feeling and when she led with the guilt feeling like you feel so guilty about that money and the fact that you have it you're like oh maybe i'll let it grow a little more maybe i'll grow but the thing it's not growing is your time on earth so i would take the trips and i think that then And she creates those meaningful memories, which is what the money is used for.

1:09:45I love it when people, by the way, give money before they pass away. I think anybody out there that is already financially independent, they know they have enough money for themselves, no matter what they do. Like take the amount you think you're going to spend and double it. And if you still have money left over, I love the idea of gifting it to people and organizations you care about while you're alive. They can use it sooner. You get the reward of watching them flourish because of your help. They're probably more likely to spend it in a way that is less wasteful because they know that you're still there and you can see them spending the money.

1:10:22So I think it works from a lot of different places. But in this case, I think she's got the timeline. I think she does have a timeline no matter which way she goes. I'm looking up facts about Uzbekistan right now. Of course you are. Of course, because in my head I was like, wait, we've never changed somebody's name before. but can we change her name from Judy to the name of some famous Uzbekistani? Well, before we get there, before we get there, I just need to know if squatty potties have a foothold yet in Uzbekistan. There's a pun there. Is there a pun there? There's a pun. I didn't know there's a pun there.

1:11:01Could you put your feet on the squat anyway? Maybe. Next to it. If you put your foot in it, then you might have a problem. Judy, we'll just stick with Judy for now. The other thing that occurs to me, so the$5 ,000 figure for the trip to Uzbekistan, as well as any future trips, if that's what you want to spend, that's amazing. But one thing that I would encourage you to look into, if, if, if, if, if, and I'm saying this not just for you, but for the sake of everyone listening, if you are sure that you can pay off a credit card in full every month, right? If you use a credit card just for ordinary expenses, like your groceries, your gasoline, just ordinary everyday expenses, if you know you're not going to do extra spending because you've got it, if you know you're going to pay it off in full, then what I would do is I would take out a card that gives you airline miles.

1:11:57And especially if you're planning on taking one trip every two years, I'm guessing you're going to be able to buy this airline ticket with miles just by using the miles that accumulate from normal daily spending on your credit card. If, if, if, if, if you pay it in full every month. I don't know if the 5 ,000 figure includes airfare or not. You know, if it doesn't, and the reason I'm thinking about this is Uzbekistan is not, it's not like Japan that, you know, a high cost, and it's not an expensive country to travel in. There are some parts of the globe that are just significantly cheaper to travel in than others.

1:12:35and the biggest cost factor of that trip is the airfare. But once you're there, the food is cheap, the accommodations are cheap, ground transportation is cheap. You can probably significantly reduce the cost of some of the trips that you want to take by using airline miles to fly there. And that changes up the amount that you need a budget for each trip, which also changes the total amount dedicated to each trip. the amount that goes in the trip bucket versus the amount that goes in the retirement bucket. Well, she could also play some games with that, right? I mean, if the$5 ,000 comes in low, she can then allocate the rest of that money toward the next trip to go to a high cost area that she might want to visit.

1:13:19Keep the budget the same, the long-term budget's the same, but the short-run budget just varies based on the place that she goes. Right, exactly. So maybe Uzbekistan is$3 ,000, but Lesotho ends up costing$6 ,000, right? I was so surprised, by the way, just in Western Europe, just moving across the globe a little bit. The difference, I'd never traveled through Spain until just a few months ago. The cost of traveling through Spain, so much less than France, which I've been to several times. I was just blown away by the cost difference. Countries right next door to each other. And I felt like I could buy a lot more with a lot less in Spain.

1:13:57Yeah. I was surprised. Just country to country right next to each other. Italy, not cheap and right around the corner. Food in Albania has gotten really expensive. The average Albanian, I was reading in the Financial Times the other day, spends 60 % of their household income on groceries. On groceries. On groceries. Wow. I just remember to your point too, when we were in Laos, you could spend tons of money there. And by spend tons of money, I mean almost none. And you can live very, very well for a long time on very little money in lots of places. But Southeast Asia was wonderful. Yeah, Judy, I can't say this enough.

1:14:41I love the destinations that you're looking at. I just I love it when people go to places that that are less common as travel destinations. And I say this as somebody who has been to nearly 50 countries at this point. I don't think I've quite hit the 5-0 mark, but I'm pretty close. There's a different quality of experience when you're in a place where you're not on a tourist conveyor belt. There's just a certain raw realness, rawness, authenticity. I know that's an overused term. I find they're two completely different experiences. And by the way, I appreciate the tourist conveyor belt. I do. But as an example, for me now, now that I've been to Western Europe several times, I was telling Cheryl that that almost feels less like a vacation and more like just my little getaway place.

1:15:37I'm not exploring, but certainly when we were in Southeast Asia, there were places we went where it felt much more like I was learning. I was experiencing some brand new culture. the people I was meeting with that were from Michigan originally living on the Arkansas, Texas border, they didn't see me every day, which was fascinating. It's so fun to see and experience just different cultures. It was awesome. Right. Well, Judy, thank you for the question and enjoy all of your trips. Send us postcards. Joe, we did it again. We did it yet again. Stuck the landing. It was incredible. And we talked about squatting.

1:16:20We talked about squatty potties. Cocaine bear. Cocaine bear. Ben and Jerry's ice cream in the grossest way ever. This is one of my favorite shows. Talked about Uzbekistan. Cocaine and poop. That was the theme of today's show. Cocaine poop in Uzbekistan. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And Ray Liotta. Special guest star, Ray Liotta. Well, Joe, where can people find you if they want to hear more of your antics? You can find me and sometimes you can find Paula as well on the Stacking Benjamin Show. Every Monday, Wednesday, Friday, you'll find Paula on our Friday episodes. Just like you can now see us on YouTube from time to time together on the Afford Anything channel.

1:17:05You can also catch Paula and I and the team on YouTube. Our Friday shows we put on our YouTube channel as well. Because this closing is airing audio only. So just so y 'all out there in audio land know, we have just started uploading actual videos to YouTube, the Afford Anything YouTube channel. Two of today's three questions we have also answered in video form on YouTube. I know. Two out of three. Two out of three. Eric's question was audio only, but we weren't rolling video at the time. Sorry, Eric. Sorry. Our bad. No, we got to focus on our words. That's right. But the other two questions, the two anonymous callers, we answered in these are the first videos, actual video videos that we have uploaded in years.

1:17:56So come say hi to us in the comments on YouTube. Come look at our faces. Exactly. Yes. Our adorable face. I think the word is adorable. Adorable faces. Yes. That's the way people talk about us, Paula. Adorable. Well, thank you for joining us, Joe. Well, thank you for having me again, Paula. And thanks to all of you in the Afford Anything community. You can, if you enjoyed today's show, please, please come find us on YouTube and just leave a comment under one of the videos to say hello and say that you enjoyed it and see what we look like. YouTube.com slash Afford Anything is our channel. And Joe, I'm sure you're what?

1:18:32YouTube.com slash StackingBenjamin? Stacky Benjamins, yeah. How did I guess? So weird. Right? Cryptic. So yes, if you enjoyed today's show, find us on YouTube and leave a comment and say hello and just share the love. Hit the subscribe button on YouTube while you're there and share it with your friends. Be like, look at these faces. Aren't they? Aren't they faces? Aren't they faces? They're very facey. Facey, yeah. As opposed to what we talked about a lot today, which was fecey. Woo! And with that, we are signing off. Thank you so much for tuning in. I'm Paula Pant. I'm Joe Salcihai. And we will catch you in the next episode.

1:19:16Here is an important disclaimer. There's a distinction between financial media and financial advice. Financial media includes everything that you read on the internet, hear on a podcast, see on social media that relates to finance. All of this is financial media. That includes the Afford Anything podcast, this podcast, as well as everything Afford Anything produces. And financial media is not a regulated industry. There are no licensure requirements. There are no mandatory credentials. There's no oversight board or review board. The financial media, including this show, is fundamentally part of the media.

1:19:54And the media is never a substitute for professional advice. That means anytime you make a financial decision or a tax decision or a business decision, anytime you make any type of decision, you should be consulting with licensed credential experts, including but not limited to attorneys, tax professionals, certified financial planners, or certified financial advisors. Always, always, always consult with them before you make any decision. Never use anything in the financial media, and that includes this show, and that includes everything that I say and do, never use the financial media as a substitute for actual professional advice.

1:20:37All right, there's your disclaimer. Have a great day.