Built in the Changing Room: Trust, Teamwork and Brotherhood with Barrie McDermott, Adrian Morley & Shaun Lunt

15:23Adrian Morley:Yeah. You've been in a few teams most, so it's probably a difficult question to ask, but I want you to try and remember the first time. So you've come from Eccles, Salford Roost as they call now. You come from Eccles, you're an amateur, you're in the environment and you're amongst all your heroes. But at what point did you think to yourself, these are my family these are more than teammates

15:47Shaun Lunt:it was only in my third game to be fair so as a 17 year old I played first team really skinner and it was my third game we played away at Wakefield and in them days the second row used to stand on the back line where the props go now anyway and I'm taking the ball up and I just kept getting because of my size kept getting put on my backside and anyway it was Richie Ayres who's the next player and all I did was, Moza, Moza, I'll switch with you now. Just a little moment like that, but I thought he's looking after me there and it meant the world. So I knew there and then that your teammates have got your back and they'll do out for you to help you out.

16:29Shaun Lunt:But yeah, it was quite a big moment really.

16:31Adrian Morley:There's an understanding, isn't there? And within any team environment, you've got 17 or 15 in the old days, you've got 17 and you've got about 25. everybody's important in different ways and if you don't do your work the halfbacks can't do their work and set up the tries and the wingers and the centers and the fullbacks and the people who score the points convert the tries can't do their stuff so everybody's reliant on one another what about off the pitch is there a is there a point where you thought that this bloke here who is my teammate I've got so much in common with him he's very quickly turning into my best friend and my most trusted ally.

17:09Shaun Lunt:Yeah, that's Eiza, Neil Harmon, who, you know, I played with Neil here for a couple of years, but then he actually moved on to Bradford Bulls. Might have been Huddersfield then, Bradford. Yeah, yeah. But he had a place up in, just off the Ring Road there, and he said, instead of travelling every day, why don't you stay here a couple of days a week? But the bond we had... Did he charge you?

17:31Barrie McDermott:He did charge me.

17:32Adrian Morley:Well, it was a business decision, let me tell you.

17:34Shaun Lunt:but it was, still worked out cheaper, but that's life and it gives me an understanding of, you know, nothing's free, but he was a great teammate here, first and foremost. He was a great lad. He's from St. Helens, but he was great even when he moved on. I'm still, still...

17:51Adrian Morley:Living in China now, isn't he?

17:52Shaun Lunt:Living in China, yeah, yeah. School teacher. Still close friends with Neil, but he was great and to have a senior player, person like that in your life, it was, I won't say father figure, that's a bit dramatic, but he was certainly like a mentor, role model. Yeah, yeah, he was fantastic. And you could argue some of the things he taught me weren't as professional as he could have been, but it was great as a young lad, dead exciting, you know, living in Leeds and playing, you know, rugby league for a profession. He was great to have on your side. And Luntie, what about you?

18:26Adrian Morley:When did you first be in a team environment and have somebody at the side of you that turned from a teammate to a trusted ally

18:33Barrie McDermott:and a mentor for me it was uh james donaldson and it wasn't until i came down with sepsis so donno is a fellow cumbrian so i've got to be obviously i'm a little bit um biased that way but and i never knew donno growing up as a kid he was actually from waft brow so obviously up in cumbria we call them jam eaters and whatnot and when i signed okr we traveled together so he lived up at burst also i was still in merfield and again when you're spending loads of time with each other you know yourself when you travel with Kev, you travel with Tez, you get to know each other, you know, you get to know each other inside out.

19:05Barrie McDermott:And it wasn't until I got really, really ill with sepsis. And I was in, so I got put into an assessment ward and they thought I had bacterial meningitis. And for three days, nobody could come see me. I had to be isolated and throughout, well, during them three days, it was my son's birthday as well. So I felt really, really low. And there was only three people that came and seen me from the rugby team and dono was one of them and he was the first one and little things like that when you're down and you you know you're out and you know you're feeling the worst you've ever ever felt your rock bottom uh dono was there for me and sadly dono has just recently done his fourth acl so i always check in and whatnot so dono for me is uh he doesn't know what that really what

19:47Adrian Morley:that what that meant to me and it's all part of the process in it we talk about the changing room environment but it's the work environment the things that you get taught and you inherit a certain set of values and morals you try to interpret them put your own spin on them and pass them back on to the next um lot of people that you have an influence on so donno sounds like a really good influence on you because you i think you said it moz about it's not just about the pitch it's not just about the training pitch it's sometimes travel but when you get deep into the bonds and the commonalities that you've got with somebody you realize that actually I weren't keen on you before but the more time I spend with you the more I realize that we're quite aligned

20:28Barrie McDermott:yeah the biggest person in rugby league that had the biggest influence on me as a as a player was Kev Sinfield obviously 2012 I wasn't getting in the team at Huddersfield I was I was I think I was 24 I just had a newborn I had my eldest son Noah and I wasn't getting picked and obviously all we want to do is play don't we had you know there was there was guys in front of me I was getting 10 minutes here on the bench and 10 minutes there and and then the the loan the loan spell came about coming here potentially coming here and um I was very fortunate again to travel with Kev so I met Kev up at early top and I spent a lot of time with Kev and he like I say when you say teamwork there was always me and me and my brother together like when my mum and dad um split up it was always me and my brother we used to go everywhere together and then my brother moved to Australia and then sort of Morocco gone and I'd sort of, I was at Huddersfield not playing, I sort of lost my way a little bit.

21:21Barrie McDermott:And I came to Leeds and then like gel with Kev and he was just reminding me of my older brother. He was that person I could go to, I felt safe in his presence. And a lot of people like they see Kev and they just see this super ultra professional person, but he's got a wicked sense of humor. He's got that dark side to him that I'm very prevalent and lucky to see. And yeah, Keb, he's had a massive, massive impact on me because the way he carries himself.

21:46Adrian Morley:I know I'm challenging here. Can you remember a specific conversation or a specific problem that he helped you solve?

21:54Barrie McDermott:I can just remember the first week I came, he just said, Lunte, just listen to me. I'll guide you around. Don't panic.

22:00Adrian Morley:And I was obviously, I'd come into this. Don't panic's good advice, isn't it?

22:03Barrie McDermott:Yeah, don't panic. Yeah, because obviously I'd come from Huddersfield, coming to the star-studded side at Leeds. and it was just like having a coach on the pitch. He just literally directed everyone and I ended up getting the supporters man of the match as well. Yeah, brilliant. Yeah, just like I say, just having his presence around. A little story, we were actually in the lounge and I was with my eldest son at the time watching a game and Keb walked in with his wife and his kids and Noah's just, his eyes lit up. He was like, there's Keb, there's Keb. I said, oh yeah. So obviously everyone goes over, checks Keb's hand and then sort of Keb sees me and we'd like we smiled and he comes right over gives me a big cuddle and then we had a we have a little chat and i've got a picture with noah and uh noah goes to me goes oh you do know him don't you i was like yeah of course i do i told you that they didn't believe me until until that and

22:50Adrian Morley:and that's uh like again i don't understand why people are suspicious of you do you tell many lies is that what's going on yeah but we know them bro yeah most you've had a brilliant career and you've had many many highs but i know that there's been times when you've been out of favor you've been injured and inevitably when you're that talisman for your team and you're making big shots and big tackles and turning games on those moments inevitably you get those wrong because you're willing to put yourself out there who do you turn to when things like that but when you had occasions like that who did you get on the phone to?

23:26Shaun Lunt:Well when I was playing Australia it was family I'd ring them and sound them out but to be fair there wasn't that I mean there was quite a few suspensions, but they weren't really, they didn't affect me profoundly. So you had self-talk, you had confidence in your own direction. And I was very thankful that Ricky Stewart, who was my coach for five years at the Roosters, he made it clear and public that he's supporting me, he's got me back, and he always used to say, because I was getting to the point where I was getting banned every couple of months, and it weren't just a little ban, because of the loading system and that kind of thing and similar offence.

24:06Shaun Lunt:I was getting like three game bans for doing, you know, something new. You do every game, Baz. But anyway, I went up to him and said, look, I'll change the way I play the game because, you know, it's no good for the club, no more for me. And his face, no, I don't want you to, I want you to carry on the way you're playing. Obviously, don't go out of your way to do it and try and be a bit more smarter. But your aggression is your strength. The players love playing with you. I love coaching you. Crack on, and that meant the world that, because I knew he had his backing.

24:38Adrian Morley:What about some of those personal struggles when you were off the pitch and you were uncertain of what was going on around you? Who did you go to then? Was that still family?

24:47Shaun Lunt:Yeah, still family.

24:48Adrian Morley:You've got two older brothers, haven't you? One daft, one sensible.

24:52Shaun Lunt:Yeah, that's right. What does that make you?

24:54Barrie McDermott:Well, I'm a bit in between.

24:57Adrian Morley:The spoiled brat.

24:58Shaun Lunt:They were always a big influence on my career, particularly the daft one who played professional rugby league because he was a big inspiration. But I always spoke to them and as I say, to be fair, I've never got myself in such a tis was where I was, you know, wound up and affected me mentally or anything like that. So I was quite fortunate. But when the big bands come along or the big injury or something like that, I always knew we had family to count on.

25:30Adrian Morley:so it was uh weren't too bad it's quite important in it whether it's business or whether it's sport that you've got things they talk about that work life balance model where you've got family you've got you as a as a professional sportsman or or how you make your living and then you as an individual that you just get things in balance then if things aren't going right the other two aspects of your life just compensate take over and you can lean into that and not get too bogged down on on what's going wrong so it's good that you had that self-confidence that awareness or lack of awareness moz because i know you really well that you didn't that you didn't over process too many things while you were while you were in those difficult spots we've covered off the brotherhood we've covered off how those bonds are strong and we're willing to work hard for one another and step up but inevitably in an elite environment there are clashes there are times where you've got to stand up and say, Moz, that's unacceptable.

26:28Adrian Morley:Can you think back to a time in a high pressure environment where you've had to do that yourself? Yeah.

26:34Barrie McDermott:So this, this was really difficult for me because as a child, I've always run from conflict. So this coming into this environment, you know, as a young kid, it was very tough for me. So when I was, it all stems back from when, when I was a youngster. So when my mum and dad split up, my mum turned gay. And so being from a small town in Cumbria where I'm going back 29 years now. So not a lot of gay people around and still frowned upon at the time and being in that small environment. And then every time, you know, lads would be talking about, you know, they'd be talking about lesbians or they'd be talking about gay.

27:11Barrie McDermott:I just, you know, fight or flight. And then I just run from, from any conflict, any sign of conflict. So that's something that I've had to work on, not until I've got older and I've realized, And again, it's always, like I say, I've always sort of shied away from that confrontation, but now I embrace it now, you know, everything that I've learned on the pitch. So again, I go back to the 2013 season when someone went out and they were drinking and I went to the coach and with a couple of us and said, listen, this can't be done. This, if we want to, I just come back from Leeds after winning the grand final win, I was a champion.

27:45Barrie McDermott:I wanted to come back and I wanted to kick on you know and you know reach highs in my in my career and that happened and I was just like I'm not letting that happen I've just come back from a club where this is probably one of the greatest team there is and I'm not letting that happen and thankfully it all went well but again you've got to be really uncomfortable in that you've got to be comfortable in them uncomfortable situations to really grow.

28:09Adrian Morley:And Moz what about you as a leader and I'm talking about probably the back-end e-career at Warrington and at Salford. How did you manage conflicts? How did you interject?

28:18Shaun Lunt:To be fair, we didn't have a huge amount of issues. When lads were getting out of order, you know, discipline, that kind of thing, I approached him and, to be fair, they were more often than not the dull that I knew. What was your style?

28:33Adrian Morley:Was it, I'll sit down, I'll take him for a coffee?

28:37Shaun Lunt:Yep, yep, just nice and easy first and then I'd let them explain, why they're going about the business the way they are. But there wasn't a huge issue, but the issues we did have, they held their hands up and said, yeah, you're right, you've got me here, I'm going to sort it out. So there wasn't a chronic episode. But earlier on in my career, we played with C*** here. Now, I don't mind saying I borrowed him some money. I went to Australia, but then he just did their own thing in terms of not keeping in touch, which basically took money and ran. But then the year after, or two years after, he made the international side, Great Britain, and everyone knew that I was, what, to give him a slap, basically.

29:22Shaun Lunt:But I went up to the coach and said, look, you've done the wrong thing by me, but I won't let it for one minute interfere with Team Harmony, that kind of thing. And I went up to him and said, look, we're going to sort out when the camp's finished, so everything's fine until then. Anyway, he did leave camp, but he didn't. up there but you know sometimes you've got to uh put things to one side absolutely yeah yeah so

29:47Adrian Morley:yeah and it's quite unusual for people to see us willing to scrap and fight and do everything we have to do on the field but the underlining issues personality wise are still there aren't they there is conflict there is people you don't actually like yeah but as long as they're good at their job yeah you'll do what you need to do to make sure that they can excel on the stage you don't

30:10Shaun Lunt:have to be absolutely best mates and being interested in some people you are but some people

30:15Adrian Morley:you think i won't walk across the street if i ever see you again no no you are so good at your job

30:21Shaun Lunt:i'll do what i can to make it better yeah well that's that's true and what about you baz have

30:25Adrian Morley:you got any uh stories yes and i know what you're alluding to it was just out here um

30:30Shaun Lunt:what year was it moz would you say 2000 i just i just left so it was 2001 2001 so there's an

30:37Adrian Morley:australian forward called jamie matthew who i didn't personally get on with i didn't connect with him in a way i tried to but i didn't connect with him and that's fine but he'd been chipping at me and he'd sort of been saying things behind my back which i put to one side and i think when i was younger i would ignore things until they got to a boiling point and then there was an explosion now i'm more likely to pull the little things and say listen i don't like that or do that slightly different but that's maturity in it but at the time there was a collection of small things and we actually came to blows out here before a semi-final did you not play had you already gone

31:14Shaun Lunt:no i'd already gone then but uh i did so you'd heard about it anyway we came to blows i knew

31:20Adrian Morley:as soon as the the kettle had switched off i thought that's that's a bad move that we played st helens at wigan and basically i'd had a scuffle with him and i broke his chain he'd said to me my kids bought that chain which i felt bad because i'm a family man myself but rather than getting in my car and going home and forgetting about it we got on a coach we stayed in the hotel i was together with him for the next probably 48 hours so every time i looked at him i was like didn't have any time to cool off well i just knew i'd got it wrong i just knew at that point when the button had been pressed i don't feel responsible for pressing it but at the point that button had been pressed and the and the explosion that happened i knew i'd got it wrong but I think sometimes you have to learn the hard way don't you we lost that semi-final whether we'd have won or lost if I hadn't done that I don't know but I look back and I think yeah I got that wrong.

32:15Adrian Morley:Right we've got a little bit of time left so we're going to dive into another fun topic and the topic is comebacks we've all been part of games we've all watched games we've all been in the sport a long long time we're in the dying minutes the result changes or a season and he's flipped on its head. We love a bit of drama and a bit of rugby drama in particular. So what's the most memorable comeback you've experienced, Moz?

32:38Shaun Lunt:I'd say it was 2002 playing down under for the Sydney Roosters. So we started, it was Ricky Stewart's first year as coach. We won our first game against South. It was South Sydney's first game back in the competition after they'd been exiled. That was a big game. Russell Crowe was there at the game. won the first game then we lost the next five games so you could say the season's going pretty terrible we had a couple of injuries suspensions but then that was the year I had the back issue so then as I was training as I was playing this constant pain wouldn't go on my back so the last option was surgery so I had the surgery it was quite a big operation on the spine the success rate was was good but it was still a chance that it wouldn't work so then I missed nine weeks with this back operation but then the team the form turned on its head and then when I come back from the back operation we won the last eight games straight to play and win the grand final there in Sydney so from a season it looked like it could be personally career changing to actually going on and winning I'd say that was my favourite flip of a season definitely

33:57Adrian Morley:I do remember that because in 2002, went over to Australia, played Australia in Australia. We got our backsides handed to us, but you were in camp with us, weren't you? I was in camp. And you were worried about the surgery.

34:09Shaun Lunt:Yeah, yeah. So I might even have had the surgery then, but I know I was asked to go in camp, which was fantastic to spend time with you guys. But it was disastrous only because the travel time from England to Australia, I think you got into Sydney on a Tuesday night and they had to play on Friday or something like that. But then, as I say, it was great to see you and Teddy and all the guys, but then the actual result was 60-odd, 10. And then I remember the headlines in the Sydney Mory Herald the next day, RIP International Rugby League. Thanks for that, Mo. Cheers for that. No, but that's how, I mean, they love a story over there.

34:48Shaun Lunt:They're quite dramatic, but I thought, you know, we've come over here. But they've just come off playing a three-game State of Origin series. they were all battle-hardened and then as I say the travel wasn't wasn't great so then Great Britain got good hiding and then on the Sunday I went to Melbourne with the Sydney Roosters and they got about 50 put past them so it was you it's me I was the I always remember we were warming up

35:13Adrian Morley:at the Sydney Football Stadium and like I said we're all over the place all jet lag woozy just trying to get into that groove and I always remember warming up some Aussie at the back of us said

35:24Shaun Lunt:McDermott you've got nothing

35:26Adrian Morley:and then O 'Connor Tez O 'Connor turned around and said has he been looking at your bank account I was like probably probably but Lunte what about you what about a time in your career where it's gone from this

35:38Barrie McDermott:to that so for me it's the most memorable game probably not the most memorable game in Super League history but one of the the iconic games of the million pound game when we got beat by Solvin so we were eight points up with four minutes left there was Tim Sheens in the

35:54Adrian Morley:You mentioned Minzy. Minzy was involved in that back then, weren't he?

35:57Barrie McDermott:Minzy, yeah. Minzy played that. Yeah, yeah. Minzy broke into the team that year. And yeah, so playing in that game and then getting beat in Golden Point and then just seeing the total carnage afterwards, you know, people fighting on the pitch, you know, everyone crying. And then I can remember being in the train station and Tim Sheen's rung me and he said he was still going to come for the next season and do I want to sign? and because again, going back to what's been instilled in me through rugby, doing my integrity, my morals, I had a part to play in that team going down and I wanted to rectify my problems.

36:34Barrie McDermott:I had young kids at the time and I want them to remember me by doing something, you know, you've done something wrong, now fix it. And that year, I can remember we had a very shy squad, first of all, we had Chris Clarkson, who you probably coached as well. He was number 10, he got given the 10 share We had big Scrutsy. He'd signed from Wakey. He still honoured his contract and came. There was myself at nine. We had Ben Kavanagh, James Donaldson, and Jamie Ellis. He had a fantastic season. And we had Adam Quinlan at the back, at the fullback. So we, yeah, that year, even though we started winning and, you know, we were grinding out results and then towards the back end of the season, working under Tim, he brought in big Mossy Massoa and he brought in Justin Carney.

37:19Barrie McDermott:and just at the right time, we beat Lee at Lee. They got promoted. So they obviously, they came up into Super League. We went down. We beat Lee in the Challenge Cup. That year, we nearly beat Salford in the Challenge Cup. We just got beat and then playing witness. And we literally, so I think we had two games left to spare. I think Warrant were in the bottom eight that year. Yeah, we played Warrant in the last game, but some of us needed surgery. So we just sat out that game. It was a dead rubber. But when people talk about emotions about winning, it was just, it was more relief than anything.

37:52Barrie McDermott:You know, when that whistle went against witness, it was more relief than, do you know, like, do you know when you - Celebration. That celebration, yeah. It was just, and then it was just like a massive emotional rollercoaster. And to see now where Hulk are, I was at the grand final, and to see them where they are now, you know, the treble winners. And it's just, it's such a good comeback story, you know, where they were as a team to where they are now, it's unbelievable.

38:20Adrian Morley:It's an incredible journey that Hulkier have been part of over the last decade or so. And when you've been part of that, when you've been down at the bottom, you celebrate with them at top. But communication and trust is all part of that growing process. How did it manifest itself for you with communication and trust?

38:36Barrie McDermott:So I was given the captaincy that year. So that year I actually needed a shoulder operation. But if I had surgery, it would have put me out about four months. I would have missed the first part of the season. So what we decided to do was just inject it and plan painkillers all year. So for me, I trust in the club. I trust in the players. And hopefully that I earned their trust as well as players. You know, I was their leader. So I showed right from day dot, I was willing to train through pain to try and rectify it. And that year, like I say, we all gelled together. We worked hard for each other.

39:14Barrie McDermott:Do you know, there was, obviously, you can imagine what stick we got from the black and whites over there, the west side of the city. So, yeah, that trust is massive because, again, going back to the individual stuff and, you know, they've got your back. Do you know, I remember Scrooge, he was just, he was phenomenal that season. He was just an absolute tank in the middle. Again, Robbie Muller, he came through that year. He was absolutely brilliant. And you could just rely on everyone. Do you know, Ryan Shaw on the wing, who got the winning try. Everyone just played their part, their little part as a collective, as a team that we produced a promotion winning season.

39:46Adrian Morley:Moz, during that time where you were recovering from your operation, you know, we'll talk about the influence of the dark cloud of a succession of defeats. What was the trust from your teammates and the communication like?

40:01Shaun Lunt:Ricochet was big on everyone sticking together, you know, throughout the win or lose, that kind of thing. And they did come right while I asked the boys and, you know, there was a great, great camaraderie, great team spirit, but we did have a few injuries. But then once we started getting the boys back, myself included, that's when you could see a bit more belief in the boys. Anyway, once we started winning and then winning and winning, it was a knock-on effect then. But I'd like to think we didn't lose hope all year, even though we had a terrible start. You know, we did keep faith in the coaches and what we were trying to achieve.

40:41Shaun Lunt:And ultimately, we ended up going all the way.

40:44Adrian Morley:But the fact that you weren't isolated, people were talking to you, you were still kept in.

40:49Shaun Lunt:Yeah, still kept in.

40:50Adrian Morley:The team meant that when you were ready and available, you felt like you took your natural place. It's interesting, actually. I think I mentioned on one of the other podcasts, when I joined Oldham, first night out after my debut, you know, I'm at the bar with my heroes, but my mates from my amateur club are across the pub and I went to walk over and one of the lads said, no, you're with us now, were you mates? When I went to Wigan, I got injured about halfway through the season and continued to go out because I thought it was an expectation that you kept with the lads and you went to the games, you celebrated, you commiserated together.

41:22Adrian Morley:I remember one of the lads at Wigan saying, no, listen, you need to focus on getting yourself right. Don't be getting out on the drink with the lads. Get in the gym, make sure you're fresh the day after a game and you're in the gym early and the coaches are seeing you trying to make an effort to get yourself right. And it was two contrasting philosophies, probably Oldham's success rate and Wigan's success rate determines which one was the best way to go. But success, failure, it's all intrinsically linked in it because every Rocky story, Rocky doesn't start by winning, does he? He starts down at the bottom and that journey is the biggest part of the lesson.

42:02Adrian Morley:Some brilliant stuff there, lads. I really enjoyed the comeback chat. So let's get into the takeaways. Let's deal with, first of all, selfless acts in a team. We talked about sometimes you're in front, sometimes you're tucked behind, weren't you?

42:15Barrie McDermott:Yeah, I can always remember when I was a plumber, an apprentice plumber, and the guy that I was working with, he couldn't drive. So I used to do all the driving. Again, I used to be up early, but again, together as a team that we worked together, and again, looking in the boardroom and whatnot, It's all about the team and encouraging people and supporting them in the right way and not putting your own agenda before theirs.

42:37Adrian Morley:Moz, teamwork, it's integral that you do your bit to make sure the outcome is a positive one.

42:44Shaun Lunt:Yeah, that's right. I mean, you can take so many points from the game of Rugby League into the business world and you've got to be selfless. You've got to do what has to be done for the sake of the team rather than yourself. So you've got to sacrifice. You've got to just basically do what has to be done.

43:05Adrian Morley:One of the important parts of that place is honesty, isn't it? Yes. How important is it to be honest in the working environment?

43:13Barrie McDermott:Hugely important. Again, whether you're on the rugby pitch or in a working environment, everything's the same process behind it. You've got to be honest. You've got to have them honest chats, like we talked about, that are uncomfortable, but you sometimes have to have those chats. And it's, again, just getting comfortable in them uncomfortable situations.

43:31Adrian Morley:And, Moz, taking responsibility for your actions is ultimately going to earn you the trust from the people around you.

43:37Shaun Lunt:Without a doubt, you need to be accountable. And that's, you know, on the training field, on game day, but in the boardrooms, you know, just how you go about your business, you need to do the right things that need to be done for the sake of the big team.

43:51Adrian Morley:So anybody listening to this, lads, anybody listening to this thinking they want a positive environment, they want people around them that are contributing to the direction that they want to go forward in.

44:01Shaun Lunt:What advice can you give them? You've got to be close, you've got to be tight. I mean, try and get yourself out of the everyday working life. If it's your family, have experiences away. But the more time you can spend each other's company, it's only going to be beneficial for the team. And going on the company, it's very important,

44:21Barrie McDermott:the company that you surround yourself with. You choose them wisely. Yes, because again, you might have some negative influences and there could be just that little devil just chirping away, chirping away, and they'll probably, again, they want you to do what they want to do. And again, going back to the team, it's that selfless acts. You're doing stuff to better other people rather than yourself.

44:43Adrian Morley:And then lastly, how important is communication in the working environment and particularly listening to others?

44:49Barrie McDermott:Especially from our background, when you're communicating, and you've got to communicate different to other people. Again, respect their needs, respect their boundaries and be mindful the way that you deliver it because the way that you might get the best out of someone is maybe give them a bit of a grilling and pump them up, whereas the next person might go in the shell and go down. So you've got to know the individual.

45:13Shaun Lunt:Yeah, totally agree. You've got to know your individuals, you've got to know the strengths of each team member, the weaknesses and work on that. and, you know, as a team, together, everyone achieves more, Barry.

45:29Adrian Morley:Well, we got there, didn't we? The dream team. We're getting a little bit better at this. Thank God, Moz, you got through it. You've had a couple of hefty days in Spain.

45:37Shaun Lunt:I have, yeah. My old mate Carlo Napolitano, best mate since we're kids. He's been to see his mum and dad in Spain.

45:44Adrian Morley:I think that's for your life story, Moz. I just said that you were slightly hungover.

45:47Barrie McDermott:Mum, you did well. You enjoyed it? Yeah, it's been really good and need a break now because he stinks of piss.

45:56Adrian Morley:Thank you for joining us on Changing Rooms, brought to you by our good friends at Lect. Remember to like and subscribe and we'll see you next time.