#54: Nathania Ong: First Singaporean to Lead the West End, And She Almost Gave Up

0:00Rachel Lim: Hi everyone, welcome to another episode of the Who We Are podcast. Today's conversation feels really special to me. On the surface, we're sitting with someone who has stepped into one of the most iconic roles in musical theatre, Apennine in Les Mis. A role about longing, about loving with your whole self and not being chosen. But the more I dug into Nathania's story, the more I realised that this isn't a story about talent. It's not even a story about making it. It's a story about the years nobody sees. The flight home after every door closes. The quiet season where you have to decide, do I keep going or do I let this go?

0:44Rachel Lim: I think whether you've ever stood on a stage or not, most of us know what it feels like to want something deeply and to wonder in the silence if we are really enough for it. Today, I don't want to just talk about the roles that she's played. I want to understand who she had to become to still be standing here. Nathania, I'm so glad to have you. Welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here. Honestly, like, I feel so blessed. I think the last time I was here for a prolonged period of time was really 2023. So it's been almost three years, I would say, since I've actually, you know, gotten to experience, you know, the day-to-day, normal, chill, mundane life of being in Singapore.

1:26Just like the normal stuff.

1:28Rachel Lim: Yeah. And, you know, before we go into the roles and what you've achieved, you know, I want to talk about you as a person. Let's start there. Okay. So who is Nathania Ong when no one's watching and when they know there's no pressure to perform on Beyond Stage? I think that Nathania is someone who is incredibly passionate about like random things, about like the small things, like about the taste of this particular plate of food sitting in front of me or of this really pretty outfit that I wore and I was like oh my gosh the material was so nice or like the way that the light hit it like I get really passionate about very small strange things or like oh I guess like I guess unconventional things necessarily but I think also at the same time I think Nathaniel is also very lazy she likes to relax she likes to chill out so definitely a lot of that she's someone who loves music, who didn't necessarily grow up with musical theatre, but actually really loves R &B and pop and that whole side of things.

2:31So the very unheard part of her voice. Yes. And you grew up with three sisters.

2:37Rachel Lim: Yes. What was it like? You know, what did it sound like in the house? And I'm very curious. So what did it teach you then about finding your voice? I think that anyone with a lot of siblings will tell you that it's a very noisy household because there's a lot of voices trying to be heard. So I remember one distinctive memory that I have actually was all of us like sat in the car. So my dad included. My mom's like not really a singer. She's, if anything, her pitching is not very good. So she doesn't sing as much. But all of us were all sat in the car. We all have very distinctive, articulate tastes in music.

3:17And we all sang five different songs simultaneously in the car.

3:22Rachel Lim: And no one refused to give in. No, no one was giving way. Everyone was just singing like in their own world. But it's like, we can hear you. We can hear everyone in this car right now. So that was one very distinctive memory I had of that. That was so fun. That sounded so fun. So fun. Honestly, growing up with siblings, I wouldn't change it for the world. I feel for only children. Because I feel like you learn so much as well by having all of those siblings. I'm the youngest of all of them. So I was very fortunate in the fact that they lived so many experience and gave me advice as I was growing up.

3:54So I've always had people looking out for me and I've just been so fortunate and always had that safety net for myself. And you know, your dad was also your vocal coach. Yeah.

4:05Rachel Lim: And I read that, you know, you said that he was tough on you, especially growing up and when you were much younger. What do you think you understand about that season in your life now That perhaps back then you didn't see it? I think that at the time, he was like my first, first vocal coach So I'm talking when I was 10 years old And how did he become your vocal coach? Because he saw something in you and he wanted to nurture that? So I think that he always knew that I could sing from a young age So he grew up in church as well, singing for this a cappella group So you got it from your daddy? I did.

4:39I got it from my dad. Yeah, I definitely, definitely got it from my dad. He is incredibly talented. His voice is amazing. And at the time, he was kind of in this acapella group, my third sister. She's three years older than me. And she was learning this song for this end of year kindergarten performances. I was probably in like nursery or something. I think I was like three years old. okay and so she was practicing she was practicing i think apparently as a child i was very gung-ho so i went to this entire group of like semi-professional a cappella singers who were doing tight 13 part harmonies and all of that and i was saying oh i want to sing i want to sing i want to sing and i sang verse chorus verse chorus repeat chorus finish and then everyone was like clapping clapping clapping clapping clapping but they were like how did she know that How did she memorize all of that?

5:31The lyrics, the music, the notes and everything. And then apparently when one of the people who was quite musical, she's in the industry, Auntie Babes, she went and she played a note on the keyboard and everyone went, what? They were like, that was, it was the exact key that I was hearing in the car. And so they were like, okay, she has something. At three. At three. I didn't even know that. And to be honest, I think my pitching was probably better than it is.

5:59Rachel Lim: because I still make like a few bum notes here and there but then I hear and I'm like oh I know that's wrong like it's not it's not anything um so I think I just had a very strong sense of a good relative pitch from from that age um in terms of how my dad actually became my singing teacher he wasn't gonna force me into singing just because he knew that I could sing from that age I had to actually want to do it and he gave you that choice he did he did I think I what is so fortunate about my siblings and I and the way that my parents had raised us is they they didn't really care about you know like whether you earn the most money in the world or like this that the other they were just like make sure that you work hard and that you that you enjoy what you do like we want you to enjoy life that is so beautiful it's so healthy I was so I honestly I don't think that I would get to do what I did or I don't know where I would be if my parents weren't so supportive of what I do at this current point.

6:55Rachel Lim: At what point growing up did you discover that, oh my God, like I love this so much and I'm really good at it. Because I think a lot of us love singing, but maybe we should keep it to our bathrooms, you know, and not like... I sing some things that I also think you should be staying in the bathroom, don't worry, don't worry. Definitely not. But so at which point did you realize that maybe, maybe I'm really good at this? It was when I was about 10 years old and I did a talent time in MGS. They were split into like primary and secondary category. And I was primary four. And I was preparing for the competition.

7:28And that's when my dad started teaching me because he said, well, if you're going to compete for it, then you better do it well.

7:34Rachel Lim: He was like, don't embarrass yourself. I was like, Uncle Kevin, please. Yeah, so I went ahead. He was very, very meticulous in his teaching. And I think at the time it was very intensive for a 10-year-old because I wasn't used to that kind of rigor. And he would really go like line by line for each song. He was like, let's try out different variations, different phrasings. And so I did that, like, sometimes I was getting frustrated because I was like, I don't know what you want. Like, I don't understand. At the end of the day, all of those teachings and all of that preparation really kind of instilled in my mind, like, the perfectionist aspect of me.

8:18but ironically considering how perfectionistic I was for a really long period in terms of singing growing up I think now I'm realizing that it's very much less about perfection and it's more about authenticity and about honesty and about living the truth of what you're singing then did you also end up pursuing also this path as you grew up so I actually I I won that competition there's a happy end to the story I know

8:48Rachel Lim: to daddy that helped you honestly I needed that teaching as well I needed that like meticulous detail that he instilled in me because I still do it but I use it as the starting point of making sure that I have my formula in place and then from there then I can play really that reminds me also at the end of the day it's not just about who's most talented it's also who's willing to put in the hard work and to go through the grind right Yeah. So then you won the competition and I won this competition. So that's when you realize that maybe there's something in me. I think it was amazing because I felt like it was the first time other people had seen that.

9:34And I finally had something concrete to put to the fact that I can sing. I can sing and I'm a good performer. Whereas, you know, when I was young, I was just singing and it was just fun. And people, you know, people can say whatever they want. But I was like, now I have this award. I've never gotten an award before, not for anything. And so because of that, I was like, I was just chasing. I'm still chasing that high of winning that competition when I was 10. Since 10, wow.

10:00Rachel Lim: And bring us to when you also decided to pursue this in your, beyond the teenage years as well, right? And then, yeah, tell us about those days. So I actually performed with this performing arts school all the way up until I was 14 years old. And then there was a small dispute that happened with my manager at the time. And because of that, I ended up stopping performing. And I just took a break entirely from singing from everything. And then I just did competitive cheerleading for a number of years. And I think over that period is also when I became captain of that team. What can you not do, Natty?

10:43Oh, a lot of things. I really, I struggle to dress myself on some days. So we can not deal with that. Come on.

10:52Rachel Lim: So you became captain of the cheerleading team. I'm sure you must have learned so much. So much. About leadership, about rigor, about passion, teamwork, everything. That period actually in particular was integral to me, not as the singer and performer Natty, but really as a human being I just learned so much about myself and I learned what I was capable of and I learned that I was more than just a performer more than just a singer I loved it I loved that such an early stage of your life you got to also discover different facets of yourself and you're not just tied to one identity no I really do feel like it was in you know someone meant to be yeah it was meant to be I feel and also like there is a happy end to this story of me like having that dispute with the manager previously because we've reconciled as well since then and she's like I do think that she's wonderful and she has a lot of really amazing things going on and truly it's like life is happening for us yes not to us even though we might not be able to see it there and exactly so I actually ended up appealing in for something that I'd never done in my life drama I'd never really acted I had to audition I was nervous I was like well I don't know what's gonna to have them but okay i basically came up with a list of songs i went to my teacher and i asked her oh like what is the best one so it was between two okay so one was gonna be a few songs from cats the musical and i was gonna do it in an acrobatic style because i had that cheerleading background as well and then the other one was like well i have this song but i genuinely don't think i can sing it like it it looks impossible and then she said she chose to do that one and i I was like what if I can't sing it she was like you'll sing it so I really like I practiced a lot for that one because it's really agility is is a little bit crazy my goodness so you performed that so I did perform for the Cambridge Judgment Day yes yes the Judgment Day is how I would call it yeah I did do that um and then I ended up well to be totally yeah I mean I guess to be totally candid like the the dep drama elective program as an a-level subject was the only thing i got an a for for my a levels that is so awesome were you surprised um i mean surely you were very happy but were you surprised i think that like you just never really know because you never really even in auditions even now when i'm auditioning i never know what they're looking for and you can do the best audition in the world and get a rejection yeah but you or you could do like something you thought it was kind of it's kind of meh but then they say oh we we want you for the part and so you go whoa okay like I was hoping for it and I think that at the time I just had to like throw all of my expectations out the window because you just never really know and yeah and I did end up getting the A and so I think that that was at that point where I was like okay this is maybe maybe there's something there maybe this is something I want to pursue then especially since the other subjects aren't so great.

13:55So what happened after that? So after that, I was very, again, still somehow quite gung-ho. I had it in me. And so I said, okay, I'm going to go and I'm going to audition for all of these drama schools overseas, all in the UK. And you applied for five. Five different schools. And I applied for straight acting.

14:16Rachel Lim: What do you mean by that? For those of who may not understand. So with straight acting, I think they lean more towards like scene work. And they do teach little bits of music, but their primary focus is really in scene work, acting, all of those things. But then you also have musical theatre, which has scene work inside as well. But you have a really strong, like leveled balance of all of the three. So you learn your dancing, your singing and your acting. In my head, I knew that I wasn't the strongest actor in the world. And so because of that, I was like, okay, well, if I can do the singing aspect, then I want to get better at the acting thing.

14:49I want to throw myself into something that I'm not as good at. So I went and I auditioned for all of these acting schools, like these big, like two, three thousand applicant schools, which will take... From all over the world. Yeah, from all over the world. And they'll take like... A fraction. A fraction. Probably maybe even less than a fraction. It was like, I think their classes, some of them are like 20 students in like a pool of three thousand applicants. Oh my gosh. So those are the kind of levels that you're competing with. And I booked a month-long trip there because I was like, okay, well, if I go, then I was planning it out in my head.

15:24I was like, I need to make time for like the next few rounds as well. There were no next few rounds. Oh no, so you came back one week later. Yeah, pretty much. So I received the majority of my rejections in the first week that I got, that I touched down. The plane touched down, the wheels, everything. Went for all of those auditions and it was an entirely new world because they are cutthroat there. And I was 18 years old and I'd never experienced anything like that in my life. So I was like, oh, this is it. So not just first week, some of them half a day. I'm like, well, it's 11 a.m. I'm going to I'm going to go get a coffee or something.

15:58Yeah, I remember distinctly I was sat on a balcony at a friend's house who was very like, fortunately, let me stay over at theirs. And I was like crying and it was overlooking the Thames. And I was like, oh, my gosh, I was like, I don't think I'll ever I'll ever be able to do something like this again I don't know how I'm going to recover from this pretty much what was it like you know on the flight home on that flight I literally sat there and I was like I was like I will never do that again I was like I can't put myself through this I can't put myself through that again that was awful and I literally sat there and I was crying I think anytime you experience anything like that you just it's all of like the bad voices in your head that tell you like that you're not good enough that you'll never amount to anything so you have all of these all of these things, all of these voices.

16:44And it hurt. It really hurt. I think very fortunately, obviously, those moments are also those moments. And it's how you recover from those moments. And so I hadn't fully recovered at the time. But like, I had a little bit of recovery, where I had my audition for LaSalle still booked in. And I said, okay, well, I really messed up on all of all of these other auditions, I was really nervous and I couldn't perform the way that I wanted to perform them. So let me, I was like, I can sit here and I can cry about it and I can be really sad or I can pick myself up. I can practice like to high heaven and do all of the intensive work that I can do and do my best for this audition and just let them say what they say.

17:30And so I did that. So I cried for the day that I touched down.

17:34Rachel Lim: And then the next day, my eyes puffing, puffing, swollen. I was like still in like a baggy t-shirt and like baggy shorts. And I was like, couldn't even dress myself. But I was like, I was like, okay, let's get to work. And I still think that till this day, I think that was the hardest period of my life that I had to go through because it was the least faith that I had in myself because I had nothing else to look to. but at that point so what did you tell yourself to pick yourself up and to find that courage and strength to try again when the world rejects you like that I think the there were a few things I think there was the logistical part of my brain that was saying you've already paid the bill it's it's there and but I think that because I was on that flight and because I was so broken I think it was it was actually now that you mention it I think it was part of my dad's training of the fact that I was sat there crying with like going through each individual line so it was almost like I was in a haze like my brain was like I know that when I was working through those periods my brain was not in it but my body moved and was saying like oh but my dad said like my dad said Like it has to be the best that it can be So I was like Let me just like Get cracking and start working So my heart wasn't in it at all But you just showed up I showed up So I did it I was like Well I don't know what the outcome is going to be But at the same time I was like I just need to like Forget about it Wash my hands of it And go eat a slice of cake So that's what I did And the results came out Yeah And then I got in On the day?

19:15Not on the day Not on the day But I think maybe a few weeks later Yeah And so I did that And then I went And I was just like, oh, amazing. Well, I get this wonderful experience in the acting course. And I can improve my acting and do all of this stuff. And so I went and I was like, well, I have a three-year course there. So I was like, so I can do that. And then I can go into the industry. And then that's going to be that. So that's all I had in my head. I was like, okay, I'm just going to stay here because I'm learning so much. Like, this is it. I'm prepared. I'm prepared to stay here and to do this.

19:47and then my my best friend came up to me like nearing the end of that of that whole period so i was telling her i was like you know i'm actually having a really good time i think that i might just might just stay here and i might just do these three years and she said but didn't you want to go to the uk and i was like i was like yeah i did but i was like by but i feel like that's that that ship's gone like i can't like i already i tried that i tried that route and it didn't work and she said yeah she was like it didn't work that time she was like you're not gonna try again and And I was like, oh, I mean, I'm having a really good time here and I'm really enjoying it.

20:19And I'm really comfortable here as well, actually, because now I found my rhythm. She was like, you wanted to do that for so long. Why are you like she was like, are you are you going to let this stop you now? So she she convinced me to go take another shot. And I said, OK, I'm going to do that. I was like, let me let me have I was like, let me have a look. But I'm not going to be dumb like last time. And I'm not going to fly for a bunch of first round auditions where where the chances are so slim. I'm not going to do that again because I need to be smarter you're wiser now yeah yeah and then also I was like my parents paid for my previous mistake I don't want my parents to pay for my mistake this time around so because of that I ended up picking up three part-time jobs at the same time because I didn't want them to pay for anything I've just picked up a bunch of part-time jobs I earned a bunch of money and I paid for my flight um I like I couch soft while I was over in the UK for a little bit stayed at like some I didn't even know these girls but they were like Singaporeans who were who were graduates like alma mater of my previous school and I did I learned as well that I wasn't going to apply for straight acting even though now even though now I had this wonderful foundation that I'd learned from from LaSalle I was going to apply for musical theater the thing that I had a slightly higher chance of getting in for so I looked through all of the audition and I missed all of them except for one school so that was so I only wanted to audition for schools that auditioned in Singapore and the only school that was left was Mountview and this was the first time that they actually auditioned in Singapore as well a few months later and then about a month before the audition they invite you for a final round audition so a penultimate round where they had three days of auditions over that finals period.

22:09So they would have two days where it was split into boys' auditions with local and internationals. So you'd have two time slots, one first half of the day, one second half of the day. Second day was women. I was like, I have to do this. I was like, oh my gosh, I was doing my final year show for LaSalle. So I went, I spoke to my course director and I was like, I'm so honest. I have to be so honest. I've actually, I went for an audition. I cheated on you. Let me just come clean. I cheated on you.

22:41Rachel Lim: I was like, I swear that I'll do better in the future. It was all of this. I was like... But I have a problem because... It clashes. It clashes. So it was four acts. And then my flight, I think, was 11 p.m. that night. Which means I have to be at the airport at nine, right? So they were like, okay... what we can do for you is we can do three acts of the play, get cut from the fourth act of the play. That's the best we can do for you. And I was like, I'll take it. So I did that. So I did three acts of that play. Out of four. Out of four. And before the show even finished, before that curtain call even happened, I ran, I met my dad, I jumped into the car, went down, checked in, was like sweating, couldn't sleep the entire flight.

23:27And then I landed. The UK is eight hours behind Singapore. I landed two hours before my audition. I arrived at my accommodation two hours before the audition and then slept for an hour, had a bite to eat and then went straight in. And I only made it because it was the afternoon set. I couldn't make the morning set. And then I finished that and I was like, that was terrible. I was like, mom, a bit teary. I was like, I don't think I'm going to get recalled. But my mom got faith lah. So she actually bumped into the guy who auditioned. He's the industry liaison for Mountview for that school. And he was the one who auditioned me in Singapore.

24:08And he saw me in the, because there's a bar at the bottom of the hostel that I was staying at. And then so saw him. And then my mum said, she was like, I have a good feeling about that. I was like, mum, don't speak to me. Please, please, please. Mummies know. No, I know. And then I got through. And then I, because they email you, they don't tell you on the spot for that one. And then next day, final round audition. and then like don't hear anything and then so I was LaSalle was was was still there at the back of my head so I did that I had this um like drama theory I guess paper that I had to write and then the Sunday was when I was flying off and I was sat there and I was rushing my my paper and I get a call to pick up hello and then after he was like hi this is Stephen Jameson from from I was like

24:55Rachel Lim: hi um uh hi it's so nice to to to hear from you he was like i just want to thank you so much for taking the time and off the back you must have been holding your breath i was holding because i'm holding my breath i was like i was like i was like so much money so much time so much stress please tell me yeah and he was just like and i would i'm pleased to be able to offer you a place in in our school and I was I was literally like oh thank thank you so much I was that's so nice of you um I just couldn't speak I just couldn't speak of course of course yeah wow put down the phone I was like closes the laptop I didn't even close it I was like I just went the end and then I closed it that was it I honestly I think out of all even all of the auditions that I've done until this day, that moment was my greatest triumph, really.

25:52Why do you think so? Because I think that it's not just the successes. The successes are wonderful. Like getting to play all of these fantastic roles is amazing. But I think that for me, the thing that the point of the most growth that I ever had was between that 18 to 19 years old. Yeah. Because I was really, I think it was - You were tested. I was really tested. I really, I really did almost give up because I was just like, I just, I was like, I'm not, I really thought I was nothing. And I think that there's a lot of people as well, like for every one person that is, that is a big fan of you that will, that will tell you that you're amazing, especially when you have nothing.

26:36There's a lot of people who will just say that Who will either be inconsequential Or like unfeeling towards whatever you're doing Or even worse They tell you that they just don't They think that you should retrain Or they don't believe in you Or that they don't think that you can make a living Or that there's a life for you in that Especially for something that's so subjective Right?

26:57Rachel Lim: Yeah What do you think that period of your life Taught you about yourself? Resilience, really And I think that I needed that to prepare for the industry that I've gone into. Absolutely. Because even now, even after all of these, even no matter how many roles you've taken on, no matter how many roles you've played, you still get rejection after rejection after rejection. Because you'll never be right for every role under the sun. Yeah. So how do you deal with those setbacks now? I'm sure your skin must have gotten thicker Right? Where you're also more hardy To withstand all of this like Rejections To be able to pick yourself up and go again So what do you tell yourself?

27:44I think that what I tell myself Is that Well now I fortunately have this on me To be able to say But you've done it before You can do it again I'm like this is no different and what is for you will not pass you by. Those are the things that I tell myself every time now. And that gives you the strength to just try and to go again.

28:10Rachel Lim: What do you hold on to in your hardest seasons? Whether is it the time when you're in London all alone without family or going through different challenges and struggles where you get rejected in different forms by different people that you don't get to really talk about or share with people with. I think that when I go through hard times for myself, what really comforts me is the fact that don't do it for me. Do it for them. Do it for the family that I have back home who believed in me when no one believed in me. And they do. And they do believe in me. And so I think that that is really what keeps me going.

28:53I have some big fans here. And they are my biggest supporters. They will fly to watch me, to see me in shows. And to be honest, I think now, not just my family, but even like randomly, oddly enough, the random, some random fans. Like, I just like even the idea that like some like what I do brings them joy. Yeah.

29:18Rachel Lim: You know, I was watching you also on YouTube, the performance that you gave as Eponine on Les Mis. I must tell you that I was in tears Watching you Oh my god Yes Thank you Yes And I'm just watching you in awe Firstly, I'm so incredibly proud of you To represent Singapore On a global stage And secondly I am in awe and admiration of you It's just like watching you living in your zone of genius And in flow And it's almost like this is your destiny And you're meant to do it what does it feel like and you can also tell us a little bit more about you know what it's like to be eponine in les mis so you know that that bit about the rejections that i was telling you so funny enough this is a teeny tiny it won't take long tiny tidbit of information but i have also been rejected from les mis and from hamilton which previously which you still secured in the end yes yeah yeah so i've actually so even though i've done so i've so now i'm obviously i've played eponine for a long time but i have also been rejected from that and i've also been rejected from hamilton which i also ended up playing and both of those times when i got rejected were for smaller parts in the shows but i think that um one thing that i've really learned and i learned this from um the is it not how to be human there's a there's a there's a podcast on like tedx or something okay um and basically i listened to one one of those podcasts i need to listen to this one now because I feel like now I'm super intrigued about like all of the other guests you've had on um uh but I literally there was this one thing which was how to get comfortable with rejection and the one piece of advice that I gleaned from that was that rejection is not always and is not a no to you and your entirety and your entire being because I think the problem is is that a lot of times when we get rejections, the reason why it hurts so much is because it feels personal and because we attach so much of our self-worth to what we do, whereas we are not just what we do.

31:32And so when you learn to detach your self-worth from the rejections that you receive, they hurt so much less because you say, oh, they just didn't like this one aspect. And because also sometimes you don't get the reasons for the rejection. It could have been anything. It could have been because you were too short. It could have been because your hair was slightly too long because you forgot to do your nails. Sorry, don't look. Yeah, so it can be really any number of reasons. And also the other thing to remember with a rejection when they tell you no, sometimes it's not no, sometimes it's not yet.

32:09So I think those are the two comforting factors that I take on when I get a rejection. I love that.

32:14Rachel Lim: And so that gave you also the strength and courage to then audition again, which eventually led you to... Yeah, pretty much. For example, Eponine and Les Mis. Yes. How was it like playing the role? And what was it like when you were first told that you got accepted for that? Oh my gosh. Bring us back with you. I, firstly, I love playing the role. I think that Eponine was a really amazing, because it's one of the first few roles that I played professionally. and it was one of the best um I think that it was it came at a really good time because I think as an actress now I've grown to be able to transform a little bit more but the way that Eponine is I think that it she really like is very close to my resting energy whereas I think Eliza's like a completely other like out of this world not even remotely attached to me And I think I'd like to believe that one of the reasons why that particular video of Eponine got so much attention.

33:17The one that I watched on YouTube? Yes. Okay. Yeah. Is because it was so, I guess, like compliment and criticism that I receive a lot from that video is that it's so raw. It's so emotional. It's too emotional. but the thing is is that when I took on the role of Eponine I never want to like I I recognize like and I have so much respect for Lea Salonga for Samantha Bucks like the people who have come before me who have like I mean they are incredible like they are they are big stars and they have really been trailblazers and they paved the way for for so many of us but I also know that I'm not them and I will never be them so what I wanted to do for myself is I wanted to be the best version of myself that I could be I love that self-assuredness because it took a while

34:09Rachel Lim: it took a long time how did you get there because I can imagine it will be so tempting to just emulate what the successful eponine was yeah I I think that and I think that a lot of the a lot of the um notes that I got when I first talked on the role of eponine was exactly that they said oh eponine needs to be prettier because you need to give her a reason as to why as like she needs to be like an equal to to cosette so you wonder why he chose cosette over eponine but i the thing is is that i guess maybe it was an artistic difference but i i don't view her as that because yes she she might be really beautiful but she's also someone who is like probably has no teeth probably um she was literally like she was beaten she was abused by her father the moment like things went downhill for them she was raised in in darkness and was even oftentimes or at least the way that it was described to me uh when like this is the kind of girl who sleeps with a knife under her bed, who even at times when, you know, because of the darkness of her family and all of that, even at times was used as barter, like her body was used for barter, for deals, negotiations, whatever.

35:33And so she is not someone who has any kind of softness to her. She's rough, she's hard, she's dirty, she's like ugly. Even if like her features were nice, she's not. she's not beautiful yeah and so I just so I guess like in that sense that was what I wanted I was like she like in the book it's described that when she speaks her voice is completely hoarse from screaming from shouting and so for me when I do this part and I think that that's one reason why it's it's very dividing like my interpretation is very dividing for a lot of people because she's not beautiful and she's not a pretty song she is ugly yeah and so those were what i was and that is what makes her so tragic is because her love for marius is pure and when she sings that song on my own it's not just about a song about unrequited love it's not just that simple it's also the idea that she had this one inkling of kindness shown to her and that's why she's so obsessed with him because he's the only person who's been kind to her in recent years and that kindness no longer belongs to her and can't even belong to her even in her mind because there's a real obstacle in the way now which is cassette that's my interpretation that's beautiful and

36:54Rachel Lim: thank you for sharing that because then it gives us so much more like context and perspective when we watch you perform the role and it sounds like such a heavy thing to take on or to really like switch on before you step on stage, especially, you know, during the back-to-back performances. You've also shared that, you know, this role has really changed your life. How has it changed your life and what do you think it has also cost you? I think that this role has allowed me to grow in confidence, definitely. I think, like, getting to play, like, one of the, a principal role for the first time was amazing.

37:32It really, really was um and i think that what what she has cost me in every performance that i take on we talk about stakes when you sing a song what makes makes a song what makes a song exciting is usually the idea that it has high stakes and so what it costs you to sing that is very much a day-to-day argument i think because sometimes you can give a little bit more sometimes you literally don't have the capacity um like I think especially over that over that period when that video had come out yeah I received a lot of love like so much love but equally as as there is a lot of love there is also a lot of people who don't love you as much and I think that that really um like made me a bit fearful I watched it for the first time and then I didn't watch it I didn't watch it again for another three years.

38:28That video, as much as it did hurt, it also like changed my life. And now when I look back on it in hindsight, I look on it with pride. But I think that at the time, I couldn't see that. I couldn't see the pride. I could only see the negative. To be honest, I think if I was a little bit smarter, I think I would have ridden the wave of that video a little bit better than I did. But I think at the time, I think mentally, I just couldn't. I couldn't take it.

38:53Rachel Lim: How did you write through the wave of that period? oh um well I developed stage fright because you were fearful of what people would say I think I was scared of what people were thinking and of like the judgment that people had on me I'm fortunate enough that it never got me to the point that it crippled me but I just in terms of like the like feeling the anxiety I just faced like around like a month period where every time I stepped on stage to sing on my own my heart was like racing and I start forgetting the words at the beginning but then I just take a really deep breath and then I'd lock in and then I'd go oh and then I then I just sing and I think that for myself what what was very fortunate for me during that period is I was not singing as me Nathania was not singing Eponine was singing so you channel Eponine yes I was so what helped me was really attaching like my song to the truth of what I was singing rather than rather than being like oh it's Nathaniel's yeah it would yeah and I mean it never was yeah but I think that what really helped to root me was that was that idea how do you pick yourself up there and then to continue I think you've literally just said it we have this term uh that I don't know I don't know who started it But it's a term that's just around the industry.

40:17But it's called cancel and continue. You can't change the past. So just cancel any thoughts you have on what you've just done. Don't think about it because then you'll forget the next thing. And then just continue. That's all you can do. Because that moment's gone. But what can you do for the future?

40:33Rachel Lim: Yeah. And it's such a mental practice that I think is so important in life. Because sometimes we tend to dwell. Or then we freeze up. And we're like, oh my god, you know, this is bad. And then it affects the rest of the game or the performance for you. Yeah, so thank you for sharing that. I think that is so inspiring, you know, for us to also know that. Firstly, you're human. And you do forget the lyrics even after, you know, performing for a while. The more you do it, the more you forget. Really? Yeah. And what is your favourite, like, pre-show ritual? Or like your must-do pre-show ritual? um so i think i have i tailor my pre-show rituals to different characters okay um so for eponine i actually don't have like a proper pre-show ritual because a i performed it for so long but also b i don't think eponine would would would take care of herself that well so in my head i actively don't do anything and also i but i find that i get really influenced by smells and so like like sense memory like triggers triggers me a lot so when I play epony and I have to like make sure that I don't have perfume or anything that's like heavily scented that I can actively smell whereas for Eliza I would like I would have like different like essential oils and like a humidifier I would have this lavender scented perfume for myself that I would tailor because you really already start channeling the character before you get on stage yeah i i think i think for myself or it's like it just just at least for those for that for that little bit before um for concerts it's a little bit different i have a concert coming up at the end of this year as well yeah um so um it's not these exact stories but it's quite i think what was amazing about when you actually sent the when you sent the the request through with all of the with all of what you were what you were hoping to talk about was it's so aligned with the message with the kind of message that I'm trying to put through with this concert that I'm doing it's something that's really close to my heart the concert is called Honest based on a song that I'm an original song that I've written that I'm I'm really hoping to debut hey you might not like the song but I feel like I feel like people need to make that make their own own minds up with that one um but that's going to be running on the 11th of September to the 13th it's really short run really small intimate space as well it's going to be at the KC Arts Center home of SRT and what I do for a concert is I just need an emergency full fat coke just in case no zero just no zero no less sugar everything why though what is it that it does for you I feel like if I can't sing there is some magic in that that will like magically make me sing it's really only if i can't sing yeah i really really and then i suddenly can sing again we all need to try that yeah and you know i'm so curious you know um netty if you were to go back to the younger you who had been rejected multiple times back then when you first tried out the auditions in drama school in london and you're sitting on that plane totally dejected and like you said you know feeling so affected like almost not not knowing if this is what you're meant to do and not knowing who you are what would you go back to her to tell her I think I have two things which is one thing was uh is is more of a reminder of something that my dad used to tell me when i was younger because obviously like even like even though you're young and even though you have like that like gung-ho-ness about you like it's hard to it's hard to gain confidence in yourself to do something and to and to make yourself vulnerable by putting yourself on a stage in front of people So he would always tell me, you don't have to be confident.

44:36You just have to act confident. And so that was one thing. And that's kind of what I did for the LaSalle audition. And then the second thing is listen to your best friend and listen to your family because they're just looking out for you.

44:49Rachel Lim: Wait, no, I think you have to first have a good best friend. Have a good best friend for us. Right. Make good friends. Yes, make good friends and choose your friends wisely. because it just so happened that you had an environment around you that truly also helped you to achieve and get to where you are today. Yeah, and I think that is so beautiful a reminder. And thank you so much for, you know, being here and sharing your story. And if there's anything else, you know, if someone who is watching you, who is also really wanting to pursue his or her dreams and passions, what would you say to them?

45:21I think if at first you don't succeed, try, try again. I think that's one thing. Your self-worth is not defined by what you do. Your self-worth is defined by who you are.

45:37Rachel Lim: That's what I would have to say. And how would you describe who you are? Who I am? Yes. Oh, I think I would describe myself as someone who loves very deeply, who cares very deeply about the people who she chooses to surround herself with and someone who really likes food. I love that and thank you so much for the reminder because it's almost like even if the roles disappear one day for you and even if the stage disappears one day for you, you come back to knowing who you are and the people who matter to you the most. thank you so much Natty for being here and for being Singapore's Pride we are so incredibly proud of you and we are so happy that you're going to be back for more as well so for those of us who are interested to follow you and your journey, where can we find you?

46:23you can find me at Natty Ong on Instagram well Natty, thank you so much I had such a good time speaking with you thank you so much for having me thank you

46:38Thank you.