Choose Impact Over Ambition: Novonesis CEO Ester Baiget

0:00A CNBC original podcast. In 2019, Ester Baiget made a decision that would change the course of her career. After 25 years at Dow, where she'd built a senior global career, she chose to leave. It was a very difficult decision, really difficult decision, because I left the company that I love. But Baiget wasn't chasing a title. I didn't need to be a CEO. What pulled her to Novozymes was the chance to make a bigger impact. She saw purpose, potential and a company that she believed she could help. I got captivated by Novo, by its purpose. I could not understand why the company was not growing. And then I knew I could make an impact.

0:41Once in the role, Beget began to shift how the company saw itself, not just as an enzyme business, but as a biosolutions company. That change helped make the merger with Danish biotech company Christian Hansen possible. We were not an enzyme company. where I'm going to give you what you need and answer to your problems with biology as a tool. Bridget's rule of thumb? Choose impact over ambition. It's impact to your soul. It's the big impact. Something that makes you feel complete. And my job gives me that. These are Esther Bridget's executive decisions.

1:22I had known you for several years. as a great CEO, but I don't know much about you as a person. And I know it's not in your comfort zone to talk about yourself. You're amazingly eloquent talking about your company. But this is a great opportunity for me and our listeners and our viewers to learn a little bit more about the amazing leader that you are. Tell me a little bit about where you come from. I know that you're Spanish. I know that you went to university at Tarragona, but I don't know anything else about your upbringing. Thank you. Thank you, Steve, for this beautiful introduction. Tell me more about who you are and where you're coming from.

2:00I'm Spanish. I'm Catalan, too. I'm both. I'm very Catalan. Actually, we speak Catalan at home. I'm from the Mediterranean. I was grown in front of the sea with the mountains behind. I'm from a family of five. I have four siblings. I'm the oldest. I'm from a good family. Our parents raised us with the biggest gift that you can give to kids, which is lots of love and love and fights, but with respect. Respect for the elderly, respect for the grandparents, respect for the society, respect for nature. We are not a very wealthy family. My parents worked. We had everything we needed, but they always invested on us, on education.

2:49They put us on the best schools. We had access to English teachers, tutors, mentors, sports, capabilities, ballet. And I think that that's something I'm very, maybe from everything we're going to talk about, the areas that I'm proud, probably the one that I'm most proud, it's my family, my extended family. Still today, we are very best friends and fight and discuss. It's a gift from my parents on the way that we raise us up. I don't want to jump forward decades to the present day, but I know already talking to your team how loved you are and what a caring leader you are. Does that dictate a lot of the decisions you make?

3:28When you are in any role, probably the most difficult thing, it is not making the decisions. Making decisions is very easy. You have the data, and the data tells you, tells you, points you on what is the right answer. What is the beauty here is not on making the decision. The beauty is on making the questions that you will have the relevant information to be able to make the best decision. Best decisions, they come also with what is going to drive value long term. And it's not at any price. And when you have the privilege to work like I do in a company that people is your most precious asset, because it's true, of course, we have amazing R &D capabilities and 10 ,000 patents and a global asset footprint and a great relationship with the customers.

4:13But what makes the difference is the human element. So it's naturally that when you're making decisions, you want to protect what is so unique and what is so strong. So those 11 ,000 employees are more important to you than the 10 ,000 patents, the 100 ,000 microbial strains. It's the employees that matter most to you. It's what's going to make a difference for the future too. And it's not only the 11 ,000 already employees. It is your capability to attract the very best talent in the world. that in a world of AI, in a world of democratization of technology, in a world of access and speed, people is what's going to make the difference.

4:57It's that human touch, that capability to making the questions to the customer on what is important for you. The capability of connecting that on how can R &D translate that in a new molecule. That human element, it's only happening when you hire the best people and when you have an environment that people can thrive, that there is trust, that there is friction, that there is empowerment, that there is a future. There's two Esthers I'm interviewing here. There's the one who is talking about her company, who finds it so easy to do so. And I see your eyes light up. I can literally see your eyes lighting up when you're talking about your company and your passion.

5:34And then there's the very considered, not quite so sure Esther, who's talking about herself as well. Why, given this amazing confidence that your family gave you and this loving, nurturing, safe environment, I keep coming back to that word, but that's what's coming across to me. You're so good. Why is that so uncomfortable for you, who's such an inspiring person with so much love around, and I'm sure you're allowed to make many, many mistakes as well. Oh, yeah. I make plenty of mistakes. We all make mistakes, and it's not the problem making mistakes. It's how big they are and how fast you turn.

6:09Mistakes is not a problem. But why do you find it so difficult to talk about yourself? To speak about myself? It's not difficult. It's just private. Yeah. It is not difficult at all. Sure. But I know so many CEOs who, look, you don't get to being a CEO without being a very powerful personality. You can have so many different qualities. And this series has shown me the amazing different qualities that CEOs have. But many CEOs I know give a cultured version of, I did this, I did this, I did this. You haven't even done that. It's like, I know you went to university. I know you did 25 years at Dow Chemical.

6:42I know nothing else. It's magic. How did it happen? Yeah. Oh, maybe it's not so interesting, but it was fun for me, the journey. Yes, I started chemical engineering. I also did an MBA. I worked 25 years in Dow, and then I moved to Nobunesse, so that's it. But maybe to your question, the common path or the common ethos among all these steps or milestones, it was curiosity, eagerness, hunger to learn. Being surrounded of people who really gets the best out of you. People that challenges you. People that makes you think. This click that you get in your brain when somebody makes an amazing thought that you would never have been able to come with that by yourself.

7:37And then impact. It's a combination of curiosity and learn and grow, not only professionally, but for sure as an individual from knowledge. But then with capabilities or with the capability to translate that into something meaningful. Of course, the impact is the revenue and the growth and the profitability, but it's much more than that. It's impact to your soul. It's the big impact, something that makes you feel complete. And my job gives me that, but also for sure my family gives me that. Why did you choose chemical engineering? Oh, that's a very good question. Through school and through high school, I get pretty good marks.

8:23and all the teachers always were pulling from me. And I was doubting between, now you're going to laugh, but philosophy and arts and a science degree. And then this teacher, this chemistry teacher, she came to me and said, Esther, you can always pick up a book and read. You would not be able to build a lab and learn about chemistry. And I found that extremely logical and very compelling. and I applied for chemical engineering. It's an amazing metaphor for all the young people listening and watching who are trying to work out their careers. And I want to do arts. I want to do philosophy. But hang on a second.

9:05If you really want that job, maybe you need to go to something a little bit more technical. But it was not about the job. No, she didn't go on the job. She knew me. She didn't go about the job or the power or the growth. She went on to what you will learn. She went into, you can always grab a book and keep reading. You can always paint. But you will not be able to learn this unless you go to that university. So she nailed it. And she clicked on the button that made me turn into chemical engineering. But it seems very obvious to me. And again, many CEOs I've spoken to, what they studied at university is nowhere near what they ended up doing.

9:45I spoke to a very, very senior US banker on this podcast series very recently. And he did languages and became one of the most important bankers in the world. Completely different. Whereas your degree actually led to the career that you chose. So I studied chemical engineering. Once when I was done, I started working at Dow. Yeah, why Dow? So I worked at Dow in the summer after the when I finished the university as a student. And then afterwards, I left to Germany. I always was getting a scholarship to go abroad. I lived every summer. I was going somewhere with a scholarship, with some way to do a master or with some subsidiaries and be able to be abroad.

10:28And then after the three months internship in Dow as a student, I went to Munich. And I was working there in the Mechanical University of Munich. And I had the best time ever. I mean, I really thrived. I mean, it was amazing. What does that mean the best time ever? It was socially, intellectually? What was it? I don't think you have to choose. It was all of that and beyond. I was 22 years old and living abroad in an amazing university, learning a lot at work or doing my master's. And then also in a community of students that it was also a fun life after what it was work time. And then in summer, during summer, I went home.

11:10They called me when I was there from Dow if I wanted to go to work for a job. I said, no way. And then for Christmas, I went home and they called again. And my mother picked the phone. And she said, of course she's interested. I love parents. I was so mad because I was just set to go back to Germany. And I went to the interview because my mom said yes. And of course, I went to the interview. But I told her, okay, I'm going to just do the interview. And then I loved it. I was captivated with the person who interviewed me. I loved the project that they were offering. And I got the job and I told my mother, it's only one year.

11:50And when it gets boring, I'm going to leave. 25 years later. And 25 years later. So let me get this right. Your sliding doors moment, wasn't you making a big decision? It was your mother making the big decision. My mother making the interview. Well, I would like to give a little bit of credit that I made the decision myself. But it was my mom guiding me. into what it was probably the best decision I could have taken.

12:17I don't want to pry into your personal life, even though this is about learning more about you. But do your family to this day still make important contributions to your key decisions in life? They make important contributions to my soul. They give me peace. Without that, I could not do anything. You couldn't be the CEO you are No, I couldn't be anything For some people it's sport, it's literature It's driving through some other factor in their lives But for you, it's your family that gives you your soul I don't run, I don't do marathons I'm not like you, Steve I don't do any of that I'm a very plain person I cook for my family We spend an afternoon in the sofa And I'm so happy I mean, this weekend I had my mom and my two sisters visiting us in Copenhagen and we had the girly time.

13:09Yeah, this is important for me. It's really interesting, that balance as well, isn't it? That is such an important lesson for other leaders watching this as well. You can't just be workaholics. It can't just be about the company. It has to be about balance in order to give you the best opportunity to make the best decisions as a leader. Absolutely. So why did you spend 25 years at Dow? Amazing company, amazing place to be. I was there in many different jobs. I started in operations, as you said. One job led to the other, from operations to R &D. I've been in sales. I've been in marketing, in finance, in corporate strategy role.

13:48It gave me the opportunity to live in different places of the world. I lived in Asia, in the U.S., twice, and always learn, and always being surrounded by amazing individuals who were capable to connect in a dimension that I would not think. And that space, it's captivating, it's addictive. And you grow and you move from one job to the other. Not every job that I took, it was a promotion. Sometimes I take a lateral job just because it was so much fun, so much more interesting. And suddenly one day I was an executive. It happened. You didn't plan to be an executive? No. How did you plan that? No, no idea.

14:31Some people do. Some leaders I've interviewed work their way up the ladder by design. I don't know how they would do that. Maybe they could chair. I did not. Every job that I took, it was because it was a better job, different job. Many times, there's only one thing that's common on every job that I've been. I've done that job and much more. I never left the job in the way that I got it. I did what I was supposed to do, but then expended or moved somewhere else. And then that stretch is what it put it to maybe something else. Have you learned more from your successes or your failures? I would like to think I don't have big failures because - But everyone's had moments in their career where, and it comes up more often than perhaps I gave it credit for when I started this podcast, that there are moments in every CEO's, every leader's career where they think it's over.

15:28I've blown it. I've made a really big mistake. Only a podcast I was filming yesterday, the word existential crisis was mentioned by my interviewee. Have you had moments like that where you thought, I've really blown this? And if you have, could you just give us a bit of an example of what happened and how you coped with it? It cannot be more tangible. And so we just moved to US and I was in this job, amazing opportunity yes without um and um i had been there for a few months and then my family moved up after and then one after the other and things were escalating and then uh at six o 'clock in the morning when i drove to the office um my i put my badge and the gate does not open and i was like well i guess that's it yeah that happens when you screw up you're fired And then it was like, oh, I'm fired, I'm fired.

16:22And then when I was driving home, yeah, well, I guess at least my family, my husband and the kids have been able to be in the U.S. Well, now we will be able to take some time off. Yeah, it was not so bad, actually, on the way driving back. I was not in jail. I didn't have cancer. My family was in a good place. I just loved my job, which was very important for me, but not as important as everything else. And then as I was driving back home, then I was like, yeah, at least I've been here for six months. And then it was, and I got that thought. When you got the badge, they told you this is temporally and you have to go to main.

16:57And I drove back. I went to the main gate. You'd gone through this whole situation where you had, in your head, you'd made it okay. I have many great things going on in my life. I've blown my job because I've made the wrong decisions, all because of a badge that didn't work. because the gate didn't open. And I thought, I guess that happens when you piss off so many people. And that's it. I'm out. I don't suppose you can tell us what you did wrong, can you? No, it was just a misunderstanding. It was not so bad, actually, because I wasn't on fire. But what was very important, that moment, it helped me so much because it helps you that when things get wrong, many times get wrong, it's okay.

17:42It's not the end. There is always another way. The gift was don't take things out of proportion. And at the very, very worst, the worst thing that can happen to you is lose your job. This is the very worst that can happen to you. You took over as the CEO of Novozyons, as it was then, from Peter Holk Nielsen in 2019. You've already answered in this podcast that you never saw yourself as an executive. It kind of just happened. You hadn't planned for it as well. But when you took over as the CEO of Novozymes, as it was then, that was a very deliberate decision. Can you talk me a little bit through that pivotal decision to leave the company you loved and start afresh as a CEO?

18:25It was a very difficult decision. Really difficult decision. Because as you said, I left a company that I love. And the reason why I changed, it was first I got captivated by Novo. At that time, it was Novozymes. By its purpose. I mean, who does not want to make a better planet? It's like, seriously. through biology. So I got captivated by that. I got captivated by the potential of the company. I could not understand why the company was not growing. And then I knew I could make an impact. I just knew it. I knew. I knew I could help. And I knew I could make a bigger impact there. And that's what made me change.

19:05I just want to ask you this, because a lot of CEOs are magnificent women and magnificent men. And goodness knows I've had the privilege of meeting hundreds, if not thousands over the years and got to know them a lot better in this podcast series. But there is something quite egotistical about pushing yourself forward very often as a CEO. But for you, I'm not sensing that. I think you're a very rare person that actually it was about the impact rather than your career development. I didn't know. I didn't see it as a big career development. You didn't? No, I had a bigger job. I had more people reporting to me, more revenue.

19:43Yeah, Dow's a huge company. More delegation of authority. I completely underestimated how awesome the CEO job is. I completely underestimated. It didn't seem so much like I'm going to go into a much bigger job. It was, I think I can help here. And I know I'm going to enjoy this too. Just before you come out, a great friend of mine is now a CEO of a Scandinavian company. Not in your country, but in another one. And he got passed over as a role of CEO for the great company he was at. And he knew he wanted to be a CEO. He knew he could be a good CEO. And he is now. He works for a very important corporation in Scandinavia as well.

20:23But that always drove him to become the leader. For you now. No. If I would have died and never been a CEO, that would have been okay. I didn't need to be a CEO. Now you know it's an awesome job. I love it. Now I like it. Now I really like it. Come on. Why? Because there's something really marvelous about being a CEO, which is when you set direction, it happens. And you look backward and you see what you have done, how you help. And then you make two steps ahead and then suddenly you realize I have to go back and get the rest and continue. And you drive change. collectively as a group, you put your own team, you can really choose with whom are you going to work.

21:10You have a different, that role of the CEO opens different doors. This was something, I am the same person as I was, but now just because you are the CEO, you get access to different doors. You get to do awkward interviews on executive decisions. That's one of the best ones probably. But in terms of driving change and impact, you can knock to different doors and get a different level of reaction just because you have the CEO there.

21:39I think the biggest decision you've made since you were CEO is the Christian Hansen acquisition or merger, which you have very kindly spoken a lot about when you announced it on CNBC. You announced it in December 2022. Is that your biggest decision? Probably it's the one that has the biggest visibility. I would say the most important decision was right was much before that decisions we talk about the decisions are not so difficult to make it's what you work you need to do to make that decision and when we start asking our customers how can I help you not which enzyme do you want yeah that open a tremendous door and unlock value as well unlock value open possibility and that's what make the combination possible because suddenly we were not enzyme company.

22:31We were, I'm going to give you what you need and answer to your problems with biology as a tool. And that just made it obvious that Christian Hansen and Novozyns had to be together to be a stronger partner. Do you get a thrill from the deal? Do you get an adrenaline when you do something like this, when you make those big decisions? It's painful, painful, painful, painful, painful. It's a lot of work. It's a lot of thrill for the drill. It's a torturous path going from the deal, negotiation. Negotiation is okay. From signature to closure, it's long. Stressful? Long. It's not stressful. It's not stress.

23:06It's just long. You wish you would be there. All your organization is wandering, but not only your organization. The other organization is wandering and so many things you can do together. It's a time that it drains. But then what we did very nicely and very effectively is we spent so much energy speaking about where we were going, making the journey, if not pleasant, at least worthwhile. while. You are a great advocate for net zero. You're a great advocate for climate, for the planet, for humanity. You're, I think, a member of the UNGC. You are on the science-based initiatives. You are a senior figure in the World Economic Forum as well.

23:54Does all of that distract? Why would it distract? Because you're a CEO and that's your main job. Yeah, but that makes you a better CEO. Why would it distract? That's an interesting question. Let me rephrase this. When I look at Elon Musk, I see he's got about six different jobs. I can't see how he can concentrate on the task of one job or another job or another job. And when I look at board members, I see the same names in UK corporate scene turning up on board after board after board. I'm the chairman of this, chairman of that as well. And I look at myself and I have one job and I find that pretty tricky.

24:26I don't know how you manage so many different kind of hats and different roles? It's only one hat. And it's only one person too. And we are an amazing company, but we're very small still. We are 11 ,000 people, 25 billion market cap. It's a small company relative to the enormous of the sea. You have to be out. You have to be out and bring that voice. And it's the power of collaboration too. It's the power of communication. It's the power of driving advocacy. I was at COP21, Le Bourget. I was at COP26. I've been at COPs in Dubai as well. And there was such a feeling of zeitgeist that things were going to change and they were never going to go back.

25:10Now, 2026, US corporate America doesn't even dare put ESG on its annual report. It doesn't look at climate initiatives so much. The political winds have changed so much. But you don't feel the need to change anything you're doing in terms of your mission. And I I know, for instance, you've grown revenues. I think it's 20 % you've grown revenues during your tenure. At the same time, you've cut your scope one and two by 60%, I think, as well. Now it's 30 and 67. Okay, latest data. But you can move forward and be sustainable and profitable and grow revenues. Why is that such a hard message, do you think, for so many of your peers?

25:46I believe that is the only way to drive long-term sustainable growth, to do it in respect with your planet, in respect of the society that you're part of. It's the only way, long-term. You can take little tiny corners if you want, but long-term, this is the way to win. I don't see any change on sustainability. I see a change on the narrative. There is much, there is no narrative. You didn't see it in the United States? You didn't see it with your US peers? There is a change on the way that we talk about it. There is no change on the dialogue we have with our customers. It's always been, always been about yield, productivity, efficiencies, producing more with less, cost savings, and with benefits to the planet.

26:27This was true five years ago, and it is true now. The value we bring to our customers, it's always replacing something many times cheaper than us, but leading to a solution that's going to be competitive, leading to cost savings, and many times also bringing a feature that is not price substitutional. You cannot make no sugar added with cheaper sugar. You cannot replace microplastics with cheaper polymers. Those are the solutions that we bring in. Have you ever been really underestimated in your career and had to prove people just how good you are? Underestimated is a strong word. Not for the long time.

27:07Not for the long run. No, I have not been underestimated. Everybody has unconscious bias. Everybody. I was also 22 at one time in my career or 25 or 26. And then they see this woman coming in and many times I've been asked to give the coffee or the assumption was that, no, I was the leader or the managing director or it was supposed to be the assistant many, many, many times. But then when that happened, you can do two things. You can take it on you or you can just say they just didn't know any better. And then you show them and then they learn. And then I have not been underestimated in the long run.