In short
IBM’s “augmented intelligence” (Watson) for creativity and recommendations, demonstrated through a Ming Tsai–style cooking experiment that adapts recipes using ingredient/flavor chemistry and recipe-pattern data.
Guests
Ming Tsai, chef/TV personality who coaches young chefs and discusses technique, seasoning, and why computers should suggest rather than dictate; “Chef Watson” is the AI system described (IBM Watson evolved to cloud services).
Key claims
Watson can enhance human creativity by combining flavor-compound knowledge with thousands of parsed recipes; it’s not “genius,” and instructions may be imperfect for never-before-made recipes; humans must apply technique, timing, and judgment.
Notable examples
Watson suggests unusual pairings (e.g., beef+salmon with green olives/blue cheese/mint chocolate chip ice cream); it swaps shrimp-tabouleh to salmon, adjusts steps/measurements, and recommends ingredient exclusions (e.g., vermouth with fish).
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOAugmented Intelligence at IBM
0:48 to 2:26
Explore IBM's approach to augmented intelligence and creativity.
“because our goal is really to enhance and scale human skills.”
Chef Watson's Creative Cooking
2:26 to 3:52
Learn how Chef Watson combines ingredients and creativity in cooking.
“I was rooting for dried cranberries, but I will try my hand at olives.”
The Cooking Process with AI
3:52 to 6:10
Follow the cooking process using Chef Watson's suggestions and techniques.
“I would probably start by prepping the vegetables.”
Flavor Combinations and AI Insights
6:10 to 10:08
Discuss the harmonization of flavors and the future potential of AI in culinary arts.
“This is gonna be really exciting for all of us.”
Flavor Combinations and AI Insights
10:55 to 11:34
Discuss the harmonization of flavors and the future potential of AI in culinary arts.
“Have you heard that McDonald's spicy chicken McNuggets made with spicy tempura and a blend of aged cayenne are back?”
Transcript
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0:47When we talk about AI at IBM, we mean augmented intelligence, not artificial intelligence, because our goal is really to enhance and scale human skills. Watson evolved from being a supercomputer to becoming a collection of services that are available on the cloud to everyone. And we thought, well, one thing that's still missing to Watson is creativity. Could Watson help its users be more creative? I'm jaded, I'm biased, so me with pickles, these are my five favorite ways to eat pickles. I'm probably gonna go to those. Watson, he's not jaded, he's not biased. I never thought about doing a pickle souffle.
1:23I would, but I never thought about it. Chef Watson has some knowledge that we don't have, you, I, or even a professional chef. He knows what flavor compounds are contained in what ingredients, he knows the chemistry of the ingredients. He also has, of course, parsed like thousands of recipes so it's seen what ingredients are often used together. It tries to combine those two sources of information to make its recommendations. I tend to cook with the same ingredients all the time, so it should be an adventure to try something totally new. I always coach young chefs and they create a dish and there's, look, this has never been done before, peanut butter and escargot.
2:01Just because it's never been done before doesn't mean it's genius. As a matter of fact, peanut butter and escargot would be horrible. However, where I think Watson could be hugely beneficial is discovering new ingredients, finding a 30th peppercorn idea to know about. But ultimately, I think it stops there. We asked our Twitter followers to take a poll. In a very close race, they picked green olives ahead of dried cranberries. I was rooting for dried cranberries, but I will try my hand at olives.
2:36Immediately you see suggestions of ingredients that are going to go well with green olives. Oh, goodness. You can exclude ingredients if you think that dry vermouth is not a good idea with fish. Oh, that's a bad idea, just in general. I want to do salmon. So Watson's first idea, which seems incredibly horrific, is a beef and salmon dish with green olive, mushroom, butter, pimento, chili darbo, bajillo, pepper. What is happening here? Green olives, blue cheese, mint chocolate chip ice cream, and shallots. What else works with it? Blueberry. No. I feel like tuna is leading me down a road I don't want to go down.
3:12Okay. That's the thing with computers. Once they decide that something works well, they're going to recommend it to you a lot. Watercress. Okay, Watson, what do we got, baby? Salmon taboo looks okay. So Watson is taking a shrimp recipe and swapped out the seafood. So that's some AI going on. And so it changes the portions and the measurements. Yeah, the proportions and the steps so that you don't have to do that yourself. Eww, cottage cheese, Watson. Oh, that could be good. We picked our recipe. It is a green olive and grits dish. Good recipe. I'm impressed that it said, okay, well, since there isn't a salmon tabbouleh recipe, I'm going to take a shrimp tabbouleh recipe and replace it with salmon.
3:52That's smart. It's not genius.
4:00I would probably start by prepping the vegetables. For most of them it just tastes chopped, so it's kind of up to you really. Okay. I don't know if this is chopping or not. They're smaller than they once were. Alright Watson, so I tweet your recipe. I'm not a big fan of cheese with seafood. It's like 86 to cheese. You also didn't have an allium group in your recipe, which is a no-no. Garlic, shallot, onion, leek, scallions. So boom. And here we have some couscous going. I'm going to go ahead and get the salmon started first. Season it up well. And that's one thing, Watson, when you ever do a recipe, you got to make sure it says season well.
4:37Ginger, you can use a spoon. No one, and I mean no one, can cut themselves with a spoon. All right? I like Propel Fitness Water. With Gatorade electrolytes, zero sugar, and vitamins, Propel hydrates better than water to help you get the most out of your workout and get back to your best self. What propels you? Propel with Gatorade Electrolytes. When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work, use Indeed Sponsored Jobs. It gives your job post the boost it needs to be seen and helps reach people with the right skills, certifications, and more. Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes.
5:17Listeners of this show will get a$75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com slash podcast. That's indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need a hiring hero? This is a job for Indeed Sponsored Jobs. You're worried too because you should be. But this is how Ming Tsai also chops carrots. Super thin slice first. Restack it. Make what we say in France, julienne, which is just really thin pieces. And then come through a second time to make dice. All right, so there's my ginger. Good to go. The scallions are going to go in with the vinaigrette. The greener part is a little bit lighter in flavor, a little less strong, and that is going to be for garnish.
5:59I like the heat of the chili, so I'm going to keep the skin and the seeds. By the way, try a piece. Every chili's different. That's good. Slow and steady wins the race. Oh wow. This is gonna be really exciting for all of us. This is spearmint. That's spanking your mint. What does that do? It releases the oils. Anyone can buy short grain rice, rice vinegar, mirin, but can it make great sushi rice? It's not the ingredients, it's the technique. And that's this. That's hands. And that's experience. Computer can't do that.
6:43It doesn't tell me how long to do it for. Until it's done. I don't know what that means. It smells really good. Some of the ingredients weren't on some of the instructions in ways I thought were going to be, so I kind of had to all of a sudden improvise, which is terrifying. What about the mushrooms? You're not cooking them? Oh God, it just roughed the mushrooms off. Chef Watson doesn't tell you what you did about this. Chef Watson doesn't tell you. Well, you gotta add them now. At one point in the middle of it, I was like, I don't know about this. Oh God, this is gonna end badly. I don't let a computer tell you what you gotta do.
7:14I thought that's what it was supposed to do. No, it's suggestions. Oh, suggestions. Oh, yeah, Chef Watson suggests I use my own creativity and experience. It's going to be so good. The instructions are pretty good. They are not perfect because we're providing instructions for a recipe that has never been made before. So if you just follow everything literally, you might have some surprises. Two and a half cups of lemon juice? Dude, are you a lemonade stand? You take the two sides off of lemon, there are no seeds. So, fresh lemon on that. Either you do what they say and you're gonna need to make small bits, I think they would say.
7:50Or, you're gonna decide to cook this separately, and then you can keep, like, bigger chunks. Yeah, I'm gonna totally cut it up into steaks. Take that recipe, I'm gonna do my own thing. Oh, look at that. Hello, Watson, G, B, and D, baby. Golden, brown, and delicious. Do that, you can get yourself a restaurant. Oh, oh god, oh god.
8:16My salmon's basically ready. I would hate to overcook it. They have all our beautiful aromatics. Cooking in that little bit of extra virgin olive oil and the salmon fat. I didn't use salt, I'm using tamari. Couscous. Look at that. I like hot and cold. It's got this beautiful water crust that's chilled and my couscous on top. You know, there's vinaigrettes coming along. Isn't that cool? Vinaigrette needs oil. Vinaigrette needs acid. More lemon juice. Try it, try it, try it. Woo! We're done. So Watson left it up to me to be creative with my plating. You ready? Boom, boom. Now, warm vinaigrette. Oh yeah, baby.
9:00Go with the watercress. Here's the scallion greens. Spank them in. That's it, brother. The Watson Ming Tsai-inspired salmon on couscous with watercress. Wish you had a mouth, dude.
9:18That is surprisingly good. I was not expecting it to actually taste edible. All right, Watson. I have a palate. I will be objective as hell. I will tell you how I think this tastes. It's freaking good, dude. Seriously. Salmon's perfectly cooked. That's money. Lemon's great with all these other flavors. This may go on the menu, Blue Dragon. We'll see. The execution of some of the techniques, for example, the giant chunks of carrot, perhaps don't work very well, whereas if someone who knew what they were doing cut everything in a way that made sense, that would be significantly better. But the flavors, actually, I'm surprised that the flavors go together as well as they do.
9:56Watson, nice cooking with you. Honestly, you need a little bit more work, But you're just a computer, so what do you expect? We're just at the beginning of seeing the possibilities. The idea of discovery is not tied to food. Creativity, discovery, getting recommendations, advice, that's all things that you can apply to your own industry, whether it's retail, finance, travel, and so on.
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From the publisher
Artificial Intelligence, Real Food
28 Jul 2017
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Can AI really help you be more creative? We paired IBM's AI with an expert chef and a kitchen novice to see how humans and machines could work together. Here's what happened.
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