How Do I Deliver a Good First Impression in a Job Interview? | New Here | S1E9

0:01This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome? That's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required, compatibility and availability varies 18+. hey Chicago class it up with Crocs you know back to school is coming in fast so why wait to find your new fave footwear step into a local Crocs store and step into your new look try it style it make it yours because the right pair doesn't just show up it shows off first day fits handled Walk out ready for whatever's next.

0:52Visit your nearest Croc store today. Where do you see the boundary of being authentic for a job interview? You know, I don't believe in being authentic in an interview. What? As bold of a statement that is, I don't believe you should be authentic because you know why? Why? The employer is not authentic.

1:17Welcome to New Here, honest conversations and practical advice to help you play the game called work. I'm Eleni Mata. This week, we're talking about job interviewing, especially the first impression you make, which can last a long time. It might be your first job out of school. You might be getting your second or third job after experiencing a layoff, switching careers, or feeling unmotivated and wanting to start over fresh. Whatever it is, your first impression is hugely important and it takes you a long way to getting an offer. Or not. A big part of making that good first impression on a hiring manager or a future colleague is finding a connection with them right away.

2:02It's a little bit of a tightrope walk, and you can't always be totally authentic. You heard Sho DeJuan's hot take on that at the top of the show. Sho is a former recruiter, and we'll have more of his advice later on. But first, all this talk about first impressions got me thinking about the nerves I always get when heading to a very particular kind of job interview, an acting audition. So I'm an actor, and I've done hundreds of auditions. Basically, you get a few minutes to show the casting director that you're the best person for that role. So I feel like actors are really good at making good first impressions because we have so much practice doing it in just a few seconds every time we audition.

2:47But it's not just about practice. There's a mindset and a method that actors have when we're auditioning. To learn more about that, I called my friend Jack.

3:06Hello. Hey.

3:11Are you Star 670-ing me right now? Nah, we're calling from the studio, not my phone. All right, so it's like that. Jack is an actor and the co-founder of a theater company here in Boston. He's also one of my favorite scene partners. We talked about this briefly the other day. like what's interesting about actors and us auditioning for shows is that we don't have that much time to make like a good impression when we go in there like we just have to have like our monologue ready like that's within like a minute or minute and a half or um you have like your 36 bar song like get ready to scream your lungs out but it's like this this question of like how do you make a good first impression when you have such little time have you thought about what helps you when you go into an audition yeah so i like to just walk in and say hi how's everyone how's everyone's day going like and i'm shaking their hands like i'm jack i mainly just want to give off that like at this moment i'm not trying to like audition for you i'm trying to work with you right now i'm trying to understand what you want from the play and like how i can help you tell your story not just like perform this big thing and let you know that like I can act I'm trying to let them know that I can collaborate when we get there I'm a good collaborator yeah and I'm also not a terrible human being you know and also I feel like the auditioners the people on the panel are not in a good mood the majority of the time you know because they just they just saw like 50 people.

4:51They just saw 50 people. Like I was in this audition room. I walked in and they needed like... This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome? That's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web. Like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50 page restoration block. Or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required compatibility and availability varies 18 plus. Hey Chicago, class it up with Crocs.

5:26You know back to school is coming in fast. So why wait to find your new fave footwear? Step into a local Crocs store and step into your new look. Try it, style it, make it yours. Because the right pair doesn't just show up, it shows off. First day fits, handled. Walk out ready for whatever's next. Visit your nearest Croc store today. Beard flannel. And I was like, cool, great, got it. And I walk in and there was like 30 other dudes who looked just like me. And that's when you realize, you're like, oh, I am just one and, you know, I'm not special. Yeah. So how did you show that you were different from like the 20 other dudes in flannel?

6:13Oh, I didn't. I totally failed that audition. I got totally nervous because I was focusing too much on separating myself from all the other people rather than just being who I am and giving what I can give. Yeah. You know, and it's easier said than done. Like right now, I fully believe that. But right before you go in to an audition, all that kind of goes out the window. Yeah. the nerves do come in. Like, how do you shake off the nerves before going into an audition so that it doesn't affect your performance and affect the way that you, like, show yourself? What helps is knowing your piece really well and caring about what you have to say.

7:00And also just pretending that I am not auditioning in that moment. Pretending that I am now working with the people who are on the panel. You know, that really helps. And also practicing getting rejected, you know. Luckily, I've had a lot of practice with that. And letting yourself be really upset for like a day. Hang out, watch a movie, play some video games, do what you got to do. And the next day, hopefully you have another audition. So I think what's cool about your approach with auditioning is like you have this confidence about you already. Like you're not worried about failing. You're not worried about this person not liking you.

7:47You're just going in as yourself and not really worried about like the worst case scenario. Oh, well, I mean, at night I worry about that. You know, like I sometimes think I'm like, oh, maybe I should just stop doing this because, you know, it's impossibly hard. So I really try not to compare myself to anyone. And I think that's I think that's what hits my insecurity is like comparing people. And that's what I need to focus on a lot. Yeah. Like don't compare yourself to anyone else. And that's hard when you're like in a room with other people that are going for the same thing that you are. Like that's so hard.

8:22Yeah. Like you're trying to listen in to see what they're doing. And then you hear a laugh. You know, you and then you're like, oh, man, they laughed. They all laughed. Now I'm next. and you know like yeah that's like no and that's the thing you just gotta focus on your own your own stuff you know and like sometimes i feel really confident and like that comes across but sometimes you gotta fake it until you make it yeah you know i actually auditioned for the first time in like three years the other day what'd you do clue like the board came think if the board came dude that sounds so fun it was mad fun but i misinterpreted the character What do you mean?

9:03Like they told me ahead of time, like, oh, we want you to read for Miss Scarlet. And I was like, cool. So I did research. Like I did my research on what the role is and what the show was about and everything. And I went in with that knowledge and being like, OK, I practiced. Like I practiced the thing. I like practiced my body language, how I was going to introduce myself and everything. But because I think my mind was so stuck on how I practiced that when they gave me a different type of direction, I froze and I didn't take it well. So I ended up not getting it. That was sad, yeah. But I'm glad that I did it, though, because I hadn't auditioned in so long.

9:42And I was like, ah, this is how it feels. Jack, thank you so much for letting us talk to you about auditioning. I feel...

10:01a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required. Compatibility and availability varies 18 plus. Hey Chicago, class it up with Crocs. You know back to school is coming in fast. So why wait to find your new fave footwear? Step into a local Crocs store and step into your new look. Try it. Style it. Make it yours. Because the right pair doesn't just show up. It shows off. First day fits handled.

10:41Walk out ready for whatever's next. Visit your nearest Croc store today. I feel the way I do after an audition right now. I feel nervous. That was fun, but I'm like, oh, wow. Did it come out well? I hope I did a good job. Okay, I'll talk to you soon. All right, I'll talk to you. Thank you. Bye. That's actor Jack Aschenbach. He is the co-founder of Deadwood Theater Company in Boston. He made a bunch of points that I think apply to any job interview. Number one, make time to rehearse beforehand. It really will help boost your confidence. But also make sure to stay flexible so you can be prepared for any unexpected questions.

11:28I learned that one the hard way in my last audition. Number two, if you're feeling nervous beforehand, pretend you've already got the job and you're just here to discuss the role with your new colleagues. And number three, in the interview, definitely highlight the skills and attributes you'll bring to the team. But there's something more subtle that you can also show the recruiter through your interactions with them. that you're good at working with people, collaborating, and listening. That's a bonus, whether you're on stage or on a laptop.

12:05After the break, we'll get a recruiter's perspective on all of this. Sho Duan, who now has his own career coaching firm, will share his secrets for making that first impression and connection with your interviewer, whether you're online or in person. Be right back.

12:33you know when you're in an interview facing your recruiter or potential future boss and you wish you could just know what they're thinking what they're looking for and what you could say to land an offer. That's exactly why I wanted to talk to Shodawan. He's a former recruiter who founded his own career consulting firm. It's called WorkHap, as in work happy. He's here to help us understand how recruiters approach a job interview. He'll cover how to set yourself apart, starting with your first impression, and he has some good tips on how to handle yourself in a

13:16how show thinks about authenticity in a job interview. It's definitely something that I toy with back and forth with like how authentic can you be to somebody who you're meeting for the first time, especially in an interview. I mean, obviously we can't swear and we can't talk about what we do on the weekends. Yeah. But we still want to show our best self. So where do you see the boundary of being authentic for a job interview you know i don't believe in being authentic in an interview what as as generic and and bold of a statement that is i don't believe you should be authentic because you know why why the employer is not authentic so i'm not telling you to be fake yeah i'm not telling you to be fake but like you said you want to showcase your best self, I don't think your best self is authentic, right?

14:12Like the way that I'm talking with my buddies, the way that I'm, if I'm getting a happy hour or I'm getting a coffee with someone, I'm myself and I'm, I'll talk what I want to talk. And that's authentic. That's real me. But when I go into an interview, I'm professional me. I'm more cheerful me. I'm more confident me. I kind of like step into that new persona, interview show, new job show. That's just the nature of interviews. There's a show with his friends and there's a show in a professional setting. It's like a shift in persona. That's also called acting.

14:59or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required, compatibility and availability varies 18+. Hey Chicago, class it up with Crocs. You know back to school is coming in fast. So why wait to find your new Fave footwear? Step into a local Crocs store and step into your new look. Try it. Style it. Make it yours. Because the right pair doesn't just show up. It shows off. First day fits, handled. Walk out ready for whatever's next. Visit your nearest Croc store today.

15:43Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's a truth. But I don't know if you've noticed by my energy so far, but I'm an actor local here in the area. Love it. And we were talking about how actors have like a pretty intense interview process. And our form of an interview is auditions. If you're lucky, you have at least two, three minutes tops to like sing your song, 36 bars and your monologue. You only have like a limited amount of time. And you've said something before that like the first two, three minutes is where you give that good first impression. And I'm thinking, shoot, in an audition process, you really only have like the first five, ten seconds.

16:30And the first two to three minutes in like an interview, those few minutes are crucial, you say, to make that good first impression and to establish rapport. So can you talk me through how you do that? Yeah. The truth is it actually starts when they meet you in the lobby and they're like, hey, nice to meet you. Yeah, like, you know, walk with me here to get to my room. And do you need a coffee? Are you good? How was your drive-in? Like, the interview's already started. So that's for an in-person interview, even for a Zoom interview. You turn the camera on, they're like, oh, hey, does everything work?

17:02Does your mic work? Are you okay? Do you need to take some notes? You know, that little prelude before the actual first question starts, that's actually the first impression. So a lot of people make that mistake of just, you know, when they ask, yeah, how are you? And they're like, yeah, I'm fine. I'm okay. And they walk alongside them in the lobby and said, yo, can I sit here? Okay. and it's just like very short and then they think when they ask you tell me about yourself then they can turn it on and all of a sudden they can impress them but how you show up even when they ask you hey how are you you want to showcase your personality you want to you want to be a little bit different than the rest people so like just going back to your example Eleni of you in your audition and they're asking like hey how are you yeah what are you going to be singing today like you could start off and say oh I'll be singing this song that I know from somewhere or you could be like hey everybody yeah it's so nice to see everybody here, man.

17:53It's a beautiful day. I had a nice drive in. I'm actually going to be singing one of my favorite songs of all time. I hope you love it too. And then you do your thing. Again, I'm not an acting career coach. Maybe that analogy is a little bit different, but I think it still applies. The first couple of seconds of how you introduce yourself, it sets you up for the rest of the interview. If you can start off on a high note and you're like, oh yeah, I'm doing great. I actually went to the gym at 6 a.m. I'm actually training for a marathon and the hiring manager's like, oh, what? Oh, I just did a marathon last weekend.

18:22And then you say, oh, how'd you do? Were you impressed? And you're having that banter for two, three, five, 10 minutes. You're not even talking about the work. You're winning. So it's like, don't think of it as an interview. Think of it as like a conversation. Like you're just meeting somebody new. You just so happen to talk about your resume at the same time. It's just a conversation. It's just a conversation. You're absolutely right. But that's really hard to think about because you're nervous, especially if you want the job or you need the job. Have you had a client who was nervous about establishing a rapport, finding that connection with the hiring manager to like get the conversation going?

19:02Yeah, absolutely. This is usually like new stuff for nine out of 10 people. We were never taught the way to get a job is to build rapport and make small talk and find some commonalities. Like we're never taught that. Most people go to school because they think high grades and me knowing technical skills, me having a degree from a school, that'll get me a job. I think that's what we were most taught. The building rapport things, it takes time. It's trial and error. You'll just get better with repetition. The people who feel nervous about those things, which everyone does, the people who feel like, oh, I don't know how to make small talk, I know this is the boring answer, but you just have to keep going.

19:44This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome? That's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required, compatibility and availability varies 18+. Hey, Chicago. Class it up with Crocs. You know back to school is coming in fast. So why wait to find your new fave footwear?

20:19Step into a local croc store and step into your new look. Try it. Style it. Make it yours. Because the right pair doesn't just show up. It shows off. First day fits, handled. Walk out ready for whatever's next. Visit your nearest croc store today. Out there. Maybe you don't start with the interviewer make small talk. Next time you're ordering a Subway sandwich, try to build some rapport there. Ask them how their day is. Ask them what their favorite sandwich is. But it's these little interactions when you do in your everyday life that will actually show up in your interviews where then you're like, oh, I'm actually not as scared or nervous to ask these questions because I've done it before so many times.

21:00What if your hiring manager isn't biting? Like what if you're trying to set this rapport up and they're just not, it's like, okay, well then what? Do I just kind of leave it to be like dry and cut to the chase and that's it? Great question. Great question. And unfortunately, the answer is kind of. Yeah. No. You want to mimic their energy, right? If that's who they are, it might also be a sign that this might not be a good fit for you. Like you want to work somewhere, right? Where you have good energy or you're around people that maybe have a similar vibe. But if they're like really closed off, maybe you don't want to work there.

21:37But if you really still want that job, you just got to mimic that energy. Okay. So you tried and you can feel yourself. You could feel them kind of being a little bit more reserved. Hey, you want to mimic that. Do you have a story from early in your career about a time that you didn't make a good first impression in an interview? There was an interview that lasted, I think, three, four minutes. It was a role that I really, really wanted. I get on the call. she asked me hey how are you yeah good but you know i'm doing my thing this is what i teach tell me a little about yourself yeah i'm currently in hr i do this i do this and maybe she asked one more question yeah so what do you think is the biggest win you've had in your career and oh you know i would probably say i did these training programs and i did this she's like okay all right thank you and then she hung up and of course i didn't get the job i knew when when the interview ended i was like i i didn't get the job um there's probably things i could i probably could have done better i probably could have tailored my answers a little bit more for the role maybe i could have built a little bit more rapport i don't know about that yeah then it's not meant to be like all right cool it's not yeah it's very easy to you to think about like man i could have said something differently oh i could have done this and don't get me wrong i was doing that too i was like i was beating myself up i was like oh man i could have done this i did it is but like you said Sometimes it's just not meant to be.

22:58Sometimes you're just not vibing with each other. And hey, that's okay. Something better is out there. And you just got to stay a little patient. So I'm going to go back to something you mentioned about virtual interviews, like a Zoom interview. Yeah. Like what's the difference in terms of approach? The Zoom interviews is a little bit lower stakes. It's in the comfort of your home usually. You get to decide how you look and where your background is and all those things. The biggest difference, I would say, between an in-person interview and a Zoom interview is in a Zoom interview, you can technically, quote unquote, cheat.

23:32All right? By cheating, I mean, you can have post-it notes actually in front of you about what you want to say. You can have your copy of your resume and actually be peeking at, oh yeah, this is a good experience that I can say. You can have the job description. Yeah. Yeah, that's totally okay. There's Zoom interviews I've had where I had the resume printed up. I would take a Sharpie and circle, go, hey, this is the story that I want to tell. So it just reminds me, right? There's also times when I would even just write onto my computer, smile more. So I'm like, oh yeah, I got to smile more. Look at the camera.

24:03I think that's where you kind of have an advantage of it being a Zoom interview or a phone interview. They can't technically see your peripheral, right? So you have that advantage. You can see the things that they can't. Again, it goes back to us memorizing the script. I don't want you to have a complete laundry list of everything you want to say, but hey, maybe two, three bullet points right here on your screen, have a resume pulled up. I think that's a perfectly fair game. Are you learning how things are changing through your clients when they come in and they tell you, hey, this is how my job interview was?

24:33Because for me, I think it's been three years since I've interviewed for corporate. Experience a membership that backs what you're building with American Express Business Platinum. Get two times membership rewards points per dollar on eligible purchases and key business categories, as well as on each eligible purchase of$5 ,000 or more on up to$2 million in eligible purchases per calendar year. American Express Business Platinum. There's nothing like it. Terms apply. Learn more at americanexpress.com slash business dash platinum. This episode is brought to you by Palmolive. Family time isn't just the big moments.

25:15It's weeknight dinners, sitting around the table, everyone talking all at once. So when the plates are empty and the sink is full, use Palmolive Ultra. Palmolive's most powerful formula removes up to 99.9 % of grease, leaving your dishes sparkling clean. And the new convenient pump makes cleaning even easier, so you can spend less time tackling dishes and more time together. Shop now at palmolive.com. You know, the only difference that I'm seeing is AI. Like some people are doing AI interviews. So that's like the biggest change that I've seen. like what other changes or shifts have you been noticing in the space of interviewing i would actually say it's similar to that you know how people are now doing interviews where you record yourself like you're not even you're not even meeting someone right now you you get on zoom for example and they have a question pop up at you like tell me about a time you handled a difficult situation and you hit record and then you actually just record live on the spot and that gets sent to the recruiter and they see that i've actually never had one of those recruiters personally, but it's still the same thing, right?

26:18It's a different medium. It's a different way of doing it. But the fundamental is there is somebody on the other side assessing, can you do the job? Do I think I like you? And are you different from the other hundreds of candidates that we have? I don't think recruitment as a core will ever change. Like that's how people are going to get jobs. So I have one last question. What is getting you through right now? This is completely unrelated to career advice, interview advice. Yes. I love my therapist. Oh, me too! I see her every Wednesday morning. It's one of my highlights of my week. I think everyone should have a mental health support or therapist or someone in their life.

26:57And it shouldn't be someone that you are friends with. It should be someone external that you can just be. This is where you want to be authentic. That is where you want to be really authentically you and just unleash and unravel everything. Not interviews, but this. Yeah, therapy is that. I love my therapist too, yo. For real. Thank you, Sho. Thanks for having me.