Walgreens CEO Roz Brewer to Leaders: Put Your Phones Away and Listen to Employees

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1:09Hi, welcome to Harvard Business Review's The New World of Work. I'm Adi Ignatius, Editor-in-Chief of Harvard Business Review. And each week on the show, we speak to a top-tier CEO about this transition moment that we're in to sort of get ideas and inspiration about how we can work more effectively going forward. Before I introduce my guests this week, I just want to quickly read a message from our friends at Unisys, sponsor of the New World of Work. Unisys is an IT company that builds critical solutions trusted by demanding businesses and governments around the world. They partner with clients to enable cloud transformation, protect critical operations, and empower the modern workforce.

1:51Visit unisys.com to learn more. So my guest today is Rosalyn Roz Brewer, the CEO of Walgreens Boots Alliance. She has a very impressive resume. Before becoming CEO of Walgreens, she served as COO of Starbucks and before that as CEO of Sam's Club. In her first half year or so at Walgreens, she started to lay down a strategic rethink that we will talk about later. She also has been an outspoken advocate throughout her career for diversity and inclusion issues. So, Roz, welcome to the show, and thank you very much for being with us. Thank you. I'm glad to be here. Let me just tell our audience, if you have questions for Roz, please put them in the comments box, and we'll try to get to some of those later in the show.

2:37So, Roz, let's start with your career. You have had a series of top jobs, as I said, at Sam's Club, at Starbucks, now at Walgreens Boots Alliance. Talk about the challenges of walking into a new company, you know, a new industry in some cases, and projecting the kind of confidence that you need to do, you know, that you need to be able to do your job from day one? Great. That's a very good question, especially now, having walked into, you know, a health care company in the middle of the pandemic. And I think that was a pretty gutsy move. And every day it's proven to be true. But I will tell you that I have been fortunate to really accumulate so many different learnings over my career.

3:21And I'm pretty adamant about making sure that I am clear about my role, what my intent is, and how do I bring together my toolbox. I think the one thread that I can pull through all of my roles and opportunities is my personal leadership. And that's the way I show up first and foremost, because most of these business problems that I face in these leadership roles, it takes character. It takes guts. It takes problem solving. And when I bring that basic toolkit to bear in these different roles, it has been proven effective for me every time. So I think the other thing I will tell you is that whenever I take on a new role, I become a real student of the business.

4:14I remember when I joined Walmart after being with Kimberly Clark for such a long time and being in consumer products and going into retail. And I decided to my job was based in Atlanta, Georgia, but I decided to move myself to Bentonville, Arkansas and go on a learning journey for 90 days. And I stayed in a little small hotel and came into the home office there and really studied them during what I call the honeymoon period. And it was the best thing I could have ever done. I met people. I learned more about retail. And I really put myself in a learning position and not in a position initially of leadership.

4:51And I chose to learn and be an advocate and open. When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work, use Indeed Sponsored Jobs. It gives your job post the boost it needs to be seen and helps reach people with the right skills, certifications and more. Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Listeners of this show will get a$75 sponsored job credit at Indeed.com slash podcast. That's Indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need a hiring hero? This is a job for Indeed Sponsored Jobs. This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome.

5:29You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required, compatibility and availability varies 18+. Minded about what the opportunities were ahead of me. Yep. That's great. So I want to ask you, so you are, you know, as a Fortune 500 CEO, you are in a very elite group.

6:05You know, as a black female CEO in that group, you are truly in rarefied territory. So, you know, how do you balance the, you know, the pressure, the scrutiny, the expectations that accompany, you know, being, you know, practically the only person like yourself in these fields? You know, I will tell you, it's sometimes, you know, you can feel like, you know, it's a lonely position, you know, because you don't see yourself in different environments that you're in. And then I look at myself personally and say, what can I do to change this? Because, you know, it could be difficult at certain times.

6:43What I will tell you, though, is I think that the environment is opening up more to people recognizing the differences and appreciating the differences. Many times, you know, I am called upon and asked to give my opinion on diversity issues. And I will be honest with you, I will I am as frank as I possibly can be because I do think I hold a unique position. So when I get in these settings, I take advantage of an opportunity to learn and educate those around me because I can feel it when they're unfamiliar with me or my culture. I don't hide my culture. I talk about it very openly. I feel like that is almost my second reason for being.

7:30You know, everybody has their purpose in how you get into a situation or environment. But I take advantage of it and do everything I can to teach and expose people to my culture and who I am. I learned probably sort of early in my career, I'd say maybe five to seven years out of college, that I really wanted to bring my whole self to work so I don't cover up my culture at all. And I think that that's helpful for me because they know how to count on me and what the expectations are in terms of interacting with me. So I'm guessing that throughout your career, you've often been the only woman, maybe the only person of color in a room full of executives.

8:13You talked about bringing yourself, but can you talk a little bit more about how do you manage that situation and how do you make it work? Yes. I really do look forward to the day where I'm not really the only in these rooms and environments, and I'm doing a lot personally to try and make that happen. And I will tell you, the way I deal with this is, really, I'm actually no different than other individuals in the room, and I try and share that as well. My accomplishments come from hard work, come from exposure. One of the things I find myself doing, fortunate or unfortunately, is sometimes I have to run a few people through my resume because I think they look at my titles and say, did she really do the work?

8:59How did she get there? But I have some absolute real lived experiences. You know, when I was at Starbucks, I've worked the drive-thru window. When I was at Walmart, I threw trucks at night so I could learn distribution logistics, warehousing at those companies. So I've done the worst and the best of the jobs. Sometimes I have to remind people of that. And it gives me credibility that I've not been a token. I've not been granted these jobs. I've absolutely had to work very hard to get where I am. and so I find myself doing that but you know it it doesn't bother me I I'm hoping I'm an optimist and hope that that is not what the next person has to do but for now I find myself having to really go in a deep dive in terms of my experience and do a lot of storytelling about why I when you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work use indeed sponsor jobs it gives your job post the boost it needs to be seen and helps reach people with the right skills, certifications, and more.

10:04Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Listeners of this show will get a$75 sponsored job credit at Indeed.com slash podcast. That's Indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need a hiring hero? This is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs. This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, But Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks.

10:38Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required. Compatibility and availability varies 18+. I believe in what I believe in. And, you know, I get in a situation, you know, I'm on the business roundtable and we're getting into some really courageous conversations around the new infrastructure bill. Well, you know, I happen to have a lot of experience in the space of what it takes to move goods across the United States. And, you know, I've been fortunate enough to maybe share a little bit of that. And maybe people didn't realize that I had a background in that as well, because you can't be in retail and not understand supply chain and logistics.

11:20So we actually were getting some questions from our viewers, and some of them were about, okay, how do you actively learn about a new business? And you really sort of answered that and sort of jumping in at the bottom in some cases. Let's talk more broadly about workplace diversity in a more general sense. As you know, the corporate world, we're all trying to move the needle on diversity, equity, inclusion, and that has been an imperative since the murder of George Floyd. You know, we didn't have to be because of that, but that's where we are. What's your view on how companies can pursue a DEI strategy that truly has meaning?

12:02Yes. So, you know, it's interesting. When the George Floyd incident happened, I actually thought I knew it all, and I had been doing a good job in DEI. I, and I quickly realized that even myself, who's been a huge proponent of it, myself, who, you know, I'm a double minority, you know, myself, a mother of, you know, a young black male, I thought I understood this, but I realized that I didn't. I realized that I had not been asking all the right questions. I had not been focusing on the parts of our environment and our social environment that are very much broken. I think myself included, you know, we have been focusing on the D of DE &I and not equity and not inclusion.

12:51And I say that because what really happened with the George Floyd incident is that I don't think people understood, you know, the race issues that are happening in our country, those that are left out and those who don't see a way out of their current situation. but we do see putting numbers in place and hiring numbers. But have we asked the questions, you know, how can someone survive off of minimum wage? And where is our country on great education and access to health care? And also, too, it made me think back. I took it personally when all of that was happening. As you can imagine, I didn't know George Floyd, and not many of us did.

13:36But I try to put myself in the shoes of him and of his family. And I think about the work that, you know, I was doing at Walmart. I was just so adamant about, you know, just clearing the way and thinking about how can I close in on food deserts, right? If people have proper food and access to the best price, you know, the best cost in food. So, you know, I did everything I could do to put Walmart stores in the right zip codes. And then when I realized that you can do that, but, you know, and providing food for early education so people can come to school and learn and engage, that was my focus.

14:12But was I listening to take it one level lower, Roz, is what I said to myself and say, so if you put the food right near them and there's still not, you know, proper nutrition and, you know, proper health care in those places, what's causing them from not being able to thrive, right? and get and rise above the minimum wage job and go to the next level and the next level, because that's the history that we know in the United States is to give someone their start and then they take it to the next level. And that's because we haven't done enough work to study and think about, you know, what happens in someone's life when, you know.

14:49When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work, use Indeed Sponsored Jobs. It gives your job post the boost it needs to be seen and helps reach people with the right skills, certifications, and more. Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Listeners of this show will get a$75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com slash podcast. That's indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need a hiring hero? This is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs. This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new.

15:25It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required, compatibility and availability varies 18+. You're single parenting more than one child, and you've got to care for that child. And, you know, it's more than cost. It's about their self-esteem. And so we began to look at things like, how do you feel about yourself? And are we developing that in people?

15:58And so I came back at that time when George Floyd's situation was happening. I was with Starbucks. And we began to do work on providing mental health access for communities, for all of our employees, actually, and making that accessible, right? we began to think about what does it mean to really teach and train someone? Are you giving them training materials? Are you teaching them how to learn? And recognizing that people learn differently, right? And so for me, that whole situation said that we've been putting numbers on the board from a diversity standpoint, but we're not creating equity. And then there's a piece around inclusion.

16:41And I would tell you from an inclusive standpoint, we have not created environments where people feel like they can bring their whole self to their opportunities in front of them. We don't recognize from where they've come from and give them the same, you know, fair chance and give them an environment where they feel listened, seen, listened to, and seen. And we don't do that. We hadn't been doing that well. And so I, at Starbucks, a group of us, the leadership team, we made it our business to make sure that when we are in stores, we are talking to people and not talking at people. And we're doing more listening than talking.

17:19And I had already had the practice of never walk into a retail unit as a leader and have your mobile device out. I never do that. I either leave it in my automobile or put it in my pocket because I need to be present. I need to listen. But that wasn't enough. I was listening and I wasn't acting and I wasn't drilling down enough. And I think that's the next level of leadership is that we're going to have to get pretty gritty about listening and acting and making people feel included in the environments that we create as leaders. So the first takeaway is, you know, leaders, leave your phones in your pockets.

17:53Let me follow up on that. You know, it seems that even when there is diverse representation, that corporate cultures can produce a kind of, you know, group think and group speak. So how do you, you know, how do you create teams and including, you know, top level executive teams that are not only diverse, you know, on paper, but truly reflect the kind of diversity of viewpoints that trace to, you know, varied experiences and backgrounds? Yes. You know, one of the things that I think about when I'm thinking about diversity is diversity of thought, because, you know, we can also, you know, realize too that, you know, there are individuals who may not be diverse of diverse culture, race, or gender themselves, but where is their mindset?

18:39How do they think about different cultures and different environments? One of the things that I began to do in my career is to put agile teams together. And what I mean by that is a lot of times, you know, you have your finance team working in their silo, you'll have the tech team working in their silo. But what I really think works is when we create these agile teams and put them against the biggest problems to solve. That's one of the things I'm doing right now at Walgreens Boots Alliance is to make sure that this organization understands what are the biggest problems that we're going to solve.

19:14It's not, do we have enough technology, but is the technology fulfilling the need for efficiencies in the organization? Is it creating the right tools for our team members at store level and for our customers? So to give you an example, You know, you can have the best strategy in the world, but if your team operates in an environment where they're all in a silo driven environment, you're not going to get the results that you expect. So, for instance. When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work, use Indeed Sponsored Jobs. It gives your job post the boost it needs to be seen and helps reach people with the right skills, certifications and more.

19:56Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Listeners of this show will get a$75 sponsored job credit at Indeed.com slash podcast. That's Indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need a hiring hero? This is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs. This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web. like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks.

20:30Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required, compatibility and availability varies 18+. You know, right now we're trying to create a tech-enabled healthcare company. I'm saying this, I have the same message for the entire group. And the biggest problem to solve is that, how do we become the best performing stock in the Dow? And so when you put that team together, you're forcing finance and technology and operations and manufacturing all to be, you know, in the same room, in the same discussion against the biggest problem to solve.

21:04And it's not finance solving a finance problem. And I think what that actually does is it gets the diversity of thought to happen. And then you have different people sitting around the table. And in some cases, one of the outcomes that I've seen is that in certain functions, we have heavier opportunity for diversity than we do in others. I would still I would love to see more diversity in technology. It's coming. But right now I have a lot of diversity in finance. So I get the opportunity to put a diverse financial team to a growing diverse tech team in the room. So diversity of thought is happening around the problem to solve, and then the cultures are coming together.

21:46And hopefully we'll move all of those opportunities up. But it's about creating these agile teams and putting them against, you know, the unique problems to solve and forcing them to relate to each other and think about how to solve it. Now, you may say, well, where does race and gender come into that? It absolutely happens, because if you don't have people who don't have the innate ability to be forced to think different about a problem to solve, they absolutely are not going to get there on a discussion with race and gender. So you have to start where people are. People operate in their functions.

22:18Start where they are and move them to where you want the organization to go to. It proved successful for me at Starbucks. I'm replicating it again at WBA. That's a really interesting approach. So you mentioned culture. I read the transcript of your recent earnings call, And you talked about the importance of culture in driving corporate results. I'm interested in your thoughts on how institutions can create and sustain culture effectively when we're now so distributed and where employees want to be even more distributed than we've tolerated or whatever that we've accepted in the past. It seems to be one of the most one of the biggest challenges right now for every institution.

22:58It is super complicated. it. You know, and, you know, I've done all the, what I'll say, all the right things. You know, how many Zoom calls can I have? How many times can I have dinner on a Zoom call, happy hour, you know, playing games, all of those things that I hope would keep us bonded together as a team and focused. I will tell you it's complicated, but I think what is happening now when I think about this hybrid position is we're taking a position that, yes, we can be hybrid. We don't want anyone in our organization to be 100 % remote. And there's a couple of reasons for that. One, they get to detach from the culture of the company.

23:38And the second reason is we're seeing that there is loneliness, anxiety, and depression in those who do not interact. There is very little substitute for human connection, very little substitute. And this is something I'll stand behind. I'm no scientist. I'm not a psychologist, but I will tell you I've seen time and time again isolation absolutely never works. I stand behind that. We're asking our teams to create opportunities to interact with their organizations twice a week, come in for lunch or hit the team meeting in person once a week. So even if you're in the other, the second thing we're doing is thinking about where are our hubs?

24:23And so could we have hubs across the United States so that you come in and you feel the culture and you breathe the culture and you live the culture? Because culture can't sit on a piece of paper like a strategy can. You can't pull it off and then go create an action. It's the way you make someone feel. Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile. Now, I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited premium wireless for$15 a month is back. So I thought it would be fun if we made$15 bills. But it turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial.

24:59Give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch. Upfront payment of$45 for three months, $90 for six months, or$180 for 12-month plan required. $15 per month equivalent. Taxes and fees extra. Initial plan term only. Greater than 50 gigabytes may slow when network is busy. See terms. It's the way the environment looks. And then the last thing I would say about driving culture is to be very, very consistent in aligning your decisions with your culture, mission, and values. There are some great examples of that. For instance, we right now are really stressing the point around the importance of health care in this country.

25:34And so we've taken a very, very hard stand on why vaccine mandates work. We have delivered 50 million shots in arms across the United States to date, 50 million. And so, and we are adamant about vaccinations. We are a healthcare company. So my organization at the corporate level has to be 100 % vaccinated. I can't have people in the stores, you know, promoting vaccinations and then we're not vaccinated. That doesn't work. So you have to live your culture, your mission and values and be very, very clear about it. Now, can I tell you how much pushback I've gotten about that, right? Because people are being told, people don't like to be told.

26:18They think it's a partisan issue. It's not a partisan issue. I take them right back to the definition of a healthcare company and what we're going to stand for in this organization. And so if I didn't do that, they would say, well, that's not, you're not kind of like, you know, forcing us or allowing us to live our mission and values. And I've been adamant about it. And there's several examples of that, of making sure that your decisions are aligned with what your culture states. And sometimes it's hard because you can say, wow, financially, this is going to kill me. Because, you know, we've got a due date coming of when these vaccinations have to be done.