Fornication Under Consent (of the) King

0:00In a world where AI is changing every role in every industry, knowing who actually has deep expertise matters more than ever. Upwork connects you with the highly skilled freelance professionals with proven track records, so you can hire with confidence. Upwork gives your business fast access to highly skilled specialists with deep expertise, so you can fill critical skill gaps, launch projects faster, and scale support up or down without committing to full-time headcount. With Business Plus, you can access the top 1 % of talent on Upwork. AI-powered shortlisting delivers a curated shortlist of top freelancers matched to your goals in under six hours.

0:36No endless searching required. Thousands of growing businesses already trust Upwork to hire highly skilled freelance professionals for everything from one-off projects to ongoing support. It's free to sign up, and posting a job is easy. Visit Upwork.com right now and post your job for free. That is Upwork.com to connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's U-P-W-O-R-K dot com, Upwork dot com.

1:26search and compare local in-network doctors with over 250 ,000 providers across more than 200 specialties. You can read reviews from real patients, find a provider who feels like the right fit, see actual appointment openings, and book instantly. I recently had a last-minute health issue pop up and needed to see someone fast. Instead of calling around or sitting on hold, I found a doctor on ZocDoc and booked an appointment in just a few minutes. It made the whole process so much less stressful. Now, taking care of your health just got easier, Download the ZocDoc app today. That's ZocDoc, Z-O-C-D-O-C, and book that appointment on your to-do list.

2:07Do we still do the theme song? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Is that where it comes in then? There's a sting that comes in there. What we, depends, because what we normally have is a cold open. Yeah, we didn't do the cold open this week. So then, yeah, the cold open usually comes. We were doing a cold open, but we weren't recording. We were talking about Bond again. But I might just chuck this in as the cold open. Sure. And just reverse it around. And leave that in as well. And here's the jingle. Joe and James. Joe and James. Joe and James. Facts up again. Joe and James, Joe and James, Joe and James. Joe and James, facts up.

2:49Hey, Joe. Hiya. It's me and you. It's me and you. Here we are. Doing a podcast. Doing a podcast. What's this podcast called? Well, it's called Joe and James Fact Up, where each week we'll be bringing one another a fact that we deem interesting. And our policy is the more interesting, the more true it is. We'll also dig into the weird things that you'd like to think are true but don't want to research. Can't be arsed. I mean, we can't be arsed to research either. It's a real alliance of people who can't be bothered to do anything. When we say we research things, we look in our brains to sort of come up with something that we think might sound true.

3:25But that's the segment that we're calling Fact Check. I believe it was Holly last week with a great question. Absolutely good question. It was break a leg. Did the saying break a leg come from a bloke? It was a lucky guy. A lucky bloke that broke his leg. Lawrence Luck. Lawrence Luck. Lawrence Luck. Well, that's what brings us on to this episode. Yes, and that's where we're going to be. So Lawrence Luck, funny name. Yeah, funny name. So we thought we'd do facts about names this week. We're going to do some other funny names. So if you want to send in your facts for us and help us with next episode's theme, our email is hello at joeandjamespod.com.

4:01I need an erm counter. That's a good little drinking game. The amount of times I say erm because I'm an idiot. I think that's the – is that not like a signal of stupidity? Erm. If you say erm. Well, I say it all the fucking times. It's a thinking time. Well, yes. So yes. Yes, yes. So to reassure you, well, how could it be? Because I say it all the time. So our, say that again, our email is hello at joandjamespod.com. It's the blind leading the blind, isn't it really? Let's be clear. Stick with me. Our WhatsApp. Stick with me. Our WhatsApp is 07822034330 and you can follow on our socials and message us on our socials at joandjamespod.

4:45You can also watch our full episodes on YouTube. Just search joandjamesfactup. you'll find it they come out the very same day that they come out on Spotify or whatever you can also head to the podcast description if you've already forgotten those details now let's get fucked up we've got some housekeeping great you guys have been using our email and our socials and whatnot to message us I've got a I've got a message here from someone called Brad oh Giles Corey yes this is great I saw the comments about this as well. So Brad says, just listen to the new episode and you can imagine my surprise when you mention someone I know is from my family tree.

5:30Unbelievable. Whoa. This has gotten even more exciting than I thought it was going to be. We've stumbled upon something completely by accident, something genuinely interesting. Do you want to just give context to the Giles Corey story just in case anyone's forgotten? Now, I can't remember the Giles Corey story, but was he crushed by a rock? Well, so... Absolutely not. No. Oh, okay. No. That's a totally different story. Oh, is it? Is it? Was he crushed by a rock? Well, so you told a ghost story for our Halloween episode. Yes, he was... About Giles Corey. And this was the thing, right? His wife was accused of witchcraft.

6:04Yeah, but there was also a few men that were accused of witchcraft. Right. Right. But the men got accused of witchcraft if they stood up for their wives, pretty much. Yeah, yeah. And they were like, well, you're a witch too. Classic. So you could never win. You could never, ever win. But I think I was looking at the comments and a lot of people were like, oh, by the way, Charles, you missed out the best part of the Charles Corey story. Giles Corey story, which is that he was crushed by a rock. Oh, right. So this is embarrassing because I should have read the comments and then I would know that he was crushed by a rock.

6:36I don't want you reading the comments. I don't know whether you know this about me, but things can get in my head. I do know that about you. Okay. And the comments are the last thing you should be reading. I've got my eye on the comments don't you mind and to be fair they're all anything that criticises us they're all true no I know honestly I've been pointed in the direction of some of the comments and they're actually they're all fair like they're not like mental they're all super reasonable and they're tweaks I feel like I was saying yeah too much I've tried to cut down there we go and the shoes are new yeah we need to get back to Giles Corey yes we do Just listen to the new episode.

7:16This is from Brad. And you can imagine my surprise when you mentioned someone I know is from my family tree. My granddad's sister looked into our family tree a couple of years ago. And this is when we all first heard of Giles Corey. After he didn't enter a plea, he was killed by the courts. His chosen form of punishment was to be crushed to death. There's a specific name for this method, which I'm not too sure of. But basically, you are placed on the ground, a wooden board is put on top of you, and then rocks are added on top until you eventually die. When they say he's chosen, they must mean it was chosen for him.

7:54No, no, no, no. You were allowed to choose. I think you're still allowed to choose. I think in America and stuff like that. But why the fuck would you choose that? I think in America, you're in maybe certain states or something, whether they allow it or not. You know, because some states are like, we only do lethal injections. if you're in a state where it's like, well, we do this, this or this. Yeah. I think the person is allowed to go, I'll take shooting by firing squad. I think there is like a few, a couple of states in America. No, I mean, I don't doubt that you're perhaps allowed to choose.

8:27It's just, I mean, without being crass, what were the other fucking options if he's choosing this? I mean, this sounds like a horrible way to be killed. Yeah. Well, I think it's, I mean, I don't, I don't think we should be executing people anyway, frankly. but I think it's a fucking barbaric thing to do but on you go America, well done I don't know, if someone's really if they're really horrible though, yeah if they're really horrible, yeah, no, good point if they're a real wrong and joke and there's 100 % if they're really nasty 100 % like, you know, proof yeah, yeah, yeah, no absolutely and that's the thing about principles, you know something's a principle when it breaks down in extreme examples that's how you know you've got a principle well you really want to do it though oh yeah no not then there is a really funny thing in Brass Eye yeah where do you know Brass Eye I've seen Brass Eye yeah and it's a Roman reporter it's a woman reporting yeah on like just like dickhead young men oh yeah I remember that they go to boar stores and she goes into a prison and then she's talking to him she's going so do you feel better do you what was he saying where have you been and I always actually oh god you do it yeah but there is a little bit there is a little bit of I can't remember what it is exactly but there is a bit like I'd like to escape up her hole get out there's a bit of that oh yeah and then she's asking questions and she's saying and where do you think where do you think the motivation came for you to commit your crimes and then he goes up your ass up your ass yeah right and then at the end of her report she goes at the end of the day would anyone care if these guys are dead yeah it's that isn't it it's like I've also I've watched quite a lot of true crime documentaries and quite often the prosecution in court cases is like this person used to be alive and now look dead and you're like no no the defence aren't arguing that it's good that they're dead they're arguing that that person didn't do it they're not saying oh they deserve they always start with like look here a living person and now look it's very evocative isn't it it's always very evocative but you've got to sway the jury.

10:41It's always like the defence would have you believe that it's good this person was murdered. No, that's not the defence. No, that's not the defence. It's that this person didn't do it. I tell you what, right, if I get arrested for something and the jury is 12 men between the ages of 13 and 21, I think I'd get away with it. You'll be fine. You can just be like, come on, guys, don't be jury wankers. they'll be like oh cheeky jade yeah I know they'll be like oh didn't you we found you stood over the body saying oh god I've killed her oh no I don't know why it's her statistically in this case it happens to be a woman but or him or him could be a man but I think if it was a jury of 13 year old boys I think I'd get away with it yeah you'd be alright I think they'd go oh I'll let him off he's a laugh he's a legend he's a fucking legend that giant.

11:36Yeah, yeah. Anyway, what's Brad saying here? So yeah, he's chosen form of punishment was to be crushed to death where you have, like I thought it was just a great big rock, like a sort of Stonehenge type rock that you just drop on someone but apparently it's a wooden board and then you add rocks to your slowly crushed to death. He says here, our family name also changed at some point from Corey with an E to Corey with a Y. That doesn't make it better, Brad, unfortunately for you. Corey is still slang for cock. Is it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, also, you know, I'm playing with fire. John Thomas. Absolutely, absolutely.

12:22Do not him. Wait for that. Wait for my facts, Joe. It's pronounced the same just without the E, and I wonder if it's because of this. Oh, right, because of the shame. Because of the shame. They changed their name from Corey to Corey. And then Brad says, big fan of the podcast. They're slightly, they're mildly embarrassed. Yeah. Big fan of the podcast. Thought you might be interested in hearing this. Yeah, no, Brad, I was. You were one of the many people. I mean, I don't think anyone else was related to the person, but you were one of the many people that did mention that somehow I'd managed to.

12:55It didn't tell me that when I was looking this stuff up. I wanted to find a true Halloween story. I didn't want it to be like, and then the ghost disappeared, like sort of like, oh, they were driving down the street, but they picked up a hitchhiker, but there was actually a ghost. I wanted it to be like a true Halloween story. Well, this is, I mean, look, we've got to the, it's fine. Listen, it's not the criticism come from me. I just know if I was listening to this, I'd be like, stop, like I am trying to enjoy this. Every now and again, Joe and James does say something slightly funny and I'd like to listen to it, but it's been spoilt with all of James's mumbling and erms.

13:33I'm really concentrating now to not say yeah as much and to not interrupt. And I have to admit, that last interaction I did with the brass, I think, that was a terrible interruption. And that did, because I hadn't got it ready. No. And I think that's undone all the good work I've done up till this point. So I'm like a kid where you've been doing so well, you've been doing so well, you've been on time. It's George Costanza. Yeah. There's an episode where George Costanza, he's in a meeting at work. He says something really funny. And they're all going, oh, that's brilliant, George. And then he says something else.

14:02And they're like, oh, can we get on with work now? And so he decides to start living his life where every time he says something funny, he just walks out the room. He goes, thank you, I'm off. Thank you very much. Then what ends up happening is his boss gets rid of everyone else and just has George for these meetings. And he's just like, I don't know what it is about you, George, but you've just been so on lately. I just you've just you just left me wanting more oh it's so good oh that's I mean that's it you've got to you've got to get out while you're on top leave people wanting leave people wanting more and that's not what you're going to get with Joe and Joe really opposite that Joe thank you very much for that Brad that's brilliant Brad I mean I really it's all horrifying as well I mean that sounds like a terrible point I mean this Giles Corey sounds like a very brave man Again, it sounds like he was standing up for his wife, got horribly killed.

14:59He literally did the opposite of bros before hoes. Yeah. He went hoes before bros. Yeah. And I think that's amicable. Yeah, absolutely. It should all be more like. Yeah. Is that a T-shirt? Hoes before bros? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I love the Corey story or something like that. I don't know. Oh, I love the Corey story. That's good as well. Well, brilliant. I absolutely love that. Thanks, Joe. Love it. Hey, listen, Joe. You're welcome. You're welcome. Joe, to rescue this podcast, I believe you've got a fact for us. Yes. Now, we did, just after the podcast that we did last. Yeah. I mean, let's not fuck around.

15:39It was just minutes ago for us. Yeah. Because we've recorded a couple in the same day. That's fine, isn't it? We're allowed to say that. Yeah. You put that in your name. But Joe, we were talking about the name Lawrence Luck. Lawrence Luck. and you were saying, oh, can we do a thing about names this week? Well, yeah, because I think like funny names are something that bring a lot of pleasure to me and my brothers. We love to put funny names back and forth. This isn't the fact, but a good one, 19th century bloke in America. What was his name? Preserved Fish. That was his name. and that is I think preserved comes from I imagine it's an evangelical name as in like it's like being called like saved or something it's the deal with God yeah but if your surname's Fish no adjectives yeah I think has to be the rule you've just you can't put something in front of Fish no you gotta be careful with Fish yeah you gotta be Fish is gonna get you in trouble like anything with Fish you need to keep a really straight bat I think in the first time around.

16:48There's two people in history. I think it's British history. Now, I don't know what part. I think it might have something to do with the South Sea bubble or something like that, or it might be something else. But in British history, there was a father and a son where their names were absolutely insane, where it was sort of like, Bartholomew, if the Lord loves me or then strike me down now, johnson like there's like yeah yeah you know like nowadays where it's like if some if one of your mates or something has a baby and it and it's a sort of obscure name and it's like they're just trying to be trendy yeah they didn't give a fuck back in the day they did not i mean late night fish like late 19th century as well are absolute yeah bananas like all sorts of stuff coming in yeah stuff that's just like i think i've taken over the yeah thing i think it's i think it's contagious anyway so preserved fish but then um this is the fact i've got for you in uh peru there's quite a lot of people with the name made in user it's a condensing of made in usa yeah because stuff would arrive and it would say made in usa right and they'd be like well that's a good name and so quite a lot of people called made in usa made in usa yeah also uh also from latin america including peru also usa navy from us us navy so usa navi i guess yeah uh john f kennedy and all one word, Marlon Brando.

18:36Marlon Brando. Marlon Brando. So, yeah, that's... I tell you what, man. Michael Jackson. Michael Jackson as well. Michael Jackson. Oh, they're all... Okay. First name. Yeah. It's a first as a whole name. Yeah. America. So it's any kind of symbol of America. I need to get in touch with whoever America's PR is because they are so great at marketing, aren't they? They're unbelievable. They're so great at marketing. It reminds me of when, I think it's the Godfather, I think it's the first Godfather, where Michael ends up going to Italy for a bit because he just shot that police officer, that police captain, right?

19:14Yeah. And there's American soldiers still in Italy at this point. And Michael's with two sort of Italian minders. Yeah. And the Italian bloke's going, American GI, American GI, take me to America. Clark Gable. Clark Gable, yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah. They've got incredible PR. They've got, yeah, like a stop sign. Yeah. Like a stop sign is like a brand almost. They're so good at sorts. Why is anyone wandering around another country wearing a United States flag on their clothing? You want to be like, what the fuck are you doing? Yeah, yeah. Genuinely, what are you doing? Yeah. Something I think would be a good question for you to ask one another is what sort of US celebrity or symbol would you like is your surname?

19:59I think that could be quite fun to chat about. Okay. What would my... Well, yeah, so... Oh, here's a question for you. What celebrity... No, no, no, no, you ask, you ask. I asked it in a very way. Oh, no, I wasn't trying to... No, but you... People like you involved. And this is great stuff. And then they'll be like, oh, look at that. Right, for the edit. Look what the man did. For the edit, Lily May... She said that. Lily May's doing an incredible job as a producer. I genuinely thought you meant you were feeding me a line. No, that is... That is what Lily May was doing. Yeah, fine. But my argument is that she should be included in the podcast.

20:30Well, I agree. and people like your voice. I've been saying that. I'm always saying stuff like that. God. I love all that stuff. Can't get me on that. But what is... I've been saying that for years. I didn't deliver it. No, no. But also explain it better to me because I'm an idiot. Fine. I'm just fucking panicking now. I'm hitting my mic with my... It's okay. It's a safe space. What would you like us to discuss, Lin-Man? I thought it would be an interesting question. So what would you change your surname to if you had to have an American icon or an American symbol as your surname, a.k.a. Made in USA?

21:09Or something. Liberty? James Liberty. Liberty, Liberty, Liberty, Liberty. I've spent quite a bit of time in America. I'd be called Joe Capitol Records Building. Joe Capitol Records Building. I've spent a bit of time in America. not obviously no like a percentage of my life that i've spent in america maybe two percent or something like that but i've been there enough time where i i can't like pizza pizza i i just like their their commercials of just the little geico um lizard and stuff like i've got all these reference they're so good at marketing america honestly i've not even been in america that long And I know the – who's that – who's the woman that does the insurance?

21:55She's been doing these insurance adverts for years. And she's like a big – she's like a famous star in America for just being in adverts. Yeah. I don't know who that is. But I've said yes, that's good. But I just – I've just got all these American adverts in my consciousness all the time that I never see over here. oh um you know auto glass repair auto glass replace right they do that in america but their company's called something different i can't remember what it's called but i'd see that advert and i go it's auto glass repair repair and they go what does repair mean yeah and then i'd spit everywhere that shows them right i bet they again i've gone to a point where I don't know what point I'm trying to make.

22:44But it is interesting. This is your fault, Lily, mate. You should never get involved. That's why I shouldn't get involved. Right. You asked the simple question, what would we change our name to? And now we're in this situation. You're right. And I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry, Sir James Liberty. You're welcome. You're welcome. You're forgiven.

23:09We can move on to Fat Check if you want. I just went there that's why they shouldn't get involved and that's a quote from the office but I don't think anyone's going to know that so everyone who's listened to this does know alright fine so I'm just genuinely paranoid now no don't be paranoid it's okay well I haven't eaten anything today that's a problem apart from those two minstrels well depending on how quickly we get through this we've got time oh okay alright fine so look alright so we've done we're only on 22 minutes yeah I know but we've no but we wasted a lot of time at the beginning we're in the first half this is the best this is the best bit this is the chunk of the bit this is good stuff I'm not saying this is bad stuff so let's crack on with the good stuff so yeah right we agree that America has an unbelievable PR agency yeah they're brilliant to the extent that anything anything American everything's iconic just like the names of places yeah yeah the names of roads yeah become literally lyrical as in are like Like, so many American songs, they're like talking about places in America, roads that you're on, American cars.

24:15You couldn't do any of that in Britain. No, of course not. You couldn't be like, I was driving to Luton in a Vauxhall. Like, it just doesn't mean anything. It doesn't mean anything in America either, but it sounds like it does.

24:28Anyway, Joe. Yeah, let's go. Joe, let's move on to fact check. We've got to move on to fact check because this is where it'd be rude not to. It would be rude not to. And it'll also be a significant deviation from the format. Exactly. I believe we've got a message from Amy. Okay. Listen, by the way, if you didn't know, this is fact check. This is the point in the show where we check a fact that you've sent in. We confirm it or we poo-poo it. I've read this. This is definitely not true. Oh, hang on. You spoiled it. You can't do that. Where's your showmanship? What the hell? I'm definitely the America of this podcast, and you are definitely the Britain.

25:11All right. Where it's just a no-nonsense... No, not true. Whereas I want to put a bit of pizzazz on it, you know. Maybe sex it up a little bit. All right. On you go. We'll be reading a fact or a question that you'd like us to get to the bottom to, and then we'll discuss it during the break, and then we'll come back and let you know how true it feels to us. So before we go to the break, Joe, can you please give us this week's facts check from Amy, right, in Bournemouth? Okay. So, yes, this week's fact check comes from Amy in Bournemouth. She said, my husband came out with a blinder of a fact. The word fuck originated in medieval times when the king had to authorise couples to be able to do it.

25:59and it's an acronym and it stands for fornication under consent of the king and Amy says that's lived rent free in my brain for years and then signs off I hang on no I've already got thoughts let's go to the break and we'll jump straight back into this yeah we'll

26:27Queen Carvania stood haloed by the morning sun. An army hung on her every word. My champions, I have sold my chariot on Carvana. It was a lovely SUV, an inexplicably queenly offer. They're even coming to the castle to collect it. Tonight, we feast. An offer you can feast on. Sell your car today on Carvana. Pick up fees, may apply. This episode is sponsored by ZocDoc. Have you been putting off a doctor's appointment or need a dentist and you don't know where to start? We've definitely been there and that's why we use ZocDoc. Actually, over the holidays, Michael had a dental emergency and seemingly every office was closed.

27:14but we hopped onto ZocDoc, found an in-network dentist, had great reviews, saw real-time appointments available, which was key. It was on New Year's Day and booked an appointment in just minutes. It took so much of the stress out of the already stressful situation. ZocDoc makes it easy to search and compare over 250 ,000 local in-network providers across more than 200 specialties. So you can find the right doctor or dentist and book instantly. Taking care of your health just got easier. Download the ZocDoc app today and book that appointment on your to-do list. That's Z-O-C-D-O-C. ZocDoc. In a world where AI is changing every role in every industry, knowing who actually has deep expertise matters more than ever.

28:02Upwork connects you with the highly skilled freelance professionals with proven track records so you can hire with confidence. Upwork gives your business fast access to highly skilled specialists with deep expertise, so you can fill critical skill gaps, launch projects faster, and scale support up or down without committing to full-time headcount. With Business Plus, you can access the top 1 % of talent on Upwork. AI-powered shortlisting delivers a curated shortlist of top freelancers matched to your goals in under six hours. No endless searching required. Thousands of growing businesses already trust Upwork to hire highly skilled freelance professionals for everything from one-off projects to ongoing support.

28:40It's free to sign up and posting a job is easy. Visit Upwork.com right now and post your job for free. That is Upwork.com to connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's U-P-W-O-R-K.com, Upwork.com. Joe and James, Facts Up! Right, Joe, Joseph Thomas, as I live and breathe. Amy was it Amy? Yeah She wanted to know oh dear she wanted to know if the word fuck comes from medieval times when the king had to authorise couples to be able to right also first of all the king's not turning up No the king the king had the king had less power than he does now I mean the king was just some bloke in London Do you know what man?

29:26He had no means of knowing what was going on even like a couple of streets over When you're in primary school and you learn about like the Tudors for example like the Tudors such a big thing in primary school. Yeah, yeah. And I'm more interested in shooting... Speaking of PR, Henry VIII had fucking good PR, didn't he? Everyone's like, oh, he was a laugh, wasn't he? Oh, no, he just kept fucking killing people. I mean, like... It depends where you are. Like, in his early days, he was like... Yeah, he was a bit of a laugh and all that. Yeah. And up for a good time. Yeah. But then he got really bitter.

29:53Yeah. Because I think it was because his heroes, like, he loved the Battle of Agincourt and stuff like that. He wanted to get... He really, really wanted to invade France. He wanted France back, didn't he? But there was no real reason. And this is my point. When you learn about Tudors and kings and queens and stuff in primary school, you just think there were these people that were just like off with their head. But they were precarious. Their position, they were always being contested. And if a load of noblemen were like, nah, he's not doing it for me, let's get William the Bastard to come over and give Harold a good kick in or whatever.

30:33Like that was always around the corner. And a lot of it is about whether you can tell a plausible story and get it to stick. So back to what Amy said about the fuck, the origins of the word fuck. They go back to medieval times when the king had to authorise couples to be able to do it. and it's an acronym of fornication under consent of the king. Now, obviously, the king's not turning up to every... No, it's... No. I do think, and of course, I'm not a historian, Joe. Sorry about that. I know you're shocked. No, well... So my history references are things like Blackadder, Braveheart, things like that.

31:20Now, there was a time when noblemen, again, Braveheart is my research here, where noblemen either got to do the wife first or whatever. Yeah, yeah. Like the land, the seigneur's right to seigneur. The lord. The lord of the manor was like, well, congratulations on getting married, but it's my, what do they call it? They're right. But they're lords, right? There was a name for it. Lily May, get on that for us. And it was... Ah, yeah, right to the lord. So there was that sort of, you know, the lord would be able to have sex first with the wife. I don't know if that was genuinely upheld. I don't think that's true.

32:09I think sometimes things happen like twice and it's like... And then it goes down in history. But that's fair enough for lords, right? Yeah. The king. Yeah. The king's got to fucking now go all the way around all of the land before they're allowed to have it off. I think the thing here is that we imagine that kings, because they claim divine right, and that's a huge claim, that because of that they sort of had this kind of totalitarian power. But the point is you can't have – What you're talking about here is a king having an almost totalitarian reach, like being able to see into people's households.

32:50Yeah. You can't even begin to think about that until at least the 20th century. Until they got the dildo tubes. That's why they got the dildo tubes. To get messages around extra quick. Yeah.

33:07That was the beginning of totalitarianism, was the dildo tube. But I think, although the king might have, I mean, many people might never even have seen the king. I mean, it's not like you're going to see him on television. He's some guy who might go around the country occasionally so that people can see him, like on a royal tour or something. But the actual, the real reach of, you know, in general laws are upheld by consent. And the actual, the institutions of the state at this time would have been extremely small. people basically would have done what they wanted to a large extent and their stuff was brought to a core and then there would have been a precedent set that then would have shifted behaviours again.

33:51But the idea that the reach of the state, which is really what the king is, is very minimum at this time. Yeah, like the immediate contact with your everyday person. Yeah. Like even up until quite recently, like a couple of hundred years until they started getting really good at portraits and stuff like that. Yeah. And no one's going to have a portrait of Henry VIII in their house anyway. No, no. But it used to be like, oh, they'd have their face on a coin. Yeah. And they looked shit. Yeah. I could draw something better than that. Yeah. It's hard to get stuff onto a coin, isn't it? Well. Because you're working in metal.

34:27Obviously, yeah. It's hard. I think like one of the oldest. If I was going to draw a quick sketch, I wouldn't choose metal as a thing to do my sketch on. I think it's like Ethel the Unready or something like that. Go on, go on. Why, you think I'm going to make a fool of myself? No, no, no, no, no, I'm not. I know what I mean is this is our, we like this stuff. No, but I think the only reference we've got to his image is like a really shit drawing of a coin. Yeah, and you're like, that just looks like a person and not even very much like a person. If my kids drew that when they were like a toddler or something, I'd go, do you want to fucking, do you want to give that another go?

35:01Yeah, yeah. That's not going on the fridge, mate. No. Not being funny. Let alone on the currency. Exactly. Yeah. exactly so what we're saying here this is a lovely idea this is a way and a great acronym and right i don't think policy is the more interesting the more true is all i'm gonna say i think it's too silly okay i think it's too silly to be to be interesting wow i think it's too silly it like i don't think they had acronyms and also medieval times language was so different It was, you know, it was still very much. I mean, like a lot of it was still like English. You're right. A lot of it was still French.

35:41Yeah. English was peasants language. Yeah. And English wasn't anything like how we speak now. It was still very much. Quite right. Sort of the Angles, the Saxons, Dutch, Northern German. That's right. And then the Normans obviously would have French or an earlier form of French, which would have been the language of the ruling class. Yeah. And it's all gradually got jumbled up. I would say fuck is – I think we've got a split jury here because I think if it's interesting, it's true. I think it is interesting. I don't think it is. You're saying that's not interesting? No. See, this is a new problem now that we've got.

36:30It is. We didn't consider this. Because I think it's interesting if I think it's true. I don't think this is true at all. It's a paradox. Yeah. It's inception. Maybe it's just not grabbed you in the right way for it to feel interesting to be true. I just don't think the word fuck is either Central Europe, like you can always trace anything language back to even France, Northern Germany, Denmark, or Scandinavian. I feel fuck might be Scandinavian. Right, right. It might be one of the Vikingers. It sounds quite sort of. There was Danish, but I feel like it was, or Norse, or... But are we split? Is there anything I've said just then?

37:22because you're saying it can't be it can't be it can't be interesting because it's not true I know but also what we're saying is if it is interesting it's true but what I just said then or is it a paradox or are we actually just saying that we like things to be true but what I just said then right yeah all made up in my head yeah okay so even again but was that more interesting than what I'm putting to you Joe yeah is that is that me talking about angles and Saxons and stuff. Was that more interesting than the acronym? There's a level of plausibility that I'm hearing coming out. So plausibility is part of how much it grabs you.

38:01Yeah. Okay. All right. Look, I think it's... I don't think it's true. I don't think it's true and I don't think it's plausible. But you do think it's interesting. Nonetheless, I think it's... You know, I think it's a... I think it's a saucy little acronym and I feel that it's one that I could see myself using. Do you think they're talking about Elvis as well? Oh, Elvis. Yeah. Did Elvis have to be present? Elvis had to be there as well. He's just going home, mama. Yeah.

38:38Oh, yeah. The king gives his consent, mama. Then he did a little karate chop. Well, I don't know how long Amy... Look out! I don't know how long Amy and her husband have been together, but it does come to a point where you need to, you know, spice things up a little bit. And maybe this is, I'm just saying this could be in the armoury. Yeah. And maybe it's like, oh, the king doth decree, you know. Maybe he's got a little crown on and the robe, nothing else. Yeah. What I'm saying is I think this is really a little insight into their sex life. Do you think they're kings? And I say good luck to them.

39:13Do you think he has a scepter? Yeah, he's got a fucking scepter. He's definitely dressed up as a king He's got a scepter And she's knighted He's got like He's got like The classic I mean I've mentioned three times today already That Blackadder's my Sort of You know what I But he's got He's got the robes of state on You know those sort of like Fluffy Yeah With the like Velvet gown Yeah But Y-fronts Yeah Just the Y-fronts But nothing else Yeah With a scepter Yeah, that is, I think so. I think that's what he's got. Have we stumbled into Amy and her husband's little kinky sex game? I think we have.

39:52Is that what's going on? Also, we have. Maybe we should say it's a fact then. Well, that's what I mean. Sort of what I'm saying is I think this is, I think it's important to them. It's interesting enough for it to be a fact. Is that what you're saying? I'm saying it's true. I just, I think it's fun. All right. I think it's, I think it's fun. I think it, I'm going to say, I think it's sexy. I mean, I'm... I mean, sorry. I'm fully wrecked. And just thinking about the king. And I think... Just thinking about the king's consent. In fact, when I get home tonight and I see Claire, I'm going to go, do I get the king's consent tonight, Bobby?

40:34So it should be true. If it's not true, it should be. And that's a fact. It's true. We're saying it's true. That's a fact. All right, we're going to say it's a fact, but I don't think it is. I mean, there's no... Yeah. so we need to go to Lily May now for the Queen's consent let's get the Queen's consent that's going to that's going to carry on for every episode I'm more than happy to become the Queen okay what do you say ma 'am thank you it's ma 'am actually, ma 'am as in jam and not ma 'am as in oh ma 'am I'll have both, that's absolutely fine sorry ma 'am okay so the word fuck actually comes from Germanic origin so James your plausibility was on the right path to be fair if you've got a super basic knowledge of history that's what I would like is anything you could throw up anything it's like it's Germanic yeah but there's a so there's a few different languages German being one of them that have words that are very similar to fuck that means to breed or to copulate so the German is ficken Dutch is fucken Swedish is fucka and Norwegian is fuck ah.

41:44There you go. So there we go. All good stuff. So it's a fact and also I was right. That's a double win. Double win. That's a double win. All right. Good night. Thanks guys. Leave him wanting more. Thanks guys. There you go. Can I, I'm ever so sorry, can I go for another piss? You're asking for the Queen's consent. Does the Queen give me permission to go to the toilet and then I'll do my fact straight afterwards. Okay, perfect. Yeah, that's all good. Absolutely. right Joe strap yourself in mate yeah and everyone listening for what because as per Joe's request that we do facts about names yeah it's time for my fact for you Joe so I decided to look into the origins of the name Thomas oh and it goes way back mate it goes so far how far back do you think it goes A thousand years Keep going 1500 What if I said to the What if I said this word to you?

42:53Aramaic Whoa Oh no Yeah yeah Aramaic Yeah yeah It was Aramaic Yeah yeah it was Aramaic Yeah yeah yeah That's far isn't it? That is far Yeah Is that the language Jesus spoke? I'm thinking like Indiana Jones when I hear Aramaic Right So that is a Yeah that's Old Testament What's the language that Jesus spoke in Passion of the Christ? He was great in that. Jesus. Yeah, he was so good. Doesn't get enough credit for it. I've never seen it. I've never seen Passion of the Christ. No, I haven't seen it. Didn't he get the record number of complaints or something? This is just a reservation. Yeah, because they implied that he had sex.

43:27Jesus. Yeah. Not on my watch. No. I think it was Passion of the Christ anyway. No, that's the Scorsese film you're thinking of. Is it? Where I think Scorsese did like this sort of De Niro version of Jesus. Right. Okay. It was like Goodfellas, but Jesus. Again, I've not seen it. That sounds right. Yeah. But I'm sure Scorsese did a Jesus film. Well, I was going to say, I've just looked up Aramaic as the language in The Version of the Christ. Right. There we go. And Thomas goes back to that. Yeah, man. Because it was a Welsh thing. Obviously. Yeah, that's where I thought we would end up. I thought it was going to be really cut and dry.

44:10It was like Welsh. Wales, like Cardiff. Wales, by the way, the word Wales, don't quote me on this. It's all right. I think means, when we're going back a few thousand years, I think it means. Does it mean something like villains or something? Something like that. I think it does, yeah. Or barbaric people or something like that. Yeah, I think you're right. It is like Vales or something. Yeah. I think that is right. Yeah. So basically... Can you just look up for me quickly what the Romans called Wales? Because I think it came from Roman times. Well, I did just look up one sec. I'll see what Romans say.

44:58so it has no direct Roman meaning but it says the English name for Wales comes from Old English word I don't know how you'd say this but it's W-E-A-L-A-S and it means foreigners foreigners yeah foreigners okay no but that is Roman that is Roman because in Roman times if you were foreign that was like awful that was like the worst thing to do so they hated like beer right they absolutely hated beer they loved wine because it was so refined and if you drank beer, you were a foreigner. Foreigner. But then it flipped because you had like the Germanic tribes and the barbarians or whatever. Like they'd love a beer and they'd love a fucking booze up and a ruck and stuff like that.

45:39Yeah. And they were like, oh, they're very effeminate, which sort of still relates today. Like if you went to a pub with your mates and you went, oh, I'll have a little Chardonnay or something like that. My pals would be like, what the fuck are you doing? Yeah, get out. Yeah. Yeah, get a pint or get out. Get out. Yeah. Either kiss me or get out. That's what they would say. Either make love to me right now. Exactly. Yeah. Right? Yeah. But that's still, like, you go back 2 ,000 years, and that was still the sort of, those preconceptions of, like, beer drinkers and wine drinkers. But then Romans did start to cotton on and be like, these people are really hard to fight, and they're drinking beer all the time, and maybe we should get into this a little bit.

46:24Yeah. Maybe we should toughen up. They'd got a bit too soft in their cities. Yeah, that was it. Yeah, and all their order and the drainage. Yeah, I know. You know? Yeah. Whereas we're just in there shitting in our pints and drinking it. Well, exactly. But yeah, no, Thomas. You can see how that would play out. Thomas, Aramaic, mate. Aramaic? Like Greek, like Aramaic, Greek, Toma. Toma. Was transliterated. That's a new word for me. Yeah, transliterated into Greek. Its meaning was twin. Twin? Twin. The Romans, and then went from Greek to Latin, the Romans adopted it as Thomas, which spread widely through the Christian world.

47:11You've got biblical references to Thomas. The name came popular due to St. Thomas, the apostle, one of Jesus's 12 disciples. Yes. I believe it's doubting Thomas, isn't it? Doubting Thomas, yeah, for his scepticism about the resurrection, yeah. He doubted him. Yeah, he did. So you'd think that name would have died out, like how crazy Christianity went in Europe. It's not as bad as Judas, though, is it? It's like he was just... My son's called Jude. That's all right. Is that okay? Yeah. He's all right. No, it's some... Yeah, that's fine. But the name entered Western Europe through the Latin Bible and became common in many languages, English, French, Spanish, Tomas, Italian, Tomaso, of course.

47:59That's not me being racist, by the way. No, no, it's just that. It's literally what it says. If you put a vowel on the end of a name, you immediately become Italian. And then German, Thomas, all apart from Spanish and Italian, all with the same spelling. So in essence, Thomas means twin, and its enduring popularity comes largely from its biblical and Christian heritage. I really did not know that. And then it goes on to say, would you like me to include how the names, pronunciation or forms changed in different regions over time? I just copied and pasted from ChatGPT. Yeah, that's okay. That's fine.

48:36But, well, look, I've – But Thomas – Thank you to ChatGPT. And you twin. But what's very interesting about your name, Thomas, is that first of all it has its nowadays I would I would think of the Welsh like Tom like it feels very Welsh it is very Welsh but it's also very English as well because obviously the when English people went to fight and stuff like that they were called Tommies Tommies yes you're right yeah so it's sort of like a generic name for an English person it is it's a very or a British person it's a very UK name yeah it's a very UK name

49:21This ad is sponsored by ZocDoc. Hi, it's Danny Pellegrino from Everything Iconic. Have you been putting off that annual doctor's appointment because you don't want to make the call? Or maybe you've been meaning to find a new dentist, but you have no idea where to start. I find that's especially true when you move. It's hard to find your people. I've been there, which is why I use ZocDoc. Now, as a busy podcaster, parent, and someone who's always juggling a million things, I love anything that makes life easier. And ZocDoc lets you search and compare local in-network doctors with over 250 ,000 providers across more than 200 specialties.

49:55You can read reviews from real patients, find a provider who feels like the right fit, see actual appointment openings, and book instantly. I recently had a last-minute health issue pop up and needed to see someone fast. Instead of calling around or sitting on hold, I found a doctor on ZocDoc and booked an appointment in just a few minutes. It made the whole process so much less stressful. Now, taking care of your health just got easier. Download the ZocDoc app today. That's ZocDoc, Z-O-C-D-O-C, and book that appointment on your to-do list. In a world where AI is changing every role in every industry, knowing who actually has deep expertise matters more than ever.

50:33Upwork connects you with the highly skilled freelance professionals with proven track records, so you can hire with confidence. Upwork gives your business fast access to highly skilled specialists with deep expertise, so you can fill critical skill gaps, launch projects faster, and scale support up or down without committing to full-time headcount. With Business Plus, you can access the top 1 % of talent on Upwork. AI-powered shortlisting delivers a curated shortlist of top freelancers matched to your goals in under six hours. No endless searching required. Thousands of growing businesses already trust Upwork to hire highly skilled freelance professionals for everything Everything from one-off projects to ongoing support.

51:11It's free to sign up and posting a job is easy. Visit Upwork.com right now and post your job for free. That is Upwork.com to connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's U-P-W-O-R-K dot com. Upwork.com. Evening. Buyers remorse. Buy a new car? I'll be moving in. Let's get started. Sorry, I think there's been a mistake. I bought it from Carvana. You what? Yeah, great price. I even have seven days to love it or return it. So there's no... No, no buyer's remorse. More like buyer's rejoice. I guess I'll let myself out. Congratulations. I mean it. Buyer's rejoice. Buy your car today on Carvana.

51:53Limitations and exclusions may apply. See our seven-day return policy at Carvana.com. Joe and James, Facts Up! I told you about my... I once had a therapist where I really did tell her about my dreams. Not the one about the octopus, was it? No, not the octopus one. Right, okay. I know we've done dreams, but I had a... The theranthroporn, yeah, sorry. And philanthroporm, yeah. That was a word that you made up, right? I made it up. I made it up in my dream. Yeah. I had this really nice therapist who she literally did work with dreams. I really would lie down and tell her about my dreams. And she was Italian.

52:36and I was being completely honest about all my dreams because you have to be totally honest and all my dreams they just kept being set in like sort of like pasta restaurants and I had to tell her and she was like I think she was like it's funny I think the Italian thing is it got in your head a little bit I think it's bothering you it's not bothering me I just have to tell you the truth because you are so neurotic but she was just I was just like I think it was she's nailed you man She was, she was right She was like, it's got in your head I was like, I know but it's not my fault This isn't me, this is my dream You are so neurotic That someone, like a therapist Has to be an Italian And then suddenly you're thrown It was so bad, but every week I'd come in And I'd have it all written in my phone I'd be like, I'm going to have to tell about another fucking pizzeria It's like I'm not meaning to I'm not reducing Italian culture To Italian food either I'm just, it just kept happening.

53:35And it was really embarrassing. We couldn't get past it. And she was just like, I think he's a god in your head. It's obviously worrying you a bit. I was like, it's not worrying. I was like, no, it's not. But it must have been. It was awful. It definitely was. I know exactly what you're like. But it wasn't. I don't believe it was a malign prejudice. No, absolutely not. I believe it was, if anything, perhaps a benign reductionism, perhaps. Of all the people I know in my life, I know that you only ever come from a good place. You're pure and honest. Yeah. And you're honest in your flaws as well.

54:08And I know for a fact that you met this therapist and went, oh, Italian. And then that thought went insane. Like it just was in your dreams. It took over everything. Even though I said a lot about your name there that was boring, I genuinely thought the most interesting in your name that he goes back to Aramaic that is amazing that's well old super old it's really old and it genuinely news to me so thank you for that fact almost as old as you right Joe we should wrap up before it gets any weirder because we've got another episode to record straight after this which is going to be stay tuned for next episode I'm being fucking out because I've got another beer I felt like this one there are bits So I was like, what the fuck are we doing here?

54:59Next episode, I am just going to be drunk. I'm all fact-out, Joe. I'm fact-out. Right, what have we learned today? We have learned that, what was your name, fact? That Madainusa is a name in Peru. Yeah, made in USA. It means made in USA. Absolutely brilliant. We've learned that fornication under consent of the king is what we're saying is where the word fuck comes from. And we've also learned that the name Thomas is so old that Jesus – I mean, yeah, he had a disciple, didn't he, called Thomas? I feel like an idiot now. Of course he was. Yeah, now you say it. But I wondered whether it – He had a mate called Thomas, Jesus.

55:48He was like – I assume that they changed it when they brought out the King James Bible. That's it, yeah. They changed it from an older name and they were like... A lot of stuff gets translated, doesn't it? They do. I assumed it was like when they did the new Bible, it was like when they do like an American remake of something. And they're like, well, change the names and set it in downtown Manhattan. Its original form, if you're interested, Joe, is T... What's that thing? T... Tioma. Tioma, yeah. As in kind of, as in like Odoherty or... Yeah. Toma. Toma. Tioma. Tioma. Tioma. there you go we've learnt the Thomas's Aramaic we do hope that you've learnt something as well I mean good luck but we'll be back next week armed with more facts chats and sweary twats and don't forget don't forget that you can get in touch with us if you'd like us to fact check something I feel like this is the worst one we've done yeah

56:47I don't know what you want to move from me yeah probably don't forget that you can get in touch with us if you like us to fact check something that feels true for you or whatever nonsense. Any message that you want to get to us, it doesn't have to be a fact check thing, by the way, if you want to get us a message. If you've got something where you're like, give these two idiots. Just something to fill up the fucking show. Honestly, because there are bits in that where I was like, I can't think of anything to say. I literally can't think of anything to say. If you've got something to say. We've got to do another one.

57:15We've got to do another one now. I'd like to get the, like, see what two idiots would say about this. Then message us Our email is hello at joeandjamespod.com. Our WhatsApp is 08... Our WhatsApp is 07822-034330. And our socials on TikTok and all that sort of stuff is joeandjamespod. At joeandjamespod, I should say. Can we get rid of the hat? Fucking... What's the point of the hat? Maybe that's a fact from... Do you know what? I did watch a fucking YouTube documentary. I've forgotten it now, but I watched the thing of the origins of the app. Wow. I think it's Latin, at Turner. Anyway. It is interesting.

58:00That's another episode. Guys, thank you for listening. We love you. We're sorry. Thank you. That's an episode. Goodbye. Bye. All the best. Bye. Joe and James fucked up.

58:20Back to school is busy enough. The last thing you need is shopping that makes it harder. Whether you're moving into a dorm, your first apartment, or just getting organized for the semester, Wayfair makes it easy to get everything you need in one place. Furniture, bedding, storage, decor, study essentials, all at prices you'll love with fast shipping before move-in day. Get everything you need for back-to-school season. Shop Wayfair.com today. It's time to set your sights on higher peaks to scale, deeper rivers to cross, and greater dreams to pursue. It's time to embrace the impossible with Defender.

59:00Built with legendary capability and tested on some of the most difficult terrain, Defender defines tough luxury. From the sleek two-door Defender 90 to the purposeful Defender 110, to the Defender 130 with seating for up to eight. There's endless potential ahead. Explore the full Defender lineup at LandRoverUSA.com. Hello, I'm Monica Reinagle, host of the Nutrition Diva podcast. Summer is here and with it, the hot and sticky weather. A morning working in the garden or maybe on the golf course can leave you more depleted than you realize. And plain water isn't always the most efficient way to restore the balance.

59:36That's where Liquid IV comes in. Its science-backed formula is clinically proven to hydrate faster than water alone. Whether you're exercising, playing outside, or simply surviving a summer heat wave, it's an easy way to stay hydrated. Shop now at liquidiv.com. Liquid IV, hydration that goes wherever life takes you.