Building Luxury Mum Guide | How Federika Turned Motherhood Into a Movement

0:00Today I'm bringing our first ever Sunday launch to the studio. I'm joined by Federica Turner, entrepreneur, educator turned founder and the woman behind the Luxury Mum Guide, a platform redefining modern motherhood and what that looks like. So let's find out why she's a lady who launched.

0:28so pleased to have you it's particularly when you are so heavily pregnant thank you we should flag you you should be at home in your pajamas just chilling but i've dragged you out thank you yeah i'm so honored to be here so thanks for having me but we also should say that you're our first ever Sunday launch in the studio wait really but did you know this no you're our first ever Sunday launch in the studio we're very very excited oh and you've inspired us to do more of this we wanted to kind of do a little bit more of that too well we've seen your sort of day in the life of so I'm so pleased to like dive a little bit deeper and I think this really happened to me I remember I was in a girl band and becoming pregnant wasn't the like done thing whilst being in a girl band and I remember really not knowing what I was going to do next and how to now shape my career perhaps in a different direction because actually my whole life has changed I have completely changed because I'm now a mum and I kind of need to figure out a new path for myself and how that looks and And I really, I love what you've done here because I think it's so, so smart.

1:37And I think one thing I always say to people that are in any industry, of course, there are lots more challenges when you, particularly, I suppose, in the corporate world, et cetera, when you have a little one. But for me, it gave me a whole different purpose. I've become this lioness mama. And I was like, OK, this, it made me actually level up my graft, I think. and I think my better years have really come since having kids actually that's actually when my career really took off for myself so I always start with that because it's such a worry when you're pregnant and you think what am I going to do now is there space for me but what I love for you is that you've really you're carving your own which is so so inspiring so take us back to the moment that you started the luxury mum guide what was happening in your life at that time so at the time I was nine months postpartum so for context we moved out of London three or so weeks before our son was born so we live in Hertfordshire um in St Albans which you know you know it's such a mummy it's where my warehouse is for my little car I heard just now um but that in itself was a big shock just for us as a family it was the right thing to do but it was you know very small compared to London obviously and it had been about like I say nine months where I'd been to the local cafes every day you know what it's like when you're on maternity leave and it's you go to the same spots you meet the same mums and it's all very safe and it's great but a lot of what I was doing day to day was based around my son and I think that's fine but after a while I got to the point where I thought right I'm ready now to do something for myself and I'm still on maternity I'm gonna to have a look at what's out there in terms of you know experiences for mums with small children I quite like to go into London I'm going to start there I'm going to have a google and see like okay if it's not your calf or if it's not a pub where can you go that's a little bit more of an elevated experience but I can still bring my son that isn't just a soft play isn't just a soft play or a breastfeeding workshop or something like that which those things definitely have a time and place but like I said I was coming out of that now yeah um so I had a quick google couldn't find anything that pointed me in the right direction of those places and I just thought is that going to stop me from going it could it couldn't but I made the decision to go I drove in the first time because I wasn't too sure about the transport that's a whole whole nother thing with a buggy and things like that and I drove in and I went to like a restaurant that I would normally go to before I had my son and it was the first time that it kind of clicked that mums are going to be returning to a world that no longer recognizes them in their new identity.

4:33There wasn't accessibility for the pram, there wasn't anywhere. Once I got the pram up the stairs with the help of the people there to put it next to me and he was still napping twice a day so I didn't want to have the pram not with us um there wasn't a baby change there was a disabled toilet but they'd kind of bless them like stacked you know it was more like a storage and it was almost like we're kind of kid tolerant not kid friendly like it's almost like well you can bring them here but this that experience that you're talking about is exactly what puts parents going anywhere again because it just feels like a headache yeah exactly and it was it was and I thought to myself gosh mums are isolated anyway in general but why should we have to be isolated from you know these sorts of experiences as well um so I went home and I got thinking and I thought gosh I wish there was a guide that had saved me this time um you know it's somewhere nice it could be your birthday it could be your partner's birthday you want to take the kids here's where to go that's going to accommodate you and that's the moment it really clicked for me and because I googled and couldn't find anything I literally thought I'm just going to make it myself.

5:41So yeah, the luxury mum guide. I mean, it's so brilliant because there's such a kind of beautiful simplicity with it. Because of course, how did that not exist? How is that not a thing? Like you say, you just Googled assuming that someone would have done this before and you would have found something suitable in the way that you kind of want it to present itself. how do you think there's a sort of going back a little bit did you feel at that time obviously then you it was that moment that gave you that idea and that light bulb to sort of okay maybe I should look into doing this now and do something for me but around that time did you experience that moment where you just felt that you lost your identity a little bit and I suppose it's one way that it might manifest itself like going to a place that you always went to and that might be lovely and I'm going to now do it with my little one and then really realizing god this is I've lost my identity already but now this I can't even do the things that I used to do and of course we're very aware that when we have children we have to change our lives and our lives are going to change but it's quite a really tricky sort of period of time to navigate through and find your feet when you actually feel like I can't I'm not the same person as I am before but I am I am in there too but I know that I now have this different level of responsibility and you know this beating heart that's outside of me but I still am her too so how do I now find the right path for me yeah that's exactly it so the identity loss I think is a big thing but I think particularly at the time for me I was still going back to a nine-to-five working job and I think the worry there was that I'm losing part of myself in motherhood but if I'm going to be doing if I'm going to be spending time away from my son I really want to be my true authentic self and I kind of it clicked at that moment that the job that I had even though I loved and had been in that sector for coming under 10 years what were you doing before I was a teacher right so I was a primary school teacher um I didn't I knew you were but I didn't know that was up until this point yeah so that's a big shift isn't it I was a primary school teacher and then I actually um started my own business education consulting um so that was kind of what I was doing right before this um but even then it was like there was this I guess tug of war between this isn't really what I want to be doing right now and you kind of open a new community don't you when you become a mum and you're kind of you see the challenges that that community faces and I just thought straight away like this is where I could help and this is where I guess pulling in my experience of being a teacher and working in education I think for me that experience was really formative and kind of getting me to the place that I am here with the luxury mum guide and it's interesting because working as a primary school teacher in Tottenham and then having a brand called the luxury mum guide I think you would never really marry the two but I think fundamentally underlying those two things is the idea of supporting families supporting mothers and actually when we might come on to this but when I became a teacher it was the first time that I saw parental sacrifice for their kids but really maternal sacrifice and explain what you mean by that so in Tottenham it was quite a this area particularly was a very low socioeconomic area and it meant that both parents just had to work and I think that's the reality of a lot yeah people these days anyway um but often I saw the weight fall on the mum a lot so you know she could be working both parents even though both parents so she could be working two three jobs um but then also trying to make the parents evenings trying to make the drop-offs um and I do remember thinking like oh my goodness who's going to help the mum specifically like who where is this help going to come from um so yeah it's funny that I've kind of come back full circle to again mums I find that I think I read something the other day it said there's 600 ,000 women give birth in the UK a year and it was saying that out of those women there are 75 percent of them who have dependents who are in the paid workforce and it's so interesting because it's like if there's that many women in the paid workforce who have dependents why hasn't the system adapted to support them it's a very good point it's something that always baffles me yeah obviously because I have a baby brand I'm so tapped into this and we could you know I mean this could take us down a whole different path but we think about child care and the support and how well how what the opposite of easy it's made for parents and mums to be at work and when you it's it's a really it's such a tricky time to navigate and the system is not set up to make it easy for us exactly or easier easier yeah it's not going to be an easy experience but easier it doesn't kind of add any value to us we kind of have to find that value ourself which is really hard to get your head around at the time where you were sort of going to go back to work and you had I suppose that decision to make of how the next few years were going to look did you miss the version of you prior to having a little one did you miss that because I remember being really uncomfortable with the fact that I actually felt super guilty because I love I remember having a layer and I was really young when I had a layer but it's been the same with Valentina and Blake I love being a mum more than anything it's my I mean you've seen in here today it's holidays I've got kids coming out of my ear holes where I don't know how this record is so quiet to be honest um they are my number one priority nothing comes before them however I remember for quite a long period of time feeling very guilty that I still I'm still in love with my career I still want to have a thriving career I still enjoy that that is still such a big part of me and such a big part of my identity but I remember feeling really conflicted because I felt like I was supposed to really enjoy trips to the soft play or monkey music or Peppa Pig and you know walks around the park with a buggy and of course I love all of that but that wasn't I felt like I didn't want that to become my personality because it isn't naturally and I remember for a while not owning that and feeling really guilty about it and but I actually love my job and it's quite a like you say it can be a bit of an internal tug of war and a bit of an inner conflict because I love nothing more than my family and my children but I also love my job and I remember thinking okay I need to find a way that everything can happen and of course I'm not going to be great at everything at once but all of those things light me up nothing more than my family obviously but I remember thinking okay work as I know it isn't gonna be able to happen whilst raising a small family what does that mean and that's when I then decided to kind of go into more tv and then obviously build out a family brand you know because of my children so is that at that time did you miss the version of you prior to having a little one um in some ways I did but I think fundamentally having my son and becoming a mum really I really embodied that as a new new me I don't know how to explain it it's like I think that's part of the reason why I created a family centric brand it's like it's yes I'm working but it's to do with bettering the lives of mums and you know I can take my son to the events that I host and that's the whole point so you sort of I suppose in essence like you're doing the same thing you're creating a new life yeah but I suppose what I'm asking did it feel enough for you to never work again or did you miss that side of your brain you know yeah no I wouldn't have ever been enough for me to never work I mean 39 weeks pregnant and I'm doing this and I think I think if that just yeah I think I'm so blessed that I found something that allows me to use my brain in a way that's also you've carved that space for yourself I don't think it didn't fall on your feet you didn't you didn't find it you you went out and you made it happen yeah but I think it's funny because I think staying at home as a mum is a whole nother beast in itself oh my goodness and that's the hardest thing ever and actually I think because of that it's almost like having this and building this does feel like yes I'm using my brain and but sometimes it does also feel like a break I know it's a funny thing to say it feels like actually being away from my son when I am hosting events and he's not there or whatever it might be it's like it makes the time with him a lot more purposeful and I do catch myself you know whether I'm working on my laptop and he's there I'm like actually you're balancing but also I do really want to be with him and spend that time and he says to me mommy like if I'm on my phone he said you're gonna get square eyes um so yeah he does he does check me himself but yeah it definitely was a moment where I thought okay I don't want to lose my whole self to this what bits of myself can I take forward in a way that serves the current me um and yeah and then this is it so it's so so incredible so that day so you have that day you have that kind of experience at a restaurant that's kind of we've all been there haven't we we're like what if I why have I come out again that I've just made this whole like I could have just stayed at home I think this is that's sort of where it starts isn't it you then your social life is then a little bit depleted because you're like okay it's just easier I've got a nap at this time I know where I'm gonna be yeah everyone's happy there's not enough space in a restaurant when you don't know where to put my buggy it just it all seems a little bit like why bother so you have this experience you search for something that ironically you've now built you're hoping that this already exists when you realize it doesn't and then you think okay this is what I'm gonna get my teeth stuck into what's the first step that you make I actually spoke to mum friends in my community because I did have a moment before I fully launched where I thought is this just me I just kind of wanted to yes sense check this obviously it being my first baby wasn't sure if I was missing something so I spoke to a few other mums who kind of validated the concept a little bit and then the first thing I did was I hopped on social media and I thought I'm just gonna film an authentic almost like a day in the life experience of um I think it was Nobu actually I thought come with me and let's see what they've got and um yeah it just it picked up and people were commenting really kind of things that touched me in the sense that oh my gosh this is what I needed and DM started flooding in terms of um you know I tried to plan a birthday for my husband and it was really difficult we couldn't take the kids we ended up staying at home we would have loved to have had something like this to guide the way and that kind of fueled me so I just kept on posting and sharing and it wasn't until I had a DM again someone said you're going to all these places I'd love to come and I'd never go on my own would you think about hosting a group of us and I'm such a community-centric person it just kind of clicked for me that that was the next step for it yes so I did I hosted an event and it was a baby wine tasting event.

17:58First one. Genius. That's my kind of event, girl. And this is it. It's like, it's things that, again, you don't normally hear like luxury and motherhood in the same sentence. You don't hear wine tasting and motherhood in the same sentence. You do, my girl. You do. Give me the wine. We're used to holidays. Exactly. We're not tasting. We're drinking. Bringing those things to the forefront as opposed to being in the background is what I wanted to do. And that was it. We just started building the community and growing it. And people really left feeling seen. And, you know, it's not a chaotic vibe at all.

18:38Because, again, we're all living chaotic lives. Yes. But when you come to a Luxury Mum Guide event, the point is, like, there's childcare. There is a soft play area. But that's, you know, in a separate space to where the mums are mumming and being themselves. and you can obviously go between the two but it's very mum first and I found that a lot of events are baby first and then mums just happen to be there um so yeah another thing that I try and do is go for those premium venues right okay just because yes it's nice for mums to go to nice places but also to hold them to account I find that when you contact a venue and you say I'd love to host a baby friendly you know event with you and you kind of they're excited and then you reel through all the things that you would kind of require for them to provide or to work in collaboration with you to provide quite often they do sit back and think like gosh we're not family friendly at all um and I think since I've been doing this things are changing and places are adapting I've seen a lot more in terms of we provide child care now you know at a restaurant or at a hotel but the standard places that are within a certain affordable price range don't typically still have those facilities yeah like you can really tell can't you when you go somewhere and you go to the baby change and you're like oh or it's that bit that you just pull out over the toilet and it's really awkward there's no room to actually change the baby but exactly it's kind of like they've ticked a box and plugged it in because they have to yeah the difference between sort of going above and beyond and it's those little touches that make you come back yeah I always say that it is and if you're dealing with I suppose those more premium venues they have a more premium budget to be able to make sure that they're kind of reaching a certain threshold it's a standard I assume yeah and I think well you'd think you would think so I think what I've learned to be honest is not every venue is is for this not every venue wants to be a family friendly and I actually think that's fair I don't because if that's not their brand you know exactly yeah and I think that's fair I think you know I see a lot online about people kind of saying children shouldn't be brought to certain places and this and that and there's a lot of discussion that can be had around that but for me it's more about the mum and like you can choose not to go somewhere but you shouldn't be forced not to be in the space yeah yeah yeah and I think when that does happen you're removing the agency from the mum like you're you're not giving her the choice yes to not be there you're saying she can't and I just don't think that's fair what how talk to me about the first event how did it look how kind of reactive were people when obviously this was kind of an ask to you and somebody sort of put this to you and said this is what you should be doing I want to I want to come I want to be involved I wouldn't go on my own so you've kind of the community that I suppose that you've organically built is is is from the want of other people so what did that first event look like and was it kind of quite clear to you that you were on the right track well for me there was a lot of imposter syndrome because I just couldn't wrap my head around the fact that anyone would want to buy tickets to come to something that was like living in my head so someone had asked for it I got in contact with um a wine company um in West Hamstead actually and just said look this is what I'm wanting to do it's a small venue do you want to collaborate on it they were happy to get involved um so we kept it really small and really intimate and just made sure that all the right things that I wanted to be there to make it a nice experience were there so we've talked about the baby change we've talked about the accessibility um we didn't have nannies at this stage because the babies were you know if you're having a wine tasting you kind of want to be able to wear them um but we were actually driving up to the midlands where my husband's family live and I put it on eventbrite and my phone just kept pinging and I thought absolutely not who on earth is buying these tickets and why but it was the first time it clicked that there is a need for this beyond just one comment and beyond what's in my head and like you were kind of alluding to the events in the community that I've built it it's really community-led it's I'm responding or I try and respond to things that are really important to the the women and the mums that follow me so it was great and then the second one after that we had an afternoon tea and that's kind of become like the flagship event I try and have one every Mother's Day and I try and have like one a quarter of the afternoon tea.

23:19Okay lovely. And then we've also done like a wellness morning which was really good. We did that in collaboration with the Four Seasons and I think that's interesting because there are I didn't know it was a franchise and I think if you go to certain places certain Four Seasons branches they're great like really family friendly but there are others that aren't and so that was quite a natural partnership in terms of the one at the London Tower Bridge being a bit more corporate yes yeah you're right but we were able to really turn it around and the space they gave us around and it made such a nice family friendly feel and yeah we just keep growing and iterating and changing our style are you noticing sort of as you grow and as the more that you're doing and the more of these kind meetups you're doing are you noticing that the kind of venues and the brands for possible collaborations are way more responsive now yeah I think so I think to be honest the landscape in terms of the luxury motherhood landscape between when I started doing this and now I think is changing and shifting I think a lot of brands want to be um kind of ahead of the curve in terms of accepting the fact that mums are almost like a new market within the luxury sector and so I think alongside me they're also you know wanting that for themselves so for example right at the beginning when I would reach out as you do every email hi this is who I am you know background on me and what I do this is my son cute picture it's crickets and I think you know starting off you're going to have that anyway but I am finding now that I'm able to also kind of show the benefits of events like this for the brand and they are a lot more receptive.

25:16Would you say your kind of ambition has changed like during the course of this I suppose you have a baby and that's the reason that this idea is born but have you kind of noticed your I suppose ambition to your career and for now what you're doing, has that changed in your approach to it? Is it changed at all? I suppose after you could see the real connection from other women, does that instantly make you, give you that fire to go, okay, now we should level it up to this and at one point I want to do that. Has it changed, yeah, the way that you are? It has. I think starting off it was content, wasn't it?

25:57It was I'm going to show, I'm going to share and I'm going to create these guides. now moving into the events it's kind of thinking more about I guess systemic change and how I can build on the community that I have already and you know mums women we're all intersectional so a lot of these women are going back to work or starting businesses and it's thinking about right how can I now adapt what I have to support a mum who went from yes being in a similar position to me on maternity leave to starting a business or maternity leave to going back to work what does that look like how can I create a space for them because a lot of mums go back if they do go back to work at all it might be part-time and they might be cooking up something cooking up a business or an idea it's funny isn't it it's like when you're at your most I guess vulnerable or in a transitional phase of life that's when the ideas come yes and I see a lot of true I see a lot of memes where it's like mum's plotting you know the business on mat leave yeah but it is true my best ideas have come from I mean I'm self-employed so my mat leave is pretty much non-existent but that moment where I'm like a bit quieter that's when my ideas really come and like you become this you become more determined I think because you're like it is that lioness mum isn't it I've got this baby to do this for and I'm gonna you know yeah it is and And so to answer your question, it's like now thinking about the next thing, it's thinking about, right, where are those mums at now?

27:32Because in the time that I've started, you know, they don't they don't have babies anymore. They might have since then had more children. But a lot of them are still figuring out that next phase of motherhood within a different sphere. Yeah. And so it's thinking about how can I meet them at that point of need within this? So, yeah, that's exactly it, isn't it? the journeys and we kind of do that as a brand as a baby brand follow the mother through that journey and almost those checkpoints and what they might need at the next stage or or however that looks what's your what's your goal do you think for the luxury mum guide like how do you if we were having this conversation another sort of three years how do you see the kind of evolution of the luxury man guide and what how do you sort of hope to reach women it's a good question I think the events is a big thing for me um I'd like to be doing more events a year but I'd also like to be scaling them up and collaborating with almost the brands that you shouldn't collaborate with as a mom right tell me like so well if you move beyond like hotels and restaurants and things I think there are brands that are I don't know almost like Zara for example so what really gets me at the moment is the lack of like maternity wear that's accessible and available and if it is available it's online and there aren't really many brands that you can kind of go in the shop try on the clothing.

29:09Yeah so kind of when I talk about events and scaling them up and thinking about the format and then working with brands you almost shouldn't it's things like putting mum in as putting mums in a zara store and filling it with um maternity clothes and making a real kind of elevated experience of it you shouldn't be ashamed of your changing body and kind of sat on the computer online ordering you know whatever it is you might be ordering it should be brought to light and i think doing those sorts of events like i say kind of putting mums in places you wouldn't normally think they would be that's a big goal of mine and something that I want to achieve I wonder why I wonder why like brands see that as almost it's like the like the moment time forgot isn't it that kind of that maternity they all sort of try their hand at the kind of big retailers for a second but it never there's like a little burst of maternity and then it then you don't see it again and I've really noticed that throughout sort of having children that I don't know is it because people are just sizing up and they don't want to necessarily commit to maternity clothing at that i i can never put my sort of finger on it but i'm always like surely there's a way bigger gap here yeah than brands are grabbing yeah but yeah i can't it's something that will always baffle me yeah i think it's possibly because it's just it's still not seen as a sexy thing is it i think you talked about you know when you were in a girl band and how it wasn't the done thing to have a kid i think that's still quite true in a lot of areas and so I think that's why it's online it's because it's crazy it's not they're not intentionally thinking but then you see brands that have launched and started you know like bump suit for example yeah they have added so much sort of they've actually made that category there like feel sexy they've kind of added so much personality into that space so then you think they launched as like a small brand that everybody I remember for a period of time was wearing those bump suits and the clothing they've done it really really well it there's a really strong aesthetic and it feels lovely but then the kind of big high street retailers yeah like it's all online I think that's the difference isn't it you have to make something new I think the people that are already there that you would normally again use in your everyday life and no longer serving your purpose yes and so therefore people are creating things and that's great but I do think that like I said I think holding brands to account is one of my favorite things to do and it seems like you do incredibly well I love that for you I love that for you and if there was if we're talking about so that would be I suppose that's like the dream collaboration for you isn't it or no we've got another dream no this is the dream collaboration for me and again it came from the community so I had a mum yeah who DM me and she said um I'm a lawyer I work in the city I'm on mat leave I got a pay rise on maternity which is apparently like unheard of in that sector she went into Chanel to buy a bag she thought yeah loving life smashed it gonna get myself a bag but she had her baby and with her with her right at a certain point she needed to feed and she went and asked them you know in the middle of the experience can I go anywhere to feed I think this was um in London one of the stores um and she said it just like their face just completely dropped and changed because they were looking at her thinking on the one hand no we don't have anywhere for you but on the other hand we kind of don't want you to be doing this in the store either and she just felt really degraded um and I put Chanel on my hit list and I thought one day one day we're gonna be doing something I know it's a completely the price point I know doesn't suit everybody and I think it's a statement but it's more the statement it's less that we're expecting mums to be buying from Chanel but it like you say it's more like you know even if it's something that they recognize themselves yeah and want to do and it all trickles down doesn't it if you get like you see that just in the high street generally if chanel if san loran these big brands are making something it will filter through to the h &ms and the zaras because they set the trends exactly so i think it's it's the statement to make versus yeah you know the fact that it's relatable and of course we you know can't go into chanel and buy a bag and that's a great privilege to have but they kind of are the tastemakers and they they kind of set the pace for everybody else and all of those kind of big retailers so it would that would be an incredible statement yeah to make one day one day I listen if anyone can you can you've sort of bridged this gap really sort of cleverly of it of course it's luxury and like you know touch touching on your point from earlier it's a luxury mum guide and it might feel quite far for a lot of people but that's the kind of irony of it right like of course in that in that time nothing really feels luxurious when you're in the trenches but I think it's so there is such a gap that you've filled so nicely because you've set this kind of aspirational way of living but equally you've brought this community together and it's more of course it's you know vetting these places and say saying go here because they really look after you and and you know this is what happens when you go to Nobu but ultimately you're bringing mums together in that space where they want to go out and do more and feel like the old them and you're you know and there are so many like-minded women that feel the same so of course the kind of aesthetic is luxurious it's really aspirational but what's aspirational about it is women that are getting together really talking about the kind of environment that I'm that they're in well how do you think moving forward for you like what would if you could say right overnight I'm gonna launch an app and it's gonna do this or I'm gonna what would be the kind of dream way for you to connect to women so it's funny because my husband actually um has an app background so it's something that we've discussed but I think what I want to get clear on if I'm honest is the guide aspect of the brand um I would like some sort of physical guide um almost like a coffee table book I think chic I mean it's luxury yeah um and obviously a digital version of that as well but something that's curated but just informative and possibly something that comes kind of when you are before you start your maternity or whatever it might be so you're prepared.

36:05Like something that you'd buy someone for the baby shower. Correct, something you'd buy someone for your baby shower. A gorgeous coffee table book. Yeah, exactly. That's, yeah, Luxury Mum Guide. And it just says what it is on the tin. And I think as I've gone on this journey, you know, it started with the restaurants and the cafes, but the journey in itself, a guide can be so many different things, like guiding you towards what, you know, along the journey. There's so much you can do with this. And I think particularly for me, having that background as a teacher and kind of going through the journey of finding a nursery for my son, thinking about schools now.

36:41I just know that I have so much to contribute to that discussion in terms of how to support families with navigating the choices that they make. So I think you need to get your book published. Bringing this is it. That's another thing on my list. 39 weeks pregnant. I'll talk that out tomorrow. we should say that that is on the list but also on the list is your hospital bag that's in the car because we're at any point ready to pop it could happen yeah um it's on it what you've done is so so brilliant and I think I mean the world is your oyster you're here at 39 weeks pregnant doing and living what you're what you're kind of practicing what you preach you're kind of helping so many women in that space but you're here and you're doing it and I think it's so exciting I can't wait to see what you do next and I think I just anybody that brings women together at a time that feels vulnerable I just think it's just you don't realize because probably it's something that you needed the best things start in a sort of self-indulgent vein but you don't realize how many women that you're helping whilst doing that so thank you so much for coming on and chatting to us and I am hoping in the next couple of years that my coffee table book changes and we get a luxury mum guide it will thank you so much if it happens when it happens I should say come back and talk to us about it I've loved talking to you thank you so much

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