Ep 14: The Launch Box with Bola Sol: Is financial empowerment the new self-care?

0:11Welcome back to the LaunchBox. In today's episode we're joined by the incredible Bola Sol. Bola is a financial advisor and author. She is so passionate about helping people take control of their money and mindset. And today she's here to share her insights on financial empowerment, building wealth and the importance of financial confidence. Please welcome to the podcast, Bola Soul. Well, welcome. Thank you very much for coming and talking to us. I think the best place to start is breaking it down exactly what you do, Bola, and how that looks, because you're a financial advisor. Yeah. I think there's that confusion between a financial advisor and an accountant, which is really interesting.

0:59Tell me what your job role actually means. Yeah. Well, thanks for having me. Thank you. I would say with a financial advisor, we help people look after their investments. So we call it assets under management. and we may have a starting figure. So somebody could come to me and say, for example, someone's left me an inheritance and I now have so much more money than I know what to do with. You might know what to do with your paycheck every month, but what do you do if maybe someone's left you£300 ,000? That's when a financial advisor could come in. It could be a lot less than that, by the way. But the whole point is we come in, we assess your attitude to risk, your capacity for loss, and then we will put together a presentation of what we think we should invest in on your behalf and then that's what we will do and maybe we'll have meetings once or twice a year catch-ups and be like this is where your money is now and this is how your money's growing what's interesting is if we work with someone like that we tend to ask oh do you have an accountant who's your accountant and then we ask can we get in touch with them because we also want to make sure that you are being tax efficient so of course that's what we have to do but we just want to make sure that everything's aligned so they can work together yeah so different but they coexist yeah exactly exactly yeah we've all just paid our taxes and I see it so much in my industry with like friends and people that I work with that we're like gosh I've got to get everything sorted because I've got you know I've got to get taxed turned in and it's like the moment that everybody goes it really is and we we know it happens every year we know it's coming we don't get any better at organizing for the year ahead it's just how it works right if we're at the time and we're probably all having the same conversation now well we're like next year I'm going to be ahead of this yeah next year I'm going to do be my best self when it comes to my taxes what's the best thing that we could do now to make the process smoother for next year oh I'd say get on top of your organization and documentation of everything right one of the things I used to do in the past is leave everything to the last minute and then my accountant's like hi can I see everything and then I have like hypertension for three days it's like the anxiety of that phone call so like have you kept the receipts have you done the thing yeah no it feels like school because like what's this for what's that for what's this for and you're like um this is for that that's for that yes however once you stay on top of things um week by week month by month so for example if you get income coming in and the company should usually send you like a remittance advice slip.

3:31And what you can do with that is essentially just keep it. So I'm with Starling Bank and I attach it, everything to that transaction. So money comes in and I'm like, okay, great. Here's all the documentation that shows and proves I've worked with this company. Or if I have an expense, I'm like, great. Here's the receipt that shows that. The key is stay on top of that as often as possible. Don't wait till the end, because it can give you more calm, if you will, as opposed to just waiting till the end. And also, maybe halfway through the tax year, speak to your accountant and just ask like, hi, where am I?

4:08What are things looking like? It's okay to have that conversation. And I think a lot of people don't know that. Because it's probably that conversation we all put off. Because also like if your accountant's gonna call you or you need to, it's always for something like this that feels like the thing that you're gonna put off until you have to. It feels like they're stealing your joy. It does. Like you're going to have an amount and they're going to go, no, it's double that. And you're going to be like, I'm going to go cry now. Yeah, and it's the way that we all talk about it. It's like, oh, I've got to do this for the tax man.

4:36I mean, I don't even know who the elusive man or woman is, but we'll say he's a man. And it just, it does, it does fill us with that dread. So it's, so are there like apps and places that kind of simplify that for us? So we're in such a modern world, but everything's online, everything's tech. Yeah. The idea of like saving a receipt seems quite archaic now. And I know it is important, but it does. It doesn't kind of in this like making life more convenient era that we're in, which we love. We love it. Holding on to a paper receipt is counterproductive. Yeah. And you could easily lose it. So with some apps, you can add attachment and then you can add your receipt.

5:16Just take a picture of it. however there are apps like OneTap because I have like an Amex business card I can't do that in the Amex app I don't believe so I use OneTap and take a picture of those receipts and add it there there's also like Dext so there's a few services QuickBooks and things like that where you can and Xero where you can kind of attach things directly so that it syncs for you because you just you don't want to do that heavy lifting on your own you want to feel like okay this is sorted I don't have to think about that so wherever possible i do think that there's things that you can allow it to like sink across and those are some of the apps that yeah okay okay that's interesting let's talk about launching a business because obviously the tax thing like you say we've got all get better preparation and you know it's timely because that's where we are now but the whole kind of ethos of this podcast is launching right and ladies looking to launch have launched the stories about the journey across the way when it comes to finances and I suppose someone looking to launch a business right now what do you think are some of the most important first steps when it comes to finances that they could kind of start with on day one before because when you are launching a business the initial without investment yeah which we know is it's hard it's very hard for women yeah we discuss the gap a lot and the two percent number that flies around is actually way too stark um it can be hand to mouth yeah at the start it's very kind of unless you've been conscious and you've thought i'm gonna do this extra job to save that pool of money to execute this idea it is hand to mouth at the start what would what would be your kind of like steps that they could take from day one i'd say from day one ask yourself if you want to be a sole trader or if you want to set up a limited company okay the reason that's so important is because you have to think about limited liability so let's say for example you choose being a sole trader and maybe you have corporation tax maybe it's higher than you thought you are personally liable for that whereas having a company limited liability it essentially kind kind of means you're very separate from your company.

7:39So it's two different entities. But once you're a sole trader, let's say you decide you don't want to set that up, then you always have to attach it to everything you've built personally. Yes, so you are, by setting up a limited company, you are adding a layer of protection to yourself and your assets. Exactly, and separating you from your business just in a legal format, whereas you and your business are a lot closer So if you're a sole trader, if that makes sense. And do you know what's so interesting? Because of my, I was telling you before, how I actually am, for somebody that runs businesses, has businesses, I am the finances and that part of my brain is something that I've really struggled to tap into.

8:23I've become very conscious of it. And, you know, I know how to stick to a budget or, you know, whether that happens or not. But I am quite incompetent when it comes to that. and I remember at the time I'm fortunate enough to have an accountant who's great and who advises me yeah however I remember when I launched my business then I'm saying no this is mine I want like everybody to know this is my baby and I'm doing it myself and this is my business and him really educating me on okay but when something happens because you know I'm not saying it will but if it if it did the liability is on you so you and I really didn't understand I found that like I don't know why I found that really hard to process I'm like no I don't I don't get it but actually having that layer of protection is so so important yeah because it just means that whatever happens in your life especially you know you're you're a family woman it's just so different for you like you don't actually want it to interfere with your personal life in that way you want to like love your business but love it from afar yes yeah yeah yeah it's really really good advice and something that I think the quicker you get your head around that the better like you say at the start yeah and also opening a business bank account so for example I think sometimes even bookkeeping can become incredibly messy if you are jumping between like your personal and business account yeah or you're saying oh no I've got some work expenses here and you've taken it from your personal account and then you know bookkeeping is now in two different places and so on and I just think it's so important that people separate that as soon as possible because some people don't and then it it's it's harder for anyone who is looking over your accounts in the months to come in the future and i think that is one thing that is really hard with small businesses when they start you know i've got a friend very close to me that actually you know she makes clothes and she's got a beautiful brand but she didn't expect the the growth to be as quick so like so fulfilling things like orders and you know that's one side of it but actually what i was sat down with her which is kind of laughable that it was me that was doing that but now I feel I've got an experience you know and I've got that experience behind me but sitting down and saying okay so this product here that first run of dresses how much did that cost you yeah but when it's it was exactly that so hand to mouth that we couldn't then it was so hard to track what she'd spent on you know to bring certain things to market because it was so much in the personal Yeah, it could even be something like, oh, she's done it.

11:01She's done so many parts of it through her business and then she's gone to post it and she spent money on her personal account. It's the small things like that. And I used to do that and I'd be like, oh, it's only four pounds in the post office, but then it starts to add up. And then once you end up paying tax, you're like, what difference could that fall? Yeah, no, of course. Yeah, so you just have to be accountable for yourself as well because you want to keep your money. and every time you kind of put things down personally sometimes you can even forget to add it up and I've done that in the past and that's when I stopped because I was just like you are missing out on tax deductibles because you're not separating this properly so just don't do it anymore yeah yeah and I think it's which again comes back to that sort of self-discipline yeah so you really kind of like those like those odd meeting a client or going for a coffee those odd things that are like it's 10 pounds it's four pounds it doesn't seem like a lot at the start yeah yeah yeah always going to amount yeah sometimes I meet with um you know meet with friends and it could be like a business meeting and I'm literally hovering over like the contact list for a second and they're like are you okay and I'm like is this a personal is this a business I'm like this is a business meeting and I'm like all right tap this card yes because you're constantly chopping and changing where am I what am I doing what is this for and so on and it's so kind of when you like you say when you live life like that it is so easy to just be like oh it's just a coffee and you're on to the next thing yeah actually the hovering over the contact list is very smart yeah it's so important takes a second takes a second but it's so key because I'd rather do that and hover for like a couple seconds than have to go back later and my accountant's like is that all your expenses and I'm like oh no wait this time I had some coffees on here let me go to that yeah go to that account as well.

12:44And I think when you're looking at like keeping your accounts in one place for any future possible investment or kind of people looking to help you or prop up the cash flow, everybody needs a clear sort of foresight of everything. Yeah. What do you think would be one of the biggest sort of financial mistakes people make when starting out a business? Yeah, I would say not thinking about the accountant they choose. I have friends who have googled accountancy services and picked the top one which there's nothing wrong with that but i also think it's good to have reviews and know your why and know your why may be very very different from someone else's so if i was starting a closed brand i might speak to people i know who have closed brands already and ask hey who's your accountant because of the type of business it is versus maybe somebody who has a service-based business and i also think that people need to think how often is your accountant communicating with you?

13:42Because what happens is, when I've had the best accountants, it's the ones that are constantly keeping me on top of things. The worst accountant I've had is the one where it's like, I'm messaging him and I'm like, hi, is everything okay? Because you don't know what's going on. And I know a lot of people who their accountants have really messed them up financially. So as a result, they're like, oh my gosh, this money's not mine. I have to give more of it because they didn't tell me about this and they didn't tell me about that. And you can feel like, oh great, I made this much profit. And then maybe you get someone else to check your money and they're like, actually you didn't, you need to take more route or did you consider this and did you consider that?

14:18So I think it's just key that people don't just think, oh, let's just go with that accountant or that works for you. You have to make sure it works for you. You're happy with the communication. Do you feel like everything is above board? Because sometimes I have heard a lot of accountants don't have good communication. Yeah, and I think that comes down to everything, doesn't it? We see that so much in business, that communication is key. And if it isn't there, whether that's a supplier, whether that's an accountant, whether that is, you know, it's always going to sort of cause tension across the relationship, isn't it?

14:50It's so interesting you talk about having an accountant because when you're budgeting and you say like you have saved up a pot of money that you're going to take this venture and you've got this product that you want to bring to market. it what is interesting is i don't think people actually account for an accountant in that budget that's true so i think maybe that's also a mindset shift because we look at okay how do we bring this here do we it's something that an accountant is thought of later on yeah right so like i think which is fair because when you're starting you don't have the finances to have a team yeah would you put we talk about spending money in marketing we talk about the web developer we talk about putting money in different places but would you really prioritize an accountant from the jump in the initial budget no not from the jump maybe the first after the first six to nine months I'd then start shopping around for an accountant and things like that right okay when you when you and what and why do you say that because you don't need an accountant straight once you start a business and so on so it's really important that you give it a second essentially because yeah there's there's nothing to report yet yes so it's just about waiting until that period okay fine so the first sort of six to nine months yeah see how see how that looks so in those first six to nine months what would you say apart from the organization yeah everything streamlined which i think is such a valuable piece of advice that actually you should be have you know you should look to have a business account yeah initially you could what would your kind of must-haves be to start a business without an accountant without maybe a financial background or expertise what would you say should be the kind of do's and don'ts oh make sure you have an emergency fund so within your business like three to six months of expenses even if that includes maybe paying yourself because I know some people they're bootstrapping they're doing it alongside having a day job but some people they're like I'm going all in and stuff like that and people can have really exciting months where they're like oh my gosh I made this much money and what I find happens to people psychologically is they start thinking that they're going to make that same amount of money every single month yes so then they're like oh my gosh I made 20k this month and then maybe another month they make 35k but then the economy can change so many things can change and they're like where is this money gone so when that money does come and it does do well just start putting some money away for some basic expenses for your business again if that includes salary for yourself because if you do hit hard times you don't want to feel like you didn't prepare for that and maybe you were reinvesting so much into the business that you didn't think about how the business would survive yes in terms of like change yeah okay emergency fund yeah yeah emergency fund yeah i've like had people argue with me about that but luckily accountants came to my defense because I said once that if you're an entrepreneur maybe you're making over 15 000 pounds a month and I said that because we're in the age of influencers and content creators people are making a lot of money you're talking hypothetically yeah yeah and some people were like oh that's not a good idea to have an emergency fund and accountants were like everyone needs an emergency fund I know of someone who runs a hedge fund and they're like in their 50s and they they they didn't have an emergency fund everybody needs one because if something does happen you want to have that buffer well nobody knows what's around the corner in life right i think it's it's never if you can afford every outgoing and every you know thing that you need to make your life operate and you've got the luxury of having an emergency fund it's like why wouldn't you literally that and it just feels so much better there's been times i think the pandemic is a fantastic example yes do you know what i mean i i think we saw so many news reports where it's like companies don't have three months of cash flow and maybe they were operating on footfall depending on the type of business and then that's when you want to say oh we've we've got some reserves and stuff like that okay emergency fund always we touched on apps before and how like you know there's a lot of ways now to simplify things to make it easy to make it convenient yeah to kind of move smart with your money what are some more kind of simple habits hacks that people can implement today to keep better track of their money so first one i'd say no matter what just take a picture of a receipt and if you just have a folder just keep it there because if anything does happen you just want to say that you actually have a copy of that somewhere because at times we don't go into the app on time so i definitely say that's one and just have your own like filing system although a lot of these apps are supposed to work sometimes they don't or they have like a 90 day period where they will connect and then you have to reconnect right so maybe if you've got an email and you're not up to date and you you don't have the reminders you might think oh yeah it's tracking everything and it's not so i'd always say maybe have a manual backup as well just in case um and you don't have to think about it too much it's just oh add it to this file or just take a picture of the receipt and just do that that way you're just up to date you don't have to think about everything now but um it takes some of the pain away yeah exactly it's always sort of keeping your own records and not as much as as good as the apps are not yeah lying on exactly yeah yeah yeah because i've done that sometimes and i'm like would you mean it stops sinking it can't literally is there one financial habit that you swear by that people that we should be doing that we kind of we get so caught up in the day-to-day outgoings and then you're on to the next month and then saving for obvious things that you know might be something that feels important to you in your lifestyle like let's get to this moment and then we can have a holiday or that I think that we then don't think bigger picture yeah definitely so I'd say saving and investing I I make sure that that's something I do every single month and I think it's easy to save for like an emergency fund even those three to six months of expenses and you want to buy a home or you want to go on holiday sure but also investing now something that's really important for people to know is that because of inflation we need to keep inflation to two percent right so that's like the base rate and that's what the bank of england does they try to keep inflation to two percent if you're getting five percent on your savings the real rate of return is three percent because it's five minus two if savings rates now go down to one percent and inflation is two you're not really making any money and that's why i tell people that you need to push past saving alone you need to invest and that's the whole point that you are getting a higher return let's say it's seven percent or ten percent if you invest in like index funds which is a pool of different companies for example or exchange traded funds which is again is a pool of different companies then the hope is maybe on average if you return 10 or 11 percent and inflation is 2 percent you still got nine in a year that you've made whereas savings can't always compete with that so i always say it's so important that like you allow your money to work hard for you and also let it compound because if you put away a certain amount of money and then you invest more and more and just add it up that becomes more money on top and it compounds and then one day you look back and you're like okay great i'm in a good position now and maybe i'm gonna add more some people withdraw it for reasons when I bought my first property I was um I think I took a heap out of my stocks and shares ISA of like investing and and that's because it compounded and I left it in there for a few years so I just say like yeah I swear by saving and investing okay I like that and it's like that you say like work smarter not harder yeah yeah yeah especially in the future sometimes I always think about what do I want to be doing in 30 years where do I want to be and what will my money look like and essentially what do I need to do now to make sure my money looks good then and that's when I'm like you've got to work smarter you don't want to feel like the only time you're making money is when you're working hard for it or when you're present somewhere and that's the whole point of investing now of course that's traditional investing you can invest through businesses of course like that and you know but it's just so important that you think how can my money grow without me constantly having to like watch it and stuff yeah yeah and how about things like i just remember my nan being obsessed with premium bonds oh yeah like that was like a thing she's like another premium bond yeah is that is that still a thing yes yes are isa still like yeah do they still is that still smart yeah yeah yeah premium bonds are great and um of course you've got the nsni that um people can go on i forget what it stands for but you can invest in premium bonds that way and there's like a lottery service yeah which essentially means that you invest a certain amount of money and then you have a chance of winning a little bit of extra to go towards it but people still invest in premium bonds just for the sake of diversity like some people don't want to be like oh all my money's in one thing so they spread it across different ways right bonds are very risk averse assets right in comparison to other things where you know your capital is always at risk when it comes to investing but premium bonds are deemed as quite safe right and then you know you're getting your money back okay if we're looking to save save or invest however that would look when it comes to somebody's outgoings and knowing what portion you can save because i think that's that that that's another thing too like savings are well and good as i said before like if you're privileged enough to be able to get by survive do what you need to do every month and you've got money left over to save how how should that look is there like a if we're looking at kind of like a ratio of what we should be spending and how we should be living in kind of like beyond our means you know yeah so there's like a well-known budgeting rule which is like 50 30 20 right which is 50 on your needs the things that you have to like put towards everyday expenses mortgage rent whatever it is and all the utilities that come with that and 30 on your wants you want to go out with your friends whatever it is and so on and 20 is supposed to be on like savings and investments and stuff so people always ask how much should i be putting away yeah and i say you know roughly around 20 however if you can put away more because you're in a position to do so do it right but um if not try to hit that minimum because it's so important that we all live beyond like so live beneath our means yes you know and I know that costs are going up in different places so it does mean that you are having to change that buffer but it is incredibly key that you actually have enough to save from time to time as opposed to oh my money doesn't stretch that far enough because when the future comes the future is going to knock and it's like hello did you not take care of me you just want to make sure that you've actually been putting money away yeah it's quite interesting I've not heard that 50 30 20 rule before because it's almost working backwards isn't it and we all kind of like you say the idea is not to live beyond your means is to live beneath them yeah and actually if you're if you look at your income what you do with that 50 % should slot into that as in like what the outgoings are yeah the house that you rent that you know that it that's how it should figure itself out yeah and that is that 50 % rule even on your needs is a great indication of where you're at and what you're spending on you know that's where they've got this affordability kind of preference when it comes to homes and buying they want to make sure that you can afford it because back in the day I think like 20 or 30 years ago someone someone on like 30 or 40k could buy like a 1.5 million house which is which is insane when you think about it which is why they now have the oh you know the multiplier of 4.5 times of your income right so for example if you're on 100k and you want a house that's 500k then you can probably afford it after you pay the um the deposit for the house and so that makes sense whereas back in the day there wasn't a multiplier so people could go wild they were defaulting on their homes and losing their homes as a result so it is key that you look at okay how much of my expenses come into that 50 % of my income if it comes over a little more 55 60 % fine but if it's like 80 % that's worrying because what about your wants what about if you want to meet up with your friends or do things you love and what about your savings yeah and then it's also it comes to that kind of working yourself into the ground yeah to to achieve the musts yeah but then also there's no want exactly yeah and I just think that's terrible I always tell people like you just you just don't want to be miserable some people that you know they come to me they get into debt and they're like how about if I work three jobs and I'm like you're gonna be miserable like look after your mental health I always say that when it comes to money like please don't burn yourself into the ground to do this or to maybe live a lifestyle if you feel like you won't have time for yourself yeah and mentally money worries are the worst worry right I think you know we and we discuss that in like groups of friends or family and you know I've I've seen that over the years with my mom and myself and obviously now my finances look a lot different to and I'm very grateful for that to how they once were but that feeling of not making ends meet the feeling of everything spiraling and it it all comes down to not being in an okay financial situation like when your worry is only money but that is such a big worry because you know not having it and not having the kind of ability to be able to support or to be able to do what you need to do and knowing that you could have the rug pulled from under you at any moment there's nothing that quite sort of touches your mental health like that yeah yeah and I agree on that um sentiment of like how I grew up is different from how I'm living now and I'm so grateful for that because just kind of seeing my mom struggle and stuff like that I was just I always knew from growing up I was like cool money's a really big thing yeah being young yeah it made me very aware I said oh this workplace is really important yes yes yes yeah exactly and I I was like, oh, okay, it's the money and stuff like that.

29:40So I've always been like, I need to be careful growing up because this thing is quite serious and I don't want money to control me. I don't think it should control anyone. And it really does. And I think that, like you say, that's a worrying place to be in. When we talk about personal income and we talk about, I suppose, personal banking, personal finances, and we're breaking down the 50, 30, 20 rule, when it comes to business yeah does this how does that say does does the same rule apply do the numbers change how do you think that looks because obviously when you start there's a lot to break down whether that's budgeting for you know i run a product-based business so i'm talking in product-based terms yeah but whether that is the for us it would look like formulation it would look like testing it would look like product it would look like packaging PR marketing everything else to you know bring it to light so when it comes to budgeting early days in a business what do you think the rule is to follow I would actually say with that just look at the difference between your needs and your wants so when I break down that list of things that are gonna have to come out yeah you have to look at okay I have to do this to get the product out so that's a need and so on so that lets you know every single month this comes up to x figure but then you may be working with a PR company but then maybe there's another PR company that offers something different what's the price then and so on so I'd always say wherever possible you want to get the best possible price and the best service which is of course what we all want right we all want everything for like a pound yeah that's true so i think um it might not necessarily be 50 30 20 because but i think the key message is the same in terms of what are your wants for the business and how different is that from a need because it's very easy when a business is your baby to say oh we've got to have that it would be great to do this because this is going to make people go wild exactly but at the same time could you live without that and then just see so it just depends on how much income you've got coming in and so on but you all know that you know oh look we can't we have to do testing that's an absolute must that's a non-negotiable exactly and that's where the need is first a want could be like oh i've got this great idea and i've hired so and so person to do that and stuff or maybe a supplier said oh i can throw this in as an extra and you think oh actually that may sell well but we have to choose between our needs and our wants and stuff like yeah so that might not necessarily be 50 on your needs it could be more especially because it's a business um but yeah i'd say that's where it differs a bit it's so interesting to hear the difference between saving and investing because like you say we our default is like we should save but actually as you mentioned making your money work harder for you rather than always having to sign it watch it and see what happens with it i know that you're really passionate about i mean i'm really passionate about women hence why this whole thing exists but you're really passionate about women when it comes to investing yeah yeah first of all i just think more women need their money um i'm so big on that it's so important and it's okay for women to want money as well um there's currently a gap so men invest 567 billion more than women which goes to show that there's still this huge gap and space for women to jump in and invest and i'm not just talking about investing in one way investing in different ways of course you've got like stocks and shares but as you said yonan does premium bonds and stuff like that we're investing in businesses or even investing in yourself like what women will add to the gdp of this country if they started their own businesses in comparison to men as well it will put us in such a better position from an economic standpoint um and i just think just wherever possible i just tell women please just get started you don't need to have all the answers because one thing i noticed from a lot of the women i talk to they will read all the books we've read every self-help book going literally we've read all the books here is our plan they've got the powerpoints they've got the briefs and stuff like that and they're like do you think i'm good to go and i'm like you were good to go five steps ago yeah do you know what's so funny is emma greed said this and obviously this isn't like finance based yeah she was like when somebody comes to me to look to invest in in them they give me the powerpoint the shiny deck it's got bells and whistles on and it looks amazing yeah but she's like just do it the best sign of an entrepreneur is someone that takes that idea and just runs with it and says i've been trying and this is where we've got so far yeah that is way more appealing than the kind of powerpoint presentation exactly because that's when you have a bottleneck that someone else can step in and help with.

34:35Even like I met with my friend and he has a fantastic business and I want to start something similar. And on my way to the meeting, I was just like, Bola, this is your last meeting about this business. I literally, I said, no more. It's actually enough. Just go and do something and start. Because I was like, I'm sick of you. I was like, I'm sick of myself. Just go and start and see how it goes and you will get better. As opposed to this whole notion of everything has to be perfect. Because everything we put on paper and in documents don't always turn out that way yeah anyway and the best lessons are the ones that you learn from starting and moving forward and being like oh i tried that or you know next time you can say oh be careful of that and you know that's how you build which is so interesting because when it comes to finances to me it feels very like methodical and like you must do this because this gets x but it's so kind of reassuring to know that you also do have to try and see what's for you and find out what sticks yeah yeah that's what i did because even when i started like investing via like the stock market i just remember i was like oh very new at this when i got started i was like very new i'm going to invest in this and i learned different things about different times and and i was like oh i don't like this way of investing so like investing in singular stocks are quite risky in comparison to investing in funds and i was just like i don't have time to track singular stocks and like check my phone time for risk exactly check my phone and be like oh my gosh like my portfolio is down by so much because it's all dependent on this one company so I think it's important as well to learn along the way and that's how you learn about yourself in different seasons as opposed to just thinking like oh I'm just going to follow this rule because that's the way to do it life doesn't work that way and when we talk about like you know there's a big difference between a finance expert and an accountant right so when we talk about you know maybe sort of teeing up an accountant when you know you've been working at this for six to nine months and now you've got a bit of a record and it's probably time to sort of seek advice and make space in the budget for that when do you think is a good time to talk about somebody that actually helps you with your finances in terms of advice and yeah you know when should young founders be interested in investing like because obviously it's hard question I know that we mentioned about saving an investment and that's something you can do early on as opposed to saving but when do you think it's time to look and say because I think the most in my mind when I think about progression and earning and building I kind of you want to make sure everything's sorted personally yeah like I don't really think of like let's invest in this and let which is probably not a great mindset to have as you've just mentioned but I think of okay let's and my friend has said this to me so it'd be really interesting to get to your take on this my friend said you're worrying too much I think the working class mentality in me will never leave like the fact that my mum me and my mum was in a hostel and then we went to a council house and then the you know it was like a lottery room the day that she bought the house from the council yeah so my mindset has always been own your own house yes don't have a credit card only use a debit card and you know pay work hard to pay off a mortgage or like you know make more down payments than you know than you than you need to yeah because that is drilled into me to like own it because no one then can ever take it away from you yeah but then when I talk to my friends that understand that and haven't sort of had probably the same upbringing as me and are way more well educated in that they're like that's wrong why spend your money when you can when you can spend the banks or why spend and they're really challenged me on that and I think but there's something mentally that I'm like I just want to work hard till I have no mortgage like that's that that is to me like the biggest life dream and they're like okay well if that's gonna satisfy you mentally that's one thing yeah but actually use a credit card don't what why are you using your debit card like there's things that kind of that we really disagree on what's your take on that who we become even like financially is so dependent on our childhood and and how we saw money growing up and the decisions that we made and the habits that we formed i think i get the paying for mortgage being a dream but i still think it's important as well to use other people's money where possible because that's how depending on how you feel about risk you can grow and make more money so some people they don't just have one property they're like actually if i have a few properties then i can use this for my pension i can use it for like my kids when they grow up and stuff and some people are like no i just want to have one property it really depends on how you see risk and what you're comfortable with and what your idea of success is exactly yeah but it's so important to maybe push yourself into your why um because you want to make sure that once you hit that pinnacle of success you don't feel stumped you don't feel like oh is this it yeah yeah like in some ways you were able to challenge yourself but yeah i mean i get where your friends are coming from because sometimes i i do that i have to push myself and i'm like really i'm a bit scared yeah and like even the idea of having a credit card terrified me until a couple of years ago yeah a lot of people have that actually a lot of people actually my mom was like they are bad i think she just when i was young i thought that i would get a credit card and just completely blow it which i did at one point and then not you know and then that becomes debt that's negative where actually yeah it can be debt that's positive and i think it's changing our mindset like not all debt is negative the word debt just terrifies me yeah but But it actually isn't, you know, it doesn't have to be negative, does it?

40:20Yeah, there's good debt and there's bad debt. So I think like running up a credit card and not having the means to like pay it back and then kind of having this huge balance, meaning that you are incurring interest is bad debt. But for me, good debt is, I don't know, like a student loan. Like I got a student loan and that to me is good debt because I studied maths and finance. I'm still in finance today. So that to me is an example of good debt. when it comes to credit cards, you just have to have financial discipline. So when people say to me, should I get a credit card? I ask them, do you have financial discipline to have it?

40:54Because everything can't be an emergency and stuff like that. Like you can't say, oh, I've got to do this. Or I hear, oh, I've got to get the kids presents. I've got to do this. And I'm like, do you really have to? And especially if you know you don't have the means to like maybe pay it back. And now you're paying more for the presents because you just felt kind of that you had to. so when it comes to like a credit card for argument's sake it's bad debt when you're putting on putting something on the credit card that you can't pay straight away but you should use the credit card if you can yes yeah use it and build up your credit because it also shows your discipline and shows that you're trustworthy on the basis that you are paying it back and you will see your score go up on that basis but if it's like you have a credit card and it's got a 10 000 pound limit and you use up 8 000 of it then it looks as if to say that you're a bit too dependent on that so that can bring your score down but if you use let's say 30 or less so that's maybe two to three k looks like okay you use it from time to time and you know how to manage it well but then say you use it and your limit is five thousand pounds you've used two thousand pounds of that credit card you have the means to pay the two thousand pounds off yeah should the preference always be spending it on the credit card versus the debit card i think it depends on what you're getting so with a credit card you've got the like credit consumer acts which means anything that you buy which is over 100 pounds you are essentially covered by that thing so for example if you were to take a flight somewhere and you booked it on your credit card and then maybe the airline goes bust and stuff like that your credit card can help you recoup that that money yeah um which you couldn't on a debit card correct and i know this because this has happened to me literally flew from my sister's wedding and they had no flights back and i booked it on my debit card and i left my credit card at home and i was so angry because i knew this but even the experts get it wrong honestly it's so important they say that literally and i was i was like follow what you're doing i had to tell my brother and he's the oldest and he's an accountant he's like what are you doing and I was like I don't know I don't know but please help me literally um okay so for that layer of protection but yeah then also for credit score and if you're seen to use it and constantly yeah do well with it so if you're managing your money well then what it means is that the next time you want to apply for something on credit they're like okay great we can trust you whereas some people if they abuse it and so on I know so you know I've seen public stories of maybe influencers who've made a lot of money and then you think the next step is for them to buy a house and some of them have come out and said I was really bad with credit I have the money I don't have the credit so they don't trust me to pay off the mortgage and stuff like that so now I have to rent for another two years and stuff like that so it's so important so that's so that's so interesting yeah yeah i always say that if like cash is king credit is queen like you just like don't play with credit yeah oh i love um i ask every guest whether that's on the launch box or whether that is you know our episodes weekly to leave a tip something tangible that our listener can take and do today and make action today so if a lady's listening that wants to start a business from a financial perspective yeah what do you think is something that they could do to sort of put that into play today yeah I would say in your business plan have an idea and have a forecast of your business in year zero year five and year ten i think that those are kind of key markers and it allows you breathing space to let your business grow and to see what type of numbers you're trying to hit in those different years because it also gives you time and allowance to get to that point and maybe look at marketing strategies for example of how you're going to get there because comparing year on year it's next to each other so sometimes it might not be as much as you thought but if you give it that space and that time you're able to maybe change your business plan slightly or tweak a few things to be like this is how we jumped and got to that next figure and this is how we grow exactly yeah and just know that you know also ask yourself i always say as well maybe ask yourself what's your number um which can change like if somebody came and said hey i want to buy your business what's your number that would make you say okay this is what i'd sell it for and so on okay so it's almost being when you're starting it's almost as well as the business launching and that be exciting you've almost got to think about the future yeah at the start yeah exactly because even the like accounting records you keep and so on if anyone comes into your business whether that's as a partner or an investor they're going to want to see that and see how everything's run so also kind of think about staying organized okay well there we go i thought i've got a lot of organizing stuff today i'm like i'm gonna i'm with myself on my own messaging that next year everything's going to be smoother when it comes to tax return it will it will it will we're all trying to get better with that it's all a work in progress yes thank you thanks for having me so much thank you

46:12don't forget to follow us on apple and spotify or wherever you get your podcast to make sure you don't miss out because next week we're going to be talking to another incredible lady who launched if like me you're a watcher then follow us on youtube and please don't forget to like and subscribe