Ep 52: From Beauty Salons to Pilates Apps: Bryony Basse's Journey to Building Her Wellness Empire

0:12Today I'm joined by the amazing Bryony Bass, founder of Pilates by Bryony, the app with a global community and hundreds of on demand classes. Briony has built a brand that is as much about business growth as it is about well-being. And I can't wait to dive into just how she's done it. She's also a very good friend of mine. So let's find out why she's a lady who launched. I'm so pleased that we're getting to do this. This is actually a bit weird. I know, isn't it? Because normally if I want to know something, I just call you. I know, you're going to have to pretend you know nothing about it. But what is interesting is how often do you actually get to sit down and like talk to your friend about every detail of what they've done?

0:56Because I think you you kind of are with people alongside journeys. I met you at a certain point and a lot of that. And we've never sort of like stripped it back and deep dived into it fully. So I am excited. I always start these conversations in the same way because I really think that we find out so much about ourselves as founders, as entrepreneurs as women way back when like it's so funny that we'll have these incredible conversations and it will always go back to ah that's because I was like that when I was younger and it's really I love connecting the dots so let's talk about your earliest entrepreneurial memory oh okay so I feel like I've lived so many different lives and at the time I didn't it wasn't as if I thought oh I'm an entrepreneur do we ever feel like I don't know something that gets put on you exactly I am but actually when I look back I there is quite a common thread where I just really was so excited by business and also kind of providing a service that made people feel more confident so I don't even think you know this but I had a beauty salon I did not know yeah so I mean it was a staff of one but I had a beauty salon on the side well not on the side of my house literally I turned my dining room into a salon because it had a separate entrance onto the garden and um I used to do all sorts of treatments so everything from like spray tans to waxing facials I did not this explains so much to me because you're always so good at like oh god knowing what the treatments are and you're so sweet no way yeah so I actually did that when I was really young so I think maybe around 20 something like that so I was quite young at the time but but it's like you say it's the same thread of making women feel yeah the best versions of themselves and I absolutely loved it and people would go away and message me and be like oh I feel so good you know like even just small things like having a tan or you know fresh nails and I loved that relationship with the client um so now as I look back it's like it's funny that I kind of am doing similar now um but even just have I love the independence it gave me I had um a boyfriend at the time that was a few years older than me and I remember I was like the breadwinner and I felt so good about it I was like don't worry I booked this trip this holiday for both of us I was like I've got this and I just always loved that independence and I think that's something my mum always instilled in me.

3:52Well, let's talk about prior to then. So the little Bryony. Where did you grow up? Where were you? And tell me a bit about your parents and how that time looked. Yeah, so my parents are just the best. Oh my God. I can't. They're so cute and they're just so supportive and so much fun. So yeah, I feel really grateful with my parents. My dad actually works with me full time. My mom, I did try and employ her, but she was like, I just want to be your mom. I never want it to cross that line. It's a valid point. Yeah. And I mean, she'll help me out if I need her whenever, but she never wanted to have that relationship.

4:36But I grew up in not far from Brighton, so West Sussex. And just, I mean, I guess everyone feels their childhood was really normal. because it's just your normal whatever it was so we just you know my parents both worked really hard and I have like really early memories of my mum in particular juggling so many things like she always wanted to be the mum that would drive me to school or be at a sports game or whatever but I remember her doing like conference calls from the car and it would be like the middle of winter and she'd be freezing cold in the car for like three hours doing her back-to-back calls just so she could drive me to school and so I really remember things like that and um yeah it was just quite a normal upbringing you know like we had our one holiday a year and that that for a long time was a caravan holiday in Scotland which I those caravan holidays honestly they are the still now the best memories core memories yeah yeah and they're just so great and um so I guess yeah that was kind of my childhood and I've got a brother who's a couple of years older than me and um we just really saw our parents being quite a good team but also really being very independently happy if that makes sense so they were they were really going for their own dreams at the same time as being this kind of family partnership so which is so so important that you get to witness that and kind of soak that up too and it's something that always as a parent puts you in a bit of a moral dilemma because I want my kids to see me going for it because I want them to think that anything's possible and the world is their oyster then equally I think by doing that sometimes there are sacrifices along the way and I'm the mum that is like you know driving Marvin and does the dance club run and then I do the paddle run for a layer and then I've got like it's kind of the juggle is so real that you I will be on like a zoom call on in the car on the way while they're having their snack on their way to club and I'm sort of watching it like go sweetie whilst on a zoom on my laptop well you know and it's kind of you do you want to make it all happen and I love to hear you say that because at times you feel a little bit guilty like I wish I was maybe a bit more present but you're just spinning like lots of plates yeah majority of the time And also, well, firstly, now having a baby in the next couple of months, I'm going to be coming to you for all the tips on all these things because.

7:08I'm still figuring it out, girl. Well, me and Casper have the same conversations because we're like, you know, what are our values in raising kids together? And how do we want it to look? And how do we want to, you know, what do we want to instill in them? Yeah. And I think one of the things that my parents really gave us was work ethic and that determination, that resilience. They weren't entrepreneurs, but they did give me that sense of like, you have to work hard for, you know, what you want in life, of course. And then I think there's also, which is interesting, you know, when you have like Casper and yourself worked really hard, but you're perhaps more fortunate.

7:52and this is the same with me than my mum was for me raising me and we've got more financial freedom than they have how do I teach them that level of graft and that level of work ethic because everything for them is going to be relatively comfortable so I want to make sure their values are like we work hard for what we and it's still kind of instilling that in the same way but knowing that they've got a lovely home and they you know and they've kind their life does look very different to mine so it's kind of making sure they're super grounded yeah but also that's what you work for right is to be able to give them opportunity so it's a bit of a kind of it's a bit chicken and egg really and nothing makes you happier than being able to do things for your family or whether it be your kids or your parents and things but yeah you you want to try and keep that but I mean you've done such a good job with your kids they're all so kind I think that's a really important thing and that's such a big value isn't it I think kindness and kindness confidence and work ethic I would say that's what and work ethic slash independence yes because you don't want them to rely on you I mean I'm coming coming at this from mother of the year and I've not even had a baby but this is what I'm this is my aim it's incredible that you'll think I didn't even I mean I was so young when I fell pregnant with a layer but I didn't even think of this wasn't even a conversation I was having then I kind of was learning on the job so it is so brilliant you were growing up yourself exactly so it's so it's brilliant that you're thinking that ahead of time I think it's it is like you say kindness and those values are so so independent important and independence is a big one too yeah what I want to talk about kind of discovering what felt right to you so you was you were working in treatments you had the beauty salon at home and then what although the values are the same what you do now is completely different so tell me about your journey after that moment oh my gosh so I've done so many different jobs I always say this like what's that expression jack of all trades master of time so it took me a really long time to find you know whether you want to call it your purpose or your passion or whatever it did take me time but I think that time is a good thing because you pick and you choose different lessons from different eras of your life it has a click doesn't it yeah I watched something the other day and I can't remember who it was that was speaking and he said something and I thought god that is that is it you know when you've found because he was saying people ask for my advice and they say how do I know that I found my thing like I quite like this I quite like that how do I know it's a thing for me and he said your thing is it's something that comes easy to you but it's hard for most oh so it's always like you kind of do it with ease but most people can't get their head around how you do what you do it's it's interesting because I think the pilates itself like Like I could teach you with genuinely my eyes closed not seeing you and I could take you through a class and know that I was somehow connecting to you and your body because I just feel it's like in my fibre.

11:17In your DNA. But what's quite cool is then applying that to a business where you do have to then, like, yes, the Pilates comes easy to me, but the whole business side of things. It's a different beast. Oh, my God. it's not natural so it's you're learning every single day and I think that's such an exciting thing because it keeps your brain awake at the same time so you're doing what comes easy but there's that whole other side of it exactly is constant work yeah which I really I really love to kind of understand how you know for the for the fitness industry it's so hard to I think the biggest problem people have is they they don't feel motivated like oh how do you get motivation and there's this kind of conversation behind motivation and discipline and I think if we all waited to feel motivated we wouldn't do anything yeah we would be waiting a long time but that discipline carries you through and I think not only in in the workouts and things I really enjoy finding ways to motivate or discipline people through the app but I find for myself it's an interesting discipline having the business side of of the pilates that's so interesting because like you like you say if you're back to basics and you're kind of renting a studio which is obviously still a business yeah but you're seeing people every day and of course you can teach those classes and you know someone's body with your eyes closed but actually the other side of it yeah it is a full business which which we'll dig into at what point did you really discover your love for Pilates because for you it's a really kind of it's a situation that spiked that real sort of organic journey I suppose you didn't ever think you'd be sat here no never founder of you know an incredible app yeah so tell me about when you first discovered Pilates and how that looked yeah so hopefully this inspires someone that is maybe going through a hard time or a challenging time because sometimes those times can be the most powerful life-changing moments and for me it was having a car accident so I had a car accident when I was um 17 18 I think I'd just turned 18 and um yeah it it basically really like took everything out of me I had to be rushed to hospital I was on a spinal board neck brace all these different things taking tramadol which is really strong painkiller and addictive yeah when I came off of tramadol I could not sleep a second I was wired all night I had lost so much weight it was it was a real low point I then was put on antidepressants to help me sleep it was this whole thing and then I discovered this doctor who introduced me to this form of rehab for my body which would heal my body which he believed would heal my body which later I realized was classical pilates so I was going into the hospital to have these treatments but you didn't it I didn't know it wasn't a thing is also a trend now too you get these wellness girlies and of course it's such a deep practice and it's such an art form but it is now a trend too yeah it's it's really cool I think it's so cool that it is so trendy because it gets so many people on it but at the same time like what I love about pilates is the nerdy side of it i love to really you know like i love teaching you for example and the practice of it and the precision and the form and everything and going real deep on the nerdy side of the mind she's like i'm like i didn't think breathe hold here do this i'm like oh my gosh but it's crazy it makes such a difference and um so that's what i'm really passionate about but thanks to this doctor that made me discover it because as we said it wasn't a thing then so I was literally going in to the hospital to do my Pilates classes that's how kind of niche it was it was yeah exactly and then just being young and naive I thought oh great I've I'm healed now and then at the time it was kind of more hip workouts and like the whole media thing around working out and eating healthy it was during like diet culture do you remember like magazines would be like oh please I was on them some of the some of the worst headlines like holiday and it'd be like Rochelle so I was off new curves I'm like I was on holiday yeah give me a break yeah it was all that but it's awful popping people on a beach yeah and really kind of exposing people but making them feel so vulnerable and that's just horrible and whereas now I love how it's much more empowering and much more supportive.

16:03Positive messaging rather than then. So at the time, I think where there was such a focus on diet culture and like how to drop a dress size and all of these kind of... It's actually wild when you think about it. Can you imagine? Yeah. You know, some of these huge brands were doing TV ads on, you know, eat this and you're going to drop a dress, get your jeans, get into your jeans. And it was like, have a bowl of this. I'm like, of course you're going to lose weight if you have a bowl of cereal for dinner. Yeah, only that.

16:33it's so sad that that was that was a thing but I also think it was a real moment of like to work out and to feel good you have to torture yourself you have to just get through the workout the boot camps and that idea of having even like having an idea of that personal trainer was like I'm gonna absolutely kill you on this session I remember actually um my brother was like practicing his one of his friends was practicing being a trainer and the whole like narrative was like basically if my brother wasn't on the edge of being sick by the end of this workout it wasn't a good workout so yeah it was definitely at that time so I was then going into that I was like doing the HIIT workouts doing this doing that right so you thought you'd almost healed yourself by going having the treatment exactly now i'm ready for like barry's boot camp exactly yeah and then i just wasn't seeing any results in my body i was feeling so stressed so puffy i also not long after the car accident was diagnosed with arthritis which again was was not really something anyone in there like at the symptoms on onset to the to the accident was it correlated to that no so it can be hereditary so I mean some people might argue the trauma then would cause it but I don't think it was anything to do with the accident but it definitely showed me that I have high levels of inflammation in my body as it is at like rest so it was kind of like an interesting journey of then I always found myself going back to Pilates like whether it was to heal my body or to kind of focus on having like mindfulness in my day or de-stress or if I was going through any bad moment I'd always find myself going back going back to that and it would always help me we talk about this all the time like if you can get out of it get into your body and get out of your head oh my gosh that's for me is the most special thing I think obviously like the exterior and the benefits we you know we do all feel better when we look better or you know whatever that is for us yeah but for me the mental the time of day that i just cannot think about anything else because you're busy telling me that i've got to hold this but it's so good like because i can't there's no time to sort of go what have i done what do the kids need who needs me at work what there's that hour is for literally for you definitely and i love that and even if you can't fit an hour in like even just 15 minutes makes you feel more you for the rest of the day you feel like okay I've done something for myself so yeah I am I feel so lucky that this is what I'm able to do for my job so when you then sort of keep getting pulled back to Pilates like the thing that isn't going anywhere when do you make that decision to train as an instructor because loving something and yeah making it your career attending class is very very different to thinking this is what I want to do yeah so before lockdown I started a corporate wellness company so we were sending therapists out to um offices all over London so we had a few like really good clients that we would send I think we had like between 30 and 40 therapists all over London most days of the week going in either doing like manicures and things like that in office or meditation Pilates yoga and then obviously all the offices closed so I was like right back to the drawing board yeah so then I thought okay maybe we can create an online version of this for people to do at home so the offices can send it to their employees to you know keep keep their mindfulness and and wellness in check whilst they're you know we were all in the thick of it weren't we so um then then I did that and actually I thought I can do this I've been doing classical pilates now for so long so I had actually whilst I had the corporate wellness company decided to qualify in classical pilates and then but just kind of as my own almost as a backup for the others yes like oh if someone phones in sick I'll be there you can do it yeah and it's just a passion project and then um my mum was really ill over covid and lockdown um so I was kind of caring for her that was my main focus but then afterwards and kind of during towards the end I was like right I can actually start teaching this I'm just going to give it a go and I started on zoom and I my first um zoom class was May 21 May 21 April 21 and who was on that like how did it literally 10 people and had you sort of made an Instagram to no like punt out to who wants to join my class or how or was it people that was part of the corporate wellness service so that had completely closed okay yeah and it just it just didn't quite translate as we hoped and it just it was just like not not the the product and that we we wanted to go ahead with but um I had 10 people on that first zoom and it was just so it was so scary I was so nervous I was so I used to be so shy hated public speaking very very very shy and had no inner confidence like externally I think you would have thought she's she's okay she's fine like she'll she's confident enough but internally I had this constant dialogue that I wasn't enough I had low self-worth low self-belief and um so then I just put myself out there and I did 10 people on this zoom class I had no following I had about 4 000 people on Instagram at the time and then it just really after I did that first zoom I thought okay wow I'm on such a high I mean it sounds so funny that it was like 10 people but I was buzzing like I you would have thought I had just done what you have done at the weekend in Paris no but because maybe that's the moment that the light bulb goes off and you think this is my thing I felt so I mean obviously at the beginning and the night before I didn't sleep I was having a panic attack but as I was going through the class I was like kind of it sounds cheesy but I was like in my stride and the momentum was building.

23:04So then after that class, I was like, I was very conscious that if I don't keep the momentum going, I'm going to lose this moment of like a little bit of a boost of self-worth. So then I set myself the challenge of building this like schedule. So I put like another class up and another class. And how soon? Really quite soon. Because I was like, you know, I've got these 10 people. Imagine next time it's 12. Yeah. the world's my oyster so then the next week I was like okay in a week's time I'll do this again and see if people like it and it just snowballed so then it was once a week then it went to twice a week and I started getting like consistently over 100 people on these zoom classes which I remember thinking during lockdown when people were doing zoom lives and whatever thinking yeah thinking actually a hundred people if that was in a room I would be I would be just shocked we'd have to probably split it into four classes so then I was just consistently doing this started making like a really good income from it and then I did the January challenge which completely changed my life which we had I think I say we I mean me well kind of we my dad was helping out but I had 550 people on that challenge and they all paid 200 pounds for a month all in Pilates challenge and I think where they had paid and invested so much money they were not skipping a class so they did five classes with me a week ranging from like 15 to 45 minute classes it was a shambles it was so manual and on zoom well it's all slick now but you can actually go back and see the first classes like my laptop's hanging off my kitchen table I'm on the kitchen floor in my studio no they're still there um but then I did this January challenge and I thought oh my god like this is a life-changing amount of money to me at the time I would have had to work like four years or something in my last job to to get what I had just gotten in a month and also at by the end of the challenge everyone's bodies were changing they felt this inner confidence like I felt like we were all in it together we were all on this confidence journey and by the end of it everyone was just so hyped and get and having knowing that you can make women men feel more confident so that then give you a different level of confidence in yourself like when you said the first time that you taught you're up all night panicking you know am I going to be enough is this going to be okay yeah that must then unlock a different level of confidence for you because of what these people are achieving definitely it makes me believe in what I'm giving them and and what I'm giving them is hopefully my own confidence if you know what I mean sort of they're loving it as much as you are yeah and I'm making a difference and I think that for me is the biggest part of this business like to know that I get these messages from people saying you've changed my life like I've gotten out of a bad relationship I've managed to speak up at work I've managed to speak up at home and and really you know unlock this higher version of myself and I'm just like wow do you know what like the things I used to worry about nothing else matters than that and and also my mum being ill also kind of gave me that perspective on life like at the end of the day who cares what we look like what we're all just trying to build this happy calm peaceful fulfilled life at the end of the day and if I can play like a small role in in your day whether it's 15 minutes in the morning on the map that sets you up to be that version of you then I feel successful I think it's a bigger role than you think like you say it's a small role but like for me those morning workouts are like my routine so it actually is a bigger role for people than you actually think obviously there's 24 hours in a day but you devote like even like you know my favorite is the 20 minute deep load that's the one that's the one that I always go back to you probably I've had five studios since then why are you still there that was the original but I'm an OG I love that but it really does and I think when you become that you become part of someone's routine it is such a big deal particularly when everybody's busy and you've got the time is precious like it it really is a big deal when you when you realize the scale of this zoom and like you say they pay sorry this challenge there's 500 people they're paying 200 pound for the month Like, OK, we've now hit a different, we've unlocked a different financial bracket on probably what you saw possible at the time.

28:04How, what, what happens to you then? Because this is now something that you love, a job that you feel really confident in, that you're sort of striving in. but also you're unlocking this sort of gap that particularly people in the UK there hadn't really been a person doing it in that same way with these kind of shiny challenges and like making them feel like this club that you want to be part of how does then the business part of Bryony's brain then sort of activate because this is now more than a passion and something that you're kind of you're feeling comfortable and this is like we've got a really good business model here how do we then build on this well I actually think my customers gave me that because at the end of the January challenge I had no plan I was like this is you know like this was this was my focus it was taking all my time up I had no time to think about what's next and I never it was never for that financial result that we did get it was more just like let's go all in and this month and feel great yeah yeah and then so at the end I had messages from people being like okay what's the February challenge and I was like well I don't know what is the February challenge and I obviously had my private clients at the same time um on the side so I thought okay I need to do some sort of a February challenge and then you know keep this momentum and keep people feeling good because there's that demand like people were asking me what was next and I almost felt this sounds really cringe but I felt like there was a duty I'm like a responsibility yeah because I thought I'm so grateful that you've trusted me for this whole month what am I just gonna leave you to it now and also there's the risk of doing so yeah means that then they find something else that they want to do in February because if they're if they're sort of on that journey they want something exactly so then I did this February challenge then I did the March challenge and the lovely Jack will remember Jack's our lovely photographer by the way he's behind the camera Jack and Karis were with me through thick and thin but I was in March which is how we know each other because Karis was like you have to try Brian's Pilates yeah before your before your renewal yeah before nice um Jack and Karis are the best um but in in March I I was doing all of my private clients and then I set myself this task oh and I had a March challenge as well and then I set myself the challenge of recording 50 classes so I just we went and did it was just carnage these days I can visualize this you're in that studio of the window behind you yeah and I would do like eight classes a day and I was like right I firstly I can't really afford that the the space the videographer you know all the the costs so I'm like we better make this work so I'm like so um so I was just in the studio doing like eight classes and we just got these 50 classes done and then I with the view of doing this app because I thought I can't keep doing this zoom challenge every month it's not sustainable and I want a place that is cheaper more accessible that people can just go to at any time rather than rely on the specific times of the challenges so that's when when um the business was just naturally born from the demand and I think Like that's a good kind of lesson that I look back on is testing your audience is a really good idea.

31:44If you do have a product, is there a version of like we cannot be perfect. And what we put out day one versus what we have now in everyone's business, I feel like is like that. That's the best advice ever. Michelle Kennedy who founded Pina who like has one of the most successful apps for mothers and parents and I'll be downloading she oh it's brilliant it's so so brilliant and hers sort of started it was known in the US before making its way here but she says something so so interesting she's so big in tech and she like for example if you'd have decided okay I'm now trained in Pilates I'm going to have an app yeah that would be the wrong route like you've organically tested it on a community yeah and it served them in the right way but if your goal is to have an app she says test it start a whatsapp group yes invite people for dinner are they going to come back again do they engage with the group like don't there's this idea that you've got to have this shiny product from the jump but it takes a lot of money a lot of investment and to do that without having tested it in different settings first so you you almost did that without knowing that that was the right exactly time I suppose I had no idea that that was even a move you know I was just putting one foot in front of the other trying to just stay afloat and do what I love but I think that's such a good piece of advice now looking back is definitely test your audience and all the the things that go wrong along the way because there will be so many things and there are all daily things that go wrong the thing is that if you're able to take one it sounds cliche but one learning from it it will only allow you to perfect and tweak your product for next time so as long as you are learning as long as you're able to move on quickly and be resilient because i don't think there's any point dwelling in what you know what fast yeah keep moving exactly and just keep going and then the more learnings you have along the way and you know they're not really failures they are learnings it's there this I think it was the CEO of um Spotify or Shopify said um failure is just the discovery of something that didn't work so true so I love that and I think as long as you can take something from it and apply it to the next time the next time the next time by the end you will have a product that you are really proud of yes of course and it takes that it can't be it is part of its cliche but it is is part of the journey when you sort of decide on I suppose isn't you call it a subscription a membership model yeah you've got live classes the challenges yeah are then back because you're kind of synonymous for the challenge and yeah how did you sort of structure how that was going to look because like I said these kind of the challenges you do are like branded so well and you kind of make a thing of them they're not just like here here's some classes it's like the gifts go out and you almost made it and this is what when I talk about you being filling that gap in the market you really made a brand out of it like it feels like a beauty brand it feels like a clothing brand you know when you do what you do you've kind of you've sort of taken learnings from other brands out there and applied that to working out and wellness which felt really really different at the time and i have to say and that's because i noticed these things a lot of people have done it since but that's how you know you're onto the right thing and i remember back in the day talking to caris and caris is a photographer by the way just i feel like i should explain this to her that i've worked with for like probably longer than she would like.

35:37I was like, Carys, you like me the best, please come and do this. But for many, many, many years, pretty much since I left the group, I remember that you guys were trying to find that studio that was like a cheap enough studio that you could use at the time and then it was really bright and it looked the way it did. But then I found it, so I remember being with her one day and she said, oh my God, you're not going to believe I was on a shoot yesterday at the same studio. And they'd said that other Pilates instructors have tried to book the same space because this was the thing that everybody was doing now and I'm like well no it was it's Bryony's thing but you know that you're onto something quickly when people that was just a kind of a great story you found this amazing studio and it was it looked great and it was bright and you filmed all of your classes in it but actually it becomes such a trend for other instructors that they were trying to book the same space which is so so interesting but that's such a compliment and I at the end of the day I just love seeing so many of our community members train and become teachers that's so empowering I love that I think that is that's at the end of the day firstly everyone a teacher that you warm to not everyone will warm to me you know like it's a certain personality and I think you've really got to gel with your teacher.

36:56You've got to enjoy listening to their voice, you know, small things like that. And what's for one is not for another person. So there's space for everyone. But I think as a teacher, it's such a compliment to hear that you've inspired someone else to be a teacher. So I love that. And the challenges, the kind of core of our business is interesting because I just did an interview this morning as we're just growing our team. and someone asked oh what's the um what would you say is the core of the business and I would say that it's our community and our challenges and the challenges are created for the community to keep that fun and that motivation and and almost to create mini brands each month and to create that kind of like is that real excitement yeah and just to make it like feel so good at the end of the day it doesn't need to be this perfect strict routine where you're wearing you know we do it in our pajamas yeah I was laughing just telling Michelle I took a picture this morning of my mat set up in my pajamas and I'm pregnant at the moment my foot was so swollen in the picture I was like oh okay tuck my foot under but yeah it doesn't have to be perfect that's the beauty of it So you touched on then about interviewing and growing the team and scaling that.

38:17Like how, because I feel like I've witnessed lots of chapters of this scaling and it's sort of happening, you know, slowly but fast at the same time. If you know what I mean, as in like I can really feel when I look back, I'm like, oh, my God, last year, if you actually, before I was sort of getting my notes together, not that I really needed a bunch of notes. I've barely looked at this all the time this morning. It's actually the difference year on year is quite obvious to see and like how it's grown. And even like as an app user myself, like how elevated the app is now. How do you find scaling as you go?

38:57And how much of a sort of conscious decision is that? or are you doing it as always as it started with the sort of user? So I would say my approach to scaling is probably not the typical approach in terms of acquisition. I don't think about acquisition. I think about retention. And through retention, we are scaling and we're having meetings with our community members. So I will get on Zoom with 100 of our community members saying, hey guys, like, what would you want more from the app? Like, what could I give you that will help you? What can we do? You know, whether it's nutrition, a food plan or meditation, like what more do you want?

39:43And they're just the best. Like, they inspire me so much. Like, they give me so many tips, so many kind of insights into their user mind, if that makes sense. And their experience on the app, yeah. So I think through our, you know, we just really value our current users and we want to make it the best for them and I think that in turn is scaling the business because you know what it's like like if I tell you well if you tell me something I'm like right I'm doing it and and yeah of course you know you're just like you're so kind of invested in your in your friends and you trust them so word of mouth is kind of the best.

40:25It would always be the best. It would always be the best. And the app is obviously offers so much more than it originally started with, which is so incredible. It's not just a Pilates app. It's a whole wellness hub now. And how important was that to you to make it really sort of, I suppose, really lifestyle? Thank you for saying that. Well, it is really important because it is a 360 and although the classes I'm so passionate about giving you these physical results because I'm so conscious that you've got 20 minutes that morning I'm gonna make every minute count to the point where if you sneeze later on you're gonna feel it in your abs we do girl sometimes I'm like why does she do that to me today but I think you can make 20 you can have an hour in the gym and not make it an effective hour and you have breaks and you go on your phone or whatever you can have 20 minutes of a short sharp efficient movement that will change your body so I am passionate about that but I really do think it is an inside job and I think this whole approach to wellness is a 360 thing it's sleep it's nutrition it's sound baths breath work meditation and I think what I'm most passionate about and our mission for the company is to create inner confidence and transformation.

41:47And that does not come from one thing. That comes from a few things. And we just want to make it a one-stop shop for that. And I also think, sorry to cut you, but I think what's such a barrier to so many people, and I can really relate to that, is going into a gym when you're on your confidence journey is super intimidating. So intimidating. Oh, my gosh. when you think you know like the weight rack how do i even use this you just feel so silly and i think if i can help you build your confidence in the comfort of your own home with you know your hair like a pineapple on top of your head in your pajamas kids running around like just living your life and you know making it fit in then then when you kind of almost like unleash into the world yeah because i think it's hard to build your confidence in public Yeah, when you feel like, is everybody looking at me?

42:42Am I being judged? I don't even know what I'm doing myself here. Exactly. And it's quite, yeah, it's definitely out of most people's comfort zone, I think. Even now, I'm like, a gym isn't my favourite place to hang. No. Like, I need to be told where I should be and what I'm doing. And not just, like, out in the wild. You just feel quite exposed. So I think it should just be a moment for you. Touching on growth, your team, I suppose for you, it's almost very important to keep and I found this with myself we now I manage myself but now I've merged with um William Morris so WME for sort of like having that bigger partner because for me it's really important that my team always stays small yeah because I think it really dilutes the messaging and it dilutes me as a you know as a brand as a person and I think when you and I found it before when I'm part of a massive company things can get lost and I wouldn't never do that or it's very important that we everybody knows me personally um so with you I'd imagine it's the same thing so scaling the business you don't you you would need a bigger team but you almost want to make sure that it stays small at the same time so how does the team look now how many of you are there and and and what does everybody do how does that now look well just before i go into kind of the team setup i do think you don't need a big team to scale your you don't need to grow your team to scale your business i actually think less is more i'm so with you my little coco is a tiny team we let we lean on back ends of yeah you know bigger companies exactly i think that's what makes that's what keeps the dna to me of a brand definitely and having that kind of tight-knit family thing like for example on um friday we had we do kind of this we do something for the community and then we do something for our influencers that are part of the community and stuff and so my dad was the delivery driver oh my god she came here she sent me a picture of him when he was on the way and it's so cute oh my god and was it him that drew on it because it said well rochelle and a love heart i'm hoping it was your dad it was actually marine this is the thing about the team is like maureen who she's incredible she's now our brand manager and she's come over from i met her through um working with dior and she's just incredible and she is in the car all day with my dad that's not a normal job situation you know but it's that family environment that i always want to keep so i don't want to change that i'm not interested in having like a hunt a team of 100 not at all with you because I think it will it takes me away from what I love and also like you say it can dilute and also nowadays I don't think it's in in definitely in what we do I don't think it's necessary we are a team of kind of um full-time about I think there's five this is my baby six including me I think it is and then we rely on a lot of freelancers as well which it which I love and I love to do projects with those freelancers and they for that time are really involved in our team and then also keeps it fresh because you get sort of a different set of eyes on stuff if you use a different person which I love that one of my friends actually she really inspired me she has a huge app and an amazing business and she has a team of three yeah and she's like I have no intention of growing that team and her business I'm so for this yeah I'm like I love it and that is it's it becomes a family and you don't ever want to put too much pressure on everybody that's a part of your business that we're like we are a family you can't leave me yeah but also don't but that is really how it feels and to me that's really important I wonder because obviously you're pregnant and I'm so I was so excited about this.

46:39I wonder for you, I had Jo Malone on the podcast. And she is like, I wouldn't change a thing because, you know, and including her battle with cancer, she was like, I wouldn't change a thing because everything has taught her a different lesson and made her a different person. And I asked her, because obviously she sold her, she sold Jo Malone London, but it's her name. So there's kind of loads of different like T's and C's as to, I think she can't hold a bottle of perfume and say, introduce herself as Jo Malone. Yeah. It's all kind of quite intricate because she was like, in hindsight, like if I was going to Jo for advice tomorrow, would she say to have her name in the brand?

47:24Yeah. Maybe not, but she wouldn't change a thing for her. Whilst you're pregnant, have you felt, because I know how hard you've been working. have you felt an extra pressure because you know pilates by briny i want you girl so has that given you sort of an extra level of pressure i know that you've worked with some great instructors too and it's kind of that's another side you know another string to your bow that you can offer that but have you felt a level a level of pressure that's like okay i have a duty here because this is me and would you change any part of that i think that's a really good question and yes I have felt a lot of pressure and I've not found pregnancy the easiest thing and I think I everyone you know you you feel you need to caveat that with saying I'm so incredibly grateful that goes without saying and being a mom is has been one of my dreams in life you know I can't wait until we have our baby but it doesn't mean pregnancy is easy but exactly and And so you're very conflicted because you feel so grateful that you're able to be pregnant and, you know, carry this baby.

48:33But at the same time, you're just it is difficult and your body is tested. It's like a marathon. And one thing I'm very happy about is the fact that we were so lucky to get pregnant quite soon after getting married. So I felt like I was in this very strong physical shape beforehand. so I do feel like if you're listening and you're thinking about getting pregnant get in the best shape of your life before pregnancy because it's a marathon yeah it's not a sprint sadly it's really it's like it's a really slow marathon yeah and um yeah you're kind of walking yeah with the heavy costume so it's hard but at the same time what I've really appreciated is the creativity it's forced me into having so like for example I've you know done a we we did a challenge in September called Strongest You and we had a strength trainer on there so that was amazing and now we're launching the Jess Hunt challenge um on Monday which is so exciting and I've had to batch record you know like four challenges in one and I did our hardest challenge we've ever done the six week transform transform six I was in my first trimester so incredibly sick waking up at 6 30 doing the 45 minute advanced classes but what it's taught me is firstly creativity because you can you just have to pull from the depths of your soul and just just do what you want you know you you can do it you have it in you but also it's taught me resilience I think just the like I looked like a crazy person dancing to myself in my bathroom to like some like song to try and hype myself before these classes and I honestly have like vomit in my in my mouth but it's our most popular challenge so it just you have to dig deep guys do you know do you know what's so interesting you're right and I think I'm always envious of your job because I think when I'm super busy the kids are everywhere work is on my plate sadly for me and it shouldn't be that's where I need to dig deep Pilates and working out and taking time for myself is the first thing to go of course because you feel it's selfish I've got a rush here I've got to do that everyone needs me yeah but actually that's where I should go no get up an hour earlier today yeah because you're going to need this because it's like and I'm thought I'm sort of in that the minute where I'm I've been so consistent that it is a non-negotiable and I think that's when I feel my best and I'm like I should know I'm 36 years old at this point I'm gonna feel better those tough days will be made easier yes if I've taken that time for myself but I that's when I look at and I think oh my god I wish I had Bryony's job because yeah that is her work and she has to do that but then equally when you're only pregnant you always have to do it I you know I didn't have to take an advanced class so it's kind of it's a blessing and a tiny curse sometimes I suppose yeah I mean look 99.9 % of the time is the luckiest best job in the world and then there are times where you have like coronavirus you're doing a 45 minute life or you know you're pregnant or whatever when you think oh I could just do with an hour extra just being ill in general like when you are literally the picture of health what people are paying you to be at the same time it's that added pressure exactly but at the same time there's a lot of other people out there doing way more like taxing mentally physically jobs so I'm very no exactly so I'm always very aware of that so yeah there are I I'm very grateful that I'm able to use my work time for also wellness which is incredible but as you said yeah exactly and as you said it it's often the first thing that you you let kind of like fall off especially as a mom like as you have three kids you you know running all these successful businesses you almost feel like that wellness time is selfish but I promise you guys it is the most effective productive thing that you can do even just 20 minutes in the morning it sets you up for success I did a video of this on on Instagram the other day because people and people were like oh my gosh I'm so glad you said it you can you it's physically impossible yeah and I say this as someone with a thousand jobs and a mum of three and yes I'm fortunate enough it takes a village I do have help but it is physically impossible to fill up everyone else's glasses with if yours is on low yeah so you have to sort of fill yours up so you can pour yourself into everybody else and everything else totally and without that sort of recharging your own battery, it's just impossible.

53:32Yeah, you really have to lean on those things. I'll just tell you a funny story the other day. Casper, before I was pregnant, saw me cry three times, and now it is three times a week at least. And so the other day I was having, honestly, the biggest just hormonal moment breakdown. He walked in and I was lying on the floor with my dog, just stretching out my back and he was like what's wrong and I was like you know when something sets you off and um he said to me he was like yeah but you know practice what you preach in these moments like don't fight it sit there and he's he's so sweet and it was it actually really made me laugh because he did an impression of what I should do and stuff and he was being so serious but he sat down and he said just sit there meditate and tell that inner voice you know what fuck you I have all the time in the world for you to come and then go I'm just gonna let you pass and I was like do you know what it was so funny in his accent the way he said it and he was sat there meditating like he it was just so funny but it's so true and I think like giving yourself that time sometimes to just reset then you can go on absolutely that and Dior who is my life coach says it in probably a bit more of an article away than fuck you but I do like that we need a bit of that sometimes and she basically says like acknowledge it so like if you're like I'm really stressed I've got a lump in my throat yeah acknowledge it like oh I'm not having a great day I've got a tight chest today or I've got a bit of a knot in my tummy but like acknowledge it you don't have to try and problem solve necessarily in that because I'm that person I'm like I've got this it's because i need to sort this out and i start sort of going into overdrive which is such a toxic trait of mine that actually just acknowledge that it's there it's with you all day it will go but you kind of you can't sort of try and fight against it sometimes because we try and we try to stop those feelings don't you well i do because i'm like i need to feel good i need to feel good but actually just acknowledging it and like living with it and letting it pass yeah and And this sounds a really cheesy thing to say, but sometimes I think about these thoughts and emotions and feelings like clouds.

55:47And they like it's a cloudy day, let's say, but tomorrow might be a sunny day. So that cloud will be there for a while, but it might start to ease off. It might start to pass like in the afternoon. It might linger, but just knowing that at some point it will pass. And we have no control over that. So like, but we don't sort of stay inside and say, well, it might keep raining all week. and not go anywhere like you know like we have no control and sometimes you don't have control over what's happening but it will yeah sometimes writing as well really can just help to take you out of that um i want to talk about what's next for you um what's sort of next for the app is it more international growth because i know that your kind of business is split into different territories like how does it look and what does now scaling look like to you and or is is it scaling what is next for the app and what do you kind of if you were back in that seat in like a year or two what would you want to say has been the kind of next couple of years that you've had so I would definitely say even though we're a digital business I would say creating more in-person and connection um is a big focus for us so whether that be through pop-ups walks classes I really want our community to meet each other as much as possible so all over the world so that's a big focus for us um and obviously I'm having a baby soon so that's quite a big moment and um yeah we've really kind of built the pre-postnatal universe on the app as well which has been really interesting doing it in real time and I'm really looking forward to that postpartum transformation because I am going to be on it guys I'm going to be I can't wait to move properly again and really just you know even though of course you're able to do pilates but I'm excited for teasers and all those things yeah all the things you could do before having a ball Exactly.

57:46So that is a big focus. So a lot more international, in-person connection. Nice. So would that look like you do those, you know, you do retreats sometimes. Exactly. You do the kind of days where everybody gets together and do those live classes. Yeah, for the community. Yeah, incredible. So I'm really looking forward to that. And that will be all over the world. I have so much travel coming up next year, which I can't wait for. so yeah I think that will be the little one in tow I know lucky Casper is kind of like we're in different life phases because I'm like thanks stay at home dad come with me that's so nice and you'll get to travel together as a little family which is lovely exactly I want to do our rocket round now so this is quick fire that's the idea it never is that quick the boys look at me every time in their lives i'm the most long-winded slow we try we try right first question is what do you believe are the non-negotiables for running a business oh okay i would say resilience the ability to move on very quickly that is important not be stuck in your yes mistakes and whatever um I would say definitely test your audience through some way for me it was zoom um test your community really embrace your community and then the third one non-negotiable for running a business I would say keep growing and learning as an individual don't just focus on the day-to-day like sometimes zoom out and think okay how can I move myself 10x rather than just doing the the 2x there's a book about 10x versus 2x so I think zoom out and say what will help me make a big difference rather than just responding and being proactive to the day-to-day so I think that helps really growing as an individual smarter yeah not harder yeah um at what moment did you first realize that you truly launched oh um I genuinely don't think I launched but I just think I think I mean you have such incredible guests and I'm like you know I don't think I'm like a I wouldn't say I'm up there in space you know but do you know what it's so interesting every good entrepreneur I mean there'll be a little moment there when they're like when my mum said she saw this or something yeah lands a little different but everyone is in pretty much the same vein they're like I've still got stuff I want to do I don't feel like I've sort of had lift off if you thought you had then maybe I don't know that that would be at the point where you were just ready to kind of just stop and I'm not I'm not there yet but one like moments that make me feel fulfilled and successful are when I get letters from people or mess dm saying that they've been on the app for x amount of time and I've changed their life that for me is genuinely the best thing ever yeah what a feeling yeah what is the first thing you do when you wake up and the last thing you do before you go to bed now you're my probably dream guest to ask this to because Because most people say, oh, God, I'm a founder, I'm a CEO, I look at my phone, and I wish I didn't say I look at my phone, but I do.

1:01:20I feel like yours is going to be the goals. I feel like you're going to set the benchmark. Well, no pressure. So I obviously do the obvious. My dog sleeps in the bed with us, which is not the best. Pregnancy pillow, dog, all the things. We'll be baby soon. Exactly. We need a bigger bed, Casper. the second I get out of bed our dog goes in and snuggles into my pregnancy pillow he's like thank god she's out yeah I also tongue scrape oh yeah I tongue scrape we've never had this I'm into it okay good I feel like that's good okay so I tongue scrape every single morning which I just feel detoxes cleanses I dry brush dry brush my face that is a really incredible thing to do I mean you can buy a dry brush for your face on amazon yeah um anyway i do all my skincare and everything i ice roll every morning and that's one thing i think about i know i feel like every morning what's briny doing right now probably if in doubt there are just staples and then also i read the lesson the daily lesson from the daily stoic every single day and quite often i'll post it i think it kind of just sets you into like a thinking mindset for the day and then one thing i've change of course I do Pilates of course I do my um meditation journaling all those things which you expect me to say but I've actually flipped it I used to have a matcha first thing now I have my breakfast first thing um because I feel really like it's made a difference to my hormones so I'll eat within like half an hour of waking up and is that during pregnancy or also pre-pregnancy pre-pregnancy as well but i'm i'm eating all the time during the house exactly there's no differentiation throughout the day okay yeah that's so i'll do breakfast and like um my water with electrolytes or whatever then i'll do um the kind of morning routine like as in um i'll do a meditation moment or breath work moment then i'll do pilates finish with some journaling and then i'll have my matcha as my reward or sometimes i'll even try if i can go on a walk and then have the matcha but kind of those are my staples and sometimes that slightly moves around but the thing that i've introduced is the breakfast first and and i think if you're struggling with hormone health that's a really good place to start it's really interesting um is there a piece of advice that you wish that you hadn't listened to oh I think when people tell you to play it safe and I think also like our parents kind of um era was definitely like you know stay in stay in your comfort zone you know play it safe don't take too many risks I think that's a bad piece of advice because you will just find yourself being stuck whether that's whether you're in a job and you want to leave or whether you have your own business or you know in your relationship I think it's always good to grow and push the boundaries and see see where you can get to and set yourself daily challenges weekly challenges monthly challenges that's how you will build your confidence yeah sorry I'm so not quick on this quick no you're so right because like you say like whether you're either way you need to be moving whether you've fallen off and you're moving backwards or whether you're moving forwards but being stuck in the same place isn't necessarily positive um what's the skill that you'd love to learn oh um I'm very into cooking at the moment so I think maybe go deeper on that but I would say I did A-level Spanish and I really love Spanish so I want to have a house in Mallorca one day so I want to be fluent Spanish one day.

1:05:18Oh, by the time you're there. Yeah. Mallorca is so gorgeous. I guess I also need to be fluent Danish because our baby's going to speak Danish. Oh, yeah. Otherwise I'll be talking about you. I know. Caster doesn't want you. He's like, I want a secret language with our baby. Well, my best friend Gemma lives in Paris. Yes. And her son speaks French and she goes to French school. Oh, that's so good. Yeah, she goes to French school once a week. I mean, I was with her at the weekend. I'm not sure. Patchy. We went to Pilates together and she was also translating for Gemma. So I'm not sure how well this is going.

1:05:47She's been there two years. But her husband and her son, she was like, they talk about me. Yeah. And it's so annoying. She goes, I pretend I understand them because I know that they're talking about me and I say, oi. Yeah. She's like, but I've got no clue. But they're saying something really nice and she's like, what do you mean? So yeah. That's always one thing to remember as they get older. They're like, don't worry, I'll just handle this with my dad. Yeah, exactly. I have to bribe them to not do it. What's one thing that you wish someone had told you before you started your career?

1:06:24Oh, that's a really hard question. One thing I wish someone had told me. it's hard because I don't feel like I I feel like that almost comes with regret yeah one thing I do appreciate about um Casper is that he's made me think a lot bigger than I ever have before so I appreciate that and I almost wish I had had that before yeah yeah yeah but I think it does happen i think everybody's upbringing is so different and like i'm the same like being risk averse is like it's quite a it's like in your personality trait doesn't it like oh i don't know how to do that because what if yeah actually flip that what if it's really exciting on the other side i know and it's interesting because i feel like he's always had that like he never questioned anything even day one whereas I was not wired like that so he's kind of instilled that in me which is nice yeah confidence um we've just seen that you did the challenge with uh Jess Hunt which just looks incredible oh my god can't wait for you to do it what would be we always ask what would be the dream collab oh for the brand obviously you've just had a really good one but not necessarily a person could be like a brand on brand collab dream collaboration okay I'll start with brand on brand I think a something to do with travel would be a good one yeah um I love what I am able to do with Dior which is incredible but it's also very you know exclusive I would love to be able to do something like that which is more accessible exactly um so something along the lines of travel like an airline or something an airline would be amazing a hotel chain yeah or like a travel company um and where we could just do like 360 wellness all together it would be amazing and then in terms of a person there are so many people who would be your dream like if you was if you sort of opened your instagram and you think you've been notified by this person what would make you go i think well firstly there's loads of people obviously that inspire me but i actually think alex cooper oh yeah because she's great did you watch her documentary do you know what i've not watched and i know and everybody keeps saying have you not seen it have you not seen it rochelle you will be so inspired she's she's incredible anyway she's incredible i'm gonna do that tonight please do it and and voice name me after she's so good she's so inspiring and i think her journey is so like like the way that she come from sport yeah and the challenges she's had and and also just how she you know her upbringing and her her childhood and she wasn't necessarily the most popular kid in school and she's now like look at her she's so inspiring and i she really inspires me so someone like that would be incredible she's cool isn't she yeah she's so cool and if you could choose one female figure as a mentor past or present who would it be oh well i'll say one one that's not so hard because she is my mentor my mom um she's incredible um and then in terms of kind of a public figure oh god we have had from i mean everybody on this podcast as in who else do we like mine would be estee lauder obviously she is past not present but i'm kind of obsessed how she trailblazed that beauty space and no one wanted to know her and no one was interested she was pitching stuff and then she became the kind of umbrella company you know after a lot of work and I think she's amazing Casper actually did an internship at Estee Lauder he traveled the world with Estee Lauder which is really random but he also was so inspired oh there's so many people honestly like there's so many that come to mind like bethany frankel i love i saw her in paris she was there again the way she walked down that catwalk in paris but also miami swim week was amazing um obviously emma greed is incredible um and then you have oh god i'm going blank there's so many people that inspire me like if you could have go oh i'd love to be able to get a coffee with that person to pick their brains who would it be can i say male one male one female absolutely okay so one male would be mo gaudet who came on my podcast and he is like a real rare combination of being very spiritual and thoughtful and he's been through so much in his life um but also has done the most incredible things with business um and he's just the best he's such a nice person he seems like the kindest you know like he's got really kind eyes and the voice as well so soothing if i was having a stressful day just call mo get him on speed so i'd say mo and then i would say um louise hay who is past right um so louise Hay has written books called um you can change your mind you can change your body you can change your life right I think that's the change or it might be change your mind but yeah you can heal you can heal your mind you can heal your body you can heal your life and those books really got me through like a dark point in my life and I feel she is just unbelievable if you haven't read any Louise Hay you will love it's okay it's kind of a combination and and and she's such a powerhouse but it's kind of a combination of like The Secret, Mel Robbins, Gabby Bernstein but also with that like real rooted wisdom yeah of like kind of a mum energy amazing books oh okay there you go We do a little book club on the podcast.

1:13:06Oh, there you go. There's my next answer. And then I get every guest to leave a tip. Almost one piece of tangible advice. If a listener is listening today and they think, do you know what, I would love to kind of launch a business in the same sort of vein as you and are really inspired by your story. What would be one piece of advice that you think that they would need to know before starting i would say set yourself daily challenges because if you don't do something every day that kind of makes you a bit nervous or moves the needle in some way you're going to be stuck and i think it's quite a good challenge in itself to say okay what am i doing today that slightly makes me nervous or scares me or is out of my comfort zone yes because before you know it imagine you do one small thing every day um i really think it has an accumulative effect and a compound effect of changing your life that's so so interesting and it's so true it's like the book we love atomic habits yeah and if you've not read that i mean i've told you a million times but read it it's such particularly in that sort of mindset of wanting to be consistent definitely it can just be small it's the small wins but if you've done something every day for a year think how far that will take you there's another book called um the power of one more which is really good yeah um and then lastly we talk about ladies who launch but we also like ladies who lunch oh so when it comes to a lunch hour how does it look for you sometimes i have women sit in this chair and they're like a lunch hour what is that or on the flip side some people really kind of strict with those boundaries that we stop for lunch go out for whatever that looks how do you spend lunch where are you and what are you eating so some days i'll be eating at my desk some days um i will do like a little lunch date with casper to try and convince him that we don't have to go out for dinner or some days i'll do a working lunch out with the team so but if i was at my desk at the moment i'm obsessed with like real hearty soups oh yeah yeah so oh god and like using like butter beans and there's there's lots of um of soup recipes on my app at the moment because that's my pregnancy craving yeah or ramen you've all got a lot of ramen on the app at the moment so yeah i'm really in my soup era this is what mom says to me he was like oh we know when mommy's on a health kit because the fridge is like yeah they're all like no this is not what we want this week not another soup yeah exactly um but I definitely always eat lunch I always eat three meals a day without fail I never skip so that is a I priority 100 % I think you need to feel your body and if you were going to take the team out for like a rewarding lunch after a great month where would you go we're talking London wherever really you know where I went the other day in london which was incredible um cafe le cafe knack oh you have to go there guys it was so good get the pasta get the asian salad and the turkey club sandwich oh gosh very specific i know i could we could have done two hours just about food right now pickles yeah pickles had those last night it was when i was when i was like oh gosh she's she's pregnant is when it was like random mince cravings, bowls of mince, chicken sausages.

1:16:49You knew. I feel like you were one of the first people. Girl! Thank you so much. It's been so, so good to see. I know that we're friends, but there's lots of information I didn't know. I didn't know that you had a beauty salon in your house. So it's been so, so nice to deep dive into you and what you do. And I'm so, so proud of you and, you know, knowing you and seeing how far that you've come and how you consistently grow. Well, you've been such a big part of my journey. So thank you. I won't cry, but I could cry at the drop of a hat. But I also wanted to just say that and acknowledge that you've been such a big part of my journey.

1:17:28And now we have our own business together, which is amazing. Which, guys, you're going to get a bonus episode all about that, which is very exciting. I know, we had to hold it in this episode. Don't mention matcha just yet. Yeah, thank you for having me. Thank you. Loved it. Yay!

1:17:48Don't forget to follow us on Apple and Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts to make sure that you don't miss out because next time we're going to be joined by another incredible lady who launched. If like me you're a watcher then please follow us on YouTube and don't forget to like and subscribe.