Ep 64: Behind Atlantis The Royal’s Beyoncé Launch ft Hanan Eissa

0:00Rochelle: Have you ever wondered how to take a regional brand and make it resonate globally? Well, today we're talking to the one behind Dubai's most talked about launch, Hanan Eissa. This episode explores the secrets behind globalizing a brand with tangible insights to anyone looking to take their brand to the next level. So, welcome to the Launchbox.

0:32Rochelle: Thanks so much for coming here. I'm so, so excited to speak to you. I suppose before we really get into it, for anyone that doesn't know you, I want to start by touching on your background and just how impressive your career is and has been and like an overview of your career today. Well, thank you for having me. First and foremost, I really, you know, I'm excited to be here. So I'm the vice president of marketing and communication for Atlantis Dubai. So for those who don't know Atlantis Dubai, it's basically two kilometres on the palm in Dubai. It's got two resorts, two gorgeous resorts, both now icons, I would say.

1:17So Atlantis the Palm is the original, opened in 2008. And then Atlantis the Royal is the new, my new baby, opened in 2023. And then between them is the world's largest water park and like the funnest place in Dubai, I think. You've been in marketing for over 25 years, which is no mean feat at all. What is it about marketing that, A, that you love, but B, that drew you originally? Do you want the truth? Always. I fell into it accidentally. Stop. Yes. So I started, I guess, my university journey sort of doing pre-med. I was meant to be a doctor. That was the dream, right? So in my household, you're either a doctor, an engineer, or a lawyer.

2:03So I picked medicine. I was good at math and chemistry and biology, et cetera. and then I did my first year of sort of university, University of Melbourne and then one day I woke up and decided that I can't be a doctor. I don't want to be a doctor. And then you go on this journey at 19 where you're like, how do I find myself? So I did a little bit of travelling and then I ended up in Egypt where my grandmother lives. That's my heritage. I'm Egyptian. And, you know, my parents were like, well, you have to do something. You can't just drop out of university. And then I sort of searched for different things and I said, okay, what am I good at?

2:38I like writing and reading. I'm a little bit creative and I'm good at math. What is this discipline called marketing? So I applied for marketing and I sort of fell into it. But as I fell into it, I also fell in love with it. Because it's just the perfect thing for me. It gave my left brain a chance, my right brain a chance, and it sort of combined them together in this amazing world of curiosity and psychology and numbers and so I actually just fell into it

3:08Rochelle: that is so crazy isn't it and they say that I was reading something the other day that and it was basically like how do you know that you've found your thing and they say that it's the thing that comes easy to you that's hard to most because you go through those kind of like especially those formative years like you say 19 you're supposed to you're at uni you're supposed to know what you want to do and we put a lot of pressure on ourselves to having to have that figured out but there are lots of people there are lots of people that will be listening now that are like I just haven't how do I know what my thing is like I didn't have that moment where it was like the last piece of the puzzle when it all clicked but actually like you say you found that thing that kind of activates all sides of your brain yeah and I think you have to you have to understand at 19 or 18 and when you make these big life decisions that it's not the end and I think I you know for a little while I thought it was the end because I didn't want to be a doctor and then I felt a little bit lost but you know I started to explore what is it that I'm good at and what is that I like to do and honestly I knew nothing about marketing I'm talking about the 90s right so it's like sort of the the mid to late 90s where marketing wasn't what it is now it wasn't as sexy and it wasn't as you know like you know well put together and um and so I just sort of said I'll give it a try and I think at that point I said I'm gonna try and if it works out it works out and if it doesn't I'm gonna figure it out and was it an instant love oh absolutely just it clicked it was you know um I don't know it was it was easy right and easy in a way that it wasn't academically easy but it just flowed yes I understood it it just clicked yeah it was meant to be yeah I want to touch on what it is you do now and what that entails and what it means and how it sort of changed to the you way back then so I look after you know the entire footprint which includes the water park both hotels the F &B sort of proposition there as well so our 50 restaurants.

5:13And then anything else you can squeeze into my day basically is how it works in my world. And it's been, this job has been the love of my life. If I talk about professionally, it's been the love of my life. And also I didn't love it to begin with because I started my career in fast moving consumer goods and it was that way until, you know, I joined Atlantis. So it took me a while to understand the difference and, you know, being going from fast moving consumer goods, which is very structured and very disciplined to the wild, wild west of Dubai and then hospitality and then Atlantis. So, you know, there's hospitality and then there's Atlantis, which does everything so different.

5:57And it took me a while to sort of adjust to that too. It wasn't easy. I think people think that where you are now is where you started. And where I started, it was tough. I remember I used to go home to my husband. I'd say, these people are crazy, like crazy um and I didn't know if I was going to make it or not but you know you fall in love with it day by day as you become equally as crazy I think that that's where I end up yeah exactly that and I see it in people who join from the beginning and then you know they look at me sometimes like you're crazy and I'm like I know it sounds crazy but you'll get there it's gonna be amazing and it will be amazing and then you do get that you adjust you you know you see bit by a bit how people sort of adapt and then adopt, I would say, is really interesting.

6:42We should actually, I should probably caveat this by saying, because if people listen to

6:47Rochelle: this and they follow me, they know just how much I love the Atlantis and Atlantis the Royal. And this is not a sponsored podcast. This is not an advertisement. I am just such a big fan of, I was lucky enough to be invited to the launch of Atlantis the Royal and when I tell you I genuinely don't believe that I will ever be invited to something like it again I mean first of all Beyonce was there which you all know how I feel about her and just the level of attention to detail global scale like but nobody felt like which I think is so interesting when you're hosting people nobody felt like they were a number there or they were part of I wasn't really aware that there were that many people if that makes sense yeah but I know the global scale because it's all I saw on my timeline I'm like oh my god that person was here I didn't even see them but the kind of the feeling that it was I think what everybody took away from a it was just the best weekend and the most fun and so generous but b that it was you felt like it was just you going And I think that is really a hard thing to convey when you, when there's, when it's such a juggernaut.

8:02Rochelle: And I'm such a big fan. And I was just so, as soon as I went to that event, I was so interested in what it takes to put something like that on. And I'm like, I need to find out who did this and I need to talk to them. And thankfully for me, it was a woman. And I'm like, cue ladies who launch. um but i just there's so many questions that i have on on on that and how it went down but within this episode i really want to focus on turning a regional brand into a global phenomenon because i think it it's something that i would appear that appears to me such a hard thing to draw an international audience and that's of course what you did and of course it goes about saying it was a fabulous invitation it was one that I don't think many people turned down but I want to kind of really pick your brains and get your tips and tricks um of how something like that starts and almost like I suppose your blueprint for creating a global buzz um it's a big old question.

9:13No, no, no. It's not complicated, but it is complicated. I think it starts with vision, honestly. I think as a marketer, in this world that we live in, I think courage is probably my favorite word, right? It requires courage, the courage to have a vision, but also the courage to know that you might fail. I think that that's really, really important. Because courage doesn't mean you're afraid, but it's pretty scary. And so the brief was you need to make Atlantis the Royal equally as successful, if not more successful than the opening of Atlantis the Palm. That was the brief, right? And if you remember in 2008 when Atlantis the Palm opened, the Palm launched.

10:02So it was like the launch of this huge, you know, icon called The Palm. And so how do you compete with that? So one morning I walked into my boss's office and I said to him, I think I know how we're going to do this. And he said, how? And I said, we're going to get Beyonce. I love this. And he looked at me and he threw down his glasses. And I remember this very well. He said, are you crazy? crazy. And I went, yep. And he's like, how? And I said, I don't know yet, but this is the only way this will be a global success, a global icon launching a new icon. This is how big it needs to be. I've just got shivers.

10:49Yeah, it was an interesting road. And so we started, and then, you know, I also believe that when you believe in something enough, really from a place of true conviction the universe conspires to help you make it happen so that these like that's going to be on my gravestone I think on my tombstone yeah it's so true it's so funny enough there were people who were put in our path coincidentally in those next few weeks that said to us they have a connection with Beyonce and that they could get Beyonce and so and then the road started we had her people over and the resort wasn't even ready back then.

11:29And so we had her people over, they looked at the resort. The beauty was that the resort was going to be empty for her for the few weeks that she was there until the opening. And so that was a great draw card as well because she could rehearse, she was comfortable in that environment.

11:47Rochelle: Right, so she sort of had... The resort to herself. Wow, okay. Yeah, for the first few weeks. It's so interesting. I did wonder, I was thinking logistics, And I remember it was so, and this makes so much sense, because there was definitely that safety from, there must have been from their side. Because I remember being sat at the bar just outside of the pool and just Jay-Z being on the next table and being like, that's playing checkers. Yes, that's actual Jay-Z just chilling. Like, this is bizarre. But that obviously is testament to how safe they felt and if they'd been there as a family for a long time, then that makes perfect sense.

12:27So, you know, the world conspired to throw all of these things at us to help us achieve that. And I remember on the night of the performance, I was actually standing right in front when she sang and she came up and she sang at last, which was kind of like, you know, the perfect song. And I just felt relief just washed over me. And it happened. So I think, you know, and that took courage and, you know, there was a process to get there because it was a huge gamble for, you know, the Dubai, for Dubai and the ownership and whatnot. But, you know, I felt so just relieved that it worked out. And then the resort flew from there.

13:08I mean, you know, we had amazing celebrities there and amazing guests who were so kind and so, you know, warm with, you know, their, you know, their experience at the resort. And I think, you know, what we offered there that day, we continued to offer two years later, you know, that, you know, sort of the warmth, the hospitality, you know.

13:31Rochelle: Oh, yeah. It's unmatched. It really, really is. I wonder, so that day when you walk into your boss's office and he's like, don't be ridiculous or whatever. did you feel like okay I've got a point to prove now this is feels a little bit crazy but this is something that I really want to get across the line because I have that belief was it just him that had that sort of standpoint or was everyone around you a little bit like great but this is never going to happen I mean thankfully he's equally as crazy as I am so I had his support and buy-in but the journey was then how do we make it happen yeah right and so yeah everybody absolutely thought we were crazy.

14:11And we got a couple of, you know, curveballs thrown at us throughout the process to make it happen. I don't know. I just had a feeling. I really did. And, you know, I bet my career on it, honestly. I really did. It was the, it's going to make you or break you. And it was just sort of magic. And the people who I was around and the people who worked on this actually were a whole load of women um you know who made it happen um and so it was really really really something special I think a once in a lifetime yeah yeah yeah yeah goes back to that

14:46Rochelle: point that you were saying courage and no risk no reward right if we're talking about sort of like you say you need a global icon to launch another global icon and I think that's that from the outside that is quite literally what happened you're you're hosting sort of celebrities influencers talent however you want to put it from lots of different territories from lots of different countries how many how many countries are we talking 30 countries 30 countries okay so tell us how you adapt and this isn't you know not necessarily just the atlantis itself but i'm I'm putting it on this kind of this moment how you adapt storytelling that it impacts different cultures different backgrounds I suppose without losing the brand's identity and keeping the messaging consistent because obviously you're you're talking about different territories you've got I suppose change the messaging but it also needs to be true to the brand's messaging I find that really really interesting particularly to have one sort of launch weekend as it were but to get that that message right um I think it's a couple of things what I loved about the proposition of Beyonce she transcends yes right so you've already got a really good head start you know she transcends culture she transcends you know nationalities whether you're Ukrainian or German or, you know, Egyptian or American, it's Beyonce.

16:15You know who she is and that voice is magic and that feeling is magic. So I think that was a really big step. But also then we got different celebrities and people of influence, I would say, from different places. So they could be part of that message and they could help tell that story in their own way and in their own words, whether you had, you know, celebrities from Germany or you had, you know, people from the UK You know, the UK is a huge market for Atlantis. So everybody told that story from their perspective. And then we had a lot of people in the background and, you know, that were working with all of these, you know, people of influence, whether it's celebrity or influencer, to help them articulate that story.

16:59So I remember in my office, we had a huge messaging board, I think the size of this wall. And we would have all the different key messages that we wanted to tell in all the different countries and what was relevant to each country. Right. Because what's relevant in Australia is food. What's relevant in, for example, the UK is the sun and, you know, the experience. And so all of these different countries had different messages that were relevant to them. And what we tried to do through that weekend is help tell those stories and articulate them.

17:28Rochelle: Yeah. And what would you say, obviously, if, you know, there's a listener listening to this right now and they are, I don't know, in their first year of their business. or it's a startup, however that might look, but they kind of want to launch something with international appeal. And, you know, there isn't a Beyonce budget or, you know, the ability to have influencers from across the globe. What would you say would be your kind of key must haves, if you're kind of building out your own marketing strategy, and you haven't got a team to help sort of deliver that messaging what would you say would be the key ways to kind of spread the word and tell the story because we talk about it a lot on this show and and that's that it could be a product based business or service based or however that looks you could have a great product but if people don't know about it they don't know about it so what would you say would be your kind of key tips I think the first thing is make sure you have a great product.

18:36I think people also think about marketing in terms of the storytelling and the end message. There are three Ps before that, right? Product, price, and place. And I think it's really, really important to nail those two, you know, really understand the story of your product and is it differentiated or if it's not differentiated, how are you different than your nearest competitor and find that, you know, unique selling point. I know it sounds really theoretical, but it's actually purely true. And then how are you going to position that versus everybody? And be really clear about that before you tell stories.

19:12And then I think the number one key advice when I talk about telling stories and getting the message out there is be authentic. Authenticity is the most underrated thing in this world at the moment and and and gather people around you who can tell help you tell authentic stories right and i'm not talking about big influences and things like that but actually people who are going to use your product and start to tell those stories and and build right start small and build and build and build and build and build because global sensations don't become global sensations just like that no they've got to be authentic they've got to resonate with people, they've got to tell the story that's true to them.

19:56You know, I'm in an industry where luxury is all very quiet, right? It's all quiet luxury. It's all very, and I'm not quiet. I'm quite loud, you know, as a person and, but also as a brand, you know, you've got 760 hotel rooms in a, in a building that's 180 meters, you know, above the sky with like peppered with, you know, 90 swimming pools and 17 restaurants. So I'm not a quiet product. And I think, you know, when we started the journey about Atlantis and also Atlantis was never seen as a luxury product. Yeah. And so how do you embrace who you really are and be authentic to who you really are?

20:38And the reality was I wasn't a quiet luxury product.

20:41Rochelle: Yes. I'm a loud luxury product. Yes. And that's okay. Yeah. And, you know, you lean into it. you lean into the things that you're authentic, you know, what is your authentic self? You're so right. And I think brands have to be really authentic. Stop copying people and stop thinking about the noise. But who are you and what are you? You're right. And once you start in, once you go down that road, it's a really distracting way to live and continue to build what, you know, what the kind of original message was supposed to be. Because, of course, people are going to, you've got to have that tunnel vision.

21:16Rochelle: And I do it with, you know, in my toiletry business, I do it with our team and it always comes back to the brand guidelines. Can we, is this us? What are those pillars? Does it sit under this? Well, if not, this sounds like a great opportunity and it's exciting and it might be reactive and loads of people are doing it at the minute and it's very trend led. But actually it might be, but that isn't us. and it's okay to sort of have those moments that they're you know that you're a little bit quieter because you're not part of because that isn't authentic to you as a brand but it's quite it's a discipline isn't it not sort of scary being distracted by what is currently relevant it's equally as courageous not to do something as it is to do it I think you know and as I said courage isn't that it's not scary but this is how you stand out and doing things differently than everybody else is good too you know being a little bit courageous in and taking a risk is important talking to different people and and I think also using your network yeah use the people around you to learn from them people who start their own business sometimes feel really alone sit down and have random conversations with different people yes and all sorts of people people who are in your industry and in your field and people who are completely different people who oppose your views versus people who agree with you and you gather all this information and learn about them you know I'm equally as happy to be challenged by people who don't like my brand yeah as much as people who do you know because well that's where you learn the most right correct it's why why don't you like it or why isn't it appropriate sit down a minute tell me what you don't know exactly but but it's but it also helps you know galvanize your own proposition and who you are Yeah.

23:01Rochelle: What would you say? Like you said, it was, you know, it was you kind of threw everything at this launch. Like you say, it's a loud brand. It needs a loud launch in it. That is authentic to what Atlantis the Royal is. What would you say with any learnings? Because from the outside, it was just the best launch ever. And it went without a hitch and everybody was happy. And but as these things always look right, you can't you don't really get that chance to sort of get under the hood and really know what went on. And that's I suppose that's the beauty of marketing. And that is what you do. It all should look a certain way.

23:42But what were there any learnings for you that perhaps didn't work? Oh, my gosh, there's so many. There are so many, Rochelle. I am you know if I look back in hindsight there were so many moments where I went oh I shouldn't have done that that was the turning point of something that went to something I think um gosh there's so many I think which I love by the way this makes you know when you when you're

24:11Rochelle: looking at the big proposition and how glossy and shiny and like you're talking like as we've you know said a billion times already but Beyonce and the level and I know the budgets are extreme and everything in between it looks utter perfection on the outside so it is so reassuring to know that at that level the wheels do also fall off oh the wheels fell off many times on that bus let me tell you but you know one of the things that you know we had 15 different events that weekend and people were in different places and and it was so complex right and you know if I went back and did it again And I would simplify some of those events.

24:48Rochelle: That's interesting. You know, we had so much going on for so many different people and so many different tiers of VIPs and, you know, gifting programs that were really complex and all of these things that we just layered and layered and layered. And it seemed like a good idea at the time and we were going to manage it all. And, you know, I remember many moments in that and I'm like, why did I decide to do this again? Like, why was this a good idea? Yeah. And so there were those moments. I think it was, we complicated it. Yeah. If I went back again and did it again, I would simplify some of those things.

25:22That's interesting.

25:23Rochelle: So you did like 15 different events. What would, how would you simplify it now? Would you, would you? I probably do a little bit less. So I would sort of streamline the number of things that we did because we had a Nobu opening in Atlantis the Palm. And then we had different dinners all around the resort to launch the restaurants. And then we had, you know, during the day we had different activations and activities for different guests because we were hosting, you know, a thousand people. So we had to keep them, you know, busy and active and engaged. So we just had so many layers of things that we sort of had in that day.

25:59You know, hindsight is incredible. It makes you, you know, think about things so much more and different gifting programs for different VIPs. And I can't say that some people didn't get the right gifts. and so right there are a couple of things and it fell off but you know it it was it was sort of complicated in that and when we did Carbone we just opened Carbone in Dubai and we did a three-day you know event as well I was very very conscious to make it simpler that's interesting

26:27Rochelle: that's such a good takeaway because even at the level that you are operating at is that there are always learnings and that it's always you're always going to every day's a school day right when you're putting on something like this and you know that is that to me is a key takeaway for a listener is that actually even doing something to that scale getting the chance to have another opening how you then look at what you did before and say okay let's take stock this was too much let's now do it like this yeah our simplicity honestly is so underrated simplicity is underrated and do you think that goes back to also messaging and being able to articulate your messages actually sometimes we put bells and whistles on everything and we shouldn't yeah 100 and just keep it simple to keep it simple to keep that authenticity it is we think we should be doing this because this would be great but actually yep yeah absolutely i mean when we did carbone that was the key thing i was like okay this is what we're going to do this is how it's going to be focused and like everybody got the same gift which was incredible everybody loved it and it was so much easier you know I learned a lot about people too and and and I think what is interesting is how different people take pressure ah and I and I learned a lot about you know my threshold to pressure is very different than somebody else's threshold to pressure and what actually pressure does to people.

27:54And so, you know, just because I can operate like a machine for 20 hours a day doesn't mean that everybody else can. And I think when I did Carbone the second time around, there was a lot of empathy for that. Right. That, you know, supporting your people, supporting your team, supporting the people who are really going to, you know, stand around you and make sure that you're saying to them, how are you today? It's not just go, go, go, go, go, go, go. Because when I did this the first time around, It was the first time I'd ever done something to this scale. And you sort of go into fight or flight mode, right?

28:26You just every day you're in survival mode to get it out. And sometimes you stop to ask people, how are you going? And I think that was a huge learning as well to make sure that the people around me who were doing this, because this is not a solo effort. It is a village that came together to do this. And you push people really to the end of their capacity that they're supported and that they're feeling okay and that they can do and yeah I think that was also another big learning and and it's

28:56Rochelle: such that's a real honest learning because it's it's so you're so right when this becomes your baby you I almost like subconsciously expect everybody to have that same energy and like you say you can I'm that person that is like I'll be I could be the first thing and last that and I've not even notice and I'm kind of that hamster on a wheel and almost parts of my life have worn that as a bit of a badge of honour like you know there's no one that's going to outwork me I'm a grafter I'll get the job done but actually it's not sometimes toxically so myself you know but actually you can't expect that same level of energy from everyone but I've definitely been guilty of that in the past like no we're a team we do this and we we fight till the end but actually you're Right.

29:44Rochelle: It's not everybody has a different threshold of pressure and how pressure looks. And you've got to be really aware when you're running a team not to push people too far to that limit. And when somebody falls behind, you turn around and you pick them up and you take them with you. That's it. I think that's the important part. And, you know, the first time around, we tried to do that as much as we could. Yeah. You know, this time around when I did Carbone, it was definitely one of the things that I was really conscious of. yes the people around me you know and also are they going to enjoy it because what I forgot to do in that weekend yes okay two things take a photo to say that I was there stop actually I think I have one photo of leading a celebrity somewhere that I think that's the only proof of posting that I had to be there and you put on this incredible everybody else got pictures no I didn't I think I got a picture of escorting somebody to the red carpet or the blue carpet at the time.

30:42And I think the second thing was just live in the moment and enjoy it.

30:45Rochelle: Yeah. And that was the second time around I did that. Particularly when you're in that position, it's like, okay, well, what's next? And that's sometimes I think I have so many, you know, whether they're founders or, you know, working in incredible jobs, incredible positions, that you create these kind of milestones and these sort of dates that you have to hit and it gets here and then you're so excited and once upon a time that was like a tiny seed of your imagination but then when it happens you don't actually sit in it and acknowledge it and celebrate it because you're so in the doing or that actually this is great and it's happened but now next week this is happening that you don't actually get time to sort of take stock give yourself a bit of a pat on the back and really sort of raise a glass to celebrate what you've achieved.

31:38Yeah, and I think that that's probably my regret. If I were to regret anything during that time was I didn't give myself or my people a moment to go.

31:48Rochelle: Look what we've bloody done. Look what we've done. You know, I look back. It's actually quite funny. I look back at the footage now and when, you know, I still see that. And sometimes I have this out-of-body experience. I'm thinking, did we do that? Did that really happen? And I think probably because we were just running to get it done that we didn't really in the moment enjoy it. I bet you slept well afterwards. You know, I slept for a week. I bet you did. I took a week off and I just slept and I was pretty much catatonic, non-functioning for a whole week. And I remember my boss who was, or my ex-boss, who was full of energy called me a day after the opening and said to me, so what's next?

32:28And I went, see you next week, bye. Not now. Literally, I'm just like, no, not happening. I'm not getting out of my pajamas. But so the next time when we did Carbone and every other thing that we've done since then, I've really taken it, you know, to heart that I enjoy the moment. My people enjoy that moment to give them that opportunity to just sit in it and say, look around and look what you've done.

32:48Rochelle: Yeah, absolutely. That is so, so important. Yeah. The Atlantis has had some incredible partnerships. And I kind of want to touch on the strategy of aligning with these brands that have had that global credibility. if we're talking about brands and we're in this age where everybody's collaborating which I love and partnering with other brands or talent um what would you advise brands I suppose have already gained global credibility but they're trying to they're kind of trying to achieve that even more so with their own strategies and I suppose partnering and collaborating what advice would you give brands when it comes to that and knowing that the partner is right do you know I think that the most important thing about collaborations is all about win-win right okay so you have to both be winning in it and how does that collaboration serve your purposes but also their purposes because that's how you convince them to do this you know with Louis Vuitton um which was the first year anniversary celebration of of the royal I really wanted it to be a win for them right I wanted I mean Louis Vuitton is not only a global icon in fashion but the heritage it's over 200 years old so you know what is little old me going to give you in that but I think that ability to be really quite playful as a brand that was really fun I think for them as well so we did the you know they've got this mascot called Vivian.

34:18And so the idea was actually a genius came up with it. Her name is Faye McLeod and she was the director of global merchandising for Louis Vuitton and we met coincidentally, again, a coincidence, and I asked her that I really want to work with her on a project and she came up with the story of Vivian visiting Atlantis the Royal. Oh, my gosh. So we built these life-size seven-foot statues of Vivian, you know, Louis Vuitton's child. And basically she visits Atlantis the Royal and experiences it. So Vivian becomes a lifeguard. Vivian becomes a shopper. Vivian becomes, you know, a music lover. And so we picked off these little stories and then we, you know, we brought in augmented reality to bring Vivian's journey to life as well.

35:12So it was really, really creative for them and for us. It was really playful because, you know, I mean, Louis Vuitton can be quite serious.

35:21Rochelle: I was going to say, it's nice to see them in that playful setting. Yeah. And so it gave them permission to be playful and it gave me permission to associate myself with a luxury brand to tell my story. Yeah. Right. That was the important part. It was about telling my story through the eyes of this amazing character called Vivian. So I think it was win-win for both of us. Yeah. In terms of collaborations, it's quite a saturated market. And I love to see it. I love it when you see brands that you wouldn't necessarily expect or that you don't think make sense until they do collaborate. And I love this new age.

35:54Rochelle: But it has to be a win-win. Yeah. And I think if you can get to that place, that's where the magic really, really, really happens in terms of, you know, brands coming together. And the collaborations that you remember are the ones where you go, you know, it's win-win for both. And I'm like, why didn't they do that ages ago? Yes. This has always made sense. Exactly. So they're the collaborations that you really see and you go, they really make sense versus, you know, some collaborations where it's not even about me too. it's just noise yeah it's something you go why did that happen it feels a bit forced yeah exactly so I think it's that was the fun part about that collaboration and so I always try to see how it's going to add value to our brand but also to my partner's brand yeah and I think that's when it works best what would be some of the top tips that you'd give to a listener looking to pitch like high impact partnerships that I suppose give the brand that global legitimacy and obviously it has to be win-win that's I mean that's quite crucial but what what would if you is there a tip that you would give to somebody thinking okay I want to partner with somebody it needs to be high impact and this is really going to help me cut through I suppose is there a tip around approaching the you know possible partner I think being brave and being fierce and not being afraid and intimidated by that partner.

37:29I mean, Louis Vuitton's a very intimidating brand.

37:31Rochelle: But girl, Beyonce, Louis Vuitton. Yeah, I know. I've, you know, tackled some bits. But I think also being confident in who you are and what you offer. Right. I think also there's a certain joy. I'm Australian, so I love an underdog, right? Australians love an underdog story. there's a certain empowerment on being an underdog that you could take that risk and be quite fierce in your approach of I'm going to pitch something to you that's really big and you're going to either love it or you're going to hate it but you know what I'm going to tell you anyway and I think you know brands that really want to cut through have to act like an underdog yes you know have to be a little bit fierce and a little bit ballish in their sort of approach to pitching an idea and And sometimes actually keeping it simple too, right?

38:20Like I said, you know, try to keep it really, really simple, but be brave and be bullish and, you know, put yourself out there like the underdog because you have nothing to lose. Yes.

38:30Rochelle: Yeah, go in as an – because, listen, when you are kind of in your infancy, you are an underdog, right? 100%. You are, and it's almost like embracing that and not being fearful of the fact that you're an underdog. Actually use it as your superpower. 100%. And I still operate as an underdog. like that's the mindset of my team it's you know how do we do things like anything that we do that's new that's never been done before it's we are absolute underdogs so you know some of these brands have been doing this for you know a hundred years how do you approach it differently how you do it differently how do you create the cut through you know and and so i think that is the tip right is don't be afraid and don't think small think big you know put it out there you know if you shoot for the stars you land on the moon it's it's kind of the approach and and what's the worst thing that could happen the worst thing that could possibly happen is they say nope yeah but you've learned so much on that journey already and you've pushed yourself much further than you would have pushed yourself and you've put yourself in that conversation yeah and I think that's what's really important to wrap up I want to know what's next for the Atlantis because I mean when just when you feel like you can't make another incredible announcement there comes another one is there anything you can tell us um I think we've got some interesting announcements that are coming up I can't tell you what they are but I think they'll be big and different as well in terms of the brand and where the brand goes and and and the um the journey of the brand right I think that'll be really really really exciting and then for Atlantis Dubai we'll just continue to surprise you I think you know and and that's my mandate to the team okay we've done this it's amazing sadly I say what's next and then how do we think bigger and differently and for both properties as well because Atlantis the Palm is such a beautiful really you know heartfelt brand and I want to make sure that you know we also take that on its next journey you know celebrates 20 years in 2028 so I'm really excited about that and I want to start planning that because I think we could do something really special for, you know, a beautiful property that's, you know, 20 years, you know, young.

40:45It's just iconic.

40:46Rochelle: It's iconic. And it's when you think of Dubai, you think of the Atlantis. Yeah. And so they're the exciting things that I really want to work on for the next couple of years. Well, I mean, it's so good to talk to you. It's so nice to get to delve a little deeper. And it's just, I'm so happy for you that, you know, after the career that you've had and that you get to have the Atlantis as a brand to be your playground and really kind of, it's so youthful that I think like, gosh, to have fun in that space and do what you love and have it as a playground must just be incredible. Yeah, I definitely wake up and pinch myself sometimes.

41:30I really do. I think it's a dream come true to work on a beautiful brand and as a marketer where you have this, you know, ability to create. I think, you know, that's the marketer's dream.

41:42Rochelle: Absolutely. But I definitely am incredibly grateful for the opportunity to speak about it today, which is always very warm to my heart. But just to be there and to be part of the story, and I am part of the story. Yeah. There are lots of people who make up this story. Yeah, of course. but to be part of it is something that I you know it's not lost on me how grateful I am well you're a big part of it thank you thanks for having me as well anytime you are welcome to come back anytime thank you I've loved it thank you very much thank you love that

42:21Rochelle: don't forget to follow us on Apple and Spotify or wherever you get your podcast to make sure that you don't miss out because next time we're going to be talking to another incredible lady who launched. If like me, you're a watcher, then follow us on YouTube and please don't forget to like and subscribe.