SERIES 17: Episode 1 - Library of Things, Wavelength Luke, Granger and Co, Novo Cabelo, Jules Fielder, Eltham Palace, Louis Theroux

0:00When people turn to healthcare for weight loss, they're looking for real support. That's why more people are choosing orderlymeds.com. Orderly Meds connects you with real doctors and access to proven GLP-1 medications like semaglutide and terzepatide. No guessing, just a more supportive experience. And all shipped directly to your door in discreet packaging. Do your research, ask questions, then visit orderlymeds.com slash podcast for an exclusive offer. That's orderlymeds.com slash podcast. Individual results may vary, not medical advice, eligibility required, see site for details.

0:38Michael Douglas: Hello. Um, how are you?

0:42Davina McCall: I am good.

0:44Michael Douglas: We're back.

0:45Davina McCall: Yeah, we're back.

0:46Michael Douglas: Been a while, hasn't it?

0:47Davina McCall: On heart breakfast.

0:49Michael Douglas: Ooh. Waking up.

0:50Davina McCall: So today, when you're listening to this, it'll be Friday.

0:53Michael Douglas: You'll have been?

0:54Davina McCall: And I will have been on radio Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, so I'll deserve a lion.

1:00Michael Douglas: Yeah, so heart radio. So you're getting up at, what, like 4.30 in the morning, 4.45, something like that. You got up this morning and then I fell back to sleep. Good. I fell back into a deep sleep. I could not get out of bed. I woke up at 8.30 this morning, which is quite late for me.

1:15Davina McCall: That is quite late for you. Normally you're sort of 7, 7.30, aren't you?

1:18Michael Douglas: But we were raving this weekend. Yeah. So, you know, we were pretty tired.

1:23Davina McCall: How are you?

1:24Michael Douglas: I'm very good. I'm a bit tired at the moment. I've got to say, I think when I last spoke to everybody, when we last spoke to everybody, we'd have been deep diving to AI. Do you remember that? We talked a little bit about AI. And then it was a nice episode, I remember. But then I went off for a weekend to a kind of retreat type thing, a little time for myself, you know. And it was really beneficial. I realized it was a very nice thing to do, to just take myself away and do a bit of meditation and relax a little bit. It made a big difference. It was like a little breather or something, you know, give me a chance to reset.

2:01Michael Douglas: So my first recommendation for people is to take some time for yourself and take 24 hours or 48 hours just to do whatever it is you want to do and try and stop thinking. One of the recommendations I gave people maybe three or four weeks ago was a book called Letting Go by Dr. David Hawkins. and that book's proved to be very helpful to me in just letting go of things that kind of occupy your mind. As you know, I went on a deep dive into the idea around free will a while ago about how much free will do people have, if any. You know, there's lots of people that believe there isn't any and that you're just controlled by your feelings and your hormones and things like that and I was getting a bit fed up of that idea and I realised that my mind was occupied by lots of thoughts that I could do with getting rid of.

2:54Michael Douglas: Anyway, that book really helped. But that little weekend away helped me really understand what it was to let go of certain feelings and thoughts that you waste your time with. And not serving you. And not serving you at all, no. And I didn't realise that you can let go of them. So I've been practising that a lot recently and it's made me a lot happier. Not that I was unhappy. I was born with a sunny disposition, really. I'm quite a sunny person. That's probably why I called my firstborn son Sonny. But yeah, you know, like taking a bit of time away and then really practising the art of letting go of just all the kind of rubbish that clogs up your mind, you know.

3:40Michael Douglas: The stuff you see on the news that then you kind of think about and then it bogs you down and the next thing you know you're a bit down and a bit grumpy and all that. I've been practicing letting go.

3:50Davina McCall: I mean, that's what happened after breast cancer for me. I didn't feel safe anymore. Every time I saw anything, I got bogged down in it and felt scared and nervous and didn't want to go on the train and didn't want to walk anywhere on my own and kept looking over my shoulder. Then I just changed everything, changed all my algorithms on everything I don't want to be served,

4:09Michael Douglas: anything negative or violent.

4:12Davina McCall: The rubbish that we get shown on social media is so toxic and poisonous for our promise. Can I also thank you for going and looking after yourself because you've come back a lovely nude kind of human being. But also I had a really nice time on my own.

4:33Michael Douglas: And I don't

4:35Davina McCall: do that very often.

4:36Michael Douglas: You went to a forced retreat.

4:38Davina McCall: I went, well, I mean I was happy. And I did a handstand.

4:47Michael Douglas: Oh my God. I'm so proud of you. You have no idea.

4:51Davina McCall: Thank you.

4:52Michael Douglas: Well done.

4:53Davina McCall: I was terrified. And I was on my own and it was really brilliant. You went there going, go on, go on, go on. I thought, I have to chivvy myself along here.

5:01Michael Douglas: Yeah.

5:02Davina McCall: And I thought, I'm not going to go until I've done it.

5:05Michael Douglas: And you did it. I did. And I've seen it because you've demonstrated a couple of them to me.

5:10Davina McCall: Yeah.

5:11Michael Douglas: Well done. I've been to the gym tonight and done a lot of handstands. In fact, I might show off later and do one for you. Yes, please. There's a guy who rocks up to the gym next to me. He's a big show-off handstand guy. He's just like up there for 10 minutes, you know. Is he? I'm like, bastard. Is he Nick? He's not Nick Brewer, no. But I mean, he's not that good. But he's a bit like that. He's a bit like that. He's heading in that direction.

5:34Davina McCall: It's Chester. Yeah, don't like it.

5:35Michael Douglas: I'll pause, pause. Sorry about that, guys. That's all right. There's Chester there. He's just come back from his travels. Yeah. And he's grown a very little moustache. He's got a proper moustache.

5:44Davina McCall: Yes, he has. Yeah.

5:46Michael Douglas: I mean, I've just never been able to grow a proper moustache, you know. You've got one now. I've got one now, though, yeah, I guess. Well done. I really wanted one when I was 19. He wants one. I don't want one. At 29, I got like my first. I'm like one of those little old Chinese men, you know, with little strings. Oh, yes, yes. Two little strings of hair coming out of me from the top lip. I had some friends of mine in LA when I was in my mid-twenties, probably,

6:11Davina McCall: and they had those very, very, very, like they were in metal bands, heavy metal, and they had the very long beards, which they'd plait.

6:19Michael Douglas: No, not a thin lizy. And then like tashes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I don't like that.

6:23Davina McCall: Yeah. It was more, it was more, less rock like that. It was more kind of thrash metal.

6:32Michael Douglas: Yeah, yeah. What was ZZ Top?

6:35Davina McCall: ZZ Top were kind of...

6:37Michael Douglas: They were metal, I suppose, weren't they?

6:39Davina McCall: Yeah, they were kind of more pop rock.

6:42Michael Douglas: It's very ugly. They were very commercial. It was very unattractive in my eyes. It's fine if you like it, but I didn't.

6:49Davina McCall: I like the music.

6:51Michael Douglas: Okay, good.

6:52Davina McCall: Good.

6:53Michael Douglas: Well, there you go. My first recommendation is take some time for yourself and practice the art of letting go of anything that doesn't serve you and boosh! Freedom. Well, a little bit of freedom anyway.

7:04Davina McCall: Oh, it's helped you or not.

7:06Michael Douglas: Yeah, it really has. Yeah, yeah. I'm in really good shape at the moment. I feel fantastic. So anyway, ladies and gentlemen, I hope you're all feeling all right.

7:14Davina McCall: I've got something really good to talk about. I'm very excited about this. Go, go, go. It is called Library of Things.

7:21Michael Douglas: Have you ever heard of that? No. Okay, libraryofthings.co.uk is, when you think of a library, it's a library of books. Yeah.

7:32Davina McCall: This is a library of things that you can go in, take out, use, take back. so we're talking like they over 80 000 rentals they've had so far electricals that are reused 432 tons of electricals members that joined saved over 12 million pounds wow wow the waste saved 514 tons and sharing libraries sparks behavior change right So like when you go to share your stuff or you go to share something else from a library, it kind of changes your behavior and everything. Then you're thinking, oh, what can I take to the library to share with other people? So basically they've got, what's it called when you've got a method of doing something and you rent it out?

8:30It's a franchise.

8:32Michael Douglas: Yeah, okay.

8:32Davina McCall: So you can have a franchise. So there's a three-stage programme and you can take it to your town. You know, it's like with delivering strategies for your city, your local authority and waste management services. And it's got like it's been going for 10 years. They've got lots and lots of data and solid kind of pattern of making this succeed. it's in London at the moment but basically it can transform where you live. What are the things? So let me show you so you can see here any kind of power tool, hoovers, sewing machines. Oh wow you can join join and get inspired and have a look and see what's there to rent and then you reserve the thing to rent and you go to a huge lock-up place a bit like an Amazon really and you go and unlock your thing and your tool or whatever you've rented is in there and you go and borrow it for a bit and then you take it back oh my goodness

9:38Michael Douglas: so it's like a huge rental store

9:41Davina McCall: a huge rental store virtually anything but it's all second hand

9:45Michael Douglas: yeah yeah

9:45Davina McCall: and it's a very democratic

9:48Michael Douglas: and brilliant way

9:50Davina McCall: and sustainable way and there are 22 different locations so when we're looking at locations so for example a cordless drill eight pounds a day and normally for for a day you'd only need it for a day like you're going to assemble a wardrobe or something like that and then don't forget you don't have to store it i mean there's um steam a steam cleaner they are so useful clean that would be good 13 £15 a day. A projector to watch a movie.

10:25Michael Douglas: I've got a projector.

10:26Davina McCall: £15 a day. Well, you can rent it.

10:28Michael Douglas: No, I was going to talk about it. Oh, really?

10:31Davina McCall: A carpet cleaner,£30 a day.

10:34Michael Douglas: Wow.

10:35Davina McCall: And this spring, we're bringing our sharing lockers to an iconic spot in central London, the Barbican Library. Oh, wow. So there are loads of places around London that you can do this. And they're basically anti-buying anything new. you don't need to buy it

10:51Michael Douglas: there's too much stuff isn't there? there's too much stuff and let's reuse I'm very aware of that and being a producer of stuff myself now we make hair tools I'm conscious about not making anything that I don't really need to make I was talking to somebody about business yesterday and what's the purposes of the business and all of that kind of stuff I've started to do a few panel talks which I find quite helpful for me to really unpick how you feel Yeah, yeah, about what am I actually doing, you know. And I realised that my business is designed to try and, I'm trying to heal people in some way, you know, by making them love themselves, you know, by getting in touch with how they would like to look and how to best connect with themselves.

11:36Michael Douglas: That's at the very heart of the business, you know.

11:38Davina McCall: We were saying today how important how you look is for how you are.

11:42Michael Douglas: Yeah.

11:42Davina McCall: Like when we were saying, like, when we shaved Chester's head last year, he just changed so much. Transformed him, didn't he? But in a really great way, like he got so kind of confident and like you could see he sort of became himself.

11:57Michael Douglas: Your identity is a very peculiar thing because it's made up of a mixture of things. It's made up of the world reflecting back at you, what people say about you.

12:04Davina McCall: Yes, and how they see you.

12:05Michael Douglas: How they see you. You take that on board and you have to be careful about what you take on board there, but you have to take some of it on board. Yes. and then your own reflection your own thoughts and your own perspective on the world and how you see it and then how you see yourself in the world and then the things you read and your parents and your upbringing and all sorts of your identity is wrapped up in so many different things but you do get the opportunity to tweak it a little bit

12:31Davina McCall: yes and your hair is like the most amazing possible chance to do that isn't it

12:36Michael Douglas: you can muck about with it it's easier than mucking about with your face yes absolutely lasting implications, you know.

12:43Davina McCall: Can we talk about you mucking about with your hair?

12:46Michael Douglas: Yeah, yeah, I've just had it coloured, yeah. Can I just say, it looks so good. So, this guy...

12:50Davina McCall: You look really, really hot. You do?

12:56Michael Douglas: That'll do, that'll do. That was the effect I was looking for.

13:00Davina McCall: It's so good.

13:02Michael Douglas: So, there's this hair colourist on Instagram, he's called Wavelength Luke, so you can go and follow him, but he specialises in colouring, like, these kind of bleach, Bleachy, dirty surfer type beachy hair. Bleachy, beachy hair.

13:16Davina McCall: But it's exactly that. Quite often you hear, oh yeah, I do bleachy. And it's not. But he really, really does. I mean, you look like a surfer. It's amazing.

13:27Michael Douglas: And anyway, he contacted me on Instagram and he said, look, next time you want to colour your own hair, just call me. I'll come and colour it for you. It's what I do, you know. And I was like, well, I think about that. So I just kind of toyed with the idea and I was led in bed, you know, thinking, yeah, we'll ask that guy to come and do it, you know. So I messaged him on Instagram. I said, you know, I work in London. He said, yeah, I'm in Melbourne all the time. And I'm like, do you want to come to my studio, colour me air, we'll make some content. He was like, I absolutely love it. I was like, brilliant.

13:54Davina McCall: Oh, great.

13:55Michael Douglas: So he came last week and we got to work, you know, and he coloured and bleached all the air. So I've got loads of blonde highlights in it.

14:02Davina McCall: You're going to have to post a picture.

14:04Michael Douglas: Let's take a picture now. You can get in it.

14:13Michael Douglas: It looks amazing. It does look good, doesn't it? It's really perked me up as well.

14:19Davina McCall: Yes, but this is what I mean. You're saying you can make little changes, but hair, like they said in Fleabag, is everything, and it changes everything. It's crazy how... I remember, I've told you this before, but when Sean Oliver died, Andy's brother, we were all devastated. it was the first person, first friend of ours that had died, we didn't know anybody else that that had happened to and when I went to his funeral the three of us had done massive, huge transformations I went completely blonde and a couple of other friends of ours did equally radical hair changes because it was like I feel I need to

15:01Michael Douglas: something's changed I need to do something it's very very interesting something about blonde hair as well you know there's that whole blondes have more fun and all that kind of stuff but I do think there is potentially something in lightness like when you think about the idea of heaven it's very bright and very light you know and you always think about heaven being upwards you know and the light is upwards and when you think about darkness or just

15:31Davina McCall: can I just say just be careful where you're going

15:34Michael Douglas: yeah yeah no no because you're sitting a brunette, I know I realise that but I'm going to clarify things, but down tends to be darkness and down is down and I've noticed this when blonde people come and see me and they say I'd quite like to go dark I always prepare them and say you might not like it, I know you want it but I'm just preparing you that you're going to feel like someone's turned the lights out. I've done that. I've gone from blonde

16:08Davina McCall: to dark.

16:10Michael Douglas: It is literally like just turning the lights off and everything's a bit harder to see. It's something peculiar going on.

16:17Davina McCall: I like being dark.

16:19Michael Douglas: Brunette is lovely. It's just the transition when somebody's blonde and they go dark. You saved yourself. That's my observation that I've seen. A lot of people are like, oh, yeah, I like it. but what I've noticed more often is when somebody is brown and you put some blonde highlights around the front they go oh wow look at this so anyway that's how I feel, I've gone blonder and I'm like wow so nice I'm not saying that everyone should go blonde that's not what I'm saying at all, you should do whatever you want to do but I've enjoyed it and I'm looking forward to the summer and getting a suntan and all of that jazz did I do a recommendation then?

16:59Davina McCall: No.

16:59Michael Douglas: Oh.

17:00Davina McCall: Well, you did. You did. You did. The hair guy.

17:02Michael Douglas: The hair guy. Wavelength Luke on Instagram. You won't go and search him, but there's content coming out on MD London and Wavelength Luke of the process.

17:11Davina McCall: I've got an amazing restaurant to tell you about, which I don't think you know. No. Do you know Granger & Co.?

17:17Michael Douglas: I don't, but I think I've walked past it on the way to the Entrecom.

17:19Davina McCall: So Granger & Co. have got several restaurants in London. they are Granger & Co Chelsea Notting Hill King's Cross and Marylebone Marylebone Marylebone they are restaurants

17:37Michael Douglas: and bars

17:39Davina McCall: so it's restaurant and bar but I just want to show you some of the pictures

17:43Michael Douglas: because the interiors

17:45Davina McCall: are absolutely stunning and look it's outside pavement and it's in a pedestrian area.

17:54Michael Douglas: Yeah, nowhere it is around the back of Marlivan High Street.

17:56Davina McCall: It's absolutely incredible.

17:58Michael Douglas: Yeah, there's a market there.

17:58Davina McCall: And all of them are gorgeous. The food was fantastic. So I cannot recommend it highly enough. Graingerandco.com When did you go there? Yeah, wouldn't you like to know?

18:10Michael Douglas: Who the hell did you go there with? Yeah, wouldn't you like to know?

18:14Davina McCall: No, I went there with Laura and the kids. Oh, did you? Yeah. How nice. But it was really, really good. Really fun. I think it was started by someone called Bill Granger. Yeah, yeah. He's from Melbourne and he was a self-taught cook and he became a global restaurateur. And very sadly, he died young. He was born, he would have been 54 now. No, 56 now. But he died in 2023.

18:45Michael Douglas: Oh, what a shame. He looks so healthy and well in that bit. Yeah, he died at 53. Yeah, okay.

18:49Davina McCall: It's really sad.

18:50Michael Douglas: Oh.

18:51Davina McCall: He's obviously just really brilliant at not just food, but interiors as well. He's just got like a fantastic style. And nice menus and not prohibitively expensive. It's kind of middle of the road.

19:07Michael Douglas: Okay, good. So I did a little bit of content recently with this guy called Rob, and he owns a company called Nova Cabela, I think it is. Let me just double check that. Anyway, he makes these hair systems that he puts on people who've lost their hair. It's mainly men. They've got bald on top and they put... It's like a very simple stick-on kind of toupee, I suppose.

19:34Davina McCall: But the stick is sticky.

19:36Michael Douglas: Yeah, and the mesh that is on is so lightweight and so tiny that is, it's not like putting a wig on, which is a lot like putting a hat on sometimes. It can sit a bit heavy on your head. These are so light that you can't really even tell. Yeah, Nova Cabello Hair is on Instagram. It's got 54 ,000 followers. It's called Rob. And anyway, I'd seen some of his Instagram posts and I just loved the transformation of seeing people, you know, go from looking bald and kind of a bit tired and old to then all of a sudden having a full head of hair that looked so real.

20:12Davina McCall: It has been unbelievably transformation for who we're just about to talk about.

20:17Michael Douglas: Yeah. So my brother always had one of these fitted because we made two bits of content. In fact, we made three in total. There was a couple of ladies, which I really wanted to do because most of my business is about talking to women. But my brother was like, are you working with that Rob guy? Can he have me a hair system? I was like, yeah, I'll ask him. So my brother's also done one as well. So if you go to MD London page and you can have a little look, because they're all in the last month or so. But the first one we did was this girl called Jules. Now, Jules just didn't have any hair. I assumed she had alopecia.

20:50Michael Douglas: I didn't actually know anything about Jules when she turned up. And it was quite nice, that, because I've no anticipation and no expectations or anything. I'm just like, here's a nice lady. She's lost her hair. Let's give her a full head of hair and bingo, you know. So she came in and sat in the chair and then I had a chat with her and I said, tell me, when did you start losing your hair? and she went on to tell me that she was diagnosed with lung cancer in about 2021, 22 and it was terminal, you know, stage 4 lung cancer and, you know, the treatment and everything meant that she lost her hair and it wasn't going to grow back, you know I was just like, oh god I hadn't prepared myself at all for this kind of confrontation with death, you know because here was this very beautiful woman Yeah, she's gorgeous Yeah, she looks so healthy and well.

21:40Michael Douglas: And I just wasn't expecting her to say that, you know. So I was really taken aback. Anyway, she went on to tell me that lung cancer is the biggest cause of...

21:50Davina McCall: The biggest cancer killer of women. Yeah, of women. So of all the cancers, every woman would think that the biggest killer was breast or ovarian. Yeah. And lung cancer kills more women than both of those combined.

22:04Michael Douglas: I just could not believe that statistic.

22:06Davina McCall: It was unbelievable. But that's a bit like cardiovascular disease kills more women than any of that. I mean, women, we just don't know anything. It's absolutely crazy, isn't it? So I was like, I'm going to ask the obvious question, Jules.

22:22Michael Douglas: You know, smoke? And she was like, no, never smoked. And apparently 30 % of all lung cancer cases are nothing to do with smoking. And you think, oh, they smoke 30%. so anyway I want to recommend people can go and follow her on Instagram because she's campaigning at the moment to create more awareness around this because one of the difficulties with lung cancer is it's very difficult to spot the symptoms because the symptoms can relate to a bunch of other stuff to do with back pain and a cough and a sore throat Karen had lung cancer

22:56Davina McCall: none of us knew and then it spread to her brain and then that's when we found out because she just thought she had a cough yeah exactly

23:06Michael Douglas: why would you think you had lung cancer you certainly would have never smoked it was crazy really

23:12Davina McCall: yeah but

23:15Michael Douglas: it is amazing that you can get it without that so I was just having a little look for her page on Instagram because I think it's called Bean Jewels and she's got a big campaign she's collaborated with boots if you can go on to there's a lovely link on good morning britain where she's done an interview um which is really good and then there is on the boots pages boots has launched a nationwide initiative to help customers recognize the early signs of lung cancer so um if you go into boots.com uh you can find that as well so i just wanted to say how nice it was to meet jules the content's brilliant we gave her a brilliant hair system she's normally wears a brunette wig and she looks great in it.

24:02Michael Douglas: It was so nice to give her this blonde one. And if you go on to MD London or you can go on to B &J. Did she like it? Absolutely. Did she? Yeah, yeah.

24:10Davina McCall: And will you just explain to everybody how long it stays on for?

24:13Michael Douglas: Yeah, well, it stays on for about three to six weeks and it just stays on and you can just have it like your hair. And obviously you might get some hair growth that comes through and pushes it away and then you can get it removed they remove all the glue and then they reattach you can go back to a salon that specializes in this country experts there and it would be like

24:35Davina McCall: going to get your hair cut you just gonna get it reapplied you just gonna get it reapplied and

24:38Michael Douglas: bingo you now got this hair piece that literally you'd have to rip off you know like it's not gonna slide off while you're disco dancing or something like that so you can follow Nova Cabela hair on Instagram as well. I think he said it was somewhere between about £300 and£600, which is not massively expensive.

24:59Davina McCall: You can keep replacing it. You don't have to buy a new one every time you get it done.

25:03Michael Douglas: And the wigs themselves, if you go to a wig shop, you can pay up to£5 ,000 for a wig.

25:08Davina McCall: Wow.

25:09Michael Douglas: And then the reapplying of this, probably about £60-70 to just get it reapplied and get it washed. That is amazing, isn't it? It's brilliant, isn't it? so it was great so go and follow all those accounts if you know anybody who's interested in that or feels like they need their hair looking out in that way then go and follow that but being Jules brilliant woman and if you're interested in what she's up to go and follow her on Instagram

25:36Davina McCall: and we should go and support her yeah absolutely

25:41when people turn to telehealth or weight loss they're looking for real support that's why more people are choosing orderlymeds.com Orderly Meds connects you with real doctors and access to proven GLP-1 medications like semaglutide and terzeptatide. No guessing, just a more supportive experience, and all shipped directly to your door in discreet packaging. Do your research, ask questions, then visit orderlymeds.com slash podcast for an exclusive offer. That's orderlymeds.com slash podcast. Individual results may vary. Now medical advice, eligibility required. See site for details.

26:18Davina McCall: I have just realized that Granger & Co was a little bit more expensive than I thought. So it's like sort of 15, 20 pounds for some of the salads, but they're like big salads, but it's still quite, quite spendy. So I just wanted to say that. But I have got something good for you in return that Elton Palace and Gardens. The history of Elton Palace is basically, I think, it's one of the few important medieval royal palaces in England to survive. Elton Palace and Gardens. So in order to go, it costs£10.20. And now, from March onwards, I think it's open on Sunday. And we're just waiting for the new March dates to come in.

27:14Davina McCall: but it is an absolutely beautiful house to visit. It's Art Deco and I'm going to show you a couple of the pictures. Look at the bath.

27:27Michael Douglas: Oh, wow.

27:28Davina McCall: The interiors of this house are absolutely stunning. Look at this room. Art Deco at its very best. If you like this kind of decor, it really, really makes me think of Peter McKick.

27:41Michael Douglas: Oh, yeah, he's great. Isn't he? I follow him on Instagram.

27:45Davina McCall: eltonpalace.org.uk go and have a look at what it looks like in the interiors but if you like Art Deco you are absolutely going to love this house but while you're looking at it if you like that kind of decor, follow Peter McKick on Instagram it is P-E-T-E-R M-I-K-I-C and we will have all the details

28:10Michael Douglas: on the blurb and Spotify.

28:14Davina McCall: But he's an amazing interior decorator, Peter McKick, and we can't really afford him, but we just like looking at the pictures.

28:22Michael Douglas: We often say, if one day we made enough money, we'd get Peter McKick to come and just interior design our whole life. Our whole life. Yeah, he's just the daddy.

28:31Davina McCall: Exactly, he's the daddy. Absolutely brilliant.

28:34Michael Douglas: So when I emailed Saskia this afternoon and said, hey, we're thinking about doing some episodes of Making the Cook, she said, fantastic, I need some recommendations to watch on telly

28:43Davina McCall: oh great we've got a couple

28:46Michael Douglas: first thing is that we could finish this tonight we started watching The Proposal

28:51Davina McCall: oh yes I really want to see that

28:53Michael Douglas: yes I would because we started watching I love you yeah I love you too so we watched this film called The Proposal and it's Ryan Reynolds and Sandra Bullock

29:07Davina McCall: definitely want to see that Yeah, it looked really funny.

29:10Michael Douglas: We tried to watch it. She looked really, really funny. You'd fallen asleep and I was a bit tired and then I thought, well, I'll just pause it. We watched about the first 20 minutes. But it's a great film. It's probably about 20 years old. And Sandra Bullock.

29:22Davina McCall: I forgot how much I like Sandra Bullock.

29:24Michael Douglas: Yeah, she's brilliant. She's really funny. Yeah, and she's great in everything she's in. She's really good. So she is a kind of publishing executive at a huge publishing house. she's Canadian and she has a problem with her passport and she's going to get extradited and pushed back into Canada unless she gets married. I'm already laughing. She forces her personal assistant, who's Ryan Reynolds, to marry her and he kind of agrees to do it but only if she promotes him. So they're going on this fiasco of getting married and they have to do it because the IRS is now following them to make sure that they are truly in love.

30:01Michael Douglas: So they have to pretend they're in love but they actually hate each other. anyway they have to go to his house and pretend to his family that they really love each other and his mum and dad are like she's a bitch like why are you marrying her you know anyway the whole thing plays out and we're going to watch it later tonight but if anyone's stuck for something to watch The Proposal is just a really good funny film it's an hour and a half long so it's not a big commitment and it's really a joy so let's watch that

30:25Davina McCall: definitely

30:26Michael Douglas: I wasn't going to recommend that

30:27Davina McCall: I think people should watch The Man of Spare with Louis Theroux if they haven't seen it yet we owe it to the world oh yeah

30:33Michael Douglas: Shall we talk about that briefly? We owe it to the world to make everybody watch it. I was so depressed.

30:39Davina McCall: Yeah, it was really tough to watch, right?

30:42Michael Douglas: Yeah, you know, I think you can criticise Louis Theroux stuff because what he often does is picks a subject and goes kind of all in on the subject.

30:55Davina McCall: Yeah, he doesn't ever show you anything positive. Not that there's anything positive with that, but we don't get a balance of the other side.

31:03Michael Douglas: No, so when he saw the most hated family in America, he's the right-wing Christians. They were petitioning at soldiers' funerals and stuff like that and saying death to gays and everything. It's not like he would go and see a normal Christian group that were actually doing good things in the world. So you do get kind of this edited version of it. It's still good, though.

31:28Davina McCall: He brings really important things to light.

31:31Michael Douglas: Yeah, and that HS Tiki-Toki guy, it depressed me so much. I was so dissatisfied. You know, the thing that bugged me most about it is this guy went to university. And I've been suspicious of universities for quite a while anyway, about what they're churning out. And it seems to me a reasonable example of a lot of what universities are pouring out. Because these young kids pile in there. I'm not sure of that. It's fine. This is my view and my opinion.

32:02Davina McCall: I'm allowing you to have it.

32:03Michael Douglas: And there is a lot of corruption gone on in the universities and a lot of people going there that shouldn't go. And they're finding themselves getting mixed up in all sorts of mad ideas about the world and then coming out and turning into people that are saying and doing the most hideous things. and he is just a bloody horrible example, I think, of somebody who's just become corrupted. You know, he's just such a horrible person.

32:36Davina McCall: The only thing I would like to say is about the language. I'm sure that that is happening to some people but when you say a lot, it sounds like you're kind of saying more than half and I don't believe that's true.

32:48Michael Douglas: No, you're probably right.

32:48Davina McCall: I think it's a minority but some... What I think is that modern life is showing you that the more vile you are and the ruder you are and the more hateful you are, or the more violent and cruel you are, the more likes you get and the more money you make. And that is fucked up.

33:09Michael Douglas: It's just appalling.

33:10Davina McCall: That's a mess.

33:11Michael Douglas: You know, after reading that Bruce Springsteen book and you realise how hard some of these artists work to develop a career. And they become famous because that's what they want to do. and they produce this work and this art and this work ethic and they travel and dedicate their lives to their craft you know and this guy becomes rich and famous by just being a fucking horrible moron you know

33:35Davina McCall: being cruel to people and he knows he's like what else can I do that's awful so I can get more likes and he's encouraging other people to do that

33:46Michael Douglas: which is really sad

33:48Davina McCall: because we need more love in the world Yeah, we do.

33:51Michael Douglas: And I just want to go back to my university statement there and just say, I don't mean all universities are corrupt. I don't mean all people shouldn't go there. There's loads of good reasons to go and educate yourselves. I just worry that there's a lot of people being driven to universities by this Tony Blair idea that education, education, education, everybody should go to university. And actually, I don't think that's been very helpful. There's loads of people who shouldn't have gone. HS Tiki Taki would have been a brilliant plumber. No, he didn't. But he could have been a brilliant vocational skilled guy doing something really useful and helpful in the world.

34:29Michael Douglas: But he ended up being this guy. And it was like, fuck out.

34:33Davina McCall: But he would say, look how successful I am. I'm making millions of pounds. I've got a sports car and a really nice house.

34:39Michael Douglas: I know. And it's the worst version of success.

34:42Davina McCall: And what is sad is that other people will see that and think,

34:45Michael Douglas: oh, I'd rather do that.

34:47Davina McCall: and go and get a skilled trade, which is terrible.

34:53Michael Douglas: There's much better ways of measuring success than money, happiness, how much joy you put out into the world. There's a much, much better measurement for success. But it's well worth a watch, The Manosphere.

35:05Davina McCall: We should watch it. Can I just quickly recommend an Instagram account that I think you are going to love? It's called get.kooky. and basically this woman has started a business with vinyl, sticky vinyl.

35:24Michael Douglas: Yep.

35:25Davina McCall: And she's sticky vinyls everything.

35:28Michael Douglas: Mm-hmm.

35:28Davina McCall: So she has got 92.1 thousand followers.

35:32Michael Douglas: Mm-hmm.

35:33Davina McCall: The business, I'm going to just show you this.

35:38Michael Douglas: Mm-hmm. I don't know.

35:42Davina McCall: Wait, you'll see. It gets better and better and better.

35:48Michael Douglas: She's just sticking stuff to the walls and stuff. But watch.

36:03Davina McCall: Decorating shouldn't feel risky. That's sticky wallpaper.

36:08Michael Douglas: I've never thought like they don't. Tiles. Sticky wallpaper. Wallpaper paste is a bloody nightmare.

36:13Davina McCall: Yeah. Look at that.

36:14Michael Douglas: Oh, yeah. That's good. I've been to B &Q and bought some vinyl covering.

36:20Davina McCall: Isn't that so clever? Look at her house. Look at that.

36:27Michael Douglas: Yeah, nice.

36:28Davina McCall: And do you know what I love about it? Yeah. Is her patterns are so cool. So I can't recommend that high enough.

36:38Michael Douglas: It'd be interesting to know where she gets her vinyl from.

36:41Davina McCall: Get.Kookie. It looks like she sells it. Peel and stick vinyl.

36:48Michael Douglas: Let's buy some.

36:48Davina McCall: Any smooth surface. Start by choosing your product. 16 peel and stick tiles. Okay. She's got vinyl rolls, but look at the patterns on the vinyl rolls.

36:58Michael Douglas: I want some.

36:59Davina McCall: And window vinyl rolls.

37:01Michael Douglas: I've already thought about what I can cover.

37:03Davina McCall: What are you covering?

37:04Michael Douglas: My mouth? DJ desks and all sorts of stuff.

37:07Davina McCall: I mean, look at...

37:08Michael Douglas: I've got loads of recommendations to make about DJ stuff.

37:11Davina McCall: Look at that.

37:13Michael Douglas: I've got loads of stuff in the canon for next week the other thing I want to recommend is Black Rabbit oh yes, is this for Saskia to watch yeah, so Saskia or anybody else is interested Netflix got the show called Black Rabbit Jude Law and Jason Bateman and it's a brilliant kind of high stakes drama about two brothers that were once in a band called Black Rabbit that then opened a bar called the Black Rabbit and the brothers have fallen out anyway, episode one is fantastic and towards the end of episode 1 there's this thing that happens and then at the end it says one month earlier and then you go back a month and then it leads up to the moment but oh my god it's chaos I just warn people it gets very dark it's quite a kind of dark by episode 3 it's like oh god should I really watch any more of this you know but if you're interested in A high-stakes drama that's tense and edgy.

38:14Michael Douglas: Black Rabbit on Netflix. It is really good.

38:17Davina McCall: Roller, roller.

38:18Michael Douglas: Now, we haven't got many shout-outs because we've not done episodes. So, people, if you'd like to start texting in on Instagram. But what I have noticed is that people started commenting on Spotify.

38:32Davina McCall: Oh, great. Yeah.

38:33Michael Douglas: So, someone had said here, this is Vicky Eckersley, says, I'm with you there, Michael. This was after our big AI chat. If I had the freedom to not have to work every day as someone who fell into a finance job they so don't enjoy and choose things I do enjoy like travel and music, I would get some practical skills like woodwork. And then Julie says, absolutely wonderful podcast. I found that very interesting. And the more I thought about it, I would be willing to change and try a new way of living. You're absolutely like you say the system is broken. How exciting. It was a really good episode that I did enjoy the things we talked about in that one.

39:12Michael Douglas: Kathy Proctor says, oh, my God, to replay a few times your comments about Taurus leaving Uranus and how I thought how tough it's been for us since 2018. Apparently, she's got the same birthday as me. It's been the toughest time for me. And I'm now so excited to move forward. Thank you for shedding light. It has been interesting that this is the very I think Taurus has now left Uranus. it was leaving in April the 1st it's gone completely thank you so much Davina and Michael for chatting about my wee brand I'm so glad that you love what I do and thank you lovely Fern Cotton for recommending me running a small business can be hard but moments like this are incredible and I'm so grateful for your sport

39:55Davina McCall: yeah we love your clothes

39:57Michael Douglas: electric eye of power and it's such a brilliant idea yeah great and then Julie says what a wonderful podcast will it be the last one or are you just taking a break let me just see if I can provide any more comments but it's quite nice Julie says happy Friday guys thanks so much for taking the time thanks so much for the lovely info certainly going to look into Blue Bella I'm going to download Born to Run so true we can only make ourselves happy in ourselves I'm now in my 50s trying to find myself

40:31Davina McCall: me too

40:32Michael Douglas: and then Vicky says Landman is fab. Landman was a recommendation that we got that we've not gone around to watching yet. So feel free to put posts or comments on Spotify and we'll read them out as well. We love hearing from you. Yeah, it's great. We've been quite relaxed in this episode. I've noticed we're quite chilled. You know?

40:52Davina McCall: Yeah.

40:54Michael Douglas: But I'm going to try and be a bit more energetic next week. A bit more spiky.

40:59Davina McCall: Why?

41:00Michael Douglas: I just feel like people sometimes like a bit of energy

41:03Davina McCall: just be yourself, they love you

41:05Michael Douglas: yeah, I mean this is me tonight, I am this tonight, that's it

41:09Davina McCall: you don't want to act at any time

41:11Michael Douglas: you're right, you're right

41:13Davina McCall: we love you

41:14Michael Douglas: thanks alright folks, we'll be back next week

41:18Davina McCall: see you next week, bye